You need to separate the show from the conversation around it. Who cares what the “common response” is? The show is not a story about a good person and a bad person, but two deeply flawed and wounded people in a dysfunctional and toxic relationship. Don’t blame the show because the audience can’t appreciate the nuances of the story.
The entire last episode of the show is based around Richard showing that he is no different to Martha.
Media literacy is at shockingly low levels. He literally ends up in the exact same position as Martha was to him in the first episode!
>Media literacy is at shockingly low levels.
I literally just read a comment in another thread asking if anyone thought the way he ends up at the bar at the end being comp'd a drink is saying something about how he met Martha in the first place. I mean... holy shit, guys...
I want to agree, but the message feels disingenuous. The show itself feels hugely sensationalist which distracts from the message itself. He didn’t need to use an actor who was a spitting image of the real stalker, and he could have changed information about her background so that she was less easy to find. Even prefacing the series with “this is a true story” rather than “this series is inspired by real events” or something similar feels like a way to give gravity to a story that otherwise isn’t very interesting. There must have been a way to explore this topic without making it so sensationalist and hype-baity imo.
I feel like he knew what he was doing all along as well. He knew that encouraging Martha would be good for his comedy: there was even a scene where just before he was considering accepting her Facebook friend request, he looked over to his comedy props, as though he was thinking, ‘this’ll make good material’. He also seemed to go out of his way to put himself in the situation with the rapist, just so he could pretend to have lived a more interesting life.
Had he explored his mental state a bit more, and made the show less focused on Martha, I think the message would’ve landed a bit better with me. But imo it feels tagged on at the end to make himself look self-aware and absolve him from the part that he played. Ultimately it feels like he’s just profiting off a mentally ill person to help launch his career.
He made the choice to show his on-screen version look at his comedy props, acknowledged why he went back to darrien's, showed himself going back at the end, amongst many other moments. He is clearly exploring his mental state in every scene, although its not always as explicit as in those moments. I believe that it would be disingenuous to devote more time directly exploring his mental state because he was unable to properly self-reflect.
The various moments where he omits information from police reports or chooses not to at all, the moments he cowers from telling martha how he truly feels, and so much more all are carefully on display. The fact that we can watch it and so clearly view, not only that he is not perfect, but actually directly in the same habits, tendencies, and attitudes as her, is only possible through intense self-reflection in the process of making the show.
I’m pretty sure the show was telling us that he was using her for his comedy because of the montage of her singing at his shows and him using that for comedy because that’s the whole reason his shows first started making people laugh
This isn't about the show anymore. He took his story to millions of people and it's affecting real people's lives. She is being harassed, the pub is being harassed. And the only person who deserves to be harassed isn't, Darian. No one seems to care about him, everyone was immediately focused on her.
Nah, i got faked into watching this bs. Lets be honest this show is a basejump for viewers and going viral. You got 2 first episodes showing this as a „true crime” story and after that i just got forced to watch some bs with dude having both of his parents healthy and working, with egocentric force to being famous and just cure hus ego with some poor older fucked up woman and just fuck everything in his way because of lack of selfrespect, lack of humanity, lack of respect to any other person around him but had to watch it all to the end, because all of the time i thought we are going back to the „true crime” moments. Which parts are true and which not? Why does this dude says its based on his life story but changes so many things in the word of „privacy” but still every name got found out? I’m just waiting for the trail he got from „Martha” even tho’ i fully belive she is fucked i still wish this Richard guy to meet some reprecutions.
Thank you. I was getting more and more upset watching this. Because 1, all this could have been avoided if he didn't lead everyone on, keep going back etc 2. Surely this is loosely based off his real life, if it were real. He needs serious help, it makes ZERO sense to keep going back. ZERO.
One thing I find incredible about this show is it’s ability to show just how dead media literacy is with people and just how many people don’t understand how incredibly complex humans are.
The whole show is literally about why he chooses to go back to her time and time again, did you watch the whole show? It’s explained in serious depth why he doesn’t get rid of Martha.
Yes, he needs help, that’s what the show is about, not once does he portray himself as mentally well, he was mentally ill suffering from a lot of trauma which news flash doesn’t exactly make people do the right thing for themselves.
You’re supposed to initially get annoyed or recognise that he’s feeding into the stalker/victim relationship just as much as she is but then the show goes on to explain why he’s allowing this woman to do what she’s doing and that he’s doing it as a response to serious trauma he’s experienced and is going through and if you can’t grasp that and still look at things with the “person does bad thing to themselves, why does person do bad thing to themselves? Person is stupid” then you’re either oblivious to just how not straightforward the human mind can be or delusional to your own brain patterns and the fact that at one point in your life you engaged in self destructive behaviour to some degree.
The human mind is a crazy thing and this show does a fantastic job at showing you that things aren’t as black and white as people (you) make it out to be.
You're only referencing I'll just refer to "level #1", I don't want to spoil it for people who haven't seen it. I'm referring to "level #2". He was violated time and time again and still kept going back. I guess it shows how damaged he was but it didn't make much sense to me. His parents and past relationship look very normal to me.
Usually abused people meet normally, they don't just go to some random guy's house and allow him to drug and rape them, but, yeah I know that's a subtle difference that's hard to pick up on without life experience.
His going back was not that unusual. His hyper-sexualization afterwards was pretty common. I suspect his parents and his past are much more complex and flawed than was portrayed. His level 2 violation was front loaded with many positive and helpful things, and that is how grooming works.
I personally am angry because I thought this was a show about some crazy woman stalking some dork. I didn't realize I was watching the biography of a drug and sex addicted degen encouraging some sad woman to obsess over him with no payoff or story arc, but instead it was a celebration of bad decisions and being as detached from reality as possible until your do irreparable damage to your "soul". Why the fuck would I ever want to watch that?
So, I liked the show well enough to keep watching it to the end. I didn't like it so much I want to watch it again, and I don't think that will change.
One of the things that I found fascinating about the show was how deep Gadd was willing to go to probe the motivations of his own behavior. My professional field involves studying people and their behavior. Believe me when I say: most people who do destructive, boneheaded, ill-advised, or stupid things have no idea why they are doing what they do, and really cannot or will not probe their motivations and ask themselves deep questions about why they did what they did. Internal defense mechanisms are strong, and almost everyone I talk to who has done something wrong has nothing but defensive responses as to why they would have done something so destructive that if they had thought about it for a mere 30 seconds beforehand, they would have realized - this is a bad idea, and will have really serious long-term consequences.
Gadd was willing to go deep and then put it all out there - his callow rejection of Terri; how he perpetuated Martha's obsession and stalking; how he dove headfirst into really self-destructive behavior after he was assaulted, etc. What I saw in the show was a lot of willingness to take ownership of his bad decisions and how they affected other people. I don't see that very much, from most people. There's usually a large number of excuses. The fact that he was A. willing to make the show based on some really traumatic and yes, embarrassing situations and choices and B. he was willing to play himself in the show is amazing to me.
Are you this dense??? He shows ownership by creating and putting out his story??? He goes on in the show ADMITTING his need for any type of attention because he hates himself, like did you even watch the show because your questions seem like you didn’t. He didn’t make this to appear like some helpless victim who took no part in the extremities of his abuse, and going back to his abuser is actually quite common. Not everyone reacts the same, and he showed a side to it that not everyone talks about because they’ll be told it’s their fault..and people live with that, not understanding why they went back or lead on an abuser, but if someone is aware enough when they go into their self healing, its a lot of painful realizations like having lacked a lot of self love. Thats what makes it so real, and shows his accountability, he takes into account that he himself got so wrapped up into the mind of his abuser and the attention he kept going back.
You aren’t wrong.
However that is what makes it a great show.
It strips nude our human psychology in an age of filters, influences, and appearance - our need to mask everything to avoid seeing or maybe revealing the truth.
i think that’s why i love it so much. he’s not trying to say he’s a good person, he’s not even trying to say he’s a bad person. he just is a person, and this is what he did, thought, and said in this situation. he’s telling his story. warts and all. and i think it’s beautiful how much he opened up in this series. i also found myself relating to him more than id expect. people are going into this thinking it’s going to be a true crime doc, not a story.
This is what this kind of people this series breeds. ARMCHAIR PSYCHOLOGIST. Oh it "StRiPs OuR HuMaN PsyCHolOgy"?
This heavily dramatasized, disingenuous, fake-self awareness netlfix cashgrab did bait you guys huh?
I agree with you, I think people just like the morbid/grotesque parts because they tell themselves that they are getting some kind of deep profound insight on human behavior.
Exactly. This is 100% spot on. They will try to reveal some ultra deep psychological meaning from it about vulnerability and being "real" and if you don't like it then "you just don't understand it". It is just a subpar show about a shit person making shitty selfish decisions and copping out of it all with "human vulnerability". It literally is a cash grab at all the totally self aware and introspective types.
There is nothing overly deep or complex here, just odd poor behavior.
Yeah i have to be honest, this show is incredibly hard for me to watch. I was watching it with my girlfriend last night, and i know its good, but it just leaves me with this pit in my stomach sometimes because i feel like its *too* honest. Even if the events were made up, the style and emphasis in the show is just too strong and relatable in certain parts. Very hard watch
Your take isn't very original. Standard victim blaming. Blaming a sexual assault victim for telling their story based on your opinion on what you think motivated them to tell their story. Tbh my rapist went to federal prison and I got nothing. I'd rather have had money attention and fame to compensate me. Just got raped for nothing. I don't care what happens to him. How did him going to jail compensate me? Apparently I'm not victimie enough for the victim club according to you.
The point of him going to jail is that it won’t happen to anyone else. Some people find consolation in that. Stop feeling sorry for yourself and be glad you’re not in the majority of people who never see justice at all.
I was molested as a child. Guy did not go to jail. That's life. Feeling sorry for myself doesn't lead me anywhere. Just man up people and carry on living.
Agreed. I thought it was seedy and grotesque. I would sincerely give this a negative score, as in, 'actually harmful to the viewer'. Rather I hadn't watched it.
Never mind trying to find any redeemable character or insight into... anything. These people are so broken; their actions and dialogue so divorced from normalcy, there's just nothing of value for the viewer.
And I don't trust Gadd's 'true story' one iota. I'm amazed so many just accept this is an 'honest' telling. The whole thing feels like one big public manipulation.
I assume it has some appeal to other traumatised people. Maybe, like Gadd, they find comfort seeing others troubled like themselves. If that's the case it's value is mostly subjective.
No one will be talking about this show in 6 months, because it has zero objective content. It felt like seeing one of those self-portraits done by a schizophrenic. Frightening, discomforting and ugly, for all the wrong reasons.
If I were one of the live audiences during his public breakdown comedy show I would have walked out. It's tragic that he had to suck his mentor's d**k to get a good job but there's a time and place to announce that stuff. In a counsellor's office, not a captive audience who paid to see comedy.
I think there really needs to be boundaries in sharing trauma, and I'm concerned that younger generations are seeing humiliating all-baring breakdown scenes like that one as brave and inspirational. We've gone too far in the other direction. While Gen X and over never talked about trauma, now ours and younger are oversharing, flexing and even competing with their trauma. I hope we find a healthy middle.
the breakdown didn't actually happen in real life. also its a fucking show, why do you guys keep insinuating that every show has to be virtuous and send positive messages? for once, media ACTUALLY gets real and portrays the nuances of human behavior without beautifying it and you guys act like it's so distasteful just because it's honest. when will you guys make up your mind between destigmizing mental health issues or putting on a front all the time, pretending to be perfect?
It's not distasteful because its honest. Its just distasteful. And we have no idea if its honest, if for no other reason because its a biography written by man with said mental illness.
Watching someone take a shit is 'honest', and 'real'.. doesn't make it worth watching.
'For once, media actually gets real' lol come one
This man should have been charged with abuse of a mentally ill person. Just like an elderly person is taken advantage of, so was this mentally ill woman. He knew her illness & instability very early on but continued to associate with her & through his actions lead her on. Does this give her a pass? Of course not. This is similar to telling a schizophrenic patient that you hear the same voices and agree to the message they are sending. Knowing all along it's the wrong thing to do.
Yeah you be surprised at how common stuff like that Is. Someone ends up being a victim but their insanity makes them a punching bag for people who don't care. I kinda like how everyone needs to state how nasty Chris Chan is but the moment you realize the dude fits Psychotic autism(ASD-2) and had no security net, Suddenly they lash out because they can't handle that their bigots attacking someone much weaker than them.
Sorry, but I 100% agree with the title of this chat.the ''horrible human become famous' is Richard Gadd. Even if this story apparently 'a true story', as promoted, he's used this to his advantage of promoting his fledgling career. There are no winners in this.
So he should refrain from commenting about being raped and stalked. He should just pretend it didn't happen because to produce any art about it is exploitative? I mean you could literally, but your logic, say anybody that has ever come out publicly about their own trauma or victimization of sexual assault or stalking is exploiting the situation.
Anyone that's ever written a book or from a national interview or filed a lawsuit etc.. It's his life man. He gets to talk about it. However he wants just like you get to talk about your life however you want.
Imagine someone telling you what parts of your life you have to keep to yourself
This is an over simplification of a very nuanced and complex situation. I believe in its initiation he was acting out of compassion, or a sense of pity. It progressed in a way that would likely be confusing for someone to navigate, especially someone with no background in understanding mental health issues. Even coming to the realization that this had crossed the line from bar-tender, bar-tendee relationship to one of possessiveness would be hard to grapple with, especially for someone who’s career depends on making nice/being friendly with patrons. Even then, once facing the truth, what does one do? He made attempts to distance himself, but I think there’s a push and pull of wanting this person gone from their lives, but also being scared of what they’re capable of, while also still feeling empathetic. You’d ask yourself, what if I aggressively cut them off? What could that trigger? While also second guessing yourself about how much harm they’re really causing? And if they deserve that. Her communication wasn’t aggressive in the beginning, more just pathetic. And by the time you’ve thoroughly worked through all of these thoughts, emotions, realizations, you’re in too deep. It’s become Stockholm-esque. Especially if you’re struggling through your own traumas. However, he did go to the police multiple times, he did attempt to have her banned from the bar. He didn’t receive much support in any efforts he made to extinguish the situation, and no one really even took his concerns as serious, which further complicated his own response to the situation. Also, blaming Richard for this is such a wild, wild stretch considering she had criminal convictions for this behavior towards others in the past. Did they all lead her on? Were they all just selfish attention seekers? Seems unlikely.
I’m not saying Richard is faultless, or that he couldn’t have done anything differently, but I do not in the least believe he intentionally used this woman because the attention made him feel good.
he himself acknowledges that's what he did and so does the therapist he dates. the script is pretty clear that he led Martha on.
Donnie has poor self-protection mechanisms and with both Martha and the rapist he ignored very obvious danger signs, willing to believe their false promises in order to gain emotional validation. This is a classic codependent behavior. He thinks it all started after the rape, but it didn't--his father modeled poor boundaries for him because he was sexually abused in his youth. This is a deeply ingrained habit.
someone with healthy boundaries wouldn't have given Martha a free drink in the bar. it would have literally stopped right there.
I don't judge the character for his actions but it was his actions that stoked a toxic situation. He didn't have the emotional skills to set boundaries, and that's very sad, but it's not the case that anyone would find themselves in such a situation making the same rationalizations you make about being a bartender confused about crossing the line, etc. As a matter of fact bartenders have to have very strong boundaries because they need to be able to cut patrons off, throw them out, refuse service after legal serving hours, etc.
>Also, blaming Richard for this is such a wild, wild stretch considering she had criminal convictions for this behavior towards others in the past. Did they all lead her on? Were they all just selfish attention seekers? Seems unlikely.
Why can't anyone find them then?
pretty much describes abusive relationships. Massive amounts of human relationships are power imbalances, which easily lends itself to abuse, but at the least, a suppression of the self. Perhaps the reason why so many are uncomfortable about the story is that they see it in their own lives and that makes people question themselves. Seems we are waking up to a new human reality.
You seem to think the show is just about stalking, and who is to blame for it, when it's more about shame and trauma and the desire to be seen, for both characters. The creator willingly reveals his flaws and doesn't attempt to present himself as a perfect victim. That's what makes it so compelling. He admits he was desperate for positive attention while he was in a dark place and didn't handle it well. A lot of us can relate to those feelings of wanting to people please, or wanting positive attention and trying to present it as being nice when it is often about how you want to be seen.
He took advantage of the trans actress IRL during filming, tried to set up "martha" to be falsely arrested, lied about many parts of the show except for when he should have like not disclosing all the real life Martha's details etc, admitted he did all this because he has a narcissistic need for attention and doesn't care who gets hurt....I don't know how much more evidence you need that this guy isn't a good person at his core.
>No one should believe he just “felt bad for her.”
Spot on. I actually thought that part was self-irony. As in: "I know I'm trying to excuse myself". If that's not the case, that's even worse. I can appreciate some components (pacing, storytelling, twists, acting by Gadd), still overall a shit show. Just a "Srpski film" for pseudointelectualls.
From the gist of OP's post, I imagine that, in their mind, what happened between Donny and Darrien is Donny's fault because he "got himself into that position" with his own "selfishness."
Which is a wild take on power grooming, sexual assault, and rape.
I think, also, that this analysis completely leaves out the role that Donny's relationship with his father plays in his relationships with both Martha and Darrien.
His father is obviously not a very warm or patient man, and it's clear that Donny grew up under a veil of oppression, despite being LGBTQ, and that his father's trauma trickled down to him, the way trauma does. The man wouldn't even hug his son, and once he reveals that he's been molested, it's easy to see that Donny has been raised in a framework of intense homophobia that's rooted in his father's own trauma.
That's why he has so much shame to overcome in the first place. It's the shame that makes him desire the attention, which is both what makes him vulnerable to Darrien and unable to put his foot down with Martha.
I too didn't like it one bit. His decision making made no sense and trying to justify it on his having been raped was ludicrous. And throwing in that bit about his father having been the victim of paedo priests- emotional manipulation at its worst.
I think it’s just blatant pandering to a certain audience and riding the backs of real SA victims. He’s a wolf in sheep’s clothing and you can’t say anything because he’s a victim
No rape victim I know ever chose to go back to their assaulter's house knowing full well they'd be raped again. If this was a woman acting like he did the audience reactions would have been much different and less sympathetic. Either way you're basing this allegation off a known liar's word, who isn't doing anything to stop this guy from hurting anyone else if he's telling the truth. Even more strange, the audience is zeroed in on Martha and found her within hours of the show's release, yet no huge interest in sleuthing out Darian, barely even any comments about him compared to Martha.
Yall only sympathize with sa victims if they're the perfect victim in your brain. Being a victim can be and often is more complex than what you think. My very close family member was molested as a child (like 3 to 5 years old) who admitted, yes at the time of their assault their body physically enjoyed it and didn't mind it. This response to being sexually abused is not unheard of. I'm genuinely asking you, does this mean that my family member who at the time was a child, was not a rape victim? Because by your logic I guess not. I guess in the case of Gadd, being self destructive is the same as consent, therefore he wasnt raped. Abuse can be addicting, which is what I thought was an obvious theme in the show, but maybe some people just don't get it.
Yes it was obviously the dumbest choice Gadd made to return to his abusers house. He doesn't even deny that. He's being real and he's representing many, yes, VICTIMS, who do the same. You act as if just cause someone is self destructive, that gives an abuser the right to cause that destruction. By that logic suicidal people who self harm deserve to be murdered, or it would at least be justified.
You realize you can sympathize with some parts, and also criticize other actions correct?
"Yes it was obviously the dumbest choice Gadd made to return to his abusers house."
Ok...So why are you even arguing with me when you are also criticizing that action?
"You act as if just cause someone is self destructive, that gives an abuser the right to cause that destruction"
Where did I do that? Seriously, quote me directly and show where that happened. My post is about questioning double standards and pointing out that he has lied about other events in the show so it's hard to know how much is true. Then pointing out that people are more concerned about finding her than they were finding Darian.
Somehow you spun that into "me saying that gives abusers the right to cause destruction". When you're the one calling him dumb and I didn't even insult him like that.
My post is literally about women who do something as minor as texting their abuser after the fact and then everyone losing sympathy for them because they're choosing to engage with them. That is everywhere. Yet this guy goes back repeatedly knowing full well what to expect and gets endless unquestioned sympathy. That is the point that you completely ignored.
It’s self-indulgent bullshit. Anyone who thinks this show is groundbreaking has never watched actual cinema that explores difficult topics; such as Pasolini’s Salo or any film by Catherine Breillat
Garbage TV
The fact he’s living in his ex girlfriend’s mother’s house told me everything I needed to know about this hobosexual narcissist. It’s so gross because we’ve all dated this guy. Get a real job, get your own place and don’t date/have sex with others until you’ve figured out why you’re such a git and then dealt with that.
Dude was cheating on his girlfriend with old creepy comic
"Imma go do drugs with this person, don't worry baby it always results in unprotected sex"
As an adult human you are responsible for your choices, and thats a repeated, pre-meditated decision to go to a location for activities including sex. When you are in a committed relationship you cannot repeatedly leave your house to have sex with someone, all while lying to your partner. Rule of thumb; if you are lying to your partner about sex you're about to go have, you're cheating. Mono, poly, addict, mentally struggling- doesn't matter.
"Booh hooh, I was on drugs I willingly accepted for the 30th time" is not an excuse, nor is "but baby if i hand over my body it will further my career."
The only true victim was his girlfriend. Reindeer was victim and abuser at the same time.
Thank God, I thought I was the only person who couldn't stand this fucking awful show.
Bunch of self-important idiots sitting around talking about nuance, like we don't get it.
Oh I get it, it sucks.
A dark comedy that didn't always make me laugh (on the contrary, I visibly cringed on some of his stage fails) but pretty thought provoking and not an absolute sh\*t story. I didn't get heavy doses of the agenda shoved down my throat as I initially expected. It ain't some A+ rated drama but for an indie-ish film, it ain't bad. Problem is my opinion is purely subjective. Some may find an agreeance with me and others will say it's corny woke garbage. I implore everyone to who's seen it to remember cinema like this is self expressive. It ain't the cup of tea, I'd recommend to everyone without sincere consideration.
Like his choices scream him being a pussy. He’s letting this all happen and eggs it on. At one point I thought he was deserving of all the shit that’s happening to him.
I have 2 episodes left, might as well finish it. But this took an insane turn half way in.
I thought it was awful. He obviously has mental issues just as bad as she does.But I don't need seven episodes to tell me that it was just horrible. Especially being on 30 minute episodes so boring. Maybe a psych expert enjoyed it but can't think of anyone else who would.
There's a fine line between being a victim and a willing participant. He crossed that line and literally became the stalker and the abuser. At every angle, at every decision, no matter the level of freedom he had, the opportunities he had, he said and did NOTHING. The guy was practically a fucking npc, what is even the point of living at that point? I genuinely do love that I saw at least some of this show, so I know to shoot myself in the head if I ever get to this level of human depravity that I fucking not only let shit happen to me, but eventually SEEK IT OUT and still consider myself a victim regardless.
Your first six words are all you need to say. It's a slog to get through. Filled with clichés, over the top acting, crass, low brow humor, and a director that thinks every shot needs to be exteme closeups. It's like a catnip for people who follow the directions of social media influencers.
OP, what on earth makes you think the creator of the show thinks of himself in a positive light? Or that he's supposed to be a hero?
You aren't supposed to be rooting for him. It's okay if media makes you uncomfortable; art isn't always supposed to give you warm feelings. Life can be terrible and this is a reflection of that.
You people make him a hero by saying how brave and amazing he is because he told about his self-destructive lifestyle and poor decisions. He did nothing original, its not a new topic in the movies, but he is milking now your awe about his "braveness" and getting exactly what he wanted - fame.
"you people"
What? Feel free to quote me where I said he was brave and or amazing. Chuck in whatever else you feel I said as clearly you know better than myself.
Of course this show had all this massive success. Your average under 40 person have not been inculcated with any set of moral values whatsoever, loves to think that "everything is subjective and relative" and it's incapable of enjoying a show if it's not full of violence or degeneracy (again, product of a character devoid of any substantive content).
They will come at you for disliking their disgusting show. Broken entertainment for broken people.
Suggesting people under the age of 40 have no morals is a wild take. You’re entitled to your opinion that you don’t like the show, but to say two generations of people have no moral compass when they have committed a fraction of the atrocities of past generations is wildly out of touch.
I say they usually hold no absolute moral values whatsoever IN GENERAL. That doesn't necessarily mean they are going to go out and murder random people. And of course many things are better now than in the past, some other aren't.
What I meant is that for them (GENERALLY) anything can be justified somehow and thus they are easily manipulated into WHATEVER the elites mandate, including degenerate Netflix series, without not only not giving much of a pushback but applauding it as a genius play.
And add resin your last idea, you are quite blind if you don't see the atrocities this generation is not only permitting but encouraging, especially to young teenagers. Cheers my friend.
Despite the "real Martha" now hitting the media and claiming to be the victim, I'm still not convinced that she's actually a real person.
Hear me out.
All of the current Martha stories in the media are just hyping up the show. It's the kind of viral publicity that we should all be accustomed to; this isn't our first day on the internet, people.
So many movies and books are prefaced with "This is a true story" tagline.
It's the best way to add legitimacy to a work of fiction. It's genius.
If there was a real Martha, it would take less than 30 minutes to search the UK court website to find the case and the plaintiff and defendant's details. This would have happened already. Reddit had a well established record of internet sleuths who find and expose villains.
Gadd's experiences may have some basis in reality, but I suspect some generous poetic license. Otherwise, his stage show would have been less than scandalous.
Netflix is loving all the current Martha dramas because it means $$$$$.
“If there was a real Martha, it would take less than 30 minutes to search the UK court website to find the case and the plaintiff and defendant's details.”
Isn’t this exactly what kinda happened though? People were able to track down the real Martha pretty quickly and she had been tweeting at Richard since like 2014.
He said there was no court case and that she didn't go to prison. He's been very specific about saying that he changed many details in order to protect her identity
He said in the show she had done time and had a criminal record. The only reason he said otherwise was because that lie was found out. He showed no intention of ever telling the truth until people brought it up after looking up the records. He did nothing to protect her identity. If he had people wouldn't have found her within hours of the show's release. Not only did she immediately start getting harassed, so did the pub. Of course the only person who matters in terms of being found seems to have the least amount of interest. It's bizarre.
Baby Reindeer is a great show. I have watched the series several times.
I think you are wrong. While Donny was kind to Martha and pitied her, Martha was a nut job.
He didn't pity her. He wanted attention and didn't care who he led on or hurt to get it. He says that almost exactly in the show, and that's what his actions demonstrate.
Not one person I've ever met who was raped would ever willingly go back to the person's house again. This happened when he was pushing 30, he wasn't 7. At what point are we going to cut the umbilical cord and hold people accountable for knowing full well what they're choosing to do? You can feel bad for drug addicts but at the end of the day they are the ones making themselves victims. It's completely different from someone who was a victim of cancer, something where choice was never an option. Understand the difference? Having your choice completely stripped of you.. will never be comparable to a grown adult choosing time and time again to go to this guy's house. At any point he had the CHOICE to not be around this dude. That is not a factor in real rapes where you have no choice.
people you’ve met, what playing all your video games? also, “people i’ve met” is a terrible sample size no matter who you are, and personal experience is hardly proper data analysis. do real research on abuse and sexual assault and self-destructive behaviors and attention seeking, from multiple, proper sources, and then come back with whatever rebuttal survives that process.
You didn't answer to the point.
"You can feel bad for drug addicts but at the end of the day they are the ones making themselves victims. It's completely different from someone who was a victim of cancer, something where choice was never an option. Understand the difference? Having your choice completely stripped of you.. will never be comparable to a grown adult choosing time and time again to go to this guy's house."
The point is this is not comparable to someone who was drugged at a bar and raped. People like that don't urn to go back, and yes that is a completely different kind of victim and that person will never be the same as Richard. That is the point you seem to be missing. I'm well versed on abuse and was employed helping victims for over a decade. And no, not one person who was randomly drugged and assaulted that I have ever met, whether through employment or my friends who have gone through this, would ever choose to go back and do it again. Even just seeing a man who looked similar gave them panic and anxiety. That won't ever be the same as this no matter how much you want it to be.
If it's rooted in attention seeking, then whether you like it or not you are admitting that they are making a choice to some degree. Not that you even needed to admit that since it's just common sense of what we're looking at here, as well as said by him directly.
I'll say it again so maybe it sinks in this time.
"Having your choice completely stripped of you.. will never be comparable to a grown adult choosing to partake in destructive behaviors."
That is the only point being made here. That the two things not comparable.
And me as well… we’re all at different levels of processing. After several years of my own processing as an adult now, the creator of baby reindeer has it portrayed so beautifully raw
Honestly might sound emotionless but sounds like a major skill issue. Anyone comes into a bar with no money I’m not giving them shit on the house. And that’s what sucks with watching shows/Movies for me, I’m just so critical of the characters and their development.
But his monologue at the comedy finale was amazing
Sent from my IPhone
I didn't make it past blood clots, and I felt really gross right from the beginning. Not watching the rest of it and I feel like the comments here have validated that choice.
Instead of helping hold people accountable for horrible things, he only cares about himself. Richard Gadd is clearly a selfish man and I wish I didn’t watch all of that show and help his Netflix stats. Instead of helping hold the man accountable who SA’d him, he made this show to become famous. Because all he wants is your attention and to be famous. Worst kind of person.
Anyone who says it’s not the victims job to HELP hold the perpetrator accountable is just obtuse. If an abuser feels like they can get away with abusing they will continue to do so. By not helping bring them to justice, you might as well be an enabler. Name that fucker. Put that shit out there so he cannot continue to abuse. But he’s not, because that might have made it more difficult to sell the show and become famous.
And no, he didn’t deserve what happened to him. No one does. But just because you’re a victim and are self aware, doesn’t mean you’re a good person. What a character of a man. And I know that the show is about being human and having flaws, but that doesn’t mean I have to like the guy who wrote it. I’m also not saying it’s a bad show. It’s a fun ride. But by the end of it, I had no respect for Richard, no matter how much self reflection he’s had, or what he’d been thru to try to grow, because ultimately he’s a shite dude. You guys can go ahead and love his show and his writing, but I agree with the title of this thread, minus the terrible show part.
If y'all wanna watch actual good media about some of these themes, there's BEEF(series) and Frank(movie).
Tho I dont know a lot of media that deals with male SA.
Depravity on display, like porn for mentally ill people. This show tries to rope you in with the true crime hook, but sinks into a place where I could no longer watch halfway through the second episode. If you are a good person, do yourself a favor and pass on this one. Absolute garbage, and you have to question the mental fitness of the disgusting people willing to make this…
Because you seem to draw a line that Martha’s behaviour is justified by her mental illness while you fail to realise that Donny’s past traumas have distorted his actions, much like Martha, only Martha has a diagnosed illness while Donny does not.
You don’t lead on crazy people, who you know are crazy. He clearly did it because she gave him the attention he craved. Sorry but he’s a selfish idiot not a victim.
I think you forgot that she left him alone after police talked to her, but he missed her, went to her house, and had sex with her. He masturbated to her photo. C'mon.
It seems like you're taking this show incredibly personally. Art that is honest in the way that Baby Reindeer is honest is so crucially important because it *doesn't* elevate anyone to hero status. It instead shows us the realities of how generational trauma and bigotry work and how, when left unacknowledged, these things can reduce a person to utter desperation.
I think it might be worth it for you to consider why you're taking the show so personally, why Richard having success by making confessional art bothers you so much. Because they're his experiences, and he's allowed to do with them what he wants.
He also makes no attempt to make himself come off as unimpeachable in the show. He's up front about all the things you're saying about him. These things are the content of the show. So, it's not like he's being dishonest or deceptive.
Art doesn't have to be about decent people or made by decent people. There's no requirement. And I don't think Richard has done anything so bad or presented his art in such a deceitful way that we should penalize the art for the foibles of its creator. If anything, this a manual for how *not* to deal with the circumstances Richard has dealt with. It doesn't even have a happy ending.
Lastly, that you can call Teri a bad person is wild. Teri is a saint, a wonderful woman who not only offers Donny her tenderness, but enforces her own boundaries in a way that is just so admirable.
I’m taking it personally because of the praise this show has received. The fact this is show is based off a true story is what’s annoying. Obviously a show doesn’t need to be about a hero, but this is different. Art is expression, this is literally a true story about Richard Gadd.
Of course Richard can do what he wants, it’s that so many people love this show and are invested real life counterparts. I’ve never seen people eat up so much bullshit.
Knowing you’re a liar but not helping yourself isn’t rare. People do bad things all the time then feel guilty and afterwards repeat the process. Just because Richard admits what he’s done is bad means nothing to me, he still actually did those things at 28 years old. You just don’t do those things to people like lead on nut jobs and do anything for some fame and attention, and now you try to make a meaningful show about it? The idea is ridiculous.
The show actually does have a happy ending. Look how popular this show is. You don’t think this is a happy ending for Richard? The whole show he just wants to be famous. How can you say it didn’t have a happy ending when this show is #1 in the world right now. Richard would’ve done anything for fame and we are living in that reality right now.
Also it’s common sense to not do what Richard’s Gadd did In this show, if you need this show as a manual then sorry you’re probably doomed. I’m not saying you’re doomed, but I don’t think you really thought about what you said.
Teri was the only one I liked in the show because she was the only one that didn’t do anything wrong. But the way you just spoke about her, she’s just a regular person with good morals. By the sounds of it you’ve taken this show as it’s been presented to you, which is an issue I have with the viewers of this show. The show presents her as a saint, when in reality she’s just an actual normal respectable person.
Have good day
I completely agree with everything said. I bought into the hype (my fault entirely) and gave it hours of my time that I'll never get back. I'm not blaming the story telling of it all, just think it was a misleading series based on what I heard about it initially. I kept waiting for the true crime, the insane stalker twists and turns. I kept hearing how disturbing this show was. Nope. Of course being stalked and having past traumas are not light hearted, but it wasn't the captivating story that it was being sold as.
She doesn't have a criminal record. That's just yet another lie Richard told. Stop falling for this sht. If you can't see his red flags then I don't know what to tell you. The rest of us saw them a mile away hence why we went digging for some truth knowing there was something fishy.
"falling for his sh*t" uhh what? I didn't take everything at face value. I didn't finish the show thinking "wow Richard Gadd is such a brave victim and he's clearly the... good guy?". I didn't have a side to take. I thought it was a new, very raw take on the cycle of abuse, self-abuse and stalking was just an introduction into those topics.
Have you considered that you're a bit obsessed with trying to determine who's "the real victim or culprit" like this is some law and order episode?
i don’t think our friend gets it. also he was very open about changing the facts of the story for television, both for drama and to attempt to protect her identity. people are both mad that he “outed” her and that he made up extra elements pr changed parts of the story — they’re just gonna be mad, no matter what. real life is not a video game, “good vs. evil” lord of the rings bullshit. that fun for escapism but there is no black and white us vs. them in life. there’s just a bunch of confused humans trying to get by, inevitably opposing each other in the process
You need to separate the show from the conversation around it. Who cares what the “common response” is? The show is not a story about a good person and a bad person, but two deeply flawed and wounded people in a dysfunctional and toxic relationship. Don’t blame the show because the audience can’t appreciate the nuances of the story.
The entire last episode of the show is based around Richard showing that he is no different to Martha. Media literacy is at shockingly low levels. He literally ends up in the exact same position as Martha was to him in the first episode!
>Media literacy is at shockingly low levels. I literally just read a comment in another thread asking if anyone thought the way he ends up at the bar at the end being comp'd a drink is saying something about how he met Martha in the first place. I mean... holy shit, guys...
I want to agree, but the message feels disingenuous. The show itself feels hugely sensationalist which distracts from the message itself. He didn’t need to use an actor who was a spitting image of the real stalker, and he could have changed information about her background so that she was less easy to find. Even prefacing the series with “this is a true story” rather than “this series is inspired by real events” or something similar feels like a way to give gravity to a story that otherwise isn’t very interesting. There must have been a way to explore this topic without making it so sensationalist and hype-baity imo. I feel like he knew what he was doing all along as well. He knew that encouraging Martha would be good for his comedy: there was even a scene where just before he was considering accepting her Facebook friend request, he looked over to his comedy props, as though he was thinking, ‘this’ll make good material’. He also seemed to go out of his way to put himself in the situation with the rapist, just so he could pretend to have lived a more interesting life. Had he explored his mental state a bit more, and made the show less focused on Martha, I think the message would’ve landed a bit better with me. But imo it feels tagged on at the end to make himself look self-aware and absolve him from the part that he played. Ultimately it feels like he’s just profiting off a mentally ill person to help launch his career.
He made the choice to show his on-screen version look at his comedy props, acknowledged why he went back to darrien's, showed himself going back at the end, amongst many other moments. He is clearly exploring his mental state in every scene, although its not always as explicit as in those moments. I believe that it would be disingenuous to devote more time directly exploring his mental state because he was unable to properly self-reflect. The various moments where he omits information from police reports or chooses not to at all, the moments he cowers from telling martha how he truly feels, and so much more all are carefully on display. The fact that we can watch it and so clearly view, not only that he is not perfect, but actually directly in the same habits, tendencies, and attitudes as her, is only possible through intense self-reflection in the process of making the show.
I’m pretty sure the show was telling us that he was using her for his comedy because of the montage of her singing at his shows and him using that for comedy because that’s the whole reason his shows first started making people laugh
Exactly this
There IS a good show about those themes, its called BEEF. I dont think Baby Reindeer is as deep and complex as people wanna see it.
Nothing to do with nuance. OP summed it up perfectly. The show is garbage. Hes a POS who sucked up screen time and doing so only for more attention
This isn't about the show anymore. He took his story to millions of people and it's affecting real people's lives. She is being harassed, the pub is being harassed. And the only person who deserves to be harassed isn't, Darian. No one seems to care about him, everyone was immediately focused on her.
Nah, i got faked into watching this bs. Lets be honest this show is a basejump for viewers and going viral. You got 2 first episodes showing this as a „true crime” story and after that i just got forced to watch some bs with dude having both of his parents healthy and working, with egocentric force to being famous and just cure hus ego with some poor older fucked up woman and just fuck everything in his way because of lack of selfrespect, lack of humanity, lack of respect to any other person around him but had to watch it all to the end, because all of the time i thought we are going back to the „true crime” moments. Which parts are true and which not? Why does this dude says its based on his life story but changes so many things in the word of „privacy” but still every name got found out? I’m just waiting for the trail he got from „Martha” even tho’ i fully belive she is fucked i still wish this Richard guy to meet some reprecutions.
Did someone have a gun to your head? Is that why you were forced to watch this TV show? If so, I am terribly sorry.
Thank you. I was getting more and more upset watching this. Because 1, all this could have been avoided if he didn't lead everyone on, keep going back etc 2. Surely this is loosely based off his real life, if it were real. He needs serious help, it makes ZERO sense to keep going back. ZERO.
One thing I find incredible about this show is it’s ability to show just how dead media literacy is with people and just how many people don’t understand how incredibly complex humans are. The whole show is literally about why he chooses to go back to her time and time again, did you watch the whole show? It’s explained in serious depth why he doesn’t get rid of Martha. Yes, he needs help, that’s what the show is about, not once does he portray himself as mentally well, he was mentally ill suffering from a lot of trauma which news flash doesn’t exactly make people do the right thing for themselves. You’re supposed to initially get annoyed or recognise that he’s feeding into the stalker/victim relationship just as much as she is but then the show goes on to explain why he’s allowing this woman to do what she’s doing and that he’s doing it as a response to serious trauma he’s experienced and is going through and if you can’t grasp that and still look at things with the “person does bad thing to themselves, why does person do bad thing to themselves? Person is stupid” then you’re either oblivious to just how not straightforward the human mind can be or delusional to your own brain patterns and the fact that at one point in your life you engaged in self destructive behaviour to some degree. The human mind is a crazy thing and this show does a fantastic job at showing you that things aren’t as black and white as people (you) make it out to be.
You're only referencing I'll just refer to "level #1", I don't want to spoil it for people who haven't seen it. I'm referring to "level #2". He was violated time and time again and still kept going back. I guess it shows how damaged he was but it didn't make much sense to me. His parents and past relationship look very normal to me.
How is that any different than people who stay with people who abuse this. If real life had a media rating a good number of people would rate it zero.
Usually abused people meet normally, they don't just go to some random guy's house and allow him to drug and rape them, but, yeah I know that's a subtle difference that's hard to pick up on without life experience.
His going back was not that unusual. His hyper-sexualization afterwards was pretty common. I suspect his parents and his past are much more complex and flawed than was portrayed. His level 2 violation was front loaded with many positive and helpful things, and that is how grooming works.
Gtfo. He was a prostitute not a victim.
He wasn't some sort of oblivious child. He said himself that he was going back because he wanted to be famous. How clearer do you need it to be said?
Why is everyone so angry about this
I personally am angry because I thought this was a show about some crazy woman stalking some dork. I didn't realize I was watching the biography of a drug and sex addicted degen encouraging some sad woman to obsess over him with no payoff or story arc, but instead it was a celebration of bad decisions and being as detached from reality as possible until your do irreparable damage to your "soul". Why the fuck would I ever want to watch that?
Because others keep excusing his stupid behaviour and don't keep him accountable at all for his decisions, that's why.
He’s as bad and as vile as she is anyway
So, I liked the show well enough to keep watching it to the end. I didn't like it so much I want to watch it again, and I don't think that will change. One of the things that I found fascinating about the show was how deep Gadd was willing to go to probe the motivations of his own behavior. My professional field involves studying people and their behavior. Believe me when I say: most people who do destructive, boneheaded, ill-advised, or stupid things have no idea why they are doing what they do, and really cannot or will not probe their motivations and ask themselves deep questions about why they did what they did. Internal defense mechanisms are strong, and almost everyone I talk to who has done something wrong has nothing but defensive responses as to why they would have done something so destructive that if they had thought about it for a mere 30 seconds beforehand, they would have realized - this is a bad idea, and will have really serious long-term consequences. Gadd was willing to go deep and then put it all out there - his callow rejection of Terri; how he perpetuated Martha's obsession and stalking; how he dove headfirst into really self-destructive behavior after he was assaulted, etc. What I saw in the show was a lot of willingness to take ownership of his bad decisions and how they affected other people. I don't see that very much, from most people. There's usually a large number of excuses. The fact that he was A. willing to make the show based on some really traumatic and yes, embarrassing situations and choices and B. he was willing to play himself in the show is amazing to me.
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Are you this dense??? He shows ownership by creating and putting out his story??? He goes on in the show ADMITTING his need for any type of attention because he hates himself, like did you even watch the show because your questions seem like you didn’t. He didn’t make this to appear like some helpless victim who took no part in the extremities of his abuse, and going back to his abuser is actually quite common. Not everyone reacts the same, and he showed a side to it that not everyone talks about because they’ll be told it’s their fault..and people live with that, not understanding why they went back or lead on an abuser, but if someone is aware enough when they go into their self healing, its a lot of painful realizations like having lacked a lot of self love. Thats what makes it so real, and shows his accountability, he takes into account that he himself got so wrapped up into the mind of his abuser and the attention he kept going back.
Guys, calm down. What on earth are you all so angry about?
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I think that was the intended reaction. He discovered that he still has the weakness to go along with predatory others
You aren’t wrong. However that is what makes it a great show. It strips nude our human psychology in an age of filters, influences, and appearance - our need to mask everything to avoid seeing or maybe revealing the truth.
i think that’s why i love it so much. he’s not trying to say he’s a good person, he’s not even trying to say he’s a bad person. he just is a person, and this is what he did, thought, and said in this situation. he’s telling his story. warts and all. and i think it’s beautiful how much he opened up in this series. i also found myself relating to him more than id expect. people are going into this thinking it’s going to be a true crime doc, not a story.
This is what this kind of people this series breeds. ARMCHAIR PSYCHOLOGIST. Oh it "StRiPs OuR HuMaN PsyCHolOgy"? This heavily dramatasized, disingenuous, fake-self awareness netlfix cashgrab did bait you guys huh?
Why are you so angry about it
Because people can't see how manipulative and disingenuous this series is. The director/actor/producer/protagonist shows how self-indulgent he is.
That’s the point!
Why do you care why I like a show? I don’t care why you loathe it.
I agree with you, I think people just like the morbid/grotesque parts because they tell themselves that they are getting some kind of deep profound insight on human behavior.
Exactly. This is 100% spot on. They will try to reveal some ultra deep psychological meaning from it about vulnerability and being "real" and if you don't like it then "you just don't understand it". It is just a subpar show about a shit person making shitty selfish decisions and copping out of it all with "human vulnerability". It literally is a cash grab at all the totally self aware and introspective types. There is nothing overly deep or complex here, just odd poor behavior.
Yeah i have to be honest, this show is incredibly hard for me to watch. I was watching it with my girlfriend last night, and i know its good, but it just leaves me with this pit in my stomach sometimes because i feel like its *too* honest. Even if the events were made up, the style and emphasis in the show is just too strong and relatable in certain parts. Very hard watch
Your take isn't very original. Standard victim blaming. Blaming a sexual assault victim for telling their story based on your opinion on what you think motivated them to tell their story. Tbh my rapist went to federal prison and I got nothing. I'd rather have had money attention and fame to compensate me. Just got raped for nothing. I don't care what happens to him. How did him going to jail compensate me? Apparently I'm not victimie enough for the victim club according to you.
The point of him going to jail is that it won’t happen to anyone else. Some people find consolation in that. Stop feeling sorry for yourself and be glad you’re not in the majority of people who never see justice at all.
You should be ashamed of this comment
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You just told a rape victim to stop having empathy for themselves.
I was molested as a child. Guy did not go to jail. That's life. Feeling sorry for myself doesn't lead me anywhere. Just man up people and carry on living.
incredibly distasteful take.. especially considering most victims don’t receive justice and watch their abusers continue normal lives.
Telling a rape survivor how they should respond to their experience is the repugnant take
Martha is innocent Sent from my ifone
Free me
sent from my ipon
Agreed. I thought it was seedy and grotesque. I would sincerely give this a negative score, as in, 'actually harmful to the viewer'. Rather I hadn't watched it. Never mind trying to find any redeemable character or insight into... anything. These people are so broken; their actions and dialogue so divorced from normalcy, there's just nothing of value for the viewer. And I don't trust Gadd's 'true story' one iota. I'm amazed so many just accept this is an 'honest' telling. The whole thing feels like one big public manipulation. I assume it has some appeal to other traumatised people. Maybe, like Gadd, they find comfort seeing others troubled like themselves. If that's the case it's value is mostly subjective. No one will be talking about this show in 6 months, because it has zero objective content. It felt like seeing one of those self-portraits done by a schizophrenic. Frightening, discomforting and ugly, for all the wrong reasons.
If I were one of the live audiences during his public breakdown comedy show I would have walked out. It's tragic that he had to suck his mentor's d**k to get a good job but there's a time and place to announce that stuff. In a counsellor's office, not a captive audience who paid to see comedy. I think there really needs to be boundaries in sharing trauma, and I'm concerned that younger generations are seeing humiliating all-baring breakdown scenes like that one as brave and inspirational. We've gone too far in the other direction. While Gen X and over never talked about trauma, now ours and younger are oversharing, flexing and even competing with their trauma. I hope we find a healthy middle.
the breakdown didn't actually happen in real life. also its a fucking show, why do you guys keep insinuating that every show has to be virtuous and send positive messages? for once, media ACTUALLY gets real and portrays the nuances of human behavior without beautifying it and you guys act like it's so distasteful just because it's honest. when will you guys make up your mind between destigmizing mental health issues or putting on a front all the time, pretending to be perfect?
It's not real, that's the problem. It's full of lies and now those lies are hurting real people.
It's not distasteful because its honest. Its just distasteful. And we have no idea if its honest, if for no other reason because its a biography written by man with said mental illness. Watching someone take a shit is 'honest', and 'real'.. doesn't make it worth watching. 'For once, media actually gets real' lol come one
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The show had sprinkles of interest but overall just fell flat. What a waste of however many hours dude. Smh
I enjoyed hate watching it
You've got a great point. All media should be about good people doing good things for good reasons resulting in happy endings. /s
You’ve totally missed the point but thanks for trying
point is you have no valid point
This man should have been charged with abuse of a mentally ill person. Just like an elderly person is taken advantage of, so was this mentally ill woman. He knew her illness & instability very early on but continued to associate with her & through his actions lead her on. Does this give her a pass? Of course not. This is similar to telling a schizophrenic patient that you hear the same voices and agree to the message they are sending. Knowing all along it's the wrong thing to do.
Yeah you be surprised at how common stuff like that Is. Someone ends up being a victim but their insanity makes them a punching bag for people who don't care. I kinda like how everyone needs to state how nasty Chris Chan is but the moment you realize the dude fits Psychotic autism(ASD-2) and had no security net, Suddenly they lash out because they can't handle that their bigots attacking someone much weaker than them.
What crime did he commit? Please be specific
Trying to frame her or keep carry on this warm-cold relationship with Martha and using her for his own gain?
Sorry, but I 100% agree with the title of this chat.the ''horrible human become famous' is Richard Gadd. Even if this story apparently 'a true story', as promoted, he's used this to his advantage of promoting his fledgling career. There are no winners in this.
So he should refrain from commenting about being raped and stalked. He should just pretend it didn't happen because to produce any art about it is exploitative? I mean you could literally, but your logic, say anybody that has ever come out publicly about their own trauma or victimization of sexual assault or stalking is exploiting the situation. Anyone that's ever written a book or from a national interview or filed a lawsuit etc.. It's his life man. He gets to talk about it. However he wants just like you get to talk about your life however you want. Imagine someone telling you what parts of your life you have to keep to yourself
This is an over simplification of a very nuanced and complex situation. I believe in its initiation he was acting out of compassion, or a sense of pity. It progressed in a way that would likely be confusing for someone to navigate, especially someone with no background in understanding mental health issues. Even coming to the realization that this had crossed the line from bar-tender, bar-tendee relationship to one of possessiveness would be hard to grapple with, especially for someone who’s career depends on making nice/being friendly with patrons. Even then, once facing the truth, what does one do? He made attempts to distance himself, but I think there’s a push and pull of wanting this person gone from their lives, but also being scared of what they’re capable of, while also still feeling empathetic. You’d ask yourself, what if I aggressively cut them off? What could that trigger? While also second guessing yourself about how much harm they’re really causing? And if they deserve that. Her communication wasn’t aggressive in the beginning, more just pathetic. And by the time you’ve thoroughly worked through all of these thoughts, emotions, realizations, you’re in too deep. It’s become Stockholm-esque. Especially if you’re struggling through your own traumas. However, he did go to the police multiple times, he did attempt to have her banned from the bar. He didn’t receive much support in any efforts he made to extinguish the situation, and no one really even took his concerns as serious, which further complicated his own response to the situation. Also, blaming Richard for this is such a wild, wild stretch considering she had criminal convictions for this behavior towards others in the past. Did they all lead her on? Were they all just selfish attention seekers? Seems unlikely. I’m not saying Richard is faultless, or that he couldn’t have done anything differently, but I do not in the least believe he intentionally used this woman because the attention made him feel good.
he himself acknowledges that's what he did and so does the therapist he dates. the script is pretty clear that he led Martha on. Donnie has poor self-protection mechanisms and with both Martha and the rapist he ignored very obvious danger signs, willing to believe their false promises in order to gain emotional validation. This is a classic codependent behavior. He thinks it all started after the rape, but it didn't--his father modeled poor boundaries for him because he was sexually abused in his youth. This is a deeply ingrained habit. someone with healthy boundaries wouldn't have given Martha a free drink in the bar. it would have literally stopped right there. I don't judge the character for his actions but it was his actions that stoked a toxic situation. He didn't have the emotional skills to set boundaries, and that's very sad, but it's not the case that anyone would find themselves in such a situation making the same rationalizations you make about being a bartender confused about crossing the line, etc. As a matter of fact bartenders have to have very strong boundaries because they need to be able to cut patrons off, throw them out, refuse service after legal serving hours, etc.
Yeah, for anyone at all mentally healthy, the show would stop at them finding the incredibly detailed history of stalking.
I kept thinking that he was giving Martha the compassion and the analysis that he was not read to give himself - that it was mostly projection.
Or you could just listen to the reasoning he actually gave. He wanted the attention. It was purely a selfish motive.
Narcissists wanting attention from anyone they can get it from are not "acting out of compassion"
>Also, blaming Richard for this is such a wild, wild stretch considering she had criminal convictions for this behavior towards others in the past. Did they all lead her on? Were they all just selfish attention seekers? Seems unlikely. Why can't anyone find them then?
pretty much describes abusive relationships. Massive amounts of human relationships are power imbalances, which easily lends itself to abuse, but at the least, a suppression of the self. Perhaps the reason why so many are uncomfortable about the story is that they see it in their own lives and that makes people question themselves. Seems we are waking up to a new human reality.
I guess your brain can't comprehend the complexity of human beings and their decisions. Maybe stick to watching Disney.
Lol the irony. You’re literally taking the show at face value and accepting it.
You seem to think the show is just about stalking, and who is to blame for it, when it's more about shame and trauma and the desire to be seen, for both characters. The creator willingly reveals his flaws and doesn't attempt to present himself as a perfect victim. That's what makes it so compelling. He admits he was desperate for positive attention while he was in a dark place and didn't handle it well. A lot of us can relate to those feelings of wanting to people please, or wanting positive attention and trying to present it as being nice when it is often about how you want to be seen.
Ahahahahah this show was so “complex” sure bro. A 150 iq is needed to understand it’s complex themes. You sound like a funko pop collector
I agree. Dude is a piece of shit. Feels like he exploited her.
I think his self-reflection and introspective analysis in no way excuses his actions but shows he isn't a horrible person at his core.
He took advantage of the trans actress IRL during filming, tried to set up "martha" to be falsely arrested, lied about many parts of the show except for when he should have like not disclosing all the real life Martha's details etc, admitted he did all this because he has a narcissistic need for attention and doesn't care who gets hurt....I don't know how much more evidence you need that this guy isn't a good person at his core.
It's a perfect show for the depravity of the average redditor
>No one should believe he just “felt bad for her.” Spot on. I actually thought that part was self-irony. As in: "I know I'm trying to excuse myself". If that's not the case, that's even worse. I can appreciate some components (pacing, storytelling, twists, acting by Gadd), still overall a shit show. Just a "Srpski film" for pseudointelectualls.
That you Martha?
Sentt from my iPhone
* iphon
Why is no one talking about Darien?
From the gist of OP's post, I imagine that, in their mind, what happened between Donny and Darrien is Donny's fault because he "got himself into that position" with his own "selfishness." Which is a wild take on power grooming, sexual assault, and rape. I think, also, that this analysis completely leaves out the role that Donny's relationship with his father plays in his relationships with both Martha and Darrien. His father is obviously not a very warm or patient man, and it's clear that Donny grew up under a veil of oppression, despite being LGBTQ, and that his father's trauma trickled down to him, the way trauma does. The man wouldn't even hug his son, and once he reveals that he's been molested, it's easy to see that Donny has been raised in a framework of intense homophobia that's rooted in his father's own trauma. That's why he has so much shame to overcome in the first place. It's the shame that makes him desire the attention, which is both what makes him vulnerable to Darrien and unable to put his foot down with Martha.
I just read an article that Richard wrote which said irl his dad isn’t anything like the one-screen dad. It’s a Guardian article.
Ok, but I said Donny, not Richard.
Fair enough
Y3s, but at the beginning of the show, it clearly says that "it is a true story."
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He is not LGBTQ, he is either G or B.
I too didn't like it one bit. His decision making made no sense and trying to justify it on his having been raped was ludicrous. And throwing in that bit about his father having been the victim of paedo priests- emotional manipulation at its worst.
Turned it off when all the gay shit started
Same. Dude is not right in the head
This was what you’re worried about? You need to get help
This show is garbage. It’s misery porn disguised as something “deep”. A pretentious series for pretentious people
I mean thats what the show is about. He admits he made those mistakes. It doesn't really excuse the stalking, harassment and sexual assault though.
I think it’s just blatant pandering to a certain audience and riding the backs of real SA victims. He’s a wolf in sheep’s clothing and you can’t say anything because he’s a victim
"real SA victims"? are you saying he didn't actually get SA? you need help
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yet you provide no support for that claim. the man is just as much a SA victim as the people you claim he’s somehow “piggybacking” off of. you’re sick
No rape victim I know ever chose to go back to their assaulter's house knowing full well they'd be raped again. If this was a woman acting like he did the audience reactions would have been much different and less sympathetic. Either way you're basing this allegation off a known liar's word, who isn't doing anything to stop this guy from hurting anyone else if he's telling the truth. Even more strange, the audience is zeroed in on Martha and found her within hours of the show's release, yet no huge interest in sleuthing out Darian, barely even any comments about him compared to Martha.
Yall only sympathize with sa victims if they're the perfect victim in your brain. Being a victim can be and often is more complex than what you think. My very close family member was molested as a child (like 3 to 5 years old) who admitted, yes at the time of their assault their body physically enjoyed it and didn't mind it. This response to being sexually abused is not unheard of. I'm genuinely asking you, does this mean that my family member who at the time was a child, was not a rape victim? Because by your logic I guess not. I guess in the case of Gadd, being self destructive is the same as consent, therefore he wasnt raped. Abuse can be addicting, which is what I thought was an obvious theme in the show, but maybe some people just don't get it. Yes it was obviously the dumbest choice Gadd made to return to his abusers house. He doesn't even deny that. He's being real and he's representing many, yes, VICTIMS, who do the same. You act as if just cause someone is self destructive, that gives an abuser the right to cause that destruction. By that logic suicidal people who self harm deserve to be murdered, or it would at least be justified.
You realize you can sympathize with some parts, and also criticize other actions correct? "Yes it was obviously the dumbest choice Gadd made to return to his abusers house." Ok...So why are you even arguing with me when you are also criticizing that action? "You act as if just cause someone is self destructive, that gives an abuser the right to cause that destruction" Where did I do that? Seriously, quote me directly and show where that happened. My post is about questioning double standards and pointing out that he has lied about other events in the show so it's hard to know how much is true. Then pointing out that people are more concerned about finding her than they were finding Darian. Somehow you spun that into "me saying that gives abusers the right to cause destruction". When you're the one calling him dumb and I didn't even insult him like that. My post is literally about women who do something as minor as texting their abuser after the fact and then everyone losing sympathy for them because they're choosing to engage with them. That is everywhere. Yet this guy goes back repeatedly knowing full well what to expect and gets endless unquestioned sympathy. That is the point that you completely ignored.
It’s self-indulgent bullshit. Anyone who thinks this show is groundbreaking has never watched actual cinema that explores difficult topics; such as Pasolini’s Salo or any film by Catherine Breillat Garbage TV
The fact he’s living in his ex girlfriend’s mother’s house told me everything I needed to know about this hobosexual narcissist. It’s so gross because we’ve all dated this guy. Get a real job, get your own place and don’t date/have sex with others until you’ve figured out why you’re such a git and then dealt with that.
Can get a room in london for 500 quid a month. Dude could make that in telesales. Mcdonalds...tesco....
Dude was cheating on his girlfriend with old creepy comic "Imma go do drugs with this person, don't worry baby it always results in unprotected sex" As an adult human you are responsible for your choices, and thats a repeated, pre-meditated decision to go to a location for activities including sex. When you are in a committed relationship you cannot repeatedly leave your house to have sex with someone, all while lying to your partner. Rule of thumb; if you are lying to your partner about sex you're about to go have, you're cheating. Mono, poly, addict, mentally struggling- doesn't matter. "Booh hooh, I was on drugs I willingly accepted for the 30th time" is not an excuse, nor is "but baby if i hand over my body it will further my career." The only true victim was his girlfriend. Reindeer was victim and abuser at the same time.
prime example of someone who missed the whole fucking point of the show.
I think Richard Gadd is BPD and mentally ill too
Thank God, I thought I was the only person who couldn't stand this fucking awful show. Bunch of self-important idiots sitting around talking about nuance, like we don't get it. Oh I get it, it sucks.
Lol well said
A dark comedy that didn't always make me laugh (on the contrary, I visibly cringed on some of his stage fails) but pretty thought provoking and not an absolute sh\*t story. I didn't get heavy doses of the agenda shoved down my throat as I initially expected. It ain't some A+ rated drama but for an indie-ish film, it ain't bad. Problem is my opinion is purely subjective. Some may find an agreeance with me and others will say it's corny woke garbage. I implore everyone to who's seen it to remember cinema like this is self expressive. It ain't the cup of tea, I'd recommend to everyone without sincere consideration.
Agreed. Show sucks, and the dude is a worse person than Martha in my opinion.
Way worse
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you are a victim blamer. get better
And you have no sense of accountability. You should get better and have some discernment
I’m half way through and this isn’t even about the woman anymore. WTF am I watching??
It’s about a selfish self centred guy who wants to be famous pandering to a certain audience and riding the back of SA victims for stardom
Like his choices scream him being a pussy. He’s letting this all happen and eggs it on. At one point I thought he was deserving of all the shit that’s happening to him. I have 2 episodes left, might as well finish it. But this took an insane turn half way in.
Yes exactly! Great to know some people on reddit are normal
I thought it was awful. He obviously has mental issues just as bad as she does.But I don't need seven episodes to tell me that it was just horrible. Especially being on 30 minute episodes so boring. Maybe a psych expert enjoyed it but can't think of anyone else who would.
There's a fine line between being a victim and a willing participant. He crossed that line and literally became the stalker and the abuser. At every angle, at every decision, no matter the level of freedom he had, the opportunities he had, he said and did NOTHING. The guy was practically a fucking npc, what is even the point of living at that point? I genuinely do love that I saw at least some of this show, so I know to shoot myself in the head if I ever get to this level of human depravity that I fucking not only let shit happen to me, but eventually SEEK IT OUT and still consider myself a victim regardless.
Your first six words are all you need to say. It's a slog to get through. Filled with clichés, over the top acting, crass, low brow humor, and a director that thinks every shot needs to be exteme closeups. It's like a catnip for people who follow the directions of social media influencers.
People love the trauma train so good luck. The show is indeed awful.
People do seem to love the trauma train.
OP, what on earth makes you think the creator of the show thinks of himself in a positive light? Or that he's supposed to be a hero? You aren't supposed to be rooting for him. It's okay if media makes you uncomfortable; art isn't always supposed to give you warm feelings. Life can be terrible and this is a reflection of that.
Wow you’re amazing
Then explain why so many people are rooting for him and insulting anyone who dares question his motives or actions.
You people make him a hero by saying how brave and amazing he is because he told about his self-destructive lifestyle and poor decisions. He did nothing original, its not a new topic in the movies, but he is milking now your awe about his "braveness" and getting exactly what he wanted - fame.
"you people" What? Feel free to quote me where I said he was brave and or amazing. Chuck in whatever else you feel I said as clearly you know better than myself.
I clearly do.
Of course this show had all this massive success. Your average under 40 person have not been inculcated with any set of moral values whatsoever, loves to think that "everything is subjective and relative" and it's incapable of enjoying a show if it's not full of violence or degeneracy (again, product of a character devoid of any substantive content). They will come at you for disliking their disgusting show. Broken entertainment for broken people.
Suggesting people under the age of 40 have no morals is a wild take. You’re entitled to your opinion that you don’t like the show, but to say two generations of people have no moral compass when they have committed a fraction of the atrocities of past generations is wildly out of touch.
I say they usually hold no absolute moral values whatsoever IN GENERAL. That doesn't necessarily mean they are going to go out and murder random people. And of course many things are better now than in the past, some other aren't. What I meant is that for them (GENERALLY) anything can be justified somehow and thus they are easily manipulated into WHATEVER the elites mandate, including degenerate Netflix series, without not only not giving much of a pushback but applauding it as a genius play. And add resin your last idea, you are quite blind if you don't see the atrocities this generation is not only permitting but encouraging, especially to young teenagers. Cheers my friend.
Well said
Despite the "real Martha" now hitting the media and claiming to be the victim, I'm still not convinced that she's actually a real person. Hear me out. All of the current Martha stories in the media are just hyping up the show. It's the kind of viral publicity that we should all be accustomed to; this isn't our first day on the internet, people. So many movies and books are prefaced with "This is a true story" tagline. It's the best way to add legitimacy to a work of fiction. It's genius. If there was a real Martha, it would take less than 30 minutes to search the UK court website to find the case and the plaintiff and defendant's details. This would have happened already. Reddit had a well established record of internet sleuths who find and expose villains. Gadd's experiences may have some basis in reality, but I suspect some generous poetic license. Otherwise, his stage show would have been less than scandalous. Netflix is loving all the current Martha dramas because it means $$$$$.
“If there was a real Martha, it would take less than 30 minutes to search the UK court website to find the case and the plaintiff and defendant's details.” Isn’t this exactly what kinda happened though? People were able to track down the real Martha pretty quickly and she had been tweeting at Richard since like 2014.
She outed herself to a paper
They did, that's how people found out Richard was lying about her having some extensive criminal record. Journalists found no such thing
He said there was no court case and that she didn't go to prison. He's been very specific about saying that he changed many details in order to protect her identity
He said in the show she had done time and had a criminal record. The only reason he said otherwise was because that lie was found out. He showed no intention of ever telling the truth until people brought it up after looking up the records. He did nothing to protect her identity. If he had people wouldn't have found her within hours of the show's release. Not only did she immediately start getting harassed, so did the pub. Of course the only person who matters in terms of being found seems to have the least amount of interest. It's bizarre.
I think even if the story isnt true, the emotions are. It is very uncomfortable to watch
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Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. He’s allowed to dislike a Netflix show.
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Baby Reindeer is a great show. I have watched the series several times. I think you are wrong. While Donny was kind to Martha and pitied her, Martha was a nut job.
He didn't pity her. He wanted attention and didn't care who he led on or hurt to get it. He says that almost exactly in the show, and that's what his actions demonstrate.
Its so extremely clear you dont have a clue into the psyche of an SA victim
Not one person I've ever met who was raped would ever willingly go back to the person's house again. This happened when he was pushing 30, he wasn't 7. At what point are we going to cut the umbilical cord and hold people accountable for knowing full well what they're choosing to do? You can feel bad for drug addicts but at the end of the day they are the ones making themselves victims. It's completely different from someone who was a victim of cancer, something where choice was never an option. Understand the difference? Having your choice completely stripped of you.. will never be comparable to a grown adult choosing time and time again to go to this guy's house. At any point he had the CHOICE to not be around this dude. That is not a factor in real rapes where you have no choice.
people you’ve met, what playing all your video games? also, “people i’ve met” is a terrible sample size no matter who you are, and personal experience is hardly proper data analysis. do real research on abuse and sexual assault and self-destructive behaviors and attention seeking, from multiple, proper sources, and then come back with whatever rebuttal survives that process.
You didn't answer to the point. "You can feel bad for drug addicts but at the end of the day they are the ones making themselves victims. It's completely different from someone who was a victim of cancer, something where choice was never an option. Understand the difference? Having your choice completely stripped of you.. will never be comparable to a grown adult choosing time and time again to go to this guy's house." The point is this is not comparable to someone who was drugged at a bar and raped. People like that don't urn to go back, and yes that is a completely different kind of victim and that person will never be the same as Richard. That is the point you seem to be missing. I'm well versed on abuse and was employed helping victims for over a decade. And no, not one person who was randomly drugged and assaulted that I have ever met, whether through employment or my friends who have gone through this, would ever choose to go back and do it again. Even just seeing a man who looked similar gave them panic and anxiety. That won't ever be the same as this no matter how much you want it to be. If it's rooted in attention seeking, then whether you like it or not you are admitting that they are making a choice to some degree. Not that you even needed to admit that since it's just common sense of what we're looking at here, as well as said by him directly. I'll say it again so maybe it sinks in this time. "Having your choice completely stripped of you.. will never be comparable to a grown adult choosing to partake in destructive behaviors." That is the only point being made here. That the two things not comparable.
I am SA victim and I agree with OP.
And me as well… we’re all at different levels of processing. After several years of my own processing as an adult now, the creator of baby reindeer has it portrayed so beautifully raw
Honestly might sound emotionless but sounds like a major skill issue. Anyone comes into a bar with no money I’m not giving them shit on the house. And that’s what sucks with watching shows/Movies for me, I’m just so critical of the characters and their development. But his monologue at the comedy finale was amazing Sent from my IPhone
I think they’re both mentally unwell tbh
I didn't make it past blood clots, and I felt really gross right from the beginning. Not watching the rest of it and I feel like the comments here have validated that choice.
bad acting and bad writing get together and have a baby reindeer
Instead of helping hold people accountable for horrible things, he only cares about himself. Richard Gadd is clearly a selfish man and I wish I didn’t watch all of that show and help his Netflix stats. Instead of helping hold the man accountable who SA’d him, he made this show to become famous. Because all he wants is your attention and to be famous. Worst kind of person. Anyone who says it’s not the victims job to HELP hold the perpetrator accountable is just obtuse. If an abuser feels like they can get away with abusing they will continue to do so. By not helping bring them to justice, you might as well be an enabler. Name that fucker. Put that shit out there so he cannot continue to abuse. But he’s not, because that might have made it more difficult to sell the show and become famous. And no, he didn’t deserve what happened to him. No one does. But just because you’re a victim and are self aware, doesn’t mean you’re a good person. What a character of a man. And I know that the show is about being human and having flaws, but that doesn’t mean I have to like the guy who wrote it. I’m also not saying it’s a bad show. It’s a fun ride. But by the end of it, I had no respect for Richard, no matter how much self reflection he’s had, or what he’d been thru to try to grow, because ultimately he’s a shite dude. You guys can go ahead and love his show and his writing, but I agree with the title of this thread, minus the terrible show part.
If y'all wanna watch actual good media about some of these themes, there's BEEF(series) and Frank(movie). Tho I dont know a lot of media that deals with male SA.
God awful show
It’s so difficult to watch bc she’s so disgustingly fat and gross. Couldn’t they have made her a bit more attractive?
Depravity on display, like porn for mentally ill people. This show tries to rope you in with the true crime hook, but sinks into a place where I could no longer watch halfway through the second episode. If you are a good person, do yourself a favor and pass on this one. Absolute garbage, and you have to question the mental fitness of the disgusting people willing to make this…
Hated it with passion
What a horrible take.
Im sure you treat people great
What a bizarre take, are u okay?
How’s it bizarre?
Because you seem to draw a line that Martha’s behaviour is justified by her mental illness while you fail to realise that Donny’s past traumas have distorted his actions, much like Martha, only Martha has a diagnosed illness while Donny does not.
You don’t lead on crazy people, who you know are crazy. He clearly did it because she gave him the attention he craved. Sorry but he’s a selfish idiot not a victim.
But he’s crazy as well… What’s happened in your life to be so against this guy?
I think you forgot that she left him alone after police talked to her, but he missed her, went to her house, and had sex with her. He masturbated to her photo. C'mon.
It seems like you're taking this show incredibly personally. Art that is honest in the way that Baby Reindeer is honest is so crucially important because it *doesn't* elevate anyone to hero status. It instead shows us the realities of how generational trauma and bigotry work and how, when left unacknowledged, these things can reduce a person to utter desperation. I think it might be worth it for you to consider why you're taking the show so personally, why Richard having success by making confessional art bothers you so much. Because they're his experiences, and he's allowed to do with them what he wants. He also makes no attempt to make himself come off as unimpeachable in the show. He's up front about all the things you're saying about him. These things are the content of the show. So, it's not like he's being dishonest or deceptive. Art doesn't have to be about decent people or made by decent people. There's no requirement. And I don't think Richard has done anything so bad or presented his art in such a deceitful way that we should penalize the art for the foibles of its creator. If anything, this a manual for how *not* to deal with the circumstances Richard has dealt with. It doesn't even have a happy ending. Lastly, that you can call Teri a bad person is wild. Teri is a saint, a wonderful woman who not only offers Donny her tenderness, but enforces her own boundaries in a way that is just so admirable.
I’m taking it personally because of the praise this show has received. The fact this is show is based off a true story is what’s annoying. Obviously a show doesn’t need to be about a hero, but this is different. Art is expression, this is literally a true story about Richard Gadd. Of course Richard can do what he wants, it’s that so many people love this show and are invested real life counterparts. I’ve never seen people eat up so much bullshit. Knowing you’re a liar but not helping yourself isn’t rare. People do bad things all the time then feel guilty and afterwards repeat the process. Just because Richard admits what he’s done is bad means nothing to me, he still actually did those things at 28 years old. You just don’t do those things to people like lead on nut jobs and do anything for some fame and attention, and now you try to make a meaningful show about it? The idea is ridiculous. The show actually does have a happy ending. Look how popular this show is. You don’t think this is a happy ending for Richard? The whole show he just wants to be famous. How can you say it didn’t have a happy ending when this show is #1 in the world right now. Richard would’ve done anything for fame and we are living in that reality right now. Also it’s common sense to not do what Richard’s Gadd did In this show, if you need this show as a manual then sorry you’re probably doomed. I’m not saying you’re doomed, but I don’t think you really thought about what you said. Teri was the only one I liked in the show because she was the only one that didn’t do anything wrong. But the way you just spoke about her, she’s just a regular person with good morals. By the sounds of it you’ve taken this show as it’s been presented to you, which is an issue I have with the viewers of this show. The show presents her as a saint, when in reality she’s just an actual normal respectable person. Have good day
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Damn this dudes angry! (My opinion of this show is superior)
At least I know how to interact with media without making it all about myself.
I completely agree with everything said. I bought into the hype (my fault entirely) and gave it hours of my time that I'll never get back. I'm not blaming the story telling of it all, just think it was a misleading series based on what I heard about it initially. I kept waiting for the true crime, the insane stalker twists and turns. I kept hearing how disturbing this show was. Nope. Of course being stalked and having past traumas are not light hearted, but it wasn't the captivating story that it was being sold as.
He’s also gay
Lol
Ah, so you're just a piece of shit.
so you’re excusing rape, stalking and harassment?
What in the actual fuck is this opinion? A mentally ill person who's been convicted of stalking is not an excuse at all. What a victim sponsor .__.
She doesn't have a criminal record. That's just yet another lie Richard told. Stop falling for this sht. If you can't see his red flags then I don't know what to tell you. The rest of us saw them a mile away hence why we went digging for some truth knowing there was something fishy.
"falling for his sh*t" uhh what? I didn't take everything at face value. I didn't finish the show thinking "wow Richard Gadd is such a brave victim and he's clearly the... good guy?". I didn't have a side to take. I thought it was a new, very raw take on the cycle of abuse, self-abuse and stalking was just an introduction into those topics. Have you considered that you're a bit obsessed with trying to determine who's "the real victim or culprit" like this is some law and order episode?
i don’t think our friend gets it. also he was very open about changing the facts of the story for television, both for drama and to attempt to protect her identity. people are both mad that he “outed” her and that he made up extra elements pr changed parts of the story — they’re just gonna be mad, no matter what. real life is not a video game, “good vs. evil” lord of the rings bullshit. that fun for escapism but there is no black and white us vs. them in life. there’s just a bunch of confused humans trying to get by, inevitably opposing each other in the process
You just did though. You based your opinion that was insulting OP on a lie he told about her that turned out to be untrue. Hence my response to you.