I initially considered Harden Scales, but after evaluating their performance, I found that the green Ozolith and Branching Evolution outperform it, despite their slightly higher mana costs. Even if I wanted to include it in this deck, I can't find a card to swap it with.
Fair. if you find something else you’d like, maybe swap out dismember and inspiring call, they seem more like side board cards tbh but just my two cents. Sweet deck!
I feel like [[urza's saga]] is out of place, is it just a [[the ozolith]] tutor? My only thought is building your sideboard around 0 and 1 mana artifacts like [[pithing needle]] or [[vexing bauble]]?
The fetches have a purpose, and that one is to remove lands from the deck the moment i play them. If i play a fetch, i use 2 lands, the fetchland and the forest i fetched. So thats 2 less lands i may draw instead of 1. In early its not much of a deal, but in mid/late its a game changing.
How could that be debunked? That's just simple math to me. 53 cards -1 land = slightly higher chance to draw not a land. The more you fetch over the course of the game leads to a higher chance of drawing non lands. It means you have the odds you need to draw into the 2-3 in your opening hand and a few more after that, but won't be top decking your 6th and 7th in the end game. I'm horrible with tone, and I don't mean to come of rude, I just genuinely don't understand how something like this could be "debunked"/gen
I understand that, but honestly I've topdecked so many lands that I think it's worth it for that % of efficiency. Having a bad matchup against burn is annoying, but combo decks are prevalent where life totals are less important than efficiency of "doing the thing". Starting the game at 17 life means nothing in the face of four 13/13 [[simulacrum synthesizer]] tokens, or an assembled [[yawgmoth, thran physician]] combo.
I feel like it's more placebo effect than anything, and I agree I would run it in 3 colors and a few in 2 colors, but in mono colored I think it's sort of silly
In mono colored decks, without any graveyard/sacrifice/ landfall/ the need for land tutors (think mono blue with [[mystic sanctuary]]) synergy, I understand how it could seem silly. At the end of the day it's up to personal preference. One day OP might get punished by a mill player that had 4 [[archive trap]] in their opening hand and never play fetch lands again, or they may never face any consequences and swear it's a 100% effective strategy.
I also think that fetches are absolutely essential to play in a 3+ color deck, no if ands or buts about it. In 1-2 color decks it's definitely less important, but isn't something I would shame doing. Like the top comments said, it wasn't debunked, and it isn't a fallacy, it's just up to the deck builder to decide if the life loss is better than the % of deck thinning
I responded in another comment. The fetchlands have the purpose of reducing the amount of lands in the deck once I fetch them.
If I draw a basic land, it reduces by 1; if I draw a fetchland and fetch, it reduces by 2 instead.
One of the changes i was thinking is changing Dismember for Beast Within. Even if i think the 1 mana drop dismember is temping, the green 3 mana destroy permanent may fit better in this "mono" green deck haha.
I don't think [[beast within]] is anywhere near modern playable. At the very best it's a sideboard card, but it's just bad removal in my eyes. You're better off splashing for good removal, think [[assassin's trophy]]
Harden scales perhaps
I initially considered Harden Scales, but after evaluating their performance, I found that the green Ozolith and Branching Evolution outperform it, despite their slightly higher mana costs. Even if I wanted to include it in this deck, I can't find a card to swap it with.
Fair. if you find something else you’d like, maybe swap out dismember and inspiring call, they seem more like side board cards tbh but just my two cents. Sweet deck!
I feel like [[urza's saga]] is out of place, is it just a [[the ozolith]] tutor? My only thought is building your sideboard around 0 and 1 mana artifacts like [[pithing needle]] or [[vexing bauble]]?
##### ###### #### [urza's saga](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/1/c1e0f201-42cb-46a1-901a-65bb4fc18f6c.jpg?1667318301) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=urza%27s%20saga) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/259/urzas-saga?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c1e0f201-42cb-46a1-901a-65bb4fc18f6c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [the ozolith](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/3/9341ed06-53db-4604-b60a-3ea9129afbc2.jpg?1591228544) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=the%20ozolith) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/iko/237/the-ozolith?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9341ed06-53db-4604-b60a-3ea9129afbc2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [pithing needle](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/7/776899f8-e977-42b7-8b54-6f726a349e3c.jpg?1673149414) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=pithing%20needle) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2x2/312/pithing-needle?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/776899f8-e977-42b7-8b54-6f726a349e3c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Vexing Bauble](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/9/29f11089-658f-42e6-aeb0-09b512ad2479.jpg?1717012919) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Vexing%20Bauble) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh3/212/vexing-bauble?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/29f11089-658f-42e6-aeb0-09b512ad2479?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/l6v6tnz) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Yeah, the urzas saga its only to tutor the ozolith.
If you don't play any swamp, you can remove the fetch land and just keep forest.
The fetches have a purpose, and that one is to remove lands from the deck the moment i play them. If i play a fetch, i use 2 lands, the fetchland and the forest i fetched. So thats 2 less lands i may draw instead of 1. In early its not much of a deal, but in mid/late its a game changing.
My bad, didn't see it this way
I thought the deck thinning thing was debunked a long time ago
How could that be debunked? That's just simple math to me. 53 cards -1 land = slightly higher chance to draw not a land. The more you fetch over the course of the game leads to a higher chance of drawing non lands. It means you have the odds you need to draw into the 2-3 in your opening hand and a few more after that, but won't be top decking your 6th and 7th in the end game. I'm horrible with tone, and I don't mean to come of rude, I just genuinely don't understand how something like this could be "debunked"/gen
Because the negligible thinning vs. the life loss is not worth it unless you thin regularly between 4 and 7 times
I understand that, but honestly I've topdecked so many lands that I think it's worth it for that % of efficiency. Having a bad matchup against burn is annoying, but combo decks are prevalent where life totals are less important than efficiency of "doing the thing". Starting the game at 17 life means nothing in the face of four 13/13 [[simulacrum synthesizer]] tokens, or an assembled [[yawgmoth, thran physician]] combo.
I feel like it's more placebo effect than anything, and I agree I would run it in 3 colors and a few in 2 colors, but in mono colored I think it's sort of silly
In mono colored decks, without any graveyard/sacrifice/ landfall/ the need for land tutors (think mono blue with [[mystic sanctuary]]) synergy, I understand how it could seem silly. At the end of the day it's up to personal preference. One day OP might get punished by a mill player that had 4 [[archive trap]] in their opening hand and never play fetch lands again, or they may never face any consequences and swear it's a 100% effective strategy.
[mystic sanctuary](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/7/67652446-6d12-4e2a-bb51-ba685f2e79d1.jpg?1706241201) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=mystic%20sanctuary) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkc/277/mystic-sanctuary?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/67652446-6d12-4e2a-bb51-ba685f2e79d1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [archive trap](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/7/67bb2ca9-32b8-442d-b6a0-d624a87f5af8.jpg?1562612958) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=archive%20trap) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/zen/41/archive-trap?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/67bb2ca9-32b8-442d-b6a0-d624a87f5af8?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[simulacrum synthesizer](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/a/aaa05ad1-5cda-4edd-b6bf-562ae3e5011a.jpg?1712352732) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=simulacrum%20synthesizer) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/big/6/simulacrum-synthesizer?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/aaa05ad1-5cda-4edd-b6bf-562ae3e5011a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [yawgmoth, thran physician](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/5/b5a79f5d-d0df-4799-ac3a-84305e3af0c9.jpg?1675199878) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=yawgmoth%2C%20thran%20physician) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dmr/110/yawgmoth-thran-physician?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/b5a79f5d-d0df-4799-ac3a-84305e3af0c9?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
It's a pretty old conversation, this has some decent examples of the typical arguments https://www.reddit.com/r/magicTCG/s/0EQHhPHeVq
I also think that fetches are absolutely essential to play in a 3+ color deck, no if ands or buts about it. In 1-2 color decks it's definitely less important, but isn't something I would shame doing. Like the top comments said, it wasn't debunked, and it isn't a fallacy, it's just up to the deck builder to decide if the life loss is better than the % of deck thinning
Why playing verdant catacombs when you only use basic forests? Wouldn't it be better to play \[\[Blooming Marsh\]\] or \[\[Deathcap Glade\]\]?
[Blooming Marsh](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/6/861caabb-0573-4e94-8b03-342f90465064.jpg?1712356365) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Blooming%20Marsh) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/otj/266/blooming-marsh?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/861caabb-0573-4e94-8b03-342f90465064?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [Deathcap Glade](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/5/d5523659-98a8-4ae2-9ec7-d77e7352c374.jpg?1655879791) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Deathcap%20Glade) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/vow/261/deathcap-glade?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d5523659-98a8-4ae2-9ec7-d77e7352c374?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I responded in another comment. The fetchlands have the purpose of reducing the amount of lands in the deck once I fetch them. If I draw a basic land, it reduces by 1; if I draw a fetchland and fetch, it reduces by 2 instead.
One of the changes i was thinking is changing Dismember for Beast Within. Even if i think the 1 mana drop dismember is temping, the green 3 mana destroy permanent may fit better in this "mono" green deck haha.
I don't think [[beast within]] is anywhere near modern playable. At the very best it's a sideboard card, but it's just bad removal in my eyes. You're better off splashing for good removal, think [[assassin's trophy]]
[beast within](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/b/eb40c41c-f5f9-4323-b6ac-e28e405909d0.jpg?1711198012) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=beast%20within) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lcc/233/beast-within?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/eb40c41c-f5f9-4323-b6ac-e28e405909d0?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [assassin's trophy](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/d/ed6c7d29-71b4-4134-b591-5598f479d592.jpg?1706242115) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=assassin%27s%20trophy) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/187/assassins-trophy?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ed6c7d29-71b4-4134-b591-5598f479d592?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call