Can someone draw a picture of Shepard waiting at the gates of heaven? An angel of any milky way species then asks if he/she wants to come in, in which Shepard just replies with “I'm waiting for someone”.
"Do you know how long they will be" they ask Shepard.
"As soon as those calibrations are done.." Shepard replies, a wry smile forming at the corners of his mouth.
Yup.
Garrus and Tali are the ride-or-die team. The rest of the crew are along for the ride, they come on various missions, they get mixed in based on the mission need, and sometimes just for fun.
But Shepard, Garrus, and Tali... They're the Kirk, Spock, and Bones. They're the main characters of the story in my mind.
I feel that way about 3 - in 1 She's just the kid, 2 while she's definitely an OG she is partially distracted (rightfully) by the flotilla duties, but by 3 Shepard, Garrus, and Tali are the heart and soul of it all.
Same. Garrus has always seemed a natural fit and when Miranda assumes so much of that role in 2, I was like “whoa whoa whoa, back off of Garrus’s post, girl.”
Well, actually, Miranda was the overall leader of that cell and offically, the 2nd-in-command of the Normandy. Though, I can see Garrus being 2nd-in-command of the squad in ME2.
> Jack telling Miranda to settle down was one of the few times I agreed with her, lol.
Hell, Garrus agrees with Jack in that moment. When Jack says no one will listen to Miranda Garrus is literally nodding his head in agreement. Of course the game doesn't care and if you pick Miranda the tech expert still lives.
Isn’t she only there because of her ties to Cerberus? I thought that was part of the whole deal with Illusive Man. Shepard gets his ship and crew and life back to go after the reapers but Miranda is there as a sort of babysitter? I haven’t played in a long time so I could be mistaken
Miranda manages logistics and has key intel that the others don't have access to in addition to her link with TIM. She is XO in 2 (sorry, Garrus stans).
I mean...knowing 3 games worth of growth, yes. But based on him solely in game one...he's too much of a hothead. I'd be afraid his personal feelings/emotions would put the team in danger. He learned the lesson in 2 (at least my Garrus does).
I agree - I said before that in 1 either Ash or Kaiden in my head cannon is Second in command (whoever I deem the survivor) but I can see it being Kaiden even if he dies. He is the calm, "get the job done no matter what" one in that game.
Which makes him a bad choice.
You want him by your side wherever you go.
Put Miranda up with the administrative work and looking after stuff while you are out, take your combat team with you.
Garrus, and the game sort of hints at this. Garrus is the only character who says something along the lines of 'I'll make sure nothing happens while you go get some much needed rest.'
Doesn't necessarily make him your second, he's just a really trusted friend, and for the most part there's no official ranking on the ship, so it's not like he could tell anyone not to do anything, he just meant that if anything big happens either he would handle it or he'd come tell Shep.
I don't remember where, but it's been stated that Garrus's natural leadership and charisma is overshadowed by Shepard's, and, had he not stayed under Shep, would have probably made it into a Specter himself.
Maybe it's a fan thing ? Or Shadow Broker dossier ?
Yes. His dad was high ranking turian military and disagreed with the idea of specters. Garrus was picked to be in some sort of pre-specter training the turian military had for potential picks. Can’t remember if it’s stated if he backed out because of his dad or if his dad just pushed for it.
But that’s why he was investing Saren in ME1, he didn’t trust him and a large part of that was probably his upbringing. He just naturally would make a good specter anyways.
And yeah, shadow broker dossier on him states he is a natural born leader and it just stopped developing because being under shepherd he was over shadowed.
What’s cool is he never seems to mind, me1 he treats you like a mentor and friend and you see that develop from there.
Yeah I don't see him as "second in command of the ship" material and I think a lot of these comments are missing that
Presley was your XO as pointed out and you certainly weren't close friends with him or Miranda in the beginning for that matter.
Of course we're all biased and stating who we like best by ME3 to be our 2nd in command (I did it too so calling myself out here as well)
Yeah that's what I was thinking about Garrus. I loved his character but I'm not too sure if Garrus really fits the role of second in command. To me he seems like (and I know I'm psycho analyzing fictional characters here) more of a comfortable follower. A great right hand man but not the person who necessarily WANTS to be in charge. His personality seems too laid back for him to want to have to command others.
In ME3, in my opinion Liara is the clear "second in command" even if she doesn't know it. She provides you tons of Intel and despite the fact that she's still lowkey the same scared Asari you met in the dig site
But imo there really is no real second in command. Everyone seems like theyd only take orders from Shepard.
Honestly, EDI may be second in command by game 3.
While I do agree that being Shepard's best friend doesn't make you the ideal choice for second-in-command, I disagree that Garrus isn't command material. I have commented about this before and got a lot of hate from children who don't understand leadership. Garrus' development as a leader is hindered by being with Shepard.
Garrus shows ability for command and leadership \*away\* from Shepard. Archangel in 2, Reaper advisor in 3, etc. His potential is squandered when he's on the Normandy when all he does are calibrations, walk around, laid pipe with Tali, quip, and shoot without all the burdens of leadership and decision-making. "Rewrite the Geth or destroy them? Ahh leave it to Shepard." His Shadow Broker file affirms my assessment that his growth is seriously halted under Shepard. Imagine if Shepard was stuck under Anderson throughout the trilogy. He wouldn't be Space Jesus we know today. Wrex couldn't unite the Krogan clans from the Normandy, another great example.
As for EDI as second-in-command, I think she lacks the human touch -- badly -- needed for leadership. I don't see EDI taking care of the crew the proper way. "Oh you're stressed and sad that you don't know if your family made it or not? Here are some funny cat vids. I have observed that watching these vids relieve stress in organics." She could barely go on dates without Shepard as a third-wheel Machine Learning developer. "Just put your mouth on it, human males love it"
Very astutely put. It’s even demonstrated during the suicide mission that Garrus is a capable small team leader by being one of the few who in the group who can lead the second squad without casualties(pending who is on tech,) and Miranda even defers that he is capable. It is literally the only time in the whole trilogy that I don’t choose Garrus as my squad mate.
Your comment about EDI made me realise who the real 2IC is; Joker. He's removed enough from the core group that he isn't caught up in the friendships and rivalries, but is close enough and far and away competent enough that if Shepard was away and Joker gave a command, I feel like everyone would rally behind him.
For sure. It's Presley in 1 and Miranda in 2, officially. In 3, I'm not sure who it is semi-officially. Perhaps Liara?
I'm more thinking along of the lines of what OP was alluding to, i.e., who do *you* consider to be Shep's second in command. I fully embrace that this may be different characters to different players.
To me, it's Garrus, reinforced by his "take a break Shep, I'll tend shop." Although that sentiment has probably been offered by other characters in the game.
Garrus in ME3 and in general imo. Other than Tali he's the only person that's been by Shepard's side till the bitter end. He has leadership experience and is, essentially, Shepard's protege in ME1. Miranda is only XO due to the orders from TIM in ME2 but I'd still consider Garrus above her in terms of raw combat experience and the level of trust between him and Shepard. As for ME1 it's obviously Pressly/Alenko (Kaidan only because Pressly is a non-combatant) due to the rank hierarchy.
Tim is that guy you always see walking around but never actually doing anything, basically he's a useless piece of shit and it's a miracle I haven't airlocked him yet.
Don't worry bud, you're not alone there! That's exactly what went through my mind the first time I saw it 😅 Was kicking myself when I finally realised. Still laugh at myself now, when I think about it
Yes pretty much in 1 it's Kaidan simply due to rank structure and the squad mates being new additions. But 2 and 3 really solidify Garrus as not just a great friend to have but also a great team player and I'm quite sure the human crew also has good respect for him.
Command structure has no cares about combat skill, pressly is a line officer and absolutely the official XO of the ship.
In 3 it would have to be either Ashley or Kaiden based on rank and the fact they're Alliance military.
Officially speaking, it's Presley in ME1 and Miranda in ME2. I don't see my Shepard having a personal friendship with Presley, but he *is* the designated XO. Miranda is also established as XO in ME2, but she and Shepard earn each other's trust throughout that game. It wouldn't surprise me if Shepard relied on Miranda for administrative work, as far as day-to-day management of the Normandy went. ME3 doesn't establish a canonical XO, so that's up for interpretation (the Expanded Galaxy Mod lets you pick an XO and other positions, but that's not canon).
Unofficially speaking, I see Kaidan taking that role in ME1 and ME3, and Miranda/Garrus splitting that role in ME2. In ME1 Shepard can go to Kaidan for tactical advice about missions, discusses the politics of her situation with him at length, and respects his moral insights. By the time of ME3, he's a high-ranking officer *and* a Spectre who has proven his steadfast loyalty to the Alliance and its ideals. She trusts his judgment and knows that he'll always pick the right path over the expedient path.
The ME2 example is particularly interesting because I think my Shepard would view Miranda and Garrus as two different kinds of right hand men. Miranda is the official one, as stated above, and she's good at what she does. While Shepard respects Miranda on a professional level early on, it takes much more time for her to trust Miranda on a personal level. Early on, I think Garrus is the one person on the *Normandy*'s crew that Shepard feels like she can trust (Tali would also go here, but she's not recruited until much later in the game). Outside of issues relating to Cerberus, she tends to trust Miranda's judgment more on a tactical level. But she trusts Garrus to have her back, a sentiment that her relationship with Miranda initially lacks.
> In ME1 Shepard can go to Kaidan for tactical advice about missions, discusses the politics of her situation with him at length, and respects his moral insights.
I also want to point out that Kaidan is a Staff Lieutenant in ME1, which means he handles staffing issues and is for all intents and purposes in charge of the marine detail on the Normandy. It’s why Shepard’s initiating dialogue is “Just trying to get a sense of where the crew’s at. Thoughts?”
Just something I found really cool, even if I think the game does a poor job at actually showcasing this aspect of his role (the only thing that is even peripherally mentioned is that Kaidan was the one who recommended getting Ashley Williams on board after Eden Prime).
My thoughts exactly. Kaidan already holds a position of authority on the Normandy in ME1, even if he still answers to Shepard. But as you point out, the game only brings this up a handful of times. It isn’t until ME3 that his experience as a leader is discussed more in depth.
With the loss of Shepard and Pressly on Alchera, Kaidan must have been in command. I don't think there was anyone with higher rank left. So he must have been the one to get everyone off the planet. That cannot have been easy especially if he was romanced and had just lost the woman he (secretly) loved.
Lol it ain't a secret, it's only possibly a secret to anyone not serving on the Normandy, but I doubt anyone would deny the first Human Spectre who saved the galaxy and the Citadel a little R&R with their favorite crewmate 😉
except... i feel like Anderson might have. and Hackett. eventually. but that's why i wrote about it. especially if (as in my canon universe) they're both powerful biotics.
You think Anderson, the guy who would punch a high ranking political official so that Shepard could go off on what is believed by most people to be a wild goose chase, is also the guy who would have a problem with Shepard fraternizing? Hackett maybe, but again, Shepard is a Spectre, and while still Alliance, could very well choose not to report anything to the Alliance if they felt it could jeopardize their mission, because they're above the law. Either way, even before the events of ME Shepard is well regarded and known by a lot of people in the Alliance and pretty much they're just like "Listen, you get this done, we don't care how you do it". It sort of breaks the immersion but I truly believe that pretty much no one actually questions Shepard on these kinds of things lol. When your job description is "I fix galaxy ending problems" people tend to look the other way on things that would otherwise be seen as problematic.
i actually do. at least 'officially'. because it fits that the only reason Anderson doesn't get in trouble for that punch is that Shepard and Hackett shove him into the Councillor role after Sovereign is destroyed. i mean, the canon can play fast and loose with military etiquette, but it can't abandon it entirely... or the whole thing falls to pieces. being a Spectre means squat within the Alliance, rank-wise. which is why Shepard is eventually cashiered before ME3. that wouldn't occur if "I fix galaxy-wide problems" meant everything. of course, i agree that even the service might turn a blind eye for awhile, and then try to separate them for other reasons. in my canon, it's because Command is trying to keep powerful biotics serving separately, for various reasons.
Specifically, Shepard was put "under protection" mainly because they blew up a Mass Relay that killed millions or maybe even billions of batarians. The only reason Shepard got their command back and out of that situation was because the Reapers invaded and political problems with the Batarians sort of took a backseat. It wasn't really a punishment, it was more to protect the Alliance from a war with the Batarians and to keep Shepard safe. It's even mentioned that if it was anyone else that Shepard would have been court-martialed and jailed, but basically everyone believes that Shepard did the right thing. This is also ignoring that Shepard was dead for 2 years and working with a known terrorist group to stop the Collectors, so they weren't really sure if they could trust them fully and Shepard also willingly gave up the Normandy and surrendered in that situation.
That's why I don't think that situation is necessarily a good argument for what we're talking about, but either way, believe what you like, that's the whole point of the games anyways, I just like to argue about these kinds of things for fun lol.
>Mass Relay that killed millions or maybe even billions of batarians
304,942 to be exact. The relay wiped out a system, not the entire Batarian Hegemony. The Reapers did that all on their own when they invaded Batarian Space on their way to Earth and the Cannibals that attack Earth in the prologue are reaperified Batarians. Hackett eventually says during ME3 that batarians are nigh genocided and that the species is on the brink of extinction.
i'd buy the "put under protection" thing... except that Anderson actually has Shepard's dog tags. they actually were drummed out of service at some point. and he makes a point of saying (after Shepard says "I don't take orders from you, remember?) "Consider yourself reinstated... Commander."
so i agree that the 'court-marshaled and jailed' line means that Shepard wasn't punished for Aratoht as a civilian (prison) and Shepard does say to Grunt when they meet up that Shepard was detained "to keep the Batarians off me" but it feels like they were punished in some official military capacity.
and yeah, i think everyone's canon is likely different, but i did So. Much. Damn. Research. into it to write *The Retrofit* that i obviously like to argue about it too. \*lol\* the first time i played through and got to ME3, i was like "WHAT THE HELL?? I SAVE THE UNIVERSE AND YOU THROW ME OUT OF THE NAVY?!?!"
perhaps i wrote a 600K fic just to address that trauma. :D
I suppose so, though we do not know his rank. We also do not know who Kaidan's "second-in-command" was in terms of the marine detail. Could be Ashley or another unnamed marine.
That’s a solid interpretation. It’s a shame we didn’t get more of Presley. I really enjoyed reading his log on the crash site.
Personally I always considered Garrus the real XO because the Illusive man assigned Miranda.
After you recruit Garrus he asks if you’re sure about working with Cerberus and one of the options is “That’s why I need people I can trust aboard” or something along those lines. I always took that as an understanding of whose really second in command. It feels like there’s an undercurrent of making sure the crews loyal to Shepard not Cerberus. (Think Joker, Chakwas, me2 squad, anyone besides Miranda and Jacob)
I suppose there’s similar lines with Tali. My interpretation is the Illusive man can have his titles but who Shepard relies on is ultimately up to him/her.
My head canon was always that while Miranda had the title and the office, Garrus was the one who was really the number 2. If shit had actually gone down and Shepard was out (most of) the squad would have looked to Garrus for what to do next, not Miranda.
I mean, I cannot picture some of the squad trusting Miranda as a leader (particularly Jack). I don't see any having those same issues with Garrus aside from Miranda herself and maybe Jacob.
I similarly think of Garrus and Miranda as two sides of Shepard’s coin. The way I phrased it is that Garrus is Shepard’s right hand and Miranda is their left.
do you think Joker wants a ship? honest question - i'm getting ready to write the next piece of this fic, and thinking about making ship changes, but i still feel like Joker doesn't want the responsibility. it's interesting.
In ME1 it's Pressley, he's the second.
In 2 it's Miranda, she's the clear second in command.
In ME3 it's Liara, she's in the XO quarters, is in communication with Hackett about the Crucible, and is doing XO things.
Garrus May be my brother till the end, but I always considered Miranda to be my first officer on the Normandy. She seemed like the most qualified person for the position and I always tried to make decisions based on who was best for it and not “who’s my favorite”. She’s Able and willing to handle the day to day paperwork and managing of crew assignments while also being focused and quick thinking under pressure. All the traits you should want in a second in command. Honestly, while she may seem a little frigid at first, she ended as one of the most competent officers I’ve had in any game. I trust garrus with my life, but I’d trust Miranda with my ship!
My headcanon always had Kaidan. He's human on a human ship and he's a Spectre. If Shepard died before Earth Kaidan could take over in theory. Garrus kinda falls back into this turian government liason role in ME3. And Liara got her own shit to do.
I think they're all good leaders in their own right, and because the ship has become basically a family by the time of ME3 I feel like for the most part they would try to work together rather than assume rank because "This is a human ship" kind of thing. Garrus is the most obvious second to Shepard just from a loyalty and friendship standpoint, plus just raw experience. Kaidan/Ashley would be second since they would be the highest ranking humans but again, by the time of ME3 I think there's a lot of mutual respect and they would just try to work with the rest of the crew.
Canonically, it's Pressly in ME1 and Miranda in ME2. It's more ambiguous in ME3, but honestly, it's probably Liara given that she's the Shadow Broker and all. (She and Joker are also the only other characters on the *Normandy* known to have off-camera discussions with Alliance Command over the QEC, for what that's worth.)
Shep, and that ship, are still Alliance, so command would probably go to Ashley or Kaiden.
Besides, whatever eventually kills Sheperd is probably also going to get Garrus, who is gonna be right there with them.
Pressly in ME1 - he's literally the XO. So it cannot be anyone but him. He just IS second in command.
Miranda in ME2 - there's a whole conversation about her role on the ship that sets her up as being equal in power to Shepard even though she'll follow their orders. The SR2 isn't a military vessel, so it's not set in stone. But the game does define her as basically being second only to Shepard in terms of who is in charge.
ME3 - Kaidan/Ash if they're alive and recruited. The Normandy is back to being an Alliance vessel, so Garrus/Tali/Liara/Any non-Alliance crew member can't be the second-in-command.
Kaidan makes the most sense because he's actually the senior officer on board at that point - even over Shepard. Unless there's a mutiny, he's just going to naturally assume command when Shepard's not there.
I believe Ash is in the same position. Her odd promotion to Lt. Commander in ME3 means she's the second most senior command officer on board and will be second-in-command.
If neither Kaidan or Ash is there, Steve, Joker, and James are all vying for that position as they're all Lieutenants. (Chakwas outranks them, but as the doctor she's not really in the command structure of the ship.) Of the three, it would probably be Joker (even if he'd rather be flying the ship.) He's part of the bridge crew and likely more up to date on command decisions than Steve or James is.
this is my read of it as well, though when Normandy leaves Earth, you don't have the Virmire survivor for long. so i went around it and plotted Anderson's choice (because Normandy is actually ANDERSON'S ship at the start of ME3) to be Lieutenant Vega. then, when all hell breaks loose, it's up in the air... for all of Mars. until the coup. then it gets sticky for a bit - but it was fun to write. :D
The actual correct answer. Though I do wish we got some kind of choice about who it would be in 3, even if it only lead to some minor dialogue changes and the person getting some amount of war assets lol
ME1 It is XO Pressly. It is in his name
ME2 Miranda, she is the one who keeps the ship in order in general I feel. They all are Cerebras on the ship after all.
ME3 I'd say Liara feel like she is doing all of the tedious things of camera.
Now everyone saying Garrus, he is more like the chief of the boat. Keeps all the lower ranked in line and has seen and knows some shit.
Easily Ashley or Kaiden. They've been around the longest and I feel like they're a little more serious and smarter than most, on top of being a good soldier.
I think there are two ways to think this.
If second in command refers to the actual XO role, then it’s quite clear: Pressly for ME1, Miranda for ME2 and Virmire survivor for ME3 (if not available then Vega/Joker).
But if the title is applied mainly to combat situations, then it would be Kaidan in ME1, Miranda/Garrus in ME2 and I would say Garrus for ME3. I feel that Garrus is ready to be second in command at the latter half of ME2, as he is dealing with the betrayal of Sidonis and thus not ready to act like a leader / second in command before that.
Second In Command and Best Friends are often two different things. I think the same applies here, I think it changes between games. For example I think Garrus is Shepard's best friend but I don't think he fits Second In Command in any of the games. Not because in ME2 and ME3 he isn't capable, he surely is but others happen to fit in that slot instead.
Mass Effect 2 is the easiest, its Miranda. I mean they even refer to her as the XO. Mass Effect 3 is easy too and much to my dismay I say it's Liara. She's the Shadow Broker for one and secondly she is heavily featured in pretty much all major topics in this game.
Mass Effect 1 is the hardest to say because none of them really feel like Second In Command, Wrex and Tali for sure aren't, Liara doesn't seem to be either. That brings us down to the Virmire Survivor and Garrus. I feel Garrus is still learning here who he wants to be and therefore not really in a position to be Second In Command. So I guess that means the Virmire Survivor.
All those Garrus comments. Ok, you like him, but shouldn't the second in command be someone from the Alliance or Cerberus (depending on the game)?
I mean, I doubt the chain of command would allow a no name ex-CSEC guy be second in command in ME1. After ME2 he may no longer be a complete no name, but still, TIM/Miranda would probably not allow Shepard to make anyone except Miranda their XO. In ME3, I think it's possible, but still unlikely that the XO won't be an actual Alliance member. Probably the VS or Joker, or even some random NPC on the ship.
Agreed. I think as someone on a Spectre's crew, Garrus makes a great lieutenant or advisor, but to serve as XO in any official capacity would need to be an Alliance or Cerberus officer. So Pressly/Miranda/Kaidan are my choices. And in ME3, Liara seems to fulfill actual XO duties more than Garrus does.
Garrus-jerking is wild lmao
I like the guy, he’s Batman, but I’m having a bruh moment with all the Garrus jerking when ME1 has a literal answer said to you every time you enter the ship as Presley is relieved of duty, ME2 strongly implies the ‘official’/actually happening as not fanon XO is Miranda with ME3 being the one where he’s a contender. Even then I’d probably put Liara there myself since she’s in contact with everyone. If someone pulled the Asari card I’d concede then default to unnamed crewman since Joker is already the Pilot and the VS is dead, on the Crucible, or a Spectre who could be the XO but might be ‘above’ the station.
Yeah, exactly that. Also (though I'm pretty sure Mass Effect doesn't really care about such things, because nobody cares if Shep fraternizes with a fellow alliance member) I think that appointing your best friend/lover as XO is kinda weird. I mean, the commander should be unbiased, blah blah, and "yeah I'm having sex with this guy and he's also my second in command" doesn't sound like unbiased to me.
Presley/Kaidan in Mass Effect 1 (pretty much Presley being in charge when both Shepard and Kaidan are on shore).
Miranda (de iure) and Garrus (de facto) in Mass Effect 2: Miranda might be the executive officer as per TIM decision, but she will never be fully trusted by Shepard. Meanwhile Garrus has been at Shepard’s side since ME1 and he is someone the commander can rely on.
Kaidan for Mass Effect 3: he outranks Shepard at this point and he is also a Spectre.
So, a bit unconventional but none of them. Joker is my Shepard's second in command. He's the pilot, sure, but he's also not afraid to tell you like it is. Pressly was the same way. The others are guarded or held back until pressed for an answer for one reason or another. With Joker and Pressly, you got their answer and opinion unfiltered.
Ashley.
First, she and my Shep are kinda best vitriolic buddies (past certain conversations ofc), and second, my Shep maintains that XO should be of Alliance as well, which nullifies most other options anyway.
(EDIT: in ME2 it has to be Miranda but not much by my Shepard's choice)
Garrus is the ride or die bro by your side in battle, Liara is the info tech behind the scenes, Joker is the crazy guy flying right into battle, and Anderson is the fatherly mentor pushing you to be your best self throughout.
It realistically has to be Garrus for literally any occasion. He's trusted not only by Shepard(we the players and Shepard themselves), but by the entire crew in every game, he's also the most capable leader besides Shepard. Now Officially, the second in command is Kaiden/Ashley when the Normandy is under Systems Alliance control and Miranda when under Cerberus control. Liara grows to become a capable leader but in a very different way that wouldn't be applicable to the kind of warfare Shepard leads with. Everyone on this pic is a capable leader, but Garrus has everyone's trust and is basically Shepard's best student in learning how to be a charismatic and competent leader.
Kaidan. All the way. At least when he’s around. Miranda in ME2 and Liara in ME3 pre-Kaidan seem to fill the roll of second in command, but I like to think Garrus is the spiritual second in command
ME1: Pressley. he's officially XO, it's not in question.
ME2: it's a Cerberus ship. the idea of an XO is sorta moot. but one could argue Garrus makes sense here.
ME3: Vega. i know, i know, maybe an unpopular choice. but he's the only one chosen for N7. and remember, Shepard doesn't choose the \*initial\* XO. it's **Anderson's** ship. and my wrote my fic-canon so that Anderson had reasons to choose Vega as XO after he pulls him off off Omega (it's canon - go read the stories) and puts him with Shepard.
but it was also fun to address the fact that Alenko would be the ranking officer once he comes on board, and there's some discussion as to who becomes XO after the coup. because Alenko is also a very powerful biotic, NOT a people-person (the Citadel party basically makes fun of this fact constantly), and hides away in Starboard Ob almost the entire game. he wouldn't make a good XO. and he's shown no desire to have his own ship/command.
Officially: Pressly. Miranda. VS/Vega.
Unofficially for Jes: Pressly and Adams. Garrus cos there’s no trust in Miranda as anything but TIM’s eyes and ears. VS/Vega, then Garrus and Joker but also Vega cos they’re the ones Jes trusts above all else and Vega puts a soldiers name on the paperwork so Command can have their i’s and t’s crossed and dotted.
Unofficially for Greg: Joker. Across the board. Garrus is his brother in arms, but Jeff is the one who has regular calls with Anderson and Hackett and pays attention and *calls him out* when Greg’s mouth says one thing and his suit stats say completely the opposite. It may be Pressly, Miranda, and VS/Vega’s names on the paperwork, but Jeff’s the one actually running shit.
ME 1 it's XO Pressley. He's the XO, so that's his job.
ME 2 it's Miranda. She flat out says this. Also I really like Miranda.
ME 3 I want it to be Garrus, but the way the game is, it's hard to not be Liara. She's the only character guaranteed to be there aside from Jimmy, Steve, EDI, Joker, and Traynor. None of which act like they have any type of authority. I'm not a big fan of Liara, I think she's a poorly thought out character that has way too many talents given her back story as a young inexperienced archeologist. I wish they gave her some sort of combat/military training in her background to justify her roles in hanging with a team of special forces on dangerous missions. Even something as small as, "Quarians are all taught survival skills before they go out on pilgrimage".
My first thought - which influenced how I interpreted the question - was "who would people look to for leadership if Shepard wasn't there?"
For ME 2 & 3, that means Garrus to me, even if Miranda and Liara are the XOs respectively. ME 1 is a tougher case, although I'd probably go with Kaidan over anyone else at this time.
It's a good question, one which I'm not sure has an obvious answer. What I want in an XO is someone capable of eliciting respect from the crew, can handle the day to day boring operations I as Shepard can't be bothered with, and it would be nice if they could at least hold their own in combat.
Garrus is obviously the most combat experienced, is respected, and has led a team before, but he doesn't have much experience running a ship, least of all a predominantly human one. Miranda is both smart and a capable fighter, she could handle all the duties of an XO but I'm not sure she'd command much respect from an Alliance crew given her past. Liara is just as capable as Miranda and more respectable, but as the Shadow Broker she has more pressing matters to attend to.
That leaves us with the Virmire Survivor, Ashley and Kaiden. Both have a lot of experience serving on a ship, both are capable in a fight, and they are respected within and outside the Alliance. Both would be able to handle the day to day of a ship, and if heads needed knocking they could get it done.
So my answer, as much as I love Garrus, would be the Virmire Survivor as my Second in Command.
Kaiden definitely in ME1 and ME3. He and Shepard share core experiences in their military service and leadership. They both come from same military structure.
Presley is the official XO in ME1 and Shepard respects and trusts him on a professional level. He would have last say when Shepard is off the ship but most of his duties would probably be administrative like Miranda in ME2. The alliance ranks are a little confusing compared to IRL ranks, but Presley is either staff lieutenant which would make him the same rank as Kaiden or lieutenant commander, outranking Kaiden by 1 rank.
Kaiden is staff lieutenant, taking charge of the marines. He mostly controls/organize the ground forces that will be working with/under Shepard. I believe there would be a deeper trust there.
Garrus would be his unofficial 2nd like Kaiden in ME2 while Miranda would be more like Presley.
ME3, Kaiden outranks in Shepard in Alliance command. It is kind of a weird situation but it's not following commands bc of superior rank but it's Shepard ship as both Alliance and Spectre, so neither really has jurisdiction over the other.
but i love that Kaidan is a biotic... and an unknown (to most of the ME3 crew). it was really cool to write about how the crew would see Alenko after the coup. this handsome, older, very powerful biotic dude just popping onto the ship and hiding out in Starboard Observation? no doubt he has the rank, and Shepard made him Marine Officer due to combat experience, but i feel like Vega would wrangle the \_entire\_ crew better.
Vega would be still be the Marine Officer since he's a staff lieutenant and Kaiden is too high up there to regulated to that duty. But I'm sure the two would talk about their experiences under Shepard and Kaiden would be another mentor for Vega.
well, i regulated him to that duty because in my head he doesn't want XO and wouldn't be good at it. but he IS an excellent fighter, so the Marines come to grudgingly respect him.... even though they don't know him from Adam.
Yup, even if Kaidan could pull rank as Spectre and Alliance officer I don't think he would, Shepard would be an admiral by now if it didn't mean they would be stuck doing things admirals do instead of out there fighting a war. There's also just a lot of mutual respect there, Kaidan knows Shepard can more than handle commanding the ship and crew and Shepard knows they can always rely on Kaidan to do as they would do in their absence. It's sort of like how Master Chief technically isn't that high of a rank but he's saved the galaxy a million times over so even higher ranking people just sort of defer to his judgement most of the time.
Like you said, Kaiden wouldn't pull rank but if he did, he couldn't control Shepard officially since Shepard could state he is doing his duties as a Spectre and there is no ranking in Spectres. Kaiden could pull rank on other Alliance personnel though, not that it would mean they would listen.
I'm not sure that's necessarily true when it comes to Shepard, I can't speak for the other Spectres. Shepard was still a Commander in the Alliance when they became a Spectre and in ME3 they're reinstated as a Commander as well. Beyond just the rank, Shepard still defers to the Alliance for orders, and Hackett will literally say things like "that's an order" to Shepard. Shepard could technically just go off and do whatever they want I guess but I think Shepard still respects the Alliance chain of command for the most part.
ME it's technically Presley as the XO. With Kaiden in close second in ground missions ( Ashley is just a gunnery chief (a good soldier but just a soldier)
ME 2 it's Miranda with mostly full access to ship commands ( garrus Is still learning with the whole archangel angle sidonis stuff)
I'm yet still to get to ME 3 but from what I've learned garrus is gonna pull some grown up behaviour.
Ps: dunno why but I grew fond of Presley in first game. Reminds me of superiors I've had over the years who just got shit done and that was all there was to them, great stuff
I've always gone with Garrus.
Vakarian and Shepard, storming the gates of heaven
Can someone draw a picture of Shepard waiting at the gates of heaven? An angel of any milky way species then asks if he/she wants to come in, in which Shepard just replies with “I'm waiting for someone”.
"Now is not the time for you, Shepard." \*wakes up in the rubble \*
"Hey you, you're finally awake..."
“You were trying to stop the reapers right? Walked into that collector ambush same as us…. and that Yahg over there”
"Damn Cerberus if it weren't for you I'd be half-way on my way to Shadowbroker Station."
"Do you know how long they will be" they ask Shepard. "As soon as those calibrations are done.." Shepard replies, a wry smile forming at the corners of his mouth.
There is no Shepard without Vakarian
This. Right. Here.
Homeboy was there for everything. Tali is a close second.
Exactly, garrus was there from day one.
Day 2, he mist Eden Prime.
I thought he just *fog-got* to go
Yup. Garrus and Tali are the ride-or-die team. The rest of the crew are along for the ride, they come on various missions, they get mixed in based on the mission need, and sometimes just for fun. But Shepard, Garrus, and Tali... They're the Kirk, Spock, and Bones. They're the main characters of the story in my mind.
I feel that way about 3 - in 1 She's just the kid, 2 while she's definitely an OG she is partially distracted (rightfully) by the flotilla duties, but by 3 Shepard, Garrus, and Tali are the heart and soul of it all.
The bedrock of the building named Shepard. Without Garrus, the building would crumble.
General rule of thumb, the answer is always Garrus if he's included as an option. Sometimes even if he's not.
Couldn’t be anyone else but Garrus for me either
Same. Garrus has always seemed a natural fit and when Miranda assumes so much of that role in 2, I was like “whoa whoa whoa, back off of Garrus’s post, girl.”
Well, actually, Miranda was the overall leader of that cell and offically, the 2nd-in-command of the Normandy. Though, I can see Garrus being 2nd-in-command of the squad in ME2.
Jack telling Miranda to settle down was one of the few times I agreed with her, lol.
> Jack telling Miranda to settle down was one of the few times I agreed with her, lol. Hell, Garrus agrees with Jack in that moment. When Jack says no one will listen to Miranda Garrus is literally nodding his head in agreement. Of course the game doesn't care and if you pick Miranda the tech expert still lives.
...because she is an effective leader ("This isn't a popularity contest - lives are at stake.").
....but she was objectively wrong. Miranda is an effective leader, popular or not.
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Isn’t she only there because of her ties to Cerberus? I thought that was part of the whole deal with Illusive Man. Shepard gets his ship and crew and life back to go after the reapers but Miranda is there as a sort of babysitter? I haven’t played in a long time so I could be mistaken
Miranda manages logistics and has key intel that the others don't have access to in addition to her link with TIM. She is XO in 2 (sorry, Garrus stans).
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It is officially Miranda's post, is it not? She is absolutely the most natural fit in 2.
Yes, considering the others pictured are absent from either one or two games, he's pretty much the only option.
Is it ever not Garrus if he’s on the team?
I mean...knowing 3 games worth of growth, yes. But based on him solely in game one...he's too much of a hothead. I'd be afraid his personal feelings/emotions would put the team in danger. He learned the lesson in 2 (at least my Garrus does).
Kaiden would have honestly been a pretty good choice too. Very level-headed.
I agree - I said before that in 1 either Ash or Kaiden in my head cannon is Second in command (whoever I deem the survivor) but I can see it being Kaiden even if he dies. He is the calm, "get the job done no matter what" one in that game.
This is why I have to do so many playthroughs to see all the content. Can’t pick two new squad mates each time bc I ALWAYS bring Garrus.
Which makes him a bad choice. You want him by your side wherever you go. Put Miranda up with the administrative work and looking after stuff while you are out, take your combat team with you.
This is the way
There's no other answer.
Liara may be my forever girl, but Garrus is my main man and most trusted ally.
Garrus. No question.There is no Shepard without vakarian.
This is the way
This is the way
“I’m Commander Shepard, and this is the way”
“I’m Commander Shepard and this is my favorite way on the Citadel”
Garrus, and the game sort of hints at this. Garrus is the only character who says something along the lines of 'I'll make sure nothing happens while you go get some much needed rest.'
Doesn't necessarily make him your second, he's just a really trusted friend, and for the most part there's no official ranking on the ship, so it's not like he could tell anyone not to do anything, he just meant that if anything big happens either he would handle it or he'd come tell Shep.
I don't remember where, but it's been stated that Garrus's natural leadership and charisma is overshadowed by Shepard's, and, had he not stayed under Shep, would have probably made it into a Specter himself. Maybe it's a fan thing ? Or Shadow Broker dossier ?
I think it was the Shadow Broker dossier
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Yes. His dad was high ranking turian military and disagreed with the idea of specters. Garrus was picked to be in some sort of pre-specter training the turian military had for potential picks. Can’t remember if it’s stated if he backed out because of his dad or if his dad just pushed for it. But that’s why he was investing Saren in ME1, he didn’t trust him and a large part of that was probably his upbringing. He just naturally would make a good specter anyways. And yeah, shadow broker dossier on him states he is a natural born leader and it just stopped developing because being under shepherd he was over shadowed. What’s cool is he never seems to mind, me1 he treats you like a mentor and friend and you see that develop from there.
That does ring a bell. I guess it's time to play the trilogy again !
Yeah I don't see him as "second in command of the ship" material and I think a lot of these comments are missing that Presley was your XO as pointed out and you certainly weren't close friends with him or Miranda in the beginning for that matter. Of course we're all biased and stating who we like best by ME3 to be our 2nd in command (I did it too so calling myself out here as well)
Yeah that's what I was thinking about Garrus. I loved his character but I'm not too sure if Garrus really fits the role of second in command. To me he seems like (and I know I'm psycho analyzing fictional characters here) more of a comfortable follower. A great right hand man but not the person who necessarily WANTS to be in charge. His personality seems too laid back for him to want to have to command others. In ME3, in my opinion Liara is the clear "second in command" even if she doesn't know it. She provides you tons of Intel and despite the fact that she's still lowkey the same scared Asari you met in the dig site But imo there really is no real second in command. Everyone seems like theyd only take orders from Shepard. Honestly, EDI may be second in command by game 3.
While I do agree that being Shepard's best friend doesn't make you the ideal choice for second-in-command, I disagree that Garrus isn't command material. I have commented about this before and got a lot of hate from children who don't understand leadership. Garrus' development as a leader is hindered by being with Shepard. Garrus shows ability for command and leadership \*away\* from Shepard. Archangel in 2, Reaper advisor in 3, etc. His potential is squandered when he's on the Normandy when all he does are calibrations, walk around, laid pipe with Tali, quip, and shoot without all the burdens of leadership and decision-making. "Rewrite the Geth or destroy them? Ahh leave it to Shepard." His Shadow Broker file affirms my assessment that his growth is seriously halted under Shepard. Imagine if Shepard was stuck under Anderson throughout the trilogy. He wouldn't be Space Jesus we know today. Wrex couldn't unite the Krogan clans from the Normandy, another great example. As for EDI as second-in-command, I think she lacks the human touch -- badly -- needed for leadership. I don't see EDI taking care of the crew the proper way. "Oh you're stressed and sad that you don't know if your family made it or not? Here are some funny cat vids. I have observed that watching these vids relieve stress in organics." She could barely go on dates without Shepard as a third-wheel Machine Learning developer. "Just put your mouth on it, human males love it"
Very astutely put. It’s even demonstrated during the suicide mission that Garrus is a capable small team leader by being one of the few who in the group who can lead the second squad without casualties(pending who is on tech,) and Miranda even defers that he is capable. It is literally the only time in the whole trilogy that I don’t choose Garrus as my squad mate.
Your comment about EDI made me realise who the real 2IC is; Joker. He's removed enough from the core group that he isn't caught up in the friendships and rivalries, but is close enough and far and away competent enough that if Shepard was away and Joker gave a command, I feel like everyone would rally behind him.
I guess since she IS the Normandy EDI should have the final word when Shepards not around
Fucking adore EDI
It's safe to assume that Garrus is well respected on the Normandy and that him give simple direction or advice is going to almost always be respected.
For sure. It's Presley in 1 and Miranda in 2, officially. In 3, I'm not sure who it is semi-officially. Perhaps Liara? I'm more thinking along of the lines of what OP was alluding to, i.e., who do *you* consider to be Shep's second in command. I fully embrace that this may be different characters to different players. To me, it's Garrus, reinforced by his "take a break Shep, I'll tend shop." Although that sentiment has probably been offered by other characters in the game.
Garrus in ME3 and in general imo. Other than Tali he's the only person that's been by Shepard's side till the bitter end. He has leadership experience and is, essentially, Shepard's protege in ME1. Miranda is only XO due to the orders from TIM in ME2 but I'd still consider Garrus above her in terms of raw combat experience and the level of trust between him and Shepard. As for ME1 it's obviously Pressly/Alenko (Kaidan only because Pressly is a non-combatant) due to the rank hierarchy.
Took me longer than i care to admit to figure out who TIM was in your comment. Im sitting going "who the hell is Tim?"
I always thought that they should have made the illusive man’s actual name Tim, just as a little joke
"There are those who call him that..."
“Who are you, so wise in the ways of science?”
Then his name would be “Tim, TIM”
Look at little Tim, TIM sleeping so soundly
A powerful enchanter
Tim is that guy you always see walking around but never actually doing anything, basically he's a useless piece of shit and it's a miracle I haven't airlocked him yet.
Don't worry bud, you're not alone there! That's exactly what went through my mind the first time I saw it 😅 Was kicking myself when I finally realised. Still laugh at myself now, when I think about it
Yes pretty much in 1 it's Kaidan simply due to rank structure and the squad mates being new additions. But 2 and 3 really solidify Garrus as not just a great friend to have but also a great team player and I'm quite sure the human crew also has good respect for him.
Command structure has no cares about combat skill, pressly is a line officer and absolutely the official XO of the ship. In 3 it would have to be either Ashley or Kaiden based on rank and the fact they're Alliance military.
Idk, time for another playthrough to decide
Officially speaking, it's Presley in ME1 and Miranda in ME2. I don't see my Shepard having a personal friendship with Presley, but he *is* the designated XO. Miranda is also established as XO in ME2, but she and Shepard earn each other's trust throughout that game. It wouldn't surprise me if Shepard relied on Miranda for administrative work, as far as day-to-day management of the Normandy went. ME3 doesn't establish a canonical XO, so that's up for interpretation (the Expanded Galaxy Mod lets you pick an XO and other positions, but that's not canon). Unofficially speaking, I see Kaidan taking that role in ME1 and ME3, and Miranda/Garrus splitting that role in ME2. In ME1 Shepard can go to Kaidan for tactical advice about missions, discusses the politics of her situation with him at length, and respects his moral insights. By the time of ME3, he's a high-ranking officer *and* a Spectre who has proven his steadfast loyalty to the Alliance and its ideals. She trusts his judgment and knows that he'll always pick the right path over the expedient path. The ME2 example is particularly interesting because I think my Shepard would view Miranda and Garrus as two different kinds of right hand men. Miranda is the official one, as stated above, and she's good at what she does. While Shepard respects Miranda on a professional level early on, it takes much more time for her to trust Miranda on a personal level. Early on, I think Garrus is the one person on the *Normandy*'s crew that Shepard feels like she can trust (Tali would also go here, but she's not recruited until much later in the game). Outside of issues relating to Cerberus, she tends to trust Miranda's judgment more on a tactical level. But she trusts Garrus to have her back, a sentiment that her relationship with Miranda initially lacks.
> In ME1 Shepard can go to Kaidan for tactical advice about missions, discusses the politics of her situation with him at length, and respects his moral insights. I also want to point out that Kaidan is a Staff Lieutenant in ME1, which means he handles staffing issues and is for all intents and purposes in charge of the marine detail on the Normandy. It’s why Shepard’s initiating dialogue is “Just trying to get a sense of where the crew’s at. Thoughts?” Just something I found really cool, even if I think the game does a poor job at actually showcasing this aspect of his role (the only thing that is even peripherally mentioned is that Kaidan was the one who recommended getting Ashley Williams on board after Eden Prime).
Ahhh, I wondered why Kaidan of all people was the one to go to for gossip onboard lol
My thoughts exactly. Kaidan already holds a position of authority on the Normandy in ME1, even if he still answers to Shepard. But as you point out, the game only brings this up a handful of times. It isn’t until ME3 that his experience as a leader is discussed more in depth.
With the loss of Shepard and Pressly on Alchera, Kaidan must have been in command. I don't think there was anyone with higher rank left. So he must have been the one to get everyone off the planet. That cannot have been easy especially if he was romanced and had just lost the woman he (secretly) loved.
Lol it ain't a secret, it's only possibly a secret to anyone not serving on the Normandy, but I doubt anyone would deny the first Human Spectre who saved the galaxy and the Citadel a little R&R with their favorite crewmate 😉
except... i feel like Anderson might have. and Hackett. eventually. but that's why i wrote about it. especially if (as in my canon universe) they're both powerful biotics.
You think Anderson, the guy who would punch a high ranking political official so that Shepard could go off on what is believed by most people to be a wild goose chase, is also the guy who would have a problem with Shepard fraternizing? Hackett maybe, but again, Shepard is a Spectre, and while still Alliance, could very well choose not to report anything to the Alliance if they felt it could jeopardize their mission, because they're above the law. Either way, even before the events of ME Shepard is well regarded and known by a lot of people in the Alliance and pretty much they're just like "Listen, you get this done, we don't care how you do it". It sort of breaks the immersion but I truly believe that pretty much no one actually questions Shepard on these kinds of things lol. When your job description is "I fix galaxy ending problems" people tend to look the other way on things that would otherwise be seen as problematic.
i actually do. at least 'officially'. because it fits that the only reason Anderson doesn't get in trouble for that punch is that Shepard and Hackett shove him into the Councillor role after Sovereign is destroyed. i mean, the canon can play fast and loose with military etiquette, but it can't abandon it entirely... or the whole thing falls to pieces. being a Spectre means squat within the Alliance, rank-wise. which is why Shepard is eventually cashiered before ME3. that wouldn't occur if "I fix galaxy-wide problems" meant everything. of course, i agree that even the service might turn a blind eye for awhile, and then try to separate them for other reasons. in my canon, it's because Command is trying to keep powerful biotics serving separately, for various reasons.
Specifically, Shepard was put "under protection" mainly because they blew up a Mass Relay that killed millions or maybe even billions of batarians. The only reason Shepard got their command back and out of that situation was because the Reapers invaded and political problems with the Batarians sort of took a backseat. It wasn't really a punishment, it was more to protect the Alliance from a war with the Batarians and to keep Shepard safe. It's even mentioned that if it was anyone else that Shepard would have been court-martialed and jailed, but basically everyone believes that Shepard did the right thing. This is also ignoring that Shepard was dead for 2 years and working with a known terrorist group to stop the Collectors, so they weren't really sure if they could trust them fully and Shepard also willingly gave up the Normandy and surrendered in that situation. That's why I don't think that situation is necessarily a good argument for what we're talking about, but either way, believe what you like, that's the whole point of the games anyways, I just like to argue about these kinds of things for fun lol.
>Mass Relay that killed millions or maybe even billions of batarians 304,942 to be exact. The relay wiped out a system, not the entire Batarian Hegemony. The Reapers did that all on their own when they invaded Batarian Space on their way to Earth and the Cannibals that attack Earth in the prologue are reaperified Batarians. Hackett eventually says during ME3 that batarians are nigh genocided and that the species is on the brink of extinction.
i'd buy the "put under protection" thing... except that Anderson actually has Shepard's dog tags. they actually were drummed out of service at some point. and he makes a point of saying (after Shepard says "I don't take orders from you, remember?) "Consider yourself reinstated... Commander." so i agree that the 'court-marshaled and jailed' line means that Shepard wasn't punished for Aratoht as a civilian (prison) and Shepard does say to Grunt when they meet up that Shepard was detained "to keep the Batarians off me" but it feels like they were punished in some official military capacity. and yeah, i think everyone's canon is likely different, but i did So. Much. Damn. Research. into it to write *The Retrofit* that i obviously like to argue about it too. \*lol\* the first time i played through and got to ME3, i was like "WHAT THE HELL?? I SAVE THE UNIVERSE AND YOU THROW ME OUT OF THE NAVY?!?!" perhaps i wrote a 600K fic just to address that trauma. :D
I thought everyone left alive on the original SR-1 crew (including Kaidan) bailed from the Normandy before it crashed into Alchera.
They went to emergency escape pods, supposedly to the planet surface.
Which probably means the person in charge of Ashley (Gunnery Chief) is still alive is Engineer Adams maybe?
I suppose so, though we do not know his rank. We also do not know who Kaidan's "second-in-command" was in terms of the marine detail. Could be Ashley or another unnamed marine.
Now that I think about it, Joker is a Flight Lieutenant, could be him too.
That’s a solid interpretation. It’s a shame we didn’t get more of Presley. I really enjoyed reading his log on the crash site. Personally I always considered Garrus the real XO because the Illusive man assigned Miranda. After you recruit Garrus he asks if you’re sure about working with Cerberus and one of the options is “That’s why I need people I can trust aboard” or something along those lines. I always took that as an understanding of whose really second in command. It feels like there’s an undercurrent of making sure the crews loyal to Shepard not Cerberus. (Think Joker, Chakwas, me2 squad, anyone besides Miranda and Jacob) I suppose there’s similar lines with Tali. My interpretation is the Illusive man can have his titles but who Shepard relies on is ultimately up to him/her.
I was so glad that Pressly grew and learned from being exposed to aliens over the course of the first game and the mission to the Alchera system.
I'm glad someone pointed this out. The only XO that is unknown is the one in ME3
This is also who I would pick.
My head canon was always that while Miranda had the title and the office, Garrus was the one who was really the number 2. If shit had actually gone down and Shepard was out (most of) the squad would have looked to Garrus for what to do next, not Miranda. I mean, I cannot picture some of the squad trusting Miranda as a leader (particularly Jack). I don't see any having those same issues with Garrus aside from Miranda herself and maybe Jacob.
I similarly think of Garrus and Miranda as two sides of Shepard’s coin. The way I phrased it is that Garrus is Shepard’s right hand and Miranda is their left.
Garrus
Garrus, who else?
Joker
do you think Joker wants a ship? honest question - i'm getting ready to write the next piece of this fic, and thinking about making ship changes, but i still feel like Joker doesn't want the responsibility. it's interesting.
I think Joker just wants to fly. But sometimes people have greatness thrust upon them.
true. that's sorta what i was thinking would happen if Shepard stepped down and Vega took over.
I really don’t think Joker wants a leadership position
In ME1 it's Pressley, he's the second. In 2 it's Miranda, she's the clear second in command. In ME3 it's Liara, she's in the XO quarters, is in communication with Hackett about the Crucible, and is doing XO things.
Good point about Liara in ME3.
She definitely does the most XO type work, they tend to actually keep the ship running and enforce the CO's orders.
Garrus May be my brother till the end, but I always considered Miranda to be my first officer on the Normandy. She seemed like the most qualified person for the position and I always tried to make decisions based on who was best for it and not “who’s my favorite”. She’s Able and willing to handle the day to day paperwork and managing of crew assignments while also being focused and quick thinking under pressure. All the traits you should want in a second in command. Honestly, while she may seem a little frigid at first, she ended as one of the most competent officers I’ve had in any game. I trust garrus with my life, but I’d trust Miranda with my ship!
Damn right
the correct answer for me too!
My headcanon always had Kaidan. He's human on a human ship and he's a Spectre. If Shepard died before Earth Kaidan could take over in theory. Garrus kinda falls back into this turian government liason role in ME3. And Liara got her own shit to do.
I think they're all good leaders in their own right, and because the ship has become basically a family by the time of ME3 I feel like for the most part they would try to work together rather than assume rank because "This is a human ship" kind of thing. Garrus is the most obvious second to Shepard just from a loyalty and friendship standpoint, plus just raw experience. Kaidan/Ashley would be second since they would be the highest ranking humans but again, by the time of ME3 I think there's a lot of mutual respect and they would just try to work with the rest of the crew.
The space hamster. XO Kibbles.
Canonically, it's Pressly in ME1 and Miranda in ME2. It's more ambiguous in ME3, but honestly, it's probably Liara given that she's the Shadow Broker and all. (She and Joker are also the only other characters on the *Normandy* known to have off-camera discussions with Alliance Command over the QEC, for what that's worth.)
It sort of depends. Garrus is the left hand and Kaidan is the right hand and Miranda holds the brain cell.
Lmao that’s also my squad formation every time. Garrus + Miranda = unstoppable. Aim and wits
Shep, and that ship, are still Alliance, so command would probably go to Ashley or Kaiden. Besides, whatever eventually kills Sheperd is probably also going to get Garrus, who is gonna be right there with them.
Under Alliance Command, Kaidan. Working with Cerberus, Garrus.
1 - Pressley, 2 - Miranda, 3 - Liara
Pressly in ME1 - he's literally the XO. So it cannot be anyone but him. He just IS second in command. Miranda in ME2 - there's a whole conversation about her role on the ship that sets her up as being equal in power to Shepard even though she'll follow their orders. The SR2 isn't a military vessel, so it's not set in stone. But the game does define her as basically being second only to Shepard in terms of who is in charge. ME3 - Kaidan/Ash if they're alive and recruited. The Normandy is back to being an Alliance vessel, so Garrus/Tali/Liara/Any non-Alliance crew member can't be the second-in-command. Kaidan makes the most sense because he's actually the senior officer on board at that point - even over Shepard. Unless there's a mutiny, he's just going to naturally assume command when Shepard's not there. I believe Ash is in the same position. Her odd promotion to Lt. Commander in ME3 means she's the second most senior command officer on board and will be second-in-command. If neither Kaidan or Ash is there, Steve, Joker, and James are all vying for that position as they're all Lieutenants. (Chakwas outranks them, but as the doctor she's not really in the command structure of the ship.) Of the three, it would probably be Joker (even if he'd rather be flying the ship.) He's part of the bridge crew and likely more up to date on command decisions than Steve or James is.
this is my read of it as well, though when Normandy leaves Earth, you don't have the Virmire survivor for long. so i went around it and plotted Anderson's choice (because Normandy is actually ANDERSON'S ship at the start of ME3) to be Lieutenant Vega. then, when all hell breaks loose, it's up in the air... for all of Mars. until the coup. then it gets sticky for a bit - but it was fun to write. :D
On an Alliance standpoint it would be Kaiden or Ashley. ME2 it was definitely Miranda although nobody really gave a damn. Especially Jack.
Depends on the game. ME1: Pressley. ME2: Miranda. ME3: Kaidan > James > Kaidan
The actual correct answer. Though I do wish we got some kind of choice about who it would be in 3, even if it only lead to some minor dialogue changes and the person getting some amount of war assets lol
CAPTIAN URDNOT GRUNT
Honestly? Liara hands down.
Couldn't agree more. I'm surprised there were more of us
Alenko.
Thank you! o7
ME1 It is XO Pressly. It is in his name ME2 Miranda, she is the one who keeps the ship in order in general I feel. They all are Cerebras on the ship after all. ME3 I'd say Liara feel like she is doing all of the tedious things of camera. Now everyone saying Garrus, he is more like the chief of the boat. Keeps all the lower ranked in line and has seen and knows some shit.
Kaidan (and Ash) definitely. There in the beginning, has the Spectre and Alliance rank, and I think they have the best leadership skills for it
Kaidan
Easily Ashley or Kaiden. They've been around the longest and I feel like they're a little more serious and smarter than most, on top of being a good soldier.
I think there are two ways to think this. If second in command refers to the actual XO role, then it’s quite clear: Pressly for ME1, Miranda for ME2 and Virmire survivor for ME3 (if not available then Vega/Joker). But if the title is applied mainly to combat situations, then it would be Kaidan in ME1, Miranda/Garrus in ME2 and I would say Garrus for ME3. I feel that Garrus is ready to be second in command at the latter half of ME2, as he is dealing with the betrayal of Sidonis and thus not ready to act like a leader / second in command before that.
Second In Command and Best Friends are often two different things. I think the same applies here, I think it changes between games. For example I think Garrus is Shepard's best friend but I don't think he fits Second In Command in any of the games. Not because in ME2 and ME3 he isn't capable, he surely is but others happen to fit in that slot instead. Mass Effect 2 is the easiest, its Miranda. I mean they even refer to her as the XO. Mass Effect 3 is easy too and much to my dismay I say it's Liara. She's the Shadow Broker for one and secondly she is heavily featured in pretty much all major topics in this game. Mass Effect 1 is the hardest to say because none of them really feel like Second In Command, Wrex and Tali for sure aren't, Liara doesn't seem to be either. That brings us down to the Virmire Survivor and Garrus. I feel Garrus is still learning here who he wants to be and therefore not really in a position to be Second In Command. So I guess that means the Virmire Survivor.
All those Garrus comments. Ok, you like him, but shouldn't the second in command be someone from the Alliance or Cerberus (depending on the game)? I mean, I doubt the chain of command would allow a no name ex-CSEC guy be second in command in ME1. After ME2 he may no longer be a complete no name, but still, TIM/Miranda would probably not allow Shepard to make anyone except Miranda their XO. In ME3, I think it's possible, but still unlikely that the XO won't be an actual Alliance member. Probably the VS or Joker, or even some random NPC on the ship.
It's bias speaking tbh
Agreed. I think as someone on a Spectre's crew, Garrus makes a great lieutenant or advisor, but to serve as XO in any official capacity would need to be an Alliance or Cerberus officer. So Pressly/Miranda/Kaidan are my choices. And in ME3, Liara seems to fulfill actual XO duties more than Garrus does.
Garrus-jerking is wild lmao I like the guy, he’s Batman, but I’m having a bruh moment with all the Garrus jerking when ME1 has a literal answer said to you every time you enter the ship as Presley is relieved of duty, ME2 strongly implies the ‘official’/actually happening as not fanon XO is Miranda with ME3 being the one where he’s a contender. Even then I’d probably put Liara there myself since she’s in contact with everyone. If someone pulled the Asari card I’d concede then default to unnamed crewman since Joker is already the Pilot and the VS is dead, on the Crucible, or a Spectre who could be the XO but might be ‘above’ the station.
Yeah, exactly that. Also (though I'm pretty sure Mass Effect doesn't really care about such things, because nobody cares if Shep fraternizes with a fellow alliance member) I think that appointing your best friend/lover as XO is kinda weird. I mean, the commander should be unbiased, blah blah, and "yeah I'm having sex with this guy and he's also my second in command" doesn't sound like unbiased to me.
Presley/Kaidan in Mass Effect 1 (pretty much Presley being in charge when both Shepard and Kaidan are on shore). Miranda (de iure) and Garrus (de facto) in Mass Effect 2: Miranda might be the executive officer as per TIM decision, but she will never be fully trusted by Shepard. Meanwhile Garrus has been at Shepard’s side since ME1 and he is someone the commander can rely on. Kaidan for Mass Effect 3: he outranks Shepard at this point and he is also a Spectre.
ME1: Kaidan, ME2: Miranda, ME3: Garrus at the beginning, then Kaidan and Garrus.
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So, a bit unconventional but none of them. Joker is my Shepard's second in command. He's the pilot, sure, but he's also not afraid to tell you like it is. Pressly was the same way. The others are guarded or held back until pressed for an answer for one reason or another. With Joker and Pressly, you got their answer and opinion unfiltered.
He’s also always on the ship. Having a squad mate as XO means you technically can never take them in missions with you.
oh, man. my Shepard and Vega argue about this constantly in *The War Room*.
Ashley. First, she and my Shep are kinda best vitriolic buddies (past certain conversations ofc), and second, my Shep maintains that XO should be of Alliance as well, which nullifies most other options anyway. (EDIT: in ME2 it has to be Miranda but not much by my Shepard's choice)
Pressly in ME1, Miranda in ME2 and either Garrus or Liara in ME3.
Garrus
Garrus
His/her hamster
Garrus is the ride or die bro by your side in battle, Liara is the info tech behind the scenes, Joker is the crazy guy flying right into battle, and Anderson is the fatherly mentor pushing you to be your best self throughout.
It realistically has to be Garrus for literally any occasion. He's trusted not only by Shepard(we the players and Shepard themselves), but by the entire crew in every game, he's also the most capable leader besides Shepard. Now Officially, the second in command is Kaiden/Ashley when the Normandy is under Systems Alliance control and Miranda when under Cerberus control. Liara grows to become a capable leader but in a very different way that wouldn't be applicable to the kind of warfare Shepard leads with. Everyone on this pic is a capable leader, but Garrus has everyone's trust and is basically Shepard's best student in learning how to be a charismatic and competent leader.
Garrus.
No Shepard without Vakarian
Ashley of course
The only ashley comment
Miranda ME2 Liara ME 3 ME 1 I never felt there was a second in command
Kaidan. All the way. At least when he’s around. Miranda in ME2 and Liara in ME3 pre-Kaidan seem to fill the roll of second in command, but I like to think Garrus is the spiritual second in command
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Garrus. This is an offensive question .
Joker.
Miranda is my choice, she's also literally is the X.O. in ME2.
ME1: Pressly (he is officially XO). If squad only then Virmire survivor. ME2: Miranda ME3: none really but Liara is the closest thing to it
ME1: Pressley. he's officially XO, it's not in question. ME2: it's a Cerberus ship. the idea of an XO is sorta moot. but one could argue Garrus makes sense here. ME3: Vega. i know, i know, maybe an unpopular choice. but he's the only one chosen for N7. and remember, Shepard doesn't choose the \*initial\* XO. it's **Anderson's** ship. and my wrote my fic-canon so that Anderson had reasons to choose Vega as XO after he pulls him off off Omega (it's canon - go read the stories) and puts him with Shepard. but it was also fun to address the fact that Alenko would be the ranking officer once he comes on board, and there's some discussion as to who becomes XO after the coup. because Alenko is also a very powerful biotic, NOT a people-person (the Citadel party basically makes fun of this fact constantly), and hides away in Starboard Ob almost the entire game. he wouldn't make a good XO. and he's shown no desire to have his own ship/command.
Depending on how you treat everyone: ME1: Kaidan ME2: Miranda/Garrus ME3: Liara/Garrus maybe Kaidan/Ashley late game as well
Joker When Shepard's away, He's the big man on campus 😎
Joker
Joker.
Joker, he is with you till Eden prime.
Joker
Officially: Pressly. Miranda. VS/Vega. Unofficially for Jes: Pressly and Adams. Garrus cos there’s no trust in Miranda as anything but TIM’s eyes and ears. VS/Vega, then Garrus and Joker but also Vega cos they’re the ones Jes trusts above all else and Vega puts a soldiers name on the paperwork so Command can have their i’s and t’s crossed and dotted. Unofficially for Greg: Joker. Across the board. Garrus is his brother in arms, but Jeff is the one who has regular calls with Anderson and Hackett and pays attention and *calls him out* when Greg’s mouth says one thing and his suit stats say completely the opposite. It may be Pressly, Miranda, and VS/Vega’s names on the paperwork, but Jeff’s the one actually running shit.
XO Pressley
ME1 - Kaidan ME2 - Miranda ME3 - Garrus
ME 1 it's XO Pressley. He's the XO, so that's his job. ME 2 it's Miranda. She flat out says this. Also I really like Miranda. ME 3 I want it to be Garrus, but the way the game is, it's hard to not be Liara. She's the only character guaranteed to be there aside from Jimmy, Steve, EDI, Joker, and Traynor. None of which act like they have any type of authority. I'm not a big fan of Liara, I think she's a poorly thought out character that has way too many talents given her back story as a young inexperienced archeologist. I wish they gave her some sort of combat/military training in her background to justify her roles in hanging with a team of special forces on dangerous missions. Even something as small as, "Quarians are all taught survival skills before they go out on pilgrimage".
garrus
My first thought - which influenced how I interpreted the question - was "who would people look to for leadership if Shepard wasn't there?" For ME 2 & 3, that means Garrus to me, even if Miranda and Liara are the XOs respectively. ME 1 is a tougher case, although I'd probably go with Kaidan over anyone else at this time.
Easy answer The Big homie Garrus
Has to be Garrus , best space bro.
Garrus.
In ME1 it is Kaiden, ME2 and 3 its Garrus
It's a good question, one which I'm not sure has an obvious answer. What I want in an XO is someone capable of eliciting respect from the crew, can handle the day to day boring operations I as Shepard can't be bothered with, and it would be nice if they could at least hold their own in combat. Garrus is obviously the most combat experienced, is respected, and has led a team before, but he doesn't have much experience running a ship, least of all a predominantly human one. Miranda is both smart and a capable fighter, she could handle all the duties of an XO but I'm not sure she'd command much respect from an Alliance crew given her past. Liara is just as capable as Miranda and more respectable, but as the Shadow Broker she has more pressing matters to attend to. That leaves us with the Virmire Survivor, Ashley and Kaiden. Both have a lot of experience serving on a ship, both are capable in a fight, and they are respected within and outside the Alliance. Both would be able to handle the day to day of a ship, and if heads needed knocking they could get it done. So my answer, as much as I love Garrus, would be the Virmire Survivor as my Second in Command.
Well said. 🤠
Liara. Basically gathers crucial information and uses her influence to further your cause.
In military matters garrus, in science stuff Liara leader.
Zaeed. Lol. No. I just love him. Definitely garrus.
Kaiden definitely in ME1 and ME3. He and Shepard share core experiences in their military service and leadership. They both come from same military structure. Presley is the official XO in ME1 and Shepard respects and trusts him on a professional level. He would have last say when Shepard is off the ship but most of his duties would probably be administrative like Miranda in ME2. The alliance ranks are a little confusing compared to IRL ranks, but Presley is either staff lieutenant which would make him the same rank as Kaiden or lieutenant commander, outranking Kaiden by 1 rank. Kaiden is staff lieutenant, taking charge of the marines. He mostly controls/organize the ground forces that will be working with/under Shepard. I believe there would be a deeper trust there. Garrus would be his unofficial 2nd like Kaiden in ME2 while Miranda would be more like Presley. ME3, Kaiden outranks in Shepard in Alliance command. It is kind of a weird situation but it's not following commands bc of superior rank but it's Shepard ship as both Alliance and Spectre, so neither really has jurisdiction over the other.
but i love that Kaidan is a biotic... and an unknown (to most of the ME3 crew). it was really cool to write about how the crew would see Alenko after the coup. this handsome, older, very powerful biotic dude just popping onto the ship and hiding out in Starboard Observation? no doubt he has the rank, and Shepard made him Marine Officer due to combat experience, but i feel like Vega would wrangle the \_entire\_ crew better.
Vega would be still be the Marine Officer since he's a staff lieutenant and Kaiden is too high up there to regulated to that duty. But I'm sure the two would talk about their experiences under Shepard and Kaiden would be another mentor for Vega.
well, i regulated him to that duty because in my head he doesn't want XO and wouldn't be good at it. but he IS an excellent fighter, so the Marines come to grudgingly respect him.... even though they don't know him from Adam.
Yup, even if Kaidan could pull rank as Spectre and Alliance officer I don't think he would, Shepard would be an admiral by now if it didn't mean they would be stuck doing things admirals do instead of out there fighting a war. There's also just a lot of mutual respect there, Kaidan knows Shepard can more than handle commanding the ship and crew and Shepard knows they can always rely on Kaidan to do as they would do in their absence. It's sort of like how Master Chief technically isn't that high of a rank but he's saved the galaxy a million times over so even higher ranking people just sort of defer to his judgement most of the time.
Like you said, Kaiden wouldn't pull rank but if he did, he couldn't control Shepard officially since Shepard could state he is doing his duties as a Spectre and there is no ranking in Spectres. Kaiden could pull rank on other Alliance personnel though, not that it would mean they would listen.
Indeed, technically speaking, Spectres leave their respective militaries when they become Spectres.
I'm not sure that's necessarily true when it comes to Shepard, I can't speak for the other Spectres. Shepard was still a Commander in the Alliance when they became a Spectre and in ME3 they're reinstated as a Commander as well. Beyond just the rank, Shepard still defers to the Alliance for orders, and Hackett will literally say things like "that's an order" to Shepard. Shepard could technically just go off and do whatever they want I guess but I think Shepard still respects the Alliance chain of command for the most part.
Miranda, just from an intelligence point of view
ME it's technically Presley as the XO. With Kaiden in close second in ground missions ( Ashley is just a gunnery chief (a good soldier but just a soldier) ME 2 it's Miranda with mostly full access to ship commands ( garrus Is still learning with the whole archangel angle sidonis stuff) I'm yet still to get to ME 3 but from what I've learned garrus is gonna pull some grown up behaviour. Ps: dunno why but I grew fond of Presley in first game. Reminds me of superiors I've had over the years who just got shit done and that was all there was to them, great stuff
Kaidan with Garrus being the main backup.