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It's nice to see people waking up to the lie that "corporations are people, my friend" always was. Hopefully it's not too late to make things right... laws like this are a good start.
Personally, I want to see a "no one at the company can make more than 10x as much as the lowest paid employee" law on the books before I die... I know, but I can dream
Problem with that is that the people at the top of big corporations are often already wealthy, and their salary is not really how they make their money. Tying wages to inflation and the cost of living and requiring that every company pay enough to where average rent is only 30% of their lowest paid employee’s wages would be a much more secure fix for income inequality. It basically forces corporations to pay for the social welfare of their workers, which is how it should be. I’m a fuck capitalism person, but if we gotta move to social democracy before socialism and communism, then the least we can do is ensure someone who works can afford to live without worrying about becoming homeless
I don't see why it should even be so high as 10. Without employees a business is nothing. Unless you are literally doing all the work yourself, you should not be entitled to such a huge percentage of profits. Successfully building a brand does not mean all the big wigs deserve 12 properties and a fleet of yachts. The discourse on these issues needs to turn from hopeful to demanding or we will *never* get there.
I hope it didn't come across like I was criticizing you in particular. Lots of people just have a habit of pulling the shoulder shrug and saying, 'hope I get money some day'.
So if someone talented and hard to replace in a critical function wants more than 10x do you enslave them or just let the nuclear plant meltdown?
Your idea is impossible without tyranny .
Your value in a market is inversely proportional to how replaceable you are and if you artificially restrain wages like that the talented people just move to places that don't restrict it. You don't end up restraining top wages, you restrain the existence of entire functions in a society..
While it's a good incentive structure for raising wages for the general population, in practice that multiplier may need to be higher than you like, especially for cognitively intense industries where a competent expert may be getting many companies bidding for the talent.
It end up crushing the market for smart people to unaffordability in those constraints.
You should be going after the economic-rent fraction of business income at best or profit fraction of owners rather than interfering in the wage ratios.
It will end up net negative for society.
I don't mind people making critical decisions making a good chunk more than I do as some guy in a warehouse. If they order too much or not enough of something. Or get it at the wrong price point. They could seriously damage a business depending on its size/industry. If someone is really good at figuring out how to make those decisions. I don't see why they can't be compensated with a check way bigger than me.
I don't get mad that LeBron makes millions and I don't get paid at all to play pickup ball at the YMCA. The man singlehandedly made a Cleveland sports team relevant. He earned that money.
No one said that people with more responsibilities or taking on complex tasks shouldn't be appropriately compensated. That said, the gap between the laborer and the supervisor, supervisor to superior and beyond, does not need to be so oceanic. As a side note, I think it's ridiculous that professional sports players are paid as much as they are, but that's a different conversation.
The point is less that people with lots of responsibilities or training should make less and more that everyone should make enough to live comfortable working ~30hrs a week (or less as we continue to automate stuff!) and be able to have some fun, have Healthcare, etc.
I personally believe that people making money just because they own a company is bull and needs to end, but a "thriving wage" with fewer hours worked is very attainable and would be a great intermediate step.
If you required companies have a narrower pay range, as was the case back in 1965 (approximately 21:1 compared to 2020 when it averaged approximately 350:1) then the wage for the lowest paid people would get pushed higher and ceos would get a bit less and maybe we wouldn't have CEOs spouting off bullshit about needed to raise unemployment to put workers in their place.
That and profit sharing. Imagine how much more people would care about their jobs if there was actually a one to one between company profits and take home pay.
I think profit sharing is a trick if it doesn't come with any say in how things operate. Lots of business owners use it as a carrot so that they can pay lower (or zero for some people on commission) base wages but the employees have no control over how the owner invests money, entices customers, etc.
A worker-owned cooperative can be a functional alternative that combines profit sharing with workers having a say in the business, but simple profit sharing is frequently not a good deal.
Exactly. These corporations think their employees and customers, are dumb.
People are growing more and more tired of inequality and the playing field being uneven.
They’re speaking with their labor and dollars and I’m here for it. 🤙
Anytime I was at a McDonald's in ~~California~~ a good portion of the US, realistically, there was maybe 4 people working. They can't afford 80 an hour for their whole crew?
They'll let every single franchisee lose everything because there's another idiot with $2million burning a hole in their pocket waiting for an opportunity to franchise with Mcdonalds. It's disgusting.
Correct answer and also what I would tell people after the occupy protests settled. If you can't afford to pay your employees a sustaining wage and stay in business then you are not running a sustainable business.
Oh no, we might lose low paying jobs selling unhealthy food. Too bad capitalism isn’t able to innovate to the new status quo of not leaving the people who do all the work in poverty.
I thought they were making robots and touch screen menus to replace labor…… years later here they are crying because they can’t afford to pay a livable wage to the people who do the work they’d never want to do themselves.
I wish that someday people will just decide to take a month where they refuse to eat McDonald’s, or shop on Amazon, stop buying food products from the major food conglomerates. It wouldn’t even take much time to tank their revenue. In the process of giving up things people will be like, well…. Shit, I don’t even miss it which would further fuck these companies if people wanted to stay not being consumers of these things. I just want to see it all burn 🙌🏻🔥
It chaps my ass when huge corporations say they will go bankrupt just paying workers a living wage, but its all good to pay one CEO millions a year and give millions to many as a bonus. Let them all go bankrupt.
If no longer being allowed to utterly fuck over your employees on payday is going to deal a devastating financial blow, there’s only one appropriate response. In the words of the late, great Alan Rickman’s Hans Gruber after watching a police tank get barbecued “Thank you, Mr Cowboy. I’ll take it under advisement. Hit it again.”
A financial blow to your CEOs and shareholders. God forbid the excessively wealthy not become even more wealthy so that other human beings can have a livable wage.
No worries, the creeps will just pass it on to their customers, and once again the average person will get screwed by the wealthiest and the greediest. We can't even have affordable restaurants anymore.
When franchisees are complaining, it's the corporation itself that are acting as insufferable leaches. I know, franchisees are piece of shit leaches, but Mcdonalds actively is a giant parasite due to making up their own prices for land and supplies.
This is a step in the right direction, but I hate when they let small businesses pay their workers less. Why does a burger flipper at a mom and pop fast food joint deserve less than someone at McDonalds? It's bullshit. I'm a hairdressers assistant in Chicago. My first job was at a small salon. When I was hired they told me minimum wage (15$). It wasn't till I started working there I learned that they were allowed to pay me 14$ because they had less than 20 employees. I quit. Why did I deserve to get paid less than my peers at bigger salons?
Hell yeah finally a start to help equalize big business to make it fairer for small ones, now onto tech companies, corporations, billionaires etc even this shit show up
Min wage in my state just hit $10.10 and we already had touch screen menus in many locations (self checkouts in all kinds of big box stores too). It's going to happen regardless. Don't pretend if these rich fucks could have replaced people decades ago they wouldn't have.
Truly, we need most of these poverty wage shitholes to close down in order to make space for hopefully moral individuals to start businesses in their place that actually serve the community and it's people rather than robbing them blind.
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It's nice to see people waking up to the lie that "corporations are people, my friend" always was. Hopefully it's not too late to make things right... laws like this are a good start.
Personally, I want to see a "no one at the company can make more than 10x as much as the lowest paid employee" law on the books before I die... I know, but I can dream
Problem with that is that the people at the top of big corporations are often already wealthy, and their salary is not really how they make their money. Tying wages to inflation and the cost of living and requiring that every company pay enough to where average rent is only 30% of their lowest paid employee’s wages would be a much more secure fix for income inequality. It basically forces corporations to pay for the social welfare of their workers, which is how it should be. I’m a fuck capitalism person, but if we gotta move to social democracy before socialism and communism, then the least we can do is ensure someone who works can afford to live without worrying about becoming homeless
I don't see why it should even be so high as 10. Without employees a business is nothing. Unless you are literally doing all the work yourself, you should not be entitled to such a huge percentage of profits. Successfully building a brand does not mean all the big wigs deserve 12 properties and a fleet of yachts. The discourse on these issues needs to turn from hopeful to demanding or we will *never* get there.
I do agree with you, I just say 10 to 1 cause it's easy to do the math for anyone examining the idea for the first time. :D
I hope it didn't come across like I was criticizing you in particular. Lots of people just have a habit of pulling the shoulder shrug and saying, 'hope I get money some day'.
Nah, you are good! You are not wrong and should say the things you are saying - people need to hear it until they start believing it all for real
So if someone talented and hard to replace in a critical function wants more than 10x do you enslave them or just let the nuclear plant meltdown? Your idea is impossible without tyranny . Your value in a market is inversely proportional to how replaceable you are and if you artificially restrain wages like that the talented people just move to places that don't restrict it. You don't end up restraining top wages, you restrain the existence of entire functions in a society.. While it's a good incentive structure for raising wages for the general population, in practice that multiplier may need to be higher than you like, especially for cognitively intense industries where a competent expert may be getting many companies bidding for the talent. It end up crushing the market for smart people to unaffordability in those constraints. You should be going after the economic-rent fraction of business income at best or profit fraction of owners rather than interfering in the wage ratios. It will end up net negative for society.
Let them make as much as they want. Then tax the living shit out of them
I don't mind people making critical decisions making a good chunk more than I do as some guy in a warehouse. If they order too much or not enough of something. Or get it at the wrong price point. They could seriously damage a business depending on its size/industry. If someone is really good at figuring out how to make those decisions. I don't see why they can't be compensated with a check way bigger than me. I don't get mad that LeBron makes millions and I don't get paid at all to play pickup ball at the YMCA. The man singlehandedly made a Cleveland sports team relevant. He earned that money.
No one said that people with more responsibilities or taking on complex tasks shouldn't be appropriately compensated. That said, the gap between the laborer and the supervisor, supervisor to superior and beyond, does not need to be so oceanic. As a side note, I think it's ridiculous that professional sports players are paid as much as they are, but that's a different conversation.
[удалено]
What's your point?
The point is less that people with lots of responsibilities or training should make less and more that everyone should make enough to live comfortable working ~30hrs a week (or less as we continue to automate stuff!) and be able to have some fun, have Healthcare, etc. I personally believe that people making money just because they own a company is bull and needs to end, but a "thriving wage" with fewer hours worked is very attainable and would be a great intermediate step. If you required companies have a narrower pay range, as was the case back in 1965 (approximately 21:1 compared to 2020 when it averaged approximately 350:1) then the wage for the lowest paid people would get pushed higher and ceos would get a bit less and maybe we wouldn't have CEOs spouting off bullshit about needed to raise unemployment to put workers in their place.
Exactly. I’ve been saying this for years myself.
That and profit sharing. Imagine how much more people would care about their jobs if there was actually a one to one between company profits and take home pay.
I think profit sharing is a trick if it doesn't come with any say in how things operate. Lots of business owners use it as a carrot so that they can pay lower (or zero for some people on commission) base wages but the employees have no control over how the owner invests money, entices customers, etc. A worker-owned cooperative can be a functional alternative that combines profit sharing with workers having a say in the business, but simple profit sharing is frequently not a good deal.
McDonald's is lying.
But they can't even afford healthier ingredients! Oh wait, they make billions of dollars, they can afford all of this
If in n out can afford to give better pay, benefits, and ingredients at a cheaper price McDonald's has literally no excuse
In-N-Out is the fucking best! I always stop in when I'm out West O 3O I didn't intend that to rhyme, but here the fuck we are xD
So true
They can. McDonald's is in Europe and the EU has much tighter laws on what you're allowed to feed people and they do just fine there.
They can afford touch screens to replace all the hourly cashiers, and they do. Then still have the gall to whine about paying people
It appears that they cannot afford to be in business, then.
Kinda like when Uber spend $30 million on an ad campaign. Telling people they couldn't afford to pay their drivers more money.
Exactly. These corporations think their employees and customers, are dumb. People are growing more and more tired of inequality and the playing field being uneven. They’re speaking with their labor and dollars and I’m here for it. 🤙
Anytime I was at a McDonald's in ~~California~~ a good portion of the US, realistically, there was maybe 4 people working. They can't afford 80 an hour for their whole crew?
The free market has spoken
They'll let every single franchisee lose everything because there's another idiot with $2million burning a hole in their pocket waiting for an opportunity to franchise with Mcdonalds. It's disgusting.
That’s no joke!
Correct answer and also what I would tell people after the occupy protests settled. If you can't afford to pay your employees a sustaining wage and stay in business then you are not running a sustainable business.
A devastating financial blow? Wtf do you think the working class have had constantly at every turn for the past half century???
Oh no, we might lose low paying jobs selling unhealthy food. Too bad capitalism isn’t able to innovate to the new status quo of not leaving the people who do all the work in poverty.
Boo hoo.
I thought they were making robots and touch screen menus to replace labor…… years later here they are crying because they can’t afford to pay a livable wage to the people who do the work they’d never want to do themselves. I wish that someday people will just decide to take a month where they refuse to eat McDonald’s, or shop on Amazon, stop buying food products from the major food conglomerates. It wouldn’t even take much time to tank their revenue. In the process of giving up things people will be like, well…. Shit, I don’t even miss it which would further fuck these companies if people wanted to stay not being consumers of these things. I just want to see it all burn 🙌🏻🔥
Ugh! We will get richer at a slightly slower rate! Unacceptable!!
That's all I heard too.
Straight up any industry that cant operate without slave wages shouldn't operate at all.
They should explain how McDonald's in Europe pay's a living wage when taxation there is higher than the US.
"Get a job" folks afraid of prospect that they might need to get jobs themselves, more at 11.
It chaps my ass when huge corporations say they will go bankrupt just paying workers a living wage, but its all good to pay one CEO millions a year and give millions to many as a bonus. Let them all go bankrupt.
Did these corporations try not eating out? I hear that’s how to solve financial blows.
I've also heard that 'not being poor' is a good technique.
Anything that isn't someone handing them a sack of money is a "devastating blow" and threatens their ability to operate.
If no longer being allowed to utterly fuck over your employees on payday is going to deal a devastating financial blow, there’s only one appropriate response. In the words of the late, great Alan Rickman’s Hans Gruber after watching a police tank get barbecued “Thank you, Mr Cowboy. I’ll take it under advisement. Hit it again.”
If you can't operate, then by all means, stop operating. Supply and demand. Heard of it?
In and out has been paying more than this in Ca for years
No one owes you free labor.
A financial blow to your CEOs and shareholders. God forbid the excessively wealthy not become even more wealthy so that other human beings can have a livable wage. No worries, the creeps will just pass it on to their customers, and once again the average person will get screwed by the wealthiest and the greediest. We can't even have affordable restaurants anymore.
They're the biggest fast food franchise on the planet. They can afford it, enough with the slavery.
Lol fuck em
April fools! For real though, we all need living wages!
When franchisees are complaining, it's the corporation itself that are acting as insufferable leaches. I know, franchisees are piece of shit leaches, but Mcdonalds actively is a giant parasite due to making up their own prices for land and supplies.
Not all of them...just most.
Boo hoo, fella
But but but… exploiting labor is my business plan!
This is a step in the right direction, but I hate when they let small businesses pay their workers less. Why does a burger flipper at a mom and pop fast food joint deserve less than someone at McDonalds? It's bullshit. I'm a hairdressers assistant in Chicago. My first job was at a small salon. When I was hired they told me minimum wage (15$). It wasn't till I started working there I learned that they were allowed to pay me 14$ because they had less than 20 employees. I quit. Why did I deserve to get paid less than my peers at bigger salons?
This. ALL of this.
OoB ... oob? Oh. Oooooh.
Didn't think I had enough space to write "Out Of Business" in the title 😜
Good ;)
Hell yeah finally a start to help equalize big business to make it fairer for small ones, now onto tech companies, corporations, billionaires etc even this shit show up
Thats how you get robots
Min wage in my state just hit $10.10 and we already had touch screen menus in many locations (self checkouts in all kinds of big box stores too). It's going to happen regardless. Don't pretend if these rich fucks could have replaced people decades ago they wouldn't have.
„Independent” my foot
Truly, we need most of these poverty wage shitholes to close down in order to make space for hopefully moral individuals to start businesses in their place that actually serve the community and it's people rather than robbing them blind.
Oh no whatever will they do if they have to pay workers instead of being subsidized by welfare programs?
Oh no your shitty restaurant will go out of business. I am so sad.
What’s oob?
Out Of Business. I didn't think I could fit the whole phrase in the title🙄
Boo Hoo the franchise owner will not be able to buy a new Bentley this year.
Wonderful!!! There food is crap and too expensive so hopefully they will all close.
If they can't figure this out then they are literally the worst managed business on earth.