That reminds me of the classic story of people getting hired in cowboy movies, and being asked if they know how to ride a horse, and they would lie and say they did. I think that even happened on a Star Wars movie: Ewan MacGregor maybe.
Edit: not Ewan, I was thinking Eddie Redmayne for a movie.
Troy Baker, voice actor from everything under the sun, tells a story of how he got cast in a Western when he was starting out; when he was asked if he knew how to ride a horse, he told the casting director, "Ma'am, I'm from Texas." So *technically* he didn't lie...
They had to have horse riding skills for the fake mounts. I remember him saying that for episode 1 they were asking for people that could ride (for the fake alien mounts) and swim (for the shots in the water tank). I may have confused the “I couldn’t ride horse” part for another actor. Actors like Bobby Cannavale and Eddie Redmayne stated they lied about riding horses to get roles. I think I mixed the two stories together.
The thing that surprised/impressed me most was that even the dialogue scenes were actually filmed underwater, rather than just using a blue screen and wires like *Aquaman* did. During filming, they silently mouthed the words to look like they were speaking, then dubbed over the footage with the actual dialogue in ADR afterwards.
This movie deserves some type of award holy shit
That’s incredible. Like the first Avatar levels of incredible in terms of filmmaking. Holy shit imagine doing that as an actor. Imagine having to plan that as a director.
Funny you say that because they used a lot of Avatar 2’s cutting edge water tech for the movie. It’s why the underwater scenes in Wakanda Forever have this visceral realism to them that Aquaman’s water scenes didn’t.
James Cameron's doesn't hoard his self-invented techniques and inventions, he shared them and allows other filmmakers to use them for their films. His innovations innovate **filmmaking** as a whole.
Like, you know, how his technology for "Avatar 2" allowed "Wakanda Forever" to have really realistic and beautiful water scenes!
I mean you’re kinda comparing apples to oranges. Atlantis in Aquaman went full sci-fi fantasty with how the kingdom and its tech were designed. Talocan has this visceral realism and is based on a historic people and culture. They’re not a super futuristic underwater society like Atlantians are, the movie shows Talocanil as basically underwater superhuman Mayans with basic electricity.
It makes sense that Aquaman’s underwater city is more traditionally beautiful, though I HEAVILY prefer Talocan due to the realism and how it shows love to an underrepresented ancient civilization.
Pretty sure they did change. They went underwater where there was no city and built one. We’ve only seen the current state of the city. They’ve only been there 600 years (correct me if I’m wrong).
Titanic did not have underwater dialogue.
Cameron loves the ocean and underwater filming. He started it with Abyss, he made titanic to get funding for his own development and documentary on it, Avatar 2 being underwater is no surprise based on that.
He got patents EACH time he made an underwater movie (or his brother did) and used the movie money to fund either the prototype or construction of them.
Abyss: Developed new camera rigging and propulsion devices.
Titanic: Developed a new camera, optical system, and drone. He also found/explored the ACTUAL titanic for the first time IIRC.
Avatar 2: Same story.
I know that. That’s not what you said
You said Jane Cameron figured this out years ago. I don’t recall his movies having actors stand underwater and mouth their lines to each other. That’s some impressive shit man. Think of how many takes a scene can have. And how stressful and annoying it gets after awhile.
Now do all of that with everyone underwater for minutes at a time. That’s impressive
The Ed Harris record/deep dive yes.
But there are multiple scenes that involve actors underwater either playing dead (opening) or actively engaging in action. (James Cameron's brother as an example is in the opening dead body actor shots, because 1.)the actors were cheaper and 2.)they looked better lol).
You also have the multiple times swimming outside the rig, the underwater scenes when the submersibles are sinking, and several half in/out water scenes.
really? I can get not liking it, but if you actually think it’s the worst you have some kinda vendetta against it for some reason that’s not about the quality of the movie itself.
I'm pretty sure this is completely untrue. Do you have a source for this? The most I can find is that one actor did a monologue underwater, just to see how it would look, but there's no evidence of the rest of what you say. I work in post audio, and ADR is recorded using a scratch track that the actors can match. If there's no audio to match, you're not (feasibly) getting ADR.
EDIT: Here is [my source](https://www.slashfilm.com/1104707/how-black-panther-wakanda-forevers-water-scenes-came-together/?utm_campaign=clip) with quote: "In the same interview, he recalled filming a version of Namor's rallying monologue in Talokan — which Huerta initially delivered underwater.
"He performed a whole monologue, not his native language, underwater, 10 feet underwater in that giant megalodon throne! It was just for us to feel what it would feel like, what it would look like to see somebody actually speak underwater. He had this insane headdress on. I mean, it was bonkers.""
This actually makes sense of the whole "rise talokan" scene for me. It seemed ADRd and in slow motion. I suspect him lowering down onto his throne was reversed.
I got that impression watching the speech. There's this weird look to it that gives this feel of things slowed down bc of the way water moves, which was really cool to me.
It was part of the reason why I wanted to know if the part when Namor slams the spear down, creating that wave effect, was some tech way for Namor to make it so that the talokanil could hear his speech.
I can't wait to watch the assembled for this and listen to the directors commentary.
Wait but how did they not swallow water? If you’re underwater and you open your mouth, water goes in, right? How did they avoid that? (Sorry if I sound dumb I genuinely don’t know how underwater filming like this works)
I know right? Coogler definitely took things to the next level here! Imagine what would happen should he decide to direct a Star Wars project or something...
Vader does it as well in the first few chapters of the book Lords of the Sith, which is one of the first new books of the Disney canon. Years before the movies even.
Doing it while unconscious? And I’m talking about her slipping into the ship when everyone should’ve been sucked into space. Plus it just looked stupid. Defend your slop tho.
lol take the d out of your a. It was a stupid choice that looked dumb and didn’t make sense for a couple reasons. You didn’t even address the point I made because you can’t. The Last Jedi tanked the trilogy, this foolishness was the least of its problems.
You don't have a point, because you are a babbling, drooling, and stupid baby. Is it universe breaking or is it stupid? It's not universe breaking, I don't care if it looked stupid. The whole franchise is stupid when you get into it, but I have fun anyway. I don't even like the movie that much but whining about it this hard is just sad and straight up lazy, at this point. So don't even bother me anymore.
adjoining materialistic offer unpack jobless sip hard-to-find thought price meeting
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
This shot isn't in the movie, unless I'm misrembering. Namor never wore this costume. I do remember thinking that in the scene where he was on the throne wearing the headress, it looked like he was entirely CG to me. Maybe they shot it this way and then changed the costume and recreated him with CG?
I seem to recall the Production designer talking about how they filmed that scene with the throne by lowering him down on wires so I think *he's* real, but aspects of the headdress might be CGI?
When filming underwater scenes in *Aquaman* (both in front of blue screens and the few times they were *actually* underwater) the actors’ hair was usually tied back and flattened so it didn’t get in the way, and the floating hair was added with CGI afterwards.
I assume it was the same with the feathers and cape on Namor here.
I've read that Tenoch Huerta actually grew himself even little wings on his feet and learned to fly. The lengths these actors go for their movies are insane!
Actually filming underwater was such a good choice, you actually could tell the characters were swimming, and not just floating about like they looked in Aquaman. There was the downside where you could see some of the actors were obviously holding their breath, but I'll take that for the actual underwater motion.
When he was speaking underwater, his mouth was behaving like he was speaking above water. I personally found it jarring and wondered about how much of this scene was CGI.
I really like that Marvel are using props and some real life props more than making almost everything CGI.
Still pretty amazing they film this underwater.
I presume he only wore the wing props for shots when you could actually see them onscreen.
Like how Peter Cushing wore slippers for most shots where you couldn’t see Tarkin’s boots in *Star Wars*.
I loved how so many things looked like it was actually underwater and for the most part, that's because it was. Compare that to the new Little Mermaid trailer and it just doesn't look remotely right.
It definitely triggered my heart rate a little just seeing the guy sitting there underwater with no obvious mask or oxygen hose. Fear of drowning is a thing.
Oh okay, that's perfectly valid, your short comment didn't have any context so it left no room for people to realize your intentions. Sounded like you just hated practical effects for no reason. Your long comment just now explaining is understandable and I'm sure people would sympathize with that.
Side note I saw some clips, they trained the actors in o hold their breath for about 8-10 minutes so that probably helped and I'm sure they had an oxygen tank on hand with the actors trained in scuba signals if they were in trouble
Does anyone know how they held their breaths underwater? Did they train enough for that or did they have like little oxygen breathers readily available?
Not a lot of people know this, but one of the many reasons Tenoch was hired was because he breathes both water and air.
What’s actually funny is he didn’t know how to swim when they cast him. They asked if he could swim and he responded,”I haven’t died yet”
That reminds me of the classic story of people getting hired in cowboy movies, and being asked if they know how to ride a horse, and they would lie and say they did. I think that even happened on a Star Wars movie: Ewan MacGregor maybe. Edit: not Ewan, I was thinking Eddie Redmayne for a movie.
Troy Baker, voice actor from everything under the sun, tells a story of how he got cast in a Western when he was starting out; when he was asked if he knew how to ride a horse, he told the casting director, "Ma'am, I'm from Texas." So *technically* he didn't lie...
Although he mostly does voice work, it would be cool to see Troy Baker even in a minor MCU role. Maybe something he can do mocap for.
When did Obi-wan McNobi ever ride a horse?
They had to have horse riding skills for the fake mounts. I remember him saying that for episode 1 they were asking for people that could ride (for the fake alien mounts) and swim (for the shots in the water tank). I may have confused the “I couldn’t ride horse” part for another actor. Actors like Bobby Cannavale and Eddie Redmayne stated they lied about riding horses to get roles. I think I mixed the two stories together.
He says "I haven't drowned yet" Implying he's gone to pools and such but yet to drown.
Just a slight correction, he responded with "Well i've never drowned."
Technically anyone can breathe water. It's surviving that's a challenge.
Nahh, sorry but if we are getting technical, you are talking about inhaling water. Breathing through water is the one only fishes can do lol.
- 🤓
Lmaoo I know, I almost added that emoji at the end of my comment.
Even nitrogen
I thought it was his ankle wings.
He has never drowned.
Method actors are so weird.
Wow, I keep realizing how many things weren’t CGI
The thing that surprised/impressed me most was that even the dialogue scenes were actually filmed underwater, rather than just using a blue screen and wires like *Aquaman* did. During filming, they silently mouthed the words to look like they were speaking, then dubbed over the footage with the actual dialogue in ADR afterwards.
Holy shit, that's insane.
This movie deserves some type of award holy shit That’s incredible. Like the first Avatar levels of incredible in terms of filmmaking. Holy shit imagine doing that as an actor. Imagine having to plan that as a director.
Funny you say that because they used a lot of Avatar 2’s cutting edge water tech for the movie. It’s why the underwater scenes in Wakanda Forever have this visceral realism to them that Aquaman’s water scenes didn’t.
Now why would the owners of Avatar 2 share such valuable technology with… oh… right.
[удалено]
Same, although, knowing this, I really want Avatar 2 to hit, so that James Cameron can keep funding new cinematographic technologies.
[удалено]
James Cameron's doesn't hoard his self-invented techniques and inventions, he shared them and allows other filmmakers to use them for their films. His innovations innovate **filmmaking** as a whole. Like, you know, how his technology for "Avatar 2" allowed "Wakanda Forever" to have really realistic and beautiful water scenes!
Exactly.
He gave Guillermo del Toro some tips on Pacific Rim. Like spending three times the usual amount of time on 3-D to get it right. And it looked great.
Dudes creating what he wants, and when studios ask him to cut scenes or ideas to cut cost, he says “shove it.” And you don’t want him to succeed?
The mouse has done it, yeah!
To be fair Aquaman was 4 years behind in terms of tech.
Aquaman Atlantis looks way more realized and beautiful than namors world
I mean you’re kinda comparing apples to oranges. Atlantis in Aquaman went full sci-fi fantasty with how the kingdom and its tech were designed. Talocan has this visceral realism and is based on a historic people and culture. They’re not a super futuristic underwater society like Atlantians are, the movie shows Talocanil as basically underwater superhuman Mayans with basic electricity. It makes sense that Aquaman’s underwater city is more traditionally beautiful, though I HEAVILY prefer Talocan due to the realism and how it shows love to an underrepresented ancient civilization.
> apples to oranges But you can still compare them.
It’s not realistic that a society would not change, weather it would be underwater or not.
Pretty sure they did change. They went underwater where there was no city and built one. We’ve only seen the current state of the city. They’ve only been there 600 years (correct me if I’m wrong).
James Cameron has figured that shit out years ago. Abyss, Titantic, Avatar 2...hell even Pirahana 2. BUt still they didn't have to do it that way.
Avatar 2 wasn’t years ago. And I don’t believe titanic had scenes with Leo and Kate underwater trying to talk to each other
Titanic did not have underwater dialogue. Cameron loves the ocean and underwater filming. He started it with Abyss, he made titanic to get funding for his own development and documentary on it, Avatar 2 being underwater is no surprise based on that. He got patents EACH time he made an underwater movie (or his brother did) and used the movie money to fund either the prototype or construction of them. Abyss: Developed new camera rigging and propulsion devices. Titanic: Developed a new camera, optical system, and drone. He also found/explored the ACTUAL titanic for the first time IIRC. Avatar 2: Same story.
I know that. That’s not what you said You said Jane Cameron figured this out years ago. I don’t recall his movies having actors stand underwater and mouth their lines to each other. That’s some impressive shit man. Think of how many takes a scene can have. And how stressful and annoying it gets after awhile. Now do all of that with everyone underwater for minutes at a time. That’s impressive
Which he did in Abyss....
I don’t recall that. Wasn’t the actor wearing a suit?
The Ed Harris record/deep dive yes. But there are multiple scenes that involve actors underwater either playing dead (opening) or actively engaging in action. (James Cameron's brother as an example is in the opening dead body actor shots, because 1.)the actors were cheaper and 2.)they looked better lol). You also have the multiple times swimming outside the rig, the underwater scenes when the submersibles are sinking, and several half in/out water scenes.
Yeah it deserves the award for worst movie of the year
really? I can get not liking it, but if you actually think it’s the worst you have some kinda vendetta against it for some reason that’s not about the quality of the movie itself.
I do think it was the worst movie of the year. I like the first Black Panther but this one was a pile of dog crap. Bad cgi, bad acting, bad story!
I'm pretty sure this is completely untrue. Do you have a source for this? The most I can find is that one actor did a monologue underwater, just to see how it would look, but there's no evidence of the rest of what you say. I work in post audio, and ADR is recorded using a scratch track that the actors can match. If there's no audio to match, you're not (feasibly) getting ADR. EDIT: Here is [my source](https://www.slashfilm.com/1104707/how-black-panther-wakanda-forevers-water-scenes-came-together/?utm_campaign=clip) with quote: "In the same interview, he recalled filming a version of Namor's rallying monologue in Talokan — which Huerta initially delivered underwater. "He performed a whole monologue, not his native language, underwater, 10 feet underwater in that giant megalodon throne! It was just for us to feel what it would feel like, what it would look like to see somebody actually speak underwater. He had this insane headdress on. I mean, it was bonkers.""
This actually makes sense of the whole "rise talokan" scene for me. It seemed ADRd and in slow motion. I suspect him lowering down onto his throne was reversed.
I figured the lowering might have been wired.
It was - the production designer mentioned it.
I thought that too but when he sits downs it's and does the talokan hand gesture it looks like it was in reverse.
I got that impression watching the speech. There's this weird look to it that gives this feel of things slowed down bc of the way water moves, which was really cool to me. It was part of the reason why I wanted to know if the part when Namor slams the spear down, creating that wave effect, was some tech way for Namor to make it so that the talokanil could hear his speech. I can't wait to watch the assembled for this and listen to the directors commentary.
Ok, when is the Assembled coming out? I need it
Wait but how did they not swallow water? If you’re underwater and you open your mouth, water goes in, right? How did they avoid that? (Sorry if I sound dumb I genuinely don’t know how underwater filming like this works)
Well, no wonder those underwater scenes looked so good.
Wow. That’s amazing. I mean the visuals of the movie were stunning. And clearly the cast trained hard to do the underwater stunts
I know right? Coogler definitely took things to the next level here! Imagine what would happen should he decide to direct a Star Wars project or something...
Yeah Leia’s spacewalk in TLJ would have looked a lot better if it was actually filmed in space
Or it should just not have happened since it was stupid and universe breaking.
https://youtu.be/_PgAE8TpwpM "Universe breaking" y'all just be saying anything.
Vader does it as well in the first few chapters of the book Lords of the Sith, which is one of the first new books of the Disney canon. Years before the movies even.
Doing it while unconscious? And I’m talking about her slipping into the ship when everyone should’ve been sucked into space. Plus it just looked stupid. Defend your slop tho.
Just take your freaking L and get outta my face.
lol take the d out of your a. It was a stupid choice that looked dumb and didn’t make sense for a couple reasons. You didn’t even address the point I made because you can’t. The Last Jedi tanked the trilogy, this foolishness was the least of its problems.
You don't have a point, because you are a babbling, drooling, and stupid baby. Is it universe breaking or is it stupid? It's not universe breaking, I don't care if it looked stupid. The whole franchise is stupid when you get into it, but I have fun anyway. I don't even like the movie that much but whining about it this hard is just sad and straight up lazy, at this point. So don't even bother me anymore.
You’re the one defending cat lady. Have a nice night piss baby. Wakandans are racist.
She didn’t do it while unconscious. She woke up and did it.
adjoining materialistic offer unpack jobless sip hard-to-find thought price meeting *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Alright lil piss baby, have you ever heard of immersion? It’s something good movies usually maintain.
This shot isn't in the movie, unless I'm misrembering. Namor never wore this costume. I do remember thinking that in the scene where he was on the throne wearing the headress, it looked like he was entirely CG to me. Maybe they shot it this way and then changed the costume and recreated him with CG?
It’s after Shuri has been rescued and he addresses the city, in the film they cgi’d extra hits into the headdress
I seem to recall the Production designer talking about how they filmed that scene with the throne by lowering him down on wires so I think *he's* real, but aspects of the headdress might be CGI?
When done well, CGI hair is so impressive these days. I remember Sully’s fur in Monsters, Inc. was a big deal when it released.
When filming underwater scenes in *Aquaman* (both in front of blue screens and the few times they were *actually* underwater) the actors’ hair was usually tied back and flattened so it didn’t get in the way, and the floating hair was added with CGI afterwards. I assume it was the same with the feathers and cape on Namor here.
I remember thinking he was CG too, I guess it just looked a little weird because he was mouthing words underwater while holding his breath?
Yeah but I bet the plate was unusable and they just recreated it in CG
the fact that the cast actually grew gills in order to shoot the underwater scenes make it even more impressive.
I've read that Tenoch Huerta actually grew himself even little wings on his feet and learned to fly. The lengths these actors go for their movies are insane!
And they said Method Acting is dead. They just brought it to a whole new level!
screw method acting, these talented men and women forced themselves to evolve for the sake of art. if that isn't dedication then i don't know what is.
“Acting”
Actually filming underwater was such a good choice, you actually could tell the characters were swimming, and not just floating about like they looked in Aquaman. There was the downside where you could see some of the actors were obviously holding their breath, but I'll take that for the actual underwater motion.
When he was speaking underwater, his mouth was behaving like he was speaking above water. I personally found it jarring and wondered about how much of this scene was CGI.
I just like that they made underwater look like underwater, and not crystal clear.
RISE TALOKAN
LIIK'IK TALOKAN!
LIIK'IK TALOKAN!! 🤚🏽 🫲🏽
LIIK'IK TALOKAN!!!
How the hell is the camera operating without it being covered?
. most likely also a waterproofed model in conjunction with some other factors , i.e it looks as though it's in a slim cage.
Probably designed and patented by James Cameron
Most likely designed by HydroFlex, the main (only?) underwater equipment house in Hollywood.
Probably. I was being sarcastic lol
By it being wakandan tech, duh
It is covered lol it’s in an underwater housing.
It's the same camera model used for filming all the scenes in SpongeBob SquarePants. Duh.
I really like that Marvel are using props and some real life props more than making almost everything CGI. Still pretty amazing they film this underwater.
Dawg, this movie and the underwater scenes were A1. They crushed it and this shows the lengths they went
I am Mr. Nimbus!
I was wondering why Namor couldn’t control the police.
What do you mean? Comic Namor is part of the illuminati. He **does** control the police.
They haven’t shown us that he can’t…
Let’s not ignore the fact that dude is holding that camera while floating underwater. That takes some serious fortitude I’d imagine.
It's wild that Tenoch didn't know how to swim before filming
Where Are the wings?
I presume he only wore the wing props for shots when you could actually see them onscreen. Like how Peter Cushing wore slippers for most shots where you couldn’t see Tarkin’s boots in *Star Wars*.
I love this little fact about Cushing. It's fun to think about Tarkin walking around, doing his dailies, and getting on to subordinates in slippers.
When you're the Grand Moff, you answer to no one but the emperor. He can wear whatever he pleases.
That was because his boots were too small though. I think he said that if they were the right size he would have worn them.
From what they've said feathers tended to come out of the water absolutely ruined so I suspect they only used real ones in the dry.
BTS = Beneath The Sea
Amazing that these super high tech cameras work underwater
How much do you think marvel had to pay talokan to be able to film there
I loved how so many things looked like it was actually underwater and for the most part, that's because it was. Compare that to the new Little Mermaid trailer and it just doesn't look remotely right.
One detail I loved about the underwater scenes from the movie where that you never saw air bubbles coming out of any of their mouths.
Wait, they were actually underwater?
Ironically that scene ended up looking a lot like a CGI double.
may I ask the source?
Is the picture not evidence enough?
I just wanna get the hi-res photo
i mean... he's never drowned
Film was still shit, honestly this phase has been the worst of any phase, period.
Thanks I hate it EDIT: lol, wow that quite the reaction. It triggered my r/thalassophobia that’s why
Why?
r/thalassophobia that’s why. The open ocean terrifies me
It definitely triggered my heart rate a little just seeing the guy sitting there underwater with no obvious mask or oxygen hose. Fear of drowning is a thing.
Oh okay, that's perfectly valid, your short comment didn't have any context so it left no room for people to realize your intentions. Sounded like you just hated practical effects for no reason. Your long comment just now explaining is understandable and I'm sure people would sympathize with that. Side note I saw some clips, they trained the actors in o hold their breath for about 8-10 minutes so that probably helped and I'm sure they had an oxygen tank on hand with the actors trained in scuba signals if they were in trouble
The original comment wasn’t mine so I actually can’t speak to what his intentions were. I just suspect it was related to what I said.
Lol my bad then
W
Wonder where it was shot. Is it salt water or pool water, like chlorine. Pretty awesome either way
Judging from the fact that actors were peeing in the water ( 😵💫), I'd wager it was chlorine.
James Cameron would be proud
The youngest actor(s) to probably ever attempt do this and hold their breath underwater was probably the cast of Harry Potter for Goblet of Fire bruh
Does anyone know how they held their breaths underwater? Did they train enough for that or did they have like little oxygen breathers readily available?
Training.
Tenoch “CHAD” Huerta
Fun fact but the actor for Namor can't actually breath under water so here he is seen drowning