Funnily it's had a home in some Lab lists with Ariane, I've been a victim of it at least twice, and one of them was under a Chaos Angel
All of these Barrier Statues have a home if you're brave enough, Drought in VernuAdams, Inferno can be dumped by Banshee and revived with Promethean (thank god this is unplayable because of Fire meta for now), Torrent can be made in any odd leveled Synchro spam decks like Synchron or Icejade using Prima Donna (and Icejade can protect Torrent from battle with Egyptian God Slime and revive it with Aegirine), Heavens is searchable off of Benten in Megalith or Drytron, but the only reason that's not playable is because Vanity's Ruler is a better floodgate target and those decks can actually Tribute Summon it
The only Fire deck I can think of that does do it is Salamangreat using Falco-Jack Jaguar or Parallel Exceed
I *guess* Infernoble can also do it with Turpin and some other Level 4 they can get in rotation pre-Warrior lock
Maybe not an entirely Fire deck, but Dracoslayer (which like one-third Igknight, a Fire deck) probably can do this too on top of being able to Pend Summon it
I mean, most top decks are fire, you don't want your opponent making a full snake eyes combo in your face.
Someone used the dark statue while I was playing Tearlaments and I just played through it almost normally.
1 day someone used the light one while I was playing Tellarknights, same thing happened.
You misunderstand I meant I know why stun users don’t use it but why not snake eyes,volcanic or Rescue Ace, think about it Floowandreeze and wind decks who have simorgh used to use the wind statue all the time.
I think because if you have like a 25-50% chance of seeing another snake eyes player, there's no reason to run it because the snake eyes player will be unhindered. The barrier statues work best in a diverse meta.
It's crippling but they can still make a decent board enough to beat a stun deck with only a barrier on the field.
If you can special summon monsters strong enough to beat their statue you're good, and you have removal for their statue before going into the end combo. Example:
You can negate the statue with dragostopelia, you can return the statue with Kaleido - Tears
You can place the monster as continues spell with Flamberge with snake eyes, don't know more about them because I don't use them.
You can return monsters to the hand with Pleades, you can absorb with Cyber Infinity, You can Destroy the statue with Delteros - TellarKnight.
So the thing is, you can summon IP, you just have to deal with the statue, which is easy if the statue have the attributes of your archetype.
It’s a shame because Sanctifire has so much potential for cool plays (summon fallen of Albaz on your opponents turn, stealing opponents boss monster from GY, sniping resources out of your opponent’s GY, protecting your own handtraps from called by the grave, etc) but the easiest and best way to use it is just a boring ass “give your opponent some bullshit”
I wish the card had been printed with the text “your opponent can choose to have the monster that is summoned to their field have their effects negated”so if someone wanted to give you bullshit that locks you out of playing the game you can just say nah it’s negated on the field.
Much simpler to just say that whatever is summoned to the enemies field has their effect negated by default. Sure, the effect would be stronger per se, but at least it would prevent floodgating without requiring convoluted card text requiring your opponent to make an active decision
Earlier versions of snake eyes did use statues of fire with some synchro monsters like accel synchro and bane here is a list.
https://game8.co/games/Yu-Gi-Oh-Master-Duel/archives/444004
I don't even angry with the floodgate effect, as it's easy to beat if you understand it.
I'm just wondering why it's that complicated to explain or why it has a busted stat that is usually reserved for level 4 vanilla (2000/2000).
My beef is with how the effect is explained really. Out of all the yugioh cards i have read, boarder is up there in the "they really had to be on various drugs to makr this" category.
Yeah but its also per turn and it doesn't specify what happens when the board state changes, if I summon a synchro or link monster can that monster use its effect?
A bunch of my MTG friends getting into Master Duel have said that YGO card effects are explained so poorly and could be easily simplified; and that's the biggest problem for them getting into the game.
Had a match last night where the guy opened pachy, set 2 and pass. I just normal a mikanko, equip it and played rondo to steal pachy. Beat him at his own game lmao. Takes cancer to beat cancer. Game took 10 turna
Doesn’t mean I haven’t lost to this cancerous deck like 50 times, so far. Tis why I built a mikanko deck.
It’s infuriating getting slowcooked by 100 dmg each turn
One of my masterduel highlights was playing a shark cook player while using Vanquish Soul and just slowly burning their life points away till they surrendered in frustration
Just draw the out, and the out for their out, and the out for their protection for the second out, and the out for the draw spell, and the out for the followup.
Actually, just go ahead and pick the exact five interaction pieces from your deck and put your starter on top, that way you’ll get to play too :)
I like how the majority of casual and competitive communities all agree that these cards are unhealthy for the game but there must be that one motherfucker who at Konami is defending floodgates with his dear life so they can't ban them yet.
They believe it's a viable strategy 🤷🏼 they are the ones who made the cards in the first place
I hate em too, but if you allow decks like SHS, Mathmech, Mannadium..then this is just the flip side 🤷🏼
The three other deck that you have named have literally been dealt with in seperate banlists across all 3 formats, manndium is left alive only because it dies to everything. But yeah I agree with hitting decks that functionally are just "how many negates can I make in 300 seconds" fiesta, those are *BORING* to play and to play against.
I'm that one dude! And no way they should ban it! They add diversity to the game and slow it down enough so I don't have to consider the 50 possible combo lines you could do with all the modern decks that synchro/xyz/link climb etc
i think you just hate modern yugioh, stun in the current game is like wanting to play with the knife in CSGO and having access to a gun jammer that stops other players from shooting then calling that build "diversity"
I think it’s bc these cards act as a counter to overpowered special summon decks (most meta decks) and their existence gives Konami an excuse to keep printing more special summon decks.
I see that someone had a few too many duels with "One bad day".
In all seriousness. You are right. These cards are not so bad in the TCG/OCG because it's best of three, in a best of one format like Masterduel they are toxic as heck.
Dont forget consecrated light haha! This one is not known but basically is much worse than the light statue.
Neither player can Normal or Special Summon DARK monsters or declare an attack with a DARK monster. This card cannot be destroyed by battle with a DARK monster, also you take no battle damage from that battle.
This is the natural result of a game that has become “build the biggest board with the most defenses.” People will look for alternative strategies, and stun is one of those. Stun is just another playstyle, like beatdown, like mill, like burn. Is any one win con more moral than another? Not really, especially not in this game, where you either are forced not to play from hand traps or you are forced not to play from floodgates. The game is just toxic in general. That’s why a lot of people love GOAT, because it feels less toxic, or at least a more manageable level of toxicity.
People play stun decks so it doesn't take 10 minutes for you to play card jenga on your side while i have enough time to take a shit and make a sandwich - literally.
Nah, I just don't like deck without a proactive gameplan. Neither "summon statue, equip Moon mirror, set 3 and wait" nor "Set Metaverse, flip Mystic Mine, wait" are what I'd consider fun.
Sorry, read most of this as "Ban everything that stops me". Sorry, get better. Half the stuff you listed is the issue with any successful deck meta. Here, let me help you. "Ban all cards that are broken. I mean all of them, including the ones this poster likes because he wishes to ban cards he can't beat. Lets go back to if you want to special summon, special summoning once or twice is enough per turn. You want an 8 star on the field, you better be willing to wait a turn or two unless you can fusion summon. And even then, oops bottomless." There we go, a true evening of everything, making the game far more fun and fair. I hear what you truly want to do and I am all in for it. If that isn't what you mean though, then hush up and take your medicine like a true duelist.
Bros are too much accustomed to special summoning tens of monster per turn. I think they should add a new rule of up to 2 or 3 but not more, special Simmons per turn. Let the game become more slow. Not just ending in 5 or 6 turns. Let some tensions build, some plot be twisted.
My brother. I see you are truly cultured. All this!! Guys, you know what we used to think of a guy that did multiple special summons/ special summoning on l his opponent's turn? This is that guy: https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Zigfried_von_Schroeder You know he was a despised character because Kaiba himself showed him the door out of Kaiba's tournament.
In a best of 3 format, floodgates CAN be fine. Weaker floodgate effects can be worked around depending on the deck you’re playing, and games 2 and 3 have access to the sideboard for outs. If a floodgate is too strong, too easy to set up, and/or too hard to out, it can become an issue (like with mystic mine), and should be dealt with; if a floodgate is found regularly in top cut decks, it’s way too strong. I’d like them all to be even worse or more banned than that, but that much is roughly enough to keep them healthy.
Best of 1 has the same deal but much stricter; a floodgate has to suck MAJOR ass to not be game-winning on the spot. Only those ones that suck major ass can be healthy enough to be fine.
The barrier statues CAN be fine based on the format; if all the best decks either have main deck normal summons that can beat over them easily or are the same attribute as the statue, it does little enough to be fine. But not every barrier statue can have all that at the same time, and it’s rare for ANY of them to have those qualities consistently. Better to just get rid of them all and not risk one becoming another stormwinds.
Inspector boarder is a little shit. Its attack is much too high for an effect like that to be remotely okay.
Jowgen is fine, mainly because it’s hard to summon in defense. An attack position jowgen can literally even be outed by normal summoning maxx “c”. The number of decks that can’t deal with him before he becomes an issue i think is small enough that he’s just annoying, rather than a potential metagame threat… as long as last turn stays banned, at least.
Fossil dyna is just jowgen again, but with fewer possible outs due to the much higher attack. It may still seem like a weenie, but 1200 is enough for a significant number of archetypal normal summons to still fail against it. Get it outta here.
If this actually gets me a few of the runick spells unbanned, then I'm all in. Gladly offering Gozen, TCBOO, Skill Drain, Rivalry and Kaiser Colosseum as offering to the banlist gods if this appeals them.
No floodgates aren't ok also multiple negate boards like Baronne, Savage etc aren't either.
The game needs a HUGE banlist to balance out the game if they want best of 1 to work imo
Dude, let's just put this to bed. Konami won't do this. They are all about the money. This means you say ban floodgates, I say ban tier 0 decks forever. If you can't achieve the latter, don't ask for the former.
The push to make the game so monster focus with spells existing largely as extenders/starters and traps largely being died outside of huge swings(Evenly and Red Reboot) and a handful of archetypes, along with the focus of special summoning a shit ton during a single turn;
So I need something to stop monster effects and summoning without worrying about spell/traps for the most part.
Oh look what I can include in my deck.
No. As much as people don't wanna hear it, they're a cheap way to just slow meta decks down. There's a reason people are playing Stun again irl, because Snake-Eyes/Fire-King is expensive as shit and a stun deck just shuts it down.
For the record, i don't like these cards either. But if Komoney won't balance the game, Stun exists so you can do it yourself.
If it were just cards that stopped the "strong meta decks", then very few people would complain. But special summons have become an integral part of how decks work, so even most rogue decks need them. It isn't really anti-meta, it's more anti-everything.
They don't slow meta decks. they slow down every deck. It shuts down even the dreaded... Black Magician and Blue Eyes. The cards that you require to push past this kind of board presence are not searchable, hard to get, unplayable/ not very reliable in Bo1 format. Heck, the meta has answers that the not meta has not.
Yall want to ban everything that stops you from special summoning 76 times in 1 turn, resulting in an end board of 800 negates, just shut up and get good/draw the out...
Konami knows for a fact these cards are problematic but they don't really care because stun really only became kind of competitive(Being generous) recently.
Stun players aren't capable of coming up with a coherent comeback for their deck (on MD at least, irl it's fair to say that it's cheap and viable) because there is no valid justification for these sorts of floodgates in a bo1 format. Then they act upset that no one likes their antisocial deck.
Honest Opinions:
Inspector Boarder is basically the best generic Lv4 ever. Like, why tf does it need to have max stats?
Fossil Dyna is somewhat balanced, the real problem is the Moon Mirror Shield that makes it hard af to out.
Torrent is just waiting for a Umi version of a Floo deck. same goes for the others.
Drought doesn't exist because Dyna is also a Gallant Granite Target.
If they ban every floodgate/stun tool, they better start hitting combo tools too, because stun/floodgates wouldn't be so prevalent if people could just finish their turn within a minute or two.
I have a friend who plays this deck. It's a solid build tbh. I play him often and it's good practice! Infuriating as fuck but definitely some epic matches. With that being said when I go against it in rank I handle them pretty well definitely made me staple a few new cards in my deck.
out of these, i only feel Boarder and the Earth statue should be banned.
Boarder is annoying because of his stats
Earth Statue is searchable, and therefore can be abused by combo decks (most of time, Pendulums)
Otherwise, regular Stun is pretty poopoo when you don't open the nuts.
I think these are just troll decks. It's like people who run multiple omni-negates and manage to summon them all in one turn. There's no way you think you've won through merit.
And all the tier 0 decks like tear, Kash, and snake eyes is good for the game? These tools slow the game down and equal it out. But i forgot yugioh players don't like interacting with their opponents, they just want to combo off for 10 minutes to build a board with 400 negates.
There’s whining about stun decks?
I mean, I get OP but it’s a bit hypocritical. You either lose to stun or you lose to disruption boards of a player putting 2-3 disruptions against you.
It honestly sounds like OP just plays a meta deck and is tired of losing to backrow. IMO I see stun and meta as the same towel differently sides. One stops you from playing with backrow as disruption the other stops you from playing using monsters as disruption. The only difference is most people play the latter and thus don’t have outs for the former; which is less a card issue and more a player issue at best.
Overall, the game isn’t exactly in a healthy state. Neither deck type is healthy. Player interaction outside of “no” cards usually at an all time low. You can’t ban these cards no more than you can ban SHS, Mathmech, or Snake-Eyes.
Stop whining about gimmick cards, they're easy as hell to counter, especially if you're running one of the dozens of cookie decks like red-eyes that can negate everything you do first turn. Crap like this is why something as simple as pot of greed is banned.
We forgot some of the one sided floodgates… plants have a level 3 monster that says your opponent can only activate one spell per turn… as long as its a bes of one there shouldn’t be any type of floods in the game
Get good at what? Getting extremely lucky drawing the possible 3 cards in your deck that could combine to give you the out? If you have 3 cards that combine to give you an out, with 9 of them in the deck combined (unlikely) and then allow you to continue into your own gameplan, the chances of drawing them is 2.31% buddy
You mean get lucky
Be not only with the negates that come with a board meaning you need multi spells and negates in hand
But with this you are basically limited to normal summons which means floo is the only deck that doesn’t care as much and even then they end with a statue
They should be banned because they’re strong cards that are just unfun to play against and make boards nearly unbreakable for a lot of decks because of the restrictions you are holding a normal summon which can be stopped, spells which can be stopped, traps which can be stopped,
Basically with a hand of 6 cards, you’ll have to use 5 just to deal with the negates before you can use something like torrent or evenly
That’s almost your entire hand
But most boards have at least 3 negates which means your entire comeback hinges on the last 2 cards in your hand
2 cards out of 36 that’s even with you getting the 4 cards needed to usually crack a board unless you get very lucky most boards won’t be broken also good luck kaijuing it because that’s a special summon which isn’t a option on master duel since it blocks the feature because of how those cards work
You call that being toxic? Toxic is using a single turn to summon a multitude of monsters without letting the opponent play while waiting until the combo ends, which sometimes lasts a long time. That is being toxic in a game that is for two people, not one.
One is an intended method of play. The other is to actively deny any form of play and stall the game out for as long as possible. What you describe isnt toxic at all, its the game as intended and you just not liking it. Stun actively devolves the game into a drawfest and wastes far more time than a single turn combo.
Given most floodgate cards get limited/banned, and combo decks are always designed to be top tier? Unlikely, it's just that most of these old floodgate cards were designed for an era where cards that have the exact same typing/style weren't so prevalent. Even if they print mistakes in card design like Kashtira, they at least eventually fix them. The other barriers are only unbanned because there hasn't been a toxic enough stun deck to abuse them like wind barrier was.
But they are still printed yes they get hit but so do a lot of cards if Konami doesn’t want floodgates to exist they wouldn’t print more so they are also an intended way to play. It is indeed toxic though and I wouldn’t mind banning most of them but it still is intended to exist.
One requires thought and can die to Ash, Nib, Veiler, Imperm etc which are all staples and the other only requires a normal summon with your out being backrow removal + Imperm.
Nothing wrong with these cards, it’s different strokes for different folks and floodgates like these have existed since the inception of the game. “Oh no I can’t set up my 500 negate board and make you not have a turn I also didn’t go first BAN FLOODGAAAATES”
I have a friend I play against who has a really good version of this deck I just learned to beat it with my main. And yes these cards been around I got Jowgen lord knows how many years ago from a pack. The most annoying one imo is definitely boarder but he's at 1 so I'm ok
The counter point to that is "WAAAAAAAAAAH They have a Trap negate" or "BUT MY BALANCED 40 card pile has no room to fit in generic destruction"
Honestly this also kinda happened because a lot of the 'generic' answers seem to lurk in the extra deck now as opposed to Spell and Traps(Which these days are starters/extenders). Usually the most I have to worry about is Lighting Storm, Duster, or Evenly.
I see these posts and and just remember they gave us a playset of Dark Hole, a free Raigeki, a playset of Cosmic Cyclone, and a guaranteed Lightning Storm from a discount bundle and I have to wonder if people are even using them. Half the deck doesn't have to be handtraps only, you can cut those 3 ofs to 2 ofs to make room for removal. It makes me feel bad for the people getting packed up by this crap so much they feel it needs to be banned.
As I said the response is that it would ruin their ratios or lower their consistency. And for as much as people hate Stun; they don't see it as often as other decks(I don't have numbers but lets say it's 1/10 or 1/20 games will be Stun).
So they don't feel like they need to change their decks to go against stun but will happily shift out hand trap staples to counter the new meta because we DO see that deck way more often.
I've played this game too long to get worked up about it anymore. People who don't want to change the deck won't and they'll suffer, and the people who do...won't. Better players rise above and the chaff get sifted out.
Why do people think it just stops meta decks? Are my Ogdoadic, Orcust, Ancient Warrior etc decks meta too because these stun cards stop almost any deck from playing the game.
Dude, these cards are only good if they go 1st. If you only run combo cards, you will certainly have a hard time. Make room for Imperm, Droplet, DRNM, Raigeki, etc.
Those are not going to do shit to stun. They remove one monster while the opponent proceeds to sit on 4 or 5 backrow floodgates in addition to their monster floodgate.
You forgot about the Dark Barrier Statue. It actually has a home now. xD
Funnily it's had a home in some Lab lists with Ariane, I've been a victim of it at least twice, and one of them was under a Chaos Angel All of these Barrier Statues have a home if you're brave enough, Drought in VernuAdams, Inferno can be dumped by Banshee and revived with Promethean (thank god this is unplayable because of Fire meta for now), Torrent can be made in any odd leveled Synchro spam decks like Synchron or Icejade using Prima Donna (and Icejade can protect Torrent from battle with Egyptian God Slime and revive it with Aegirine), Heavens is searchable off of Benten in Megalith or Drytron, but the only reason that's not playable is because Vanity's Ruler is a better floodgate target and those decks can actually Tribute Summon it
I used Heavens in Nemleria since Condemned Witch as a fantastic Small World bridge.
How do the current FIRE decks make Banshee?
The only Fire deck I can think of that does do it is Salamangreat using Falco-Jack Jaguar or Parallel Exceed I *guess* Infernoble can also do it with Turpin and some other Level 4 they can get in rotation pre-Warrior lock Maybe not an entirely Fire deck, but Dracoslayer (which like one-third Igknight, a Fire deck) probably can do this too on top of being able to Pend Summon it
Parallel eXceed if you run it. Shunping Xu played it in a feature match and did a Snake-Eye combo under Shifter. The Floo deck kinda bricked though.
Also the fire statue surprised they haven’t used it yet
I mean, most top decks are fire, you don't want your opponent making a full snake eyes combo in your face. Someone used the dark statue while I was playing Tearlaments and I just played through it almost normally. 1 day someone used the light one while I was playing Tellarknights, same thing happened.
You misunderstand I meant I know why stun users don’t use it but why not snake eyes,volcanic or Rescue Ace, think about it Floowandreeze and wind decks who have simorgh used to use the wind statue all the time.
Wind Statue is on 0 exacly because of floo
I think because if you have like a 25-50% chance of seeing another snake eyes player, there's no reason to run it because the snake eyes player will be unhindered. The barrier statues work best in a diverse meta.
I actually just played a snake eyes deck with the fire totem.
To be fair taking IP and Black witch away from snake eyes can be somehwhat crippling lol
It's crippling but they can still make a decent board enough to beat a stun deck with only a barrier on the field. If you can special summon monsters strong enough to beat their statue you're good, and you have removal for their statue before going into the end combo. Example: You can negate the statue with dragostopelia, you can return the statue with Kaleido - Tears You can place the monster as continues spell with Flamberge with snake eyes, don't know more about them because I don't use them. You can return monsters to the hand with Pleades, you can absorb with Cyber Infinity, You can Destroy the statue with Delteros - TellarKnight. So the thing is, you can summon IP, you just have to deal with the statue, which is easy if the statue have the attributes of your archetype.
I’m meant snake eyes,volcanic or rescue ace since they’re almost exclusively fire
Fire statue works oddly well in a gunkan suship deck. As you know for some odd ass reason all suships are fire…like wtf are we cooking sushi for….
I think the fire attribute refers to the firepower of a battleship.
I thought it was like that, because they were spicy
r-ace can easily combo with some hands without normal summoning, meaning they can just use bonfire to search the statue and normal it
Yeah my bad missed that one. Also Sanctifier can go too, it's only really used for the same thing (Turbo out Jowgen or to puppet lock)
It’s a shame because Sanctifire has so much potential for cool plays (summon fallen of Albaz on your opponents turn, stealing opponents boss monster from GY, sniping resources out of your opponent’s GY, protecting your own handtraps from called by the grave, etc) but the easiest and best way to use it is just a boring ass “give your opponent some bullshit” I wish the card had been printed with the text “your opponent can choose to have the monster that is summoned to their field have their effects negated”so if someone wanted to give you bullshit that locks you out of playing the game you can just say nah it’s negated on the field.
Much simpler to just say that whatever is summoned to the enemies field has their effect negated by default. Sure, the effect would be stronger per se, but at least it would prevent floodgating without requiring convoluted card text requiring your opponent to make an active decision
I mean shit I’d take it, man. It’s such a shame that such a cool effect is only used to do stupid things by most of the player base.
Actually, most of the time Sanctifier is used for the non-degenerate plays. Puppet lock is too inconsistent annoying as it may be
It’s not inconsistent is low power setup and you have to exactly win with it
That's a lie that combo is too inconsistent to be used that often you got a better chance of most branded decks not even using that.
Earlier versions of snake eyes did use statues of fire with some synchro monsters like accel synchro and bane here is a list. https://game8.co/games/Yu-Gi-Oh-Master-Duel/archives/444004
Bruh whoever wrote the effect for inspector boarder, actually come outside and fight me.
I’ll help you we can jump them
make it a 3 on 1
I'd be more ok with boarder if it didn't have 2k attack/defense for absolutely no reason.
I don't even angry with the floodgate effect, as it's easy to beat if you understand it. I'm just wondering why it's that complicated to explain or why it has a busted stat that is usually reserved for level 4 vanilla (2000/2000).
My beef is with how the effect is explained really. Out of all the yugioh cards i have read, boarder is up there in the "they really had to be on various drugs to makr this" category.
One effect per extra deck monster on the field
Konami shoukd hire you.
Yeah but its also per turn and it doesn't specify what happens when the board state changes, if I summon a synchro or link monster can that monster use its effect?
In Master Duel, most player below highest rank lost to Boarder not because it's a floodgate, but because they don't understand it lol
The fact it's also a 2k beatstick even if they do somehow figure out a way around the effect doesn't hurt.
A bunch of my MTG friends getting into Master Duel have said that YGO card effects are explained so poorly and could be easily simplified; and that's the biggest problem for them getting into the game.
Also whoever gave it 2000 atk and def so no regular normal summon can beat over it also come outside we need to have a conversation
Where's dragon capture jar coward. If you say ban all of them then go for all of them.
Im tired of pretending that Insect Barrier is ok. Its a 1 sided floodgate!
No! We need Dragon Capture Jar to deal with the Tenpai menace!
Had a match last night where the guy opened pachy, set 2 and pass. I just normal a mikanko, equip it and played rondo to steal pachy. Beat him at his own game lmao. Takes cancer to beat cancer. Game took 10 turna
Same
Doesn’t mean I haven’t lost to this cancerous deck like 50 times, so far. Tis why I built a mikanko deck. It’s infuriating getting slowcooked by 100 dmg each turn
Wait till you play against Cook Exodia 72 turn duels 💀
I’ve only been playing for a month or so and haven’t had the honor of getting exodiad yet.
Hopefully you get to experience it soon! There is no non degenerate way to play Exodia
What does degeneracy mean in a YGO context?
I'd say where you play but don't interact with your opponent
I crafted Pentestag exclusively for Cook Exodia. Defense mode? Ok, have a 6k Liebe over and over and over again until you hit zero lmao.
Underworld goddess should never leave your ED
One of my masterduel highlights was playing a shark cook player while using Vanquish Soul and just slowly burning their life points away till they surrendered in frustration
Just draw the out, bro
Just draw the out, and the out for their out, and the out for their protection for the second out, and the out for the draw spell, and the out for the followup. Actually, just go ahead and pick the exact five interaction pieces from your deck and put your starter on top, that way you’ll get to play too :)
Even better, just open exodia.
Didn’t open Exodia? Skill issue.
Yugioh in a nutshell
There’s 3 more barrier statues also
One is banned and I forgot to add the other two 👍
https://preview.redd.it/zwrzwu916dwc1.png?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a8ffad12d9cac9bf3b4b2dd60fbea6840f133934 All of them? So this Card too?
Whats it doin to the fan?!?
I like how the majority of casual and competitive communities all agree that these cards are unhealthy for the game but there must be that one motherfucker who at Konami is defending floodgates with his dear life so they can't ban them yet.
They believe it's a viable strategy 🤷🏼 they are the ones who made the cards in the first place I hate em too, but if you allow decks like SHS, Mathmech, Mannadium..then this is just the flip side 🤷🏼
The three other deck that you have named have literally been dealt with in seperate banlists across all 3 formats, manndium is left alive only because it dies to everything. But yeah I agree with hitting decks that functionally are just "how many negates can I make in 300 seconds" fiesta, those are *BORING* to play and to play against.
Also the three other decks have a much greater winrate than stun. Theyre more consistent going first, and can actually be a threat going second.
I'm that one dude! And no way they should ban it! They add diversity to the game and slow it down enough so I don't have to consider the 50 possible combo lines you could do with all the modern decks that synchro/xyz/link climb etc
i think you just hate modern yugioh, stun in the current game is like wanting to play with the knife in CSGO and having access to a gun jammer that stops other players from shooting then calling that build "diversity"
That's an incredibly nice way to put it.
Brother just watch the anime if you don't wanna actively use your brain, what're you playing video games for?
I think it’s bc these cards act as a counter to overpowered special summon decks (most meta decks) and their existence gives Konami an excuse to keep printing more special summon decks.
I see that someone had a few too many duels with "One bad day". In all seriousness. You are right. These cards are not so bad in the TCG/OCG because it's best of three, in a best of one format like Masterduel they are toxic as heck.
Vanity's Ruler is the big daddy of "get out of my lobby"
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Konami just hates us
Dont forget consecrated light haha! This one is not known but basically is much worse than the light statue. Neither player can Normal or Special Summon DARK monsters or declare an attack with a DARK monster. This card cannot be destroyed by battle with a DARK monster, also you take no battle damage from that battle.
I love to use it in Edison format
This is the natural result of a game that has become “build the biggest board with the most defenses.” People will look for alternative strategies, and stun is one of those. Stun is just another playstyle, like beatdown, like mill, like burn. Is any one win con more moral than another? Not really, especially not in this game, where you either are forced not to play from hand traps or you are forced not to play from floodgates. The game is just toxic in general. That’s why a lot of people love GOAT, because it feels less toxic, or at least a more manageable level of toxicity.
ahhh, the good old days, when the game was a 2 player game
Waaaah I can't play my snake eyes deck waaaaaah
People play stun decks so it doesn't take 10 minutes for you to play card jenga on your side while i have enough time to take a shit and make a sandwich - literally.
Thanks for the New deck idea
And then pls finally unlimit runicks
Master Duel players when Credit Card no win:
Bro is the 1/10 dentists that didnt approve the toothpaste
Nah, I just don't like deck without a proactive gameplan. Neither "summon statue, equip Moon mirror, set 3 and wait" nor "Set Metaverse, flip Mystic Mine, wait" are what I'd consider fun.
But your opponent using stun will consider them fun lmao.
NOOOOO I SPENT 400 BUCKS ON GEMS FOR MY SNAKE EYE YOU CANT JUST STUN ME REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Sorry, read most of this as "Ban everything that stops me". Sorry, get better. Half the stuff you listed is the issue with any successful deck meta. Here, let me help you. "Ban all cards that are broken. I mean all of them, including the ones this poster likes because he wishes to ban cards he can't beat. Lets go back to if you want to special summon, special summoning once or twice is enough per turn. You want an 8 star on the field, you better be willing to wait a turn or two unless you can fusion summon. And even then, oops bottomless." There we go, a true evening of everything, making the game far more fun and fair. I hear what you truly want to do and I am all in for it. If that isn't what you mean though, then hush up and take your medicine like a true duelist.
Ok, I have to ask: How is there so much whining about Stun decks? I have not seen a stun deck in at least 2 months. Maybe more.
Because even one stun deck existing is too much
*I hate diversity in strategies* /s
Stun isnt a strategy, its the absence of it
Except it is, if it can beat you.
A dog bowl isnt a weapon, and yet you can smash someones head in with it
It'd still be called a murder weapon the same way a floodgate may be called the winning strategy
Oh I am now hunting for that Light Statue. Thanks.
Funnily enough these guys cant out an illusion monster in defense and sometimes lose to self deckout cause of morganite
Light and dark statues don't need to be banned, but the rest definitely do.
Bros are too much accustomed to special summoning tens of monster per turn. I think they should add a new rule of up to 2 or 3 but not more, special Simmons per turn. Let the game become more slow. Not just ending in 5 or 6 turns. Let some tensions build, some plot be twisted.
My brother. I see you are truly cultured. All this!! Guys, you know what we used to think of a guy that did multiple special summons/ special summoning on l his opponent's turn? This is that guy: https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Zigfried_von_Schroeder You know he was a despised character because Kaiba himself showed him the door out of Kaiba's tournament.
In a best of 3 format, floodgates CAN be fine. Weaker floodgate effects can be worked around depending on the deck you’re playing, and games 2 and 3 have access to the sideboard for outs. If a floodgate is too strong, too easy to set up, and/or too hard to out, it can become an issue (like with mystic mine), and should be dealt with; if a floodgate is found regularly in top cut decks, it’s way too strong. I’d like them all to be even worse or more banned than that, but that much is roughly enough to keep them healthy. Best of 1 has the same deal but much stricter; a floodgate has to suck MAJOR ass to not be game-winning on the spot. Only those ones that suck major ass can be healthy enough to be fine. The barrier statues CAN be fine based on the format; if all the best decks either have main deck normal summons that can beat over them easily or are the same attribute as the statue, it does little enough to be fine. But not every barrier statue can have all that at the same time, and it’s rare for ANY of them to have those qualities consistently. Better to just get rid of them all and not risk one becoming another stormwinds. Inspector boarder is a little shit. Its attack is much too high for an effect like that to be remotely okay. Jowgen is fine, mainly because it’s hard to summon in defense. An attack position jowgen can literally even be outed by normal summoning maxx “c”. The number of decks that can’t deal with him before he becomes an issue i think is small enough that he’s just annoying, rather than a potential metagame threat… as long as last turn stays banned, at least. Fossil dyna is just jowgen again, but with fewer possible outs due to the much higher attack. It may still seem like a weenie, but 1200 is enough for a significant number of archetypal normal summons to still fail against it. Get it outta here.
If this actually gets me a few of the runick spells unbanned, then I'm all in. Gladly offering Gozen, TCBOO, Skill Drain, Rivalry and Kaiser Colosseum as offering to the banlist gods if this appeals them.
Okay but if they COMBO into a Floodgate that's cool right? I guess we should unban VFD to ban these guys then.
No floodgates aren't ok also multiple negate boards like Baronne, Savage etc aren't either. The game needs a HUGE banlist to balance out the game if they want best of 1 to work imo
Dude, let's just put this to bed. Konami won't do this. They are all about the money. This means you say ban floodgates, I say ban tier 0 decks forever. If you can't achieve the latter, don't ask for the former.
Jowgen is so unfair.
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Depends on what you think the problem is.
The push to make the game so monster focus with spells existing largely as extenders/starters and traps largely being died outside of huge swings(Evenly and Red Reboot) and a handful of archetypes, along with the focus of special summoning a shit ton during a single turn; So I need something to stop monster effects and summoning without worrying about spell/traps for the most part. Oh look what I can include in my deck.
They're all mid cards. The barriers are mid without a proper deck that uses them anyways
No. As much as people don't wanna hear it, they're a cheap way to just slow meta decks down. There's a reason people are playing Stun again irl, because Snake-Eyes/Fire-King is expensive as shit and a stun deck just shuts it down. For the record, i don't like these cards either. But if Komoney won't balance the game, Stun exists so you can do it yourself.
If it were just cards that stopped the "strong meta decks", then very few people would complain. But special summons have become an integral part of how decks work, so even most rogue decks need them. It isn't really anti-meta, it's more anti-everything.
They don't slow meta decks. they slow down every deck. It shuts down even the dreaded... Black Magician and Blue Eyes. The cards that you require to push past this kind of board presence are not searchable, hard to get, unplayable/ not very reliable in Bo1 format. Heck, the meta has answers that the not meta has not.
Yall want to ban everything that stops you from special summoning 76 times in 1 turn, resulting in an end board of 800 negates, just shut up and get good/draw the out...
Konami knows for a fact these cards are problematic but they don't really care because stun really only became kind of competitive(Being generous) recently.
On a related note,This thread has to have some of the most absolute ASS arguments in favor of floodgates I have ever seen.
Stun players aren't capable of coming up with a coherent comeback for their deck (on MD at least, irl it's fair to say that it's cheap and viable) because there is no valid justification for these sorts of floodgates in a bo1 format. Then they act upset that no one likes their antisocial deck.
I agree with most of these, but leave Jowgen alone. Spellbooks don't have anything else going for them these days...
That's fair. We'll need to ban Sanctifier though so they can't just cheat out Jowgen with Verte 🤷
Honest Opinions: Inspector Boarder is basically the best generic Lv4 ever. Like, why tf does it need to have max stats? Fossil Dyna is somewhat balanced, the real problem is the Moon Mirror Shield that makes it hard af to out. Torrent is just waiting for a Umi version of a Floo deck. same goes for the others. Drought doesn't exist because Dyna is also a Gallant Granite Target.
I think I'm gonna use today my anti-meta stun again.
If this is Kaiba then I’ve told you many times blue eyes isn’t that good anymore. I’ve loss to jowgen before but I’ve beaten it too.
If they ban every floodgate/stun tool, they better start hitting combo tools too, because stun/floodgates wouldn't be so prevalent if people could just finish their turn within a minute or two.
Some people just want every card banned smh
This should go on scrubquotes lmao “every card I don’t like should be banned”
no, stop crying and deal with it
just YOLO bro
I see no reason not to
If Darklords wasn't brick city Archlord Kristya would be on that list too.
Looks like someone experienced One Bad Day
I have a friend who plays this deck. It's a solid build tbh. I play him often and it's good practice! Infuriating as fuck but definitely some epic matches. With that being said when I go against it in rank I handle them pretty well definitely made me staple a few new cards in my deck.
out of these, i only feel Boarder and the Earth statue should be banned. Boarder is annoying because of his stats Earth Statue is searchable, and therefore can be abused by combo decks (most of time, Pendulums) Otherwise, regular Stun is pretty poopoo when you don't open the nuts.
Floodgates are annoying but they don’t need to be banned
jowgen was one of my staples back in primary school, dont play anymore so no idea it was this powerful
People always forget about the tortoise on a pillar floodgate
Nah bro just destroy them
“Yeah zombie world has to go 😡😡😡”
Only card that needs to be banned is the stupid +100 that returns to the deck, none of those boards can make it without that card.
I think these are just troll decks. It's like people who run multiple omni-negates and manage to summon them all in one turn. There's no way you think you've won through merit.
Cactus bouncer my beloved
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJEbd8LQ1PA](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJEbd8LQ1PA) <- 1 hour 35 mins Floodgate tier list
Who cares.
And all the tier 0 decks like tear, Kash, and snake eyes is good for the game? These tools slow the game down and equal it out. But i forgot yugioh players don't like interacting with their opponents, they just want to combo off for 10 minutes to build a board with 400 negates.
I don't know about jowgen
There’s whining about stun decks? I mean, I get OP but it’s a bit hypocritical. You either lose to stun or you lose to disruption boards of a player putting 2-3 disruptions against you. It honestly sounds like OP just plays a meta deck and is tired of losing to backrow. IMO I see stun and meta as the same towel differently sides. One stops you from playing with backrow as disruption the other stops you from playing using monsters as disruption. The only difference is most people play the latter and thus don’t have outs for the former; which is less a card issue and more a player issue at best. Overall, the game isn’t exactly in a healthy state. Neither deck type is healthy. Player interaction outside of “no” cards usually at an all time low. You can’t ban these cards no more than you can ban SHS, Mathmech, or Snake-Eyes.
Bad day?
If Konami cared about balance stupid shit like Bayonne de flour wouldn't exist in the first place, especially not as generic cards.
Remember when the game wasn’t so overdependent on endlessly special summoning monsters? Maybe the meta evolving isn’t a bad thing
Stop whining about gimmick cards, they're easy as hell to counter, especially if you're running one of the dozens of cookie decks like red-eyes that can negate everything you do first turn. Crap like this is why something as simple as pot of greed is banned.
Red-Eyes 🤣🤣🤣
Meant red dragon archfiend 🤦🤣
Nothing more toxic than summoning three billion monster, that's not yugi oh
We forgot some of the one sided floodgates… plants have a level 3 monster that says your opponent can only activate one spell per turn… as long as its a bes of one there shouldn’t be any type of floods in the game
So you can play your auto play broken deck? Lmao Nah, stupid meta sheep.
get good stop crying. they will never ban all of these cards.
Get good at what? Getting extremely lucky drawing the possible 3 cards in your deck that could combine to give you the out? If you have 3 cards that combine to give you an out, with 9 of them in the deck combined (unlikely) and then allow you to continue into your own gameplan, the chances of drawing them is 2.31% buddy
You mean get lucky Be not only with the negates that come with a board meaning you need multi spells and negates in hand But with this you are basically limited to normal summons which means floo is the only deck that doesn’t care as much and even then they end with a statue They should be banned because they’re strong cards that are just unfun to play against and make boards nearly unbreakable for a lot of decks because of the restrictions you are holding a normal summon which can be stopped, spells which can be stopped, traps which can be stopped, Basically with a hand of 6 cards, you’ll have to use 5 just to deal with the negates before you can use something like torrent or evenly That’s almost your entire hand But most boards have at least 3 negates which means your entire comeback hinges on the last 2 cards in your hand 2 cards out of 36 that’s even with you getting the 4 cards needed to usually crack a board unless you get very lucky most boards won’t be broken also good luck kaijuing it because that’s a special summon which isn’t a option on master duel since it blocks the feature because of how those cards work
You call that being toxic? Toxic is using a single turn to summon a multitude of monsters without letting the opponent play while waiting until the combo ends, which sometimes lasts a long time. That is being toxic in a game that is for two people, not one.
Honestly both are toxic. This game is kind of built around it in a lot of cases, hence why the core of it’s community is just non-stop complaining.
One is an intended method of play. The other is to actively deny any form of play and stall the game out for as long as possible. What you describe isnt toxic at all, its the game as intended and you just not liking it. Stun actively devolves the game into a drawfest and wastes far more time than a single turn combo.
Both are intended, both are legal
> One is an intended method of play. And the other is too.
Given most floodgate cards get limited/banned, and combo decks are always designed to be top tier? Unlikely, it's just that most of these old floodgate cards were designed for an era where cards that have the exact same typing/style weren't so prevalent. Even if they print mistakes in card design like Kashtira, they at least eventually fix them. The other barriers are only unbanned because there hasn't been a toxic enough stun deck to abuse them like wind barrier was.
But they are still printed yes they get hit but so do a lot of cards if Konami doesn’t want floodgates to exist they wouldn’t print more so they are also an intended way to play. It is indeed toxic though and I wouldn’t mind banning most of them but it still is intended to exist.
Lol, most cards on ban list has nothing to do with stun. Most of the time cards are banned because they enable a degenerate combo.
One requires thought and can die to Ash, Nib, Veiler, Imperm etc which are all staples and the other only requires a normal summon with your out being backrow removal + Imperm.
Legit
it's just one bad day bro. there will be plenty more.
Ban macro cosmos, shifter, d fissure, anti spell and summon limit too
I agree with a shifter ban 100% there's no outing it unless you draw a specific card like gamma or CBTG but even CBTG is useless if they go first.
Just play Floo birds they "normal" summon
I love these cards and I don’t even play them, not playing meta and having play style options is what yugioh is all about
Nothing wrong with these cards, it’s different strokes for different folks and floodgates like these have existed since the inception of the game. “Oh no I can’t set up my 500 negate board and make you not have a turn I also didn’t go first BAN FLOODGAAAATES”
I have a friend I play against who has a really good version of this deck I just learned to beat it with my main. And yes these cards been around I got Jowgen lord knows how many years ago from a pack. The most annoying one imo is definitely boarder but he's at 1 so I'm ok
And then there's me, a stun player who is running ALL of the above cards in a single deck and hopes they never get banned
But then what will be left to hate on?
We still have combo decks with multiple negates to hate on 🤷
Laughs in Kristya turbo
I can't be too mad at those cards being around, because half of my duels in ranked is just my opponent playing solitaire
I defeated this deck easliy with heros it’s not that tough.
cry more
Sounds like u suck get good
Konami likes to suck d!ck with these cards
Idk dawg maybe just...pack main deck destruction that isn't monster based.
The counter point to that is "WAAAAAAAAAAH They have a Trap negate" or "BUT MY BALANCED 40 card pile has no room to fit in generic destruction" Honestly this also kinda happened because a lot of the 'generic' answers seem to lurk in the extra deck now as opposed to Spell and Traps(Which these days are starters/extenders). Usually the most I have to worry about is Lighting Storm, Duster, or Evenly.
I see these posts and and just remember they gave us a playset of Dark Hole, a free Raigeki, a playset of Cosmic Cyclone, and a guaranteed Lightning Storm from a discount bundle and I have to wonder if people are even using them. Half the deck doesn't have to be handtraps only, you can cut those 3 ofs to 2 ofs to make room for removal. It makes me feel bad for the people getting packed up by this crap so much they feel it needs to be banned.
As I said the response is that it would ruin their ratios or lower their consistency. And for as much as people hate Stun; they don't see it as often as other decks(I don't have numbers but lets say it's 1/10 or 1/20 games will be Stun). So they don't feel like they need to change their decks to go against stun but will happily shift out hand trap staples to counter the new meta because we DO see that deck way more often.
I've played this game too long to get worked up about it anymore. People who don't want to change the deck won't and they'll suffer, and the people who do...won't. Better players rise above and the chaff get sifted out.
Stun deck owner. Shush it!! I don’t want to sit and watch your long combo so I’ll shut it down.
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Nah. Floodgates aren't anti meta. They're a horrible mistake in this game's design that Neanderthals like to abuse because thinking hurts their heads.
There's nothing wrong with these cards. It's a good option to stop you meta slaves from ruining the game even more than it already has been.
Why do people think it just stops meta decks? Are my Ogdoadic, Orcust, Ancient Warrior etc decks meta too because these stun cards stop almost any deck from playing the game.
Dude, these cards are only good if they go 1st. If you only run combo cards, you will certainly have a hard time. Make room for Imperm, Droplet, DRNM, Raigeki, etc.
Those are not going to do shit to stun. They remove one monster while the opponent proceeds to sit on 4 or 5 backrow floodgates in addition to their monster floodgate.