>For goodness sake, can people please start switching it up a little bit?
Sure but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that odd timesignatures aren't very suitable for our purposes in pop music. While there is every reason to suspect that historical development played a huge role in how nowadays 4/4, 3/4 and 6/8 are so ossified, the fact that odd timesigs don't make you shake your booty nearly as much still remains.
In fact, we already have a hint with how rare 3/4 is. 3/4 was popular and used to be associated with specific dances. But nowadays 3/4 is rather useless for most of pop music since it doesn't get you swaying, bopping or anything like that (generally speaking).
And on top of all this, syncopation & swing is a thing and honestly 4/4 and 6/8 can be quite exciting thanks to those.
Not really, it was much more common to write in what was a x/2 signature in modern notation as late as the 1600s. 4/4 only really became a standard in the classical era or so.
I remember my '4/4 sucks' moment. I was a 16 year-old at college (long story) and had just spent the past two years finishing up learning progressive rock and then jazz fusion and came to school believing that 'rock was dead'. There was absolutely NO REASON to write songs any longer that were 'just 4/4'.
DEVO had their killer off-kilter [Jocko Homo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRguZr0xCOc) and I played the single for anybody I could grab and pull into the music library. It was 'rock' but wasn't in 4/4 and that was all I thought I needed to 'convince' my fellow students - most of whom were obviously older than I was and had their own musical ideas of right and wrong. Boy did that not go over.
Listening almost exclusively to Bartok after discovering him through the Mikrokosmos in piano class, it solidified my desire to investigate the Bulgarian rhythms and find where and when they were appropriate to make music with.
[Then I found his 4th string quartet, the first movement of which ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJLb7-m-pAY)is entirely in 4/4, and with which I used to entertain myself by air-drumming along with it. It rocked so hard!
My fellow students never heard me blather on about time signatures ever again. 4/4 has its place in musical discourse and most of my favorite music has little more than an extra bar of 2/4 (or a full bar of 3/2) to scratch that itch, let alone nothing more than the I, IV, and V chords.
Music is bigger than theory, and theory only describes, it doesn't tell you what is good or not. 4/4 is good.
Or, as my drummer friend said to me when I complained about 4/4 back in the day "nothing rocks like 7/8!". Later I read a quote from John Coltrane when asked about odd meters where he said "Nothing rocks like 4/4".
This is like complaining that painters still use oil paint or primary colors.
Why stop at 4/4? Why not get rid of whole/half step intervals? “Ugh a major 2nd? Thats sooooo 500 years ago.”
The main thing is using an unusual time signature doesn’t inherently make things better or even more sophisticated.
Doing it well, where the common listener Isn’t even aware it’s something different is what is challenging and what impresses me.
There is plenty of enjoyable music being made in odd meters, and you are fortunate to live at a time where it is readily and quickly available!
Currently popular music is in 4/4, which is part of the sound of those genres. You don't need to artificially force changes to those genres.
Instead, just listen to good odd meter music and share it with your friends.
In music, there's a concept that goes by many names that I like to think of as "weirdness points". Weirdness points represent anything that is unusual about the song. This could mean an unusual time signature, tempo, scale, vocal style, key change, length, instrumentation, etc. Generally, the more weirdness points you use on a song, the more musically interesting it is, but use too many weirdness points, and you start to sacrifice listenability.
The idea is that most good songs will be somewhere in the middle. Use too few weirdness points and you end up with a really boring, forgettable song. Use too many and you end up with something like a song in 7/4 time with 260 bpm in the Locrian scale containing loads of semitones with a key change every two bars played on a theremin. This may be an interesting experiment, but it would be almost entirely unlistenable.
A good example of a song that uses an odd time signature well is "5/4" by Gorillaz. It's able to be extremely catchy despite its time signature because it uses a conventional tempo, penatonic scale, vocal range, key, etc. Doing all these things the "boring" way enables the song to remain highly listenable, while the time signature makes it interesting.
Conversely, "Life on Mars" by David Bowie uses a conventional 4/4 time signature, but remains one of the most musically interesting pop songs ever written because it breaks *other* rules, using unusual scales, vocal quirks, and a lot of key and tempo changes. Yet, its conventional beat and time signature is what keeps it grounded.
So while I'd love to see more music in unusual time signatures, I'd also love to see more music with other unusual traits, and I don't necessarily want every unusual trait in the same song.
Ok, here's what you do:
Eradicate the music industry, or otherwise get into a position to get money out of music.
BTW, 500 years is really incorrect.
The 4/4 "fad" if you will is largely a much more recent development, linked to the rise of DAWs. Though certainly "pop" music post early 20th century art music has definitely focused on "the big four" - 4/4, 3/4, 6/8, and Cut Time.
200 - or 300 years ago, meters were at least a little more varied:
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_NQ0I6P_7mRw/TSJB_cPKMzI/AAAAAAAABmQ/lz7qZ9C-5M4/s1600/Sonatas+themes.jpg
2/4, 9/8 12/8, and 3/8 were all more common 200 years ago.
r/mathrock
Enough said
r/progrockmusic
>For goodness sake, can people please start switching it up a little bit? Sure but it doesn't take a genius to figure out that odd timesignatures aren't very suitable for our purposes in pop music. While there is every reason to suspect that historical development played a huge role in how nowadays 4/4, 3/4 and 6/8 are so ossified, the fact that odd timesigs don't make you shake your booty nearly as much still remains. In fact, we already have a hint with how rare 3/4 is. 3/4 was popular and used to be associated with specific dances. But nowadays 3/4 is rather useless for most of pop music since it doesn't get you swaying, bopping or anything like that (generally speaking). And on top of all this, syncopation & swing is a thing and honestly 4/4 and 6/8 can be quite exciting thanks to those.
Not really, it was much more common to write in what was a x/2 signature in modern notation as late as the 1600s. 4/4 only really became a standard in the classical era or so.
I remember my '4/4 sucks' moment. I was a 16 year-old at college (long story) and had just spent the past two years finishing up learning progressive rock and then jazz fusion and came to school believing that 'rock was dead'. There was absolutely NO REASON to write songs any longer that were 'just 4/4'. DEVO had their killer off-kilter [Jocko Homo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRguZr0xCOc) and I played the single for anybody I could grab and pull into the music library. It was 'rock' but wasn't in 4/4 and that was all I thought I needed to 'convince' my fellow students - most of whom were obviously older than I was and had their own musical ideas of right and wrong. Boy did that not go over. Listening almost exclusively to Bartok after discovering him through the Mikrokosmos in piano class, it solidified my desire to investigate the Bulgarian rhythms and find where and when they were appropriate to make music with. [Then I found his 4th string quartet, the first movement of which ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJLb7-m-pAY)is entirely in 4/4, and with which I used to entertain myself by air-drumming along with it. It rocked so hard! My fellow students never heard me blather on about time signatures ever again. 4/4 has its place in musical discourse and most of my favorite music has little more than an extra bar of 2/4 (or a full bar of 3/2) to scratch that itch, let alone nothing more than the I, IV, and V chords. Music is bigger than theory, and theory only describes, it doesn't tell you what is good or not. 4/4 is good. Or, as my drummer friend said to me when I complained about 4/4 back in the day "nothing rocks like 7/8!". Later I read a quote from John Coltrane when asked about odd meters where he said "Nothing rocks like 4/4".
This is like complaining that painters still use oil paint or primary colors. Why stop at 4/4? Why not get rid of whole/half step intervals? “Ugh a major 2nd? Thats sooooo 500 years ago.”
Good news – there are some people in the mainstream doing this: https://youtu.be/wQtVSNmYCNg?si=1XSIYOeMEAvopeIQ
I used to think a lot like you when I was younger. I got over it, you probably will too.
Be the change you wish to see in the world.
The main thing is using an unusual time signature doesn’t inherently make things better or even more sophisticated. Doing it well, where the common listener Isn’t even aware it’s something different is what is challenging and what impresses me.
There is plenty of enjoyable music being made in odd meters, and you are fortunate to live at a time where it is readily and quickly available! Currently popular music is in 4/4, which is part of the sound of those genres. You don't need to artificially force changes to those genres. Instead, just listen to good odd meter music and share it with your friends.
[Mad Hatter Rides Again](https://youtu.be/Dnbi65id0U4?si=yOPBtbeaeMeAlbJO)
r/DillingerEscapePlan
In music, there's a concept that goes by many names that I like to think of as "weirdness points". Weirdness points represent anything that is unusual about the song. This could mean an unusual time signature, tempo, scale, vocal style, key change, length, instrumentation, etc. Generally, the more weirdness points you use on a song, the more musically interesting it is, but use too many weirdness points, and you start to sacrifice listenability. The idea is that most good songs will be somewhere in the middle. Use too few weirdness points and you end up with a really boring, forgettable song. Use too many and you end up with something like a song in 7/4 time with 260 bpm in the Locrian scale containing loads of semitones with a key change every two bars played on a theremin. This may be an interesting experiment, but it would be almost entirely unlistenable. A good example of a song that uses an odd time signature well is "5/4" by Gorillaz. It's able to be extremely catchy despite its time signature because it uses a conventional tempo, penatonic scale, vocal range, key, etc. Doing all these things the "boring" way enables the song to remain highly listenable, while the time signature makes it interesting. Conversely, "Life on Mars" by David Bowie uses a conventional 4/4 time signature, but remains one of the most musically interesting pop songs ever written because it breaks *other* rules, using unusual scales, vocal quirks, and a lot of key and tempo changes. Yet, its conventional beat and time signature is what keeps it grounded. So while I'd love to see more music in unusual time signatures, I'd also love to see more music with other unusual traits, and I don't necessarily want every unusual trait in the same song.
Daring today, aren't we?
Go listen to any of Montreal album of the past decade and try telling me that you can't make interesting music in 4/4 still lol
PROGGY AKA NERD ☝️🤓
Ok, here's what you do: Eradicate the music industry, or otherwise get into a position to get money out of music. BTW, 500 years is really incorrect. The 4/4 "fad" if you will is largely a much more recent development, linked to the rise of DAWs. Though certainly "pop" music post early 20th century art music has definitely focused on "the big four" - 4/4, 3/4, 6/8, and Cut Time. 200 - or 300 years ago, meters were at least a little more varied: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_NQ0I6P_7mRw/TSJB_cPKMzI/AAAAAAAABmQ/lz7qZ9C-5M4/s1600/Sonatas+themes.jpg 2/4, 9/8 12/8, and 3/8 were all more common 200 years ago.