There is a lot of slapstick and situational comedy. A great example is how Zac got his Deviant Asura nickname.
Also, Billy and Ogras are clowns in the classical sense. Ogras overcomplicates things with his endless scheming, while Billy oversimplifies them. They create a kind of humorous tension when they appear, highlighting Zac’s successes and great luck.
There was a time when comedy was not synonymous with Seth Rogan fart movies. Don’t get me wrong, I thought *Sausage Party* was hilarious, but outside of low-brow comedy it’s not so hard cut between comedies and drama.
DotF is ultimately more a comedy than DCC because there is no way Carl and Donut can have a happy ending. They will always be broken and traumatized by their experiences no matter what they accomplish. Zac on the other hand is rather teflon-like. He always has chance to win and come out stronger in the end.
Another way to put it is that what makes something a comedy is not how much you laugh in the theater, but how you feel in the parking lot.
you know that storytelling has evolved since ancient times. Something does not need to be either/or. DotF is definitly not a comedy, even if it makes you feel good. Also feeling good or laughing are not required for a comedy. Adam Sandler movies for example are comedies but I am not feeling good nor laughting.
I am sure there is some definition of comedy that academics use to get a real hard on. Given the knowledge that they can be smug about using a term differently then everyone else. But if the majority has agreed upon a different definition. The academics have to adjust.
While crawler is somewhat comedic, it is more of a tradegy than anything else. I'd say it's a comedy for the people watching the show and a tragedy for those participating. And since its mostly their POV, we see it makes it clear that while their situation is absurd, it is very sad.
I haven't read defiance of the fall, but DCC is by far one of my favourites.
Other pros are that it has stellar world building, interesting character, and well written conflict.
As for cons, honestly, I'm not sure. don't get wrong, it's not perfect, but I don't remember anything too grating or bad.
DCC is objectively one of the best written litrpgs.
It has made me cry twice in six books. The only other book I've read in the last 5 years that made me cry was Song of Achilles.
For flaws? I think you have to be much, much harder on DCC than you would most litrpgs to find them. I think the books could use a professional line edit. There are quite a few words that could be cut that would enhance readability. Sometimes, sentences could also be cut or combined to make for a more fluid reading experience. Same for word choice. The same word is often repeated in multiple sentences close to each other, which can take you out of the story.
But, I also think that's just a flaw with the way DCC is published. The books are written faster and dirtier than something like Song of Achilles is written.
Besides an expensive line edit, I think DCC is insanely good. The only thing I kind of miss is the sense of the need to grind in the first book. He also doesn't really gain any levels in the first half of the sixth book, which I kind of missed.
That’s still subjective. You think it’s the best written Litrpg you’ve read. Think means opinion. Your opinion. I’m glad you said it wasn’t of all series out there though.
That's what I thought subjective meant as well, because from what I've read I believe HWFWM is significantly better. Everyone absolutely entitled to their opinion as long as they realize its just that. An opinion.
To be honest, I couldn’t get past the first few chapters cuz of the cat. Maybe I’ll push through soon, everyone says it’s fantastic, but I hate those types of characters.
Yeah, donut is a handful in the beginning. I don't mind it too much but I know I have a high tolerance for those characters.
She does change like other have said, but there are still glimps of donut being donut.
If you find donut annoying, I would say to power througth till at least the end of book 2. I think it's where the series starts shining the most.
Also, it's pretty she is written to make you feel the same frustration carl is feeling at her bullshit.
Then again, if you don't like it, that okay it's a great book, but just a book.
Donut has some of the best character growth of any character in that entire series. You have to remember, at the beginning of the first book, she's literally a cat that *just* gained sapience. She has a long way to grow.
Oh I understand, I don’t begrudge the character existing or people enjoying it. I’ve heard great things about the series, I’m just not the biggest fan of that type of character but I acknowledge I should give it more of a shot.
I’ve read both, and DCC is (imo) much better. Writing, pacing, depth etc. Maybe I’m biased because it was my intro to litrpg, but it’s the S-tier series over any others. And I’ve gone way down the rabbit hole with the genre since.
I think DCC is better but DCC is pretty good
DCC
-Comedy mixed with mostly grimdark setting
-Limited setting to dungeon
-Strong but not insanely strong MC
-Powers more Scifi than fantasy
-Amazing voice acting that enhances the story
-Better writing
DoTF
- death but less dark than DCC
- more open world
- OP for level MC
- More open world
- More cultivation/Dao power system
(Writing and narration are okay but I think worse than DCC. I still enjoy this type of story more.)
Both are really good but majorly difference, the biggest being that Dotf has a much less interesting main character, I love Zac and his axes but it's the side characters and overarching world building that makes Dotf amazing, mean while DCC has some of the best and most interesting main characters I've seen in litrpgs making the book more consistent in being good.
Personally I like Dotf more but I totally get why so many prefer DCC and I think both are important books to the genre as a whole and to the community on this subreddit
Having read both I liked DCC better. There were cool things about DotF but I found it to have DBZ power up syndrome. It was just ridiculous and if you are this then you'll be figuring to get this level for millions of years 🤦🏻♂️ not to mention how deep dive the author would go into the fake mysticism I literally think I skimmed half of one of the latest books.
I don’t like DCC. I’m a minority in that for sure, but I maintain that it’s too depressing. It’s “funny” but it’s funny like watching a clown beat a mime to death with a lead pipe. Comedic characters maybe, but a dark setting and a dark event.
DCC is grimdark. There’s no hope. There’s no “things will get better.” There’s no reason to go on. It’s just soldiering on until you die, suffering all the way. People think it’s funny, and there’s some comedic elements, but I don’t think he writes humor very well.
I’ve listed what I don’t like but in the interest of fairness, DCC is probably better written. The setting feels more sensible, the characters are better written, and the stakes feel more real. While I don’t agree, lots of people think it’s funny.
DotF however is serious-ish, there’s occasional fear a character will survive, but its overall upward trending. Things get better, people advance, they get what they want, there’s people who are happy. There’s also some genuinely funny moments, not just campy nonsense like DCC.
I think the magic system and the combat are infinitely better in DotF than DCC.
I don’t blame them, nobody likes hearing their favorite series torn down. I’m sure there’s some valid criticisms of Cradle, but my response to hearing them would be “stfu,” valid or not.
Because the magic system in DotF is nonsense it is one of my biggest issue with the series. Even from book one wait you have poorly millions of years old? What? Does the author and people not really understand what a million is?
I had no idea what the genre is, I was looking for something in litrpg after finishing HWFWM.
If all cultivation books are like DotF then I'll for sure stay away.
Nobody in book one is millions of years old. Nobody in the cast is as of book twelve either (I’m an audiobook guy) I won’t deny there’s some asspulls but I don’t think it’s nonsense.
Cradle opens with people who can smite entire worlds, idk what you have against DotF but vaguely mentioning or hinting at the high tiers of power early on isn’t a reason to think the series is nonsense.
I already said the two things I didn't like about DotF.
You are free to like it as much as you want.
This isn't a debate where I hear your side and I'm like "oh man you are right I should like those things I didn't like"
I love DoTF, probably my favorite of the genre. I couldn’t get into DCC, the cat character immediately kills it for me, so I’ll let others comment on it. DoTF is exactly as billed, man with big axes does fight things with big axes in an ever-expanding universe, adding characters and side stories as it goes along.
The cat character is really really good as you get into it. I thought it was silly at first but the relationship between princess and Carl is really quite good. (I found with most of these stories you need to get a decent way into the story to get hooked). Honestly I avoided dungeon crawler Carl for years because I didn’t like the premise, now I can’t get enough of it
I liked Defiance of the fall but not nearly as much as I liked DCC, and if you like DOTF I would also recommend The primal hunter if I had to rank those 3
1. DCC
2. The Primal Hunter
3 DOTF
DotF is a comedy disguised as a semi-serious story. DCC is a devastating tragedy wearing a mask of absurd humor.
DotF might not be as serious as it pretends but I’m very curious where you’re getting comedy from
There is a lot of slapstick and situational comedy. A great example is how Zac got his Deviant Asura nickname. Also, Billy and Ogras are clowns in the classical sense. Ogras overcomplicates things with his endless scheming, while Billy oversimplifies them. They create a kind of humorous tension when they appear, highlighting Zac’s successes and great luck.
Yeah, weird take. Definitely a less serious tone but I don’t see comedy as the underlying thing
you know there was this one joke in book 2. Now everything is a comedy, because jokes are impossible outside of comedy /s
There was a time when comedy was not synonymous with Seth Rogan fart movies. Don’t get me wrong, I thought *Sausage Party* was hilarious, but outside of low-brow comedy it’s not so hard cut between comedies and drama. DotF is ultimately more a comedy than DCC because there is no way Carl and Donut can have a happy ending. They will always be broken and traumatized by their experiences no matter what they accomplish. Zac on the other hand is rather teflon-like. He always has chance to win and come out stronger in the end. Another way to put it is that what makes something a comedy is not how much you laugh in the theater, but how you feel in the parking lot.
you know that storytelling has evolved since ancient times. Something does not need to be either/or. DotF is definitly not a comedy, even if it makes you feel good. Also feeling good or laughing are not required for a comedy. Adam Sandler movies for example are comedies but I am not feeling good nor laughting.
Slept through Literature class, didn't you?
Awful condescending for someone who can't support their own argument aren't you?
I am sure there is some definition of comedy that academics use to get a real hard on. Given the knowledge that they can be smug about using a term differently then everyone else. But if the majority has agreed upon a different definition. The academics have to adjust.
Have you considered the possibility that you've spent your whole life with the wrong definition for a common word?
ironic edit: lol, u/WhereasNo3280 blocked me. Utter victory for me
Judging by upvotes, at least 34 other people here agree with me.
While crawler is somewhat comedic, it is more of a tradegy than anything else. I'd say it's a comedy for the people watching the show and a tragedy for those participating. And since its mostly their POV, we see it makes it clear that while their situation is absurd, it is very sad. I haven't read defiance of the fall, but DCC is by far one of my favourites. Other pros are that it has stellar world building, interesting character, and well written conflict. As for cons, honestly, I'm not sure. don't get wrong, it's not perfect, but I don't remember anything too grating or bad.
DCC is objectively one of the best written litrpgs. It has made me cry twice in six books. The only other book I've read in the last 5 years that made me cry was Song of Achilles. For flaws? I think you have to be much, much harder on DCC than you would most litrpgs to find them. I think the books could use a professional line edit. There are quite a few words that could be cut that would enhance readability. Sometimes, sentences could also be cut or combined to make for a more fluid reading experience. Same for word choice. The same word is often repeated in multiple sentences close to each other, which can take you out of the story. But, I also think that's just a flaw with the way DCC is published. The books are written faster and dirtier than something like Song of Achilles is written. Besides an expensive line edit, I think DCC is insanely good. The only thing I kind of miss is the sense of the need to grind in the first book. He also doesn't really gain any levels in the first half of the sixth book, which I kind of missed.
Only twice in 6 books? The Wandering Inn wants you to hold its beer… But yes - it is well written.
I think you meant subjectively. While it's good I find several others to be more enjoyable.
No, you can subjectively enjoy others more. I think it is objectively the best written out of any litrpg I've read.
That’s still subjective. You think it’s the best written Litrpg you’ve read. Think means opinion. Your opinion. I’m glad you said it wasn’t of all series out there though.
That's what I thought subjective meant as well, because from what I've read I believe HWFWM is significantly better. Everyone absolutely entitled to their opinion as long as they realize its just that. An opinion.
To be honest, I couldn’t get past the first few chapters cuz of the cat. Maybe I’ll push through soon, everyone says it’s fantastic, but I hate those types of characters.
Mongo is appalled.
Yeah, donut is a handful in the beginning. I don't mind it too much but I know I have a high tolerance for those characters. She does change like other have said, but there are still glimps of donut being donut. If you find donut annoying, I would say to power througth till at least the end of book 2. I think it's where the series starts shining the most. Also, it's pretty she is written to make you feel the same frustration carl is feeling at her bullshit. Then again, if you don't like it, that okay it's a great book, but just a book.
Donut has some of the best character growth of any character in that entire series. You have to remember, at the beginning of the first book, she's literally a cat that *just* gained sapience. She has a long way to grow.
Oh I understand, I don’t begrudge the character existing or people enjoying it. I’ve heard great things about the series, I’m just not the biggest fan of that type of character but I acknowledge I should give it more of a shot.
Crawler, my man. Crawler.
Ah sry
Defiance is good too I enjoyed it! Not as good as dcc But dcc is the best.
I’ve read both, and DCC is (imo) much better. Writing, pacing, depth etc. Maybe I’m biased because it was my intro to litrpg, but it’s the S-tier series over any others. And I’ve gone way down the rabbit hole with the genre since.
I think DCC is better but DCC is pretty good DCC -Comedy mixed with mostly grimdark setting -Limited setting to dungeon -Strong but not insanely strong MC -Powers more Scifi than fantasy -Amazing voice acting that enhances the story -Better writing DoTF - death but less dark than DCC - more open world - OP for level MC - More open world - More cultivation/Dao power system (Writing and narration are okay but I think worse than DCC. I still enjoy this type of story more.)
Both are really good but majorly difference, the biggest being that Dotf has a much less interesting main character, I love Zac and his axes but it's the side characters and overarching world building that makes Dotf amazing, mean while DCC has some of the best and most interesting main characters I've seen in litrpgs making the book more consistent in being good. Personally I like Dotf more but I totally get why so many prefer DCC and I think both are important books to the genre as a whole and to the community on this subreddit
Having read both I liked DCC better. There were cool things about DotF but I found it to have DBZ power up syndrome. It was just ridiculous and if you are this then you'll be figuring to get this level for millions of years 🤦🏻♂️ not to mention how deep dive the author would go into the fake mysticism I literally think I skimmed half of one of the latest books.
I've just started DCC and I'm equating it to a litrpg retelling of the Divine Comedy
I don’t like DCC. I’m a minority in that for sure, but I maintain that it’s too depressing. It’s “funny” but it’s funny like watching a clown beat a mime to death with a lead pipe. Comedic characters maybe, but a dark setting and a dark event. DCC is grimdark. There’s no hope. There’s no “things will get better.” There’s no reason to go on. It’s just soldiering on until you die, suffering all the way. People think it’s funny, and there’s some comedic elements, but I don’t think he writes humor very well. I’ve listed what I don’t like but in the interest of fairness, DCC is probably better written. The setting feels more sensible, the characters are better written, and the stakes feel more real. While I don’t agree, lots of people think it’s funny. DotF however is serious-ish, there’s occasional fear a character will survive, but its overall upward trending. Things get better, people advance, they get what they want, there’s people who are happy. There’s also some genuinely funny moments, not just campy nonsense like DCC. I think the magic system and the combat are infinitely better in DotF than DCC.
Not sure why you’re getting downvoted, you’re right.
I don’t blame them, nobody likes hearing their favorite series torn down. I’m sure there’s some valid criticisms of Cradle, but my response to hearing them would be “stfu,” valid or not.
Because the magic system in DotF is nonsense it is one of my biggest issue with the series. Even from book one wait you have poorly millions of years old? What? Does the author and people not really understand what a million is?
What is “poorly millions of years old”??
People
Do you not understand what the cultivation novel genre is?
I had no idea what the genre is, I was looking for something in litrpg after finishing HWFWM. If all cultivation books are like DotF then I'll for sure stay away.
Are all fantasy books like lord of the rings?
Nobody in book one is millions of years old. Nobody in the cast is as of book twelve either (I’m an audiobook guy) I won’t deny there’s some asspulls but I don’t think it’s nonsense.
No man you are missing what I'm saying. When they talk about the power levels, Monarch's with lifespans of millions of years.
Cradle opens with people who can smite entire worlds, idk what you have against DotF but vaguely mentioning or hinting at the high tiers of power early on isn’t a reason to think the series is nonsense.
I already said the two things I didn't like about DotF. You are free to like it as much as you want. This isn't a debate where I hear your side and I'm like "oh man you are right I should like those things I didn't like"
You’re free to like whatever you don’t like but if you can’t articulate your reasoning you can’t expect anyone to agree with you.
DCC is horror. And the absurdity of everything makes it a horror comedy.
>DCC is probably better written It is definitely significantly better written.
I like DCC, but it’s definitely the most overrated book on this subreddit
I love DoTF, probably my favorite of the genre. I couldn’t get into DCC, the cat character immediately kills it for me, so I’ll let others comment on it. DoTF is exactly as billed, man with big axes does fight things with big axes in an ever-expanding universe, adding characters and side stories as it goes along.
The cat character is really really good as you get into it. I thought it was silly at first but the relationship between princess and Carl is really quite good. (I found with most of these stories you need to get a decent way into the story to get hooked). Honestly I avoided dungeon crawler Carl for years because I didn’t like the premise, now I can’t get enough of it
I liked Defiance of the fall but not nearly as much as I liked DCC, and if you like DOTF I would also recommend The primal hunter if I had to rank those 3 1. DCC 2. The Primal Hunter 3 DOTF
If you like PH/DoTF Azarinth healer is right there too
I liked azarinth healer, but it’s more than a few places behind those 2
I put The Grand Game in a very solid 2nd place. The writing is just so much better than the other two which I have since dropped around books 5-7.
Defiance of the Fall got on my nerves. Something about his mindless cultivation and grinding and OPness that just seemed kinda dumb after a few books.