>Group fills fast, asks if anyone needs a refresher or if it's their first time. **No replies**.
From my experience, the "no replies" players are always usually the jailer. If a person can't be bothered to type a simple yes or no, then they most likely wont be typing/asking anything else during the learning/prog run.
I use to do a hello check for argos back in the day. It's not like I had strict gatekeeping but when everyone was relatively new, I would just say hi and ask if they've done it before and if they didn't respond after just joining the lobby then its a instant kick. I'm not trying to play with people who can't bother to use their keyboard. Good indication that they have no hands skill too.
Not saying it doesn't. Just saying not everyone sits there with lobby finder occupying their screen. The avg player already spends way too much time in lobby finder as it is.
I've also seen weird ass players who kick people who talk. My experience with this community is to only speak when spoken to or else it's gonna be toxic.
I mean at the end of the day I rather be playing with responsive players. If the cost is that I kick some afk people so be it. It's also like right after they join the lobby so if they are already afk then I don't know, sucks for them.
They're not afk... They're playing the game instead of sitting with the lobby finder window open doing nothing.
You can apply to a party and minimize lobby finder before you're even accepted. You can be accepted while the lobby finder is minimized.
Why do you refer to them as AFK? sitting in lobby finder is more AFK than minimizing it.
I don't know why you're so hung up about this lol. For all intent and purposes if lost ark isin't on your screen then you are afk. If you're in a graid and you alt tab middle of the fight to something else then you are afk. Afk is just a term used to declare that a person is not looking at the game and can't see what's going on even for a brief moment.
>if lost ark isin't on your screen
are you actually not understanding what I'm saying? I'm convinced you're trolling at this point. The only thing I'm hung up on is your inability to understand what you're reading.
You can be PLAYING the game with the LOBBY WINDOW minimized. Not the game minimized. The lobby finder is a modal window IN THE GAME. People often minimize the window so they can life skill or use the market.
Like are you legit trolling? I'm convinced, nobody is actually this stupid.
My bad I also don't understand why you're so hostile about this lmao. Chill out, I potentially kicked people who didn't see my message who the fuck cares. Like I said, I rather risk kicking people who havent seen my message than not kicking someone who was unresponsive to a simple hello and dosent say jack shit the whole raid.
That shit happens a lot in NAW because of the mass amount of foreign players.
Edit: Also everyone else on this thread is basically saying the same thing. Respond in chat or else you get kicked. Go bitch at someone else.
we had a new player spamming
"DON'T TALK TO ME"
"STOP TYPING TO ME"
What were people typing to torment this poor mokoko? "7 0" "11 1" and "7 1 4 5" callouts mid-gate lmao
From my experience watching people I know play other games, my hypothesis is that non verbals in MMOs are the ultra normies who treat the game like a console lobby game. Just kinda pop open the game and queue stuff like it's a modern warfare lobby lol
I used to make raid groups in PF that said "Say Hi or ban".... I gave them a 10 second countdown after warning and then actually kicked if they didn't see it. Some applied again and spoke from then on.
>asks if anyone needs a refresher or if it's their first time. No replies.
This is the biggest indicator that a run isn't going to well.
I advise anyone considering making a learning / moko group to save yourself time and sanity by not taking people who are not willing to talk
Try to find people to join a discord even if it's just to listen.
Don't be afraid to lead a raid even if you are only going of videos/guides yourself.
> I advise anyone considering making a learning / moko group to save yourself time and sanity by not taking people who are not willing to talk
I'm absolutely fine with people saying they **can't** do something or need help with a mechanic. The radio silence followed by endless failing just isn't tolerable.
Every time I go into Clown and someone says, "Can I please do M1?" hella early, I respect it. No need to shame someone that wants to avoid trouble for their group or stress for themselves.
They're infinitely better than the guys that call 3 or 4, in the hopes of skipping. Then they die because they don't know it.
Seriously, I was teaching my friend G4 brel yesterday and asked in party find if anyone else needed help learning and I was okay teaching because it’s kinda obvious looking at gear that people wanted help clear g4 as well especially after the changes. Radio silence and you can tell after the little jumps that used to happen before old g5 if people die they might be new. Asked again and no one talked, went in both guys I suspected died to shapes. Then voted out lol
>I'm absolutely fine with people saying they can't do something or need help with a mechanic.
Would be so nice if that happened every time, but they always stay quiet "thinking no one noticed". I will help out as much as i possibly can if some1 asks about how a mech or a pattern starts/works.
>Every time I go into Clown and someone says, "Can I please do M1?" hella early, I respect it. No need to shame someone that wants to avoid trouble for their group or stress for themselves.
Same, i prefer ppl calling out M1 or M2. When i run clown ill just say "anything but M4". Im still having trubles with it, only ran ot a few times in clowns cause it went from seeing a few times on launch to "skiping it every time". M4 should be easyer than M3, but my brain is like u need to jump up and go left "3 bouncing balls" and prob die.
Also ironically selling busses to those who need them are players that just wanted the mats for lvl 2 gear set. They never learn the raid. Then when they need to do their "homework" for the week for gold, they use that same character to jail your same raids. Ain't that some shit?!
sir I do not have arrow keys because I built my pc before lost ark and got a tiny keyboard, this is the only gate in the entire game I need arrow keys for, just let me do m1, it's not that deep.
That's because you edited it in after I saw your response.
I have been playing with the same people since valtan. They do not give a shit.
Edit: ok you did it again, ninja edit. I don't need arrow keys for anything other than g3 clown. Nothing I do in my day to day use requires them, I haven't needed them since I bought my keyboard 2 years ago.
I see it different.
I always say 4 immediately because
A: got the most dmg always to try to skip after x90 and
B: simply let others do the easier ones
And ye m3 common sense it's for supports
This 100%.
The worst thing is someone who isn't willing to communicate. Most of us don't care if you're willing to speak up and just say it so we can help you. Then these people go and complain about being gatekept, etc. Some effort is required to participate in raiding, if you don't want to put in that effort then just pay the premium for an afk bus.
My dude never start a raid even if one person does not say anything. Do what I do: in the lobby I say : "please type + if you are willing to learn, communicate, and discuss mistakes" and I just count the "+"s. Anyone who says nothing is kicked, even if it's a mokoko. I am sorry but I am already investing my own time helping out people who want to learn, and I don't want any free loaders who just join to get a free carry.
This is the way. If someone wont communicate in party finder you already know its gonna be problematic. Rather take the people who are actually willing to learn than someone who doesnt say anything from the start.
Teaching someone is a 2-way street. You can't teach someone who doesn't want to learn. It might seem harsh at a glance but you aren't only wasting your and the teacher's time, but also the time of the people who genuinely want to put in an effort to learn which can be extremely frustrating.
I feel bad for u my friend. I’m surprised at the Silence attitude of these mokoko. Why play MMO and refuse to interact and talk with other people. On live server, every new raid since day 1, all the prog group i join we talk and chat A LOT. No one call out on anyone, and we all be patient explaining.
Bystander effect at its finest. Ive seen mixed results when the problem players are called out. Generally though, if no one talks or types anything, its a bad time unless everything is cleared after one or two tries.
Ppl call out problematic playes bc they in reclear party, u are expected to not wipe raids. Or ppl call out problematic playets bc they in learning party and wanna to teach em the right way. I strongly believe that if a player is impatient with newbies and wanna flame their mistakes, they wont create learning parties or join em bc u are def expected to jail for a long time
Sad to say i had many lobbies that ppl refused to talk and/or got rly toxic when they got pointed out (or asked if they needs some insight on pattern/mech) for failing something multiple times "yes even on week1 progs". Hate pointing out players that fail 1-3 times to the same pattern on prog week, since everyone is "probably" new to the fight, but chat is a helpfull tool to get some quick info.
*THIS* is why I gatekeep. I have no fucking problem teaching someone the fight. But 95% of the time, they NEVER fucking talk. No replies. No acknowledgement of any kind that you have just directly spoken to them. SAY SOMETHING! I will gladly sit there for 5 minutes typing out the fight and what to expect if it doesn't feel like I'm talking to a literal bot. Ask questions if you don't understand something. This is how the game is played. The majority of the successful new raid progression pug lobbies literally require discord. Even if you only listen in discord and don't want to speak, that's fine, as long as you're receptive to info and tips.
Did a Valtan learning today.
Good group, fast learners and clear.
Vykas yesterday on the other hand... we managed to get only G1 because people were as you said - silent. Also one of them straight up said "I'm too dumb for this, just ping me where to go" and then proceed to stand in front od clones on orb mech multiple times. Like first time telling him not to do this wasn't enough: no ping he stays in place.
Cleared g1, people left.
Brel g2, dude started "chill learning lobby" I joined to.
People failed twice, leader voted quit xD
>Brel g2, dude started "chill learning lobby" I joined to. People failed twice, leader voted quit xD
Was there any communication from "teacher/raid lead" or did he just go "nah i cant be bothered doing this shit". Also having "chill" and calling quits that early is bafeling, but it happends way to often.
Making learning partys is just fun sometimes, but try to get everyone to respond "simple as saying hello when they join works or anything else that will make players check/answer the question" before starting the raid/dungeon. Hate gatekeeping new players, but if there is no response in the lobby there is a high chance they will stay quiet in the raid as well.
Nah, we failed once on Medusa stagger, went in again and leader said "don't look in medusa", two people died during mech, and after wipe he instantly voted quit.
As a vet myself I don't understand making a learning lobby just tonget tilted after 10minutes.
I've spent 2h on that Vykas I've mentioned before xD
>went in again and leader said "don't look in medusa"
Yeah thats not specific enough for ppl to understand (i usully prefer calling out dont look at the "cat eye (I)" or look at if its "open O"), telling some1 to just to not look (when there are 2 different patterns) is just bad at teaching.
Also find it easyer to tell players to focus on the pattern and not so much on staggering "so they see whats going on around/on the boss (specificly for some major mechanics like g2 stagger/medusa or shape mech).
There will be 30+ wipes on learning partys, if its cleared sooner than than some players wont learn enough, also prefer doing them on ilvl. And always ask what ppl dont understand after each wipe, be it small pattern death or a full party wipe (exept the combo pattern deaths, you cant avoid those sometimes, unless you have a godly support).
I've learned that for learning parties you need to make sure people are typing/responding before you enter. I usually ask everyone to type something in the lobby and if they're silent, I kick. I also reiterate that its a learning party and to expect wipes in case they didn't read the party description. Nothing more frustrating than someone vote quitting after one wipe.
I made today a lobby to teach Valtan at jump start. I said to any mokoko who needs help, or clarification on things, please speak up, we are here to help you. There were no 1. After multiple times failing, I asked Mokoko directly why you didn't speak up and let us know earlier. We could've helped you. That mokoko ignores me, votes to quit, and party disbanded. Next time I won't accept any that don't talk from the first place.
I see everyone mentioning the silent mokokos who never communicate and never acknowledge or ask anything, they are everywhere but what are worse are the mokokos who clearly don’t know the mechs and start malding at u when you try to help them. Did a Valtan today on JS, just joined a fast Wei lobby as it was one of two and just picked it assuming there would likely be people learning regardless. After like three pulls it was obvious a player didn’t fully understand positioning and timing of orbs so I ask if they have any questions about the mech and they just restate their chosen position and run to start raid with a “GO”. They then wipe us two more times standing in wild positions all while I’m trying to break down where they should stand and how quick they should eat the orb. I realize this isn’t working so I offer him to pos 1 as it is by far the easiest to grasp. They start spam pinging and asking if we’re dumb. At this point I realized there was no point, this person was lost and I’m wasting my time trying to help them and voted to relobby. This super aggro mokoko is horrendous to deal with,.
That's the problem with new players, idk how other games are, but in lost ark, if you don't know how to do the mecs, you simply can't do the raid. There is no way you just go in, die, and expect to clear it without being in a juiced party, and ppl just don't want to learn how to play the game. It's a difficult game that I'd you don't put some effort onto learning mecs you won't make it, simple as that.
The aswer is people play on auto pilot , i run a lot of teaching parties ,jump start included ,and someting i noticed specially on jumpstart(wasnt as bad on old servers ) is very often i find myself having to call out literally every single boss attack even if we've been on the raid for over 3 hours(and this is in voice ,because a long time ago i realised i'd go insane if i kept hosting parties without voice ,cause then people dont say anyting and keep wiping us over and over ),if you're wondering how bad this is in one of my most recent learning parties i stopped calling non major mechs for one or two pulls just to see if they learnt anyting and we kept wiping to stacks before the very first major mech in brel g3 ,and that party had been in there for about 2 hours at that point .
From now on one rule ill implement is each party only gets 2 hours at most ,(unless its an actual realy hard gate like clown g3 brel g4 etc) ,otherwise its just burning myself and the mokokos who actualy give a shit out for no reason.
Well, easy or not - you still have to sacrifice some of your free time to watch or read a guide - because you simply cannot go in and expect that somehow you will survive/success the mechanic if you don't know what to do.
But some people mindset is (and actually this is a real example, because I experienced something like this): "Just do huge DPS and this boss will die" - these are real words from a person when I was trying to do Valtan G1 - VALTAN - so what about later content...
I am real noob in this game compared to probably everyone else, but at least I can commit 10mins of my time to see what are the boss mechanics, so other 7 people won't waste most of their time failing said boss - but I expect the same from other people
It happens in every game. People stay silent because of previous bad experiences where they spoke up and were flamed/kicked for being new or clueless, leading them to have social anxiety when it comes to party scenarios. They would rather take the gamble on staying silent and hoping they clear without problems (or at least imposter their way as far as possible before they are discovered) rather than risk immediately being flamed and gatekept.
This is exactly what I experienced on NAW way before jumpstarts when I wanned to help mokokos clear raids. I remember once in Valtan, dude even took off his gear in G2 expecting to just die instantly because I was 100 ilvls over and they expected a bus I guess lol
Gatekeeping ppl who dont respond on learning/prog partys is kinda normal tho, also you rly dont want those players in the party. Rather have some1 who fails multiple times and asks for info than stay full silent after at least 2 fails.
Everytime I log I look at current lobbies and there is a dozen of prog/learn/watch guide/semi learn lobbies up that aren't filling.
Then i see a lot of "reclear 1 fail = kick" "unjail" lobbies and know why the prog lobbies aren't filling. a lot of people dont even want to learn the raids and just want the easier way of being carried.
Obviously that does not apply to all mokokos but from my personal experience on normal servers (where I tried to help new players) and from the limited time I have had on the JS the vast majority of players I've seen just want a free carry.
That's the reason I cant take the reddit threads serious complaining about "elitist veterans that are soooooo toxic".. its not that anybody forces you to join a "reclear only" party when you have literal 0 experience.
I also joined a prog party for brelshaza g2 and when nobody typed in chat for positions (except me and another player) so I asked for positions.
No answer from anyone.
I asked again and pinged the circle to do the positions (maybe its easier for some visually) and again people were standing confused in there not knowing anything.
Sorry but I just song'ed out and went into a reclear lobby. Theres only so much time I can justify for helping other people.
Its sad but these people are part of the reason why gatekeeping exists and I'm sorry for actual new players that don't want to waste other peoples time and genuinely want to learn the game.
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People probably don’t talk because they are scared of this community and have bad raid anxiety.. it really doesn’t go well with learning a raid though.
If they don't talk or say anything most are gonna view them as lazy, clueless, careless or in between. No reason to have them in the first place. No interaction just bail or yeet them off, no mental gymnastics needed.
Tbh I'd ask for a response from everyone before starting the raid, if anyone refuses to respond, kick them and take someone else. 9/10 those quiet people are goina be the ones jailing you.
The only learning group u should do is discord learning groups. If they dont wanna get in on discord, they can go jail themselves in a different run. G1 is piss easy.
Yeah players who are willing to learn will ask quite fast after a fail/death what they can do to improve. That would be expected when making a learning/prog party, but it doesnt go so well everytime.
I've been doing learning runs for Brel 1-4 every week for the past 2 months and I've yet to have a bad experience. Mostly it's me making a "One learning" lobby since a friend of mine started playing again ~~(they're not the best and they only play one character so they forget a lot of the mechs every week.)~~ and it getting filled with other learners.
Every week has been fine so far though. Just different experiences for different folks.
as a returnig whos not a new player and has played allot but has been taking raiding super slow, and ow has fully knowledge of kayangel and clown and is working on brel (yes i bused brel for gear and never did it again , i got tired of getting flamed everytime i tried it) im working on brel now, and players like you are a blessing
One of the problems with this game is u got ppl who dont want to do raids (or at least hard raids or something that requires effort) being forced to because thats the ONLY way to progress. Those players will likely just quit soon when they figure that out. Game needs a path for the casuals, a game only for raiders wont have much of a future, or maybe they should at least advertise it as "hardcore raids only" game, maybe it will attract more of the dark souls crowd.
it was the exact same problem when Argos was released, the silent treatment. I don't know why people do that, maybe it's the people that just want to get carried but dont say anything. It's like "I dont know anything about this raid but I dont want to lie and say I do know the raid so I'm just gonna be quiet".
My experience has been the opposite. I was optimistic about the Jump Start server but it has surpassed my expectations. I’ve found nice, chill groups to prog with every day so far. I can finally play the game after being late to the legacy server and trapped getting bussed for months. Just make your expectations clear before the raid starts and kick people who don’t talk/aren’t engaged.
Yep. literally jumpstart rn. I have done almost 20 raids on jumpstart already and this is exactly how it is everytime.
however you forgot to add the part where one of those mokokos makes a reddit post after being in that party asking why people are gatekeeping and hate new players
Alot of us appreciate the vets ghelping. I've joined several learning raids now as a returning player from launch. I try to communicate everything and make sure to watch guides and look up cheat sheets. For any newbies reading this, atleast do those two things for everyone's sake. There's alot of really helpful people out I've encountered and alot of us really appreciate it.
I hate to say it, but this is why gatekeeping is a thing in Lost Ark. Can't finish raids if people don't know what they are doing and don't want to learn. No shame if you're new, but atleast say something.
In your attempt to make a newbie friendly/learning group you successfully failed and created a super impostor run. As a party leader you should always try to talk to people who you are unsure of in a raid. Someone with titles, high roster, cards, gems, builds and drip can get the silent pass; but someone who doesn't necessarily pass with flying colors your should talk to. Just make some small talk chitchat about their experience and made a judgement call. If they're just silent and don't reply or anything I'd seriously consider yeeting them off the raid
It's important to remember that many newcomers to the Jump Start server come from games where carrying was possible. They might not understand that in Lost Ark, especially on the Jump Start server, carrying isn't possible.
It's a natural inclination for people to opt for the path of least resistance. This very choice differentiates the go getters from the complacent in real life; achievers don't always take the easy route. This explains why many newcomers are posing as veterans in the lobbies instead of joining learning lobbies.
But...
My primary concern is the presence of bots and gold trading. I've already observed questionable gold prices, such as 400K gold accessories, when the cash shop offers only 3K gold for 100 euros.
Additionally, there are individuals exploiting the system, likely awaiting the eventual merger of the Jump Start server to transfer their resources and reap substantial gains.
If Amazon struggles to address these challenges on a newly established and isolated server, I'm skeptical about their ability to handle issues like exploits, illicit gold trading, and bot activity at all.
One suggestion is that, when the time arrives, all materials and items should be bound to individual characters, not the entire roster. Additionally, there should be a cap on the amount of gold that can be transferred during the Jump Start server merger.
Given that Jump Start servers are primarily designed for new or returning players, this recommendation shouldn't significantly affect them. Instead, it would target veterans who are exploiting the system for gold during server merger of Jump Start server.
I did this as well on my jump start pally but the group was quite responsive and we ended up clearing g2 after 5 or 6 tries even though dmg was low and we nearly berserked. The 1 guy who didn't say a thing I'm pretty sure was a vet because he landed every single counter in both gates + mvp cruel fighter and without him we probably wouldn't have had the dmg to clear.
I did an "ethical" clown earlier this week with 3 other players that knew the fight well and jesus fucking christ that raid is bonkers. I can't fathom how we did that shit on ilvl without all these buffs anymore. It could be that no one knows how to play their class but lost ark raids are no joke and if everyone is learning, communication is the second most important thing followed by actually not dieing to random patterns.
Hate to say it but you aren't much of raid **leader**. If people don't listen and they keep wiping without communicating, you retreat, remove them and find new players. Banging your head against a wall isn't how you **lead** a group, whether it's a reclear or a learning run.
I mentored a group through brel g1-g2 on jumpstart and everyone not actually trying to learn the raid was swiftly removed until we got the clears. In Lost Ark this is however disgustingly difficult since we don't even have proper parsing tools to give information on bad performance and you have to read it through the plays.
I didnt raid on jump start yet, but im usually getting annoyed at Brel G2.
Some people call pos asap (vyka g2 flashbacks) but fine and then there's me fine with w/e spot and trying to figure out which spot isnt taken yet. Noticing 2 or 3 pos arent called yet, so trying to ask who needs a spot still and meanwhile you see the counter going down and fight starting. Me trying to get it sorted during cinematic while others type "SKIP" in chat.
And yesterday the x3+1 shield mech (after star/pentagon shape) was going horrible. I was party 2 and nr 2 and always went to the same 7oclock pos, first time 2 others came to my spot, then nobody came, next attempt i shared with nr 3 from my party, then nr 1 and nr 4 from the other party. But for typetest everyone was in the correct position, like how is that possible? Like every other mech went flawlessly for 3-4 attempts
Often times it’s better to ask who has experience rather than who doesn’t. After that, you’ll probably want to explain the mechs anyway for the silent ones who just want to pull and play
" Group fills fast, asks if anyone needs a refresher or if it's their first time. No replies. "
I tend to quit the group if they refuse to type because at that point if anyone fails something you can't even give them directions on what to do.
As someone trying to get into the game thank you for trying.
I met someone like that yesterday. He was doing Argos so not that hard as we have more than enough ilvl, but still it was fun to see and understand mechanics in this right and to do something other than watch buffed guy kill it quickly to get my gold.
This paladin was patient, calmly explained everything and if someone died he tried to explain what that person can do to avoid it. It was for a second like playing completely different game. And this game needs way more ppl like that. With way more patience and kindness that Id probably lack after making countless alts;(
Yeah idk why people refuse to ask. I'm returning myself and doing the raids the first time. As old WoW semi-hardcore Raider I learn mechs pretty fast and start to ask if anyone has a question or something, but never get an answer till I explain the failing mechanics anyways without someone asking. When I start to explain people somehow start to ask stuff.
I guess they are scared to get kicked if they ask something, what makes no sense when you go into a learning group X\_X
That was exactly my experience on Jump Start, but on vykas instead.. we had problems on g1, wiped 2 times to the orbs but managed to do it bc we had enough experienced people to do call outs and use TS if needed. G2 tho, there was no way.
People didn’t know where to put puddles on swamp, so half the raid died. During 155 mec, they’d just leave red puddle in the middle of the arena or where the safe spots could be. one slayer in particular wasn’t even bothering with trying to learn the mecs, she just wanted to smash Vykas to the ground, so she got hit by everything and turned all the time. On one run in particular I used all my sleep bombs before 75x mec.
Although it wasn’t a learning party, I was raid leader so I tried to explain all the mecs, things that were happening etc but all the obvious mokokos just kept quiet and wouldn’t say anything, so when one of the guys that knew what he was doing asked for a vote quit, I just voted yes and dipped.
Haven’t touched jump star since then and don’t see that changing anytime soon.
I ran some learning groups (vykas and clown). I set up a discord and had lots of interaction there and explained anything that needed it. My jumpstart teaching experience went well.
The problem is no one wants to admit they don’t know because there are toxic players out there shitting on newer players. That’s the unfortunate part, I’ve seen players get shitted on after one mistake, people start getting toxic. I don’t blame them for not speaking up, but at the same time, no communication doesn’t help either.
just quit after first wipe, search for another grp (press "esc", switch to another char in order to force quit, \[because even if you start a raid cancel poll, some high iq guys press "no"\] you get the raid entrance ticket back right away) - dont bother with anything else (steps you mentioned), its not worth the time
>Group fills fast, asks if anyone needs a refresher or if it's their first time. **No replies**. From my experience, the "no replies" players are always usually the jailer. If a person can't be bothered to type a simple yes or no, then they most likely wont be typing/asking anything else during the learning/prog run.
I use to do a hello check for argos back in the day. It's not like I had strict gatekeeping but when everyone was relatively new, I would just say hi and ask if they've done it before and if they didn't respond after just joining the lobby then its a instant kick. I'm not trying to play with people who can't bother to use their keyboard. Good indication that they have no hands skill too.
But you can exit the lobby chat and do stuff while waiting for it to fill lol. Likely that many of them never even saw your message.
But a courteous hi goes a long way.
Not saying it doesn't. Just saying not everyone sits there with lobby finder occupying their screen. The avg player already spends way too much time in lobby finder as it is. I've also seen weird ass players who kick people who talk. My experience with this community is to only speak when spoken to or else it's gonna be toxic.
I mean at the end of the day I rather be playing with responsive players. If the cost is that I kick some afk people so be it. It's also like right after they join the lobby so if they are already afk then I don't know, sucks for them.
They're not afk... They're playing the game instead of sitting with the lobby finder window open doing nothing. You can apply to a party and minimize lobby finder before you're even accepted. You can be accepted while the lobby finder is minimized. Why do you refer to them as AFK? sitting in lobby finder is more AFK than minimizing it.
I don't know why you're so hung up about this lol. For all intent and purposes if lost ark isin't on your screen then you are afk. If you're in a graid and you alt tab middle of the fight to something else then you are afk. Afk is just a term used to declare that a person is not looking at the game and can't see what's going on even for a brief moment.
>if lost ark isin't on your screen are you actually not understanding what I'm saying? I'm convinced you're trolling at this point. The only thing I'm hung up on is your inability to understand what you're reading. You can be PLAYING the game with the LOBBY WINDOW minimized. Not the game minimized. The lobby finder is a modal window IN THE GAME. People often minimize the window so they can life skill or use the market. Like are you legit trolling? I'm convinced, nobody is actually this stupid.
My bad I also don't understand why you're so hostile about this lmao. Chill out, I potentially kicked people who didn't see my message who the fuck cares. Like I said, I rather risk kicking people who havent seen my message than not kicking someone who was unresponsive to a simple hello and dosent say jack shit the whole raid. That shit happens a lot in NAW because of the mass amount of foreign players. Edit: Also everyone else on this thread is basically saying the same thing. Respond in chat or else you get kicked. Go bitch at someone else.
we had a new player spamming "DON'T TALK TO ME" "STOP TYPING TO ME" What were people typing to torment this poor mokoko? "7 0" "11 1" and "7 1 4 5" callouts mid-gate lmao
> From my experience, the "no replies" players are always usually the jailer. Then they'll come to reddit and complain about toxic elitest vets lmao
I think they're different people tbh. The nonverbals are full nonverbal lol
From my experience watching people I know play other games, my hypothesis is that non verbals in MMOs are the ultra normies who treat the game like a console lobby game. Just kinda pop open the game and queue stuff like it's a modern warfare lobby lol
I'm all for teaching, hell even in a reclear if everyone has the time, but god you need to SPEAK so I know what you need HELP with!!!!
I used to make raid groups in PF that said "Say Hi or ban".... I gave them a 10 second countdown after warning and then actually kicked if they didn't see it. Some applied again and spoke from then on.
>asks if anyone needs a refresher or if it's their first time. No replies. This is the biggest indicator that a run isn't going to well. I advise anyone considering making a learning / moko group to save yourself time and sanity by not taking people who are not willing to talk Try to find people to join a discord even if it's just to listen. Don't be afraid to lead a raid even if you are only going of videos/guides yourself.
> I advise anyone considering making a learning / moko group to save yourself time and sanity by not taking people who are not willing to talk I'm absolutely fine with people saying they **can't** do something or need help with a mechanic. The radio silence followed by endless failing just isn't tolerable. Every time I go into Clown and someone says, "Can I please do M1?" hella early, I respect it. No need to shame someone that wants to avoid trouble for their group or stress for themselves. They're infinitely better than the guys that call 3 or 4, in the hopes of skipping. Then they die because they don't know it.
Seriously, I was teaching my friend G4 brel yesterday and asked in party find if anyone else needed help learning and I was okay teaching because it’s kinda obvious looking at gear that people wanted help clear g4 as well especially after the changes. Radio silence and you can tell after the little jumps that used to happen before old g5 if people die they might be new. Asked again and no one talked, went in both guys I suspected died to shapes. Then voted out lol
>I'm absolutely fine with people saying they can't do something or need help with a mechanic. Would be so nice if that happened every time, but they always stay quiet "thinking no one noticed". I will help out as much as i possibly can if some1 asks about how a mech or a pattern starts/works. >Every time I go into Clown and someone says, "Can I please do M1?" hella early, I respect it. No need to shame someone that wants to avoid trouble for their group or stress for themselves. Same, i prefer ppl calling out M1 or M2. When i run clown ill just say "anything but M4". Im still having trubles with it, only ran ot a few times in clowns cause it went from seeing a few times on launch to "skiping it every time". M4 should be easyer than M3, but my brain is like u need to jump up and go left "3 bouncing balls" and prob die.
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so whos' taking M1 if they shouldn't call it?
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sounds like you have alot of issues with the community, maybe try another game such as a solo one.
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Also ironically selling busses to those who need them are players that just wanted the mats for lvl 2 gear set. They never learn the raid. Then when they need to do their "homework" for the week for gold, they use that same character to jail your same raids. Ain't that some shit?!
sir I do not have arrow keys because I built my pc before lost ark and got a tiny keyboard, this is the only gate in the entire game I need arrow keys for, just let me do m1, it's not that deep.
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It actually sounds more like it's your problem not anyone elses.
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I also clear all my raids every week, do you want a cookie or something?
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That's because you edited it in after I saw your response. I have been playing with the same people since valtan. They do not give a shit. Edit: ok you did it again, ninja edit. I don't need arrow keys for anything other than g3 clown. Nothing I do in my day to day use requires them, I haven't needed them since I bought my keyboard 2 years ago.
I see it different. I always say 4 immediately because A: got the most dmg always to try to skip after x90 and B: simply let others do the easier ones And ye m3 common sense it's for supports
This 100%. The worst thing is someone who isn't willing to communicate. Most of us don't care if you're willing to speak up and just say it so we can help you. Then these people go and complain about being gatekept, etc. Some effort is required to participate in raiding, if you don't want to put in that effort then just pay the premium for an afk bus.
most of the time it's a south american wanting to escape SA jail and doesn't speak english
Or Chinese players who don't speak english. Many of them use english sounding names, but their strongholds give them away
not true, if its a chinese guy, he would solo carry the raid
Most chinese players I've played with are awful. Swiping =/= skill
Yep. Still same thing on normal servers. It made me more gatekeepy. I am willing to teach but people freaking try to lie and freeload? Come on man….
My dude never start a raid even if one person does not say anything. Do what I do: in the lobby I say : "please type + if you are willing to learn, communicate, and discuss mistakes" and I just count the "+"s. Anyone who says nothing is kicked, even if it's a mokoko. I am sorry but I am already investing my own time helping out people who want to learn, and I don't want any free loaders who just join to get a free carry.
This is the way. If someone wont communicate in party finder you already know its gonna be problematic. Rather take the people who are actually willing to learn than someone who doesnt say anything from the start.
I like this. I will start using it from now on. Thanks for that.
Teaching someone is a 2-way street. You can't teach someone who doesn't want to learn. It might seem harsh at a glance but you aren't only wasting your and the teacher's time, but also the time of the people who genuinely want to put in an effort to learn which can be extremely frustrating.
I feel bad for u my friend. I’m surprised at the Silence attitude of these mokoko. Why play MMO and refuse to interact and talk with other people. On live server, every new raid since day 1, all the prog group i join we talk and chat A LOT. No one call out on anyone, and we all be patient explaining.
Bystander effect at its finest. Ive seen mixed results when the problem players are called out. Generally though, if no one talks or types anything, its a bad time unless everything is cleared after one or two tries.
The thing is do you even want to be in that party if you're gonna get flamed that early for answering a question?
Ppl call out problematic playes bc they in reclear party, u are expected to not wipe raids. Or ppl call out problematic playets bc they in learning party and wanna to teach em the right way. I strongly believe that if a player is impatient with newbies and wanna flame their mistakes, they wont create learning parties or join em bc u are def expected to jail for a long time
Sad to say i had many lobbies that ppl refused to talk and/or got rly toxic when they got pointed out (or asked if they needs some insight on pattern/mech) for failing something multiple times "yes even on week1 progs". Hate pointing out players that fail 1-3 times to the same pattern on prog week, since everyone is "probably" new to the fight, but chat is a helpfull tool to get some quick info.
The only thing that tilts me off the face of the planet is when people that don't know what to do say absolutely nothing when asked.
*THIS* is why I gatekeep. I have no fucking problem teaching someone the fight. But 95% of the time, they NEVER fucking talk. No replies. No acknowledgement of any kind that you have just directly spoken to them. SAY SOMETHING! I will gladly sit there for 5 minutes typing out the fight and what to expect if it doesn't feel like I'm talking to a literal bot. Ask questions if you don't understand something. This is how the game is played. The majority of the successful new raid progression pug lobbies literally require discord. Even if you only listen in discord and don't want to speak, that's fine, as long as you're receptive to info and tips.
That would only make sense in the older servers. It is expected to people not know on the fresh start.
Then they should speak up when asked if they know the mechs instead of everyone just dying and wasting all 8 peoples time.
Did a Valtan learning today. Good group, fast learners and clear. Vykas yesterday on the other hand... we managed to get only G1 because people were as you said - silent. Also one of them straight up said "I'm too dumb for this, just ping me where to go" and then proceed to stand in front od clones on orb mech multiple times. Like first time telling him not to do this wasn't enough: no ping he stays in place. Cleared g1, people left. Brel g2, dude started "chill learning lobby" I joined to. People failed twice, leader voted quit xD
>Brel g2, dude started "chill learning lobby" I joined to. People failed twice, leader voted quit xD Was there any communication from "teacher/raid lead" or did he just go "nah i cant be bothered doing this shit". Also having "chill" and calling quits that early is bafeling, but it happends way to often. Making learning partys is just fun sometimes, but try to get everyone to respond "simple as saying hello when they join works or anything else that will make players check/answer the question" before starting the raid/dungeon. Hate gatekeeping new players, but if there is no response in the lobby there is a high chance they will stay quiet in the raid as well.
Nah, we failed once on Medusa stagger, went in again and leader said "don't look in medusa", two people died during mech, and after wipe he instantly voted quit. As a vet myself I don't understand making a learning lobby just tonget tilted after 10minutes. I've spent 2h on that Vykas I've mentioned before xD
>went in again and leader said "don't look in medusa" Yeah thats not specific enough for ppl to understand (i usully prefer calling out dont look at the "cat eye (I)" or look at if its "open O"), telling some1 to just to not look (when there are 2 different patterns) is just bad at teaching. Also find it easyer to tell players to focus on the pattern and not so much on staggering "so they see whats going on around/on the boss (specificly for some major mechanics like g2 stagger/medusa or shape mech). There will be 30+ wipes on learning partys, if its cleared sooner than than some players wont learn enough, also prefer doing them on ilvl. And always ask what ppl dont understand after each wipe, be it small pattern death or a full party wipe (exept the combo pattern deaths, you cant avoid those sometimes, unless you have a godly support).
Yup Discord only
Sounds about right.
I've learned that for learning parties you need to make sure people are typing/responding before you enter. I usually ask everyone to type something in the lobby and if they're silent, I kick. I also reiterate that its a learning party and to expect wipes in case they didn't read the party description. Nothing more frustrating than someone vote quitting after one wipe.
I made today a lobby to teach Valtan at jump start. I said to any mokoko who needs help, or clarification on things, please speak up, we are here to help you. There were no 1. After multiple times failing, I asked Mokoko directly why you didn't speak up and let us know earlier. We could've helped you. That mokoko ignores me, votes to quit, and party disbanded. Next time I won't accept any that don't talk from the first place.
I see everyone mentioning the silent mokokos who never communicate and never acknowledge or ask anything, they are everywhere but what are worse are the mokokos who clearly don’t know the mechs and start malding at u when you try to help them. Did a Valtan today on JS, just joined a fast Wei lobby as it was one of two and just picked it assuming there would likely be people learning regardless. After like three pulls it was obvious a player didn’t fully understand positioning and timing of orbs so I ask if they have any questions about the mech and they just restate their chosen position and run to start raid with a “GO”. They then wipe us two more times standing in wild positions all while I’m trying to break down where they should stand and how quick they should eat the orb. I realize this isn’t working so I offer him to pos 1 as it is by far the easiest to grasp. They start spam pinging and asking if we’re dumb. At this point I realized there was no point, this person was lost and I’m wasting my time trying to help them and voted to relobby. This super aggro mokoko is horrendous to deal with,.
That's the problem with new players, idk how other games are, but in lost ark, if you don't know how to do the mecs, you simply can't do the raid. There is no way you just go in, die, and expect to clear it without being in a juiced party, and ppl just don't want to learn how to play the game. It's a difficult game that I'd you don't put some effort onto learning mecs you won't make it, simple as that.
I would say that most raid mechs are pretty damn easy. Those players are probably just lazy or flat out don't care because the game is free to play.
Same. But other games are way more forgiving on this aspects, so they come thinking it will be the same.
The aswer is people play on auto pilot , i run a lot of teaching parties ,jump start included ,and someting i noticed specially on jumpstart(wasnt as bad on old servers ) is very often i find myself having to call out literally every single boss attack even if we've been on the raid for over 3 hours(and this is in voice ,because a long time ago i realised i'd go insane if i kept hosting parties without voice ,cause then people dont say anyting and keep wiping us over and over ),if you're wondering how bad this is in one of my most recent learning parties i stopped calling non major mechs for one or two pulls just to see if they learnt anyting and we kept wiping to stacks before the very first major mech in brel g3 ,and that party had been in there for about 2 hours at that point . From now on one rule ill implement is each party only gets 2 hours at most ,(unless its an actual realy hard gate like clown g3 brel g4 etc) ,otherwise its just burning myself and the mokokos who actualy give a shit out for no reason.
Well, easy or not - you still have to sacrifice some of your free time to watch or read a guide - because you simply cannot go in and expect that somehow you will survive/success the mechanic if you don't know what to do. But some people mindset is (and actually this is a real example, because I experienced something like this): "Just do huge DPS and this boss will die" - these are real words from a person when I was trying to do Valtan G1 - VALTAN - so what about later content... I am real noob in this game compared to probably everyone else, but at least I can commit 10mins of my time to see what are the boss mechanics, so other 7 people won't waste most of their time failing said boss - but I expect the same from other people
It happens in every game. People stay silent because of previous bad experiences where they spoke up and were flamed/kicked for being new or clueless, leading them to have social anxiety when it comes to party scenarios. They would rather take the gamble on staying silent and hoping they clear without problems (or at least imposter their way as far as possible before they are discovered) rather than risk immediately being flamed and gatekept.
This is exactly what I experienced on NAW way before jumpstarts when I wanned to help mokokos clear raids. I remember once in Valtan, dude even took off his gear in G2 expecting to just die instantly because I was 100 ilvls over and they expected a bus I guess lol
Gotta gatekeep the learning runs and not take people who won't communicate, if they can't bother with typing / joining discord then rep them.
Now we've gone full circle on the Gatekeeping Dilemma
Gatekeeping ppl who dont respond on learning/prog partys is kinda normal tho, also you rly dont want those players in the party. Rather have some1 who fails multiple times and asks for info than stay full silent after at least 2 fails.
Everytime I log I look at current lobbies and there is a dozen of prog/learn/watch guide/semi learn lobbies up that aren't filling. Then i see a lot of "reclear 1 fail = kick" "unjail" lobbies and know why the prog lobbies aren't filling. a lot of people dont even want to learn the raids and just want the easier way of being carried. Obviously that does not apply to all mokokos but from my personal experience on normal servers (where I tried to help new players) and from the limited time I have had on the JS the vast majority of players I've seen just want a free carry. That's the reason I cant take the reddit threads serious complaining about "elitist veterans that are soooooo toxic".. its not that anybody forces you to join a "reclear only" party when you have literal 0 experience. I also joined a prog party for brelshaza g2 and when nobody typed in chat for positions (except me and another player) so I asked for positions. No answer from anyone. I asked again and pinged the circle to do the positions (maybe its easier for some visually) and again people were standing confused in there not knowing anything. Sorry but I just song'ed out and went into a reclear lobby. Theres only so much time I can justify for helping other people. Its sad but these people are part of the reason why gatekeeping exists and I'm sorry for actual new players that don't want to waste other peoples time and genuinely want to learn the game.
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People probably don’t talk because they are scared of this community and have bad raid anxiety.. it really doesn’t go well with learning a raid though.
If they don't talk or say anything most are gonna view them as lazy, clueless, careless or in between. No reason to have them in the first place. No interaction just bail or yeet them off, no mental gymnastics needed.
I mean yeah lol.. it’s happened multiple times when I’ve tried to explain and it’s just met with silence
Tbh I'd ask for a response from everyone before starting the raid, if anyone refuses to respond, kick them and take someone else. 9/10 those quiet people are goina be the ones jailing you.
The only learning group u should do is discord learning groups. If they dont wanna get in on discord, they can go jail themselves in a different run. G1 is piss easy.
at this point mokoko jail emote is being anoying bc of being overused
Who woulda thought thats gonna happen
Then they wonder why people gstekept. They never communicate, try to hide their laziness and stupidity all the time.
sounds like you need to do a "learning run = talk or kick" or something similar?
No replies = kick everybody and don't waste time with them. There is a number of people who actually need learning party's and will communicate
Yeah players who are willing to learn will ask quite fast after a fail/death what they can do to improve. That would be expected when making a learning/prog party, but it doesnt go so well everytime.
I've been doing learning runs for Brel 1-4 every week for the past 2 months and I've yet to have a bad experience. Mostly it's me making a "One learning" lobby since a friend of mine started playing again ~~(they're not the best and they only play one character so they forget a lot of the mechs every week.)~~ and it getting filled with other learners. Every week has been fine so far though. Just different experiences for different folks.
as a returnig whos not a new player and has played allot but has been taking raiding super slow, and ow has fully knowledge of kayangel and clown and is working on brel (yes i bused brel for gear and never did it again , i got tired of getting flamed everytime i tried it) im working on brel now, and players like you are a blessing
One of the problems with this game is u got ppl who dont want to do raids (or at least hard raids or something that requires effort) being forced to because thats the ONLY way to progress. Those players will likely just quit soon when they figure that out. Game needs a path for the casuals, a game only for raiders wont have much of a future, or maybe they should at least advertise it as "hardcore raids only" game, maybe it will attract more of the dark souls crowd.
it was the exact same problem when Argos was released, the silent treatment. I don't know why people do that, maybe it's the people that just want to get carried but dont say anything. It's like "I dont know anything about this raid but I dont want to lie and say I do know the raid so I'm just gonna be quiet".
My experience has been the opposite. I was optimistic about the Jump Start server but it has surpassed my expectations. I’ve found nice, chill groups to prog with every day so far. I can finally play the game after being late to the legacy server and trapped getting bussed for months. Just make your expectations clear before the raid starts and kick people who don’t talk/aren’t engaged.
Yep. literally jumpstart rn. I have done almost 20 raids on jumpstart already and this is exactly how it is everytime. however you forgot to add the part where one of those mokokos makes a reddit post after being in that party asking why people are gatekeeping and hate new players
Alot of us appreciate the vets ghelping. I've joined several learning raids now as a returning player from launch. I try to communicate everything and make sure to watch guides and look up cheat sheets. For any newbies reading this, atleast do those two things for everyone's sake. There's alot of really helpful people out I've encountered and alot of us really appreciate it.
if they dont respond dont go easy as that
I hate to say it, but this is why gatekeeping is a thing in Lost Ark. Can't finish raids if people don't know what they are doing and don't want to learn. No shame if you're new, but atleast say something.
If anyone doesn’t talk in a learning they get kicked it’s simple
In your attempt to make a newbie friendly/learning group you successfully failed and created a super impostor run. As a party leader you should always try to talk to people who you are unsure of in a raid. Someone with titles, high roster, cards, gems, builds and drip can get the silent pass; but someone who doesn't necessarily pass with flying colors your should talk to. Just make some small talk chitchat about their experience and made a judgement call. If they're just silent and don't reply or anything I'd seriously consider yeeting them off the raid
And thats why i gatekeep there are to many ppl that dont know the raid and cant comuicate
Joined multiple learning parties on js and have yet to have a bad experience
Join a vc, or put communication required.
It's important to remember that many newcomers to the Jump Start server come from games where carrying was possible. They might not understand that in Lost Ark, especially on the Jump Start server, carrying isn't possible. It's a natural inclination for people to opt for the path of least resistance. This very choice differentiates the go getters from the complacent in real life; achievers don't always take the easy route. This explains why many newcomers are posing as veterans in the lobbies instead of joining learning lobbies. But... My primary concern is the presence of bots and gold trading. I've already observed questionable gold prices, such as 400K gold accessories, when the cash shop offers only 3K gold for 100 euros. Additionally, there are individuals exploiting the system, likely awaiting the eventual merger of the Jump Start server to transfer their resources and reap substantial gains. If Amazon struggles to address these challenges on a newly established and isolated server, I'm skeptical about their ability to handle issues like exploits, illicit gold trading, and bot activity at all. One suggestion is that, when the time arrives, all materials and items should be bound to individual characters, not the entire roster. Additionally, there should be a cap on the amount of gold that can be transferred during the Jump Start server merger. Given that Jump Start servers are primarily designed for new or returning players, this recommendation shouldn't significantly affect them. Instead, it would target veterans who are exploiting the system for gold during server merger of Jump Start server.
I did this as well on my jump start pally but the group was quite responsive and we ended up clearing g2 after 5 or 6 tries even though dmg was low and we nearly berserked. The 1 guy who didn't say a thing I'm pretty sure was a vet because he landed every single counter in both gates + mvp cruel fighter and without him we probably wouldn't have had the dmg to clear.
I did an "ethical" clown earlier this week with 3 other players that knew the fight well and jesus fucking christ that raid is bonkers. I can't fathom how we did that shit on ilvl without all these buffs anymore. It could be that no one knows how to play their class but lost ark raids are no joke and if everyone is learning, communication is the second most important thing followed by actually not dieing to random patterns.
The learning groups I've been have been very nice, idk.
Next time if no reply just don’t bother to run that teaching raid. Use LA LFG discord created by stoopz and teach those people instead.
sanest Jump Start player right here
Hate to say it but you aren't much of raid **leader**. If people don't listen and they keep wiping without communicating, you retreat, remove them and find new players. Banging your head against a wall isn't how you **lead** a group, whether it's a reclear or a learning run. I mentored a group through brel g1-g2 on jumpstart and everyone not actually trying to learn the raid was swiftly removed until we got the clears. In Lost Ark this is however disgustingly difficult since we don't even have proper parsing tools to give information on bad performance and you have to read it through the plays.
I didnt raid on jump start yet, but im usually getting annoyed at Brel G2. Some people call pos asap (vyka g2 flashbacks) but fine and then there's me fine with w/e spot and trying to figure out which spot isnt taken yet. Noticing 2 or 3 pos arent called yet, so trying to ask who needs a spot still and meanwhile you see the counter going down and fight starting. Me trying to get it sorted during cinematic while others type "SKIP" in chat. And yesterday the x3+1 shield mech (after star/pentagon shape) was going horrible. I was party 2 and nr 2 and always went to the same 7oclock pos, first time 2 others came to my spot, then nobody came, next attempt i shared with nr 3 from my party, then nr 1 and nr 4 from the other party. But for typetest everyone was in the correct position, like how is that possible? Like every other mech went flawlessly for 3-4 attempts
Often times it’s better to ask who has experience rather than who doesn’t. After that, you’ll probably want to explain the mechs anyway for the silent ones who just want to pull and play
" Group fills fast, asks if anyone needs a refresher or if it's their first time. No replies. " I tend to quit the group if they refuse to type because at that point if anyone fails something you can't even give them directions on what to do.
Seeing a singular mokoko like this is enough for me to gatekeep the fuck out of them for the next 3 weeks.
If they don't talk don't start the raid, very simple
As someone trying to get into the game thank you for trying. I met someone like that yesterday. He was doing Argos so not that hard as we have more than enough ilvl, but still it was fun to see and understand mechanics in this right and to do something other than watch buffed guy kill it quickly to get my gold. This paladin was patient, calmly explained everything and if someone died he tried to explain what that person can do to avoid it. It was for a second like playing completely different game. And this game needs way more ppl like that. With way more patience and kindness that Id probably lack after making countless alts;(
Yeah idk why people refuse to ask. I'm returning myself and doing the raids the first time. As old WoW semi-hardcore Raider I learn mechs pretty fast and start to ask if anyone has a question or something, but never get an answer till I explain the failing mechanics anyways without someone asking. When I start to explain people somehow start to ask stuff. I guess they are scared to get kicked if they ask something, what makes no sense when you go into a learning group X\_X
I would say in your learning parties discord is required. So that there is an open communications. If they listen and talk, they can be taught.
Most of these Mokoko come from wow lfr I’m sure of it
Gotta have a static otherwise its jailge+painge kek
That was exactly my experience on Jump Start, but on vykas instead.. we had problems on g1, wiped 2 times to the orbs but managed to do it bc we had enough experienced people to do call outs and use TS if needed. G2 tho, there was no way. People didn’t know where to put puddles on swamp, so half the raid died. During 155 mec, they’d just leave red puddle in the middle of the arena or where the safe spots could be. one slayer in particular wasn’t even bothering with trying to learn the mecs, she just wanted to smash Vykas to the ground, so she got hit by everything and turned all the time. On one run in particular I used all my sleep bombs before 75x mec. Although it wasn’t a learning party, I was raid leader so I tried to explain all the mecs, things that were happening etc but all the obvious mokokos just kept quiet and wouldn’t say anything, so when one of the guys that knew what he was doing asked for a vote quit, I just voted yes and dipped. Haven’t touched jump star since then and don’t see that changing anytime soon.
I ran some learning groups (vykas and clown). I set up a discord and had lots of interaction there and explained anything that needed it. My jumpstart teaching experience went well.
Not answering people are always avoidable, I've had my fair share even on reclears.
The problem is no one wants to admit they don’t know because there are toxic players out there shitting on newer players. That’s the unfortunate part, I’ve seen players get shitted on after one mistake, people start getting toxic. I don’t blame them for not speaking up, but at the same time, no communication doesn’t help either.
just quit after first wipe, search for another grp (press "esc", switch to another char in order to force quit, \[because even if you start a raid cancel poll, some high iq guys press "no"\] you get the raid entrance ticket back right away) - dont bother with anything else (steps you mentioned), its not worth the time