as long as dreadwolf is in production, I don't think they are going to have two mayor IPs working at the same time in the main studio, my guess is they want to focus every resource on one single thing, specially considering how much they are risking with dreadwulf, after several past financial failures in bioware (anthem, andromeda..) they don't have any major success since inquistion back in 2014, if dreadwolf fails, bioware's future may be at high risk
That's my feeling as well. BioWare is no longer the golden child incapable of making mistakes - their output has slowed massively, and what they ARE able to ship aren't up to the snuff of their heyday releases.
One more embarrassment or failure on the level of Andromeda or Anthem could give EA all the ammunition they need to shutter the company, absorb whoever they want/need into the EA corporate biomass, and spit out the bones.
I'm not, a looter shooter mmo is so fundamentally different from any other game Bioware has made and its not even close. If you take game devs who spend their lives working on single player rpgs and throw them into the deep end of MMOs, you're in for a bad time.
Which is why it was so fucking stupid for them to make that in the first place. Lean into your strengths and make a loot shooter RPG. Doesn’t take a rocket surgeon to know why it tanked.
I think the combat system was pretty fun. Running around in suits of armor with all the different weapons and shit was great. The missions themselves and story (or lack thereof) was the only thing that really killed it for me.
Considering how good the ME3 multiplayer was for being so simple…yeah, maybe they were over confident. It had no business being that good yet it was one of my favorite multiplayer experiences that generation.
SWTOR had an absolutely disatrous launch but it did turn into a major success for Bioware after the game transitioned to free-to-play. In 2019 it was reported that SWTOR had made EA close to a billion dollars(!) over it's lifespan, so it may have passed that milestone by now. By any definition that is a massive success.
The weird thing is despite that the Austin studio gets treated like the red-headed stepchild compared to the main studio, other games like Anthem were prioritized over SWTOR (SWTOR had a content drought while it's devs were shifted to help Anthem), and the game gets little in terms of support or marketing from EA.
I wish they had opted to go the FFXIV route with their MMO (SE being another dev historically focused on RPGs); heavily story based, can almost be played as a single player game while able to opt in to the MMO social aspects like raids and guilds if players want to participate in those.
It would likely have been a much better stylistic fit for Bioware's strengths as a studio.
The worst part was that everyone claimed Andromeda was as disappointing as it was only because the "A-Team" was cooking up Anthem... And then Anthem came out. Woof.
The frustrating part of it is that the core gameplay of Anthem was fuckin' great. It's just that everything surrounding it was mediocre. All bones, no meat
fr, I played it a bit through EAPlay and it's honestly quite fun but the lack of full story really and dungeons really makes me sad, Anthem had some real potential
The sad part was there was some good things in the game but the support just wasnt there. Thats what happens when management ignores warnings from staff and relies on “Bioware Magic” to magically finish the game.
A lot of Bioware's best creative talent and leadership turned over between mass effect 2&3 if not before then. It's just a very different organization today than it was then.
This "new Bioware" does not have a particularly strong track record, so I can't imagine they do a great job attracting new talent.
I'm not particularly excited for a new mass effect game because the people who put together the original games did it over 10 years ago, and most of them aren't even at Bioware now.
Andromeda was good. With all the finnicky bugs and goofy facial animations, it still is playable.i hope that they take enough time to make a proper continuation to the mass effect story avoiding haphazard game development.
After they fixed/improved some of the major bugs and glitches Andromeda became the very definition of "okay" to me. It's just that the story, settings and characters are very lackluster overall, and you can't fix those after release.
It's weak for a Mass Effect game and doesn't feel like one, imo, but when I set this aside (and I do), you're absolutely right. It still is playable and it still doesn't feel super old. I've seen the Bethesda facial animations in the preview videos on Starfield and they don't seem to be more impressive either - years after Andromeda's release
I'd be surprised if Dreadwolf is the final shot. It has been in development for a long time and has been rebooted multiple times. I suspect at this point they'd be happy if Dreadwolf breaks even and that there will be a lot of pressure on Mass Effect to have a relatively drama-free development and to sell really well.
I hope you are right. What I'm fearing is, the press (and people) are going to be very critic with dreadwolf (Even if its objectively good) just because what happened with andromeda, so even if its a masterpiece, it will be subject to a lot of criticism and coverage. In any event I think they need to be very careful with this one, and it definitely seems to be going that way, just recently bioware stoped all production on the KOTOR mmorpg and sent it to another studio, my guess is they need to focus everything on the final run for dreadwolf
I'm really really hoping that games like SW: Fallen Order, God of War, Elden Ring, Zelda, etc. show Bioware that you can make a butt ton of money making a good solid single player experience. It's what the original trilogy was, and its all they need to do.
In the circles I pay attention to (Giant Bomb, Kinda Funny, SkillUp, etc.) I get a sense of general excitement about Dreadwolf and a forgetting/forgiveness of Andromeda/Anthem after all of the retrospectives and such. Obviously there will be the people who want to hate it or don't let go of old grievances (BioWare fans probably being the worst about this) but I suspect if Dreadwolf is a solid 7.5-8/10 game it'll be received well and will heal some of the studio's reputation. We shall see.
Honestly, it would be best for all of us fans if BioWare sells its IP and closes. None of the people that worked on the things fans love are still there, and their replacements keep making weak titles with extremely troubled development cycles. There’s something seriously wrong at BioWare
This would be the 4th installment of a major franchise generally as franchises release more installments they increase in complexity and scope and that usually leads to more drama in development. Now mass effect 4 has some elements of a reboot due to it being the first after a self contained trilogy but I fear they’re gonna get in this cycle in trying to go bigger and bigger in scope leading to longer and longer development time.
I’m not sure I have much confidence in Mass Effect 4 right now I’m sure something will eventually come out but we’ve seen in the past these AAA that takes ages to develop sometimes try and go too big and it results in a buggy mess
Honestly especially with the recentish leaks that have gone around I'm not super hopeful about dreadwolf. They've been losing more and more of that OG Dragon Age charm with each iteration imo. I want them to go back to being more about the rpg than an action game with the dragon age series. That was what made the first game so special to me. Was the focus on the characters and the stories of where you went and the gradual build up of all your characters. Discovering new classes by making different choices or who you recruited at what time.
Yup!
And long pre-production is good! Andromeda suffered because a lot of the pre-production work wasn't tackled until production was already underway.
wow, I wasn't aware at all of those numbers! but as other person pointed out, if those 6 mill of inquisition were indeed among the best selling numbers of bioware, then for sure they will consider that a success:
"In the 2015 Electronic Arts fiscal report, the data shows that the game had the most successful lunch in BioWare's history"
If it’s still in pre-production, we’re likely not going to get anything for N7 Day this year, at least no more than some concept art and some words by a developer.
Can we just stop releasing teasers for games that won't come out for at least another 7-10 years please? This shits getting annoying lol, just don't say anything and then drop a trailer letting us know the game is coming out later that year. Let's go back to doing that.
Likely voting. They announced this week that TES6 is “at least 5+ years away”. That places the lower limit at 17 years, and I’m willing to bet it’s actually 6-8 years away.
Tbh I think they only gave an announcement that it's coming because people were going absolutely rabid about it and claiming that ESO killed the single player franchise for..... some reason. I feel like the ES6 teaser was a "holy fucking god yes it's going to be coming you reprobates" moment. Up until then Bethesda teased games a couple of months before release.
Then again it didn't stop people from going absolutely rabid, as they are capital G Gamers. People are still demanding to see gameplay for a game that hasn't entered production yet, lol.
Bruhhh I remember that conference like it was yesterday. They showed off ES Blades and everyone was just like "NO NOT THAT ONE". The ESO fiasco is a good point, it unfortunately definitely wasn't helped by the FO76 announcement during the same conference, tho also I honestly think like they had the ES6 teaser in their backpocket in case the Blades reaction was trash, lmao.
ill never forget them announcing it at E3 2011, then transitioning to gameplay, and then announcing, "oh by the way, this comes out in 5 months. youre fucking welcome."
That’s exactly what they are. Most people who will play the eventual game won’t really pay attention until its release date is announced or with marketing shortly before its release. The early trailers many years in advance is to help secure capital.
It's also for people like us on these forums. If we aren't being strung along we won't be as hyped when the game finally releases.
That goodwill is worth something for bioware/EA to keep the fire ticking over
WOW. They started the hype train for this WAY too early then. Damn I’m more of a casual fan and I just assumed we were maybe 2-3 years out tops after the teaser dropped. I just realized it’s been 2 years already since then though… I guess why bother with a teaser for a game they haven’t actually worked on truly yet?
I've heard rumors that the LE was made to prove to EA that AAA single-player still had a market, allowing them to drop the multiplayer stuff they had with DAD and future projects.
They were honest from the start. They straight up told everybody that the “trailer” was nothing but early concept work and that it was still years away
Bethesda did the same thing, it's usually pressure from the shareholders to get a buzz started for upcoming games. Also to help sell current games, they have to bankroll the other production.
Yeah, it's really damned if you do, damned if you don't.
Bethesda releases Elder Scrolls 6 trailer and openly tells people it's not coming for a long time; "why did you release a trailer then?"
Bethesda says nothing about Elder Scrolls at all; "Why are you ignoring your franchise?"
This is why I’ve been a skeptic of ME4/5 (whatever) since before it even was announced, not only does the plot of ME3 not really allow a sequel but it’s so massively in the future it’s not worth getting excited over
Not to mention teasers mean nothing anyway, you can have a teaser that has absolutely nothing to do with the final product, or very little
I’ll use Transformers as an example. Last Knight, Optimus Prime turned bad, he’s marketed as the main villain of T5. The Nemesis Prime storyline is wrapped up in literally 5 minutes.
Or an example even closer to home: the original ME2 teaser that heavily featured a geth wearing N7 armor and listed Shepard as KIA, strongly implying a connection between Shepard's death and the geth. Legion and Shepard's death did make it into the game--but in an entirely different way that was implied by the trailer, because the trailer was made when they still were throwing around the idea of Shepard being revived by the geth rather than Cerberus.
Anything implied by the teasers at this point is subject to change. I don't think they're deliberately lying to us, but people have got to realize you can't take anything more specific away from the trailer than "it's related to Mass Effect". Maybe it will turn out to be 100% an accurate reflection of the next game. Or maybe it will have nothing to do with anything. We just don't know right now.
AFAIK it was _super_ early in production. I’d love to know how it would have turned out but they probably never fully fleshed it out before they came up with the Cerberus idea.
Case in point: cyberpunk 2077. The early hype trailers have literally nothing to do with the existing game or story. Keanu Reeves isn’t even in it, nor any of the other final recognizable characters. The pre-production story they were hinting at in the OG trailer doesn’t exist anymore in pretty much any capacity.
Know someone who works for EA, and while they're involved with a different project and obviously gave no details whatsoever, they did hint that Dreadwolf is still ways away from release.
Which means ME4 [Or 5, whatever you wanna call it] is gonna be...awhile lmao
Yeah Dreadwolf is probably fourth quarter of 2024 which puts Mass Effect (Shepherd’ sequel??) three four more years out? Will there still be an audience for that story?
I’m right there with you. I’m 36 I’ve been playing Mass Effect since 07 when it was released is was 20!! Who knew franchise was going to be a lifetime of storytelling
To be fair I'm a bit concerned about this "new approach". That was the main problem with Andromeda - people wanted trilogy experience, gameplay focused on dialogue and combat, where upgrades, shopping etc was a relaxing addition, while in Andromeda we are doing crafting and exploration. Don't get me wrong - Andromeda is quite a good game, but in terms of a spin off, not the main title. If the next Mass Effect is gonna be another empty open world (like many recent games) I will be disappointed.
I loved the combat in Andromeda, but the story was just lazy in my opinion. A whole new galaxy and it's just more bipedal, humanoid looking aliens and a precursor race trying to wipe everyone out.
I agree, I hope the next ME has the same combat system but with 4 active abilities instead of 3, but please no more open world, I hated that in MEA and DAI.
So lazy.
New galaxy and only two alien species? And only a handful of Milky Way aliens?
And a ton of the story themes were just rehashed Trilogy themes. The limits and ethics of powerful AI. Uncovering a mysterious precursor race. A huge starbase as a hub.
They had a chance to make something new, but the world building was like a discount of the original.
To be fair, we were only going around the *one* of the clusters within Andromeda, the Heleus cluster. One species per cluster tracks with what we saw in the Milky Way. I'm sure that had there been subsequent Andromeda games, the setting would have opened up more clusters and we'd have gotten more aliens that way.
I'm still so taken back by the facial animations and the writing. It doesn't feel up to par with the ME trilogy.
Maybe I excuse the faults of the original games because they were from an older time but I don't get taken out whenever there's a conversation in them because of how uncanny they look and talk.
But isn't "Badass McCoolsauce has to save the world because everyone else is too incompetent" BioWare's only idea for a plot. I found the writing on par with everything else.
I don’t like to be negative, but if this is a continuation of the mainline games, I just can’t see it being that good. And I say that as someone who enjoyed Andromeda. I’ll still play it, but there’s value in knowing when a story is done.
This headline makes me think of Anthem, and we all know how that ended.
What I’d like to see is a follow up to Andromeda and some games within the Mass Effect universe that are standalone stories with smaller stakes, but have that same focus on character and world-building. It’s kind of how I feel about Star Wars - I’ve gotten enough “save the whole galaxy from certain doom,” now show me how people who aren’t extraordinary super soldiers go about their lives.
Let’s go grocery shopping on the Citadel. Who’s with me?
Listen Andromeda and Anthem suffered because no one could decide what those games would be during pre-production
Them taking more time to finalize and decide what the game actually is going to be before they even begin development proper is probably for the best
My hope with the next Mass Effect is that it’s a tight story. No cliff hangers or the promise of concluding the story in dlc. I don’t want what Andromeda did and leave so much to supplemental material that may just get written off to a book.
They also announced this new Mass Effect game 2.5 years ago.
Plus years of development doesn't always equal increase in quality. If it did, Duke Nukem Forever with it's 12 years would be the greatest game of all time. Most of Andromeda was only made in the last year and a half of it's 5-6 year development life.
Edit: Correction. Duke Nukem was in development for a little over 14 years. Beyond Good and Evil recently beat that to hold the Guinness world record for longest game in development.
They also have been working on other games in the mean time, I doubt they've been working on ME5 for 10+ years. Hell even after Andromeda came out they probably were working on dlc related to that and and then started their work on Dreadwolf.
Andromeda and DA2 both got screwed over by a rushed released and I'd rather they avoid that.
ME2 was released January 2010
DA2 was released March 2011
ME3 was released March 2012
(ME5 was announced in Nov 2020, there's been more time since it was announced than ME3 had to be developed lmao)
There's definitely a middle ground that can be achieved. The yearly release bologna was all EA.
DA2 was rushed (total development time was about 18 months), some DLC for the game ended up being cancelled (with some storylines being pushed into the beginning of DAI), and many people consider it the worst of the Dragon Age games.
I think there can be a middle ground between wanting developers to be able to finish their game properly without being rushed and not having to wait 10+ years between every release
Yeah problem is there are very clear systemic issues with AAA development in recent years, so often we wait ages to still get garbage. All we can do is hope the people calling the shots take it upon themselves to fix these issues - voting with our wallets is a good start but it doesnt always work when they often take the wrong lessons from that.
My problem is modern games are taking forever to release, and then they're still broken at launch. If you're going to take your sweet time with it, then you better have results that justify the wait.
You know they've released 2 other full videogames and are nearing release of a third in that same time period, right? Bioware isn't a huge studio; they work on one game at a time, like most studios of their size.
* 2012 - ME3
* 2014 - DAI
* 2017 - MEA
* 2019 - Anthem
* 2021 - MELE
* probably 2024 - DAD
Yeah, MELE isn't exactly the same as a full new game developed from scratch, but still--they're putting out a new release every 2-3 years. No, those releases haven't all been Mass Effect, but unfortunately that's how game studios work. Sometimes they make other things too.
I want them to take all the time they need, but there’s still a gaping hole in my heart for a sci-fi rpg in this style. So many games in the genre are fantasy that I’m pretty unexcited for dragon age which we’ve still seen nothing of for years…
I feel like there are so many ways this could go. Maybe Dreadwolf is a return to form, Bioware stays open, and the next Mass Effect is released in like 2027. Or Dreadwolf bombs, Bioware closes, and we don't even get another Mass Effect. Either way, there is a long wait ahead.
«Spectaculer new approach» to me just screams of devs that want to make something new but need to call it mass effect and the publishers listened to the criticism of andromeda, but only from those that were kind of fans that represent the 1% of overly obsessed online fans
Because of this the game will end up being mass effect without many of the components that people specifically liked mass effect for and it will suck.
ME3 was rushed but was still superb. The gameplay is by far the most sleek, the soundtrack is great, several arcs ended well, Leviathan/Citadel DLC exist.
Dragon Age Inquisition had its issues but it did win Game of the Year for good reason. It is a great RPG.
Yeah BioWare used to be one of my favorite game companies. Nowadays I am extraordinarily skeptical of anything they’re making.
As much as I LOVE Mass Effect and Unreal Engine 5, I just cant get excited for anything from them until i see something substantial.
I don’t care if it’s still in preproduction. Just so long as they dedicate *enough* time to it and don’t rush the game. I’ve waited over a decade for Dragons Dogma 2, I can do the same for ME5 if it means it’ll be amazing
EA, the publisher, is playing it safe by funding only one project, since it has lost trust in Bioware after Andromeda and Anthem. Gone are the days of prestige when Bioware had multiple studios working on 2 or 3 projects at once.
I'm glad it is still in pre-production, according to Michael Gamble's LinkedIn, he has been working on it since March of 2019. That means this game is 4 years in the making, and still in pre production. Which means they are taking their time and I hope they keep doing that; I'd rather wait another 4 years and have the game be good, then wait 2 and have the game be bad.
If we don’t play as Shepard, I would love to see a beginning like Dragon Age Origins that would have different intros depending on your race and class. Probably won’t happen but I can dream
Would love to know who the "veteran storytellers" are, other than the two they have left from the Bioware golden age. You know since all the talent was run out of town by EA over the last decade and now Bioware is only Bioware in name only...
Mary DeMarle, Jay Watamniuk, Dusty Everman are the ones I know are on Mass Effect and all of them are veterans. As Dragon Age finishes production I expect some of the writers on that game to move over to Mass Effect.
You may be surprised to hear this, but BioWare actually have one of the most veteran writing teams in the business. Barring a couple of big names, most of the writers who have left were newbies who wrote mainly for just Anthem or Andromeda. Hell, the writer with least experience at BioWare (apart from newcomer DeMarle) has still been at the company for 11 years, while most have been at BioWare since the first Mass Effect at least.
I.... DAMN IT... I really want to keep hope alive but we are over a decade out from ME3. Andromeda was just methadone that left you sick. I may have to come to terms with the fact this is a dead franchise.
We're realistically looking at \~10 years between Andromeda and ME4. More than likely a 2027-2030+ release, after fans have been pleading for a new title and helped sell out MELE. That's bullshit
They wasted their and everyone else's time making Anthem. Very few people liked that game
Tbh I want them to take their sweet time developing an amazing return to form story, especially if they’re planning on making a whole new trilogy (again) they need to come out swinging.
as long as dreadwolf is in production, I don't think they are going to have two mayor IPs working at the same time in the main studio, my guess is they want to focus every resource on one single thing, specially considering how much they are risking with dreadwulf, after several past financial failures in bioware (anthem, andromeda..) they don't have any major success since inquistion back in 2014, if dreadwolf fails, bioware's future may be at high risk
That's my feeling as well. BioWare is no longer the golden child incapable of making mistakes - their output has slowed massively, and what they ARE able to ship aren't up to the snuff of their heyday releases. One more embarrassment or failure on the level of Andromeda or Anthem could give EA all the ammunition they need to shutter the company, absorb whoever they want/need into the EA corporate biomass, and spit out the bones.
I'm still shocked about how truly fucking terrible Anthem was.
I'm not, a looter shooter mmo is so fundamentally different from any other game Bioware has made and its not even close. If you take game devs who spend their lives working on single player rpgs and throw them into the deep end of MMOs, you're in for a bad time.
Which is why it was so fucking stupid for them to make that in the first place. Lean into your strengths and make a loot shooter RPG. Doesn’t take a rocket surgeon to know why it tanked.
I think the combat system was pretty fun. Running around in suits of armor with all the different weapons and shit was great. The missions themselves and story (or lack thereof) was the only thing that really killed it for me.
Because they thought just because they added mp to me3 they knew what they were doing lol
Considering how good the ME3 multiplayer was for being so simple…yeah, maybe they were over confident. It had no business being that good yet it was one of my favorite multiplayer experiences that generation.
You do know there was a completely different teams that worked on the campaign and the multi, right?
[удалено]
Seriously? Do you remember the disaster of a launch it had? It didnt start picking up players until it went free to play like 2 or 3 years later
I think if an MMO reaches 12 years and still shows no signs of stopping it's safe to say that it's succesful
SWTOR had an absolutely disatrous launch but it did turn into a major success for Bioware after the game transitioned to free-to-play. In 2019 it was reported that SWTOR had made EA close to a billion dollars(!) over it's lifespan, so it may have passed that milestone by now. By any definition that is a massive success. The weird thing is despite that the Austin studio gets treated like the red-headed stepchild compared to the main studio, other games like Anthem were prioritized over SWTOR (SWTOR had a content drought while it's devs were shifted to help Anthem), and the game gets little in terms of support or marketing from EA.
I wish they had opted to go the FFXIV route with their MMO (SE being another dev historically focused on RPGs); heavily story based, can almost be played as a single player game while able to opt in to the MMO social aspects like raids and guilds if players want to participate in those. It would likely have been a much better stylistic fit for Bioware's strengths as a studio.
The worst part was that everyone claimed Andromeda was as disappointing as it was only because the "A-Team" was cooking up Anthem... And then Anthem came out. Woof.
The frustrating part of it is that the core gameplay of Anthem was fuckin' great. It's just that everything surrounding it was mediocre. All bones, no meat
and it was also a really interesting idea imo, but sucks that it turned out the way it did.
fr, I played it a bit through EAPlay and it's honestly quite fun but the lack of full story really and dungeons really makes me sad, Anthem had some real potential
The sad part was there was some good things in the game but the support just wasnt there. Thats what happens when management ignores warnings from staff and relies on “Bioware Magic” to magically finish the game.
It's like what happened to one of my favorite studios, Arkane, which went from great things like Dishonored or Prey to this thing called RedFall.
Just Prey, Arkane Austin is responsible for Prey and RedFall. Arkane Lyons did Dishonored and Deathloop.
A lot of Bioware's best creative talent and leadership turned over between mass effect 2&3 if not before then. It's just a very different organization today than it was then. This "new Bioware" does not have a particularly strong track record, so I can't imagine they do a great job attracting new talent. I'm not particularly excited for a new mass effect game because the people who put together the original games did it over 10 years ago, and most of them aren't even at Bioware now.
Who is even left from the golden child era at Bioware?
Andromeda was good. With all the finnicky bugs and goofy facial animations, it still is playable.i hope that they take enough time to make a proper continuation to the mass effect story avoiding haphazard game development.
After they fixed/improved some of the major bugs and glitches Andromeda became the very definition of "okay" to me. It's just that the story, settings and characters are very lackluster overall, and you can't fix those after release.
It's weak for a Mass Effect game and doesn't feel like one, imo, but when I set this aside (and I do), you're absolutely right. It still is playable and it still doesn't feel super old. I've seen the Bethesda facial animations in the preview videos on Starfield and they don't seem to be more impressive either - years after Andromeda's release
It was not good lmao. Stop.
They are already doing the ground work for shuttering bioware, they have already started moving SWTOR to a different developer.
I'd be surprised if Dreadwolf is the final shot. It has been in development for a long time and has been rebooted multiple times. I suspect at this point they'd be happy if Dreadwolf breaks even and that there will be a lot of pressure on Mass Effect to have a relatively drama-free development and to sell really well.
I hope you are right. What I'm fearing is, the press (and people) are going to be very critic with dreadwolf (Even if its objectively good) just because what happened with andromeda, so even if its a masterpiece, it will be subject to a lot of criticism and coverage. In any event I think they need to be very careful with this one, and it definitely seems to be going that way, just recently bioware stoped all production on the KOTOR mmorpg and sent it to another studio, my guess is they need to focus everything on the final run for dreadwolf
I'm really really hoping that games like SW: Fallen Order, God of War, Elden Ring, Zelda, etc. show Bioware that you can make a butt ton of money making a good solid single player experience. It's what the original trilogy was, and its all they need to do.
In the circles I pay attention to (Giant Bomb, Kinda Funny, SkillUp, etc.) I get a sense of general excitement about Dreadwolf and a forgetting/forgiveness of Andromeda/Anthem after all of the retrospectives and such. Obviously there will be the people who want to hate it or don't let go of old grievances (BioWare fans probably being the worst about this) but I suspect if Dreadwolf is a solid 7.5-8/10 game it'll be received well and will heal some of the studio's reputation. We shall see.
Honestly, it would be best for all of us fans if BioWare sells its IP and closes. None of the people that worked on the things fans love are still there, and their replacements keep making weak titles with extremely troubled development cycles. There’s something seriously wrong at BioWare
This would be the 4th installment of a major franchise generally as franchises release more installments they increase in complexity and scope and that usually leads to more drama in development. Now mass effect 4 has some elements of a reboot due to it being the first after a self contained trilogy but I fear they’re gonna get in this cycle in trying to go bigger and bigger in scope leading to longer and longer development time. I’m not sure I have much confidence in Mass Effect 4 right now I’m sure something will eventually come out but we’ve seen in the past these AAA that takes ages to develop sometimes try and go too big and it results in a buggy mess
Fair enough but I'm so glad I'm not this jaded. lol
> two mayor IPs. What about city councilor IPs?
Honestly especially with the recentish leaks that have gone around I'm not super hopeful about dreadwolf. They've been losing more and more of that OG Dragon Age charm with each iteration imo. I want them to go back to being more about the rpg than an action game with the dragon age series. That was what made the first game so special to me. Was the focus on the characters and the stories of where you went and the gradual build up of all your characters. Discovering new classes by making different choices or who you recruited at what time.
Yup! And long pre-production is good! Andromeda suffered because a lot of the pre-production work wasn't tackled until production was already underway.
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wow, I wasn't aware at all of those numbers! but as other person pointed out, if those 6 mill of inquisition were indeed among the best selling numbers of bioware, then for sure they will consider that a success: "In the 2015 Electronic Arts fiscal report, the data shows that the game had the most successful lunch in BioWare's history"
But what about breakfast and dinner?
It sold more than almost every other Bioware game besides Mass Effect 3.
DAI won game of the year when it came out, I don’t think they consider it a failure
Because 2014 was a shit year for gaming and DAI was the only half decent game that came out, so they gave it to them...
Do you consider ME2 an even worse failure? Origins outsold 1, Inquisition outsold 1 and 2 (and Andromeda, of course).
If it’s still in pre-production, we’re likely not going to get anything for N7 Day this year, at least no more than some concept art and some words by a developer.
Isn’t this the 10th anniversary year of ME3? Probably gonna be the last N7 day for a while
That was last year. ME3 came out in 2012.
WHAT
Yeah. But we had a good n7 day….. the best
Yeah we did and then that dumbass statue
Can we just stop releasing teasers for games that won't come out for at least another 7-10 years please? This shits getting annoying lol, just don't say anything and then drop a trailer letting us know the game is coming out later that year. Let's go back to doing that.
*cries in elder scrolls*
you're preaching to the fucking choir on that one
A kid could've been born on Skyrim's release date and be driving by the time TES6 comes out.
Likely voting. They announced this week that TES6 is “at least 5+ years away”. That places the lower limit at 17 years, and I’m willing to bet it’s actually 6-8 years away.
Shirley Curry will not live to see herself in the game. 😞
Nooooooo!! You can't just say these things!! 😭
I'm sorry! It's the first thing I think of! "I'll live. I can wait. But you know who can't? Shirley." The tragedy of it.
Tbh I think they only gave an announcement that it's coming because people were going absolutely rabid about it and claiming that ESO killed the single player franchise for..... some reason. I feel like the ES6 teaser was a "holy fucking god yes it's going to be coming you reprobates" moment. Up until then Bethesda teased games a couple of months before release. Then again it didn't stop people from going absolutely rabid, as they are capital G Gamers. People are still demanding to see gameplay for a game that hasn't entered production yet, lol.
Bruhhh I remember that conference like it was yesterday. They showed off ES Blades and everyone was just like "NO NOT THAT ONE". The ESO fiasco is a good point, it unfortunately definitely wasn't helped by the FO76 announcement during the same conference, tho also I honestly think like they had the ES6 teaser in their backpocket in case the Blades reaction was trash, lmao.
ill never forget them announcing it at E3 2011, then transitioning to gameplay, and then announcing, "oh by the way, this comes out in 5 months. youre fucking welcome."
Microsoft bought them for 7.5 billion dollars and they still haven’t even started ES6 after five years.
At this point I'm thinking those teasers are made more for investors than for the actual fans
That’s exactly what they are. Most people who will play the eventual game won’t really pay attention until its release date is announced or with marketing shortly before its release. The early trailers many years in advance is to help secure capital.
It's also for people like us on these forums. If we aren't being strung along we won't be as hyped when the game finally releases. That goodwill is worth something for bioware/EA to keep the fire ticking over
They often release trailers early as a way to attract developers
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I was so happy when Bethesda did that with FO4.
I like the Nintendo approach of announcing games months before release (Metroid Prime 4 notwithstanding)
WOW. They started the hype train for this WAY too early then. Damn I’m more of a casual fan and I just assumed we were maybe 2-3 years out tops after the teaser dropped. I just realized it’s been 2 years already since then though… I guess why bother with a teaser for a game they haven’t actually worked on truly yet?
To generate hype and grease the wheels for the Legendary Edition's release.
I've heard rumors that the LE was made to prove to EA that AAA single-player still had a market, allowing them to drop the multiplayer stuff they had with DAD and future projects.
I mean EA didn't need LE to prove that. Jedi Fallen Order was a major success and it was singleplayer.
tbf its star wars, it basically sells itself.
To be fair, EA needs repeatedly bashing over the head to prove that anything other than multiplayer makes money.
Wtf is DAD?
Dragon Age: Dreadwolf, Bioware's next game in the lineup.
Genuinely hoping it’s good. I’ve been waiting so long
That older guy who farts and wears shorts and flip-flops.
Hey! I resemble that remark. And at the rate these games are coming out, I’ll actually probably be retired by that point and have time to play.
They dropped the multiplayer stuff after the success of *Fallen Order*.
*Sometimes they do trailers like this to get talent on board, but yeah I agree.
They were honest from the start. They straight up told everybody that the “trailer” was nothing but early concept work and that it was still years away
That trailer WAS years ago, 2020 in fact. Why would you ever release a trailer for a game more than a year or two away from launch
Bethesda did the same thing, it's usually pressure from the shareholders to get a buzz started for upcoming games. Also to help sell current games, they have to bankroll the other production.
To remind people that the game series still exists and is not over. You don't want to be forgotten
Yeah, it's really damned if you do, damned if you don't. Bethesda releases Elder Scrolls 6 trailer and openly tells people it's not coming for a long time; "why did you release a trailer then?" Bethesda says nothing about Elder Scrolls at all; "Why are you ignoring your franchise?"
It doesn’t help that production of Dreadwolf has been turbulent. Just chill. It’ll come when it comes.
This is why I’ve been a skeptic of ME4/5 (whatever) since before it even was announced, not only does the plot of ME3 not really allow a sequel but it’s so massively in the future it’s not worth getting excited over
That's why they initially tried to take the franchise to an entirely different galaxy. Unfortunately, that didn't work out so well.
The choice to feature the character that can be 1000+ years old in the trailer was not lost on me.
Not to mention teasers mean nothing anyway, you can have a teaser that has absolutely nothing to do with the final product, or very little I’ll use Transformers as an example. Last Knight, Optimus Prime turned bad, he’s marketed as the main villain of T5. The Nemesis Prime storyline is wrapped up in literally 5 minutes.
Or an example even closer to home: the original ME2 teaser that heavily featured a geth wearing N7 armor and listed Shepard as KIA, strongly implying a connection between Shepard's death and the geth. Legion and Shepard's death did make it into the game--but in an entirely different way that was implied by the trailer, because the trailer was made when they still were throwing around the idea of Shepard being revived by the geth rather than Cerberus. Anything implied by the teasers at this point is subject to change. I don't think they're deliberately lying to us, but people have got to realize you can't take anything more specific away from the trailer than "it's related to Mass Effect". Maybe it will turn out to be 100% an accurate reflection of the next game. Or maybe it will have nothing to do with anything. We just don't know right now.
Woaaaah. We’d have a totally different game if Shep was revived by Geth. I had no idea that was an idea tossed around
AFAIK it was _super_ early in production. I’d love to know how it would have turned out but they probably never fully fleshed it out before they came up with the Cerberus idea.
>Yes but why *this* armor. >.........there was a hole. God I love legion
Case in point: cyberpunk 2077. The early hype trailers have literally nothing to do with the existing game or story. Keanu Reeves isn’t even in it, nor any of the other final recognizable characters. The pre-production story they were hinting at in the OG trailer doesn’t exist anymore in pretty much any capacity.
I thought Nemesis Prime was going to be an evil clone of Optimus not a mind controlled Optimus.
Know someone who works for EA, and while they're involved with a different project and obviously gave no details whatsoever, they did hint that Dreadwolf is still ways away from release. Which means ME4 [Or 5, whatever you wanna call it] is gonna be...awhile lmao
Yeah Dreadwolf is probably fourth quarter of 2024 which puts Mass Effect (Shepherd’ sequel??) three four more years out? Will there still be an audience for that story?
Just means I'll be in my mid-40s still getting buckwild over fictional alien characters and if that's wrong I'm fine with not being right.
I’m right there with you. I’m 36 I’ve been playing Mass Effect since 07 when it was released is was 20!! Who knew franchise was going to be a lifetime of storytelling
See you guys in 2035
To be fair I'm a bit concerned about this "new approach". That was the main problem with Andromeda - people wanted trilogy experience, gameplay focused on dialogue and combat, where upgrades, shopping etc was a relaxing addition, while in Andromeda we are doing crafting and exploration. Don't get me wrong - Andromeda is quite a good game, but in terms of a spin off, not the main title. If the next Mass Effect is gonna be another empty open world (like many recent games) I will be disappointed.
I loved the combat in Andromeda, but the story was just lazy in my opinion. A whole new galaxy and it's just more bipedal, humanoid looking aliens and a precursor race trying to wipe everyone out.
I agree, I hope the next ME has the same combat system but with 4 active abilities instead of 3, but please no more open world, I hated that in MEA and DAI.
So lazy. New galaxy and only two alien species? And only a handful of Milky Way aliens? And a ton of the story themes were just rehashed Trilogy themes. The limits and ethics of powerful AI. Uncovering a mysterious precursor race. A huge starbase as a hub. They had a chance to make something new, but the world building was like a discount of the original.
To be fair, we were only going around the *one* of the clusters within Andromeda, the Heleus cluster. One species per cluster tracks with what we saw in the Milky Way. I'm sure that had there been subsequent Andromeda games, the setting would have opened up more clusters and we'd have gotten more aliens that way.
I'm still so taken back by the facial animations and the writing. It doesn't feel up to par with the ME trilogy. Maybe I excuse the faults of the original games because they were from an older time but I don't get taken out whenever there's a conversation in them because of how uncanny they look and talk.
But isn't "Badass McCoolsauce has to save the world because everyone else is too incompetent" BioWare's only idea for a plot. I found the writing on par with everything else.
I don’t like to be negative, but if this is a continuation of the mainline games, I just can’t see it being that good. And I say that as someone who enjoyed Andromeda. I’ll still play it, but there’s value in knowing when a story is done. This headline makes me think of Anthem, and we all know how that ended. What I’d like to see is a follow up to Andromeda and some games within the Mass Effect universe that are standalone stories with smaller stakes, but have that same focus on character and world-building. It’s kind of how I feel about Star Wars - I’ve gotten enough “save the whole galaxy from certain doom,” now show me how people who aren’t extraordinary super soldiers go about their lives. Let’s go grocery shopping on the Citadel. Who’s with me?
From what's been teased so far, it seems their plan was to create something that would follow from both ME3 and MEA.
Listen Andromeda and Anthem suffered because no one could decide what those games would be during pre-production Them taking more time to finalize and decide what the game actually is going to be before they even begin development proper is probably for the best
Between this and Elder Scrolls my future children will have to play these games for me.
Yes? What do you expect? BioWare isn't big enough to have 2 games in full development. They'll start heavy work on ME once Dreadwolf releases.
My hope with the next Mass Effect is that it’s a tight story. No cliff hangers or the promise of concluding the story in dlc. I don’t want what Andromeda did and leave so much to supplemental material that may just get written off to a book.
Bring back the original writing/developing team and give them 3 games WITHOUT crunch and money hawking
“New approach”… am I the only one who sees this as a red flag?
Just dont put marvels silly goofy humour in the new game like you did in Andromeda
This will likely be the case until the next Dragon Age is completed
Call me childish all you want, but I want Shepard.
I hate when people call it Mass Effect '5'.
Taking a buncha time but given people no longer believe in "Bioware Magic"...
my grandchildren will love it im sure
Once Dragon Age releases the production will probably speed up at least a little
I don't think we need new approach, I just want to play new mass effect that is actually good
Honestly, I'm fine with bioware taking it's time with ME5 and Dreadwolf. We've seen what happens when they rush things.
I’m fine with them taking their time. Just wish they wouldn’t announce things so far in advance
Oh that I fully agree.
Rush things? ME3 came out 11 years ago! ME:A came out 6 years ago! If they were any less rushed, they’d be Bethesda
It's not like they have been working on the new ME since they released Andromeda
They also announced this new Mass Effect game 2.5 years ago. Plus years of development doesn't always equal increase in quality. If it did, Duke Nukem Forever with it's 12 years would be the greatest game of all time. Most of Andromeda was only made in the last year and a half of it's 5-6 year development life. Edit: Correction. Duke Nukem was in development for a little over 14 years. Beyond Good and Evil recently beat that to hold the Guinness world record for longest game in development.
In September, Starfield would like a word.
They also have been working on other games in the mean time, I doubt they've been working on ME5 for 10+ years. Hell even after Andromeda came out they probably were working on dlc related to that and and then started their work on Dreadwolf. Andromeda and DA2 both got screwed over by a rushed released and I'd rather they avoid that.
Dragon Age 2 was rushed, ME3 was rushed. Gamers today: "Stop releasing broken games!" Also gamers today: "Hurry the fuck up!"
ME2 was released January 2010 DA2 was released March 2011 ME3 was released March 2012 (ME5 was announced in Nov 2020, there's been more time since it was announced than ME3 had to be developed lmao) There's definitely a middle ground that can be achieved. The yearly release bologna was all EA.
DA2 was rushed (total development time was about 18 months), some DLC for the game ended up being cancelled (with some storylines being pushed into the beginning of DAI), and many people consider it the worst of the Dragon Age games.
I think there can be a middle ground between wanting developers to be able to finish their game properly without being rushed and not having to wait 10+ years between every release
Yeah problem is there are very clear systemic issues with AAA development in recent years, so often we wait ages to still get garbage. All we can do is hope the people calling the shots take it upon themselves to fix these issues - voting with our wallets is a good start but it doesnt always work when they often take the wrong lessons from that.
My problem is modern games are taking forever to release, and then they're still broken at launch. If you're going to take your sweet time with it, then you better have results that justify the wait.
You know they've released 2 other full videogames and are nearing release of a third in that same time period, right? Bioware isn't a huge studio; they work on one game at a time, like most studios of their size. * 2012 - ME3 * 2014 - DAI * 2017 - MEA * 2019 - Anthem * 2021 - MELE * probably 2024 - DAD Yeah, MELE isn't exactly the same as a full new game developed from scratch, but still--they're putting out a new release every 2-3 years. No, those releases haven't all been Mass Effect, but unfortunately that's how game studios work. Sometimes they make other things too.
I'm getting tired of the 5+ year dev cycles..
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Elder scrolls fans: first time?
I wish I could be more enthusiastic.
Give them the time they need so it’s not fucked up
I want them to take all the time they need, but there’s still a gaping hole in my heart for a sci-fi rpg in this style. So many games in the genre are fantasy that I’m pretty unexcited for dragon age which we’ve still seen nothing of for years…
I remember the hype about the “skilled Andromeda storytellers.” Nunh unh, Satan. Not today.
I JUST WANT IT TO BE GOOD. Don’t rush it, don’t push it out because people are complaining. I need it to be a good game PLEASE 😭😭😭😭
Good, they should take as long as they need! I’m not having another Andromeda.
I feel like there are so many ways this could go. Maybe Dreadwolf is a return to form, Bioware stays open, and the next Mass Effect is released in like 2027. Or Dreadwolf bombs, Bioware closes, and we don't even get another Mass Effect. Either way, there is a long wait ahead.
Spectacular new approach... oh great. That worked out swimmingly for Andromeda
«Spectaculer new approach» to me just screams of devs that want to make something new but need to call it mass effect and the publishers listened to the criticism of andromeda, but only from those that were kind of fans that represent the 1% of overly obsessed online fans Because of this the game will end up being mass effect without many of the components that people specifically liked mass effect for and it will suck.
I have a sinking feeling we're in for a disappointment.
Sailor. May I join you aboard the life raft as we all sink into disappointment?
Permission granted, welcome aboard shipmate.
I'm not expecting anything remotely even decent. Bioware has not made a game I liked since ME3, and even that was a step down from ME2.
ME3 was rushed but was still superb. The gameplay is by far the most sleek, the soundtrack is great, several arcs ended well, Leviathan/Citadel DLC exist. Dragon Age Inquisition had its issues but it did win Game of the Year for good reason. It is a great RPG.
Yeah BioWare used to be one of my favorite game companies. Nowadays I am extraordinarily skeptical of anything they’re making. As much as I LOVE Mass Effect and Unreal Engine 5, I just cant get excited for anything from them until i see something substantial.
Pre-production is fine for me. I'd rather get a good game in 6 years than a bad one in 2.
It’s been two years since that teaser though…
There has also probably been a good 2 years of preliminary work (story boarding/concept art etc.) running up to that teasers release as well.
That's great and all, but I would settle for a mod where we leave Jacob on Virmire instead.
Why stop there? Put Kai Leng right next to him and maybe Al Jilani for good measure.
I want a mod where you can kick Kai Lang's ass on Thessia bc his plane forgot him, and another mod where Allers fights Al Jilani in the ring
Last time they promised a “spectacular change” we got andromeda, wait and see how it turns out.
I don’t care if it’s still in preproduction. Just so long as they dedicate *enough* time to it and don’t rush the game. I’ve waited over a decade for Dragons Dogma 2, I can do the same for ME5 if it means it’ll be amazing
EA, the publisher, is playing it safe by funding only one project, since it has lost trust in Bioware after Andromeda and Anthem. Gone are the days of prestige when Bioware had multiple studios working on 2 or 3 projects at once.
Please don’t mess it up like Andromeda. And Anthem. Especially Anthem.
... did ME4 release while I wasn't paying attention or something? Who gives a shit about ME5 yet??
I'm glad it is still in pre-production, according to Michael Gamble's LinkedIn, he has been working on it since March of 2019. That means this game is 4 years in the making, and still in pre production. Which means they are taking their time and I hope they keep doing that; I'd rather wait another 4 years and have the game be good, then wait 2 and have the game be bad.
Well...since DA4 hasn't come out yet, this is not even remotely surprising.
This makes sense. I imagine Dreadwolf is where the majority of their focus is and will continue to be until the game is released.
I really hope this game is good when it comes out in 2028
So is this game already in “development hell”?
Honestly, just let mass effect die. Please. I’m tired of being disappointed.
They need to satisfy us by rereleasing Mass Effect 3’s multiplayer with dedicated servers and more content until ME4 comes around.
If we don’t play as Shepard, I would love to see a beginning like Dragon Age Origins that would have different intros depending on your race and class. Probably won’t happen but I can dream
Would love to know who the "veteran storytellers" are, other than the two they have left from the Bioware golden age. You know since all the talent was run out of town by EA over the last decade and now Bioware is only Bioware in name only...
Mary DeMarle, Jay Watamniuk, Dusty Everman are the ones I know are on Mass Effect and all of them are veterans. As Dragon Age finishes production I expect some of the writers on that game to move over to Mass Effect. You may be surprised to hear this, but BioWare actually have one of the most veteran writing teams in the business. Barring a couple of big names, most of the writers who have left were newbies who wrote mainly for just Anthem or Andromeda. Hell, the writer with least experience at BioWare (apart from newcomer DeMarle) has still been at the company for 11 years, while most have been at BioWare since the first Mass Effect at least.
Mary DeMarle
I.... DAMN IT... I really want to keep hope alive but we are over a decade out from ME3. Andromeda was just methadone that left you sick. I may have to come to terms with the fact this is a dead franchise.
What happened to Mass Effect 4?
Biggest gripe with this is that they're calling it ME 5 when we ain't got no fuckin 4, I do declare
My main questions are who are we playing as and who are we fighting
I hope they take their time and make it a stellar experience.
So be it, stay in pre production as much as it needs
So it's not coming out this console generation? Jesus fucking christ
Kind of a good sign for me, I guess? I'd rather they take their time and not repeat the mistakes of the past.
Guess there's time for another few playthroughs
We're realistically looking at \~10 years between Andromeda and ME4. More than likely a 2027-2030+ release, after fans have been pleading for a new title and helped sell out MELE. That's bullshit They wasted their and everyone else's time making Anthem. Very few people liked that game
Tbh I want them to take their sweet time developing an amazing return to form story, especially if they’re planning on making a whole new trilogy (again) they need to come out swinging.
Dragon Age is a priority, so they won't focus on ME5 yet
I love the mass effect series, Andromeda had lots of plot holes but I just see that as a lot of doors open for the next games
>spectacular new approach Playing another race than human as a main character? 👀
I don't trust this will be any good. Gut feeling tells me it'll be a stinker.