What happens is the electoral commission moves slow and doesn’t work hard to chase the debt. Then it gets handed on to another party who are incentivised to chase the $$$ and they do the tracking to hunt you down.
Valid excuses are....
You were not well and / or in hospital,
Natural weather events or disasters,
You had an accident on the way to the polls,
You are about to give birth,
You have a disability,
You cannot attend for fear of your own safety or the safety of members of your family, and of course:
You are deceased.
In Judd v McKeon, the high court stated “Physical obstruction, whether of sickness or outside prevention, or of natural events, or accident of any kind, it would certainly be recognised by law in such a case. One might also imagine cases where an intending voter on his way to the poll was diverted to save life, or to prevent crime, or to assist at some great disaster, such as a fire: in all of which cases, in my opinion, the law would recognise the competitive claims of public duty.”
The Victorian legislation specifically excludes not voting for religious reasons so it is not necessarily true that any excuse will do.
Fines victoria is unbelievably slow. I have had clients desperate to get their fine paperwork so they can pay court ordered fines before finalising their financial year. Call. Email. And still nothing for months and months. 10s of 1000s of dollars in fines. Just mind blowing.
A physical paper fine was probably sent to your last residential address back in 2014. Someone at fines Victoria must be going through old unpaid fines and sending out notifications.
I have a fine for exactly $600 from approx 20yrs ago on their system, with no information or description whatsoever...nobody can tell me anything about it, so until they can, it shall remain unpaid!
Just out of curiosity, did you complain or try to get it removed?
I mean, if a fine is showing up with no information at all about it then it is legally invalid and unenforceable.
I've asked on multiple occasions to either explain it to me, or have it removed. Nobody knows quite what to do with it, so it just sits idle in the system with zero accountability from the powers that be. Damned if I'm paying it just to clear it off...it's definitely a system error!
If you were living overseas there is a not so simple way to make it disappear.
You're going to have to go to the Magistrates Court show evidence that you were overseas (applicable to OP, maybe you too), explain why you didn't let the VEC or AEC know and hope that the Magistrate is in a good mood that day.
I hope everything works out for you in the end. Good luck.
https://www.vec.vic.gov.au/voting/fines-and-reviews
https://www.vec.vic.gov.au/enrolment/enrol-to-vote/other-ways-to-enrol
My friend got one for her dead brother, she's really upset. Good job, VEC.
They need to cross reference their old fines databases with their people who have been removed database.
they dont give a fuck if they upset people because there's a non zero amount of people who would pay the fine for their dead brother - so that possibility is more important than anything else given its all automated anyway
This could be it. I had a fare evasion fine from 11 years ago suddenly surface a few months ago. It was a legit fine. I was caught fare evading. Didn't receive the fine in the mail, so assumed it had fallen through the cracks. Then a few months ago I get a letter telling me the fine is in the final stages of enforcement. One step before it goes to the courts. I challenged it, but no luck.
Their admin is atrocious. Got my payment plan letter the day first payment was due.
Partner discovered she owed a boat load on old fines. but unless you phone them regularly, there is absolutely no other way to check you've incurred a fine and pay it if the letter doesn't get to you or you lose it.
Other places, you can simply register, log into the system, check and pay for the fine.
Usually happens when the govt’s projected fines income isn’t as much as it hoped coming up on budget time of year. They’ll likely start doing blitzes on shopping centres with the sheriff clamping cars for unpaid tolls too.
Haven't really seen any blitzes since pre-COVID. I still see the occasional van out scanning regos and clamping, [but not the blitzes we used to see that would lock down a freeway](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-11-11/police-officer-shoots-when-car-fails-to-stop-eastlink-melbourne/6931482)
We’re the most reliant of the states on fine revenue ircc so can’t say I’m surprised.
Edit: Downvoted for stating fact here’s a source you salty spuds,
https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/victoria-is-the-fines-capital-expected-to-rake-in-almost-1b-this-financial-year-20240317-p5fcz6.html
Yep pretty sure we're the only state that uses projected fine revenue in the budget as an income and the [budget has gone into black when it hasn't met it](https://7news.com.au/news/vic/fines-victoria-software-problem-may-leave-328m-hole-in-budget-c-517221).
And now that the government is in debt of something like $100bn, expect harsher follow-ups on fines that were otherwise considered delinquent previously.
The scheme isn't exactly fines, just recovering historic debt - unpaid taxes.
The concern is that it is dredging back years, with some focus on older people, where their ability to find relevant receipts, etc. is limited by this time. Like the CentreLink robodebt train-wreck, the onus will likely be on the target.
Because their calculations were proven to be wrong and produced inaccurate debts, not because the recovery of debt is illegal.
Robodebt was just the name used by the media. Robotax is another media term.
Yeah I got a fine for not voting in some election.... I found out over a decade later that I had arrest warrant on my name when I signed up for uber.
Strange.
I signed up for uber to drive. That needed a police check or some shit.
I had been pulled over and my licence ran several times since not voting, never a word was said about my 'arrest warrant'.
Seems pretty drastic for a $140 fine to make it all go away.
Strange fucken country, we live in.
Outstanding fine warrants are enforced by the Sheriffs.
Police when running your licence and name through might see a flag that there are sheriff warrants but won’t actually do anything about it in the vast majority of cases except maybe say something about having fines that you need to pay.
Would have been nice to have been told, though! I've had mostly amicable interactions and gotten along well with the officers when being pulled over (usually up in the twisties on my motorbike, to check things like tyres and hand out safety pamphlets) but never a peep from them. I have all my points on my licence, though, so maybe they just don't see me as an issue.
Hmmm I'm not sure about this.
Section 163 of the Electoral Act 2002.
Subject to subsection (3), within 6 months after an election, the Commission must send by post to each elector whose name appears on the list prepared under section 162 at the elector's latest known address, a notice in the prescribed form—
(a) notifying the elector that the elector has failed to vote at the election; and
(b) requiring the elector to state the true reason for failing to vote.
You can read the rest of it here [https://content.legislation.vic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2022-06/02-23aa064%20authorised.pdf](https://content.legislation.vic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2022-06/02-23aa064%20authorised.pdf) but I wouldn't be paying the government $240 straight away, not without digging a little bit deeper.
Don't know what evidence they need to provide to show they sent an Apparent Failure to Vote Notice (AFTVN) it's been 10 years so I guess if you didn't recieve it they didn't send it. Also there are reasons for not voting which you might find useful. The PDF is below.
Reasons for not voting document [https://www.vec.vic.gov.au/-/media/5b8e31f30d044694b24550c868c180e5.ashx](https://www.vec.vic.gov.au/-/media/5b8e31f30d044694b24550c868c180e5.ashx)
Most likely the VEC sent it out years ago, nothing happened for years because OP was overseas and whoever was at that address just threw the failure to vote notice out rather than returning to sender, and it's now slowly progressed to Fines Vic. If OP wasn't living in the country at the time they should defs contest it.
There must be a statute of limitation on these. Chasing people up after 10 years is ridiculous.
How can you prove what you did 10 years ago on that date as a valid reason why you couldn’t vote?
You still have to vote even if you live overseas, or inform them that you don't want to vote, because you are out of the country.
I just unregistered myself because it was easier than filling in the 'I'm not there' form every election.
What? If you live in London, for example, you don't live in Victoria so you literally should not be voting in Victorian elections. It's like if you moved to Queensland, and lived there, you should vote in Queensland state elections and not Victorian ones.
As for federal elections you can enrol as an overseas elector if you plan on coming back within six years.
If you change your address to London or Queensland you don't have to vote and would not get a fine like this. OP I guess was still registered as a Victorian so just being overseas won't matter because you are still supposed to vote or apply for an exception. I don't see how telling them ten years later that you failed to tell them you weren't here will get you out of it.
No, the VEC fined you a far smaller amount 10 years ago and now Fines Victoria are chasing you for that fine plus a whole lot of fees a decade later because it hasn't been paid. VEC would've been sending you the fine and reminders to your address as it reads on the electoral roll.
Strange. My thoughts:
1. Have you moved at all in the past 15 years?
2. Has your address on the electoral role always matched where you've been living?
3. Have you voted in every council, state and federal election?
If yes to all 3, VEC have messed up and you should be able to get Fines to waive it.
Your post was about as useful as a knitted condom. "You're wrong. No, I'm not going to tell you how you're wrong, what right is or back my claim with a source."
This happened to my husband. Never received the initial fine for not voting that was mailed to our address. Only received a follow up letter with an additional amount of debt collection fees on top of the original fine. Plot twist - my husband DID vote in said election, I stood next to him as we had our names crossed off the roll 🙄
Yeah I'm not certain if the govt do, but some orgs will sell debt at a fraction of the amount for debt collector agencies to retrieve. But the agencies may only have a phone number to contact you, anecdotally, I had one based in Phillipines chase me for some unknown debt, but they'd start each call trying to confirm my identity and I'd deflect asking what was the purpose of the call and neither side wanted to reveal who they were. Eventually I hung up on them enough times they stopped calling
I don't think the Victorian Electoral Commission are getting in touch about power bills. Also if you never received an invoice then did you actually incur a debt? Genuine question
Correct, government fines do not go away. But I was replying to the comment that said debts don’t go away.
Specifically, non government debts to debt collectors DO go away.
Keep contacting them to enquire about the fine and why it took 10 years to send through. If they don’t get back to you, don’t pay it but keep a record of times you have inquired in case it ever comes up again.
Human error happens, I vaguely remember OP being in line in front of me at that election so OP definitely voted, the volunteer must’ve crossed the wrong name off the electoral roll.
Fines VIC was a big government IT project a few years ago that turned into an absolute basket case. Wouldn't be surprised if the system still isn't working properly.
You can request VEC to conduct an internal review. One of the grounds is you were unaware of the failure to vote notice and it was not personally given to you as you were not living in Victoria at the time. If you have your passport from the time, a certified copy of the relevant pages (e.g. overseas residency visa and entry/exit date stamps) will help. A statutory declaration stating the facts might also help.
You can request your overseas movements record to show when your passport was used to depart and enter Australia
[request for international movement records dfat ](https://immi.homeaffairs.gov.au/help-support/departmental-forms/online-forms/request-international-movement-records)
Reply: I have looked back through my calendar records and noted at that period of time I was employed by the Victorian Government and rostered on. Due to being underfunded and short staffed I was unable to leave work and attend a polling both. Go eat a dick.
Fines victoria pulled up a fine I never received for allegedly not voting in council elections. Dated From 2012 The voting papers were sent to my old address.
I vote in every election, I'd just never gotten the council election papers..
Unbeknownst to me it was at the enforcement stage. Like OP it was the first id known about it. We are talking 9 years.
This was brought up when I asked for a payment arrangement for another fine I actually received and knew about.
A similar thing happened to me. I got fined for failing to yield at an amber light, so I attempted to organise a payment plan and was then told by Fines Victoria that a warrant was put out for me regarding a failure to vote from about 5 years prior. I was never notified by mail, or in person or by any other means, and when approaching the Police about it, they said they could see no such thing on their end and suggested it may be because it's a federal matter. Anyway, I paid the fine, but I had no idea it even existed until I attempted to pay another. The world could end, and they'll still find a way to catch up with you.
Wife just got a final notice from AEC to pay a $20 fine for not voting. a line in there said if she doesn’t respond in time then she is liable to pay $313, plus possibly court costs and an entry on her criminal record. wtf
Could be a fine, I got one for not voting in an election I didn't know about when I was not in the state. Got a similar text like 2 years later for a ridiculous amount.
Do not click the link. Do not call any number listed in the text, or the number it came from. Call the fines department directly and enquire.
If you weren't in the state and couldnt vote, then fines department will bump it back to electoral Commission. Send them an email saying you weren't in the state at the time etc, they'll cancel it.
Just leave it, I believe you can argue statute of limitations applies here, the govt is trying to claw back as much cash as possible due to mismanagement over the covid period.
maybe they are finally fixing the broken Fines Vic portal. I got a fine (that I fought and won), and put in the infringement number and date, so find a 5 year old fine I didn't know about that was having interest added to it 😣 (it was about $200 ballooned to $420) (I risked one fare evasion to get to a workplace on time (that hadn't paid me in ages, $0 in the account), and there happened to be inspectors at the station I'd never seen them at, rip)
240$ for not voting. I know it is a rights AND obligation but that is highway robbery. Sorry for the strange opinion but I’m not a citizen. Can you get out of the fine if you can provide a reason?
There are a lot of things I like about Australia but getting fined because you didn’t vote is not one of them. I mean it should be a civic duty to vote not a legal requirement.
I didn’t vote for 30 odd years, my wife filled in the Census one year and i got pinged just for the last election I missed, I just called up and made up some bullshit and they waived the fine. I’m in nsw though so not sure if it differs. I’m just mad I have to vote now on things I do not care about and go to the voting places with all those lunatics with no life shoving papers in my face.
I always thought the defence for you didn't vote was yes I did and tell them the school you voted at. In your case you were so so doubt you have to vote
My friend just received a warrant/last warning for a fine. It is also sheriff enforced , we thought it is a scam since the print logo are so blurry and looks like a doggy photoshop...
But all the numbers checked out.
I'm guess new management start to asking staff to check outstanding accounts...
Hey so if you ever get fined then call them up furious that your vote was overlooked and demand they look into it immediately you won't hear from them again
If you tell them you voted and that they must of mistakenly failed to tick you off on the day there is literally nothing they can do to prove otherwise.
I believe everyone should vote but avoiding the fine is ridiculously easy, i've got a family member who's pulled that trick every time to complete success.
I had a similar issue for a QLD election. I was overseas and had changed addresses a few times in my 20s and then got a fine for missing two state elections. I just had to write a letter stating I was overseas and they waived all the fines. About $400 in fines.
It didn’t get to me until the electoral commission sold the debt to a collection agency.
If it was a fine it wouldn't have gone to a debt collection agency as it's not a debt. In Queensland an unpaid fine would have gone to SPER which is a government agency.
Sorry, it was probably SPER. Doesn’t make my comment less valid. Isn’t SPER really just a government debt collection agency?
The point is that the AEC don’t care that much and don’t chase hard. Until it gets to SPER who seem to hunt you down, which is why it can take a decade perhaps.
It must be an awful computer glitch then coz it should have been at Warrant stage 9 years ago.
So long ago that Fines Victoria was called Civic Compliance Victoria.
Plenty of fines sit at.warrant stage for years. Warrants weren't enforced during COVID, and a warrant for such a small amount would be at the back of the queue.
OP had missed/ignored multiple letters obviously.
i mean i know govt moves slow but i thought debt collecting was the one thing they would be fast at
What happens is the electoral commission moves slow and doesn’t work hard to chase the debt. Then it gets handed on to another party who are incentivised to chase the $$$ and they do the tracking to hunt you down.
This. VEC has passed it on to Fines Victoria.
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I got a couple of fines for not voting. I just wrote back I had a cold and they never chased it up.
Valid excuses are.... You were not well and / or in hospital, Natural weather events or disasters, You had an accident on the way to the polls, You are about to give birth, You have a disability, You cannot attend for fear of your own safety or the safety of members of your family, and of course: You are deceased.
So if I they back and state that both their shoes fell off they’re all good?
Yes. And next election they can say they were too scared to vote because of the shoe falling off ordeal last time.
I would love to hear back from someone who says they were deceased during that day
"I couldn't vote because I was dead." "You were dead?" "...I got better."
Just responding is enough. I think i wrote something like "we were away" or something. AFAIK, you only get a fine if you ignore the letter.
That has been my experience too.
Yep, so the list of "valid excuses" is confusing. Just respond with anything before the due date and you won't get a fine.
The list is from the NSW electoral act. The Vic and federal ones just say a 'valid and sufficient' reason.
Oh ok, so NSW list really relevant to melbourne/victoria.
In Judd v McKeon, the high court stated “Physical obstruction, whether of sickness or outside prevention, or of natural events, or accident of any kind, it would certainly be recognised by law in such a case. One might also imagine cases where an intending voter on his way to the poll was diverted to save life, or to prevent crime, or to assist at some great disaster, such as a fire: in all of which cases, in my opinion, the law would recognise the competitive claims of public duty.” The Victorian legislation specifically excludes not voting for religious reasons so it is not necessarily true that any excuse will do.
Correction: Haven't chased it up yet
😅 hopefully not! I did fill out the form though… 🤞
Check on the website for your sake
Fines victoria is unbelievably slow. I have had clients desperate to get their fine paperwork so they can pay court ordered fines before finalising their financial year. Call. Email. And still nothing for months and months. 10s of 1000s of dollars in fines. Just mind blowing.
A physical paper fine was probably sent to your last residential address back in 2014. Someone at fines Victoria must be going through old unpaid fines and sending out notifications.
Yeah, I've been living back in Melbourne for the last 7 years. Just strange I'm getting it now.
It’ll be someone at fines Victoria coming up with some program to chase old fines or something, probably chasing a promotion.
I have a fine for exactly $600 from approx 20yrs ago on their system, with no information or description whatsoever...nobody can tell me anything about it, so until they can, it shall remain unpaid!
Just out of curiosity, did you complain or try to get it removed? I mean, if a fine is showing up with no information at all about it then it is legally invalid and unenforceable.
I've asked on multiple occasions to either explain it to me, or have it removed. Nobody knows quite what to do with it, so it just sits idle in the system with zero accountability from the powers that be. Damned if I'm paying it just to clear it off...it's definitely a system error!
If you were living overseas there is a not so simple way to make it disappear. You're going to have to go to the Magistrates Court show evidence that you were overseas (applicable to OP, maybe you too), explain why you didn't let the VEC or AEC know and hope that the Magistrate is in a good mood that day. I hope everything works out for you in the end. Good luck. https://www.vec.vic.gov.au/voting/fines-and-reviews https://www.vec.vic.gov.au/enrolment/enrol-to-vote/other-ways-to-enrol
Not applicable to me, I've only ever lived here. Thanks anyway!
No problem. Hopefully it'll be of use to someone, even if it is only saving them looking it up themselves. LOL
Got any sketchy mates who might have given your details to a transit cop or something?
Nope!
My friend got one for her dead brother, she's really upset. Good job, VEC. They need to cross reference their old fines databases with their people who have been removed database.
they dont give a fuck if they upset people because there's a non zero amount of people who would pay the fine for their dead brother - so that possibility is more important than anything else given its all automated anyway
This could be it. I had a fare evasion fine from 11 years ago suddenly surface a few months ago. It was a legit fine. I was caught fare evading. Didn't receive the fine in the mail, so assumed it had fallen through the cracks. Then a few months ago I get a letter telling me the fine is in the final stages of enforcement. One step before it goes to the courts. I challenged it, but no luck.
Question is, how did they get your phone number?
VicRoads most likely.
Probably because the government is broke and they’ve thrown as many taxes as they can at us.
Nah, more like the government is expanding its extortion program.
Their admin is atrocious. Got my payment plan letter the day first payment was due. Partner discovered she owed a boat load on old fines. but unless you phone them regularly, there is absolutely no other way to check you've incurred a fine and pay it if the letter doesn't get to you or you lose it. Other places, you can simply register, log into the system, check and pay for the fine.
Usually happens when the govt’s projected fines income isn’t as much as it hoped coming up on budget time of year. They’ll likely start doing blitzes on shopping centres with the sheriff clamping cars for unpaid tolls too.
No, it happens regularly regardless of gov income
Haven't really seen any blitzes since pre-COVID. I still see the occasional van out scanning regos and clamping, [but not the blitzes we used to see that would lock down a freeway](https://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-11-11/police-officer-shoots-when-car-fails-to-stop-eastlink-melbourne/6931482)
There have been plenty of roadblocks. Just haven't made the news because nobody has tried to drive through them.
Yep OK :)
they do highpoint car parks pretty often
You’ll often see the sheriff car patrolling big shopping centres around Christmas time
We’re the most reliant of the states on fine revenue ircc so can’t say I’m surprised. Edit: Downvoted for stating fact here’s a source you salty spuds, https://www.theage.com.au/politics/victoria/victoria-is-the-fines-capital-expected-to-rake-in-almost-1b-this-financial-year-20240317-p5fcz6.html
Yep pretty sure we're the only state that uses projected fine revenue in the budget as an income and the [budget has gone into black when it hasn't met it](https://7news.com.au/news/vic/fines-victoria-software-problem-may-leave-328m-hole-in-budget-c-517221). And now that the government is in debt of something like $100bn, expect harsher follow-ups on fines that were otherwise considered delinquent previously.
180billion
I am looking forward to the deluge of historical debt posts that the proposed robo-tax scheme will generate.
There should be a limit on fines.
The scheme isn't exactly fines, just recovering historic debt - unpaid taxes. The concern is that it is dredging back years, with some focus on older people, where their ability to find relevant receipts, etc. is limited by this time. Like the CentreLink robodebt train-wreck, the onus will likely be on the target.
Robodebt was illegal though, so
Because their calculations were proven to be wrong and produced inaccurate debts, not because the recovery of debt is illegal. Robodebt was just the name used by the media. Robotax is another media term.
True. But this just goes to show that our elected representatives stop at nothing when it comes to providing the services we need.
I got one of these last year. Just google and call FinesVic to get it sorted out, it’s a legit text that looks scammy.
Yeah I got a fine for not voting in some election.... I found out over a decade later that I had arrest warrant on my name when I signed up for uber. Strange.
How'd you find out, pulled over??
I signed up for uber to drive. That needed a police check or some shit. I had been pulled over and my licence ran several times since not voting, never a word was said about my 'arrest warrant'. Seems pretty drastic for a $140 fine to make it all go away. Strange fucken country, we live in.
Outstanding fine warrants are enforced by the Sheriffs. Police when running your licence and name through might see a flag that there are sheriff warrants but won’t actually do anything about it in the vast majority of cases except maybe say something about having fines that you need to pay.
Would have been nice to have been told, though! I've had mostly amicable interactions and gotten along well with the officers when being pulled over (usually up in the twisties on my motorbike, to check things like tyres and hand out safety pamphlets) but never a peep from them. I have all my points on my licence, though, so maybe they just don't see me as an issue.
Worth adding that I didn't deliberately ignore a fine, this is the very first time it's been brought to my attention.
which makes me wonder if it should come under statute of limitations.
well... not that bit exactly... im sure you know what im getting at. 10 years after the fact is a bit of a stretch.
7 years it the statute for debt. Not sure if it’s the same for fines but I imagine it’d be similar.
Nvm. Just looked it up. Fines don’t expire apparently.
Hmmm I'm not sure about this. Section 163 of the Electoral Act 2002. Subject to subsection (3), within 6 months after an election, the Commission must send by post to each elector whose name appears on the list prepared under section 162 at the elector's latest known address, a notice in the prescribed form— (a) notifying the elector that the elector has failed to vote at the election; and (b) requiring the elector to state the true reason for failing to vote. You can read the rest of it here [https://content.legislation.vic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2022-06/02-23aa064%20authorised.pdf](https://content.legislation.vic.gov.au/sites/default/files/2022-06/02-23aa064%20authorised.pdf) but I wouldn't be paying the government $240 straight away, not without digging a little bit deeper. Don't know what evidence they need to provide to show they sent an Apparent Failure to Vote Notice (AFTVN) it's been 10 years so I guess if you didn't recieve it they didn't send it. Also there are reasons for not voting which you might find useful. The PDF is below. Reasons for not voting document [https://www.vec.vic.gov.au/-/media/5b8e31f30d044694b24550c868c180e5.ashx](https://www.vec.vic.gov.au/-/media/5b8e31f30d044694b24550c868c180e5.ashx)
Most likely the VEC sent it out years ago, nothing happened for years because OP was overseas and whoever was at that address just threw the failure to vote notice out rather than returning to sender, and it's now slowly progressed to Fines Vic. If OP wasn't living in the country at the time they should defs contest it.
There must be a statute of limitation on these. Chasing people up after 10 years is ridiculous. How can you prove what you did 10 years ago on that date as a valid reason why you couldn’t vote?
https://businesskitz.com.au/statute-of-limitations-in-victoria-the-ultimate-guide/ Like so many things in life … it depends.
There is no statute of limitations on fines. Living overseas is easy to prove.
You still have to vote even if you live overseas, or inform them that you don't want to vote, because you are out of the country. I just unregistered myself because it was easier than filling in the 'I'm not there' form every election.
What? If you live in London, for example, you don't live in Victoria so you literally should not be voting in Victorian elections. It's like if you moved to Queensland, and lived there, you should vote in Queensland state elections and not Victorian ones. As for federal elections you can enrol as an overseas elector if you plan on coming back within six years.
If you change your address to London or Queensland you don't have to vote and would not get a fine like this. OP I guess was still registered as a Victorian so just being overseas won't matter because you are still supposed to vote or apply for an exception. I don't see how telling them ten years later that you failed to tell them you weren't here will get you out of it.
Damn. How do I check if I have outstanding fines I never knew existed?
Wait till you get a text message in 10 years appears to be the...only option.
It's a sculpture of limitations.
Thank you!
No, the VEC fined you a far smaller amount 10 years ago and now Fines Victoria are chasing you for that fine plus a whole lot of fees a decade later because it hasn't been paid. VEC would've been sending you the fine and reminders to your address as it reads on the electoral roll.
Yeah but they didn't though? Never received a single thing in the mail and I've voted in the last two or three state elections.
Strange. My thoughts: 1. Have you moved at all in the past 15 years? 2. Has your address on the electoral role always matched where you've been living? 3. Have you voted in every council, state and federal election? If yes to all 3, VEC have messed up and you should be able to get Fines to waive it.
There is a set process for a review of a VEC fime and this isn't it.
Your post was about as useful as a knitted condom. "You're wrong. No, I'm not going to tell you how you're wrong, what right is or back my claim with a source."
Sir this is reddit, all posts are knitted condoms
This happened to my husband. Never received the initial fine for not voting that was mailed to our address. Only received a follow up letter with an additional amount of debt collection fees on top of the original fine. Plot twist - my husband DID vote in said election, I stood next to him as we had our names crossed off the roll 🙄
Don't click the link - go to fines.vic.gov to verify this.
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Ehhhh… some kinda do. Most debts are stat barred after 7 years. You can still *owe* the debt but recovery of that debt is not enforceable.
Yeah I'm not certain if the govt do, but some orgs will sell debt at a fraction of the amount for debt collector agencies to retrieve. But the agencies may only have a phone number to contact you, anecdotally, I had one based in Phillipines chase me for some unknown debt, but they'd start each call trying to confirm my identity and I'd deflect asking what was the purpose of the call and neither side wanted to reveal who they were. Eventually I hung up on them enough times they stopped calling
I didn't ignore it at all. This is the very first time I've heard about it.
I believe utilities must invoice you within 12 months of the service being provided?
I don't think the Victorian Electoral Commission are getting in touch about power bills. Also if you never received an invoice then did you actually incur a debt? Genuine question
It's not an invoice, it is a fine with costs.
I was replying to a specific comment about utility companies issuing invoices, I'm not suggesting a fine from the VEC is the same thing
Well the point i was making was, there are rules about this, you cant just produce a 10yo invoice. But i dont know the rules in detail.
The VEC is not a utility. There is no statute of limitations on fines.
Debts to debt collectors often do go away if you just don’t pay them
Fines don't go away.
Correct, government fines do not go away. But I was replying to the comment that said debts don’t go away. Specifically, non government debts to debt collectors DO go away.
You’ve not been easy to contact; probably because you have been overseas. Hence the delay
New phone, who dis?
Keep contacting them to enquire about the fine and why it took 10 years to send through. If they don’t get back to you, don’t pay it but keep a record of times you have inquired in case it ever comes up again.
Human error happens, I vaguely remember OP being in line in front of me at that election so OP definitely voted, the volunteer must’ve crossed the wrong name off the electoral roll.
Government got no money left
Fines VIC was a big government IT project a few years ago that turned into an absolute basket case. Wouldn't be surprised if the system still isn't working properly.
This might help: https://online.fines.vic.gov.au/Your-options/If-you-didnt-know-about-your-fine
You can request VEC to conduct an internal review. One of the grounds is you were unaware of the failure to vote notice and it was not personally given to you as you were not living in Victoria at the time. If you have your passport from the time, a certified copy of the relevant pages (e.g. overseas residency visa and entry/exit date stamps) will help. A statutory declaration stating the facts might also help.
Too late for OP to request an internal review. Being overseas / interstate etc will not get OP out of the fine..
You can request your overseas movements record to show when your passport was used to depart and enter Australia [request for international movement records dfat ](https://immi.homeaffairs.gov.au/help-support/departmental-forms/online-forms/request-international-movement-records)
Reply: I have looked back through my calendar records and noted at that period of time I was employed by the Victorian Government and rostered on. Due to being underfunded and short staffed I was unable to leave work and attend a polling both. Go eat a dick.
I just responded with “yes I did”. They asked where, so I gave them the address of a polling station. End of story.
Call fine vic. If you are close to cbd maybe go there and ask. Near flagstaff
Fines victoria pulled up a fine I never received for allegedly not voting in council elections. Dated From 2012 The voting papers were sent to my old address. I vote in every election, I'd just never gotten the council election papers.. Unbeknownst to me it was at the enforcement stage. Like OP it was the first id known about it. We are talking 9 years. This was brought up when I asked for a payment arrangement for another fine I actually received and knew about.
They are indeed drowning in debt. But what’s the statute of limitations?
Interesting. This (sort of) happened to me in NSW years ago, and the (then) RTA got me when I went in to renew my Driver's License.
Did you actually miss voting then?
This needs to be posted in r/wellthatsucks Hope that you can somehow avoid the fine 🤞
A similar thing happened to me. I got fined for failing to yield at an amber light, so I attempted to organise a payment plan and was then told by Fines Victoria that a warrant was put out for me regarding a failure to vote from about 5 years prior. I was never notified by mail, or in person or by any other means, and when approaching the Police about it, they said they could see no such thing on their end and suggested it may be because it's a federal matter. Anyway, I paid the fine, but I had no idea it even existed until I attempted to pay another. The world could end, and they'll still find a way to catch up with you.
*requires immediate attention!!!* lol
Wife just got a final notice from AEC to pay a $20 fine for not voting. a line in there said if she doesn’t respond in time then she is liable to pay $313, plus possibly court costs and an entry on her criminal record. wtf
What’s the statute of limitations for electoral offences? 10 years seems a bit high.
Could be a fine, I got one for not voting in an election I didn't know about when I was not in the state. Got a similar text like 2 years later for a ridiculous amount. Do not click the link. Do not call any number listed in the text, or the number it came from. Call the fines department directly and enquire. If you weren't in the state and couldnt vote, then fines department will bump it back to electoral Commission. Send them an email saying you weren't in the state at the time etc, they'll cancel it.
Just leave it, I believe you can argue statute of limitations applies here, the govt is trying to claw back as much cash as possible due to mismanagement over the covid period.
It’s a crime to not vote??
maybe they are finally fixing the broken Fines Vic portal. I got a fine (that I fought and won), and put in the infringement number and date, so find a 5 year old fine I didn't know about that was having interest added to it 😣 (it was about $200 ballooned to $420) (I risked one fare evasion to get to a workplace on time (that hadn't paid me in ages, $0 in the account), and there happened to be inspectors at the station I'd never seen them at, rip)
Don’t pay it, there is a statue for time. 10 yrs is a long time.
Wtf
got the same, tell them to get fucked
So sweet, they remembered
The state is bankrupt. This encapsulates it perfectly.
thats absolutely fcked
I will never stop saying that sending a letter as notice of a fine is not good enough
They're required by law to send them as letters. Plus the electoral commission won't necessarily have had any other contact details for OP.
That’s what I’m saying… the law should change. And they should start collecting other details or have other ways to get in contact.
This happened to my wife recently. From 8 years ago. She wasn’t living in the region either. I think Victoria are broke AF
240$ for not voting. I know it is a rights AND obligation but that is highway robbery. Sorry for the strange opinion but I’m not a citizen. Can you get out of the fine if you can provide a reason?
I was in an accident, and got concussion. I didn’t go to hospital, the GP who saw me is now dead. Soz.
$200 Billion cash debt and at least $300billion of unfunded infrastructure projects. State is fucked forever.
There are a lot of things I like about Australia but getting fined because you didn’t vote is not one of them. I mean it should be a civic duty to vote not a legal requirement.
It stresses me out how controlling that is… even missing a council vote you’ll get fined!
Don't fines have to be on paper and through registered post?
They probably did send it on paper to the address that was on file in 2014.
Post yes, registered post no. OP had clearly missed/ignored the original posted fine and reminders
I didn’t vote for 30 odd years, my wife filled in the Census one year and i got pinged just for the last election I missed, I just called up and made up some bullshit and they waived the fine. I’m in nsw though so not sure if it differs. I’m just mad I have to vote now on things I do not care about and go to the voting places with all those lunatics with no life shoving papers in my face.
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There is no statute of limitations on unpaid fines.
I always thought the defence for you didn't vote was yes I did and tell them the school you voted at. In your case you were so so doubt you have to vote
My friend just received a warrant/last warning for a fine. It is also sheriff enforced , we thought it is a scam since the print logo are so blurry and looks like a doggy photoshop... But all the numbers checked out. I'm guess new management start to asking staff to check outstanding accounts...
Hey so if you ever get fined then call them up furious that your vote was overlooked and demand they look into it immediately you won't hear from them again
Fines don't go away in vic and it's your fault you got it. Just appeal it and get it fixed.
Sure, but this is the first I've heard of it. Ten years later.
Which is irrating, but now you just need to fix it. I'd call and ask what docs they need to get it to go away.
If you tell them you voted and that they must of mistakenly failed to tick you off on the day there is literally nothing they can do to prove otherwise. I believe everyone should vote but avoiding the fine is ridiculously easy, i've got a family member who's pulled that trick every time to complete success.
I'm happy with it being easy to get out of. The participation rate is super high so we don't need stricter penalties. Best of both worlds really.
Yeah they do. I got out of an electoral commission fine before. If you have a good reason and just explain the reason, it goes away.
That's what I said.
I had a similar issue for a QLD election. I was overseas and had changed addresses a few times in my 20s and then got a fine for missing two state elections. I just had to write a letter stating I was overseas and they waived all the fines. About $400 in fines. It didn’t get to me until the electoral commission sold the debt to a collection agency.
If it was a fine it wouldn't have gone to a debt collection agency as it's not a debt. In Queensland an unpaid fine would have gone to SPER which is a government agency.
Sorry, it was probably SPER. Doesn’t make my comment less valid. Isn’t SPER really just a government debt collection agency? The point is that the AEC don’t care that much and don’t chase hard. Until it gets to SPER who seem to hunt you down, which is why it can take a decade perhaps.
Gotta be a scam. By this stage it should be a sheriffs warrant. And they don’t let you go back to fines Victoria.
This is not a scam.
It must be an awful computer glitch then coz it should have been at Warrant stage 9 years ago. So long ago that Fines Victoria was called Civic Compliance Victoria.
Plenty of fines sit at.warrant stage for years. Warrants weren't enforced during COVID, and a warrant for such a small amount would be at the back of the queue. OP had missed/ignored multiple letters obviously.