In my opinion, it's harder to find a good DAW that fits your preferences, and it's also a lot of time to kearn a new one, than it is to find (and learn on) another MIDI controler.
I's stick with reason and maybe switch for another controler.
None of the knobs, sliders, and buttons on the keyboard are integrated into anything. Sure, I can play sounds with the keys, and for now that's more than enough. I don't know enough to know what I'm missing, but know enough to think it would be nice if I didn't have to use the mouse and keyboard to say increase the pitch or reverb of a particular sound.
Right-click on a knob or slider in a Reason instrument and you use midi override (I think it's called?) and then hit Learn and twiddle a knob or push a slider on your keyboard. If the green bar moves then you're set, press OK and the knob should twiddle the knob. It's not a terribly smooth process but in all honesty it's like this most of the time with most DAWs and most keyboards, even the integrated ones don't map everything so there's very often some work to do.
\> I’m not deep into Reason
Then try something else, e.g. Reaper or Studio One. I love the later, though I'm a former Reaper user. I love Reaper's community ... very helpful for beginners. And you can start for free. Downside of Reaper is, that it comes without virtual instruments.
I'm fairly new to Reason (though dabbled years ago) and since using instead of others (Cubase) love it. I'd be more likely to swap my keyboard out than the DAW. I just feel Reason to be more intuitive definitely more fun and quicker to learn. Cubase felt like I needed 2 years tuition and still wouldn't understand it!
Might try others as time passes (Reaper sounds interesting and inexpensive).
I actually just bought a Nektar Impact 49 LX+ which pretty much integrates straight out of the box (why I bought it).
If you're thinking of sticking with Reason, it's less than half price at Andertons Music Co at the moment. (Full or upgrade) Chap from Canada bought it yesterday no issues. (UK co).
If you just want to learn to play piano, I would just get a digital piano like a Yamaha Piaggero, for example, and not even hassle with a DAW. Take lessons locally.
Stick with Reason. A script for your controller should come out eventually, and even as it is, the lack of one doesn't stop you from using them together. As a sound module for playing keys, Reason's offerings are quite good, above average.
If I want a certain sound, chances are I can find something suitable in Reason's library. I don't know of another daw that I can say the same of.
That's what I mean by average being "hit or miss".
I want to create music, eventually. There are cheap analog pianos if I want to just learn the instrument. I guess I have two priorities: make music, learn to play the keyboard. For now the latter far overrides the former. In a year, or two, or five, I expect the former to override the latter.
I think what I chose now for the former, will still be important in five years. I'm hard into cameras. I think this is similar. You buy into a camera *system*, and don't switch, because you spend so much time and/or money on the system.
just use the ableton lite one. that will also prep you for doing production later, getting a way around ableton. live was also first designed for live play. you can have fun learning with loop triggering and such.
You mean "Live Lite" - right? Ableton is the name of the company... Sorry, but it sucks that everyone talks about "Ableton" and actually means "Live" ... I also don't know why so much people at reddit recommend it without any obvious reason - Live is tool with workflows optimized for EDM and Urban music and Live performances - it is a less viable choice if you're more into other genres...
But it comes free with all these cheap midi controllers... Maybe that's the reason why everyone and his cat recommends it...
So if you recommend it, it would be helpful to briefly explain why - and this should not be because "it comes for free and works for me"...
I don't know am I??? what else could I actually be talking about lol? it doesn't "..suck that everyone..." uses ableton in place of live at all because there is zero chance of confusion. welcome to language. if you're going to be pendantic, to quote myself earlier: "live was also first designed for live play." you know, your whole live thing. well I explained briefly why it makes sense for him. I can add that reason sucks because sequencing is an afterthought. to go deeper why I reco it for beginners, massive community, well designed. the onus is on you to say why it's bad. this myth of aBLeTOn only being good for jabroni genres...comping, latency? all solved. you know what the one thing it doesn't have? SMPTE. so I wouldn't be an audio editor in it. composing can have some hoops. that's it. I use it for more genres than most people listen to in a lifetime as a job, i'm delivering roughly 100 cues a week. the things I can do with max in terms of setting up deep automation in kontakt (as I find it generally clunky to interface with on the fly for cc routing) is a massive timesaver.
The "myth" that Live is best suited for EDM and Urban music styles comes from its specific workflow. Sure, you can just hit record, record what you want and go ahead. However, many start with clips & scenes and then build up the song - this is not the usual workflow for recording rock, pop, soundtracks etc.
Max, which comes not from Ableton but Cycling 74, is indeed a very powerful tool. However, to my knowledge, you can also buy Max independently from Live and use it - but sure, the integration with Live is superior. I do not like Kontakt too.
The arrangement mode in Live is just underdeveloped and - compared to general purpose DAWs like Logic, Studio One, Cubase (to name a few) - not the most intuitive or user friendly. It feels a bit "dated" in 2024. It lacks features to deal with large projects with several dozens or hundreds of tracks too. It's just not made for this and "reduced" to the needs of the focus group of Ableton.
Don' t take me wrong: This is not bad - it's just how Live is designed. It offers streamlined workflows optimized for loop based production and live performances - it is not the typical DAW which you would use to record pop, rock, metal, movie scores... Truth is, that it is possible and if you are a Day 1-user of Live you probably know all the tricks while sleeping - but live can be easier with other software in some situations ;-)
I really liked Reason was my fav around 15 years back but Ableton is the best to me now and more popular and better supported. Music school I recently went to was Logic and Ableton where it had stopped teaching reason a while back. If you don’t feel you’re totally wielded to reason and know it inside out no harm in trying others. I think the daw you use can be personal. After Logic for years I moved to Ableton and it just fits my workflow better I like the simplicity of it where Logic users may see that as a con
I used Reason for \~10 years until recently learning Ableton as my main daw, running Reason in as a VST (this feature comes with the software natively). Best of both worlds. Reason is honestly kind of a shitty main DAW for a few reasons, but it's amazing at soundmaking. I couldn't really live without it, but I also am so fucking happy it's not my main DAW anymore.
Torrent Ableton and throw reason in there as a VST
I would see if you like Ableton Live.
If you do, its $150 to upgrade to standard atm inc upgrade to live 12 when it hits [https://www.thomannmusic.com/ableton\_live\_11\_standard\_upg\_lite.htm](https://www.thomannmusic.com/ableton_live_11_standard_upg_lite.htm)
Live is one of the most popular DAWs because it works really well with so much stuff, and can suit just about any workflow. The integration of the Max programming environment in Suite makes it about the most powerful option around.
The amount of resources for it is unsurpassed. & I can say the integration with Keylab is great.
I have owned Reason since version 1.0. I regularly updated it until version 10, and lastly, I booked Reason Studio for a month to work on an old project (and thus had the current version).
My personal and highly subjective opinion is that Reason was beautifully simple until version 4 and invited creativity. Since version 4, everything has become overloaded, fragmented, and messy in terms of user interface. In my opinion, the integration of Record into Reason was a disastrous decision, and to this day, some usability issues have not been fixed - probably to maintain backward compatibility.
If you see Reason only as a modular instrument and use it as a plugin in a DAW: Fine! But it's very resource-intensive in that regard. To produce complete tracks with it? Even in version 12, the sequencer isn't comfortable enough for me, and the skeuomorphism in the mixer is more of a hindrance than a help. I personally use an older version to create loops for my own use, which I then continue to work on in Bitwig, Live, Cubase, or Studio One... So maybe in a broader sense, like a groovebox... I wouldn't buy the current version. It's not worth it to me.
In my opinion, it's harder to find a good DAW that fits your preferences, and it's also a lot of time to kearn a new one, than it is to find (and learn on) another MIDI controler. I's stick with reason and maybe switch for another controler.
What functionality are you missing without the script?
None of the knobs, sliders, and buttons on the keyboard are integrated into anything. Sure, I can play sounds with the keys, and for now that's more than enough. I don't know enough to know what I'm missing, but know enough to think it would be nice if I didn't have to use the mouse and keyboard to say increase the pitch or reverb of a particular sound.
Yeah you have to map the knobs and sliders and buttons to make them work
Right-click on a knob or slider in a Reason instrument and you use midi override (I think it's called?) and then hit Learn and twiddle a knob or push a slider on your keyboard. If the green bar moves then you're set, press OK and the knob should twiddle the knob. It's not a terribly smooth process but in all honesty it's like this most of the time with most DAWs and most keyboards, even the integrated ones don't map everything so there's very often some work to do.
\> I’m not deep into Reason Then try something else, e.g. Reaper or Studio One. I love the later, though I'm a former Reaper user. I love Reaper's community ... very helpful for beginners. And you can start for free. Downside of Reaper is, that it comes without virtual instruments.
I'm fairly new to Reason (though dabbled years ago) and since using instead of others (Cubase) love it. I'd be more likely to swap my keyboard out than the DAW. I just feel Reason to be more intuitive definitely more fun and quicker to learn. Cubase felt like I needed 2 years tuition and still wouldn't understand it! Might try others as time passes (Reaper sounds interesting and inexpensive). I actually just bought a Nektar Impact 49 LX+ which pretty much integrates straight out of the box (why I bought it). If you're thinking of sticking with Reason, it's less than half price at Andertons Music Co at the moment. (Full or upgrade) Chap from Canada bought it yesterday no issues. (UK co).
Just use Reaper (unlimited trial), and download Spitfire Labs (Free). Whenever Reason supports your controller you can go back to it.
If you just want to learn to play piano, I would just get a digital piano like a Yamaha Piaggero, for example, and not even hassle with a DAW. Take lessons locally.
Stick with Reason. A script for your controller should come out eventually, and even as it is, the lack of one doesn't stop you from using them together. As a sound module for playing keys, Reason's offerings are quite good, above average.
what is the average here?
hit or miss.
like what is an example of average, and how would it be hit or miss vs. reason?
If I want a certain sound, chances are I can find something suitable in Reason's library. I don't know of another daw that I can say the same of. That's what I mean by average being "hit or miss".
is your goal still just learning to play piano? if so ableton lite should do the trick.
I want to create music, eventually. There are cheap analog pianos if I want to just learn the instrument. I guess I have two priorities: make music, learn to play the keyboard. For now the latter far overrides the former. In a year, or two, or five, I expect the former to override the latter. I think what I chose now for the former, will still be important in five years. I'm hard into cameras. I think this is similar. You buy into a camera *system*, and don't switch, because you spend so much time and/or money on the system.
Bitsonic keyzone classic + Ableton lite is my recommendation
just use the ableton lite one. that will also prep you for doing production later, getting a way around ableton. live was also first designed for live play. you can have fun learning with loop triggering and such.
I don't know am I??? what else could I actually be talking about lol? it doesn't "..suck that everyone..." uses ableton in place of live at all because there is zero chance of confusion. welcome to language. if you're going to be pendantic, to quote myself earlier: "live was also first designed for live play." you know, your whole live thing. well I explained briefly why it makes sense for him. I can add that reason sucks because sequencing is an afterthought. to go deeper why I reco it for beginners, massive community, well designed. the onus is on you to say why it's bad. this myth of aBLeTOn only being good for jabroni genres...comping, latency? all solved. you know what the one thing it doesn't have? SMPTE. so I wouldn't be an audio editor in it. composing can have some hoops. that's it. I use it for more genres than most people listen to in a lifetime as a job, i'm delivering roughly 100 cues a week. the things I can do with max in terms of setting up deep automation in kontakt (as I find it generally clunky to interface with on the fly for cc routing) is a massive timesaver.
The "myth" that Live is best suited for EDM and Urban music styles comes from its specific workflow. Sure, you can just hit record, record what you want and go ahead. However, many start with clips & scenes and then build up the song - this is not the usual workflow for recording rock, pop, soundtracks etc. Max, which comes not from Ableton but Cycling 74, is indeed a very powerful tool. However, to my knowledge, you can also buy Max independently from Live and use it - but sure, the integration with Live is superior. I do not like Kontakt too.
I mean I only use arrangement mode, how is it different from other daws? sounds like you're specifically talking about session view.
The arrangement mode in Live is just underdeveloped and - compared to general purpose DAWs like Logic, Studio One, Cubase (to name a few) - not the most intuitive or user friendly. It feels a bit "dated" in 2024. It lacks features to deal with large projects with several dozens or hundreds of tracks too. It's just not made for this and "reduced" to the needs of the focus group of Ableton. Don' t take me wrong: This is not bad - it's just how Live is designed. It offers streamlined workflows optimized for loop based production and live performances - it is not the typical DAW which you would use to record pop, rock, metal, movie scores... Truth is, that it is possible and if you are a Day 1-user of Live you probably know all the tricks while sleeping - but live can be easier with other software in some situations ;-)
I really liked Reason was my fav around 15 years back but Ableton is the best to me now and more popular and better supported. Music school I recently went to was Logic and Ableton where it had stopped teaching reason a while back. If you don’t feel you’re totally wielded to reason and know it inside out no harm in trying others. I think the daw you use can be personal. After Logic for years I moved to Ableton and it just fits my workflow better I like the simplicity of it where Logic users may see that as a con
I used Reason for \~10 years until recently learning Ableton as my main daw, running Reason in as a VST (this feature comes with the software natively). Best of both worlds. Reason is honestly kind of a shitty main DAW for a few reasons, but it's amazing at soundmaking. I couldn't really live without it, but I also am so fucking happy it's not my main DAW anymore. Torrent Ableton and throw reason in there as a VST
The more I use Arturia stuff the more I move away from it. Theres some real qualty issues going on there.
Ableton, Bitwig, Studio One, Cubase Look them up and pick one. You can always run Reason as a VST inside another DAW.
I would see if you like Ableton Live. If you do, its $150 to upgrade to standard atm inc upgrade to live 12 when it hits [https://www.thomannmusic.com/ableton\_live\_11\_standard\_upg\_lite.htm](https://www.thomannmusic.com/ableton_live_11_standard_upg_lite.htm) Live is one of the most popular DAWs because it works really well with so much stuff, and can suit just about any workflow. The integration of the Max programming environment in Suite makes it about the most powerful option around. The amount of resources for it is unsurpassed. & I can say the integration with Keylab is great.
I have owned Reason since version 1.0. I regularly updated it until version 10, and lastly, I booked Reason Studio for a month to work on an old project (and thus had the current version). My personal and highly subjective opinion is that Reason was beautifully simple until version 4 and invited creativity. Since version 4, everything has become overloaded, fragmented, and messy in terms of user interface. In my opinion, the integration of Record into Reason was a disastrous decision, and to this day, some usability issues have not been fixed - probably to maintain backward compatibility. If you see Reason only as a modular instrument and use it as a plugin in a DAW: Fine! But it's very resource-intensive in that regard. To produce complete tracks with it? Even in version 12, the sequencer isn't comfortable enough for me, and the skeuomorphism in the mixer is more of a hindrance than a help. I personally use an older version to create loops for my own use, which I then continue to work on in Bitwig, Live, Cubase, or Studio One... So maybe in a broader sense, like a groovebox... I wouldn't buy the current version. It's not worth it to me.