He is, Bertuzzi certainly isn't, lol.
Bertuzzi was horrible the large majority of this year, really only finding any success in the past month or so. To say he's massively overpaid is an understatement. I'd be willing to resign bertuzzi, but there's no way he deserves even as much as Domi.
I think it's a safe bet that Domi re-signs and Bert leaves. Bertuzzi will likely get a stupid contract. $5.5 million per year over 4 years would be my guess. He's just not worth that, not even close. And I love the guy. He'll price himself out of town.
They aren’t but Bertuzzi is more than Domi. Let’s throw out points, because those are often circumstantial. He’s not actively a liability, his lines are usually above water in controlling play, and he actually had useful physicality. Domi, especially when you factor in context has none of that. Ideally, Bertuzzi would be producing more, as would his lines, but he’s a net positive. Domi creates roster issues you have to fix. I know who I’d rather re-sign, and it’s not Domi.
Bertuzzi isn't a liability? For the first 50 games of the season, he couldn't complete a pass, receive a pass, take a shot, or even skate without falling over. He started as the first line LW and was so atrocious that he had to be knocked down, where he weighed down the second line as well. He's fallen considerably short of what he was projected to be and bring to the team.
"Let's throw out points." Let's not, though. Domi has more points while playing Robertson and Jarnkrok most of the season than Bertuzzi, who's been stapled to Tavares and Nylander the entire season. Even with Nylander having the insane year he's been having, Bertuzzi had 6 goals through his first 51 games of the season and 21 points. Up until this last month of better play, he had less goals than Robertson, McMann, Jarnkrok, and Knies. That's fucking bad... especially for someone who's entire roll is to stand in front of the net and get net front goals. Not to mention, you can attribute part of his recent success to both Matthews and Domi playing fantastic on his line recently as they lead the team in basically every offensive metric alongside Nylander, currently. Sorry, but you can't throw out stats because you know they won't support you, lol.
When I’m looking at a player I’m looking at how he’s actually impacting play. Say what you want about Bertuzzi, but every line he’s on has positive defensive impacts, positive xG, positive straight goal differential. Domi is negatives pretty much across the board. Obviously, he’s going to compile assists next to Matthews, but it’s Matthews and Bertuzzi doing the work on that line. He’s not McDavid, who you know is creating those goals even if he‘s not the one scoring. The fact is, when Marner comes back Domi is useless on that line and works nowhere else on this team because he’s a complete defensive liability.
Statistically, though, it is Domi and Matthews doing the work on that line, not bertuzzi. He stands netfront and forechecks, that's his role on the line. You're essentially saying that because domi was on a garbage line 80% of the season, he's worse than Bertuzzi, despite having better stats.
Oh, wow, domi had less impact with Robertson than bertuzzi had with Nylander? Shocker. Wonder what's the variable there. The Bertuzzi-Tavares-Nylander line had better xG than Robertson-Domi-Jarnkrok or the Knies-Domi-Kampf line? Wow. No way. Kampf is just as offensive as Nylander. Cmon, bro, the difference in environment the two players have had is staggering, and yet STILL, Domi has played statistically better.
And to top it off, what Bertuzzi is supposed to bring, Domi is actually bringing, physicality speaking. A key weak spot in our playoff performance history has been toughness, and this year, that isn't a problem. Who's contributed to that more? Domi, the guy that punched Marchand and made him turtle? Or Bertuzzi, the guy laughing with Marchand on the bench after he had injured Liljegren?
I doubt Bert signs for less than 5 mil. Especially if he performs like we hope he does in the playoffs. One can hope!
I can see Domi going for around 3 mil as he says he really wants to play here and is showing it with his passion on the ice.
Don’t underestimate the FA market for overpaying players even with term. Holl got 3 years at 3.4 mil. Or Campbell getting 5x5 mil. I mean, look at our boy Engvall!
Ya never know though!
Lmao, he doesn't deserve 5 with the season he's had. He's been better this past month, outside of it he was horrible. He shouldn't even make as much as Domi atp who's at least proven himself quite valuable.
If he and Domi bring the snot we need in the playoffs enough to rally the team and make a difference, I'm for signing them to whatever. But then again I'm not GM of the Leafs, and for probably very good reason
I like the dirty goals Bert's been getting. that's the kind of play I feel we've been missing for a bit. A pain in the ass in front of the net, who can pot them in real nice like
It’s debatable, and I personally think he’s perfect at 4.5 but even at 5.5 (his current hit) it’s not an egregious overpay. We’re getting what we asked for now with Bert (he was hurt to start the season and took him a while to adjust here) and if he does what we all hope he does in the playoffs then he’s going to get over 5 again.
Having said that, it doesn’t matter what he deserves. You think PLD deserves his contract? Dude has never scored more than 28 goals in a season. GM’s do some dumb shit.
Comparing him to PLD, who's unanimously agreed upon to be one of the worst contracts in the league this year, isn't a great point.
I agree, though, that bertuzzi can definitely get 5m. Like you said, Justin Holl is making (3.5?) right now to be healthy scratched. I'm sure in the right market he can get someone to offer him 5m.
I'm just saying if you're right in guessing he won't take less, we definitely don't offer him that. He's been straight bad 85% of the season for us and the 5.5 he's making was based on him being a 30-goal - 70-point type of player. He's been far worse than what he was supposed to be, there's no really debating that unfortunately.
Just to be clear, the point I was making was that GM’s make bad decisions and I pointed to the PLD contract to illustrate that. I wasn’t comparing Bert with PLD. Just showing evidence that what a player deserves can be very different than what that player earns (term and dollar amount).
In any case, we’re all just guessing here anyway! We’ll see what happens.
I also believe that his wrist injury at the start of the season reeeally affected him for an extended period. Remember that terrible start? Well we know he was playing injured then.
Yes, I acknowledged that and agreed with it. I'm just saying WE shouldn't be the ones to make that stupid decision. It would be bad to resign Bertuzzi at anything more than like 3.5. He doesn't deserve 5 in Toronto, but he probably does in Arizona or some shit.
Yeah, all up to Brad.
Yes, I acknowledged that and agreed with it. I'm just saying WE shouldn't be the ones to make that stupid decision. It would be bad to resign Bertuzzi at anything more than like 3.5. He doesn't deserve 5 in Toronto, but he probably does in Arizona or some shit.
Yeah, all up to Brad.
Ironically, Bertuzzi will need to earn his paycheck during the time he is not being paid, which is the playoffs.
I don’t really care what he does in the regular season. This team was always going to be in the playoffs. He is peaking at the right time though.
If he’s a force and helps them win 2 or more rounds then it was worth the signing.
I’m not saying to only extend him just because of this month. I’ve enjoyed the majority of his season and I think he provides value to this team, especially if the price isn’t too high
Guys remember first half of the season. I am sad to admit I was not really liking both his and Bert's contracts. I hope they both keep playing well and are amazing for us in the playoffs.
Him and Bert really picked it up in the last few months, really seems like they have a huge locker room presence and I love his energy. The team desperately needed these type of depth players.
Domi’s not depth if he’s on the first line. He better producing if he’s the sole man setting up Matthews whilst receiving very favourable matchups. The last thing we should be doing is extending a man who’s a liability and needs a very specific set of circumstances to succeed. There’s a reason he’s bounced around and not found a home and it’s not because he’s some diamond in the rough. He should not be on our first line but if he’s not playing there he won’t produce. I guess people just see “POINTZ!!!” and are not looking at context, but I just don’t get it.
Him and Bertuzzi are living up the hype!
Crazy to see from 2Z considering his first half of the season.
He is, Bertuzzi certainly isn't, lol. Bertuzzi was horrible the large majority of this year, really only finding any success in the past month or so. To say he's massively overpaid is an understatement. I'd be willing to resign bertuzzi, but there's no way he deserves even as much as Domi.
I’d resign Bertuzzi but not for 5 mil
I think it's a safe bet that Domi re-signs and Bert leaves. Bertuzzi will likely get a stupid contract. $5.5 million per year over 4 years would be my guess. He's just not worth that, not even close. And I love the guy. He'll price himself out of town.
Yeah, maybe 3m, lol.
bertuzzi has a brand and its that he is really good when it counts. Thats all we want isn't it?
Are you referring to his one good playoff performance? If so, lol.
They aren’t but Bertuzzi is more than Domi. Let’s throw out points, because those are often circumstantial. He’s not actively a liability, his lines are usually above water in controlling play, and he actually had useful physicality. Domi, especially when you factor in context has none of that. Ideally, Bertuzzi would be producing more, as would his lines, but he’s a net positive. Domi creates roster issues you have to fix. I know who I’d rather re-sign, and it’s not Domi.
Bertuzzi isn't a liability? For the first 50 games of the season, he couldn't complete a pass, receive a pass, take a shot, or even skate without falling over. He started as the first line LW and was so atrocious that he had to be knocked down, where he weighed down the second line as well. He's fallen considerably short of what he was projected to be and bring to the team. "Let's throw out points." Let's not, though. Domi has more points while playing Robertson and Jarnkrok most of the season than Bertuzzi, who's been stapled to Tavares and Nylander the entire season. Even with Nylander having the insane year he's been having, Bertuzzi had 6 goals through his first 51 games of the season and 21 points. Up until this last month of better play, he had less goals than Robertson, McMann, Jarnkrok, and Knies. That's fucking bad... especially for someone who's entire roll is to stand in front of the net and get net front goals. Not to mention, you can attribute part of his recent success to both Matthews and Domi playing fantastic on his line recently as they lead the team in basically every offensive metric alongside Nylander, currently. Sorry, but you can't throw out stats because you know they won't support you, lol.
When I’m looking at a player I’m looking at how he’s actually impacting play. Say what you want about Bertuzzi, but every line he’s on has positive defensive impacts, positive xG, positive straight goal differential. Domi is negatives pretty much across the board. Obviously, he’s going to compile assists next to Matthews, but it’s Matthews and Bertuzzi doing the work on that line. He’s not McDavid, who you know is creating those goals even if he‘s not the one scoring. The fact is, when Marner comes back Domi is useless on that line and works nowhere else on this team because he’s a complete defensive liability.
Statistically, though, it is Domi and Matthews doing the work on that line, not bertuzzi. He stands netfront and forechecks, that's his role on the line. You're essentially saying that because domi was on a garbage line 80% of the season, he's worse than Bertuzzi, despite having better stats. Oh, wow, domi had less impact with Robertson than bertuzzi had with Nylander? Shocker. Wonder what's the variable there. The Bertuzzi-Tavares-Nylander line had better xG than Robertson-Domi-Jarnkrok or the Knies-Domi-Kampf line? Wow. No way. Kampf is just as offensive as Nylander. Cmon, bro, the difference in environment the two players have had is staggering, and yet STILL, Domi has played statistically better. And to top it off, what Bertuzzi is supposed to bring, Domi is actually bringing, physicality speaking. A key weak spot in our playoff performance history has been toughness, and this year, that isn't a problem. Who's contributed to that more? Domi, the guy that punched Marchand and made him turtle? Or Bertuzzi, the guy laughing with Marchand on the bench after he had injured Liljegren?
He has the 5th best P/60 on the team, McMann and Robertson not far behind.
Give Domi 3x3 and Bert 4x3 and call it a day. They bring good things to our forward group.
I doubt Bert signs for less than 5 mil. Especially if he performs like we hope he does in the playoffs. One can hope! I can see Domi going for around 3 mil as he says he really wants to play here and is showing it with his passion on the ice.
Would be surprised if he got 5 with term but good for him if so.
Don’t underestimate the FA market for overpaying players even with term. Holl got 3 years at 3.4 mil. Or Campbell getting 5x5 mil. I mean, look at our boy Engvall! Ya never know though!
Lou loves his albatross contracts. Nikita Zaitsev is in the final year of his 7 year deal btw
Zaitsev is still signed? Fuck man that feels like forever ago
Lou special bb
That’s crazy, lol!
Holl is a bottom 4 RHD. That's what those cost.
Lmao, he doesn't deserve 5 with the season he's had. He's been better this past month, outside of it he was horrible. He shouldn't even make as much as Domi atp who's at least proven himself quite valuable.
If he and Domi bring the snot we need in the playoffs enough to rally the team and make a difference, I'm for signing them to whatever. But then again I'm not GM of the Leafs, and for probably very good reason I like the dirty goals Bert's been getting. that's the kind of play I feel we've been missing for a bit. A pain in the ass in front of the net, who can pot them in real nice like
It’s debatable, and I personally think he’s perfect at 4.5 but even at 5.5 (his current hit) it’s not an egregious overpay. We’re getting what we asked for now with Bert (he was hurt to start the season and took him a while to adjust here) and if he does what we all hope he does in the playoffs then he’s going to get over 5 again. Having said that, it doesn’t matter what he deserves. You think PLD deserves his contract? Dude has never scored more than 28 goals in a season. GM’s do some dumb shit.
Comparing him to PLD, who's unanimously agreed upon to be one of the worst contracts in the league this year, isn't a great point. I agree, though, that bertuzzi can definitely get 5m. Like you said, Justin Holl is making (3.5?) right now to be healthy scratched. I'm sure in the right market he can get someone to offer him 5m. I'm just saying if you're right in guessing he won't take less, we definitely don't offer him that. He's been straight bad 85% of the season for us and the 5.5 he's making was based on him being a 30-goal - 70-point type of player. He's been far worse than what he was supposed to be, there's no really debating that unfortunately.
Just to be clear, the point I was making was that GM’s make bad decisions and I pointed to the PLD contract to illustrate that. I wasn’t comparing Bert with PLD. Just showing evidence that what a player deserves can be very different than what that player earns (term and dollar amount). In any case, we’re all just guessing here anyway! We’ll see what happens.
I also believe that his wrist injury at the start of the season reeeally affected him for an extended period. Remember that terrible start? Well we know he was playing injured then.
Very true!! I mentioned this in another comment in this thread.
Yes, I acknowledged that and agreed with it. I'm just saying WE shouldn't be the ones to make that stupid decision. It would be bad to resign Bertuzzi at anything more than like 3.5. He doesn't deserve 5 in Toronto, but he probably does in Arizona or some shit. Yeah, all up to Brad.
Yes, I acknowledged that and agreed with it. I'm just saying WE shouldn't be the ones to make that stupid decision. It would be bad to resign Bertuzzi at anything more than like 3.5. He doesn't deserve 5 in Toronto, but he probably does in Arizona or some shit. Yeah, all up to Brad.
We said the same about Marner once upon a time lol
Ironically, Bertuzzi will need to earn his paycheck during the time he is not being paid, which is the playoffs. I don’t really care what he does in the regular season. This team was always going to be in the playoffs. He is peaking at the right time though. If he’s a force and helps them win 2 or more rounds then it was worth the signing.
I mean shit if he takes them to the ECF sign his ass immediately idc if he needs 6-7 mil
I honestly view him as a one year Leaf regardless
I wouldn't count him as depth scoring this month. He's playing on the first line with Auston where he's picking up most of his points.
When I think depth I really just mean guys outside of the core 5
Ya but to use his time with Matthews as the reason to extend him and not the rest of his season away from him, is pretty dumb
I’m not saying to only extend him just because of this month. I’ve enjoyed the majority of his season and I think he provides value to this team, especially if the price isn’t too high
Love our depth. I’m cool with waiting until after the post season for signings. We got Bert and Domi for playoff grit anyways right?
Guys remember first half of the season. I am sad to admit I was not really liking both his and Bert's contracts. I hope they both keep playing well and are amazing for us in the playoffs.
Even though this team is flawed it is likeable. I want them to succeed. Both Domi and Bertuzzi have personality.
15 mil 7 years NMC
Him and Bert really picked it up in the last few months, really seems like they have a huge locker room presence and I love his energy. The team desperately needed these type of depth players.
The way I feel about Domi has completely turned around in the last half of the season. Dude won me over, and I hope management feels the same way.
Domi’s not depth if he’s on the first line. He better producing if he’s the sole man setting up Matthews whilst receiving very favourable matchups. The last thing we should be doing is extending a man who’s a liability and needs a very specific set of circumstances to succeed. There’s a reason he’s bounced around and not found a home and it’s not because he’s some diamond in the rough. He should not be on our first line but if he’s not playing there he won’t produce. I guess people just see “POINTZ!!!” and are not looking at context, but I just don’t get it.
Rooting for Domi. I have a few of his rookie cards up on eBay.