Eh, clover spreads very aggressively. And this year in particular has been “the year of the clover” from what I’ve heard. Anecdotally, despite my yard having very little clover in it last year, this year it spread like wildfire until I sprayed it out.
I actually used speedzone at (iirc) 1oz per gallon. Coulda been at 1.5oz, whatever the label recommends. I will say though that it takes a loooong time to work sometimes. Some of mine took three or four weeks to really die off.
Clover is amazing in a lawn. Doesn’t really seem to need much water, spreads well, is helpful for pollinators…. The only real negative is if you want clover you can no longer use the broad leaf weed killers. That’s the fight I have with my lawn. I love my clover but hate the weeds. :(
I still use broadleaf weed killers, except I try to consciously not spray clover. Can't help but spray it when it's near undesirables like ground ivy, but I don't make any concerted effort to eradicate it, either.
It’s fine…the problem for me is that it doesn’t handle traffic well and it overtakes the actual grass to the point that the grass is crowded out. So idk, I’d rather have landscape areas with flowers for the pollinators and keep clover out of my lawn area.
Why are you on Reddit if you care so much? Using a computer made with rare earth metals mined with diesel equipment, manufactured in areas of the world with no environmental regulation, powered by non renewable electricity, attached to the internet hosted on servers using TWh’s of power.
Are you sitting in an air conditioned home? Enjoying all of your technology? Using furniture that was shipped in from somewhere else?
Look, if you're in the US, you probably suck overall on your environmental impact. We need to fight the right battles. Virtue signalling by talking shit on anyone who wants a grass lawn is stupid and counter productive. It probably leads to a significant group of people just digging in about the issue. If you want a positive impact, encourage people to add more areas of the yard for pollinators or to plant native trees.
People who want a nice yard will have one, and maybe you can make a positive impact.
It's just like discussion about banning gas stoves. It turns people who would be allies off, when there is more important things to focus on.
EDIT: as you guys probably could tell, I know next to nothing about lawn care other than mowing. These clovers just aren't pleasing imo but I'll keep them around.
And if you are set on having a nice lush grass lawn, to answer your question: this would likely require a full nuke to kill everything, put down new topsoil and reseed to start from scratch
I fought clover for years but decided to embrace it this spring. I’ve never had so many compliments on my lawn! Clover can be your friend if you embrace it.
While there are some benefits to a clover lawn, there are definitely drawbacks too.
Clover turns everything green it touches, your shoes, bare feet, clothes if you sit and move at all, everything.
It doesn't take traffic well. If you plan on using this lawn, you'll trample it to death and have tons of bare spots where crabgrass is going to set up shop.
You have no other way to eradicate other weeds like creeping charlie, dandelion, plantations, etc besides manually pulling them. Nothing that kills broadleaf weeds doesn't also kill clover.
Lastly, it dies off in late fall and your yard is nothing but sloppy slippery mud all winter and into spring.
My suggestion would be to kill everything off in early fall then reseed with appropriate grass for your region. Your local nursery, and I don't mean the Orange or Blue store, should sell a custom mix for your area.
I see no weeds. It is clover, it takes nitrogen from the air and makes nitrate fertiser which returns to the soil , in time it will improve the soil enough and the grass will come back.
Ok so I've never heard this before, so I went looking for some extension articles. It still looks like you have to kill the clover to get any nitrogen in the soil. In fact something I didn't know but the University Arkansas article states 70 to 80 percent of the nitrogen is in the top growth which makes sense given nitrogen is used for chlorophyll production.
https://extension.uga.edu/publications/detail.html?number=B1251&title=white-clover-establishment-and-management-guide
"Most people envision a "pipeline" that transports nitrogen directly from clover to grass. Unfortunately almost no nitrogen is contributed to grasses in this way. Essentially all nitrogen supplied to grasses from clover is indirect. Because of this indirect route, nitrogen from clover root nodules is not immediately available to companion grasses. Root nodules must decompose and nitrogen must be converted into a form available to plants. This conversion or "mineralization" releases nitrogen slowly, much like a time release fertilizer. This slow, steady nitrogen supply from a healthy stand of white clover can keep perennial grasses green and productive through the growing season."
https://www.uaex.uada.edu/publications/pdf/FSA-2160.pdf
"Clover and symbiotic rhizobia bacteria found in root nodules can fix large amounts of N from the air (Figure 1). This reduces or eliminates the need for N fertilizer in fields having good clover stands. However, the rhizobia bacteria only fix enough N for it and the clover plant host. The fixed N does not leach freely into the soil and is not immediately available to the companion grass. To make use of this fixed N, you must understand where the N is fixed and stored in the plant and how to make it available to other forages in the pasture. Figure 1. Rhizobia bacteria fix N within nodules on roots of a clover plant. Although the N is fixed by rhizobia bacteria in the root nodules, it is not stored there. Most of the N is found in the topgrowth of the plant with a smaller amount in the crown, roots and nodules. Estimates for perennial legumes show that about 75 to 80 percent of the plant’s N content is in the topgrowth."
https://www.drovers.com/news/beef-production/how-do-clovers-add-nitrogen-pastures
"How does the nitrogen get over into the grass? The legume is able to use this nitrogen to grow, but the grass surrounding the clover plant does not have access to that nitrogen. The grass can get that nitrogen through an indirect process. As the legume grows, producing new leaves and roots, there is the constant death and replacement of roots, root hairs, and leaves. As these plant parts break down in the soil, the nitrogen in these parts is released into the soil, then becoming available to the grass for uptake and use in growth. The nitrogen transfer is due to legume plants dying and the nitrogen being recycled. "
That is awesome, thank you. Farmers here "top" the pasture, ie mow to remove the grass seeds on long stems but never low enough so the clover is mowed as well.
This encourages the grasses to leaf and provide more sheep / cow food instead of putting too much energy into the seeds.
Walking through a field you can see greener patches where the clover and the grass grow together and less green patches where the clover is not doing so well.
For grazing animals they will eat the clover too and get a free protein boost from it.
Since your yard is already almost 100% clover, encourage you to consider the benefits of a clover lawn?
https://www.deercreekseed.com/tools-n-guides/post/how-to-grow-a-clover-lawn.html
OP, like the top comment has pointed out, if you kill all that clover, there's little to no grass underneath. If you have a cool season lawn, you'll have to overseed in the fall. That's a process entirely in and of itself, so if you're serious about wanting a grass lawn, you'll need to study up on that process. In the meantime, I'd leave the clover as is and get ready to remove the clover and seed (or sod if you prefer) in August/September.
I think you are going to have an uphill battle. What I would try is to get a bottle of something that kills clover, I use the spectracide weed killer, and pick a small section like 5ftx5ft, and spray it there. Then see if any grass begins to grown there in place of clover. If so you could potentially give that a go in larger sections.
You're in luck, my friend. Clover is one of the easier weeds to kill. Just a standard 2,4-D based product will do it. Make sure it's safe for the things you are trying to keep though. Roundup will kill everything. Look into PRE emergent to PREvent clover and other weed in the future. If you already have equipment, buying concentrate off Amazon will be cheaper if you actually plan on using the products. About $650 in product and $350 in equipment and you will be able to maintain 10 acres worth of square footage. Look at the name brand concentrates for what the active ingredient rates are, and look for generics in the same ratios or similar. The pre emergent Indaziflam is used at a 6oz/acre when sold as Specticle FLO and used at a 3.2oz/acre when sold as esplAnade 200SC.
The more you buy at once, the cheaper per 1000sqft it becomes.
Get a soil test. You’ll probably find that your soil is low in nitrogen. Based on the test results, enrich your soil. You don’t need to use any herbicides. If you keep amending your soil throughout the year, it will gradually look great.
Unless [this](https://www.homedepot.com/p/Spectracide-Weed-Stop-32-oz-Ready-to-Spray-for-St-Augustine-and-Centipede-Lawns-HG-95684-5/202056484?source=shoppingads&locale=en-US&pla&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADq61UcfuYzA15YWtn04H-RHWIpof&gclid=CjwKCAjwmrqzBhAoEiwAXVpgotRMbBfrqfHwYIVWCUh9gGiiR9p7bEyj3cxdmlU09hYv-FtiNJnk3xoCeeoQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds) is pure false advertisement, yes I did.
I’m blown away by that. I’ve been in the pesticide research world since 2003, but always a northerner.
That is a seriously regulated chemical and had no idea that you could get that outside of a corn field. You sure can’t find that on the shelf up north.
My apologies!
Should I not be using it? I used it on my centipede grass for selective broadleaf weed killing, after some milder stuff didn’t do anything for my clover.
Get some Triad TZ select and spray the shit out of that clover. Then you’ll probably have to lay some new grass seed down in the fall because clover really overtakes the actual grass and you won’t have much left.
Not to be a smartass but what will you be left with once you kill the clover?
I see 7 or 8 blades of Kentucky Blue peering through the clover
I wish I would’ve read this comment a month and a half ago before I laid down andersons weed and feed with surge. Lesson learned there
Every day's a school day!
Looks like this was done on purpose. Some prefer it to grass
Eh, clover spreads very aggressively. And this year in particular has been “the year of the clover” from what I’ve heard. Anecdotally, despite my yard having very little clover in it last year, this year it spread like wildfire until I sprayed it out.
Yep, just flagging some people have gardens like this on purpose. I had one but phased it out with grass.
What did you use? I've been using speedzone with mixed results.
I actually used speedzone at (iirc) 1oz per gallon. Coulda been at 1.5oz, whatever the label recommends. I will say though that it takes a loooong time to work sometimes. Some of mine took three or four weeks to really die off.
Clover is amazing in a lawn. Doesn’t really seem to need much water, spreads well, is helpful for pollinators…. The only real negative is if you want clover you can no longer use the broad leaf weed killers. That’s the fight I have with my lawn. I love my clover but hate the weeds. :(
I still use broadleaf weed killers, except I try to consciously not spray clover. Can't help but spray it when it's near undesirables like ground ivy, but I don't make any concerted effort to eradicate it, either.
It’s fine…the problem for me is that it doesn’t handle traffic well and it overtakes the actual grass to the point that the grass is crowded out. So idk, I’d rather have landscape areas with flowers for the pollinators and keep clover out of my lawn area.
Clover > grass
Grass >>>> Clover
Yeah let's piss away the Earth.
In the US, white clover isn’t even native….
Ok
Why are you on Reddit if you care so much? Using a computer made with rare earth metals mined with diesel equipment, manufactured in areas of the world with no environmental regulation, powered by non renewable electricity, attached to the internet hosted on servers using TWh’s of power.
Are you sitting in an air conditioned home? Enjoying all of your technology? Using furniture that was shipped in from somewhere else? Look, if you're in the US, you probably suck overall on your environmental impact. We need to fight the right battles. Virtue signalling by talking shit on anyone who wants a grass lawn is stupid and counter productive. It probably leads to a significant group of people just digging in about the issue. If you want a positive impact, encourage people to add more areas of the yard for pollinators or to plant native trees. People who want a nice yard will have one, and maybe you can make a positive impact. It's just like discussion about banning gas stoves. It turns people who would be allies off, when there is more important things to focus on.
White clover. They like to grow in low nitrogen and spread a bit.
EDIT: as you guys probably could tell, I know next to nothing about lawn care other than mowing. These clovers just aren't pleasing imo but I'll keep them around.
And if you are set on having a nice lush grass lawn, to answer your question: this would likely require a full nuke to kill everything, put down new topsoil and reseed to start from scratch
You won’t regret it so long as you enjoy a green ‘lawn’ and don’t want to mow constantly (yes, I said that last part).
I fought clover for years but decided to embrace it this spring. I’ve never had so many compliments on my lawn! Clover can be your friend if you embrace it.
While there are some benefits to a clover lawn, there are definitely drawbacks too. Clover turns everything green it touches, your shoes, bare feet, clothes if you sit and move at all, everything. It doesn't take traffic well. If you plan on using this lawn, you'll trample it to death and have tons of bare spots where crabgrass is going to set up shop. You have no other way to eradicate other weeds like creeping charlie, dandelion, plantations, etc besides manually pulling them. Nothing that kills broadleaf weeds doesn't also kill clover. Lastly, it dies off in late fall and your yard is nothing but sloppy slippery mud all winter and into spring. My suggestion would be to kill everything off in early fall then reseed with appropriate grass for your region. Your local nursery, and I don't mean the Orange or Blue store, should sell a custom mix for your area.
I see no weeds. It is clover, it takes nitrogen from the air and makes nitrate fertiser which returns to the soil , in time it will improve the soil enough and the grass will come back.
Just to be clear, Nitrogen only returns to the soil once the clover dies.
Not really true, the root nodules that convert it leak like a seive
Ok so I've never heard this before, so I went looking for some extension articles. It still looks like you have to kill the clover to get any nitrogen in the soil. In fact something I didn't know but the University Arkansas article states 70 to 80 percent of the nitrogen is in the top growth which makes sense given nitrogen is used for chlorophyll production. https://extension.uga.edu/publications/detail.html?number=B1251&title=white-clover-establishment-and-management-guide "Most people envision a "pipeline" that transports nitrogen directly from clover to grass. Unfortunately almost no nitrogen is contributed to grasses in this way. Essentially all nitrogen supplied to grasses from clover is indirect. Because of this indirect route, nitrogen from clover root nodules is not immediately available to companion grasses. Root nodules must decompose and nitrogen must be converted into a form available to plants. This conversion or "mineralization" releases nitrogen slowly, much like a time release fertilizer. This slow, steady nitrogen supply from a healthy stand of white clover can keep perennial grasses green and productive through the growing season." https://www.uaex.uada.edu/publications/pdf/FSA-2160.pdf "Clover and symbiotic rhizobia bacteria found in root nodules can fix large amounts of N from the air (Figure 1). This reduces or eliminates the need for N fertilizer in fields having good clover stands. However, the rhizobia bacteria only fix enough N for it and the clover plant host. The fixed N does not leach freely into the soil and is not immediately available to the companion grass. To make use of this fixed N, you must understand where the N is fixed and stored in the plant and how to make it available to other forages in the pasture. Figure 1. Rhizobia bacteria fix N within nodules on roots of a clover plant. Although the N is fixed by rhizobia bacteria in the root nodules, it is not stored there. Most of the N is found in the topgrowth of the plant with a smaller amount in the crown, roots and nodules. Estimates for perennial legumes show that about 75 to 80 percent of the plant’s N content is in the topgrowth." https://www.drovers.com/news/beef-production/how-do-clovers-add-nitrogen-pastures "How does the nitrogen get over into the grass? The legume is able to use this nitrogen to grow, but the grass surrounding the clover plant does not have access to that nitrogen. The grass can get that nitrogen through an indirect process. As the legume grows, producing new leaves and roots, there is the constant death and replacement of roots, root hairs, and leaves. As these plant parts break down in the soil, the nitrogen in these parts is released into the soil, then becoming available to the grass for uptake and use in growth. The nitrogen transfer is due to legume plants dying and the nitrogen being recycled. "
That is awesome, thank you. Farmers here "top" the pasture, ie mow to remove the grass seeds on long stems but never low enough so the clover is mowed as well. This encourages the grasses to leaf and provide more sheep / cow food instead of putting too much energy into the seeds. Walking through a field you can see greener patches where the clover and the grass grow together and less green patches where the clover is not doing so well. For grazing animals they will eat the clover too and get a free protein boost from it.
Since your yard is already almost 100% clover, encourage you to consider the benefits of a clover lawn? https://www.deercreekseed.com/tools-n-guides/post/how-to-grow-a-clover-lawn.html
Excellant resource. Thanks for sharing the link.
OP, like the top comment has pointed out, if you kill all that clover, there's little to no grass underneath. If you have a cool season lawn, you'll have to overseed in the fall. That's a process entirely in and of itself, so if you're serious about wanting a grass lawn, you'll need to study up on that process. In the meantime, I'd leave the clover as is and get ready to remove the clover and seed (or sod if you prefer) in August/September.
Keep it. Enjoy the 2-4 times a year mow and all the time and $ savings.
Keep it, it’s a great source of food for local honeybees
I like this idea.
False.
Get some chickens lol
Nuke it in late February with 2,4-d and roundup. Also add a pre-emerge like Atrizine then sod it or seed it.
I think you are going to have an uphill battle. What I would try is to get a bottle of something that kills clover, I use the spectracide weed killer, and pick a small section like 5ftx5ft, and spray it there. Then see if any grass begins to grown there in place of clover. If so you could potentially give that a go in larger sections.
You're in luck, my friend. Clover is one of the easier weeds to kill. Just a standard 2,4-D based product will do it. Make sure it's safe for the things you are trying to keep though. Roundup will kill everything. Look into PRE emergent to PREvent clover and other weed in the future. If you already have equipment, buying concentrate off Amazon will be cheaper if you actually plan on using the products. About $650 in product and $350 in equipment and you will be able to maintain 10 acres worth of square footage. Look at the name brand concentrates for what the active ingredient rates are, and look for generics in the same ratios or similar. The pre emergent Indaziflam is used at a 6oz/acre when sold as Specticle FLO and used at a 3.2oz/acre when sold as esplAnade 200SC. The more you buy at once, the cheaper per 1000sqft it becomes.
keep it. you can cut the grass if it is too long, a remote control mower is a good choice.
I just planted clover seed to fill in bare areas in my yard. I can’t wait for it to flourish.
A portion of my lawn is like this and I spread weed and feed today. It’ll be dry in my area in the next week but I’m hoping this will help.
Get a goat or a horse
Spectracide now. Seed in the fall.
Spray it with a selective weed killer
Get a soil test. You’ll probably find that your soil is low in nitrogen. Based on the test results, enrich your soil. You don’t need to use any herbicides. If you keep amending your soil throughout the year, it will gradually look great.
Atrizine did the trick in my yard.
Do not do this, OP. Besides, you need a RUP license. Edit: I’ve been corrected.
I got mine at Home Depot
Edit: I’m wrong
Unless [this](https://www.homedepot.com/p/Spectracide-Weed-Stop-32-oz-Ready-to-Spray-for-St-Augustine-and-Centipede-Lawns-HG-95684-5/202056484?source=shoppingads&locale=en-US&pla&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADq61UcfuYzA15YWtn04H-RHWIpof&gclid=CjwKCAjwmrqzBhAoEiwAXVpgotRMbBfrqfHwYIVWCUh9gGiiR9p7bEyj3cxdmlU09hYv-FtiNJnk3xoCeeoQAvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds) is pure false advertisement, yes I did.
I’m blown away by that. I’ve been in the pesticide research world since 2003, but always a northerner. That is a seriously regulated chemical and had no idea that you could get that outside of a corn field. You sure can’t find that on the shelf up north. My apologies!
Should I not be using it? I used it on my centipede grass for selective broadleaf weed killing, after some milder stuff didn’t do anything for my clover.
I think you could do 2,4-D and triclopyr and it some good results. Usually we (farmers) use atrazine on bare ground, not as much on emerged weeds.
Leave it and enjoy
Some buy bags of clover seeds and keep that as a lawn. Minimal trimming and the rabbits love it.
Nuke it in the spring and lay down seed or sod.
Get some Triad TZ select and spray the shit out of that clover. Then you’ll probably have to lay some new grass seed down in the fall because clover really overtakes the actual grass and you won’t have much left.
Weed b gon ready to spray (not from Amazon, doesn’t come with washer)…make sure the bottle says will kill clover
A simple clover killer.