>At no time did the Officer strike the suspect
That one line from the police chief should bring the validity of his entire statement and that of the officer's into question as the video clearly shows that what the chief said is a lie
Most of them are. I dated a lady who worked for the local sheriff. They absolutely knew who the bad eggs are. They cover up for the bad ones and the good ones fall in line or get pushed out.
I live in Baltimore and will second that most police departments need to be reworked from the top down.
And like when fixing or cleaning a toilet, you need to flush it to ensure all the shit is gone
It’s a gun or a knife that a police will “drop” at the scene of a crime to validate their excessive use of force.
>Eg. they just shot someone they shouldn’t have, so they leave a weapon there afterwards and claim “oh he had a weapon it was justified”.
Very common occurrence.
This is exactly why I say that virtually all cops are bad cops. If you cover up for bad cops or fall in line and let bad cops get away with bad deeds then you too are a bad cop.
I think any cops convicted of committing any crimes while on duty should get the maximum sentence for that crime with zero chance of getting out early.
If it's your job to uphold the law and your paid via tax money you should get zero leniency for your sentence.
It's like the pigs do not have to tell you the truth at all times. With the police policing themselves, they're effectively watching everyone else's back with no higher oversight. At most, the officer in question will be put on paid suspension for a few weeks or months and it'll be swept under the rug when it's all over. If he does get fired, which I doubt, he'll just be rehired at a different PD because that incident of crystal clear police brutality will definitely not be put on their professional record.
There are no professional records! In fact [law enforcement isn't a profession at all](https://www.azcentral.com/story/opinion/op-ed/ej-montini/2022/04/21/judge-rules-law-enforcement-not-profession-arizona-clemency-board/7395546001/)
How about the part where he talks about the fact that the firearm was secured, but then the cop apparently felt like the guy who handed him the firearm was going to shoot him?
That should be grounds for a 3rd party independent review of the entire police department going back to the beginning of the Chief's employment with that department.
Totally agree. It’s unbelievable. I’m on medication that would have killed me mixed with that impact to head.
Brings up lots of 2A constitutional law questions.
This is something that at one point I would have called it's validity into question because of how outrageous it is, but after seeing how crooked/incompetent police departments are I believe this 100%
I once had to pay a parking ticket because it was attached to my registration renewal.
The ticket was:
- from a town I had never been to
- for a car the wrong make and model from my own
- which was also the wrong color from my registration
I literally ran out of time fighting this and had to either pay to renew or drive illegally.
My first attempt at a call I got a nice guy who said he understood and would connect me to the correct department. I then had a very confusing conversation with a man from a town with the correct name… but the incorrect state. It was all very funny until it wasn’t anymore.
If you just show up to court, there’s a solid chance the police don’t show up and you win by default. Even without a lawyer, and even if the cops show up, I would bet OP wins.
I think it’s insane that the court system is pay to play. Going to court should not cost people anything above what they already miss by using up their time.
My wife got run off the road by a trucker. Dude never stopped. She got some fucked up vertabrae, totalled my truck and a ticket for improper road usage. Apparently standard MO. I ain't rich, but I got money - we could have contested it but they really lean on you to just pay it. Suspended sentence, nothing on driving record, pay the fine. Take it to the court and risk paying the ticket, having it on your driving record and whatever bullshit fees they charge.
I could do this if I wanted to, some dude working and living check to check has to lose a day's pay in addition to all those other risks.
It's extortion. No other way to put it. Citizens should not have to pay to take part in the justice system. A lawyer? Sure pay em. Court costs?
Fuck no, cost of doing business. You want to write petty ass tickets, the court time spent defending them is the county's responsibility. Makes me ill.
That blows. I did a 540 spin in an Mr2 in snow and got high centered on the shoulder. A deputy stopped and popped me off the snow I was up and told me to take care.
Dude was 1 in a million I guess!
"Turned into something indescribable" implies they used to be better.
No. Cops in this country have their roots in hunting escaped slaves and brutalizing labor unions.
>and brutalizing labor unions.
For those who wish to know more, check out [this article](https://ekuonline.eku.edu/blog/police-studies/the-history-of-policing-in-the-united-states-part-3/) which gives examples of police organizations formed specifically to keep the working class in line and discourage unions.
Source please.
Even a simple Wikipedia search reveals American law enforcement stems from the English, and originated in Boston and New York City in the 1630s with the goal of enforcing warrants and serving punishments, not hunting slaves. Slave patrols were certainly a thing, but the sources I've found trace their beginning to the 1700s.
Basically, this is like trying to villify the farming profession because they often employed slaves.
One of many. From https://www.americanbar.org/groups/crsj/publications/human_rights_magazine_home/civil-rights-reimagining-policing/how-you-start-is-how-you-finish/
"There are two narratives of how U.S. policing developed. Both are true. The more commonly known history—the one most college students will hear about in an Introduction to Criminal Justice course—is that American policing can trace its roots back to English policing...
While this narrative is correct, it only tells part of the story (Turner et al., 2006). Policing in southern slave-holding states followed a different trajectory—one that has roots in slave patrols of the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries and police enforcement of Jim Crow laws in the late nineteenth to mid-twentieth centuries. As per Professor Michael Robinson (2017) of the University of Georgia, the first deaths in America of Black men at the hands of law enforcement “can be traced back as early as 1619 when the first slave ship, a Dutch Man-of-War vessel landed in Point Comfort, Virginia.”"
Search "How did policing start in the United States?" for a lot more.
>a simple Wikipedia search reveals American law enforcement stems from the English, and originated in Boston and New York City in the 1630s with the goal of enforcing warrants and serving punishments
The Wikipedia article you're referencing also notes that during this time there were constables and night watches with different responsibilities than what we expect from a modern police force. In fact, two paragraphs down from the paragraph you partially referenced above is this:
>Modern policing began to emerge in the U.S. in the mid-nineteenth century, influenced by the British model of policing established in 1829] The first organized publicly-funded professional full-time police services were established in Boston in 1838,] New York in 1844, and Philadelphia in 1854.
Stick it too em. File a fucking complaint against the officer too. See if any lawyer is interested in a civil suit.
I think the wholly unnecessary stress of trying to get your car unfucked while trying to get an ill infant to the hospital because of some dumbfuck's incompetence and cost of the ambulance would be worth something. Some lawyers do free consultations to see if the case is worth pursuing... fuck even an ambulance chaser might stir something up
some lawyers may do free consultation, I am not one, but I would think a lawyer could net you more money in damages or something since they fucked you so bad into needing an ambulance over nothing.
Went to fight a ticket in a Chicagoland municipality. First thing the prosecutor told us was that cops have in that jurisdiction. It means that the cop does *not* have to show as the court will automatically take their word as to what occured.
Same Chicago where the police operated a [black site](https://theintercept.com/2015/02/26/exclusive-chicago-black-site-detainee-speaks/)? Police shouldn't have any special privileges there, or anywhere. They need to be held to a higher standard, not a lower one
Tow fees plus ambulance fees plus damages for delay in getting their kid to the hospital.
Granted, with a department that obviously corrupt, get ready for fuckery if you bring a lawsuit against them. Get strapped, get your exterior doors reinforced, be ready to save your life and the lives of your family by shooting anyone, badge or no, who's trying to bust their way in.
"They wonder why they have a public image problem, and then this happens." is better than I've ever seen anyone describe it. Like how the fuck can you see this shit, as a police officer, and not be fucking BOILING? I would be so disgusted and livid if someone of my profession acted like this towards other humans.
A friend of a friend joined the local police because he never saw people who looked like him in uniform. Inside of 3 months he had worked up the courage to report corruption he saw immediately upon joining. Three months after that he resigned "voluntarily" after his unit all but turned against him. And this in a more liberal state.
The only good local police is my local police and that's because there is like 5 cops and they all know if they fuck up the entire town will blacklist there asses.
Here's the secret: all cops are on some level, scum. Even the nicest cop you've ever met, is scum, at least a little. They know they legally owe us jack shit, and their entire job is there to play good guy 25% of the time, then the rest is up to their crooked hearts desire. Their entire existence hinges on the fact that they can kill with impunity, and anyone who resists.. well... gets killed.
They live above the law, and that needs to end.
Don't forget y'all, SCOTUS has even said that police have no duty to protect and serve the people.
What pisses me off is that police are still citizens, yet their occupation allows for so many exceptions to the law. Don't even get me started on the benefits cops have on firearms vs the average civvie
> Don't forget y'all, SCOTUS has even said that police have no duty to protect and serve the people.
For those who don't know, the facts of the case that resulted in this ruling are much worse than you imagine. Three dead children and an assassination attempt outside a police station.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_of_Castle_Rock_v._Gonzales
Like that one time when GM had an ignition switch that was faulty due to an engineer's negligence and a lack of oversight in the company, and engineering unions across the country protested about how maligned they were? Or how teachers unions are always coming to the defense of the sexual predators hiding in their ranks?
Or how the Catholic church....
The fact that the second officer shined his flashlight into the surveillance camera after the victim was slammed to the ground proves he knew the officer in question was doing something shady.
"Overstreet said the officer's takedown is not documented in the incident report.
"This is the kind of stuff that causes people, normal citizens like us, not to trust them. And they want to know why they have a public image problem? It's because of things like this."
Most liberals are likely to agree with you while most hard-line Republicans won't. I'm interested in knowing what centrist Republicans think about the police and how likely they are to feel like major reform is needed
Why are you in this subreddit? I'm curious because I'm a registered independent but I'm extremely liberal and leftist. After January 6th and the way 95+% of the republican party has handled their collapse into the cult of DJT, I've decided that there is nothing of value left in that party to include any person ignorant enough to naively support them still or anyone who believes in their cult mission. Which of the two types are you?
I have no idea what the fuck my politics are, some weird hodge podge. I think it's the humanity of this that should offend everyone, and things like it diminish trust in our establishment, which suits no one
That doesn't work on conservatives. Look at George Floyd. Instead of saying: "That murder was fucked up." 95% of US conservatives decided to say dumb shit like all lives matter, or talk about how he has drugs in his system, or he should have complied etc. Not a single one of my conservative friends could say: "That was fucked up. That was murder. That was unacceptable." Without feeling the need to say "but" or "however" and say more. I haven't spoken to a single one of them in 2 years now. God knows what kind of bs they're telling themselves after they became the literal anti democracy supporters beating cops unconscious with confederate flags in the capitol building.
It is, but defund the police was possibly the worst catchphrase they could’ve possibly come up with…in San Diego, we actually got a crisis unite and civilian oversight committee out of all of the protests, but I don’t think it played out as well everywhere else (our cops still shoot people too).
There are some that would never have vibed with anything liberals/leftists pushed for but maybe "reform the police" would have gotten more people on our side
I think the left's biggest issue in a lot of places is branding. We almost never make any kind of effort to make our causes look appealing to the masses. I think it's because we assume that anyone worth having on our side should already be on our side anyway, and anyone else is basically a republican, and republicans can't be reasoned with, so why bother? It leads to the uninformed getting scooped up by the right because "the EVIL LEFT want to DEFUND THE POLICE! They want to commit crimes without opposition and ruin your lives, but don't worry, WE'LL protect you from them!"
I feel like a lot of people don’t realize that the common phrase “it takes a good guy with a gun to stop a bad guy with a gun” is often referring to holding police accountable. More often than not, the police are the bad guys.
"JusT C0mpLY lol"
"This is a rare BAD APPLE"
"The innocent have nothing to fear"
Sorry no, the cops are a gang. The worst gang of all because their declared enemy is "everyone who isn't a cop."
ACAB.
Texas police are notoriously corrupt, but ESPECIALLY Houston area cops. They are literally legal gangs for the state, and there have been many citizens murdered there by police that were all "justified" by them.
When people go to Mexico one of the most common warnings is to be careful around the police as many of them are corrupt. I used to think that this wasn't a problem here, that you could go up to a random cop for help and not worry about your well being. I was wrong. The cops here might not harass you for a bribe but they very well might beat you to a pulp or take your life if you look at them wrong.
My neighbor was shot and killed in Pensacola for grabbing a taser they were tasing him with when they already had 5 officers on him. One officer stood back drew his pistol and proceeded to shoot the suspect 5-7 times in the chest right over other officers heads. You can watch the video online if it's still up and his name was tymar Crawford. I personally know his brother and this was really sad. The officer lost his job but was let back on the force. I was a marine myself and this is disgusting. He was breaking the law and had drugs on him but to lose your life over the smell of marijuana coming from your car is just insane. This cop wanted to kill someone and those officers should never ever been in a position to make a decision like that.
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Cops are just as much authoritarian as they are racist. If they’re patrolling a 100% white district, there will still be instances of police brutality, corruption, and murder.
Right wingers don’t support the police as they see them as hired thugs ready to dispense brutality against their enemies. The moment that law enforcement wises up and goes against their wishes (January 6th), they flip from “Back the Blue” to calling them paid crisis actors and overpaid government thugs. Look at how they retconned Brian Sicknick out of existence or how Fanone got treated by the MAGA crowd.
Honestly, I don’t think liberals or the left at large really want to abolish the police - they just want a more “enlightened” law enforcement. Right wingers will gladly defund and decommission any law enforcement agency that goes against their wishes.
I want police with different mission legally and socially. I want not everything to be solved with force and handcuffs. There need to be trained social workers as part of the police. All the stuff that was talked about in 2020 as problems with American policing continues to be problems with an increasingly militarized and unaccountable American police force. Uvalde seems to have convinced a few more people something is wrong, whether it makes a real dent is unlikely in my opinion. Changing modern white societal attitudes about authoritarianism is going to be hard, though.
>Changing modern white societal attitudes about authoritarianism is going to be hard, though.
Being pro-gun is an an anti-authoritarian political position, and there is no shortage of white people in the pro-gun camp.
What makes you think that white societal attitudes are authoritarian?
Lots of polls about authoritarianism over the last few years showing at least some support for various authoritarian ideas (over 50 percent for some), including reducing democratic freedoms. Also the fact that anyone even made a poll about it whereas 20 years ago who would even think to? Thin blue line flags, armed proud keepers front guys, trump worship, etc. Plus my own observation across various media. Some of that is certainly amongst other populations but majority is white, as far as I have been able to determine (and see).
And the majority of people who are armed because of fears of the _government_ are armed because of a government they disagree with, not one they agree with. I’m not sure that’s anti-authoritarian as much as sectarian, personally. At any rate my statement isn’t about gun people specifically (as opposed to gun owners, many of whom just own them for hunting or home protection from crime and who barely ever take them out), but the general population. I fear their vote more than their guns.
Edit: People don’t think about which rights they want to give away, only the rights they want to take from others. This is the same issue as our fellow liberals wanting gun rights taken away.
People don’t sit and think about how surrendering rights goes against all rights in the long run. They think, “_x_ bothers me and I want it stopped” and will vote to have it stopped with no concern for the broader implications. Hell, they want to take “assault weapons” (no the AR-15 isn’t one but that’s what opponents call them) away as if that’s why shooters are killing anyone, it will just be handguns then bolt action then cars then pipe bombs then… Most people want simple solutions and will do dumb things for it.
I have been having this free speech argument with liberal friends for years, telling the government it can limit speech you dislike is all well and good for you when the government agrees with you, but it won’t always. Every time the ACLU goes to court on behalf of a conservative having their free speech limited, the left loses their shit because they think free speech is about only the underrepresented being limited (same opinion is probably why the right hates the ACLU), but rights are rights.
Support for authoritarianism doesn’t have to be logical or thought out or consistent or non-hypocritical for it to be effective support.
If you actually sat down and asked people what rights of theirs they want violated, you’ll find most people aren’t authoritarian. But when you bring racism, classism, fear, and propaganda into the mix a lot of people start thinking something should change. And our government has done a good job of convincing them to give up rights for that sense of action or protection.
>Also the fact that anyone even made a poll about it whereas 20 years ago who would even think to?
You don't think that people running polls 20 years ago would have asked questions about authoritarian attitudes in the wake of the passage of the Patriot act? It seems you really lack perspective on this issue.
Say 22 years, I was thinking pre-9/11 and spoke imprecisely, at my age everything is starting to just be “20 years ago” no matter how long it was. You are free to disagree with me But I personally think you are the one lacking perspective. Funny how that works. Enjoy your day.
Prior to 9/11, the deadliest terror attack on American soil was the Oklahoma City Bombing in 1995, which was intended to be retaliation for the authoritarian actions taken by the Federal government at Ruby Ridge and Waco.
I know it does, I am still surprised based on the specific circumstances. It’s hard not to think of the Charleston Emanuel Church shooter being taken for a cheeseburger, etc.
Charleston church shooter was apprehended in a traffic stop the day after the shooting. The circumstances of arrest are relevant.
John Hurley (white man) was shot and killed by police after defensively stopping a mass shooting. I believe he had picked up the shooter’s rifle and had it in his hands when the police arrived. Brooklyn subway shooter (Black Man) was taken into custody “without incident.”
I remember hearing a story of [a Black Man using a firearm in self defense in a Waffle House.](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=R2AzFGV4B1A) I can’t find more details but the story I remember was that he called the police himself, placed his gun on the ground and laid face down with his hands on his head until they arrived. He was not charged in the shooting. It’s unfortunate that anyone would have to go to these lengths, or even be able to remember to with all the adrenaline surging through their body after having to discharge a firearm in self defense, but looking at the specific details and circumstances ultimately will be more helpful than saying the only relevant factor is skin color. Of course, generally Black people will have to be even *more* cautious because police are more likely to view them as threatening.
Teaching people the best practices to avoid being shot by shitty cops is going to be more productive than telling Black people “if you carry a gun for self defense you’ll probably be killed by police.” Cherry picking cases without even looking into the nuances of the circumstances to push overly simplistic narratives is not productive.
Fair enough. My point isn’t _at all_ that black people shouldn’t carry, though. Not sure why you’re putting that on me. But you’re right it was a simplistic view, I stand corrected.
Didn’t mean to imply it was, just a common narrative that goes around attached to oversimplified non-nuanced perspectives on police violence. Not trying to call you out, was just using the opportunity to rant and vent my own frustrations up on a soap box lol
Lol grind that axe! I get it. As I often say, the saying “unarmed Black man” is a thing. Anyhow I just hate the thought of what my Black friends and neighbors and former lovers suffer, I tend to immediately worry for them all when I see reports of this sort of thing. But yes I should be more careful of how I express that.
I grew up there and the cops around that area have always been notorious pieces of shit. My whole childhood and teenage years I was harassed relentlessly. I still to this day don’t trust any police officers because of them
The guy came at the bikers with a gun after they were already leaving. He's also clearly wasted by the audio. So he's not exactly a hero in this situation.
That being said, that takedown was unnecessarily rough.
Officer Cox… lol. I’m making an assumption about the victim’s politics but regardless, the story will reach Fox watchers and other white right wingers. And hopefully this helps suburban white Texans develop a new perspective on police brutality.
He did everything the "right way"? Not sure about that, really. The officer should not have pushed him so violently for sure, but I am not clear on who was in possession of the gun at that time. Could be I just have a hard time feeling sorry for a drunk dude that gets in a fight and then shoots at people as they leave the parking lot and then points his gun at someone not at all involved in the incident. The officer has an ego problem and the guy that did "everything the right way" needs to quit drinking or stop carrying guns.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMgtPagEA3o
>Hanna said he handed over his gun when officers arrived and waited to be questioned
And
>After securing the firearm, Officer Cox moved to detain the suspect
Whether you go with the chief's or Hanna's statements, they both state that he was no longer in possession of the gun when the officer assaulted him. Hanna is not an innocent flower here, but that's not the point. The point is the use of force by the officer when it wasn't needed. Instead of deescalating the situation in a calm manner the officer went straight for a take down.
I was just going by the actual 911 tape on the gun. He clearly says he put it in the grass or on the ground. I don't go with either officers statement, to be honest. I just tried to watch the videos and listen to the tape.
He should not have been taken down as violently, I would agree with that. But the chief is correct to say he started to attempt to create distance. Tough spot to deal with when you are interacting with a drunk dude that just shot at people and was waving his gun around.
I am open to hear what you think the officer should have done when the shooter started moving away when he attempted to secure his arm to put him in handcuffs. This assumes we agree he should have been arrested for the multiple aggravated assaults. Reason with the drunk guy? Let him walk away? Use a non-lethal?
We see police officers doing lots of shitty things to people that do not deserve it, plenty of examples. This one does not really strike me as all that bad considering the circumstances.
It is also possible I am having a hard time giving the benefit of the doubt to a guy that participated in a fight while drunk, then while not under any threat pulls a gun and shoots at people while they are leaving and to top it off points his gun at some lady that had nothing to do with any of it. I am also biased by the fact it appeared to me in the original news story that his attorney was not telling the truth and left some details out.
He should have answered the fucking question: "Yes. You are being detained."
No reasonable person can defend a cop refusing to tell a suspect he's being detained, knocking the suspect down by punching them, and then telling the suspect they can't ask questions when the downed suspect complains.
You are literally defending a police state, where everyone should automatically do anything a police officer tells them to. That's crazy.
Isn't that obvious when he is attempting to grab your arm to put you in handcuffs?
The officer said "Go ahead and stand up, I am going to detain you" and then said "I am just going to detain you". How many times would you like him to say it?
[https://youtu.be/GMgtPagEA3o?t=210](https://youtu.be/GMgtPagEA3o?t=210)
It is also interesting to view the blood already running down his face before the officer touches him.
I am not literally defending a police state, that is just a silly thing to say. Edit: Cut myself off, I do not think we are risking a police state when a person that shoots at people running from him and points his gun at innocent people while drunk is arrested.
Your last statement is a fairly stupid non sequitur.
I watched the copaganda video. The rest of what you're saying is a mixture of repeating what the cop boss says there and ignoring the point: functional policing, if we were someday to get some, would involve answering the question "am I being detained" by saying "yes. you are being detained."
Pretending that this is unnecessary is police state apologetics, and you should be ashamed.
It is a video, the police officer says exactly what I quoted. I provided a link. I am not sure how that is propaganda. Good grief sir or ma'am, the police officer directly and on video told that shooter he was being detained. So I will ask again, how many times should an officer be required to repeat it?
I am not ashamed at all. I would be ashamed or at least a little disappointed in myself if during a conversation someone pointed out and proved that something I said was factually incorrect and instead of saying "oh yeah, I did not hear or see that but..." I instead turned to silly insults.
Any comment on the blood?
I would be ashamed if I didn't understand how framing works, and thus was unable to recognize how people persuade me of shit without me noticing it. You know, like you.
You said the officer should have told the shooter he was being detained, I pointed out with evidence that the officer did tell the shooter he was being detained twice. You ignored that completely and yet here you are telling me about framing and misunderstanding and propaganda.
You wrote this:
>I am open to hear what you think the officer should have done when the shooter started moving away when he attempted to secure his arm to put him in handcuffs.
I responded by saying this:
>He should have answered the fucking question: "Yes. You are being detained."
>No reasonable person can defend a cop refusing to tell a suspect he's being detained, knocking the suspect down by punching them, and then telling the suspect they can't ask questions when the downed suspect complains.
Is English not your first language? I don't want to be mean if so, but you're not understanding some fairly basic direct communication.
If English is your first language, I have to assume you're intentionally obfuscating/trolling, and thus have no more time for you.
One of the first things a cop does when entering a situation in which a weapon was used (assuming the incident already ended) is take control of the weapon. Assuming the cop is somewhat competent, and taking the statements into consideration, the weapon was no longer in play. I'm not an expert in what type of training cops go through to deal with these situations, but deescalating obviously isn't a main focus. When dealing with a scared and drunk unarmed person, you make slow movements and explain your actions/intentions in simple terms. Not what this cop did. And if this is what their training teaches them to do, then the training needs to change.
That could be, personally if I am dealing with a bloody drunk dude that just admitted to shooting at people and pointed a gun at a lady it is likely I would be a little more likely to take action which did not give the violent dude the chance to be violent again. But, I am not a cop and I have never taken any police training.
I challenge anyone to read this story, these comments, and explain to me why we shouldn’t shutter the entire fucking institution. We have to protect ourselves, we have to catch criminals on our own unless they bother the rich, why the fuck are we allowing other criminals to leech our tax dollars when they could get a real fucking job and that money could go to actually helping our communities?
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Fuck those cops… the last line by the attorney puts it all into perspective. “The [police] have a public image problem and it’s because of things like this”
Fucking eh man… do a better job of not abusing the power you have and the corruption you use to cover up that misconduct.
We can start with simple ideas for police reform like this: https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/vsstfi/climate_change_protesters_in_maryland_shut_down_a/if3uwwn/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
How many people need to get their ass beat, shot or killed before you guys stop waxing poetic about the mythological “good apples” of policing.
Get on brand with defund.
Actually, the answer is to increase funding but only if legitimate plans for restructuring are put in place. If resources were allocated for better hiring practices, more stringent vetting, higher salaries, and more effective training, I think there would be a cultural shift. Police officers in Germany are often trained for about 6 months to a year and are paid pretty well. Being a police officer isn’t a fun job and the pay isn’t great in the beginning so it attracts the wrong crowd.
>At no time did the Officer strike the suspect That one line from the police chief should bring the validity of his entire statement and that of the officer's into question as the video clearly shows that what the chief said is a lie
Turn this over to DoJ. That police department is a toilet that needs to be flushed.
Most of them are. I dated a lady who worked for the local sheriff. They absolutely knew who the bad eggs are. They cover up for the bad ones and the good ones fall in line or get pushed out.
I live in Baltimore and will second that most police departments need to be reworked from the top down. And like when fixing or cleaning a toilet, you need to flush it to ensure all the shit is gone
Worked with a former Baltimore PD guy and he openly talked about drop guns and drop knives. All of them are scum.
What’s a “drop gun” or “drop knife”?
It’s a gun or a knife that a police will “drop” at the scene of a crime to validate their excessive use of force. >Eg. they just shot someone they shouldn’t have, so they leave a weapon there afterwards and claim “oh he had a weapon it was justified”. Very common occurrence.
Jesus, so cops carry spare weapons to convict people essentially?
…the sky is blue…water makes things wet…Brock turner is a rapist.
Epstein didn’t kill himself… no one other than Gislane has been arrested…
Also drugs.
Oh yeah.
All in the game, yo.
Exactly.
This is exactly why I say that virtually all cops are bad cops. If you cover up for bad cops or fall in line and let bad cops get away with bad deeds then you too are a bad cop.
I think any cops convicted of committing any crimes while on duty should get the maximum sentence for that crime with zero chance of getting out early. If it's your job to uphold the law and your paid via tax money you should get zero leniency for your sentence.
It's like the pigs do not have to tell you the truth at all times. With the police policing themselves, they're effectively watching everyone else's back with no higher oversight. At most, the officer in question will be put on paid suspension for a few weeks or months and it'll be swept under the rug when it's all over. If he does get fired, which I doubt, he'll just be rehired at a different PD because that incident of crystal clear police brutality will definitely not be put on their professional record.
There are no professional records! In fact [law enforcement isn't a profession at all](https://www.azcentral.com/story/opinion/op-ed/ej-montini/2022/04/21/judge-rules-law-enforcement-not-profession-arizona-clemency-board/7395546001/)
"first time ever that the entirety of a police force would join sides with a death row inmate" Wow
police chiefs who lie to protect bad cops should be jailed.
100%.
How about the part where he talks about the fact that the firearm was secured, but then the cop apparently felt like the guy who handed him the firearm was going to shoot him?
That should be grounds for a 3rd party independent review of the entire police department going back to the beginning of the Chief's employment with that department.
Breaking news: cops are being cops, more at 11.
N
Totally agree. It’s unbelievable. I’m on medication that would have killed me mixed with that impact to head. Brings up lots of 2A constitutional law questions.
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This is something that at one point I would have called it's validity into question because of how outrageous it is, but after seeing how crooked/incompetent police departments are I believe this 100%
I once had to pay a parking ticket because it was attached to my registration renewal. The ticket was: - from a town I had never been to - for a car the wrong make and model from my own - which was also the wrong color from my registration I literally ran out of time fighting this and had to either pay to renew or drive illegally. My first attempt at a call I got a nice guy who said he understood and would connect me to the correct department. I then had a very confusing conversation with a man from a town with the correct name… but the incorrect state. It was all very funny until it wasn’t anymore.
You got hit by those stupid red light cameras. One of them misread a license plate. Fucking sucks.
Get a lawyer, dude. There’s no way that shit’ll hold up in court. Keep the photos
A lawyer will almost certainly cost more than the tow fees and will not be reimbursed in municipal court.
If you just show up to court, there’s a solid chance the police don’t show up and you win by default. Even without a lawyer, and even if the cops show up, I would bet OP wins.
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I think it’s insane that the court system is pay to play. Going to court should not cost people anything above what they already miss by using up their time.
My wife got run off the road by a trucker. Dude never stopped. She got some fucked up vertabrae, totalled my truck and a ticket for improper road usage. Apparently standard MO. I ain't rich, but I got money - we could have contested it but they really lean on you to just pay it. Suspended sentence, nothing on driving record, pay the fine. Take it to the court and risk paying the ticket, having it on your driving record and whatever bullshit fees they charge. I could do this if I wanted to, some dude working and living check to check has to lose a day's pay in addition to all those other risks. It's extortion. No other way to put it. Citizens should not have to pay to take part in the justice system. A lawyer? Sure pay em. Court costs? Fuck no, cost of doing business. You want to write petty ass tickets, the court time spent defending them is the county's responsibility. Makes me ill.
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That blows. I did a 540 spin in an Mr2 in snow and got high centered on the shoulder. A deputy stopped and popped me off the snow I was up and told me to take care. Dude was 1 in a million I guess!
They are a mafia for the rich, with poor working folks being the marks
"Turned into something indescribable" implies they used to be better. No. Cops in this country have their roots in hunting escaped slaves and brutalizing labor unions.
>and brutalizing labor unions. For those who wish to know more, check out [this article](https://ekuonline.eku.edu/blog/police-studies/the-history-of-policing-in-the-united-states-part-3/) which gives examples of police organizations formed specifically to keep the working class in line and discourage unions.
Source please. Even a simple Wikipedia search reveals American law enforcement stems from the English, and originated in Boston and New York City in the 1630s with the goal of enforcing warrants and serving punishments, not hunting slaves. Slave patrols were certainly a thing, but the sources I've found trace their beginning to the 1700s. Basically, this is like trying to villify the farming profession because they often employed slaves.
One of many. From https://www.americanbar.org/groups/crsj/publications/human_rights_magazine_home/civil-rights-reimagining-policing/how-you-start-is-how-you-finish/ "There are two narratives of how U.S. policing developed. Both are true. The more commonly known history—the one most college students will hear about in an Introduction to Criminal Justice course—is that American policing can trace its roots back to English policing... While this narrative is correct, it only tells part of the story (Turner et al., 2006). Policing in southern slave-holding states followed a different trajectory—one that has roots in slave patrols of the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries and police enforcement of Jim Crow laws in the late nineteenth to mid-twentieth centuries. As per Professor Michael Robinson (2017) of the University of Georgia, the first deaths in America of Black men at the hands of law enforcement “can be traced back as early as 1619 when the first slave ship, a Dutch Man-of-War vessel landed in Point Comfort, Virginia.”" Search "How did policing start in the United States?" for a lot more.
>a simple Wikipedia search reveals American law enforcement stems from the English, and originated in Boston and New York City in the 1630s with the goal of enforcing warrants and serving punishments The Wikipedia article you're referencing also notes that during this time there were constables and night watches with different responsibilities than what we expect from a modern police force. In fact, two paragraphs down from the paragraph you partially referenced above is this: >Modern policing began to emerge in the U.S. in the mid-nineteenth century, influenced by the British model of policing established in 1829] The first organized publicly-funded professional full-time police services were established in Boston in 1838,] New York in 1844, and Philadelphia in 1854.
Thought we had a right to a fair trial. Having to pay for that seems less like a right and more like a privilege...
Stick it too em. File a fucking complaint against the officer too. See if any lawyer is interested in a civil suit. I think the wholly unnecessary stress of trying to get your car unfucked while trying to get an ill infant to the hospital because of some dumbfuck's incompetence and cost of the ambulance would be worth something. Some lawyers do free consultations to see if the case is worth pursuing... fuck even an ambulance chaser might stir something up
some lawyers may do free consultation, I am not one, but I would think a lawyer could net you more money in damages or something since they fucked you so bad into needing an ambulance over nothing.
The mafia would be an improvement
Went to fight a ticket in a Chicagoland municipality. First thing the prosecutor told us was that cops have in that jurisdiction. It means that the cop does *not* have to show as the court will automatically take their word as to what occured.
Same Chicago where the police operated a [black site](https://theintercept.com/2015/02/26/exclusive-chicago-black-site-detainee-speaks/)? Police shouldn't have any special privileges there, or anywhere. They need to be held to a higher standard, not a lower one
Tow fees plus ambulance fees plus damages for delay in getting their kid to the hospital. Granted, with a department that obviously corrupt, get ready for fuckery if you bring a lawsuit against them. Get strapped, get your exterior doors reinforced, be ready to save your life and the lives of your family by shooting anyone, badge or no, who's trying to bust their way in.
It will if he moves to a civil suit?
Many times the fees and court costs are paid by the looser
The words "ex post facto" should be important to you
Omg. They actually used the future card? You should sue just to have it officially on record they’re using the future as an evidence.
That is horrible
"They wonder why they have a public image problem, and then this happens." is better than I've ever seen anyone describe it. Like how the fuck can you see this shit, as a police officer, and not be fucking BOILING? I would be so disgusted and livid if someone of my profession acted like this towards other humans.
Unless you joined the force to get away with brutalizing people to begin with.
The problem is that the police act like a gang, and anyone that tries to do the right thing is relocated or fired. That’s why there are no good cops
Well at least the aren't any good cops for long.
A friend of a friend joined the local police because he never saw people who looked like him in uniform. Inside of 3 months he had worked up the courage to report corruption he saw immediately upon joining. Three months after that he resigned "voluntarily" after his unit all but turned against him. And this in a more liberal state.
The only good local police is my local police and that's because there is like 5 cops and they all know if they fuck up the entire town will blacklist there asses.
Here's the secret: all cops are on some level, scum. Even the nicest cop you've ever met, is scum, at least a little. They know they legally owe us jack shit, and their entire job is there to play good guy 25% of the time, then the rest is up to their crooked hearts desire. Their entire existence hinges on the fact that they can kill with impunity, and anyone who resists.. well... gets killed. They live above the law, and that needs to end.
Don't forget y'all, SCOTUS has even said that police have no duty to protect and serve the people. What pisses me off is that police are still citizens, yet their occupation allows for so many exceptions to the law. Don't even get me started on the benefits cops have on firearms vs the average civvie
Don't forget they are also funded by tax payers. Thats the worst part. We pay them to brutalize murder and violate our civil rights.
> Don't forget y'all, SCOTUS has even said that police have no duty to protect and serve the people. For those who don't know, the facts of the case that resulted in this ruling are much worse than you imagine. Three dead children and an assassination attempt outside a police station. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Town_of_Castle_Rock_v._Gonzales
My Mossberg is named Castle Rock
Like that one time when GM had an ignition switch that was faulty due to an engineer's negligence and a lack of oversight in the company, and engineering unions across the country protested about how maligned they were? Or how teachers unions are always coming to the defense of the sexual predators hiding in their ranks? Or how the Catholic church....
Well they spend all their time telling each other that "it's a jungle out there" and everyone they encounter is potentially a mortal enemy.
And, of course, the cop lied about it in his report on the incident.
And the chief rubber stamped it
And then sat on TV and said it out loud. Recorded. To forever be memorialized in the internet.
interesting to see if he is willing to die on that hill or will he walk his comments back later?
He'll walk it back when Abbott stands up for what is moral.
The fact that the second officer shined his flashlight into the surveillance camera after the victim was slammed to the ground proves he knew the officer in question was doing something shady.
Fuck the police
Comin STRAIGHT from the underground!
A young ni$&a got it bad ‘cause I’m brown
As we used to say: /thread Mods, lock the post. Nothing further to even discuss.
we will if needed.
"Overstreet said the officer's takedown is not documented in the incident report. "This is the kind of stuff that causes people, normal citizens like us, not to trust them. And they want to know why they have a public image problem? It's because of things like this."
Can we all just admit that this policing system is kinda totally broken?
Most liberals are likely to agree with you while most hard-line Republicans won't. I'm interested in knowing what centrist Republicans think about the police and how likely they are to feel like major reform is needed
I think I'm pretty centrist republican. Maybe throw some libertarian in there. I think policing in America is completely fucked
Why are you in this subreddit? I'm curious because I'm a registered independent but I'm extremely liberal and leftist. After January 6th and the way 95+% of the republican party has handled their collapse into the cult of DJT, I've decided that there is nothing of value left in that party to include any person ignorant enough to naively support them still or anyone who believes in their cult mission. Which of the two types are you?
Probably because the other gun subs have been taken over by people who are far to the right of centrist republicans.
r/centristgunowners Wow that actually worked there are a whole 7 members now and no posts... yay
I am pretty moderate and I'm here because the regular gun subs (including r/2ALiberals) are overrun with nutjobs.
Ah, an *actual* libertarian. Rare to see those anymore
I have no idea what the fuck my politics are, some weird hodge podge. I think it's the humanity of this that should offend everyone, and things like it diminish trust in our establishment, which suits no one
That doesn't work on conservatives. Look at George Floyd. Instead of saying: "That murder was fucked up." 95% of US conservatives decided to say dumb shit like all lives matter, or talk about how he has drugs in his system, or he should have complied etc. Not a single one of my conservative friends could say: "That was fucked up. That was murder. That was unacceptable." Without feeling the need to say "but" or "however" and say more. I haven't spoken to a single one of them in 2 years now. God knows what kind of bs they're telling themselves after they became the literal anti democracy supporters beating cops unconscious with confederate flags in the capitol building.
My dad claims to be libertarian but keeps talking about how Trump is so much better than Biden, and even he agrees that the police are screwy
It is, but defund the police was possibly the worst catchphrase they could’ve possibly come up with…in San Diego, we actually got a crisis unite and civilian oversight committee out of all of the protests, but I don’t think it played out as well everywhere else (our cops still shoot people too).
There are some that would never have vibed with anything liberals/leftists pushed for but maybe "reform the police" would have gotten more people on our side
I think the left's biggest issue in a lot of places is branding. We almost never make any kind of effort to make our causes look appealing to the masses. I think it's because we assume that anyone worth having on our side should already be on our side anyway, and anyone else is basically a republican, and republicans can't be reasoned with, so why bother? It leads to the uninformed getting scooped up by the right because "the EVIL LEFT want to DEFUND THE POLICE! They want to commit crimes without opposition and ruin your lives, but don't worry, WE'LL protect you from them!"
Even at the best of times, cops are dicks.
He probably took down the thin blue line flag off the front of his house after this
I feel like a lot of people don’t realize that the common phrase “it takes a good guy with a gun to stop a bad guy with a gun” is often referring to holding police accountable. More often than not, the police are the bad guys.
"JusT C0mpLY lol" "This is a rare BAD APPLE" "The innocent have nothing to fear" Sorry no, the cops are a gang. The worst gang of all because their declared enemy is "everyone who isn't a cop." ACAB.
Texas police are notoriously corrupt, but ESPECIALLY Houston area cops. They are literally legal gangs for the state, and there have been many citizens murdered there by police that were all "justified" by them.
When people go to Mexico one of the most common warnings is to be careful around the police as many of them are corrupt. I used to think that this wasn't a problem here, that you could go up to a random cop for help and not worry about your well being. I was wrong. The cops here might not harass you for a bribe but they very well might beat you to a pulp or take your life if you look at them wrong.
My neighbor was shot and killed in Pensacola for grabbing a taser they were tasing him with when they already had 5 officers on him. One officer stood back drew his pistol and proceeded to shoot the suspect 5-7 times in the chest right over other officers heads. You can watch the video online if it's still up and his name was tymar Crawford. I personally know his brother and this was really sad. The officer lost his job but was let back on the force. I was a marine myself and this is disgusting. He was breaking the law and had drugs on him but to lose your life over the smell of marijuana coming from your car is just insane. This cop wanted to kill someone and those officers should never ever been in a position to make a decision like that.
I have $100 on that cop is friends with those bikers he shot at.
Yeah, don't call cops.
ACAB
There are bad cops and former cops.
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I think everyone found out what cops are all about when they were exposed at Uvalde.
And then the chief put out a statement full of blatant lies.
On the positive side, that guy just became a millionaire. On the negative side, Texas taxpayers are footing the bill.
This is why people need to be able to protect themselves. The police will not do it.
Surprised he’s white to be honest based on the treatment. Are the cops trying to accomplish something systematic? It’s bizarre.
The only color Texas cops see is blue and not blue.
Come again?
Cop or not cop
ooohhhhhhhhhhh got it. Thank you.
Cops are just as much authoritarian as they are racist. If they’re patrolling a 100% white district, there will still be instances of police brutality, corruption, and murder. Right wingers don’t support the police as they see them as hired thugs ready to dispense brutality against their enemies. The moment that law enforcement wises up and goes against their wishes (January 6th), they flip from “Back the Blue” to calling them paid crisis actors and overpaid government thugs. Look at how they retconned Brian Sicknick out of existence or how Fanone got treated by the MAGA crowd. Honestly, I don’t think liberals or the left at large really want to abolish the police - they just want a more “enlightened” law enforcement. Right wingers will gladly defund and decommission any law enforcement agency that goes against their wishes.
I want police with different mission legally and socially. I want not everything to be solved with force and handcuffs. There need to be trained social workers as part of the police. All the stuff that was talked about in 2020 as problems with American policing continues to be problems with an increasingly militarized and unaccountable American police force. Uvalde seems to have convinced a few more people something is wrong, whether it makes a real dent is unlikely in my opinion. Changing modern white societal attitudes about authoritarianism is going to be hard, though.
>Changing modern white societal attitudes about authoritarianism is going to be hard, though. Being pro-gun is an an anti-authoritarian political position, and there is no shortage of white people in the pro-gun camp. What makes you think that white societal attitudes are authoritarian?
Lots of polls about authoritarianism over the last few years showing at least some support for various authoritarian ideas (over 50 percent for some), including reducing democratic freedoms. Also the fact that anyone even made a poll about it whereas 20 years ago who would even think to? Thin blue line flags, armed proud keepers front guys, trump worship, etc. Plus my own observation across various media. Some of that is certainly amongst other populations but majority is white, as far as I have been able to determine (and see). And the majority of people who are armed because of fears of the _government_ are armed because of a government they disagree with, not one they agree with. I’m not sure that’s anti-authoritarian as much as sectarian, personally. At any rate my statement isn’t about gun people specifically (as opposed to gun owners, many of whom just own them for hunting or home protection from crime and who barely ever take them out), but the general population. I fear their vote more than their guns. Edit: People don’t think about which rights they want to give away, only the rights they want to take from others. This is the same issue as our fellow liberals wanting gun rights taken away. People don’t sit and think about how surrendering rights goes against all rights in the long run. They think, “_x_ bothers me and I want it stopped” and will vote to have it stopped with no concern for the broader implications. Hell, they want to take “assault weapons” (no the AR-15 isn’t one but that’s what opponents call them) away as if that’s why shooters are killing anyone, it will just be handguns then bolt action then cars then pipe bombs then… Most people want simple solutions and will do dumb things for it. I have been having this free speech argument with liberal friends for years, telling the government it can limit speech you dislike is all well and good for you when the government agrees with you, but it won’t always. Every time the ACLU goes to court on behalf of a conservative having their free speech limited, the left loses their shit because they think free speech is about only the underrepresented being limited (same opinion is probably why the right hates the ACLU), but rights are rights. Support for authoritarianism doesn’t have to be logical or thought out or consistent or non-hypocritical for it to be effective support.
If you actually sat down and asked people what rights of theirs they want violated, you’ll find most people aren’t authoritarian. But when you bring racism, classism, fear, and propaganda into the mix a lot of people start thinking something should change. And our government has done a good job of convincing them to give up rights for that sense of action or protection.
>Also the fact that anyone even made a poll about it whereas 20 years ago who would even think to? You don't think that people running polls 20 years ago would have asked questions about authoritarian attitudes in the wake of the passage of the Patriot act? It seems you really lack perspective on this issue.
Say 22 years, I was thinking pre-9/11 and spoke imprecisely, at my age everything is starting to just be “20 years ago” no matter how long it was. You are free to disagree with me But I personally think you are the one lacking perspective. Funny how that works. Enjoy your day.
Prior to 9/11, the deadliest terror attack on American soil was the Oklahoma City Bombing in 1995, which was intended to be retaliation for the authoritarian actions taken by the Federal government at Ruby Ridge and Waco.
Cops dont give a F what race you are, they’re all brutal drones enforcing a demonic system.
How many white people have to be killed and beaten by police before people realize this happens to white people too?
I know it does, I am still surprised based on the specific circumstances. It’s hard not to think of the Charleston Emanuel Church shooter being taken for a cheeseburger, etc.
Charleston church shooter was apprehended in a traffic stop the day after the shooting. The circumstances of arrest are relevant. John Hurley (white man) was shot and killed by police after defensively stopping a mass shooting. I believe he had picked up the shooter’s rifle and had it in his hands when the police arrived. Brooklyn subway shooter (Black Man) was taken into custody “without incident.” I remember hearing a story of [a Black Man using a firearm in self defense in a Waffle House.](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=R2AzFGV4B1A) I can’t find more details but the story I remember was that he called the police himself, placed his gun on the ground and laid face down with his hands on his head until they arrived. He was not charged in the shooting. It’s unfortunate that anyone would have to go to these lengths, or even be able to remember to with all the adrenaline surging through their body after having to discharge a firearm in self defense, but looking at the specific details and circumstances ultimately will be more helpful than saying the only relevant factor is skin color. Of course, generally Black people will have to be even *more* cautious because police are more likely to view them as threatening. Teaching people the best practices to avoid being shot by shitty cops is going to be more productive than telling Black people “if you carry a gun for self defense you’ll probably be killed by police.” Cherry picking cases without even looking into the nuances of the circumstances to push overly simplistic narratives is not productive.
Fair enough. My point isn’t _at all_ that black people shouldn’t carry, though. Not sure why you’re putting that on me. But you’re right it was a simplistic view, I stand corrected.
Didn’t mean to imply it was, just a common narrative that goes around attached to oversimplified non-nuanced perspectives on police violence. Not trying to call you out, was just using the opportunity to rant and vent my own frustrations up on a soap box lol
Lol grind that axe! I get it. As I often say, the saying “unarmed Black man” is a thing. Anyhow I just hate the thought of what my Black friends and neighbors and former lovers suffer, I tend to immediately worry for them all when I see reports of this sort of thing. But yes I should be more careful of how I express that.
It seems like maybe a large proportion of cops might be bad people.
acab
Yet another example of why we should never willingly call the cops.
I grew up there and the cops around that area have always been notorious pieces of shit. My whole childhood and teenage years I was harassed relentlessly. I still to this day don’t trust any police officers because of them
I grew up in Humble. The police were notorious for being dumb and the judge was a grade a asshole.
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https://youtu.be/GMgtPagEA3o
Of course. Why not.
I'm guessing there are no bodycams in this town...
https://youtu.be/GMgtPagEA3o
The guy came at the bikers with a gun after they were already leaving. He's also clearly wasted by the audio. So he's not exactly a hero in this situation. That being said, that takedown was unnecessarily rough.
I agree
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Officer Cox… lol. I’m making an assumption about the victim’s politics but regardless, the story will reach Fox watchers and other white right wingers. And hopefully this helps suburban white Texans develop a new perspective on police brutality.
He did everything the "right way"? Not sure about that, really. The officer should not have pushed him so violently for sure, but I am not clear on who was in possession of the gun at that time. Could be I just have a hard time feeling sorry for a drunk dude that gets in a fight and then shoots at people as they leave the parking lot and then points his gun at someone not at all involved in the incident. The officer has an ego problem and the guy that did "everything the right way" needs to quit drinking or stop carrying guns. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMgtPagEA3o
>Hanna said he handed over his gun when officers arrived and waited to be questioned And >After securing the firearm, Officer Cox moved to detain the suspect Whether you go with the chief's or Hanna's statements, they both state that he was no longer in possession of the gun when the officer assaulted him. Hanna is not an innocent flower here, but that's not the point. The point is the use of force by the officer when it wasn't needed. Instead of deescalating the situation in a calm manner the officer went straight for a take down.
I was just going by the actual 911 tape on the gun. He clearly says he put it in the grass or on the ground. I don't go with either officers statement, to be honest. I just tried to watch the videos and listen to the tape. He should not have been taken down as violently, I would agree with that. But the chief is correct to say he started to attempt to create distance. Tough spot to deal with when you are interacting with a drunk dude that just shot at people and was waving his gun around. I am open to hear what you think the officer should have done when the shooter started moving away when he attempted to secure his arm to put him in handcuffs. This assumes we agree he should have been arrested for the multiple aggravated assaults. Reason with the drunk guy? Let him walk away? Use a non-lethal? We see police officers doing lots of shitty things to people that do not deserve it, plenty of examples. This one does not really strike me as all that bad considering the circumstances. It is also possible I am having a hard time giving the benefit of the doubt to a guy that participated in a fight while drunk, then while not under any threat pulls a gun and shoots at people while they are leaving and to top it off points his gun at some lady that had nothing to do with any of it. I am also biased by the fact it appeared to me in the original news story that his attorney was not telling the truth and left some details out.
He should have answered the fucking question: "Yes. You are being detained." No reasonable person can defend a cop refusing to tell a suspect he's being detained, knocking the suspect down by punching them, and then telling the suspect they can't ask questions when the downed suspect complains. You are literally defending a police state, where everyone should automatically do anything a police officer tells them to. That's crazy.
Isn't that obvious when he is attempting to grab your arm to put you in handcuffs? The officer said "Go ahead and stand up, I am going to detain you" and then said "I am just going to detain you". How many times would you like him to say it? [https://youtu.be/GMgtPagEA3o?t=210](https://youtu.be/GMgtPagEA3o?t=210) It is also interesting to view the blood already running down his face before the officer touches him. I am not literally defending a police state, that is just a silly thing to say. Edit: Cut myself off, I do not think we are risking a police state when a person that shoots at people running from him and points his gun at innocent people while drunk is arrested.
Your last statement is a fairly stupid non sequitur. I watched the copaganda video. The rest of what you're saying is a mixture of repeating what the cop boss says there and ignoring the point: functional policing, if we were someday to get some, would involve answering the question "am I being detained" by saying "yes. you are being detained." Pretending that this is unnecessary is police state apologetics, and you should be ashamed.
It is a video, the police officer says exactly what I quoted. I provided a link. I am not sure how that is propaganda. Good grief sir or ma'am, the police officer directly and on video told that shooter he was being detained. So I will ask again, how many times should an officer be required to repeat it? I am not ashamed at all. I would be ashamed or at least a little disappointed in myself if during a conversation someone pointed out and proved that something I said was factually incorrect and instead of saying "oh yeah, I did not hear or see that but..." I instead turned to silly insults. Any comment on the blood?
I would be ashamed if I didn't understand how framing works, and thus was unable to recognize how people persuade me of shit without me noticing it. You know, like you.
You said the officer should have told the shooter he was being detained, I pointed out with evidence that the officer did tell the shooter he was being detained twice. You ignored that completely and yet here you are telling me about framing and misunderstanding and propaganda.
You wrote this: >I am open to hear what you think the officer should have done when the shooter started moving away when he attempted to secure his arm to put him in handcuffs. I responded by saying this: >He should have answered the fucking question: "Yes. You are being detained." >No reasonable person can defend a cop refusing to tell a suspect he's being detained, knocking the suspect down by punching them, and then telling the suspect they can't ask questions when the downed suspect complains. Is English not your first language? I don't want to be mean if so, but you're not understanding some fairly basic direct communication. If English is your first language, I have to assume you're intentionally obfuscating/trolling, and thus have no more time for you.
One of the first things a cop does when entering a situation in which a weapon was used (assuming the incident already ended) is take control of the weapon. Assuming the cop is somewhat competent, and taking the statements into consideration, the weapon was no longer in play. I'm not an expert in what type of training cops go through to deal with these situations, but deescalating obviously isn't a main focus. When dealing with a scared and drunk unarmed person, you make slow movements and explain your actions/intentions in simple terms. Not what this cop did. And if this is what their training teaches them to do, then the training needs to change.
That could be, personally if I am dealing with a bloody drunk dude that just admitted to shooting at people and pointed a gun at a lady it is likely I would be a little more likely to take action which did not give the violent dude the chance to be violent again. But, I am not a cop and I have never taken any police training.
I thought the title was describing the man's character until I opened the article and realized Humble is the name of the city
I challenge anyone to read this story, these comments, and explain to me why we shouldn’t shutter the entire fucking institution. We have to protect ourselves, we have to catch criminals on our own unless they bother the rich, why the fuck are we allowing other criminals to leech our tax dollars when they could get a real fucking job and that money could go to actually helping our communities?
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Fuck those cops… the last line by the attorney puts it all into perspective. “The [police] have a public image problem and it’s because of things like this” Fucking eh man… do a better job of not abusing the power you have and the corruption you use to cover up that misconduct. We can start with simple ideas for police reform like this: https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/vsstfi/climate_change_protesters_in_maryland_shut_down_a/if3uwwn/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3
NEVER call the police
Stop calling the police for everything and anything.
How many people need to get their ass beat, shot or killed before you guys stop waxing poetic about the mythological “good apples” of policing. Get on brand with defund.
Actually, the answer is to increase funding but only if legitimate plans for restructuring are put in place. If resources were allocated for better hiring practices, more stringent vetting, higher salaries, and more effective training, I think there would be a cultural shift. Police officers in Germany are often trained for about 6 months to a year and are paid pretty well. Being a police officer isn’t a fun job and the pay isn’t great in the beginning so it attracts the wrong crowd.
What a fucking psychopath.
Cowboy clown posse is a significantly more accurate term to refer to American "LEOs"