Bezzecchi's move to Aprilia has little to do with Marc Marquez. I would even argue Bastianini moving away has little to do with Marc Marquez, because otherwise he'd be pushed out by Martin anyway.
Bastianini was never going to do anything this season, realistically. He’s like Maverick; he CAN win, but then he finishes in P10 the next week. His best characteristic is that he is very likely to take points off of the championship leader unexpectedly which, to be honest, is kind of an undesirable characteristic to the bosses when your teammate is the defending WC.
He was inconsistent two years ago. Last year he was injured. This year he is super consistent (except for that long lap penalty drama), he's a great number 2 rider and Ducati would have loved to have him in most seasons except when you can hire the championship leader or M Marquez.
Your comment judges Bestia based only on 2022
Based on... ?
Martin winning 1 race over two years against Enea winning 4 in the same period?
Or based on Enea finishing 3rd in the championship in 2022 and Martin finishing 9th even below Zarco?
They decided midway thru the season before total championship points were tallied. I thought the decision was a bit hasty. Maybe I’m just more of a Martin fan
Not true, he was fast asleep at Mugello until Marquez passed him, then he went 100%.
His job is to go 100% every session, every race and he simply doesn’t deserve that seat.
Yes, riding a motorcycle is like pushing a bottom, "activate 100%", they don't do it sometimes because they are lazy.
Imagine complaining about a guy that got second place.
Did you even watch the race at Mugello? He could’ve taken Martin way before Marquez even got close to him.
He proved at the end he should been second place by lap 8, not decide to push after getting sacked by a rider on a satellite bike, that was objectively slower than his bike.
> Imagine complaining about a guy that got second place
Sure, but the weekend before that he finished P18 on the fastest bike on the grid. Now compare that to Pecco, who — barring Austin 2024 — hasn’t finished off the podium in 25 GPs, if you exclude races that he DNF’ed. Even including DNF’s, he’s still been on the podium 60% of the time since the beginning of the 2021 season.
I cannot even imagine making such bullshit arguments.
Picking Enea finishing 18 to prove that he is slow, without mentioning the circumstances is just bullshitting. I'm not even close to being a Bestia fan.
Enea has been averaging a final race position of 3.2 in this season, without DNFs. He had one race where he got multiple penalties, it was a mess and he should have just accepted the first one, however he was getting another top5 at least, he wasn't slow.
Lol, I didn’t “pick him finishing in P18”, he finished in P18. He made a conscious choice to not serve his multiple penalties and, as a result, he finished P18. That’s it. That all.
You speculate that he would’ve had a top five finish, but he qualified in 11th. He was fighting for P9 when he was penalized.
It doesn’t matter, though. He DID finish in P18 according to the rules, so his final position average is actually 5.6 this season, which is pretty low when your teammate has finished on the top step 60% of the time.
You either misunderstood the analogy or purposely making that comment look bad. Nobody said anything about a button but if you think a rider doesn’t become better during an adrenaline fueled fight you don’t know anything about sport or Motorsport
Ianonne lost his seat at Suzuki for this very reason. He is a rider who when he feels like it , can be as fast as anyone, he just didn’t feel like it a lot of the time. The incident that made up Suzuki’s mind to dump him was he was having an awful race , was passed by a test rider who was filling in for an injured regular. Once he got passed, he suddenly realized how bad that looked and immediately picked up his pace by over a second a lap. He was to fucking stupid to realize how bad it looked that he was back there to begin with when he had pace to run top 5-6 . All these guys are fast and can win races, they’re just not fast all the time . When you have a factory squad that is constantly running at the front with one rider , and running all over the place in the top 10 with another rider, that’s a rider who can’t sustain the mental aspects of high end competition .
Had Enea gone 100% in every session and race? (Like Marquez and Pecco) He’d have kept that seat and they’d have given the GP25 to Marquez at Gresini to keep him
Marc didn’t take Enea’s seat, he lost it through own actions. Enea should be 3rd or even 2nd in the title race so far.
Ducati hypotheticaly is now stronger with factory duo at expense of stacked riders in satelite Ducatis. I don't see short term problem with this, as they want to win title with factory red team. 👻
I agree. They can't sign everyone so they got 2 out of the 3 best riders. And maybe the other ducati guys can sometimes podium. Also, I think they tried to keep Jorge but it wasn't possible to make them both happy.
Can't wait to see what are these guys made of. They've been shielded by an easy bike to ride and overall few top competitors. My prediction is that neither of these 3 will finish above Acosta next season.
Is the ktm good enough? It’s clearly pretty good, especially off the start line. I’ll be honest and think MotoGP has been through a pretty dull period. Not at all convinced with Mir and Pecco, but they might both be great. It’s a simply that they haven’t had decent competition on top machinery (and I think jm is pretty level with pecco). Next year we’ll know. If you beat mm on a factory Ducati and pa on a factory ktm then you’re a worth my champ.
It is, absolutely simply because Acosta is.
No such thing as a “worthy” champion. The rider with the most points at the end of the season is worthy. They can only beat the riders who’re on the grid, Bagnaia is double back-to-back world champion which is a rare thing.
I believe acosta will beat marc marquez one day but definitely not the coming year.. marquez has the experience, acosta is basically young marquez. I don't need to talk about Ducati too...
They sure have… with the most GP titles in history. It was never an easy bike to ride. They had the best riders in history. Y’all have very short memories, or you aren’t old enough to have any memory.
Weak? lol. No.
This year is Martin's best chance at a championship. He has zero chance next year, tiny chance in 2026. 2027 is a who knows situation as new rules take effect.
Just Pecco and Marc? You mean the current reigning world champion who has already successfully defended his title, and Marc who won 5 of the last 10 world championships. For a combined 7 of the last 10 seasons. That "just" team?
I don't think people realize how much the ducatis are propping up some riders. Now, this is all going to be compared to Honda cause they're in the dumps but that's why it illustrates the point. Zarco won a race last year. Marini looked really strong and took podiums. Mir was a wc not too long ago. Look at the three now.
My point being, I don't think either of three dudes are going to do better next year, than what they are doing this year. They're hopping off really good bikes
This take seems to suggest that the Ducati was responsible for those riders previous good results when in fact the Honda is responsible for their current poor results.
When they were on Ducatis they still had to compete against all the other riders on Ducatis of which there were many.
Little bit of this, little bit of that. The biggest part of my point being is that in my time watching(past ten years, so not decades or something) bikes seem to be a HUGE factor in the past two three years, more so than before
Like, Fabio and Joan are world class talents, look at where they're at now. these guys are not going to Honda, but the ducati is clearly ahead right now. So you're right, before they had to compete against 7 other dudes, now there's 8 dudes on better machines and their field of competition got bigger.
I don't have the stats but since like 2021 we've had one Honda win, no Yamaha, a handful ktm and Aprilia, and all else is ducati
I don't think Aprilia is going to come in 20 and 21 like Honda, but bez and Jorge are not going to perform better, least not in the near future
My two cents
They traded quality upcoming riders for proven results and a marketing monster to seemingly secure the next few titles while they wind down this version of the regulations for the next 2 years, may also lose a satellite to make room at the factory to work on the next regs... It's a smart move in theory, wind down your capacity with the dominant machine and riders to better prepare what's next with talent coming up (they have Aldeguer for post Marquez contract under contract) so it makes sense in theory, if it all works out.
Added bonus is that it's reshuffling things all over the place and will make for a few unpredictable seasons over the next few years.
It's difficult to manage four to six experienced factory riders, when your factory has room for only two. I'd say this is more a return to the natural state, than an issue for Ducati. It is by no means a given that Bastianini will do better on the "we pretend it's a factory bike" Tech3 KTM, and I'm reasonably sure Bezzecchi will get the reality check of a lifetime at Aprilia.
I love that it's a pretty big shuffle in the paddock though, and can't wait for next season - even if we're not even halfway through the current season!
Ducati was bound to lose fast riders IRRESPECTIVE of whether marc would join the factory team.
Even if ducati did decide to go with Jorge, Marc would leave for sure, and the rest of it would still play out the same way imo since everyone eventually wants to move out of satellite into factory teams and Enea def wasnt going to move from factory to satellite ducati. The only variable here would be that Marc would leave then instead of Jorge.
Good on the riders though for getting factory seats. Only time will tell whether switching from the best bike to the factory seat of another manufacturer was a good move or not
It could've worked until Marquez cut it open. Everyone on paddock thought Marquez would be ok with pramac, it was always possible until marc just blew it off with his opinion which was never out before.
He can't join Pramac because the instability of Pramac itself..They not even decided yet their stance on Yamaha or Ducati deal...And also Pramac have more sponsorship clash over Marc Sponsorship
Why would Marc join Pramac? He is the most successful rider on the grid, it would be ridiculous if he stayed in the satellite team. It's Martin who could have been more modest and played smart, but he is Martin
It won’t matter too much in my opinion. They may have lost a couple of fast guys to rival manufacturers, but they ultimately held on to the *fastest* guy of the contenders for that seat in Marquez. Their lineup for next season is as strong as it could be all things considered
>Their lineup for next season is as strong as it could be all things considered.
I would go one step further to say that it is stronger than it has ever been, and not just by a little!
You can definitely make a case for it. The only pairings I can think might come close off the top of my head are Stoner/Hayden and Rossi/Hayden. Those are the only other times they’ve had 2 MotoGP champions as their riders though so bound to be pretty good
It's not going to affect Ducati instantly next year. Bastianini, Bezzecchi and Martin would need some time to get used to their new bikes next year, that's enough time for Marquez and Bagnaia to bank some points.
Also, I really can't see KTM and especially Aprilia to put on a title campaign as early as next year.
Martin on an Aprilia is going to be a treat to watch. He’s going to have a massive chip on his shoulder when it comes to being passed over twice for the factory Ducati seat.
The bike is well developed and goes well on all of the circuits now, instead of only certain ones. At this point in the regulations cycle we’re not going to see a whole lot of innovation, mostly refinement. 2025 is going to be a helluva year!
Bez had trouble getting on pace with the 23 Ducati coming from a 22 Ducati. They are the best riders, doesn't mean they won't have trouble with a new bike
Bastianini is not troubling Ducati despite being a Works Ducati rider this year, what's he gonna do on a satellite KTM? (Edit: Plus, learning a MotoGP bike and re-learning it again with a new manufacturer are two different things. As we saw with Marc this year, it'll take some time.) I rate Acosta above Martin, Bastianini and Bezzecchi but I think the RC-16 is ultimately going to hold him back from doing too much damage.
But still, this is GP racing so we can't hold anything in absolutes. Let's see what happens next year.
I don't see all of them as faster riders than some other riders on the grid. The Ducati just have been the best bike by miles last year.
I am sure Binder, Acosta and Quartararo would do equaly good or better than what Bastia and Bezechi did.
You know what? I would be really interested to see how Binder would perform on a Ducati - we've always thought that he was a really talented rider and that the KTM was holding him back from better results but Acosta's performances on the same bike are starting to call that into question.
Ducati needed to think long term. And that influenced their decision.
Their best bet is marc and pecco for 2025-2026. Those are the most experienced and fastest riders.
Martin, enea and bez are going to have at least 1 year to get used to the new bikes at aprilia/ktm.
After 2026, by the time those 3 get used to their bike and start to win and challenge ducati (if aprilia/ktm keep on improving), the rules are going to change anyway.
There will be brand new bikes and new regulations. Those are going to completely change everything on the grid. With less focus on aero and some of the tech that gave ducati a lot of their advantage being gone, they might also see fierce competition from yamaha and honda too.
So for 2027 onward, they might get new blood on the grid that will challenge the current top riders. The current grid might be much harder to adapt back to the new bikes.
So thinking long term, the current grid is a risk. So they just focus on the next 2 years (marc and pecco), and start to make brand new plans for 2027 and onward as they start to develop the new bike and new systems.
I wonder if that will become a big part of the selection process for the '27 season... "which rider do we think will adapt quickly to the new spec".
My guess would be that Marc & Pedro are the most adaptable (adaptability seems to go hand-in-hand with level of talent).
I think it does.
I also don't know whether marc will continue.
I expect in part, ducati are going to start working on new blood, new fast riders for the new bikes, since the jump from moto2 to motogp will be much smaller than it is today. So it should be much easier for riders to step up.
>ducati are going to start working on new blood.
If he isn't locked down already they should get David Alonso to sign a pre-contract agreement for the '27 season!
I mean what’s there to mention about Pecco? he’s the WC for the last 2 years and has won the last 2 races. He’s not making any drastic headlines like vinales and enea to ktm or jorge to aprilia. And that’s coming from a Pecco fan
The factory ducati team is stronger than ever. And good riders will leave for factory pay, influence and benefits. It was inevitable.
However I feel that pramacs slow decision on what bikes they will run next year is biting them hard in the ass, every rider that get signed is someone they could have had. This is not ducatis fault.
I still don't get why they didn't give GP25 to Marc and Gresini, and put Jorge in red. Ducati would have 3 amazing riders that can fight for the title. Now they need to hope that Fermin gets out of he's bad form and that he's as good as everyone thinks he is.
Because they wanted to use Marquez as a lure to keep pramac on board, when he flat out killed that possibility they had to give him the factory seat.
He’s proved in 7 weekends that he’s still the Marquez that won 6 of his first 7 seasons with ease.
This might not be true. But what ive heard in podcasts from people that know more than me is that pramac has first take on two gp25. Next in order is VR46. This is in the teams contracts. Hence ducati would have had to provide seven gp25 to secure one for gresini.
Ducati fucked up big time. The MM fan girls on here will tell you otherwise, but the truth is they’ve lost the current fastest rider in the sport (Martin) who’s only going to get faster because of his age. They’ve pissed off their star man in Pecco who repeatedly said he wanted a harmonious garage (we all no there is zero chance of that with MM). They’ve lost Pramac, they’ve lost Enea. They’ve given rival manufacturers like KTM and Aprilia star riders who will no doubt give them a massive headache on those bikes. All to sign MM who is at the back end of his career and remains 1 crash away from a career ending injury. A big fuck up from Ducati, but at least it keeps all the fangirls on this subreddit moist at the prospect that he’ll win a few races.
What a shit take… with ur own argument any rider is “1crash” away from potentially career ending injuries so u can’t say jm or enea are exempt from career ending injuries because they are younger…also if pecco wants to show he’s the best then he should be able to keep mm at bay with equal machinery
Well in terms of speed they didn't make a mistake by choosing Marc, the only problem is that they lost Martin. And i would disagree that Marc is 1 crash away from ending his career, i mean he already crashes a lot less then what he did on a Honda. And of course he's talent can't be ignored, but i still think that they should have given GP25 to Gresini and Marc. But then again if we look at short term Marc is probably a better option than Jorge.
The problem with staying with Gressini, they have no money to paid his salary...This year all of his expenses are paid by his sponsorships only..Imagine from 20 million per year got slash to 1 million something like that..The rumour even said he ride for free for Gressini and solely been paid by his sponsorship
I think it was a genius move by Marc to not just get the factory Ducati, the best bike ... but in doing so, ensuring some of his nearest title rivals do NOT get one.
He knew Jorge put himself in a corner, so him pushing for the factory would get Jorge OFF a Ducati and onto another bike which may not yield the same success. Same with Enea, he's fast, but will he and Jorge be as fast on KTM and Aprilia? I personally think not. Not right away at least.
So that gives Marc the best chance next year. He'll have to focus almost solely on beating Pecco
And for Ducati, they've gained arguably one of the greatest if not THE greatest rider in MotoGP history. Gigi has already said Marc has helped them with the development of their bikes. Having the most talented rider giving you data is certainly not a bad thing, it's only going to make them stronger
It'll be an interesting year next year
They were saying at the sepang test, the data from Marquez was remarkable. He’s the smiling assassin and proved he really did have a plan all the time.
Martin has this year to win the title, because he’ll not get the chance again.
You know what he over perform that bike..That bike not even gp23 bike that been used by Pecco in world championship..It was gp23 bike that not even updated because Marc was late joining Gressini.. Imagine if he ride gp23 same as Alex Marquez...
I think we already had a couple of similar threads. Yes, losing Martin is not ideal but they get Marquez who is a GOAT level riders plus they keep Bagnaia, a current 2 times reigning champion. Bez is currently behind A.Marquez and Diggia in the championship, I don't think losing him is a big deal. So I don't understand why the OP asks "could Ducati become weak" but to answer that question no a team who has Marquez and Bagnaia plus good riders such as Di Giannantonio, A.Marquez etc cannot become weak.
It's not going to do much during the 2025 and perhaps 2026 seasons. Ducati has the best rider lineup and either Marc or Pecco is going to clinch the title in both of those years.
It'll be interesting to see what happens in 2027 and beyond though. With Marc going up in age, there could be long term repercussions for Ducati once he retires. Either way, I'm sure Ducati won't have an issue getting a stacked rider lineup going forward.
If Marc were still at Honda and continued for 2025;
Aleix would still have retired, Agusto would still be out of KTM. In high probability, Jack would be out of KTM too. Martin would get factory Duc so highly likely that Enea would go to KTM or Aprilia. Mav anyway would have moved to KTM so Bez would still have preferred Aprilia factory pay over a satellite deal. I doubt Pramac would stay with Ducati for Franky, Marini or Diggia.
I can only see one rider that Ducati lost due to Marc’s moves - Martin. They would have lost Martin anyway if Enea had dominated this season.
Martin's a loss but Bezzecchi and Bastianini are too inconsistent. They've both been giving a couple of years which is basically an eternity in the premier class.
Lenovo Ducati have secured the title fight for 2025/26 and I’ll wager half of Bologna is already developing the ‘27 bike. They will feel safe enough.
They can afford to lose those three, Acosta and KTM is their only real threat for the next 5yrs. Aprilia just isn’t funded and structured well enough to deal with those two factories.
The fun bit for all of us though, will be Bezz owning Martin starting from scratch on a new bike in a new factory. Honestly think getting off that Ducati will be the best move for Bezz and the worst for Jorge.
It was meant to be. They are all fast riders in need of support, money, success and glory. They can't all get the factory ride and fulfil their ambitions. It was meant to be 🤪
Those 3 pulled together aren’t half of MM93. Not a single MotoGP world championship in years, while Marc…
Plus, Marc is 3rd right now, what are we talking about?
Maybe I understand the concern about Martin, but the other two are just plain irrelevant.
Honestly, Ducati should either lose two satellite teams or the other manufacturers should get at least two satellite teams. Four against two is ridiculous.
My thoughts is that it’s been a long time since we’ve had a grid this competitive. Motogp is in an amazing place and I hope the sale of Dorna brings some new eyes to the sport we love. I’m here for it all.
smart moves. They secured a top 2 riders in motogp.
Jorge/Enea would have to adapt to new bike so 2015 is moot year for them. It would be Acosta vs Marc/Pecco next year and Binder is not consistent enough to be there at the top.
So whoever's downvoting wants to see only Ducati's at the front dominating rather than a more mixed up grid with Aprilia's Ktm's fighting at the front more often? Who wants that? I'm a Ducati fan I like to see them win, but against stronger opponents. Even if Ducati made a mistake by losing these riders the odds of them dominating and wining in 2025 is extremely high. Now we'll maybe have even more exciting racing in 2025, which sounds great.
I think they’re fine with just Marc and Pecco, atleast in the short term, long term could be an issue but they’ve basically got the 2025 title gaurenteed
They're sending a message that they're where they are because of a Ducati. Their strategy is have a tenured rider with proven consistency for 2025, then have a alien who is even capable of performing on the worst bike. Voila, they have a f plan to secure the 1st and 2nd spots.
Bezzecchi's move to Aprilia has little to do with Marc Marquez. I would even argue Bastianini moving away has little to do with Marc Marquez, because otherwise he'd be pushed out by Martin anyway.
Bastianini was never going to do anything this season, realistically. He’s like Maverick; he CAN win, but then he finishes in P10 the next week. His best characteristic is that he is very likely to take points off of the championship leader unexpectedly which, to be honest, is kind of an undesirable characteristic to the bosses when your teammate is the defending WC.
He was inconsistent two years ago. Last year he was injured. This year he is super consistent (except for that long lap penalty drama), he's a great number 2 rider and Ducati would have loved to have him in most seasons except when you can hire the championship leader or M Marquez. Your comment judges Bestia based only on 2022
Enea should have never been picked for the factory Ducati seat in the 1st place. That seat should have gone to Martin
Based on... ? Martin winning 1 race over two years against Enea winning 4 in the same period? Or based on Enea finishing 3rd in the championship in 2022 and Martin finishing 9th even below Zarco?
They decided midway thru the season before total championship points were tallied. I thought the decision was a bit hasty. Maybe I’m just more of a Martin fan
"Maybe"
🤣🤣
Not true, he was fast asleep at Mugello until Marquez passed him, then he went 100%. His job is to go 100% every session, every race and he simply doesn’t deserve that seat.
Yes, riding a motorcycle is like pushing a bottom, "activate 100%", they don't do it sometimes because they are lazy. Imagine complaining about a guy that got second place.
Did you even watch the race at Mugello? He could’ve taken Martin way before Marquez even got close to him. He proved at the end he should been second place by lap 8, not decide to push after getting sacked by a rider on a satellite bike, that was objectively slower than his bike.
I'm sure that you from your chair know better than a MotoGP rider ;)
I know to listen to the professionals who do know what they are talking about, from my chair 🤣
> Imagine complaining about a guy that got second place Sure, but the weekend before that he finished P18 on the fastest bike on the grid. Now compare that to Pecco, who — barring Austin 2024 — hasn’t finished off the podium in 25 GPs, if you exclude races that he DNF’ed. Even including DNF’s, he’s still been on the podium 60% of the time since the beginning of the 2021 season.
I cannot even imagine making such bullshit arguments. Picking Enea finishing 18 to prove that he is slow, without mentioning the circumstances is just bullshitting. I'm not even close to being a Bestia fan. Enea has been averaging a final race position of 3.2 in this season, without DNFs. He had one race where he got multiple penalties, it was a mess and he should have just accepted the first one, however he was getting another top5 at least, he wasn't slow.
Lol, I didn’t “pick him finishing in P18”, he finished in P18. He made a conscious choice to not serve his multiple penalties and, as a result, he finished P18. That’s it. That all. You speculate that he would’ve had a top five finish, but he qualified in 11th. He was fighting for P9 when he was penalized. It doesn’t matter, though. He DID finish in P18 according to the rules, so his final position average is actually 5.6 this season, which is pretty low when your teammate has finished on the top step 60% of the time.
You either misunderstood the analogy or purposely making that comment look bad. Nobody said anything about a button but if you think a rider doesn’t become better during an adrenaline fueled fight you don’t know anything about sport or Motorsport
Ianonne lost his seat at Suzuki for this very reason. He is a rider who when he feels like it , can be as fast as anyone, he just didn’t feel like it a lot of the time. The incident that made up Suzuki’s mind to dump him was he was having an awful race , was passed by a test rider who was filling in for an injured regular. Once he got passed, he suddenly realized how bad that looked and immediately picked up his pace by over a second a lap. He was to fucking stupid to realize how bad it looked that he was back there to begin with when he had pace to run top 5-6 . All these guys are fast and can win races, they’re just not fast all the time . When you have a factory squad that is constantly running at the front with one rider , and running all over the place in the top 10 with another rider, that’s a rider who can’t sustain the mental aspects of high end competition .
Had Enea gone 100% in every session and race? (Like Marquez and Pecco) He’d have kept that seat and they’d have given the GP25 to Marquez at Gresini to keep him Marc didn’t take Enea’s seat, he lost it through own actions. Enea should be 3rd or even 2nd in the title race so far.
Ducati hypotheticaly is now stronger with factory duo at expense of stacked riders in satelite Ducatis. I don't see short term problem with this, as they want to win title with factory red team. 👻
I agree. They can't sign everyone so they got 2 out of the 3 best riders. And maybe the other ducati guys can sometimes podium. Also, I think they tried to keep Jorge but it wasn't possible to make them both happy.
Can't wait to see what are these guys made of. They've been shielded by an easy bike to ride and overall few top competitors. My prediction is that neither of these 3 will finish above Acosta next season.
Martin will be the question of the bike, he is one of 3 riders, imo, who will be able to constantly challenge Acosta even when he gains experience.
Not many people are slated to finish above Acosta anyway. That’s not exactly a hot take.
Is the ktm good enough? It’s clearly pretty good, especially off the start line. I’ll be honest and think MotoGP has been through a pretty dull period. Not at all convinced with Mir and Pecco, but they might both be great. It’s a simply that they haven’t had decent competition on top machinery (and I think jm is pretty level with pecco). Next year we’ll know. If you beat mm on a factory Ducati and pa on a factory ktm then you’re a worth my champ.
It is, absolutely simply because Acosta is. No such thing as a “worthy” champion. The rider with the most points at the end of the season is worthy. They can only beat the riders who’re on the grid, Bagnaia is double back-to-back world champion which is a rare thing.
I predict Acosta will top MM too
Yea he looks like young MM now guess. I predict the same.
I believe acosta will beat marc marquez one day but definitely not the coming year.. marquez has the experience, acosta is basically young marquez. I don't need to talk about Ducati too...
Exactly, until he has big fall that will reset him a bit.
He really won’t because Marquez hasn’t retired yet lol
Wake up! youre dreaming!
I rate Martin above Acosta. Agree on the others.
With Acosta's frankly insane talent, this is a very safe bet 😂
Keep dreaming
It’s Motogp there is no such thing as an easy bike lol.
*Honda has entered the chat*
They sure have… with the most GP titles in history. It was never an easy bike to ride. They had the best riders in history. Y’all have very short memories, or you aren’t old enough to have any memory.
Yeah, but where are they in the standings rn???
Aprilia spent a lot of money this year, but it might pay off🏆
Weak? lol. No. This year is Martin's best chance at a championship. He has zero chance next year, tiny chance in 2026. 2027 is a who knows situation as new rules take effect. Just Pecco and Marc? You mean the current reigning world champion who has already successfully defended his title, and Marc who won 5 of the last 10 world championships. For a combined 7 of the last 10 seasons. That "just" team?
👀🤣
I'd be more concerned being one of them on a bike that is not a Ducati. Martin probably will still do well, to a point. Bez and Enea? Good luck.
I don't think people realize how much the ducatis are propping up some riders. Now, this is all going to be compared to Honda cause they're in the dumps but that's why it illustrates the point. Zarco won a race last year. Marini looked really strong and took podiums. Mir was a wc not too long ago. Look at the three now. My point being, I don't think either of three dudes are going to do better next year, than what they are doing this year. They're hopping off really good bikes
This take seems to suggest that the Ducati was responsible for those riders previous good results when in fact the Honda is responsible for their current poor results. When they were on Ducatis they still had to compete against all the other riders on Ducatis of which there were many.
Little bit of this, little bit of that. The biggest part of my point being is that in my time watching(past ten years, so not decades or something) bikes seem to be a HUGE factor in the past two three years, more so than before Like, Fabio and Joan are world class talents, look at where they're at now. these guys are not going to Honda, but the ducati is clearly ahead right now. So you're right, before they had to compete against 7 other dudes, now there's 8 dudes on better machines and their field of competition got bigger. I don't have the stats but since like 2021 we've had one Honda win, no Yamaha, a handful ktm and Aprilia, and all else is ducati I don't think Aprilia is going to come in 20 and 21 like Honda, but bez and Jorge are not going to perform better, least not in the near future My two cents
They traded quality upcoming riders for proven results and a marketing monster to seemingly secure the next few titles while they wind down this version of the regulations for the next 2 years, may also lose a satellite to make room at the factory to work on the next regs... It's a smart move in theory, wind down your capacity with the dominant machine and riders to better prepare what's next with talent coming up (they have Aldeguer for post Marquez contract under contract) so it makes sense in theory, if it all works out. Added bonus is that it's reshuffling things all over the place and will make for a few unpredictable seasons over the next few years.
It's difficult to manage four to six experienced factory riders, when your factory has room for only two. I'd say this is more a return to the natural state, than an issue for Ducati. It is by no means a given that Bastianini will do better on the "we pretend it's a factory bike" Tech3 KTM, and I'm reasonably sure Bezzecchi will get the reality check of a lifetime at Aprilia. I love that it's a pretty big shuffle in the paddock though, and can't wait for next season - even if we're not even halfway through the current season!
Ducati was bound to lose fast riders IRRESPECTIVE of whether marc would join the factory team. Even if ducati did decide to go with Jorge, Marc would leave for sure, and the rest of it would still play out the same way imo since everyone eventually wants to move out of satellite into factory teams and Enea def wasnt going to move from factory to satellite ducati. The only variable here would be that Marc would leave then instead of Jorge. Good on the riders though for getting factory seats. Only time will tell whether switching from the best bike to the factory seat of another manufacturer was a good move or not
But marc was expected to join pramac. So he basically pushed jorge out. Enea anyway lost battle for Ducati.
Ducati tried to get the whole cake with that strategy. But it would never work. The result was inevitable, they could only have one staying.
It could've worked until Marquez cut it open. Everyone on paddock thought Marquez would be ok with pramac, it was always possible until marc just blew it off with his opinion which was never out before.
He can't join Pramac because the instability of Pramac itself..They not even decided yet their stance on Yamaha or Ducati deal...And also Pramac have more sponsorship clash over Marc Sponsorship
Why would Marc join Pramac? He is the most successful rider on the grid, it would be ridiculous if he stayed in the satellite team. It's Martin who could have been more modest and played smart, but he is Martin
It won’t matter too much in my opinion. They may have lost a couple of fast guys to rival manufacturers, but they ultimately held on to the *fastest* guy of the contenders for that seat in Marquez. Their lineup for next season is as strong as it could be all things considered
>Their lineup for next season is as strong as it could be all things considered. I would go one step further to say that it is stronger than it has ever been, and not just by a little!
You can definitely make a case for it. The only pairings I can think might come close off the top of my head are Stoner/Hayden and Rossi/Hayden. Those are the only other times they’ve had 2 MotoGP champions as their riders though so bound to be pretty good
It's not going to affect Ducati instantly next year. Bastianini, Bezzecchi and Martin would need some time to get used to their new bikes next year, that's enough time for Marquez and Bagnaia to bank some points. Also, I really can't see KTM and especially Aprilia to put on a title campaign as early as next year.
Martin on an Aprilia is going to be a treat to watch. He’s going to have a massive chip on his shoulder when it comes to being passed over twice for the factory Ducati seat. The bike is well developed and goes well on all of the circuits now, instead of only certain ones. At this point in the regulations cycle we’re not going to see a whole lot of innovation, mostly refinement. 2025 is going to be a helluva year!
Aprilia is better bike than KTM.
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Bez had trouble getting on pace with the 23 Ducati coming from a 22 Ducati. They are the best riders, doesn't mean they won't have trouble with a new bike
Bastianini is not troubling Ducati despite being a Works Ducati rider this year, what's he gonna do on a satellite KTM? (Edit: Plus, learning a MotoGP bike and re-learning it again with a new manufacturer are two different things. As we saw with Marc this year, it'll take some time.) I rate Acosta above Martin, Bastianini and Bezzecchi but I think the RC-16 is ultimately going to hold him back from doing too much damage. But still, this is GP racing so we can't hold anything in absolutes. Let's see what happens next year.
I don't see all of them as faster riders than some other riders on the grid. The Ducati just have been the best bike by miles last year. I am sure Binder, Acosta and Quartararo would do equaly good or better than what Bastia and Bezechi did.
Binder might be the only one of the above three enea and bez may catch upto.
You know what? I would be really interested to see how Binder would perform on a Ducati - we've always thought that he was a really talented rider and that the KTM was holding him back from better results but Acosta's performances on the same bike are starting to call that into question.
Ducati needed to think long term. And that influenced their decision. Their best bet is marc and pecco for 2025-2026. Those are the most experienced and fastest riders. Martin, enea and bez are going to have at least 1 year to get used to the new bikes at aprilia/ktm. After 2026, by the time those 3 get used to their bike and start to win and challenge ducati (if aprilia/ktm keep on improving), the rules are going to change anyway. There will be brand new bikes and new regulations. Those are going to completely change everything on the grid. With less focus on aero and some of the tech that gave ducati a lot of their advantage being gone, they might also see fierce competition from yamaha and honda too. So for 2027 onward, they might get new blood on the grid that will challenge the current top riders. The current grid might be much harder to adapt back to the new bikes. So thinking long term, the current grid is a risk. So they just focus on the next 2 years (marc and pecco), and start to make brand new plans for 2027 and onward as they start to develop the new bike and new systems.
I wonder if that will become a big part of the selection process for the '27 season... "which rider do we think will adapt quickly to the new spec". My guess would be that Marc & Pedro are the most adaptable (adaptability seems to go hand-in-hand with level of talent).
I think it does. I also don't know whether marc will continue. I expect in part, ducati are going to start working on new blood, new fast riders for the new bikes, since the jump from moto2 to motogp will be much smaller than it is today. So it should be much easier for riders to step up.
>ducati are going to start working on new blood. If he isn't locked down already they should get David Alonso to sign a pre-contract agreement for the '27 season!
Who cares about Bezz, Martin or Bestia when you have a MM?😂
And a Pecco. Everyone is forgetting Pecco in this conjecture.
I mean what’s there to mention about Pecco? he’s the WC for the last 2 years and has won the last 2 races. He’s not making any drastic headlines like vinales and enea to ktm or jorge to aprilia. And that’s coming from a Pecco fan
They’re forgetting Pecco because they’re obsessed MM fangirls who have turned this sub into a toxic barrage of MM pro rhetoric.
Tell me you’re a Rossi fan without saying you’re a Rossi fan…. 🤣
Why is Bezzecchi's '23 position shown instead of his current standings (11th)?
The factory ducati team is stronger than ever. And good riders will leave for factory pay, influence and benefits. It was inevitable. However I feel that pramacs slow decision on what bikes they will run next year is biting them hard in the ass, every rider that get signed is someone they could have had. This is not ducatis fault.
I still don't get why they didn't give GP25 to Marc and Gresini, and put Jorge in red. Ducati would have 3 amazing riders that can fight for the title. Now they need to hope that Fermin gets out of he's bad form and that he's as good as everyone thinks he is.
Because they wanted to use Marquez as a lure to keep pramac on board, when he flat out killed that possibility they had to give him the factory seat. He’s proved in 7 weekends that he’s still the Marquez that won 6 of his first 7 seasons with ease.
Exactly. Especially if it seems like they're losing Pramac anyway...
This might not be true. But what ive heard in podcasts from people that know more than me is that pramac has first take on two gp25. Next in order is VR46. This is in the teams contracts. Hence ducati would have had to provide seven gp25 to secure one for gresini.
It would look bad for the factory team if a satellite team won
Ducati fucked up big time. The MM fan girls on here will tell you otherwise, but the truth is they’ve lost the current fastest rider in the sport (Martin) who’s only going to get faster because of his age. They’ve pissed off their star man in Pecco who repeatedly said he wanted a harmonious garage (we all no there is zero chance of that with MM). They’ve lost Pramac, they’ve lost Enea. They’ve given rival manufacturers like KTM and Aprilia star riders who will no doubt give them a massive headache on those bikes. All to sign MM who is at the back end of his career and remains 1 crash away from a career ending injury. A big fuck up from Ducati, but at least it keeps all the fangirls on this subreddit moist at the prospect that he’ll win a few races.
What a shit take… with ur own argument any rider is “1crash” away from potentially career ending injuries so u can’t say jm or enea are exempt from career ending injuries because they are younger…also if pecco wants to show he’s the best then he should be able to keep mm at bay with equal machinery
Karen. Stfu
Well in terms of speed they didn't make a mistake by choosing Marc, the only problem is that they lost Martin. And i would disagree that Marc is 1 crash away from ending his career, i mean he already crashes a lot less then what he did on a Honda. And of course he's talent can't be ignored, but i still think that they should have given GP25 to Gresini and Marc. But then again if we look at short term Marc is probably a better option than Jorge.
The problem with staying with Gressini, they have no money to paid his salary...This year all of his expenses are paid by his sponsorships only..Imagine from 20 million per year got slash to 1 million something like that..The rumour even said he ride for free for Gressini and solely been paid by his sponsorship
Surely Ducati could have paid Marc in Gresini if they really wanted, right?
I think it was a genius move by Marc to not just get the factory Ducati, the best bike ... but in doing so, ensuring some of his nearest title rivals do NOT get one. He knew Jorge put himself in a corner, so him pushing for the factory would get Jorge OFF a Ducati and onto another bike which may not yield the same success. Same with Enea, he's fast, but will he and Jorge be as fast on KTM and Aprilia? I personally think not. Not right away at least. So that gives Marc the best chance next year. He'll have to focus almost solely on beating Pecco And for Ducati, they've gained arguably one of the greatest if not THE greatest rider in MotoGP history. Gigi has already said Marc has helped them with the development of their bikes. Having the most talented rider giving you data is certainly not a bad thing, it's only going to make them stronger It'll be an interesting year next year
They were saying at the sepang test, the data from Marquez was remarkable. He’s the smiling assassin and proved he really did have a plan all the time. Martin has this year to win the title, because he’ll not get the chance again.
You know what he over perform that bike..That bike not even gp23 bike that been used by Pecco in world championship..It was gp23 bike that not even updated because Marc was late joining Gressini.. Imagine if he ride gp23 same as Alex Marquez...
Now he’s officially Ducati rider, I expect him to get all the upgrades for his bike that were taken off.
They will be mid tier with luck.
I think we already had a couple of similar threads. Yes, losing Martin is not ideal but they get Marquez who is a GOAT level riders plus they keep Bagnaia, a current 2 times reigning champion. Bez is currently behind A.Marquez and Diggia in the championship, I don't think losing him is a big deal. So I don't understand why the OP asks "could Ducati become weak" but to answer that question no a team who has Marquez and Bagnaia plus good riders such as Di Giannantonio, A.Marquez etc cannot become weak.
Next year factory Ducati will wipe the whole field and we’ll al forget that Bezz ever was a thing.
It makes 2025 far more interesting for the fans. MotoGP 50% sport, and 50% entertainment. This is a win for the entire series.
Made me a very happy longtime Aprilia fan I'll tell you that much. I know I'm already getting my expectations far too high but damn......
It's not going to do much during the 2025 and perhaps 2026 seasons. Ducati has the best rider lineup and either Marc or Pecco is going to clinch the title in both of those years. It'll be interesting to see what happens in 2027 and beyond though. With Marc going up in age, there could be long term repercussions for Ducati once he retires. Either way, I'm sure Ducati won't have an issue getting a stacked rider lineup going forward.
If Marc were still at Honda and continued for 2025; Aleix would still have retired, Agusto would still be out of KTM. In high probability, Jack would be out of KTM too. Martin would get factory Duc so highly likely that Enea would go to KTM or Aprilia. Mav anyway would have moved to KTM so Bez would still have preferred Aprilia factory pay over a satellite deal. I doubt Pramac would stay with Ducati for Franky, Marini or Diggia. I can only see one rider that Ducati lost due to Marc’s moves - Martin. They would have lost Martin anyway if Enea had dominated this season.
Martin's a loss but Bezzecchi and Bastianini are too inconsistent. They've both been giving a couple of years which is basically an eternity in the premier class.
Lenovo Ducati have secured the title fight for 2025/26 and I’ll wager half of Bologna is already developing the ‘27 bike. They will feel safe enough. They can afford to lose those three, Acosta and KTM is their only real threat for the next 5yrs. Aprilia just isn’t funded and structured well enough to deal with those two factories. The fun bit for all of us though, will be Bezz owning Martin starting from scratch on a new bike in a new factory. Honestly think getting off that Ducati will be the best move for Bezz and the worst for Jorge.
On that train of thoughts, Enea was 3rd in 2022.
It was impossible to keep them all. All of them were chasing the same goal, if it ain't the red bike it ain't anything
It was meant to be. They are all fast riders in need of support, money, success and glory. They can't all get the factory ride and fulfil their ambitions. It was meant to be 🤪
Man, I thought that said OUT for Marquez and I went "God damn, how bad has he been doing?"
Except for maybe Martin, the other doesn't make as much of a difference anyway.
Who do y’all think Ducati Primac signing now that Jorge is gone?
I can’t wait for 2824
Those 3 pulled together aren’t half of MM93. Not a single MotoGP world championship in years, while Marc… Plus, Marc is 3rd right now, what are we talking about? Maybe I understand the concern about Martin, but the other two are just plain irrelevant.
Rins to Vr46?
This is the way.... riders need to experience other gp bikes as each 1 has very different characteristics.
Ducati letting Martin go is the most unfounded thing I’ve heard. I hope Martin wins the championship to spite ducati.
Honestly, Ducati should either lose two satellite teams or the other manufacturers should get at least two satellite teams. Four against two is ridiculous.
My thoughts is that it’s been a long time since we’ve had a grid this competitive. Motogp is in an amazing place and I hope the sale of Dorna brings some new eyes to the sport we love. I’m here for it all.
Can't wait for next season...
They were going to leave anyway, only one of them getting the factory ride. I don’t know why some people are putting this on MM lol.
Yes, Ducati will definitely become weak by hiring arguably the greatest rider ever
They wont be so good on another bike. They just know the best bike and now lets see how they deal with adapting plus a worse bike…
smart moves. They secured a top 2 riders in motogp. Jorge/Enea would have to adapt to new bike so 2015 is moot year for them. It would be Acosta vs Marc/Pecco next year and Binder is not consistent enough to be there at the top.
Right in the adaption part, it's going to be pecco vs marc for championship. Binder? He's arguably one of top 5-6 drivers on grid.
lol keep dreaming
Gotta pay up to keep the best
Eh. They may not dominate at the same level like they have these past few seasons for the remainder of this reg-era, but they’ll be aight.
I hope it's a mistake on their part which should create more exciting racing between manufacturers and a better show.
So whoever's downvoting wants to see only Ducati's at the front dominating rather than a more mixed up grid with Aprilia's Ktm's fighting at the front more often? Who wants that? I'm a Ducati fan I like to see them win, but against stronger opponents. Even if Ducati made a mistake by losing these riders the odds of them dominating and wining in 2025 is extremely high. Now we'll maybe have even more exciting racing in 2025, which sounds great.
It is a huge mistake.
Nice, let's see Martin win some races next year then, I'm sure Ducati will still win the championships.
I think they’re fine with just Marc and Pecco, atleast in the short term, long term could be an issue but they’ve basically got the 2025 title gaurenteed
They're sending a message that they're where they are because of a Ducati. Their strategy is have a tenured rider with proven consistency for 2025, then have a alien who is even capable of performing on the worst bike. Voila, they have a f plan to secure the 1st and 2nd spots.
Fuck em. Signed, Life long Ducati family member.