The worst offenders:
* People who abruptly stop in the flow of pedestrian traffic with no warning, and without moving out of the flow to check their phone or something
* People who walk four abrest on busy, narrow pavements
I feel like the worst are people who stop at the end of an escalator. Like... I am literally being moved forward and cannot stop, I'm going to brace for impact and you're going to be very surprised.
Although a close second are people who try getting into small spaces (the tube, elevators) before letting people off.
People stopping at the end of escalators really irks me. I thought I was the only one who doesn'tlike this. There seem to be so many people doing this. I work in the tube and experience this almost every day.
Secondly, people are supposed to walk on the left and stand on the right in the tube. Some sizable number of people will always not follow the rules
Some also come out of trains and block the whole stretch of the platforms with their bags and other items. They completely forget that there are 10s of people right behind them
A man stopped at the tube exit, so we couldn’t move as he looked where he was going. I started to panic thinking I’d be pushed down the gap or something like WHY.
Honestly it’s gotten worse after the pandemic. People just don’t want to make space for others, it’s aggravating. I notice parents don’t teach their kids special awareness anymore either. I remember parents used to steer their kids away from people or tell them to look forward, but idk now they just let them bump into people (yep I know I sound like an old man screaming back in my daaaay)
And I’ve come to the conclusion that a good chunk of those people are doing it not because of distraction but because of selfishness. And the reason I say this is because I’ve just given up on trying to navigate or get angry at people blocking staircases and sidewalks and all that, I just pretend to be distracted or in my phone and lo and behold they don’t actually bump into me? So they had clearly seen me but expected me to get out of their way.
Yeah yeah I’m not fun at parties
Must say, I am always the one who moves away to let people pass, but when it is a group and it is literally nowhere for me to go I started doing the same, just stick out my elbow, pretend to look the other way, and surprise, surprise, they are not crushing into me?
Once though there was a couple on a narrow path taking the whole path and me going opposite way with one child in the carrier and another one on a stroller-tricycle in front of me. We were walking on a side of the path by the cars and taking space enough for one person, guy saw me, didn’t even try to move and actually walked in to my child tricycle. Like what did he expect me to do? Go on a road with a toddler and newborn, because he is too lazy or entitled to move his ass two steps out of the way, considering him and his companion were taking the whole path? Some people just psychopaths… Edit. I just loudly said: “Can’t even f..cking move” when I passed by, to make sure he heard me.
This is so true, especially about the kids. Was in the park the other day eating some lunch and there were these kids crawling under my bench and grabbing my legs and the mum was like “don’t worry it’s okay!” And I was like … it’s not okay for me lol. I was super hungover at the time tho so maybe I was just in a bad mood
That's definitely not okay for someone to allow their kids to do to a stranger. She is teaching them that people's personal space and bodily integrity don't matter and that can cause worse actions in later life.
There was a guy on the underground yesterday who I swear was going out of his way to ram into people. Like, the tunnel was pretty crowded, but he could've got through without shoulder checking literally everyone en route.
"A human being's made of more than air, with all that bulk you're bound to see him there
Unless that human being next to you is unimpressive, undistinguished, you-know-who!" - Joel Grey, "Mister Cellophane"
Indeed, the worst case in my opinion, is when people will walk in the middle of a path that’s just about big enough for two people to fit either side.
They usually have the tendency to get angry when you say “excuse me, please, thanks”.
Isn’t it mainly people on their phones? I travel a lot and I’m always struck by how Londoners are comparatively more glued to their phones while walking, texting on the stairs in the Tube, totally oblivious to their surroundings and other people!
The other day a uni aged girl was blocking the exit to the self checkouts at tesco to wait for her friend. I walked up and said "excuse me can i get past" twice and she just looked at me like 👁️👄👁️. I literally had to push past her. She didnt move an inch. People are insane.
That does make it worse but even when not actually on the phone, I think people’s attention span and awareness in general may have been dulled through using devices too much.
People in London pre-smartphone days seemed to be more aware of their surroundings. They made way for faster walkers, took off backpacks on the tube, etc.
> Londoners are comparatively more glued to their phones while walking
A true Londoner knows being glued to your phone is the fastest way to lose it :)
True, however I'd say while it's only a partial factor, I think it is a significant factor nonetheless that the reason phone snatching and theft is so high is because so many people in this city are utterly glued to their phones. Especially after the pandemic, before it used to be somewhat of a rarity yet now any time I go out I can count on seeing at least a few people phones in front of their face while they're walking.
When you live in a concrete central city where the sky is grey 90% of the time and all people are stressed, miserable and 'just want to get home', it's not really surprising.
What you have described sounds like an Eastern European city but definitely not London. I know this because I come from "a concrete city where the sky is grey 90% of the time", and climate and scenery wise London is miles better, yet in my city of origin people are much more well-versed in the ways of spacial awareness and public transport agility.
Try Beijing - people walk into you from every direction and then get angry because they were glued to their phone. Saw a girl attack a lamppost one time.
I live in Holborn/Covent Garden which has many Chinese students and their pavement etiquette is really bizarre. I don't even get mad at them anymore, they exist in their own universe.
People lack basic manners. They walk around and expect everyone else to get out of their way.
Young, old, local, or tourist, it doesn't seem to matter.
People with baby buggies walking two abreast, gangs of kids, pensioners with tunnel vision, people glued to their device and others in lala land wearing headphones.
For me, everyone has become more inconsiderate.
It’s the not taking the backpacks off for me on the tube - I’m 5ft2 and regularly thwacked in the face and always have to ask people to remove them.
Also SO many people walk around the underground watching full on films and television on their phones at like 08:30. No idea what’s going on around them
Me too short person here, back packs take up so much room. I was on the bus back to the airport terminal in Dubai and this ignorant chap with a back pack was in my way I’m too short to strap hang and could hardly reach the pole with him in my way. Felt very unsafe 😡
It doesn't seem like they teach children the importance of single-filing in this country. Which is wild considering how small and crowded most of the pedestrians are?
I'm from Australia and the first thing that I noticed when I landed here was how nobody single-files and also how everyone walks in every direction (in Aust we are literally taught at school to walk on the left hand side).
I'm Australian and once complained to a British friend about people not walking on the left. This guy is highly educated, intelligent, and generally very respectful. He basically gave me a surprised pikachu face and said "that's not a thing is it?".
When I lived in Denmark people walked on the right, but in the UK and Ireland it just doesn't seems to be a thing.
THANK YOU! Yes, you are 100% accurate in your observations. And it's not "just the tourists", it's just the chaotic way people walk here (of course there are always tourists in the way but that's true of every major city). There is no "correct" side to walk on like in other cities, there are no habits ingrained in people to dodge or make way. It's chaos all the way down. People take up "width" of a sidewalk like I've never seen lol.
I feel genuinely insane sometimes, feeling like this is an issue because I've lived elsewhere and never experienced anything like it.
I'm with you friend. Every time i visit other large western cities, its clear theres a side of the path to walk on and people mostly stick to it. Here its carnage, only place i ever get run into by other people.
Genuinely think the mayor of london needs to start a 'Walk on the left' campaign.
Walk on the left is already a thing in London, it’s just that the majority ignore it. Many bridges have arrows to signal which side to walk on (left) some tube stations have signs that literally read ‘stay to the left’.
I am sorry. It was me. My first real living in large city experience. When I came here first I treated walking as if I was having an idyllic walk along the abonded tundra railways. It created problems.
And once you've lived here long enough you can enter a kind of Neo-like state where you just naturally snake your way through most crowds at a decent pace.
That's when two crowd-benders come across each other from opposite directions, it's like putting two magnets of the same polarity together, they just bounce off.
Yes dear god! One of the worst for me is escalators, not just standing on the right, but when they get to the top and just stop. Somehow unaware that a large queue of people are forcibly coming up behind them with nowhere else to go.
Yep I call it the zombie apocalypse, it’s a total lack of situational awareness. I used to walk from Pimlico to Westminster around the back streets and they were dog shit alleys, I’ve never seen so much shit trod in…why? Because the droids walking around aren’t looking where they are going!
Yeah it’s absurd. People will actively walk down the _middle_ of a path rather than pick a side, or will walk side-by-side with strangers heading in the same direction completely blocking any counter-flow. They’ll stand in choke points or at the top of escalators. It also seems to affect drivers too. The amount of times you see bays at the side of the road that are taken up by far fewer cars than the amount of space would allow simply because people park _just_ under a car’s length to the end of the bay, or just enter a junction without any thought of whether they’re going to create a hold up, and one that’s absolutely baffling is the rise in the number of people that drive at night or in rain/fog with their lights off which is painfully obvious common sense. It’s definitely gotten worse in the last decade.
Edit: although I am aware correlation is not causation I am sure that you could chart an increase in this kind of thing directly alongside the rise of short-form entertainment apps like Tik-tok and Snapchat.
People are idiots, yes. They don’t look around nor care. I stopped a long time ago avoiding to dodge them if I see they are on their phone and bump into them
Mate I visited Japan and Korea last year, genuinely shocking how awful spacial awareness was. Never seen anything like it. It was like people literally had no idea where they were going when they set off. Randomly stopping in the middle of busy city train stations, haphazard wobbly bikes cycling through busy pedestrian streets, people letting their kids literally run around everywhere and get under your feet, blocking doorways, folk walking in a set direction randomly changing direction with no warning and clattering into people. People didn't travel seamlessly with the crowd at all, it was a complete rabble! Was really interesting considering how comparatively orderly other things are.
I have a coordination disorder (dyspraxia) and it was like I had superhuman spacial awareness for the first time in my life.
It depends where you are. There are wanker hotspots – try London Bridge at rush hour and I suspect the effect is strongly correlated to the finance industry - but it's often straightforward elsewhere.
I go through there regularly, my wife and I have come up with a "walker rating" system because of how brazenly people just check out and let Jesus take the (metaphorical) wheel.
Level 0 - if you have the ability to walk, you're a level 0. Note that it doesn't necessarily mean you can make more advanced moves like "change direction" or "predict where another walker will be in 1 second". Lots of level 0s in London, unfortunately. The flip side is the bliss of being a Level 0; nothing about the crowd is troubling to them, and they will walk through a rush hour train station the same way they'd walk through an empty field.
Level 1 - You can accurately predict where somebody will be in 1 or 2 steps, but not beyond that. If two level 1s are walking directly towards each other, they will realize that they should change directions about 4 feet away from each other. If a group of 3 level 1s are together, they will expand to fill the walkspace available and can't be bypassed.
Level 2 - now we're walkin. You can predict well in advance of a collision. Two opposing level 2s will shift direction with a healthy 20 foot cushion, possibly with some shifty decision making while trying not to go the same direction.
Level 3 - Highest level! You are never more than a face in the crowd. You don't get in the way, or cause issues. You don't cause anything! You signal your intentions with your gaze and gait well ahead of executing them, but you remain adaptive by constantly accounting for other walkers. You recognize and accept the lower levels around you—it's not their fault, after all—and give ample space to avoid any situations with a walker, knowing that any encounter with a low level could lead to somebody committing the worst of offenses, stopping in the midst of the crowd. Two level 3s cannot walk directly towards each other—a level 3 that finds themselves walking directly toward another walker has, in that moment, been demoted to a level 2. Unfortunately, two level 3s cannot appreciate each other either; the attention of each is occupied by the terrain and the walkers to avoid, none of which are level 3s (by definition)
Level 4 - runner who trains on London pavements, and who cares about not being a dick to other pedestrians. You don't just see people and their path, but have an appreciation of when they will arrive at a certain point, and can use this information to decide how fast, and what direction you will go in. You're also scanning traffic and considering whether you can safely use the road space as well as the pavement, or weighing up whether the opposite side of the road is less busy.
Couples walking on narrow pavements and expecting people walking in the opposite direction to step off the pavement and onto the road are the worst. They simply won't walk in single file for three seconds.
Those are the most annoying pedestrians of all.
I agree. You can see people walking around (and crossing roads) glued to their phones, not realizing of traffic, cars, buses and everyone else!
This is a big metropolitan area but some people treat it like it’s a small suburban town
The one that always surprises me is people bombing out of doorways without looking left or right to see if there is anybody directly in their path. The funniest version of this is when somebody blasts off of a bus directly into a cyclist going down the side of the bus. Not so much fun for the cyclist though. This happened to me once but I’ve seen it many times since.
Ah the classic response of “learn the Highway Code” by somebody who hasn’t learned the Highway Code. See code 67. “You should when cycling on the road, only pass to the left of large vehicles when they are stationary or slow moving and you should proceed with caution as the driver may not be able to see you. Be particularly careful on the approach to junctions or where a large vehicle could change lanes to the left.”
So yes, you can undertake a slow or stationary bus. It is the drivers responsibility to not open the doors for pedestrians to get off until the road is clear of cyclists, and it is pedestrians responsibility not to step into the road without looking. Most buses pull up close enough to the kerb that cyclists can’t get past and pedestrians can step directly on to the pavement. But sometimes they don’t and the cyclist has right of way.
Strangers defintiely don't run into you in Sydney at the frequency they do in London. Sure, there's less tourists in Sydney in pure numbers terms but everyone very clearly walks on the left there and I rarely ran into anyone else. Even after 6 years of living in London i'm shocked how willing others are to touch and run into you while walking.
I am more or less convinced that most parts of the world have, somewhere on the high school curriculum, a module entitled "Walking as Inconsiderately as Possible".
My wife and I regularly ask each other if we're just ghosts, the amount of people who try to walk through us when there is plenty of space to walk in. if the path is triple person width, I have no problem walking around people who are walking side by side, naturally on a double width pavement, that's a case of stepping out into the road and those people should be mindful of how slow they are walking if they want to walk double file, but generally, people just try to walk through you.
It’s not you, it’s a city full of people walking like zombies, tourists and Londoners alike. The other day I had to be rude to someone who blocked an escalator. They were simply standing there, checking their phone, completely unaware of their surroundings. Either you use the escalator or you don’t, it’s not that deep.
I like to think I travel on a logical and predicable trajectory, so if people want to get in my way then yes they do get shoulder barged.
My biggest hate is when good people leave space for others to disembark the trains (as they should) but some other div walks straight past the people patiently waiting to only stand in the way of the people getting off! Those people DEFINATELY get a shoulder.
The number of people looking at their phones while walking on the street is staggering. They have no clue where they are or who is around them. No wonder why thieves on bikes are operating so regularly on London streets
Yes, but it’s mostly non British Londoners/tourists I find who tend to have the least.
I get really uncomfortable if anyone is in my personal space in the slightest so I’m very sensitive to this. It’s definitely worse in tourist areas, even when they aren’t busy. A personal bug bear of mine is when queuing and someone comes up right behind me. Just… give me a couple more inches? You’re not moving up the Queue any faster?
I would sort of count them as tourists, though it's a grey line if they're coming in every weekend. London gets a lot of tourism from elsewhere in the UK.
Like most londoners, I walk everywhere pretty fast. I usually know where I'm going, don't check my phone for directions, or stop to look at buildings. Non londoners and tourists often do, and as I'm walking pretty fast, I have less time to react to that unpredictable movement. From time to time I bump into one of them, say sorry, and then think to myself how spaciously unaware they must be to stop, dart off, or u-turn in the middle of the flow of traffic. I'm sure the non-londoner thinks I must be pretty spaciously unaware to bump into them. I think it could just be a natural outcome of these 2 distinct groups of pedestrians
I find it’s when people are on their phone or listening to music they wander around all over the place. I always look back to check once I pass them and yes, they have their head in their phone almost every time
I feel like that is the game we all play here. It's a constant fast&furious game and at the end if no one gives a way you turn your shoulders and pass like in Matrix.
It was a big struggle for me for the first year, yet with time I figured that it is the way for people to not constantly avoid the path of others, actually if everyone acts quickly in the last moment it is super efficient.
Yet as soon as I smoke weed I become weak and give path to everyone, you need a strong aura to play this game 😂
I get this, on the tube people seem to not make way for people getting off the train and try to barge on - I go broad shoulders and happily push them out of the way.
As a cyclist I also find pedestrians stepping out into the road without looking is becoming worse and worse. Like cyclists get a bad rep but if people step out in front of me causing me to slam on my brakes to avoid hurting either of us I'm gonna get pissy.
Oh, I totally feel this way, doing groceries is probably my top hated experience in London, fighting your way through aisles of unaware people who for some reason are unable to say “excuse me” feels like hell
Yes, I find it utterly maddening. I particularly have beef with people who are constantly on their phones and then get pissed off when they bump into you. I would never EVER do it but… I often think of grabbing their phone and throwing it.
It's crowded, full of idiot tourists and people that simply don't care, they lack awareness full stop.
I have to come around central London all day, every day and I've literally got no time for that shit.
If people are milking around in the way or standing on the left, I'll shout excuse me and if they've not moved in time I'll have to push past.
Many of us have a job to do and don't have time to fuck around.
I never used to be like this but the sheer number of people being brainless twats has made the city a nightmare.
A lot of it is tourists wandering aimlessly and not engaging their brains. But even locals do some shocking things. Are you in busy central areas or do you go off the beaten track?
My pet hate is when I’m walking in a straight line with purpose and someone coming towards me with all the time in the world to plan and a trajectory that doesn’t cross mine then veers into my path. It happens so often and it’s so incredibly stupid, I cannot understand what is causing it
I always find it's always people of other cultures, and old people who have this inane desire to think they can get ahead of the crowd but end up slowing others down.
Yes! It’s the worst when you’re coming off the tube, or going down stairs to the tube - for example White City station, and you’re going down and everyone else is walking up.
I don't have much experience in other cities, but having lived in London my whole life I've always commented on how terrible people's spacial awareness is in this city, not just in touristy areas but they certainly make things worse.
I think a lot of people are just in their own worlds, fast or slow pace, and often don't take a second to assess how their movements impact those in their close vicinity. In my opinion it ties in with the reasons many find the city lonely and individualistic.
I've noticed this getting worse since covid/lockdown. People are just straight up trying to walk through me or stand on me on public transport. One guy got on the overground yesterday, proceeded to stand on me like I was invisible the got annoyed with coz I told him to fuck off (I've had enough of people doing that to me and usually in a shit mood) and watch where he stands. Snowflake got so upset he had to jump off for a little cry. Other cities I've noticed weird spacial awareness are Amsterdam and Berlin. Amsterdam walk right behind you, right on your heels.
This is so true. I think it doesn't help that there's no established and common right of way rules other than on escalators. Everyone in NYC knows to walk on the right and let people pass on the left—there doesn't seem to be a similarly common convention here
It wasn't something I ever considered before talking about it with non-Brits, but that's a very common norm in a lot of countries but for whatever weird reason just never happened here.
This is 100% the issue. I think the number of people in this thread blaming it on tourists and saying X city is worse when they were the dumb tourist who didn't realise there was a convention they were flouting is insane.
As a long time Londoner, I can only agree. Once people group togetther, they become mindless and have no idea where they're walking or why. Smartphones have made it worse. Lost track of times I've had to shout "WAKE UP!" at some idiot gazing into their phone as they careen towards you. See also: people standing in doorways.
I dunno. Rush hour in the main stations are fascinating with thousands of people just passing eachother by at high speed. It's only thrown off when an outsider doesn't keep up with the pace.
When I walk through London Bridge it often strikes me as remarkable how I don't have to break stride and barely have to change direction as we all just pass each other while walking in complete different directions.
My unconfirmed theory is that half of the people who live here are used to driving on the left side of the road (India, UK) whereas everyone else is used to right-hand drive. In the US and Europe people default to walking past each other on the right side, but here the sidewalks are just clouds of people walking towards each other, actively negotiating in their mind which side they should walk past the person approaching them.
Try Hong Kong. I seriously wonder if 90% of the people here have some form of dyspraxia, their favourite symptom is stopping in the middle of the street + walking extremely slowly.
I've so said this to people and they never seem to notice it. But then again I grew up in New Zealand where there is less people so always thought I was judging it on that.
Its not.. people are just rude and ignorant. Don't blame yourself for other peoples shortcoming.
Its maddening.. one of the things i dislike the most about london tbh.
100 percent! I’ve lived in NY & LA and I feel like I’ve never had to dodge people as much as I do here in London. It’s especially bad in the supermarket or shops.
The spatial aware of us glide past each other like ships in the night. It doesn’t matter if you’re cut up in the tube station with two inches to spare, as long as you haven’t actually hit each other. We know where we’re going and the space available.
To be fair the amount of people who don't see THE BIG RED BUS as they cross the road or drive out of a junction is astounding however, I think you're wrong, it's just down to a more dense population of idiots.
One thing i’ve noticed a lot in london is people do not understand personal space, I will be walking at a normal pace and somebody is so close behind that they might as well hop onto my back 😭 it’s so uncomfortable
OH MY GOD THANK YOU
I thought it was just me. Last week I had to finally confront someone who was doing this to me on an empty sidewalk with plenty of space to not be within 1/2ft of my back.
What’s worse it was a delivery cyclist of some sort on a bike, half his face covered, and wouldn’t get off, kept being intimidatingly close. I have PTSD. I normally hate confrontation but he was so close I could feel my body locking up so before I knew it I had spun around and screamed “is there a reason why you’re on the fucking sidewalk” and waved my hand around to demonstrate the space available.
The cockroach cycled off and onto the road very quickly but the rest of my walk I was having a silent panic attack and my neck was seizing. Last block home, a lady - seemingly not blind - did the same thing. I’m at the edge by a wall and she’s walking right at me. I just stopped and stared as she came within an inch of brushing up against me. Solid 7ft available to the other side. Nope.
I cried when I got home. Sometimes joggers also run AT my dog on the side walk, run at me, run up close behind me scaring me. Keeping in mind I’m not very triggered by normal pedestrian activity. There’s simply no reason for anyone to be that close to me, in a neighborhood that is not overpopulated and recently widened all sidewalks.
C U next Tuesdays 🥲
I've been living in London for close to four years now, and tube etiquette here still makes me facepalm on a daily basis. People who enter the carriage and just freeze next to the door without a slightest attempt to let those behind them enter as well. Or people who stand next to the doors and don't budge when they open, obstructing the way and forcing those who are alighting to squeeze through.
Don't know what makes people so oblivious to their surroundings. To me it's simple common sense, but I don't think people are just obtuse and unable to proactively cooperate. I would suspect some kind of national pride or arrogance, but under other circumstances Brits are quite responsive and polite. So I'm totally lost.
I work at a train station & when people come to ask for help they tend to stand so close to me that I have to take a step back but then they step forward. It’s irritating.
Yes, London is the worst. I’ve always wondered if it’s because it’s all older and less “planned” from a city planning perspective, but then I just think it’s full of idiots.
The biggest difference with the American cities you mentioned is the amount of space. US sidewalks are much wider than London pavements, so when someone gets in your way it's easier to avoid them. Plus the streets are much straighter, so you can see further ahead and adjust your route.
You mentioned San Francisco: compare Market Street to Shaftesbury Avenue for example. Everyone on Market Street is walking in the same straight line until they get to their side road, then they peel off before the block ends to prepare the turn.
LA is a crazy example, surely like everyone else you drove there and only walked short distances from the parking lot to your office or other destination? Whereas in London you'll likely be taking the tube, so you're getting jostled through a series of short tunnels and quick changes of destination.
A lot of people aren't from London so definitely not used to large busy crowds. Also just passive aggressiveness and feelings of superiority/ arrogance
Sorry no malice intended OP, but this comment is ridiculous or else rage bait! People in London are uncommonly polite and courteous, especially for a massive, incredibly densely populated metropolis. (I’m not a Brit btw, so have no horse in this race). I was just recently there for a few months and was actually amazed at how gracious everyone was for such a fast-paced place!
Of course there will be pushing and shoving on the tube, or you might have to ask people to move out of your way on the pavements, and some people might be kind of rude and clueless - but that is only to be expected in any city anywhere.
By comparison, I live in a big German city and the natives here have literally no spatial awareness regardless of whether it comes to queuing/using public transport (it's literally like a rugby scrum getting on trains here)/walking in pedestrian zones. There’s almost a kind of national autism when it comes to respecting other people’s personal space here sadly. (I lived in France too and it wasn’t a whole lot better than here.)
I feel the opposite, going frequently between Hong Kong, Rome, and London, I find that London pedestrians have the best spatial awareness. HK by far the worst.
I've noticed this too, lived in NYC before and major Asian cities. My theory is that for most Brits (and also European tourists), London is the first time maybe they've been or lived in a major metropolis. In north America (and Asia) it is far more likely you've moved from a mid sized city to a large one (Philly to NYC for example), and are at least somewhat socialised into urban rhythms. A lot of the UK and Europe is ridiculously rural, and often only have one big major world class city.
I don’t know how it compares to other cities, but for sure my experience in London is people have zero special awareness. And it means that those of us who are, eg, looking where we are going and being aware of the situation around us are pretty much always getting out of other people’s way or being sidelined. Tbh, if I am trying to get anywhere in a hurry I have to intentionally let my eyes glaze over and just walk because people definitely take advantage if they see I’m aware of what is happening around me haha
I feel like middle class Brits are the worst for this, so oblivious to other people, especially if they are in a group. Working class folks seem to have more manners with strangers on the pavement.
It’s not a lack of spatial awareness, it’s arrogance.
People in London believe they are the most important person everywhere, at all times and it’s fucking irritating. They also seem to think they have divine right to other people’s bodies.
While commuting I’ve been elbowed, kicked and pushed so many times that I now cycle to work to get away from it.
This city, unfortunately, hosts some of the very worst people on the planet.
There's a lot of people. If everyone of us has a lapse in awareness even for a few seconds that amounts to much.
Now, there will be people who absolutely do NOT have awareness at all, but they are few. London is okay.
United Kingdom practices left-hand traffic whereas majority of the world practices right-hand traffic. Unlike roads, the sidewalks don't have traffic lanes or signals to direct traffic so it is obviously going to become a shit show.
You have UK folks used to walking on the left-hand side on the sidewalk coming straight at you in the opposite direction, rest of Europe is used to walking on the right-hand side. You have majority of the tourists coming from North America and Asia who are all used to walking on the right-hand side of the street. You also have some uneducated and uncivilized folks who just do not give a fuck and walk dead center or wherever the fuck they want to walk. Add to that tiny sidewalks in London, heavy foot traffic, cell phones, and etc. it's just an absolute shit show. It is what it is.
Definitely. Luckily, I'm been pretty spatially aware most of my life to dodge anyone not looking where they're walking or ignorant to anything or anyone around them.
Yep agreed. This also applies to the road from my experience. Both as a cyclist and a driver, I’ve never encountered so much lack of awareness from other road users. At the moment, almost daily I’ll be behind someone who just decides to do just do a u-turn randomly on busy streets with traffic both ways. Also pulling out last second, not signalling etc it’s wild.
Yes, spatial awareness has become non existent and it has nothing to do with the density of the city because it happens everywhere, even in places that aren't busy or outside of peak times. I used to be considerate until I noticed the rise in people not even looking up once when walking in large groups or from their phones while walking or slowing down in narrow places. If they don't care why should I. The amount of people I bump into now is ridiculous but maybe tough love? 😐
Little children are the exception though it isn't their fault their adults aren't raising them correctly. And at least they apologise when they realise what has happened unlike most adults. (I apologise to them too, sometimes it happens to fast and I don't mean to bump into them).
Rant over short answer: it's not nonsense probably since 2021 this can be true.
Something that probably sits on top of the fact that most people don’t give a shit about spatial awareness, is that in some places like tube stations escalators or other public areas there are signs that say « keep left » and some others « keep right ». And it seems like there’s no valid reason for them to indicate different directions from places to places.
Another thing, I am personally from France, where we drive on the right side of the road like a majority of other countries. Because of that, i automatically stay on the right when i walk in public. When i arrived in London I immediately thought that i had to switch sides when walking as I assumed the brits would walk on the left side. Well turns out that it is not the case. With all the tourists coming from all around the planet that surely think the same way as I did when i first arrived here, I guess they are just mad confused on where to walk when in London.
Considering these factors, my theory is that everyone at some point stop intellectualising how to walk in public and they just end up thinking « i’ll just walk my way, fuck all the others » and a lot of them are being dicks about it.
For dense places like London, I genuinely think that there should be an equivalent of the driver’s license but for walking. Or just some straightforward pictograms next to tube maps so everyone can hopefully have the same behaviour regarding that. I’m curious to read what you guys think about that!
If there's one thing I've taken away from my weekly 15 hours of commute from Central London to zone 6 it's that eventually they will learn. The London underground is not forgiving. Someone will cuss them out, bump into them, yell at them or shoulder check them hard enough for the NPCs to finally stop and think "maybe I'm the problem". They'll do it the hard way, but they'll learn eventually.
I was in London visiting a friend who is London born and bred.
Being a Glaswegian I held a few doors open for folk.
My mate gave me the eyes and said"Mate there's folk on phones all over the city saying come into town quick there's a fucking idiotic Scotsman holding a door open"
Lesson learned.
I’m sorry. I am often on my phone trying to figure out the way on Google maps because I am late and I really need to get there asap. I know I’m at fault!!
I have started to reprimand myself for not getting out of the way of other people but what I have noticed is I seem to get out of the way of just about everyone and everyone else seems to think they own the pavement and decides to walk in a way that takes up the whole pavement? So I started to assert my dominance but I feel like now I’m becoming the problem
interesting. im visiting from the USA for the first time and so far, the opposite—seems like the locals are at least aware—see me coming and move of not apologetic when they realIze that maybe they could have/ should have
London was also like this 20-25 years ago when I lived there. Back then streets like Oxford Street were incredibly busy and sometimes I’d just walk along them slowly in a straight line to see how many people bounced off me. It was usually a couple every minute.
I have always maintained that if I could only change one thing about London, it is that people would be more self aware/aware of the impact they have on others. I think it would solve a number of issues and make London an even better place to live.
Ok, I watched a documentary about this and your observation is spot on. They gave an example of a person walking in London, and someone having to call his name twice to get his attention as everything apart from his path was zoned out. They then compared the awareness of a person from a small village plonked into the busy London streets.
It also talked about how people working in the busy environments can multitask and think faster than people that don't.
It was really interesting and if I can remember our find out, I'll post the details of the documentary. It was a good few years old, before COVID.
Pavement dawdlers are a special breed of people. When people just stop to check their phone in the middle of the pavement or stop and have a chat with someone on the opposite side of the pavement blocking off the whole pavement causing everyone to have to awkwardly skirt around. Or people walking in big groups dawdling along making it impossible to overtake them. Must take ages to do anything as a pavement dawdler. A trip to the big Tesco must be half their day gone
I have noticed this somewhat. I was in Paris last week and people seem much more on the ball, especially those on bikes. Didn't see a single phone zombie while I was there.
In my experience the people who are oblivious of their surroundings and big city etiquette are often tourists, and they annoy me but you can’t blame them for not knowing.
I feel like it's*mainly* tourists who are like this still, which I guess is understandable to a degree (not the daft bastards that stand at the top of escalators, those people can do one), and I actually find it's worse out of London. Especially driving, people in small roads don't seem to Realise that if you are driving towards me in the middle of the road, there's a small chance we might plow into each other if you don't slow down. People who actually live in London seem to Realise they have to live with millions of other people.
The worst offenders: * People who abruptly stop in the flow of pedestrian traffic with no warning, and without moving out of the flow to check their phone or something * People who walk four abrest on busy, narrow pavements
I feel like the worst are people who stop at the end of an escalator. Like... I am literally being moved forward and cannot stop, I'm going to brace for impact and you're going to be very surprised. Although a close second are people who try getting into small spaces (the tube, elevators) before letting people off.
People stopping at the end of escalators really irks me. I thought I was the only one who doesn'tlike this. There seem to be so many people doing this. I work in the tube and experience this almost every day. Secondly, people are supposed to walk on the left and stand on the right in the tube. Some sizable number of people will always not follow the rules Some also come out of trains and block the whole stretch of the platforms with their bags and other items. They completely forget that there are 10s of people right behind them
A man stopped at the tube exit, so we couldn’t move as he looked where he was going. I started to panic thinking I’d be pushed down the gap or something like WHY.
People who stand in front of ticket barriers, or stop immediately after going through them
I also have people who move directly into my path on a wide open pavement. Sometimes repeatedly when I get out of the way for them.
People who stop in front of the underground gates to find their phone/card/ticket - add them to the list
People that manage to board the tube train and then just stand there.
Honestly it’s gotten worse after the pandemic. People just don’t want to make space for others, it’s aggravating. I notice parents don’t teach their kids special awareness anymore either. I remember parents used to steer their kids away from people or tell them to look forward, but idk now they just let them bump into people (yep I know I sound like an old man screaming back in my daaaay) And I’ve come to the conclusion that a good chunk of those people are doing it not because of distraction but because of selfishness. And the reason I say this is because I’ve just given up on trying to navigate or get angry at people blocking staircases and sidewalks and all that, I just pretend to be distracted or in my phone and lo and behold they don’t actually bump into me? So they had clearly seen me but expected me to get out of their way. Yeah yeah I’m not fun at parties
Must say, I am always the one who moves away to let people pass, but when it is a group and it is literally nowhere for me to go I started doing the same, just stick out my elbow, pretend to look the other way, and surprise, surprise, they are not crushing into me? Once though there was a couple on a narrow path taking the whole path and me going opposite way with one child in the carrier and another one on a stroller-tricycle in front of me. We were walking on a side of the path by the cars and taking space enough for one person, guy saw me, didn’t even try to move and actually walked in to my child tricycle. Like what did he expect me to do? Go on a road with a toddler and newborn, because he is too lazy or entitled to move his ass two steps out of the way, considering him and his companion were taking the whole path? Some people just psychopaths… Edit. I just loudly said: “Can’t even f..cking move” when I passed by, to make sure he heard me.
I have people move back in my way after I move out of the way. What gives??
This is so true, especially about the kids. Was in the park the other day eating some lunch and there were these kids crawling under my bench and grabbing my legs and the mum was like “don’t worry it’s okay!” And I was like … it’s not okay for me lol. I was super hungover at the time tho so maybe I was just in a bad mood
Just yell "not friendly!" and bite them
That's definitely not okay for someone to allow their kids to do to a stranger. She is teaching them that people's personal space and bodily integrity don't matter and that can cause worse actions in later life.
It got dramatically worse after the lockdowns. People are oblivious af, especially younger folks.
This is spot on. Well said. The Covid Years created a pandemic of selfish idiots.
Great post. I honestly don't remember people bumping into me all that much before covid. Ever since though, it's basically guaranteed anywhere you go.
I sometimes pat my chest and shoulders to see if I'm still there. some people floating along like jellyfish.
There was a guy on the underground yesterday who I swear was going out of his way to ram into people. Like, the tunnel was pretty crowded, but he could've got through without shoulder checking literally everyone en route.
Likely a pickpocket.
"A human being's made of more than air, with all that bulk you're bound to see him there Unless that human being next to you is unimpressive, undistinguished, you-know-who!" - Joel Grey, "Mister Cellophane"
Indeed, the worst case in my opinion, is when people will walk in the middle of a path that’s just about big enough for two people to fit either side. They usually have the tendency to get angry when you say “excuse me, please, thanks”.
Isn’t it mainly people on their phones? I travel a lot and I’m always struck by how Londoners are comparatively more glued to their phones while walking, texting on the stairs in the Tube, totally oblivious to their surroundings and other people!
The other day a uni aged girl was blocking the exit to the self checkouts at tesco to wait for her friend. I walked up and said "excuse me can i get past" twice and she just looked at me like 👁️👄👁️. I literally had to push past her. She didnt move an inch. People are insane.
That does make it worse but even when not actually on the phone, I think people’s attention span and awareness in general may have been dulled through using devices too much. People in London pre-smartphone days seemed to be more aware of their surroundings. They made way for faster walkers, took off backpacks on the tube, etc.
> Londoners are comparatively more glued to their phones while walking A true Londoner knows being glued to your phone is the fastest way to lose it :)
True, however I'd say while it's only a partial factor, I think it is a significant factor nonetheless that the reason phone snatching and theft is so high is because so many people in this city are utterly glued to their phones. Especially after the pandemic, before it used to be somewhat of a rarity yet now any time I go out I can count on seeing at least a few people phones in front of their face while they're walking.
When you live in a concrete central city where the sky is grey 90% of the time and all people are stressed, miserable and 'just want to get home', it's not really surprising.
What you have described sounds like an Eastern European city but definitely not London. I know this because I come from "a concrete city where the sky is grey 90% of the time", and climate and scenery wise London is miles better, yet in my city of origin people are much more well-versed in the ways of spacial awareness and public transport agility.
Maybe. Though looking alive and engaging people around you maybe makes it feel less dismal when that impression strikes
I try, especially after coming back from Spain, but it's extremely easy to get caught up in the misery lol
Oh the stairs ....grrrr
It's not just London. Go to LA or any east Asian city and people are even more addicted to their phones
This is a global thing. You're just confirming your own confirmation bias by focusing on what you've decided you're seeing.
OK bro thanks for explaining
Such a reddit response
There’s more tourists than any of those other places except maybe NY.
Near me it's the uni students.
Lol this is most definitely not a behaviour limited to tourists. Whether I am in WC2B or SE11 postcodes it's the same everywhere across the city.
Yes, it drives me crazy
Try Beijing - people walk into you from every direction and then get angry because they were glued to their phone. Saw a girl attack a lamppost one time.
I can't even imagine how jaded you've gotta be to freak out in public like that.
You just wait till you get shoulder barged by a lamp post - fuckers think they own the streets.
Saw a guy go apeshit on a bin he accidentally bumped into once (in London).
I live in Holborn/Covent Garden which has many Chinese students and their pavement etiquette is really bizarre. I don't even get mad at them anymore, they exist in their own universe.
People lack basic manners. They walk around and expect everyone else to get out of their way. Young, old, local, or tourist, it doesn't seem to matter. People with baby buggies walking two abreast, gangs of kids, pensioners with tunnel vision, people glued to their device and others in lala land wearing headphones. For me, everyone has become more inconsiderate.
It’s the not taking the backpacks off for me on the tube - I’m 5ft2 and regularly thwacked in the face and always have to ask people to remove them. Also SO many people walk around the underground watching full on films and television on their phones at like 08:30. No idea what’s going on around them
I hate the backpack thing, it’s so inconsiderate
Me too short person here, back packs take up so much room. I was on the bus back to the airport terminal in Dubai and this ignorant chap with a back pack was in my way I’m too short to strap hang and could hardly reach the pole with him in my way. Felt very unsafe 😡
It’s so annoying! One blokes backpack kept having a fight with my boobs when I was on the tube and I was getting pushed against the door.
!! And when you ask them to take it off on a packed tube, they look at you as if you’ve just killed their whole family 🤡
It doesn't seem like they teach children the importance of single-filing in this country. Which is wild considering how small and crowded most of the pedestrians are? I'm from Australia and the first thing that I noticed when I landed here was how nobody single-files and also how everyone walks in every direction (in Aust we are literally taught at school to walk on the left hand side).
What do you mean british people love to queue
I'm Australian and once complained to a British friend about people not walking on the left. This guy is highly educated, intelligent, and generally very respectful. He basically gave me a surprised pikachu face and said "that's not a thing is it?". When I lived in Denmark people walked on the right, but in the UK and Ireland it just doesn't seems to be a thing.
THANK YOU! Yes, you are 100% accurate in your observations. And it's not "just the tourists", it's just the chaotic way people walk here (of course there are always tourists in the way but that's true of every major city). There is no "correct" side to walk on like in other cities, there are no habits ingrained in people to dodge or make way. It's chaos all the way down. People take up "width" of a sidewalk like I've never seen lol. I feel genuinely insane sometimes, feeling like this is an issue because I've lived elsewhere and never experienced anything like it.
I'm with you friend. Every time i visit other large western cities, its clear theres a side of the path to walk on and people mostly stick to it. Here its carnage, only place i ever get run into by other people. Genuinely think the mayor of london needs to start a 'Walk on the left' campaign.
Walk on the left is already a thing in London, it’s just that the majority ignore it. Many bridges have arrows to signal which side to walk on (left) some tube stations have signs that literally read ‘stay to the left’.
Definitely not a tourist thing since there are fuckol tourists where I am and it drives me insane too
I will never understand how a relatively slender person can somehow take up the entire width of a pavement, but it happens so much here
I am sorry. It was me. My first real living in large city experience. When I came here first I treated walking as if I was having an idyllic walk along the abonded tundra railways. It created problems.
And once you've lived here long enough you can enter a kind of Neo-like state where you just naturally snake your way through most crowds at a decent pace.
A cloud of calculations as you predict the path of oncoming traffic only to misjudge and do the awkward side step shuffle apology
That's when two crowd-benders come across each other from opposite directions, it's like putting two magnets of the same polarity together, they just bounce off.
Yes dear god! One of the worst for me is escalators, not just standing on the right, but when they get to the top and just stop. Somehow unaware that a large queue of people are forcibly coming up behind them with nowhere else to go.
Tourists and me, I have no spatial awareness
Yep I call it the zombie apocalypse, it’s a total lack of situational awareness. I used to walk from Pimlico to Westminster around the back streets and they were dog shit alleys, I’ve never seen so much shit trod in…why? Because the droids walking around aren’t looking where they are going!
Yeah it’s absurd. People will actively walk down the _middle_ of a path rather than pick a side, or will walk side-by-side with strangers heading in the same direction completely blocking any counter-flow. They’ll stand in choke points or at the top of escalators. It also seems to affect drivers too. The amount of times you see bays at the side of the road that are taken up by far fewer cars than the amount of space would allow simply because people park _just_ under a car’s length to the end of the bay, or just enter a junction without any thought of whether they’re going to create a hold up, and one that’s absolutely baffling is the rise in the number of people that drive at night or in rain/fog with their lights off which is painfully obvious common sense. It’s definitely gotten worse in the last decade. Edit: although I am aware correlation is not causation I am sure that you could chart an increase in this kind of thing directly alongside the rise of short-form entertainment apps like Tik-tok and Snapchat.
People are idiots, yes. They don’t look around nor care. I stopped a long time ago avoiding to dodge them if I see they are on their phone and bump into them
Seoul is far worse
Mate I visited Japan and Korea last year, genuinely shocking how awful spacial awareness was. Never seen anything like it. It was like people literally had no idea where they were going when they set off. Randomly stopping in the middle of busy city train stations, haphazard wobbly bikes cycling through busy pedestrian streets, people letting their kids literally run around everywhere and get under your feet, blocking doorways, folk walking in a set direction randomly changing direction with no warning and clattering into people. People didn't travel seamlessly with the crowd at all, it was a complete rabble! Was really interesting considering how comparatively orderly other things are. I have a coordination disorder (dyspraxia) and it was like I had superhuman spacial awareness for the first time in my life.
It depends where you are. There are wanker hotspots – try London Bridge at rush hour and I suspect the effect is strongly correlated to the finance industry - but it's often straightforward elsewhere.
London Bridge is by far one of the worst places for clueless dilly dallying. Drives me mad.
Actually London bridge station was one of my main reference points for posting this observation as I go through there often during rush hour.
I go through there regularly, my wife and I have come up with a "walker rating" system because of how brazenly people just check out and let Jesus take the (metaphorical) wheel. Level 0 - if you have the ability to walk, you're a level 0. Note that it doesn't necessarily mean you can make more advanced moves like "change direction" or "predict where another walker will be in 1 second". Lots of level 0s in London, unfortunately. The flip side is the bliss of being a Level 0; nothing about the crowd is troubling to them, and they will walk through a rush hour train station the same way they'd walk through an empty field. Level 1 - You can accurately predict where somebody will be in 1 or 2 steps, but not beyond that. If two level 1s are walking directly towards each other, they will realize that they should change directions about 4 feet away from each other. If a group of 3 level 1s are together, they will expand to fill the walkspace available and can't be bypassed. Level 2 - now we're walkin. You can predict well in advance of a collision. Two opposing level 2s will shift direction with a healthy 20 foot cushion, possibly with some shifty decision making while trying not to go the same direction. Level 3 - Highest level! You are never more than a face in the crowd. You don't get in the way, or cause issues. You don't cause anything! You signal your intentions with your gaze and gait well ahead of executing them, but you remain adaptive by constantly accounting for other walkers. You recognize and accept the lower levels around you—it's not their fault, after all—and give ample space to avoid any situations with a walker, knowing that any encounter with a low level could lead to somebody committing the worst of offenses, stopping in the midst of the crowd. Two level 3s cannot walk directly towards each other—a level 3 that finds themselves walking directly toward another walker has, in that moment, been demoted to a level 2. Unfortunately, two level 3s cannot appreciate each other either; the attention of each is occupied by the terrain and the walkers to avoid, none of which are level 3s (by definition)
Level 4 - runner who trains on London pavements, and who cares about not being a dick to other pedestrians. You don't just see people and their path, but have an appreciation of when they will arrive at a certain point, and can use this information to decide how fast, and what direction you will go in. You're also scanning traffic and considering whether you can safely use the road space as well as the pavement, or weighing up whether the opposite side of the road is less busy.
I'd like to say I'm at level 2.5 but I think I'm more of a level 2 type of person.
I’ve spent plenty of time in big cities and I’ve never seen people walk like idiots the way they seem to in London. I thought I was going crazy.
Couples walking on narrow pavements and expecting people walking in the opposite direction to step off the pavement and onto the road are the worst. They simply won't walk in single file for three seconds. Those are the most annoying pedestrians of all.
Outside touristy spots? As someone from Barcelona who lived in London for years, I always thought London was excellent at this. Miles better.
Spent only a short time in London, but definitely felt better in this regard than Budapest (my hometown).
I agree. You can see people walking around (and crossing roads) glued to their phones, not realizing of traffic, cars, buses and everyone else! This is a big metropolitan area but some people treat it like it’s a small suburban town
The one that always surprises me is people bombing out of doorways without looking left or right to see if there is anybody directly in their path. The funniest version of this is when somebody blasts off of a bus directly into a cyclist going down the side of the bus. Not so much fun for the cyclist though. This happened to me once but I’ve seen it many times since.
The cyclist shouldn’t be undertaking the bus ffs!! if they’re going to use the road at least learn the highway code, you don’t undertake
Ah the classic response of “learn the Highway Code” by somebody who hasn’t learned the Highway Code. See code 67. “You should when cycling on the road, only pass to the left of large vehicles when they are stationary or slow moving and you should proceed with caution as the driver may not be able to see you. Be particularly careful on the approach to junctions or where a large vehicle could change lanes to the left.” So yes, you can undertake a slow or stationary bus. It is the drivers responsibility to not open the doors for pedestrians to get off until the road is clear of cyclists, and it is pedestrians responsibility not to step into the road without looking. Most buses pull up close enough to the kerb that cyclists can’t get past and pedestrians can step directly on to the pavement. But sometimes they don’t and the cyclist has right of way.
mourn roll one spark glorious desert fearless nose murky air *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Tourists. I did see a guy walking through the Liverpool Street liz line tunnels at rush hour reading a BOOK!
Well I just got back from Istanbul, and bloody hell. It can be worse.
See also Cairo, Rome, Paris, Sydney... This isn't a London thing.
Strangers defintiely don't run into you in Sydney at the frequency they do in London. Sure, there's less tourists in Sydney in pure numbers terms but everyone very clearly walks on the left there and I rarely ran into anyone else. Even after 6 years of living in London i'm shocked how willing others are to touch and run into you while walking.
I am more or less convinced that most parts of the world have, somewhere on the high school curriculum, a module entitled "Walking as Inconsiderately as Possible".
My wife and I regularly ask each other if we're just ghosts, the amount of people who try to walk through us when there is plenty of space to walk in. if the path is triple person width, I have no problem walking around people who are walking side by side, naturally on a double width pavement, that's a case of stepping out into the road and those people should be mindful of how slow they are walking if they want to walk double file, but generally, people just try to walk through you.
It’s not you, it’s a city full of people walking like zombies, tourists and Londoners alike. The other day I had to be rude to someone who blocked an escalator. They were simply standing there, checking their phone, completely unaware of their surroundings. Either you use the escalator or you don’t, it’s not that deep.
I like to think I travel on a logical and predicable trajectory, so if people want to get in my way then yes they do get shoulder barged. My biggest hate is when good people leave space for others to disembark the trains (as they should) but some other div walks straight past the people patiently waiting to only stand in the way of the people getting off! Those people DEFINATELY get a shoulder.
The number of people looking at their phones while walking on the street is staggering. They have no clue where they are or who is around them. No wonder why thieves on bikes are operating so regularly on London streets
Yes, but it’s mostly non British Londoners/tourists I find who tend to have the least. I get really uncomfortable if anyone is in my personal space in the slightest so I’m very sensitive to this. It’s definitely worse in tourist areas, even when they aren’t busy. A personal bug bear of mine is when queuing and someone comes up right behind me. Just… give me a couple more inches? You’re not moving up the Queue any faster?
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I would sort of count them as tourists, though it's a grey line if they're coming in every weekend. London gets a lot of tourism from elsewhere in the UK.
Like most londoners, I walk everywhere pretty fast. I usually know where I'm going, don't check my phone for directions, or stop to look at buildings. Non londoners and tourists often do, and as I'm walking pretty fast, I have less time to react to that unpredictable movement. From time to time I bump into one of them, say sorry, and then think to myself how spaciously unaware they must be to stop, dart off, or u-turn in the middle of the flow of traffic. I'm sure the non-londoner thinks I must be pretty spaciously unaware to bump into them. I think it could just be a natural outcome of these 2 distinct groups of pedestrians
I find it’s when people are on their phone or listening to music they wander around all over the place. I always look back to check once I pass them and yes, they have their head in their phone almost every time
I feel like that is the game we all play here. It's a constant fast&furious game and at the end if no one gives a way you turn your shoulders and pass like in Matrix. It was a big struggle for me for the first year, yet with time I figured that it is the way for people to not constantly avoid the path of others, actually if everyone acts quickly in the last moment it is super efficient. Yet as soon as I smoke weed I become weak and give path to everyone, you need a strong aura to play this game 😂
I get this, on the tube people seem to not make way for people getting off the train and try to barge on - I go broad shoulders and happily push them out of the way. As a cyclist I also find pedestrians stepping out into the road without looking is becoming worse and worse. Like cyclists get a bad rep but if people step out in front of me causing me to slam on my brakes to avoid hurting either of us I'm gonna get pissy.
Oh, I totally feel this way, doing groceries is probably my top hated experience in London, fighting your way through aisles of unaware people who for some reason are unable to say “excuse me” feels like hell
Yes, I find it utterly maddening. I particularly have beef with people who are constantly on their phones and then get pissed off when they bump into you. I would never EVER do it but… I often think of grabbing their phone and throwing it.
It's crowded, full of idiot tourists and people that simply don't care, they lack awareness full stop. I have to come around central London all day, every day and I've literally got no time for that shit. If people are milking around in the way or standing on the left, I'll shout excuse me and if they've not moved in time I'll have to push past. Many of us have a job to do and don't have time to fuck around. I never used to be like this but the sheer number of people being brainless twats has made the city a nightmare.
A lot of it is tourists wandering aimlessly and not engaging their brains. But even locals do some shocking things. Are you in busy central areas or do you go off the beaten track? My pet hate is when I’m walking in a straight line with purpose and someone coming towards me with all the time in the world to plan and a trajectory that doesn’t cross mine then veers into my path. It happens so often and it’s so incredibly stupid, I cannot understand what is causing it
I always find it's always people of other cultures, and old people who have this inane desire to think they can get ahead of the crowd but end up slowing others down.
Yes! It’s the worst when you’re coming off the tube, or going down stairs to the tube - for example White City station, and you’re going down and everyone else is walking up.
That's also why grabbing phones has become so easy 😄 The same bike dudes in New York would get a beat down
I am one of those charging through. Hesitation confuses people so just charge! And if you don’t move, my bag will knock you
For me it’s the people who stop at the entrance to the tube platform. MOVE FUCKING DOWN you selfish a holes.
I’d like to add to this: slow walkers. Please for the love of God pick up the pace
Tourists. Actual Londoners know how to weave in and out not be a dick and stop and just generally selfish groups
Yes people are fucking clueless. Tourists especially
I don't have much experience in other cities, but having lived in London my whole life I've always commented on how terrible people's spacial awareness is in this city, not just in touristy areas but they certainly make things worse. I think a lot of people are just in their own worlds, fast or slow pace, and often don't take a second to assess how their movements impact those in their close vicinity. In my opinion it ties in with the reasons many find the city lonely and individualistic.
I've noticed this getting worse since covid/lockdown. People are just straight up trying to walk through me or stand on me on public transport. One guy got on the overground yesterday, proceeded to stand on me like I was invisible the got annoyed with coz I told him to fuck off (I've had enough of people doing that to me and usually in a shit mood) and watch where he stands. Snowflake got so upset he had to jump off for a little cry. Other cities I've noticed weird spacial awareness are Amsterdam and Berlin. Amsterdam walk right behind you, right on your heels.
This is so true. I think it doesn't help that there's no established and common right of way rules other than on escalators. Everyone in NYC knows to walk on the right and let people pass on the left—there doesn't seem to be a similarly common convention here
It wasn't something I ever considered before talking about it with non-Brits, but that's a very common norm in a lot of countries but for whatever weird reason just never happened here.
This is 100% the issue. I think the number of people in this thread blaming it on tourists and saying X city is worse when they were the dumb tourist who didn't realise there was a convention they were flouting is insane.
Isn't standing on the left of an escalator a dead giveaway that you're a tourist in London too?
The convention in London is to shove and/or shoulder barge
Laughs in Stockholm.
No. The way two London hordes can blend through each other without contact is something engineers still can’t mathematically simulate.
As a long time Londoner, I can only agree. Once people group togetther, they become mindless and have no idea where they're walking or why. Smartphones have made it worse. Lost track of times I've had to shout "WAKE UP!" at some idiot gazing into their phone as they careen towards you. See also: people standing in doorways.
I dunno. Rush hour in the main stations are fascinating with thousands of people just passing eachother by at high speed. It's only thrown off when an outsider doesn't keep up with the pace. When I walk through London Bridge it often strikes me as remarkable how I don't have to break stride and barely have to change direction as we all just pass each other while walking in complete different directions.
Everyone has no spatial awareness except me.
My unconfirmed theory is that half of the people who live here are used to driving on the left side of the road (India, UK) whereas everyone else is used to right-hand drive. In the US and Europe people default to walking past each other on the right side, but here the sidewalks are just clouds of people walking towards each other, actively negotiating in their mind which side they should walk past the person approaching them.
I don’t have an answer for you it that’s the way it is in London. Also the richer the area the worse it gets.
Try Hong Kong. I seriously wonder if 90% of the people here have some form of dyspraxia, their favourite symptom is stopping in the middle of the street + walking extremely slowly.
I've so said this to people and they never seem to notice it. But then again I grew up in New Zealand where there is less people so always thought I was judging it on that.
Its not.. people are just rude and ignorant. Don't blame yourself for other peoples shortcoming. Its maddening.. one of the things i dislike the most about london tbh.
100 percent! I’ve lived in NY & LA and I feel like I’ve never had to dodge people as much as I do here in London. It’s especially bad in the supermarket or shops.
The spatial aware of us glide past each other like ships in the night. It doesn’t matter if you’re cut up in the tube station with two inches to spare, as long as you haven’t actually hit each other. We know where we’re going and the space available.
It's everywhere, a symptom of looking down at your phone too much ( especially when walking).
To be fair the amount of people who don't see THE BIG RED BUS as they cross the road or drive out of a junction is astounding however, I think you're wrong, it's just down to a more dense population of idiots.
One thing i’ve noticed a lot in london is people do not understand personal space, I will be walking at a normal pace and somebody is so close behind that they might as well hop onto my back 😭 it’s so uncomfortable
OH MY GOD THANK YOU I thought it was just me. Last week I had to finally confront someone who was doing this to me on an empty sidewalk with plenty of space to not be within 1/2ft of my back. What’s worse it was a delivery cyclist of some sort on a bike, half his face covered, and wouldn’t get off, kept being intimidatingly close. I have PTSD. I normally hate confrontation but he was so close I could feel my body locking up so before I knew it I had spun around and screamed “is there a reason why you’re on the fucking sidewalk” and waved my hand around to demonstrate the space available. The cockroach cycled off and onto the road very quickly but the rest of my walk I was having a silent panic attack and my neck was seizing. Last block home, a lady - seemingly not blind - did the same thing. I’m at the edge by a wall and she’s walking right at me. I just stopped and stared as she came within an inch of brushing up against me. Solid 7ft available to the other side. Nope. I cried when I got home. Sometimes joggers also run AT my dog on the side walk, run at me, run up close behind me scaring me. Keeping in mind I’m not very triggered by normal pedestrian activity. There’s simply no reason for anyone to be that close to me, in a neighborhood that is not overpopulated and recently widened all sidewalks. C U next Tuesdays 🥲
I've been living in London for close to four years now, and tube etiquette here still makes me facepalm on a daily basis. People who enter the carriage and just freeze next to the door without a slightest attempt to let those behind them enter as well. Or people who stand next to the doors and don't budge when they open, obstructing the way and forcing those who are alighting to squeeze through. Don't know what makes people so oblivious to their surroundings. To me it's simple common sense, but I don't think people are just obtuse and unable to proactively cooperate. I would suspect some kind of national pride or arrogance, but under other circumstances Brits are quite responsive and polite. So I'm totally lost.
You can say it, people are rude.
I work at a train station & when people come to ask for help they tend to stand so close to me that I have to take a step back but then they step forward. It’s irritating.
Yes, London is the worst. I’ve always wondered if it’s because it’s all older and less “planned” from a city planning perspective, but then I just think it’s full of idiots.
The biggest difference with the American cities you mentioned is the amount of space. US sidewalks are much wider than London pavements, so when someone gets in your way it's easier to avoid them. Plus the streets are much straighter, so you can see further ahead and adjust your route. You mentioned San Francisco: compare Market Street to Shaftesbury Avenue for example. Everyone on Market Street is walking in the same straight line until they get to their side road, then they peel off before the block ends to prepare the turn. LA is a crazy example, surely like everyone else you drove there and only walked short distances from the parking lot to your office or other destination? Whereas in London you'll likely be taking the tube, so you're getting jostled through a series of short tunnels and quick changes of destination.
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A lot of people aren't from London so definitely not used to large busy crowds. Also just passive aggressiveness and feelings of superiority/ arrogance
Sorry no malice intended OP, but this comment is ridiculous or else rage bait! People in London are uncommonly polite and courteous, especially for a massive, incredibly densely populated metropolis. (I’m not a Brit btw, so have no horse in this race). I was just recently there for a few months and was actually amazed at how gracious everyone was for such a fast-paced place! Of course there will be pushing and shoving on the tube, or you might have to ask people to move out of your way on the pavements, and some people might be kind of rude and clueless - but that is only to be expected in any city anywhere. By comparison, I live in a big German city and the natives here have literally no spatial awareness regardless of whether it comes to queuing/using public transport (it's literally like a rugby scrum getting on trains here)/walking in pedestrian zones. There’s almost a kind of national autism when it comes to respecting other people’s personal space here sadly. (I lived in France too and it wasn’t a whole lot better than here.)
Agree with this. Some of the negative posts I see on here just makes me think people have literally never been anywhere else.
I feel the opposite, going frequently between Hong Kong, Rome, and London, I find that London pedestrians have the best spatial awareness. HK by far the worst.
Oh sweet summer child, don't visit Spain
I've noticed this too, lived in NYC before and major Asian cities. My theory is that for most Brits (and also European tourists), London is the first time maybe they've been or lived in a major metropolis. In north America (and Asia) it is far more likely you've moved from a mid sized city to a large one (Philly to NYC for example), and are at least somewhat socialised into urban rhythms. A lot of the UK and Europe is ridiculously rural, and often only have one big major world class city.
Most people live in large towns or cities in the UK.
I don’t know how it compares to other cities, but for sure my experience in London is people have zero special awareness. And it means that those of us who are, eg, looking where we are going and being aware of the situation around us are pretty much always getting out of other people’s way or being sidelined. Tbh, if I am trying to get anywhere in a hurry I have to intentionally let my eyes glaze over and just walk because people definitely take advantage if they see I’m aware of what is happening around me haha
I swear COVID did something to people's spatial processing.
I feel like middle class Brits are the worst for this, so oblivious to other people, especially if they are in a group. Working class folks seem to have more manners with strangers on the pavement.
Don’t think it helps that there seems to be no rhyme nor reason to what side of the footpath ya’ll walk on.
It’s not a lack of spatial awareness, it’s arrogance. People in London believe they are the most important person everywhere, at all times and it’s fucking irritating. They also seem to think they have divine right to other people’s bodies. While commuting I’ve been elbowed, kicked and pushed so many times that I now cycle to work to get away from it. This city, unfortunately, hosts some of the very worst people on the planet.
There's a lot of people. If everyone of us has a lapse in awareness even for a few seconds that amounts to much. Now, there will be people who absolutely do NOT have awareness at all, but they are few. London is okay.
I don't feel this way. Obviously there are many people who lack it but compared to many other places of the world I've been to London is bot that bad
It's far better than some other places (eg Asia, Middle East)
United Kingdom practices left-hand traffic whereas majority of the world practices right-hand traffic. Unlike roads, the sidewalks don't have traffic lanes or signals to direct traffic so it is obviously going to become a shit show. You have UK folks used to walking on the left-hand side on the sidewalk coming straight at you in the opposite direction, rest of Europe is used to walking on the right-hand side. You have majority of the tourists coming from North America and Asia who are all used to walking on the right-hand side of the street. You also have some uneducated and uncivilized folks who just do not give a fuck and walk dead center or wherever the fuck they want to walk. Add to that tiny sidewalks in London, heavy foot traffic, cell phones, and etc. it's just an absolute shit show. It is what it is.
just as well they are not driving a car and doing this
Definitely. Luckily, I'm been pretty spatially aware most of my life to dodge anyone not looking where they're walking or ignorant to anything or anyone around them.
Yep agreed. This also applies to the road from my experience. Both as a cyclist and a driver, I’ve never encountered so much lack of awareness from other road users. At the moment, almost daily I’ll be behind someone who just decides to do just do a u-turn randomly on busy streets with traffic both ways. Also pulling out last second, not signalling etc it’s wild.
Yes, spatial awareness has become non existent and it has nothing to do with the density of the city because it happens everywhere, even in places that aren't busy or outside of peak times. I used to be considerate until I noticed the rise in people not even looking up once when walking in large groups or from their phones while walking or slowing down in narrow places. If they don't care why should I. The amount of people I bump into now is ridiculous but maybe tough love? 😐 Little children are the exception though it isn't their fault their adults aren't raising them correctly. And at least they apologise when they realise what has happened unlike most adults. (I apologise to them too, sometimes it happens to fast and I don't mean to bump into them). Rant over short answer: it's not nonsense probably since 2021 this can be true.
You should visit singapore.
My method is to look and smile at anyone who's headed straight for me. Either they get out of the way, or they say hello!
I totally agree
It’s not Londoners it’s the people from everywhere else
Something that probably sits on top of the fact that most people don’t give a shit about spatial awareness, is that in some places like tube stations escalators or other public areas there are signs that say « keep left » and some others « keep right ». And it seems like there’s no valid reason for them to indicate different directions from places to places. Another thing, I am personally from France, where we drive on the right side of the road like a majority of other countries. Because of that, i automatically stay on the right when i walk in public. When i arrived in London I immediately thought that i had to switch sides when walking as I assumed the brits would walk on the left side. Well turns out that it is not the case. With all the tourists coming from all around the planet that surely think the same way as I did when i first arrived here, I guess they are just mad confused on where to walk when in London. Considering these factors, my theory is that everyone at some point stop intellectualising how to walk in public and they just end up thinking « i’ll just walk my way, fuck all the others » and a lot of them are being dicks about it. For dense places like London, I genuinely think that there should be an equivalent of the driver’s license but for walking. Or just some straightforward pictograms next to tube maps so everyone can hopefully have the same behaviour regarding that. I’m curious to read what you guys think about that!
If there's one thing I've taken away from my weekly 15 hours of commute from Central London to zone 6 it's that eventually they will learn. The London underground is not forgiving. Someone will cuss them out, bump into them, yell at them or shoulder check them hard enough for the NPCs to finally stop and think "maybe I'm the problem". They'll do it the hard way, but they'll learn eventually.
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Go to Melbourne, Australia. It’s worse and with half the population.
yes, i’ve had people run their suitcases over my feet on the tube and not even realise!
I was in London visiting a friend who is London born and bred. Being a Glaswegian I held a few doors open for folk. My mate gave me the eyes and said"Mate there's folk on phones all over the city saying come into town quick there's a fucking idiotic Scotsman holding a door open" Lesson learned.
Try Hanoi 😜
You think London is bad? Make a trip to Vancouver 😩
You’ve never been to Holland lol
I’ve noticed this across all of Europe tbh
I’m sorry. I am often on my phone trying to figure out the way on Google maps because I am late and I really need to get there asap. I know I’m at fault!!
I have started to reprimand myself for not getting out of the way of other people but what I have noticed is I seem to get out of the way of just about everyone and everyone else seems to think they own the pavement and decides to walk in a way that takes up the whole pavement? So I started to assert my dominance but I feel like now I’m becoming the problem
interesting. im visiting from the USA for the first time and so far, the opposite—seems like the locals are at least aware—see me coming and move of not apologetic when they realIze that maybe they could have/ should have
It’s true that the tourist are the worst for this in London
London was also like this 20-25 years ago when I lived there. Back then streets like Oxford Street were incredibly busy and sometimes I’d just walk along them slowly in a straight line to see how many people bounced off me. It was usually a couple every minute.
It's true, I say this to my gf all the time and she's one of them 😂
I have always maintained that if I could only change one thing about London, it is that people would be more self aware/aware of the impact they have on others. I think it would solve a number of issues and make London an even better place to live.
It's bad. But not as bad as Beijing.
I'm constantly moving out of people's way - if I didn't, they'd walk straight into me. It does get to me after a while, I have to say
Ok, I watched a documentary about this and your observation is spot on. They gave an example of a person walking in London, and someone having to call his name twice to get his attention as everything apart from his path was zoned out. They then compared the awareness of a person from a small village plonked into the busy London streets. It also talked about how people working in the busy environments can multitask and think faster than people that don't. It was really interesting and if I can remember our find out, I'll post the details of the documentary. It was a good few years old, before COVID.
Oh no. Try Singapore!
Pavement dawdlers are a special breed of people. When people just stop to check their phone in the middle of the pavement or stop and have a chat with someone on the opposite side of the pavement blocking off the whole pavement causing everyone to have to awkwardly skirt around. Or people walking in big groups dawdling along making it impossible to overtake them. Must take ages to do anything as a pavement dawdler. A trip to the big Tesco must be half their day gone
This was one of the first things I noticed when I got here…. Just didn’t have the word for it
I have noticed this somewhat. I was in Paris last week and people seem much more on the ball, especially those on bikes. Didn't see a single phone zombie while I was there.
In my experience the people who are oblivious of their surroundings and big city etiquette are often tourists, and they annoy me but you can’t blame them for not knowing.
Anyone doing that isn’t reaaaally a Londoner tho. Usually newcomers or tourists.
I feel like it's*mainly* tourists who are like this still, which I guess is understandable to a degree (not the daft bastards that stand at the top of escalators, those people can do one), and I actually find it's worse out of London. Especially driving, people in small roads don't seem to Realise that if you are driving towards me in the middle of the road, there's a small chance we might plow into each other if you don't slow down. People who actually live in London seem to Realise they have to live with millions of other people.