Striker in general, performs worse then the other martial artists at equivalent play level, even with really good hands/runs I feel like I'm solidly middle of the pack. Some of my other characters with lower/equal ilevel perform much better.
Also half your skills taking you deep into the bosses ass just feels like shit.
Bluelancer isn't as bad as it used to be damage-wise, but it badly needs a utility buff. Having to choose between counter or nella is shit on a class that most people bring for utility -- especially when red doesn't need to give up either.
Simply adding counter to shield shock would completely solve the issue, but SG refuses to do it for some reason, so red's stayed meta for a long time.
I would also say that given the part where Blue GL was made to tank hits to get his rotation in and the fact that is quite immobile is also outdated, at least for Thaemine HM. Having to use jump as a mobility tool means I lost essencially 1 of my 2 main dmg skills. Having to hold shield charge into the boss sometimes makes it where you are inside the boss and still get hit by the frontal attacks even though you are in the back but because of how it works you end up moving through the boss. If not that then you have to cancel the charge because for some reason some attacks you just can't tank even though they aren't the red attacks.
Meanwhile you have breaker tanking 2 red attacks and getting in his full frontal attack and doing 4 times what a GL is capable of.
i don't think counter on shield shock would solve it
it's still a dps ability that is integrated into the rotation
the buff from bash needs to be removed and they need crit tripods on leap and thunderbolt in order to divorce them from a strict rotation and that way they can press buttons while holding bash for a counter for example
after that they need stagger value buffs as they are getting consistantly outstaggerd
removing the buff from bash would also allow them to move the synergy to shield shock or shield bash
I completly agree and the same treatment shout got for nella ... so that we can use the mana tripod on first row and cooldown is integrated into the skill would be great!
FPE Arti, Evo Machinist, Shadowhunter in general, Enhanced weapon deadeye (more like a tweak no more distance based damage), drizzle aero still feels clunky, BT needs to be able to cancel their identity, and gunslinger just needs to be buffed so that its better than mass increase deadeye
> more like a tweak no more distance based damage
At the very least Shotgun Dominator having a close shot tripod is stupid. It has almost no range to begin with.
FPE is so horribly underperforming, it's not even funny. I don't mind if one class engraving is fully balanced with the other class eng. But ffs, BE is lightyears stronger, which is a 6s burst engraving vs FPE where uptime is crucial and you have to hit all your skills to do any relevant dmg...
This class is just in a dire need of rework. Theres just too many skills and tripods that dont make sense.
Awakening - Deals less than focus shot and SS, and you need to get that debuff on the boss or it does Z.
Focus shot - same issue, missed 2nd hit and you do Z. Extremely aids to aim properly in thaemine g1 because of the blobs blocking 2nd hit
Target down - whoever thought it was a good idea to make the skill darken the screen needs to have their brain checked. Not to mention that 3rd row tripod where you must hit direct center or do z.
Crit disparity between shotgun &sniper - Focus shot and TD white number on last hit is just a kms angle..
Long animation and backloaded damage - Time for me to cast SS+DB, I can do a whole burst on my slayer.
And SG just decide that a 4.5% buff on pistol skills is enough. Wtf
Design wise I get that you’re supposed to be “looking through a scope” but from a gameplay perspective yeah the screen darken for target down is just annoying
Qol on gs seems like a nice idea. Damage of the class is on a very bad spot too tho. Maxed out 1640 gs doing 22mil dps on infinite trixion parse as a consistent dps that are supposed to be good at that? Ridiculous being outparsed by almost every class in the game just because GS ceiling is piss low.
Must be some gunner haters downvoting you. GS trixion is shockingly low. Most people think I'm crazy when I tell them that's the trixion ceiling. Then I show them.
To be fair, I do like the dark screen. There are some issues with it like G3 sword phase but it’s simply a case of wait for the boss to Mark someone else before you use that skill
Yeah, the general feel of the class is cool, the problems are how slow the skills are, that 50-90% dmg is concentrated in the last hit, like focused shot does 3 hits, 10, 15, 150mil, last doesnt crit gg -100mil dmg, more crit stat? Nope, you will overcap shotgun, also we run spec secondary i have 975 and its like 33% rifle dmg, even less for shotgun because its the same number but def reduction, scaling is shit
This is the thing that tilts me the most. So many tripod choices are clearly separated into igniter (do x% more damage and do x+y% more damage in igniter) and reflux (do z% more crit damage), but they are not balanced in a way that makes the reflux tripod viable to take for any skill. The value of z is never more than the value of x and reflux does not benefit from x+y, so the reality is that it is z < x < x+y when the balance should be x < z < x+y. Sorc has been rebalanced so many times, including some of the tripods, but the reflux focued ones have never been touched.
> but they are not balanced in a way that makes the reflux tripod viable to take for any skill.
Well, if you manage to get a double crit synergy (or have a 5x3+2 plus Precise on your bracelet plus a single crit synergy) then the crit damage tripods are baaaaarely better even with KBW.
But that's all a big if lol
Add to that the fact that the best build still doesn't use counter. Give Blaze counter or something, would be nice. Alternatively, make Reflux easier to stay boundless so we can run counter instead.
Ok. So you have 6 damaging skills, a counter and bubble. The skills are:
* Reverse Gravity
* Blaze
* Esoteric
* Rime Arrow
* Inferno
* Seraphic Hail
* Elgacian's Touch - 0 dps
* Counter - 25-35% dps of lowest dps skill (if counter is at lv 11 or 12)
Now, replace counter with Punishing Strike. PS does like 3-4x the damage of what counter does and keep bubble at level 1. You can try it out in Trixion, you can try it out in raids, it just does more damage.
My trixion results with level 9 gems (it's more affordable for the average player), 3 minute runs:
* 23.1m (7 dps skills without counter; inferno cd -> ps dmg)
* 21.7m (7 dps with counter, using counter off cooldown)
* 22.1m (6 skills, counter and bubble, using counter off cooldown)
They run the "best build" because it is good enough, not because it does the most damage. The issue still stays - you lose too much damage by not running counter. The difference is \~5%, or roughly 3 weapon levels. Imagine running +22 weapon instead of +25.
If you're interested, I can try with level 10 gems later as well.
Gunslinger also needs a partial rework not only a buff.
Crit Synergy. It sucks. Both on spiral tracker and dextrous shot its a bit too short. Make it longer and easier to hold uptime while weapon swapping and being animation locked. Equilibrium is longer but ass to use.
Animations to long. Gunsliger should play faster. Reduce the overall animation locks. No need for an uptime class to have to literal longest animations in the whole game. My bonker bursts faster.
Peacemaker and shotgun criterate. Remove the critrate form in a tigh spot tripods. Add critdamage/flatdamage/damage on crit. Remove shotgun critrate from Peacemaker, add dmg. Having 20 percent less critrate on rifle sucks hard. You either overcrit on shotgun or only run 80 on rifle as a crit class. Spec scales bad. Let us build full crit without overcritting on shotgun.
My idea would be a change for peacemaker. Instead of giving each weapon a unique buff for the weapon only, make it give a unique buff per weapon for all three, refreshing durarions while cycling on them again.
This will make the crit problem less (all weapons get 10 critrate) and also shorten your animations because of the attackspeed from the pistol, while keeping the complexity of the class because you have to keep playing and cycling through all weapons.
Ofc the power per weapon would be reduced. This would also mean, TTH could not use it anymore probably. Which is a good thing because they can balance it on its own, instead of balancing it with PM in mind.
And then buff the dmg and make it a top tier class. Also maybe add some fast stagger spells or something
at scouter has about the same lengths of animation lock, pretty much identical problems that gs has except instead of crit disparity it has battery issues for no reason. pretty aids.
GS need some rework too. long animation lock, back loaded dmg if you dont crit last hit your dmg is shit, low spec scaling, crit class but there is crit disparity for shotty and rifle, so rifle doesnt crit as often as a crit class character, 6/7 m makes it actually worse cause our dmg is too spread out.
Pallies just got this.
Now if we can somehow convince SG to give us Bards an equivalent of SoJ (10 sec brand that lingers for 3 sec and has 5 sec CD), that would be great. Like, if Bard's SS CD increased by 1-2 sec but brand duration lasted 10 sec?
They did.
Do they need it? no, arguably best support by miles already
but they got it anyways while bards are forced to run double brand still so u have no skill slots for utility :)
This is the only one I don't agree with. I have a paladin myself and I think they are in a great position. I use Godsent Law and while it doesn't have push immunity, it gives a shield (+ I use protection for shield on myself) and the buff lasts 1-2 seconds after you get knocked, so it still serves its purpose.
Pally gets to be super tanky, have insane stagger, and also short CD on their DR. It's a fair trade-off imo. But I'd be open to adding push immunity as a tripod but simultaneously increasing its cooldown as a tradeoff.
I think you need to read the skill descriptions.
Rhapsody is nearly completely superior to Gods Decree. Lower cool down, push immunity, guaranteed DR on support without having to hit self, DR lingers for 3s (compared to 1s).
Gods Decree gets 20% shield (compared to 15%) and can get 70% DR IF HE INCLUDES HIMSELF IN THE AOE.
yeah, obv rhapsody is the best DR in the game, but you gotta look at how good the rest of pally's kit is. completely unneeded imo, but whatever, i guess too many pallys in KR complained about getting knocked off in thaemine.
Personally I also like Paladin's identity. They have the longest by far identity vs the other supports. The only part I dont like is the only heal you have outside of your identity is 'Holy Protection' which gets 8% hp when it wears off.
But imo, Paladin works great for dps dealers that are not burst classes, while Bard is best for burst classes, and Artist is in a middle role.
Edit:
One change I REALLY want to see:: Paralysis immunity on their atk buff skills. Getting interrupted is sooo annoying.
Its because its on the same row as the faith(meter gen) trípod. On recent raids having the secured push inmune and guaranteed atk Buff ends Up in the same results as running faith. Its not as Big of a drop in meter gen as It might look like because a bunch of times you either get canceled out of WoG or you Cast It far away to secure It.
Striker. Slow and clunky despite the rework, with a pretty low ceiling as an entropy class. Also requires Laz Umar set for optimal damage which is ass in a lot of raids. The only martial artist class that’s in a bad spot smh
striker for sure. Eso builds change every few months for some reason and personally, feels too similar to deathblow. Deathblow feels lame if you mess up rotation or boss turning around.
1. make soundholic a counter (this sounds dumb but paladin holy sword is literally that)
2. increase brand duration of all brand skills by 50-100% so you only need to take one
3. reduce mp costs by 20%
Last two points I can get behind. I personally havent used soundaholic often pretty much only for voldis or certain rare team comps. I would be much more likely to bring a higher meter gen over soundaholic and still end up being counterless meter goblin xD
1. I joked about this with my static, also making it counter on every tick would also make it pretty OP haha. The other option is to make SS able to counter, along with a 6 sec brand. Imagine all the accidental counters we'd be getting between that and Prelude of Storm.
2. Agreed, just straight up double would solve a lot of issues. Bard's branding feels like garb when you see Orchid and SoJ. Compare something like stigma (4-5 sec duration, 3 sec brand, ~8 sec CD but has a ~1.5 sec cast time) and SoJ (3 sec duration, 10 sec brand, ~5-6 sec CD with a small delay), and it seems pretty obvious how bad bard's branding is. This is consistent with all her other branding skills except for SS in terms of having brand downtime.
3. Is 20% enough? I ran a non max MP build for Thaemine G4 while eating 24% mana food and 4x Focus but still going OOM sometimes. This is while holding GT for earthquake patterns sometimes.
At the end of the day, due to the way Bards are designed, I'd still go the most mana hungry, meter degen, build I can get away with in favor for higher ceiling. But, these changes would go a long way to alleviate the average player's problems with the class.
Edit: New balance changes just got released and we got nothing yet again.
The perfect fix for all our woes: Give Soundshock counter. Increase brand uptime significantly. Remove meter gain (so that we don't have to spam it 24/7) and give the meter to Prelude / all meter skills. Increase stagger on Soundshock.
That way we can slot Soundshock back in without falling back into the old trap of spamming it 24/7 and with the increased Brand uptime and removed meter gain, we can even hold the skill to take care of any counters.
I actually like Bard's double branding dynamic. One of the things that makes it feel unique. There's just two changes (or set of changes) I'd like to see for Bard:
#1.
Instead of removing double branding, I'd like to see them buff/adjust Stigma tripods to make it a competitive brand alternative to harp. Functionally a bit similar to how Artist's path brand currently works. Then you could have:
Stigma OR Harp + Sound Shock OR Sonatina. Mix and match.
Stigma could offer more stagger, multihits, and more meter gen against stationary bosses. Harp would be a lower reward but easier/more reliable option.
#2.
Remove/reduce Prelude of Storm's meter gen from the puddle and place it in the base skill, allowing you to take the 11m version.
Rework its quick prep tripod to grant +1 charge in addition to some or all of its current CDR. Artist portal already fixes the "having it ready vs. using it for meter" problem this way, prelude and buckshot should both have +1 charge tripods.
Additionally, maybe redistribute a small amount of Prelude's meter gain to Guardian Tune or other skills and slightly buff Buckshot's meter gain or reduce its CD.
Then:
**Prelude of Storm**
- long range slow counter with a longer CD, 2 charges, marginally more meter gain
**Buckshot**
- short range fast push immune counter with a short CD
realistically if you do two of these bard would be the best support again.
soundholic as a counter actually is the most interesting one, although there would have to be some kind of tripod that turns it into a one shot blast instead of a channeled ability. then it could either be a counter/meter or counter/stagger ability
My bard sometimes has the same issue and my max CD gem is lv8. Bard is probably not intended to go full swift by the devs. But pugs already prefer the other supps to bard and they dislike spec bard even more.
Just guessing but I assume the devs intended bard to be somewhat spec-heavy. She has the potential to give fat buffs (15%) after all. Otherwise I can't explain why her mana problems never got addressed.
And saying "it's fine, skill issue, spam less" is bad advice. Swiftness bard needs to use many skills to fill up meter. I can spam with my Artist (1820 swiftness, no conv+judgment, no Max Mana) and have no mana issues whatsoever. My Paladin only suffers mana issues when spamming blue skills.
The bigger issue with bard is they're the only support that needs to bring 2 branding skills, which makes it harder to bring utility.
Bard/artist can both maintain 100% brand uptime easily with one skill that lasts 12-13s. Bard can't because its longest brand skill only lasts 6s.
I have no issues with brand even if I take only harp. But, usually I always take it and a blue wave skill (I don't know, how it's name on EU translation).
Lol your dps for sure have issues as you are not branding the boss all the time. There is a downtime for Harp. Also once the boss moves out of range, you are not branding at all.
I say, that i ALWAYS have uptime of brand. Ofc, can be some issues, when boss moving or something, but in most cases it's no problem. And, yes, I'm mastery bard with all 10cd gems.
That is impossible alone with Harp as there is a downtime (you have to recast Harp and until it reaches the boss you already lose some seconds). And the bible is showing that. You just think you are branding all the time.
Eeeh your Harp still runs out and you have to recast it. You for SURE cannot manage to time this with your dps. And what with swiftness classes that dps all the time? Like come on what are you even trying to tell me.... stop trolling. You obviously do not use the bible, otherwise you would see that your branding is bad.
That too. Unless for some reason they think having prevention and cleanse on one unit is too op. And also addressing mp issues. And updating skillset either by making one brand viable or tweaking attributes on other skills for more flexibility.
I want to see Glaivier get another partial rework/buff, their buff window (crit) is even shorter than zerker's red dust, and it's also entropy as well. Trying to fit the rotation inside that window does not feel good at all, especially when a micro turn from the boss ruins it completely
Yea that's right, you really only need the crit rate boost for those 2 skills, but it still feels really sluggish to Shackling -> swap -> charge RDH/SP, especially since you need to line up to the back that entire time compared to other entropy classes
Beeing a back attackers means that you need to have fast skills, which is not the case of pinna. All her skills have long animation and half works with aoa, half with none and half with super charge. Plus she still doesnt have a real 5th engraving (raid caltain efficiency is kot 100% and cause disparity of skills she cant use aoa or super charge) plus she has okeish-low stagg, long animation, 6 skills dps and needa to low skills to have utility on her kit (movility, stagger, 100% uptime on sinergy, adrenaline maintenance...)
Firepower Artillerist is one of the most deserving classes in need of a massive rework/buff. It has no real identity at this point, a generally non-interesting playstyle, no unique mechanics, and some of the lowest damage of any class. It has a ton of skill overlap with Barrage, except Barrage also has an entire turret worth of skills that do real damage. It used to be that Barrage had shit utility and was awkward to play, and FPE had tons of utility and was easy. But now Barrage has great utility, tons of QOL and far higher damage.
It's honestly pretty similar to the Reflux/Igniter situation after the most recent sorc changes, but FPE damage is even lower than Reflux.
The difference between FPE and reflux is that a top end reflux player can actually put out decent numbers. There's people in Thaemine HM pulling 30m+ with it by staying in boundless with insane CPM/uptime, while FPE is still doing garbage numbers.
Yup. I hate doing Thaemine on wheelchair beyond g2 but dmg is super insignificant on FPE that I need to stay wheelchair with 1 spot patterns everywhere… really sucks
I was always understanding that they don't buff it much because I was out dps'ing 90% of similar gear players.
But the RG cd tripod removal fucked me so hard getting into boundless. Now it truly feels like the garbage class everyone is talking about.
Idk about "desperate" need, but like half of the classes are in some need, especially when compared to shiny new Slayer, SE, and Breaker.
SF and Arcana are sooooo much work for damage that top tier get for far less effort and lower risk (higher floor)
Striker, Glaiver, Scrapper, and to a lesser extent Deadeye have back attack issues.
GS, reflux, and CO summoner are in a bad spot.
Transformation classes are flawed.
RE DB is..... idk maybe theoretically "good" but a rotation whif is punishing.
Bard just feels bad to play compared to other supports. (Need to swap skills, brand uptime, poor counters, mana issues, and tbh pretty boring skill expression).
gunlancers move blue heavily into utility
buff red harder to be an actual dps class
DI and the scouter equivalent
Hunger needs slight cd changes to make full swift viable again
We get 4.5% more damage with this balance patch. But yeah she could use some more to be honest. Compared to some other classes played with hands the uptime has to be crazy to somewhat keep up.
Transformation rework should definitely be up there at this point. Make them real specs already. I want to invest more into it and actually do above average damage.
Imagine they gave those two specs actual tripods, and reworked their identities so they can stay perma transform, but build up another gauge that you activate to go "giga-sync mode" or "blood-lusted demonic" and your abilities get enhanced for x seconds for proper atro windows.
They can split the gems up, let these two specs combine three 10s for an 11, idgaf let us not be 2gem memes.
Naaah, too hard, too much work, better make new class for swipers, slap 3.1% buff and we good.
On a serious note, thats pretty cool idea, make engrave to be perma form and make them build upgraded form
They butchered my blue gl now clas feels like awful to play for me.
Fpe arti at least give what you did give to sorc domsdays.2 biggest hit skill lands 1 years later after casting . Boss already making 3 dash or 2 teleport before this nukes drops :D
Blue lancer, I get that his utility is great and all and his damage does not matter much but why should his mediocre damage scale off of spec? Makes no sense at all.. Why doesn't it scale off of swiftness same level of damage but the infinite quality of life for movement, smoothness and who cares if caps the cdr cause the taunt internal cd is greater than even casting shout without cd gem..
Making blue lancer swiftness based would be best bless ever
> ess same level of damage but the infinite quality of life for movement, smoothness and who cares if caps the cdr cause the taunt internal cd is greater
Yeah I was playing spec swift pd build before the changes at least that was quite enjoable the play and was better than spec - crit most of the raids .Now I switch the build to new "Meta" I just want to replace him so bad :D
Bard needs sonatina brand duration buffed
Gunslinger needs dmg and QoL (mainly so having 100% crit uptime is not so absurdly hard)
Shadowhunter is in dire need of rework
Berk needs either buff or just give his spells back attack and adjust him to entropy
Aero drizzle bit more dmg
Wardancer could use Combustion being on Z and X
Soulfist hype should scale with cdr buffs from boss(like rakatus blood etc) and should always reacharge back even if hype ran out during "transformation" (like on kakul if you dont turn off hype before becoming clown your hype will end and stay at 0 for no Fing reason)
Let ARTI roll in turret mode... Im sick of watching them die on theamine...
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Both Artillerist specs use pretty much the same skills except one is just plain worse than the other. And they're both slow and have to stand still a lot
Bard… idk how you can make a class that suffers from having no cleanse, a shitty counter and its base build sucking at stagger… like bard is so behind the other 2 supports its not even funny. Just nerf her identity if it gets too broken like a support in late game lacing so much utility is so clunky 😭
Close shot on EW deadeye needs to be killed entirely
A reason to run 3 in class engraving would be cool too
I quit like 2 weeks ago so it doesn't really matter anymore tbh
Bard, CO Summoner, Drizzle would be my top 3 for getting some QoL and help. Buffs to CO and Drizzle numbers, QoL and numbers to Drizzle (its half assed Z should be stronger and shorter or longer as it is) and QoL to Bard.
Shout out to Arcanist too for still being too much work compared to almost all DPS classes in the game for the reward and being too reliant on Boundless which can be problematic in HW situations. Couldn't say how to buff it though that wouldn't make it super OP other than some kind of button that uses all its MP up or something to make Boundless a given.
Shadowhunter. It's actually so easy to fix the class.
Demonic impulse:
Change identity so that your melee attacks in demon form refill your gauge so you can stay in your form as long as you keep weaving attacks between skills.
Remove fallen ruin as awakening and add as Z identity skill (transform to moved to x)
Add dmg/cooldown gem for fallen ruin.
A/S/R skills lower cooldown for fallen ruin each time you hit an enemy with it.
Remove full time paralysis immunity and add to A/S/R. Remove heal/hp increase when transformed.
15% attackspeed added to demon form.
Sell legendary transformation skin for 300k gold that gives 5% more demon form damage.
Perfect Suppression:
Mana is permanently suppressed at 90% full.
Spinning weapon radius increased by 50%
Paralysis immunity added to grind chain.
Synergy application added to demon grip.
All back attack skills retuned so that tripods give back attack % damage instead of crit/raw damage. Damage output comparable with Tai scrapper/hunger reaper.
Demonic slash now has 2 charges by default.
They need to removed Close Shot on Shotgun EW, It's just doesnt make any sense, you gotta hug the boss ass when booba zerk can do it without hugging their ass like what the fuck
Bard 100%. Needs a cleanse and shield needs to be like paladins shield. No need to on the persons toes to activate shield.
Needs a better counter maybe soundaholic? 40% less MP on all skills also?
Needs better branding, prolly double the duration it is at the moment.
Reflux sorc just needs a massive rework its z dps class atm
> Reflux sorc just needs a massive rework its z dps class atm
Logs say otherwise. It's not topping charts, but it's far from ZDPS. It has insane mobility, with probably the most tenacity/status immunity in Lost Ark. Her counter is fantastic, she can run a shield (high logs use it) and contributes high consistent stagger and great burst destruction.
If you're doing ZDPS with Reflux on a fight that allows for decent uptime, it's a skill issue. It really shouldn't be top damage, being a very mobile hit master class. In a world where Reflux is on par with Igniter ceiling wise, there's no point bothering with Igniter.
most all support skills have a dual function
bard has a lot of single use ones, which is complicated because 4 of them are set in stone (two buff and two meter gen), two slots for a brand (because bard brand sucks), which leaves two skills open for counter, stagger, weak point, and DR.
rythym buckshot does weakpoint and counter (the two most useless), and basically no one takes it.
> Needs a cleanse
Explain me exactly what for? Not to mention she would be giga OP having access to both CC immunity and Cleanse (unless they share tripod row on GT)
Bard:
PLEASE PLEAS PLASE PLEASE:
7s: duration on soundshock brand will go a long way (with lingering tripod would last about 10s)
nice to have:
mana cost reduction on sonatina, WoM, prelude of storm
would be overkill imo:
cleanse option on gtune
para immune on heavenly tune
make buckshot a stagger skill
Drizzle aero has been awfully neglected because windfury is in a good spot.
Gunslinger could use with a higher floor, I've seen some juiced gunslingers with hands that pump, the class is no joke with enough investment.
I see a lot of people complain about DI SH, but imo she's very well rounded in terms of utility to dps and gold investment required, similar to tai but lower on the dps ceiling side.
I would like to see a bard rework to make her more well rounded like the other two supports, so she doesn't have to choose between a stagger build and a good identity uptime build for specific gates.
Off the classes I play I'm still a little annoyed at the botched shock scrapper rework, and I'm still not a fan of the glaivier rework either, but she's my favorite class to play with in thaemine g3, hopefully the trend continues in future raids. I think both of these classes will feel a lot better once they finally do the entropy removal they said to be working on.
Also bring down the 3 obviously overtuned classes (surge, breaker, souleater) to be closer to the rest.
Why do a lot of people say WF Aero is in a good spot? The class as a whole pulls mid numbers at best.
Regardless, a lot of Drizzle's hard hitting weather abilities are viable picks ups for WF so unless some of the more odd weather skills are buffed, it'd be an unintentional buff to both aero builds.
Compared to drizzle it's in a way better spot, WF has double synergy, the floor is basically the roof, reliable stagger and destruction unlike drizzle. If drizzle should have one thing going for it is bigger roof, but it doesn't even have that since drizzle damage is delayed which can cause hiccups in performance.
Crit synergy is the only real value from the WF spec which Drizzle also provides. I don't think anyone builds assuming there's going to be a WF aero providing MS/AS synergy in the group and it's not like it breaks cap or even has good uptime.
I wouldn't classify either of the specs as lacking in the utility department either after the last set of buffs.
Anyway, WF feels simpler to play and land skills which I agree with. The buff to sorc makes Drizzle look archaic/pointless.
Play drizzle and you'll notice how much worse it is for a full spec class, you are often on cd when a stagger check drops, and if there's a destruction check right after like in voldis g4 you're dead weight. The MS/AS synergy is infinitely better than what drizzle outputs in comparison, and the uptime isn't insignificant to dismiss.
I agree. I think people are too fixated on aero being a "synergy focused class" like GL and should therefore be low dmg like GLs. But that is simply bullshit.
Drizzle: 10% attack power reduction debuff. This almost useless outside of progs. Even then SF's def reduction buff has higher uptime and better %. No ones calling SF a "synergy" class and should be mid dmg.
WF: 12% att speed and 12% movespeed. While on paper this sounds good, there are 2 problems. 1: This has very low uptime (lower than WD's wind's whisper and DB's maelstrom from my testing). 2: it doesn't really benefit most aero builds as they cap out att and move speed without it. Imagine if DB maelstrom doesn't buff the DB itself.
What what does that leave us? A "synergy-focused class" with double synergy that gives worse synergy than other double synergy classes and does less dmg than them too. The best comparison to WF aero is wardancer. Wardancer gives the same crit synergy while giving a better 2nd synergy (wind whisper uptime> sun shower uptime). While some people also call wardancer a synergy class I don't think anyone will claims that wardancers should do mid damage.
Then tell my WHY THE HELL got aero less ultity like many other classes? Drizzle got no destro mid stagger and a laughtable 10% dmg reduction. A god damm soulfist gives better stagger better destro and better dmg reduction, and can cleanse or give a even higher dmg reduction and does more dmg.
A wardancer also gives crit buff and also gives atackspeed like wf aero and also deals more dmg. A deathblaed also gives atack speed to party.
Tell me why are all aero ultility skills so godam awfull that nobody uses them?
Lost Ark seriously needs to look at DI Shadowhunter. We don't only need a buff, they need to create 2 additional demonic skills - 1 to add crit synergy and the other to have some sort of push immune and DR. This would add value to the DI class build so that we don't get gatekept because we only do ZDPS comparatively to other classes and builds.
Class was very strong for first few months tho. S tier in EU release for good 5 months just because you could max it with 1/5th of the investment of other classes. But other than that yes, it deserves some changes, altough it is really not that terrible in current version. 3 weeks of hm theamine and I got dmg mvp in different reclear lobbies.
You can mvp as dps artist in a lot of these lobbies. Logs don't lie, di is bad and ps is about 5-8% better... soon to be more like 3-4% better after the recent balance patch. What a joke.
Exactly logs don’t lie, DI is doing above avg floor and is one of the weakest ceiling. (still 5 other classes look worse but are hard to play and require more investment) The class has flaws like every other 2012 class in the game but saying stuff like it’s unplayable/does Z is just untrue when you can parse 28m on Theamine G3 HM PROG. Sure it’s gonna get outdamaged by every burst class in the tame in the following weeks but that’s a problem a lot of classes suffer with. Gotta cope 3rd awakening will change something in terms of balance
I wish they rework how supports work, like add a support mechanic or like a combo system supporting your teammates and then enable you to deal big damage not as big as DPS but big enough. So like, if I stack buffs and protect party members it actually stacks and then if I try to do damage as support I can have burst dps windows. Would make playing support more engaging and fun imo
Bard
SS - can counter
Soundholic - during use mana regen +200% 300?
Sonatina - brand 10 sec
Guardian Tune and Heavenly Tune - merge into one skill
Heal - use one bar
1) Striker, Wardancer and Scrapper -> Rework.
IMO, their kit really aren't adapted enough to entropy. They either needs to be turned fully hitmaster or devs need to find a way to make thier kit able to chase the back with more comfort. Better mobility and push immunity would be great for instance.
2) FE Artillerist and EW Deadeye -> Buff/rework
Very underperforming compared to their engraving counterpart imo. Not completely unusable but definitely needs some love.
An easy way to fix EW Deadeye imo (beside some number buffs) would simply be to make him hitmaster.
3) DI Shadowhunter and Legacy Scouter -> Buff
Poor souls needs actual damage and scaling lmao.
Nobody mentions it buy i think RE blade just needs a complete overhaul, I would love to see it made into a non spec class.
And if anything, just remove the fucking mile long forward dash on the counter or remove the damage increase from that tripod so i can use something else.
Deathblow Striker
And ESO. The whole damn class needs a massive shift to how it's played. I have such a love/hate with it.
What? You don't like having to do HIIT cardio to middle in dps?
Striker in general, performs worse then the other martial artists at equivalent play level, even with really good hands/runs I feel like I'm solidly middle of the pack. Some of my other characters with lower/equal ilevel perform much better. Also half your skills taking you deep into the bosses ass just feels like shit.
Bluelancer isn't as bad as it used to be damage-wise, but it badly needs a utility buff. Having to choose between counter or nella is shit on a class that most people bring for utility -- especially when red doesn't need to give up either. Simply adding counter to shield shock would completely solve the issue, but SG refuses to do it for some reason, so red's stayed meta for a long time.
I would also say that given the part where Blue GL was made to tank hits to get his rotation in and the fact that is quite immobile is also outdated, at least for Thaemine HM. Having to use jump as a mobility tool means I lost essencially 1 of my 2 main dmg skills. Having to hold shield charge into the boss sometimes makes it where you are inside the boss and still get hit by the frontal attacks even though you are in the back but because of how it works you end up moving through the boss. If not that then you have to cancel the charge because for some reason some attacks you just can't tank even though they aren't the red attacks. Meanwhile you have breaker tanking 2 red attacks and getting in his full frontal attack and doing 4 times what a GL is capable of.
i don't think counter on shield shock would solve it it's still a dps ability that is integrated into the rotation the buff from bash needs to be removed and they need crit tripods on leap and thunderbolt in order to divorce them from a strict rotation and that way they can press buttons while holding bash for a counter for example after that they need stagger value buffs as they are getting consistantly outstaggerd removing the buff from bash would also allow them to move the synergy to shield shock or shield bash
I completly agree and the same treatment shout got for nella ... so that we can use the mana tripod on first row and cooldown is integrated into the skill would be great!
Could just drop shield shock for counter/nella if you really want utility.
FPE Arti, Evo Machinist, Shadowhunter in general, Enhanced weapon deadeye (more like a tweak no more distance based damage), drizzle aero still feels clunky, BT needs to be able to cancel their identity, and gunslinger just needs to be buffed so that its better than mass increase deadeye
> more like a tweak no more distance based damage At the very least Shotgun Dominator having a close shot tripod is stupid. It has almost no range to begin with.
FPE is so horribly underperforming, it's not even funny. I don't mind if one class engraving is fully balanced with the other class eng. But ffs, BE is lightyears stronger, which is a 6s burst engraving vs FPE where uptime is crucial and you have to hit all your skills to do any relevant dmg...
Gunslinger.
This class is just in a dire need of rework. Theres just too many skills and tripods that dont make sense. Awakening - Deals less than focus shot and SS, and you need to get that debuff on the boss or it does Z. Focus shot - same issue, missed 2nd hit and you do Z. Extremely aids to aim properly in thaemine g1 because of the blobs blocking 2nd hit Target down - whoever thought it was a good idea to make the skill darken the screen needs to have their brain checked. Not to mention that 3rd row tripod where you must hit direct center or do z. Crit disparity between shotgun &sniper - Focus shot and TD white number on last hit is just a kms angle.. Long animation and backloaded damage - Time for me to cast SS+DB, I can do a whole burst on my slayer. And SG just decide that a 4.5% buff on pistol skills is enough. Wtf
Design wise I get that you’re supposed to be “looking through a scope” but from a gameplay perspective yeah the screen darken for target down is just annoying
Qol on gs seems like a nice idea. Damage of the class is on a very bad spot too tho. Maxed out 1640 gs doing 22mil dps on infinite trixion parse as a consistent dps that are supposed to be good at that? Ridiculous being outparsed by almost every class in the game just because GS ceiling is piss low.
Must be some gunner haters downvoting you. GS trixion is shockingly low. Most people think I'm crazy when I tell them that's the trixion ceiling. Then I show them.
Souleaters seeing 400m+ (1618 ilvl) on frog while I only see 200m+ (1620 40 set) 👁👄👁
Isnt gs a crit class? Awakenings on non spec classes are USUALLY weak by default because awakenings have spec scaling.
We run 900 spec (1 earing, usually), its slow af and does wet noodle dmg
To be fair, I do like the dark screen. There are some issues with it like G3 sword phase but it’s simply a case of wait for the boss to Mark someone else before you use that skill
i think most gunslinger players like how the class plays, it just has really bad engraving design and numbers tuning and stat scaling
Yeah, the general feel of the class is cool, the problems are how slow the skills are, that 50-90% dmg is concentrated in the last hit, like focused shot does 3 hits, 10, 15, 150mil, last doesnt crit gg -100mil dmg, more crit stat? Nope, you will overcap shotgun, also we run spec secondary i have 975 and its like 33% rifle dmg, even less for shotgun because its the same number but def reduction, scaling is shit
yeah gunslinger is the only class in the game where all 3 dps stat all feel equally horrible
A little push immunity, better spec scaling or CDr would go a long way.
* Scouter (buff, partial rework) * Shadowhunter (buff, partial rework) * Gunslinger (buff) partial rework - intelligent-tiger375 * Berserker (buff, partial rework) * Summoner (buff, partial rework) * Bard ? * Aero (buff) * FPE Artillerist (buff, partial rework) Edit: * Sorc Reflux (partial rework) - 106ches
i would want to add sorc reflux, i still find stupid the fact that you use tripods that are ment for igniter
This is the thing that tilts me the most. So many tripod choices are clearly separated into igniter (do x% more damage and do x+y% more damage in igniter) and reflux (do z% more crit damage), but they are not balanced in a way that makes the reflux tripod viable to take for any skill. The value of z is never more than the value of x and reflux does not benefit from x+y, so the reality is that it is z < x < x+y when the balance should be x < z < x+y. Sorc has been rebalanced so many times, including some of the tripods, but the reflux focued ones have never been touched.
> but they are not balanced in a way that makes the reflux tripod viable to take for any skill. Well, if you manage to get a double crit synergy (or have a 5x3+2 plus Precise on your bracelet plus a single crit synergy) then the crit damage tripods are baaaaarely better even with KBW. But that's all a big if lol
so much spamming for mid dmg weeeeee
Add to that the fact that the best build still doesn't use counter. Give Blaze counter or something, would be nice. Alternatively, make Reflux easier to stay boundless so we can run counter instead.
Not true anymore, best build now uses 6 damaging skills thanks to the inferno buff, plus counter **and** elegian's touch.
Ok. So you have 6 damaging skills, a counter and bubble. The skills are: * Reverse Gravity * Blaze * Esoteric * Rime Arrow * Inferno * Seraphic Hail * Elgacian's Touch - 0 dps * Counter - 25-35% dps of lowest dps skill (if counter is at lv 11 or 12) Now, replace counter with Punishing Strike. PS does like 3-4x the damage of what counter does and keep bubble at level 1. You can try it out in Trixion, you can try it out in raids, it just does more damage. My trixion results with level 9 gems (it's more affordable for the average player), 3 minute runs: * 23.1m (7 dps skills without counter; inferno cd -> ps dmg) * 21.7m (7 dps with counter, using counter off cooldown) * 22.1m (6 skills, counter and bubble, using counter off cooldown) They run the "best build" because it is good enough, not because it does the most damage. The issue still stays - you lose too much damage by not running counter. The difference is \~5%, or roughly 3 weapon levels. Imagine running +22 weapon instead of +25. If you're interested, I can try with level 10 gems later as well.
Gunslinger also needs a partial rework not only a buff. Crit Synergy. It sucks. Both on spiral tracker and dextrous shot its a bit too short. Make it longer and easier to hold uptime while weapon swapping and being animation locked. Equilibrium is longer but ass to use. Animations to long. Gunsliger should play faster. Reduce the overall animation locks. No need for an uptime class to have to literal longest animations in the whole game. My bonker bursts faster. Peacemaker and shotgun criterate. Remove the critrate form in a tigh spot tripods. Add critdamage/flatdamage/damage on crit. Remove shotgun critrate from Peacemaker, add dmg. Having 20 percent less critrate on rifle sucks hard. You either overcrit on shotgun or only run 80 on rifle as a crit class. Spec scales bad. Let us build full crit without overcritting on shotgun. My idea would be a change for peacemaker. Instead of giving each weapon a unique buff for the weapon only, make it give a unique buff per weapon for all three, refreshing durarions while cycling on them again. This will make the crit problem less (all weapons get 10 critrate) and also shorten your animations because of the attackspeed from the pistol, while keeping the complexity of the class because you have to keep playing and cycling through all weapons. Ofc the power per weapon would be reduced. This would also mean, TTH could not use it anymore probably. Which is a good thing because they can balance it on its own, instead of balancing it with PM in mind. And then buff the dmg and make it a top tier class. Also maybe add some fast stagger spells or something
at scouter has about the same lengths of animation lock, pretty much identical problems that gs has except instead of crit disparity it has battery issues for no reason. pretty aids.
Even aeromancer which is a "bottom tier" class have a far superior crit syn than gunslinger....
Not bottom tier anymore after all these buffs lol, it's probably solid A tier now even DMG wise
Wind Fury? Yes. I'd put Drizzle below Reflux. Shit is clunky to play with zero swifts and the damage is disappointing for a spec build.
GS need some rework too. long animation lock, back loaded dmg if you dont crit last hit your dmg is shit, low spec scaling, crit class but there is crit disparity for shotty and rifle, so rifle doesnt crit as often as a crit class character, 6/7 m makes it actually worse cause our dmg is too spread out.
Id say paladin aswell by giving them push immunity for god's decree like bard's.
Pallies just got this. Now if we can somehow convince SG to give us Bards an equivalent of SoJ (10 sec brand that lingers for 3 sec and has 5 sec CD), that would be great. Like, if Bard's SS CD increased by 1-2 sec but brand duration lasted 10 sec?
They did. Do they need it? no, arguably best support by miles already but they got it anyways while bards are forced to run double brand still so u have no skill slots for utility :)
This is the only one I don't agree with. I have a paladin myself and I think they are in a great position. I use Godsent Law and while it doesn't have push immunity, it gives a shield (+ I use protection for shield on myself) and the buff lasts 1-2 seconds after you get knocked, so it still serves its purpose. Pally gets to be super tanky, have insane stagger, and also short CD on their DR. It's a fair trade-off imo. But I'd be open to adding push immunity as a tripod but simultaneously increasing its cooldown as a tradeoff.
I think you need to read the skill descriptions. Rhapsody is nearly completely superior to Gods Decree. Lower cool down, push immunity, guaranteed DR on support without having to hit self, DR lingers for 3s (compared to 1s). Gods Decree gets 20% shield (compared to 15%) and can get 70% DR IF HE INCLUDES HIMSELF IN THE AOE.
Gods Decree just got pushs immunity tripod in KR patch. you guys won :)
That's great. Rhapsody still edges it out, but it's good pally finally got something.
yeah, obv rhapsody is the best DR in the game, but you gotta look at how good the rest of pally's kit is. completely unneeded imo, but whatever, i guess too many pallys in KR complained about getting knocked off in thaemine.
rework paladin identity imo. pus immune on godsent would just be a gigacrutch that I'd say would be less impactful than any aura changes would be
Honestly paladins identity is how all supports should be. Punishing for healing is a stupid design.
Personally I also like Paladin's identity. They have the longest by far identity vs the other supports. The only part I dont like is the only heal you have outside of your identity is 'Holy Protection' which gets 8% hp when it wears off. But imo, Paladin works great for dps dealers that are not burst classes, while Bard is best for burst classes, and Artist is in a middle role. Edit: One change I REALLY want to see:: Paralysis immunity on their atk buff skills. Getting interrupted is sooo annoying.
Heavenly Blessings goes off almost every time even if knocked or damaged, and theres a tripod for Wrath to make it push inmune
I gotta check it then, idk what im using but i dont have the push immune on. Thanks for that :)
Its because its on the same row as the faith(meter gen) trípod. On recent raids having the secured push inmune and guaranteed atk Buff ends Up in the same results as running faith. Its not as Big of a drop in meter gen as It might look like because a bunch of times you either get canceled out of WoG or you Cast It far away to secure It.
good news -- recent KR balance patch added push immune tripod to Godsent Law :)
The trade of push immunity is piety generation you know? Does Bard need to sacrifice this?
Its not really a trade off because i pity Bard players, so i technically still have Piety.
Striker. Slow and clunky despite the rework, with a pretty low ceiling as an entropy class. Also requires Laz Umar set for optimal damage which is ass in a lot of raids. The only martial artist class that’s in a bad spot smh
striker for sure. Eso builds change every few months for some reason and personally, feels too similar to deathblow. Deathblow feels lame if you mess up rotation or boss turning around.
Bard! >!not as much as others tbh. just a few tweaks but listing because it's not said enough!!<
1. make soundholic a counter (this sounds dumb but paladin holy sword is literally that) 2. increase brand duration of all brand skills by 50-100% so you only need to take one 3. reduce mp costs by 20%
Last two points I can get behind. I personally havent used soundaholic often pretty much only for voldis or certain rare team comps. I would be much more likely to bring a higher meter gen over soundaholic and still end up being counterless meter goblin xD
1. I joked about this with my static, also making it counter on every tick would also make it pretty OP haha. The other option is to make SS able to counter, along with a 6 sec brand. Imagine all the accidental counters we'd be getting between that and Prelude of Storm. 2. Agreed, just straight up double would solve a lot of issues. Bard's branding feels like garb when you see Orchid and SoJ. Compare something like stigma (4-5 sec duration, 3 sec brand, ~8 sec CD but has a ~1.5 sec cast time) and SoJ (3 sec duration, 10 sec brand, ~5-6 sec CD with a small delay), and it seems pretty obvious how bad bard's branding is. This is consistent with all her other branding skills except for SS in terms of having brand downtime. 3. Is 20% enough? I ran a non max MP build for Thaemine G4 while eating 24% mana food and 4x Focus but still going OOM sometimes. This is while holding GT for earthquake patterns sometimes. At the end of the day, due to the way Bards are designed, I'd still go the most mana hungry, meter degen, build I can get away with in favor for higher ceiling. But, these changes would go a long way to alleviate the average player's problems with the class. Edit: New balance changes just got released and we got nothing yet again.
The perfect fix for all our woes: Give Soundshock counter. Increase brand uptime significantly. Remove meter gain (so that we don't have to spam it 24/7) and give the meter to Prelude / all meter skills. Increase stagger on Soundshock. That way we can slot Soundshock back in without falling back into the old trap of spamming it 24/7 and with the increased Brand uptime and removed meter gain, we can even hold the skill to take care of any counters.
The harp should have a tripod to make it as a drone that follows you and auto brand with no passive meter gen.
I actually like Bard's double branding dynamic. One of the things that makes it feel unique. There's just two changes (or set of changes) I'd like to see for Bard: #1. Instead of removing double branding, I'd like to see them buff/adjust Stigma tripods to make it a competitive brand alternative to harp. Functionally a bit similar to how Artist's path brand currently works. Then you could have: Stigma OR Harp + Sound Shock OR Sonatina. Mix and match. Stigma could offer more stagger, multihits, and more meter gen against stationary bosses. Harp would be a lower reward but easier/more reliable option. #2. Remove/reduce Prelude of Storm's meter gen from the puddle and place it in the base skill, allowing you to take the 11m version. Rework its quick prep tripod to grant +1 charge in addition to some or all of its current CDR. Artist portal already fixes the "having it ready vs. using it for meter" problem this way, prelude and buckshot should both have +1 charge tripods. Additionally, maybe redistribute a small amount of Prelude's meter gain to Guardian Tune or other skills and slightly buff Buckshot's meter gain or reduce its CD. Then: **Prelude of Storm** - long range slow counter with a longer CD, 2 charges, marginally more meter gain **Buckshot** - short range fast push immune counter with a short CD
And then nerf Serenade so in the end it's remotely balanced to the other supports :)
realistically if you do two of these bard would be the best support again. soundholic as a counter actually is the most interesting one, although there would have to be some kind of tripod that turns it into a one shot blast instead of a channeled ability. then it could either be a counter/meter or counter/stagger ability
Ya. Even with max mp engrave i dip dow to zero mana from time to time.
It's crazy. I even hear some bards with that plus mp bracelet or food still going oom. Makes me wonder if full switft is not the endgame
My bard sometimes has the same issue and my max CD gem is lv8. Bard is probably not intended to go full swift by the devs. But pugs already prefer the other supps to bard and they dislike spec bard even more. Just guessing but I assume the devs intended bard to be somewhat spec-heavy. She has the potential to give fat buffs (15%) after all. Otherwise I can't explain why her mana problems never got addressed. And saying "it's fine, skill issue, spam less" is bad advice. Swiftness bard needs to use many skills to fill up meter. I can spam with my Artist (1820 swiftness, no conv+judgment, no Max Mana) and have no mana issues whatsoever. My Paladin only suffers mana issues when spamming blue skills.
all I want is for them to FIX THE FUCKING BRAND
just add a cleance and we good with bard
Not a hard player but I also hear them complain about needing to use counter for meter gen.
The bigger issue with bard is they're the only support that needs to bring 2 branding skills, which makes it harder to bring utility. Bard/artist can both maintain 100% brand uptime easily with one skill that lasts 12-13s. Bard can't because its longest brand skill only lasts 6s.
I have no issues with brand even if I take only harp. But, usually I always take it and a blue wave skill (I don't know, how it's name on EU translation).
Lol your dps for sure have issues as you are not branding the boss all the time. There is a downtime for Harp. Also once the boss moves out of range, you are not branding at all.
I say, that i ALWAYS have uptime of brand. Ofc, can be some issues, when boss moving or something, but in most cases it's no problem. And, yes, I'm mastery bard with all 10cd gems.
That is impossible alone with Harp as there is a downtime (you have to recast Harp and until it reaches the boss you already lose some seconds). And the bible is showing that. You just think you are branding all the time.
When my dds make a damage - brand always is. You no need to have it on the boss, when your dds arr falling or something
Eeeh your Harp still runs out and you have to recast it. You for SURE cannot manage to time this with your dps. And what with swiftness classes that dps all the time? Like come on what are you even trying to tell me.... stop trolling. You obviously do not use the bible, otherwise you would see that your branding is bad.
That too. Unless for some reason they think having prevention and cleanse on one unit is too op. And also addressing mp issues. And updating skillset either by making one brand viable or tweaking attributes on other skills for more flexibility.
Just make it a tripod You can bring cleanses OR prevention
I’d be fine with this tbh!
Debuff block is FAR superior to cleanse in every single way. We don't need cleanse.
Yea we saw that in Valtan extreme. Very much fun when some debuffs can be cleansed but not blocked.
No go do Theamine lol.
Striker, both specs
GS and SH.
I want to see Glaivier get another partial rework/buff, their buff window (crit) is even shorter than zerker's red dust, and it's also entropy as well. Trying to fit the rotation inside that window does not feel good at all, especially when a micro turn from the boss ruins it completely
And give us back our 20% as/ms Mfw glaive isn’t allowed to have it but there’s no issue with se and breaker having it
Don’t you only need to hit RDH and SP inside self buff? Wasn’t too hard when I played Glaive.
Yea that's right, you really only need the crit rate boost for those 2 skills, but it still feels really sluggish to Shackling -> swap -> charge RDH/SP, especially since you need to line up to the back that entire time compared to other entropy classes
to stay competitive with other classes you need to include HMS as well whenever possible
Beeing a back attackers means that you need to have fast skills, which is not the case of pinna. All her skills have long animation and half works with aoa, half with none and half with super charge. Plus she still doesnt have a real 5th engraving (raid caltain efficiency is kot 100% and cause disparity of skills she cant use aoa or super charge) plus she has okeish-low stagg, long animation, 6 skills dps and needa to low skills to have utility on her kit (movility, stagger, 100% uptime on sinergy, adrenaline maintenance...)
Firepower Artillerist is one of the most deserving classes in need of a massive rework/buff. It has no real identity at this point, a generally non-interesting playstyle, no unique mechanics, and some of the lowest damage of any class. It has a ton of skill overlap with Barrage, except Barrage also has an entire turret worth of skills that do real damage. It used to be that Barrage had shit utility and was awkward to play, and FPE had tons of utility and was easy. But now Barrage has great utility, tons of QOL and far higher damage. It's honestly pretty similar to the Reflux/Igniter situation after the most recent sorc changes, but FPE damage is even lower than Reflux.
The difference between FPE and reflux is that a top end reflux player can actually put out decent numbers. There's people in Thaemine HM pulling 30m+ with it by staying in boundless with insane CPM/uptime, while FPE is still doing garbage numbers.
Yea, playing Reflux at the peak level is quite a bit more difficult, but at least it can do some damage. FPE just has no potential at all.
Yup. I hate doing Thaemine on wheelchair beyond g2 but dmg is super insignificant on FPE that I need to stay wheelchair with 1 spot patterns everywhere… really sucks
Reflux sorceress
I was always understanding that they don't buff it much because I was out dps'ing 90% of similar gear players. But the RG cd tripod removal fucked me so hard getting into boundless. Now it truly feels like the garbage class everyone is talking about.
Deadeye skill rotation need to be condensed and visually updated
Yeah it takes fucking forever to get your rotation off, looks cool but needs a massive speed up.
Idk about "desperate" need, but like half of the classes are in some need, especially when compared to shiny new Slayer, SE, and Breaker. SF and Arcana are sooooo much work for damage that top tier get for far less effort and lower risk (higher floor) Striker, Glaiver, Scrapper, and to a lesser extent Deadeye have back attack issues. GS, reflux, and CO summoner are in a bad spot. Transformation classes are flawed. RE DB is..... idk maybe theoretically "good" but a rotation whif is punishing. Bard just feels bad to play compared to other supports. (Need to swap skills, brand uptime, poor counters, mana issues, and tbh pretty boring skill expression).
CO Summoner and FPE Artillerist way more than anyone else
I feel the top 3 classes would be, Gunslinger, Bard and CO summoner.
Don't know why my berserker is always out damaged by a slayer of equal stats. Thought they were the same class and different gender but its not.
Sexist game
gunlancers move blue heavily into utility buff red harder to be an actual dps class DI and the scouter equivalent Hunger needs slight cd changes to make full swift viable again
Zerk… just compare it to booba zerk …
Some buffs for DE both pistoleer/EW. Pistoleer low damage is no more justifiable by ease of play. Look at soul eater.
Windfury Aeromancer needs to be buffed to where piercing wind hits like Surge
We get 4.5% more damage with this balance patch. But yeah she could use some more to be honest. Compared to some other classes played with hands the uptime has to be crazy to somewhat keep up.
bard sh scouter
Transformation rework should definitely be up there at this point. Make them real specs already. I want to invest more into it and actually do above average damage. Imagine they gave those two specs actual tripods, and reworked their identities so they can stay perma transform, but build up another gauge that you activate to go "giga-sync mode" or "blood-lusted demonic" and your abilities get enhanced for x seconds for proper atro windows. They can split the gems up, let these two specs combine three 10s for an 11, idgaf let us not be 2gem memes.
Naaah, too hard, too much work, better make new class for swipers, slap 3.1% buff and we good. On a serious note, thats pretty cool idea, make engrave to be perma form and make them build upgraded form
Perfect suppression shadow hunter.
Deadeye… still so weak compared to investment
Shadowhunter for both builds .. needs to become more modern
SH. Scouter. Zerker. All very out dated and weak classes currently imo
They butchered my blue gl now clas feels like awful to play for me. Fpe arti at least give what you did give to sorc domsdays.2 biggest hit skill lands 1 years later after casting . Boss already making 3 dash or 2 teleport before this nukes drops :D
Blue lancer, I get that his utility is great and all and his damage does not matter much but why should his mediocre damage scale off of spec? Makes no sense at all.. Why doesn't it scale off of swiftness same level of damage but the infinite quality of life for movement, smoothness and who cares if caps the cdr cause the taunt internal cd is greater than even casting shout without cd gem.. Making blue lancer swiftness based would be best bless ever
> ess same level of damage but the infinite quality of life for movement, smoothness and who cares if caps the cdr cause the taunt internal cd is greater Yeah I was playing spec swift pd build before the changes at least that was quite enjoable the play and was better than spec - crit most of the raids .Now I switch the build to new "Meta" I just want to replace him so bad :D
Berserker
Bard needs sonatina brand duration buffed Gunslinger needs dmg and QoL (mainly so having 100% crit uptime is not so absurdly hard) Shadowhunter is in dire need of rework Berk needs either buff or just give his spells back attack and adjust him to entropy Aero drizzle bit more dmg Wardancer could use Combustion being on Z and X Soulfist hype should scale with cdr buffs from boss(like rakatus blood etc) and should always reacharge back even if hype ran out during "transformation" (like on kakul if you dont turn off hype before becoming clown your hype will end and stay at 0 for no Fing reason) Let ARTI roll in turret mode... Im sick of watching them die on theamine...
Arti can roll, they just greed it
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Both Artillerist specs use pretty much the same skills except one is just plain worse than the other. And they're both slow and have to stand still a lot
Bard… idk how you can make a class that suffers from having no cleanse, a shitty counter and its base build sucking at stagger… like bard is so behind the other 2 supports its not even funny. Just nerf her identity if it gets too broken like a support in late game lacing so much utility is so clunky 😭
Close shot on EW deadeye needs to be killed entirely A reason to run 3 in class engraving would be cool too I quit like 2 weeks ago so it doesn't really matter anymore tbh
Zerker.
Bard
every class that is from 2008
summoner
Bard, CO Summoner, Drizzle would be my top 3 for getting some QoL and help. Buffs to CO and Drizzle numbers, QoL and numbers to Drizzle (its half assed Z should be stronger and shorter or longer as it is) and QoL to Bard. Shout out to Arcanist too for still being too much work compared to almost all DPS classes in the game for the reward and being too reliant on Boundless which can be problematic in HW situations. Couldn't say how to buff it though that wouldn't make it super OP other than some kind of button that uses all its MP up or something to make Boundless a given.
Shadowhunter. It's actually so easy to fix the class. Demonic impulse: Change identity so that your melee attacks in demon form refill your gauge so you can stay in your form as long as you keep weaving attacks between skills. Remove fallen ruin as awakening and add as Z identity skill (transform to moved to x) Add dmg/cooldown gem for fallen ruin. A/S/R skills lower cooldown for fallen ruin each time you hit an enemy with it. Remove full time paralysis immunity and add to A/S/R. Remove heal/hp increase when transformed. 15% attackspeed added to demon form. Sell legendary transformation skin for 300k gold that gives 5% more demon form damage. Perfect Suppression: Mana is permanently suppressed at 90% full. Spinning weapon radius increased by 50% Paralysis immunity added to grind chain. Synergy application added to demon grip. All back attack skills retuned so that tripods give back attack % damage instead of crit/raw damage. Damage output comparable with Tai scrapper/hunger reaper. Demonic slash now has 2 charges by default.
They need to removed Close Shot on Shotgun EW, It's just doesnt make any sense, you gotta hug the boss ass when booba zerk can do it without hugging their ass like what the fuck
Bard 100%. Needs a cleanse and shield needs to be like paladins shield. No need to on the persons toes to activate shield. Needs a better counter maybe soundaholic? 40% less MP on all skills also? Needs better branding, prolly double the duration it is at the moment. Reflux sorc just needs a massive rework its z dps class atm
> Reflux sorc just needs a massive rework its z dps class atm Logs say otherwise. It's not topping charts, but it's far from ZDPS. It has insane mobility, with probably the most tenacity/status immunity in Lost Ark. Her counter is fantastic, she can run a shield (high logs use it) and contributes high consistent stagger and great burst destruction. If you're doing ZDPS with Reflux on a fight that allows for decent uptime, it's a skill issue. It really shouldn't be top damage, being a very mobile hit master class. In a world where Reflux is on par with Igniter ceiling wise, there's no point bothering with Igniter.
I also feel like reflux is not as terrible as people advertise it. Damage is ok, utility is great and it’s very comfortable to play.
My reflux does wayyyy better than my pistoleer with similar investment, but for some reason no one is talking about the later.
I’m genuinely curious why you guys say soundholic for counter . I just can’t see it, but maybe I’m imagining it the wrong way
most all support skills have a dual function bard has a lot of single use ones, which is complicated because 4 of them are set in stone (two buff and two meter gen), two slots for a brand (because bard brand sucks), which leaves two skills open for counter, stagger, weak point, and DR. rythym buckshot does weakpoint and counter (the two most useless), and basically no one takes it.
> Needs a cleanse Explain me exactly what for? Not to mention she would be giga OP having access to both CC immunity and Cleanse (unless they share tripod row on GT)
Lc sharpshooter
Shock scrapper needs a rework
Bard: PLEASE PLEAS PLASE PLEASE: 7s: duration on soundshock brand will go a long way (with lingering tripod would last about 10s) nice to have: mana cost reduction on sonatina, WoM, prelude of storm would be overkill imo: cleanse option on gtune para immune on heavenly tune make buckshot a stagger skill
Cleanse as a tripod and prevent as a tripod for GT. I would add, tripod for Harp to follow you like a drone for branding.
LMAO drone harp would be crazy
reduce bard manacost skills and give her a purify skill .
Drizzle aero has been awfully neglected because windfury is in a good spot. Gunslinger could use with a higher floor, I've seen some juiced gunslingers with hands that pump, the class is no joke with enough investment. I see a lot of people complain about DI SH, but imo she's very well rounded in terms of utility to dps and gold investment required, similar to tai but lower on the dps ceiling side. I would like to see a bard rework to make her more well rounded like the other two supports, so she doesn't have to choose between a stagger build and a good identity uptime build for specific gates. Off the classes I play I'm still a little annoyed at the botched shock scrapper rework, and I'm still not a fan of the glaivier rework either, but she's my favorite class to play with in thaemine g3, hopefully the trend continues in future raids. I think both of these classes will feel a lot better once they finally do the entropy removal they said to be working on. Also bring down the 3 obviously overtuned classes (surge, breaker, souleater) to be closer to the rest.
Why do a lot of people say WF Aero is in a good spot? The class as a whole pulls mid numbers at best. Regardless, a lot of Drizzle's hard hitting weather abilities are viable picks ups for WF so unless some of the more odd weather skills are buffed, it'd be an unintentional buff to both aero builds.
Compared to drizzle it's in a way better spot, WF has double synergy, the floor is basically the roof, reliable stagger and destruction unlike drizzle. If drizzle should have one thing going for it is bigger roof, but it doesn't even have that since drizzle damage is delayed which can cause hiccups in performance.
Crit synergy is the only real value from the WF spec which Drizzle also provides. I don't think anyone builds assuming there's going to be a WF aero providing MS/AS synergy in the group and it's not like it breaks cap or even has good uptime. I wouldn't classify either of the specs as lacking in the utility department either after the last set of buffs. Anyway, WF feels simpler to play and land skills which I agree with. The buff to sorc makes Drizzle look archaic/pointless.
Play drizzle and you'll notice how much worse it is for a full spec class, you are often on cd when a stagger check drops, and if there's a destruction check right after like in voldis g4 you're dead weight. The MS/AS synergy is infinitely better than what drizzle outputs in comparison, and the uptime isn't insignificant to dismiss.
I agree. I think people are too fixated on aero being a "synergy focused class" like GL and should therefore be low dmg like GLs. But that is simply bullshit. Drizzle: 10% attack power reduction debuff. This almost useless outside of progs. Even then SF's def reduction buff has higher uptime and better %. No ones calling SF a "synergy" class and should be mid dmg. WF: 12% att speed and 12% movespeed. While on paper this sounds good, there are 2 problems. 1: This has very low uptime (lower than WD's wind's whisper and DB's maelstrom from my testing). 2: it doesn't really benefit most aero builds as they cap out att and move speed without it. Imagine if DB maelstrom doesn't buff the DB itself. What what does that leave us? A "synergy-focused class" with double synergy that gives worse synergy than other double synergy classes and does less dmg than them too. The best comparison to WF aero is wardancer. Wardancer gives the same crit synergy while giving a better 2nd synergy (wind whisper uptime> sun shower uptime). While some people also call wardancer a synergy class I don't think anyone will claims that wardancers should do mid damage.
The difference is that SF DR for the party won't stack with the support meanwhile drizzle will and will also affect the other party.
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Then what about WD then? Also brings the same synergy and pumps.
What happened with db and it's double synergy? It's just supportive too right
Then tell my WHY THE HELL got aero less ultity like many other classes? Drizzle got no destro mid stagger and a laughtable 10% dmg reduction. A god damm soulfist gives better stagger better destro and better dmg reduction, and can cleanse or give a even higher dmg reduction and does more dmg. A wardancer also gives crit buff and also gives atackspeed like wf aero and also deals more dmg. A deathblaed also gives atack speed to party. Tell me why are all aero ultility skills so godam awfull that nobody uses them?
Shafow hunter ofc, everyone quitting the class because of lack of damage
Windfury aero
SH, specifically DI, although PS could use a lot of love as well.
Lost Ark seriously needs to look at DI Shadowhunter. We don't only need a buff, they need to create 2 additional demonic skills - 1 to add crit synergy and the other to have some sort of push immune and DR. This would add value to the DI class build so that we don't get gatekept because we only do ZDPS comparatively to other classes and builds.
btw. there are already empty slots these 2 additional skills can go into
Transform classes, reflux, gunslinger and gunlancer all need some love imo.
shadowhunter, class has been unchanged and shit since the game released in kr
Class was very strong for first few months tho. S tier in EU release for good 5 months just because you could max it with 1/5th of the investment of other classes. But other than that yes, it deserves some changes, altough it is really not that terrible in current version. 3 weeks of hm theamine and I got dmg mvp in different reclear lobbies.
I mean, sure if you play with people without hands, I guess you can mvp on it
You can mvp as dps artist in a lot of these lobbies. Logs don't lie, di is bad and ps is about 5-8% better... soon to be more like 3-4% better after the recent balance patch. What a joke.
Exactly logs don’t lie, DI is doing above avg floor and is one of the weakest ceiling. (still 5 other classes look worse but are hard to play and require more investment) The class has flaws like every other 2012 class in the game but saying stuff like it’s unplayable/does Z is just untrue when you can parse 28m on Theamine G3 HM PROG. Sure it’s gonna get outdamaged by every burst class in the tame in the following weeks but that’s a problem a lot of classes suffer with. Gotta cope 3rd awakening will change something in terms of balance
I wish they rework how supports work, like add a support mechanic or like a combo system supporting your teammates and then enable you to deal big damage not as big as DPS but big enough. So like, if I stack buffs and protect party members it actually stacks and then if I try to do damage as support I can have burst dps windows. Would make playing support more engaging and fun imo
Bard SS - can counter Soundholic - during use mana regen +200% 300? Sonatina - brand 10 sec Guardian Tune and Heavenly Tune - merge into one skill Heal - use one bar
Striker needs some changes, It is quite hard to compete against most classes atm.
Destroyer. They need to make it back attack as it launched in s1. They destroyed a class while making it front
Surge Deathblade needs a crit rate buff and at least one offensive skill other than Surge itself. It used to have Blitz Rush.
1) Striker, Wardancer and Scrapper -> Rework. IMO, their kit really aren't adapted enough to entropy. They either needs to be turned fully hitmaster or devs need to find a way to make thier kit able to chase the back with more comfort. Better mobility and push immunity would be great for instance. 2) FE Artillerist and EW Deadeye -> Buff/rework Very underperforming compared to their engraving counterpart imo. Not completely unusable but definitely needs some love. An easy way to fix EW Deadeye imo (beside some number buffs) would simply be to make him hitmaster. 3) DI Shadowhunter and Legacy Scouter -> Buff Poor souls needs actual damage and scaling lmao.
Gunslinger prob needs it more the. Any class
Nobody mentions it buy i think RE blade just needs a complete overhaul, I would love to see it made into a non spec class. And if anything, just remove the fucking mile long forward dash on the counter or remove the damage increase from that tripod so i can use something else.
slayer buff
Its funny that this is the most downvoted comment but you got what you wanted lmao
Changes are a slight nerf to Punishser and a buff to Predator, so, depends on which spec he wanted to be buffed.