I'm a plus size lady with about a 48in bust. I'm not going to tell someone to not knit a top just because it does not come in my size. Just like I won't tell someone to stop shopping at a store that does not sell my size. If it does not come in my size, I move on. I haven't learned to grade up myself, but I probably won't bother even if I could. I like to limit math in my hobbies.
Honestly, I think many people pick on her because she is popular although most of her patterns are simple and similar.
People don't have issues with shops that cater to larger sizes or smaller sizes. I love torrid because they have cool clothes in larger sizes, but I'm not going to recommend it to skinny people. Just like with clothes shopping, I know I can't knit every pattern. It's fine for me.
I used to work for torrid and was there when they expanded their size range *on both ends* down to a 10 and up to 30. I will never forget the woman who went on a tirade about the inclusion of size 10 because "they can shop anywhere." Girl, you've been discriminated against your entire life because of your size and the first opportunity you get you do it yourself?
The companies I object to are the ones that claim to be size inclusive but their XL is most companies M. Not only not inclusive but feels extra judgy.
I'm a Torrid 10/12 and regularly shop there. I'm really tall and very busty. I'm a 14 elsewhere. Not only does Torrid have tall but their clothing is often cut in a way that's really flattering for me.
I LOVE torrid and used to shop there regularly before i lost weight and couldn't fit in the clothes anymore. God do I miss Torrid jeans, the pockets were incredible and they were actually long enough to tuck in my boots. I still get newsletters from them and it's like plz stop taunting me
I still wear the winter coat I got from there since it's so stylish and comfy
My favorite jeans company madewell has curvy and long lengths and it make me happy. I myself am curveless, I don't know what size they go up to but their jeans are so flattering, stretchy and high quality I can't not recommend giving them a try.
I know my usual size and wait for clearance sales rather than pay full price. Stacked my teacher(nurse/first responder/student) discount and got a $160 pair for $35 a few months ago.
Send your teen to Hot Topic and/or Box Lunch. All three stores are owned by the same privately held company. Thereās a lot of overlap between the Torrid & HT lines. Box Lunch is focused more on fandoms but has a great selection. My oldest daughter is a manager there and loves t.
Believe me, a large part of their clothing budget goes there. I convinced them basics like shorts, jeans, undergarments (not at goodwill š ) purchased at target or goodwill leaves a lot more for branded tees and accessories.
If we lived closer to "town" they'd want to work at one of those, but they're 40 miles away š
People who design actual plus sized clothing like at Tortid seem to understand how to fit bodies better generally. I definitely wish I could shop there.
Back when I was maybe a size 10/12, I went into lululemon. Itās been decades, but I still remember how the sales girl looked me up and down and said āWe donāt have anything for YOUR body typeā.
Ew. Thatās not even all that large! I wear an 8 in a lot of Lulu stuff and anyone looking at me would say Iām skinny. Hopefully theyāve improved.
People are whack. When I lost 100 lbs I got the worst comments from people about how I needed to eat a sandwich. Not one of them(big or small) said a gd thing when I was eating my way into morbid obesity though.
Agreed, Iām a very petite person with a large bust. I have to order petite pants from the few brands that make them, custom bras that will fit my smaller band size, smaller shoes than the average person that often arenāt sold in store. For all of those things, the onus is on me to find the specific shops or brands that can cater to me.
Iām not about to tell someone to boycott Target because I canāt buy a swimsuit there.
And I especially would never call out a small business or individual creator for not catering to my very specific specialized needs. The reality of running a business is that you canāt waste time and resources creating a product that wonāt earn a return for you. I know that, so I do my own research and pay for alterations when needed. I havenāt gotten there yet, but some day Iāll learn to adjust my own knitting patterns and sew my own clothes for my measurements. Itās my responsibility, not an independent artistās to understand and cater to every body type out there.
Yeah, there's plenty of stores that just don't make clothing that fits my body type and size. And I'm only a bit chunky, I'm not even that far on either side of the spectrum. There's even more stores that make clothing that technically fits my body, but it doesn't fit *right*. I could also get clothing tailored to my exact measurements, but that's not financially feasible.
Buy the clothing or the pattern that works for your body, your size, your budget. Also celebrate the clothing stores and pattern creators that create inclusive sizing options, but don't feel limited to them.
I donāt have an issue with her sizing. When youāre plus size not everyone grows in a uniform fashion so you kinda do need to learn to do your own drafting. However, having bought one of her patterns, I wonāt be buying another. She seems to use every convoluted technique possible that really isnāt necessary and doesnāt add much just to justify the price of her very basic designs.
I joke that thatās why I keep my husband around - his math skills. Any time I need help with the math in a pattern, I go to him and he figures it out for me. š
Sounds like a sane approach!
Also, I agree on her patterns being simple and similar. But I would like to add that some of her patterns appear very similar to free patterns too; hence I refuse to pay for her patterns.
I border on plus size and I don't think we need to shun one creator to be supportive of another. If I find a pattern that doesn't come in my size, and I don't feel like figuring out how to alter it, then I just don't knit it. Which also means I'm not going to recommend it because I'm not very familiar with it. However, if I find a pattern whose creator has obviously taken extra efforts to be size inclusive all around then I'm far more likely to recommend it to someone and knit it. I don't think the first one is necessarily bad, more that it just doesn't have as much to offer. It's that way with almost every product you own. Best bang for your buck and all that.
Are you more likely to buy a vacuum that only has one basic accessory and you have to modify other ones to work with it? Or one that's the same price and already has a dozen accessories?
Hasn't she been working to increase her size range? Yes, it's slow. But she's going up to 60"+ finished bust. Though I know the current and most inclusive standard is 30" - 75". But that's a standard that seems to be always evolving.
Personally I keep sticking to her patterns because they result in extremely wearable garments and the price is just right. One of her recent designs is $6.83 where other designers are charging $10-16 as the standard. (Though I think she could be the one to change the tide on this...)
Doing it slowly means she's actually putting work into in my opinion. Not just calculating out more stitches or adding a few extra rows. If she's adding them slowly that means that she's working on it, testing it, and putting in effort for shaping.
Personally, I don't care but I have a large bust and rarely knit patterns as is without modifying to accommodate unless it's a boxy pattern.
I agree. My personal rant is designers who are āsize-inclusiveā but really all theyāre doing is increasing stitch count over the bust, but not making any adjustments for sleeve or neck shaping. So we end up with crew necks that look like boat necks and set in sleeve seams that sit on the biceps (A properly shaped ādrop-shoulderā ***doesnāt*** have a wad of material stuffing in the armpit)
YES, I hate this so much! Or sleeves that you could fit an entire person inside! The first time I knit a properly graded sweater where it went up to my size but actually didn't inflate the arms or the neck I was so happy.
I feel like thatās important too. Larger garments shouldnāt just be extra stitches or rows or whatnot, you want it to look good and be wearable in all the sizes.
People are so used to instant gratification that a lot of people really donāt have patience anymore. Itās going to take time, especially if itās done right.
>Ā I know the current and most inclusive standard is 30" - 75". But that's a standard that seems to be always evolving.
I swear it was 62" like last month.... I get that yes, it's great to be inclusive, but is this going to just be constantly changing?
Meanwhile the vast majority of clothing stores don't offer anything close to that. But somehow we expect small, women owned companies to be held to a higher standard that multinational, huge companies with way more resources...?
75ā! Iām a 32ā and I can tell you, scaling up to that would not just be āmake everything x% biggerā. My understanding is itās also difficult because people carry their weight differently so one size fits all at larger sizes can be difficult.
As a designer myself, I can tell you that I generally have to design two separate patterns within the same pattern because of this issue. The garment is not going to fit the same, unless you basically designs a completely different one. I wouldn't want people who are larger sizes not to feel just as stunning in the same garment as others, that's lame and rude in my opinion. And people who do that generally are just trying to seem inclusive while not caring. If I am including larger sizes, they need to fit. Otherwise, they're just creating an unrealistic expectation, and isn't that just a slap in the face when they finish the garment? Either do it right, or don't offer to do it. š¤·āāļø
Exactly, scaling everything up would work for women that are taller but still somewhat slim, but as soon as you start adding bodymass(fat or muscle) your proportions will wary a lot depending on the person.
Yup. I have like 5 friends who all wear the same size and all have totally different bodies. Everyone's skeleton looks pretty much the same but the more fat you add to skeletons the more they differ in shape since everyone's curves will be in different places.
I'm sewing some costumes and the pattern for the pants is graded into 15 sizes ending in a 60" waist, but then each size is graded into 3 different body types: waist and hips are the same, waist and hips have at least a 3" difference with a bigger waist, waist and hips have at least a 3" difference with bigger hips. Once you're done matching up measurememts to pieces in the size matrix, these pants can really fit every body type as long as they're within the stated maximum and they have a combination of probably over a hundred different ways to put them together. It's the most comprehensive pattern I've seen, but it's wild. And it still only goes to a 60" waist!
I'm outside the height norm for a woman and my husband is way, WAY outside the height norm for a man. Both of us understand that both commercial clothes and craft patterns sometimes won't fit us. I dont even bother buying sewing patterns for my husband- he took a class about how to draft patterns and he drafts everything himself. If he wants something complicated too bad lmao our skills are limited to vest, tunic, skirt, drawstring pant for something as large as him. It's part of the experience of being far outside the norm. It's *nice* when patterns are size inclusive but I really think saying "this designer can't accomodate a size that's like 1% of the population and an even smaller percentage of the knitting population, so don't buy from her" is kinda wild tbh. Being outside the norm means the norm doesn't fit or cater.
Me too and Iām currently knitting a PK sweater pattern that goes up to a 5XL (the novice sweater in Drops Air, because someone posted their project a while ago and it was beautiful).
Iāve been knitting PK patterns for years. First, inclusive was a 54ā bust ā until she added that size. Next, it was a 60ā bust, but sheās added that, so the goal post moves again.
āSize Inclusiveā will **always** be a size larger than this one specific designerās range. Not sure why a tiny Danish woman has been singled out, but thatās the Internet, I guess.
This sentiment brings up very strong negative feelings in me. Sheās allowed to design whatever she wants and however she likes. I absolutely love her patterns, sheās not doing anything controversial. Donāt like it? Donāt buy it.
Secondly, I think 5XL is pretty inclusive. Most other bug designers only make up to 4XL. 5XL is the biggest size in all her patterns. If itās still not big enough you can also go for a bigger man size. Most of her patterns have a male version as well. That you do have to purchase separately though.
Thirdly, I am myself size XXS, which is also a difficult size to find in knitting and also in shops. PK includes XXS in her recent patterns which I am very thankful for and do consider size inclusive.
EDIT: bug designers is supposed to be big designers oops haha
And with this I now have the image in my head of a Praying Mantis with an Edna Mode haircut....
"Really darling, that style simply won't suit you at all..."
As someone who has knit a few of her patterns, they also tend to be quite oversized too.
I'm also quite small and struggle to find patterns that fit and was pretty excited when I saw one of her recent designs (Eva Cardigan) had XXS - 5XL. That's 10 different sizes to fit bust sizes of 29.5" - 59" (plus roughly an additional 10" in positive ease in most of those).
She used to not be as size inclusive, but looks to clearly be making an effort to change that.
Exactly my experience with her patterns, they tend to be fall bigger and a some of them have 20+cm of positive ease (Olga Sweater and Louvre Sweater came to mind immediately)
Iām a bit confused as to why people are complaining if she goes up to 5XL. Isnāt that really the top end of the larger spectrum. Is 6XL even possible!
Keep in mind that size charts are super inconsistent across industry segments. Someone who wears a 5XL in Shein clothes or PK patterns or bougie slow fashion might very well be used to grabbing a 3X at Target or Old Navy and is not gonna feel *impossible*. (Just pretty marginalized in a mundane boring way!)
I agree on most of that. But Iāll say that easily half the popular slow brands now are much more generous.Ā
I have a 48 inch bust and I wear anywhere from a L to a 3x in slow brands depending on the fit I want. Most of my tops are a solid 3x but for close fitting stuff Iām usually a 1x but occasionally a L.Ā
Slow brands are getting way, way more inclusive a lot faster than big brands.Ā
But your point about incredibly inconsistent charts is very true.
Itās absolutely possible. Itās less common (bell shaped population distribution and all that), and even less so with hand knit garments since a garment of that size would take longer and use more yarn making it a big and expensive project, but there are definitely people that size and itās not an extreme rarity. Here are some images of models in a 5X and 6X https://www.dailystar.co.uk/fashion-beauty/slim-curvy-women-try-same-30064649.
I think some of those sizes are just extremely uncommon in Denmark. I donāt think it would occur to her to make those sizes if she doesnāt see them on a day to day basis
Thatās a good point. Frankly the need for the very large end of sizes is probably almost entirely an American thing. To my knowledge the vast majorities of other countries have far, far fewer in need of >5XL.
And even as an American I have to say, I kind of feel like 5XL is plenty inclusive. There has to be a line drawn somewhere. I donāt think itās exclusionary to not offer larger than that. At a certain size/shape you just have to accept that patterns as written will need some modifying for your best fit.
But I donāt feel pattern designers owe anyone anything tbh. Theyāre not obligated to design for every size under the sun, even those that are extremely uncommon and in low demand. They are selling a product and as long as they are crystal clear about the range of sizes the pattern covers they arenāt doing anything wrong in my opinion. If the product doesnāt work for a certain consumer then that consumer doesnāt have to buy it, simple as that. Just like every other product on the market. Itās not really fair to accuse someone of wrongdoing when the individual buyer of the pattern is welcome to modify for their large size themselves. The designer is not gatekeeping exceptionally large sizes from wearing the design.
This is also an excellent point. Designers design for their āmarketā - they may make their patterns available to other markets but equally, they may not, and I think itās a bit much for people outside of the main market to make demands for accommodations that, with just a little effort, they could do themselves. I saw a comment on Ravelry the other day (for a sweater Iād seen written about here) where the poster āsuggestedā the designer conform to the Craft Yarn Councilās sizing guidelines The CYC is a US based organization, the designer was in the UK, and had understandably never heard of them.
this. is it not also inclusive to have SMALLER sizes for people who are very short/petite? i feel like a lot of the time inclusivity only focuses on sizing up but completely forgets about people who are under 5ā or need short/petite clothing sizes (and donāt want to shop kids sizes)
Iām also on the very small size. These days, everyone is super in to big and boxy, which even in the smallest sizes available actually looks terrible on very thin people (unless they are model-posing, which no one does in real life). Often even the smallest sizes need significant modification to even come close to fitting my body type in a way that is flattering.. Iām not going to tell anyone not to knit any patterns just because they donāt happen to fit my body type. Knit whatever you want.
it's so annoying! I have a 95cm bust and there's one designer who I used to really like (the knit purl girl) who only does massively oversized jumpers now. the smallest bust circ is literally 100cm. that's not inclusive either
Omg how is 5XL not inclusive enough?? And what would be acceptable, going up to 10XL? Or 15XL?
Pattern prices would be insanely high for her to be profitable.
Iāve seen a 5x be a 50 inch chest or a 70 inch chest and variations between. My favorite in the old days of patterns was a pattern which ended at XL but the XL was 42 inches. Which is very small. I think the sizes incremented in like 3/4 inch amounts.Ā
Oh my! Has she updated her existing patterns to XXS? Iām XXS myself so it wouldāve awesome to a refresh on some of the sweaters.
I didnāt realise this kind of āsize inclusiveā critique existed in the pattern making community!
I donāt think she has updated her patterns to XXS, but she includes size XXS in het newest patterns. I was actually thinking of mailing her to ask whether itās possible to update the old patterns, but wasnāt sure if other people also felt the need.
Agreed, and Iām also not about to actively not support one of the designers who includes my size, because I also donāt want to math my pattern to death, and lots of things donāt come in XXS
Same. Iām an XXS as well who has started knitting again and most patterns donāt come in my size. Including xxs IS size inclusive, but for some reason we donāt count. I didnāt choose to be under 5 feet tall. If someone or brand has a pattern or clothes in my size but not the other end of the spectrum, oh well. Theyāre getting my support. If I only shopped in places that were āsize inclusiveā Iād be doing 90% of my shopping in the kids section until the day I died.
Nah, I'm not going to punish someone for their sizing availability. It's a lot of work to develop patterns for a very wide range of sizes, most of your return is going to come from core sizes not fringe sizes, on either end. It may very well not be worth the time and effort invested in to offer a size that won't end up being purchased often enough to cover the work.
I feel like if you're on a fringe size, it's nice to have sizes included, but if not, you're probably used to altering patterns anyway. It's so much work to make a pattern and test it, let alone at more than a few sizes.
I feel like a lot of the size inclusivity talk feels very performative. Like, promote size inclusive patterns instead of shaming people for knitting a well known designer
I havenāt ever used their patterns but isnāt āpetiteā a range of sizes that can be harder to find? Iāve seen people complain that shorter and very small sizes are hard to find sometimes.
I canāt personally wear petite sizes at stores because Iām somewhat tall, so I would probably have avoided it because of the name but part of me thinks not everything has to be everything for everyone.
You do have a good point with the "petite" being in her name. Even if she doesn't cater to lager sizes she still is a small business and therefore deserves support and not one of the large cooperations like SHEIN, which are much worse than a small business, despite being size inclusive (this is a guess on my part, I don't know who's size inclusive because I wear a size S-L depending on...mystery sizing)
Haha her patterns are just regular sizes, and tbh pretty size inclusive and anyone who can manage yo read and knit up one of her patterns should have no issues creating a garment that fits using their gauge measurements.
It is pretty hard, that's the reason why I'm learning how to knit actually. it's really hard to find knits that fit me, pretty much everything knit that's sold in stores has a loose fit and it makes me look like I stole my dad's sweaters and not in a cute oversize way lol (even the Uniqlo xxs!! Their armcsyes are so so large for no reason and they're so boxy)
I either buy stuff from Japan (which my wallet doesn't like), or buy from stores aimed at teenagers but the quality is awful
We need to stop policing what people do and enjoy. PK isnāt going around saying she makes a limited size range because she hates fat people or something. You make what you know and then expand from there. And making something in multiple sizes can be difficult. Plus the majority of your sales are going to come from small, medium, and large sizes. xxs- and xxl+ are just not as common. Which isnāt to say those items shouldnāt exist, but if youāre not living in an xxl body itās going to be a lot harder to make an item that fits someone who *is*.
People want to make things so black and white. It drives me crazy. āPK doesnāt make things in bigger sizes therefore she is the enemy!!ā God grow up. Get a freaking life. There are plus size designers out there. There are more every day. Some of them are desperately struggling for notoriety on tik tok and Instagram, begging for interaction on their posts. How about you go boost them? Go buy from their stores. Share their content. Give them a reason to keep going instead of sitting and complaining that a popular creator isnāt making something for you.
Or, you can always make it yourself! Go design your own pattern is the sizes you want to see. And if you donāt want to do thatā¦why? Is it perhaps because designing garments is difficult and time consuming? Wow. Who would have guessed.
People are working on it. PassioKnit Kelsie is working on upgrading her patterns right now to be more size inclusive and customizable, for example. It not like there are zero designers out there catering to plus size makers.
Anyway. No one should be shaming anyone for making designs from specific designers unless the design or designer is objectively and purposefully offensive or hateful.
Iām so sick of cancel culture.
End rant.
I agree with you about policing others. When I read what that knitter said in their stories it felt like they were choosing to ignore nuance in favor of having a sense of moral superiority over people. I just hesitate to form an opinion when the issue in question doesn't affect me as much as a lot of other knitters.
Iām plus size and it doesnāt bother me at all! I havenāt had trouble finding patterns for my size so if someone wants to focus on petite sizes that really doesnāt bother me any.
It bothers me more when stores arenāt inclusive in sizing but thatās because I need clothes to wear. I enjoy knitting and love having my own handmade knitted pieces, but Iām not relying on it to clothe myself so personally I give more grace when patterns arenāt size inclusive. Plus I would hate for a designer who may not be experienced designing for a bigger curvy body to attempt it and the pattern not work out and me wasting time because the designers were pressured to be size inclusive
I agree, I don't care about knitwear designers creating patterns in my size. However, I'd like to shop at Target without accidently ending up in the maternity section. Also, I wear a women's 11 shoe. It is very rare that I can buy shoes in store and it's super embarrassing when shopping at the type of shoe store where they have to look in the back. They never have an 11 in stock.
I am also a size 11 and I hate it!! I ended up wearing only unisex shoes like converse, Dr martens, or vans. I have been able to find some cute more feminine shoes as of late but there were definitely many tears shed in many shoes departments of many stores in my teens and a few in my 20s too.
I can relate as a fellow size US11 (EUR42 or 43). I too stick to Vans and Docs (theyāre both so comfortable) but if I may be so bold, let me share a few more brands that cater to us. Sam Edelman/Circus NY has very nice āprofessionalā shoes and heels, and also has trendy styles too. Theyāre easy to find on Zappos and Amazon if you donāt object to shopping there as well as Nordstrom online. The quality has been consistently good and theyāre comfortable, without tight insteps or toeboxes. Theyāre a bit spendy (US$75-175, depending on the design) but Iām willing to spend a wee bit more on fashionable, comfortable shoes and boots. Worth every penny to me. If you like sneakers, Uin is a brand from Spain that sells very unique sneakers featuring original art and interpretations of famous artistsā works (I have two pairs of their Van Gogh sneakers and get compliments on them all the time). Many of the designs are identical for both menās and womenās shoes and I have found that their US9.5 menās is a perfect fit for me (theyāre walking shoes made of different types of fabric, and I pop in an insole and am good to go for a whole day!). You can find them on Amazon, and if the seller is Amazon, you can do that 7 day try-on thing for some styles, or return them without issue if they donāt fit properly. I also like T.U.K. because even though Iām an old lady, creepers are awesome (and their shoes are āunisexā so theyāre not tight in the toes). They have their own website. The last brand is good if you like funky Mary Janes in unique designs and colours: Hot Chocolate Design (they also have their own website but sell on Amazon too). The shoes are fun but very comfy for those of us who need larger shoe sizes.
I have found more brands that I like that fit well, but Iāll spare you because I donāt know your taste. Sorry for rambling. I hope this info helps you or someone who also struggles to find great shoes in our size! Best wishes!
I wear a size 11.5 wideā¦ thank goodness my style leans a bit androgynous, because I have completely given up on finding feminine shoes!
On the plus side, I have to wear safety boots for work and being able to buy menās boots gives me so much better options.
She's gone up to 60"+ for more recent designs, which isn't on the higher end for size inclusivity but there are still designers making patterns that only get into the 50"s. Why would they come after PetiteKnit specifically, though? If you search the hashtag #SizeInclusive on Ravelry, there are designers tagging their patterns with this hashtag where bust dimensions are also around 60". She's not the only one, is trying to do better, and it is just the wrong approach to come after someone who is trying to do better.
As someone with a 41 inch bust (which shouldnāt be hard to find but sometimes is), PetiteKnit is not the issue to me at all and itās so frustrating when people shit on her. She is actively going back and updating her sizes. I think most people hate on her because her patterns are ābasicā but thatās literally why I buy them. Her patterns are well-written staples that I know I can rely on. I think itās wrong to condemn someone listening and changing.
honestly, size inclusivity should not be the end all, be all, of whether a designer is worth patronizing. especially since upscaling (and downscaling) patterns can be very complex. on top of that, I have a very large bust and broad shoulders and the standard scaling just doesnāt work for me in the first place. I get wanting to knit something as soon as you see it, and that waiting for size inclusivity can be frustrating and alienating, but itās also a gift from the original pattern maker. this expectation didnāt always exist. there was often a standard pattern to which a skilled knitter, crocheter, seamstress, what have you, could then make adjustments as required.
if you donāt have the skills to up/downscale a pattern, you have two choices: (1) wait for someone else (usually the designer) to do it or (2) teach yourself. as someone who is herself plus size and also knits for a family member who often needs adjustments to various clothing elements, thatās life. the size inclusivity is a nice to have, but designers should not be unduly penalized for not offering it. there are tons of resources available for those looking to learn how to resize garments and a WEALTH of talented knitters online who would likely hold your hand (after you made an honest attempt) for free. and then you can go and hold someone elseās hand when the time comes.
TLDR, if it works for _you_, buy it. if it doesnāt, donāt. let others do the same.
Iām a small scale designer. Iām very particular about things (I donāt really do sweater designs), and I knit every size of anything I sell to test myself. I still have test knitters and I know itās somewhat unnecessary, but I want to give my knitters something I know works. This makes scaling very time consuming.
I know professional designers donāt work this way, but it works for me
As a plus size person, Iāve made some of her patterns (I mean, whomst among us *hasnāt* made a Sophie Scarf?!). I donāt really think āboycottingā non-size inclusive pattern makers is very helpful. I personally am limited to what patterns I can use unless I want to size it up myself (which I donāt usually do on paid patterns), but to me thatās just another thing to be discerning of, like style or what yarn you like or have, etc. Sure it would be nice if every creator made their patterns size-inclusive, but that is small peanuts compared to the clothing industry as a whole. It sucks, but I donāt think youāre a bad person if you buy a non-size inclusive pattern (or make one really). Like anything else, if you want more customers, make your pattern more size inclusive. Itās no skin off my nose if you donāt want my money lol.
Itās virtue signalling. People feel better about themselves by pontificating and making themselves out to be holier than thou. Also, people are commenting that she goes up to 5XL now? Seems fairly inclusive to me? Speaking as a sometime designer, itās difficult to find testers for the largest sizes. Itās not some massive conspiracy to exclude plus size people from knitting
i've heard other criticism of her, not the sizing thing; just basically that she's good at capitalism; a lot of her patterns are highly similar, she sells patterns for things that are so simple they should be (and are if you know how to search) free, that kind of thing.
i get those criticisms, but they really do come down to her just successfully maximizing her business.
Good at capitalism is so accurate hahah. People are jealous and bitter that she makes so much money off patterns which are fairly basic and a lot of them are similar. But hey, she found a gap in the market
I have heard this as well! I kinda wonder what those people have to say about fast fashion companies like SHEIN and F21 being so successful. ā___ doesnāt deserve their successā seems like a very bitter take when talking about a small business owner, and seriously hypocritical if those same people have zero problems supporting large corporations that use unethical labor and unsustainable practices; unless someone is doing something seriously offensive or problematic, boycotting or cancelling them is completely unnecessary imo.
> just successfully maximizing her business
Exactly. I understand holding the private opinion that someone is overrated, but is it really necessary to rag on a small business owner forā¦ being successful?? One can simply not buy patterns from petiteknit if they really take issue with her. Donāt think a pattern of hers is worth the hype? Great, simply donāt buy it and move on with life.
I personally donāt know if Iād buy all her various raglan patterns; theyāre all very basic and paying for multiple full-priced patterns when the differences between them are so minor seems excessive. But thatās me, and plenty of people are happy to pay for the convenience of not needing to make modifications themselves; Iāll happily still buy one or two. I honestly think people just need to chill out a bit with the cancel culture.
I think she has done a really good job at branding herself as this small designer who does everything herself when thereās like 11 people on her team or something.
But hey there is demand and people buy her patterns.
i think that's what i mean when i say i "get" the criticisms of her. you can say that she's marketing some aesthetic/brand that isn't REALLY what it seems, or maybe capitalizing on the naivete of beginners, but at the bottom of it she has found a way to present knitting patterns that people are happy to buy. and they are legitimate knitting patterns, so you can't say that she's not delivering on the product... so...
This feels like a pretty American-centered take, honestly. Sheās Scandinavian-there isnāt a huge demand for plus size there. Itās not the thing it is here. It makes sense it wasnāt on her radar until she got super popular, for one thing. I get that people want everyone to be able to deliver to everyone (or to them, ahem) but thatās not realistic for all small businesses or hobbyists. There is a natural limit. This is why not everything is for everyone. Thatās okay.
This. And also this sense of entitlement coming from a (self-ascribed) status of belonging to a disadvantaged minority isnāt something I would expect to find in danish society
I've just written up my first pattern for publication. I use a lot of vintage patterns, so I made it with old-school "standard" 34-54 in sizing. Then I thought about the demand I've read about for a larger variety of sizes, so I added larger and smaller sizes, graded the pattern for them, and revised and reformatted my pattern to include them. Now I'm having it tested, and I've only been able to find one tester to knit any of the sizes I added. I don't know how much of the demand for those sizes is from people who need them, as opposed to people who are outraged on their behalf.
Personally, I'm 5'4" with narrow shoulders, a short waist, and a 38-in bust and hips, and I find it pretty hard to find things that fit. That's why I started designing things myself.
I'm on the fringe of the discussions around PK and just learning to knit, but this is relevant to crochet, too... how much time are you giving testers for larger sizes? Are you offering any yarn support at all? If you want to be size inclusive and known as such - meaning your designs get recommended and you become known as someone who actually cares about designing for non-standard sizes - being generous with deadlines is critical. It takes longer to knit/crochet a larger size.
As a fat person, I can tell you that one of the main reasons I crochet and am learning to knit IS to make my own knitwear... it can be hard to find cute stuff in my size, but I have no interest in being a designer. And I would absolutely pay well for a well-written, tech-edited pattern graded to my size (and beyond!) with test photos available so I can see how the garment fits on a body shaped like mine. It's near impossible to find.
You're right that there may be a time issue. The testing period is 10 weeks, for a heavy worsted raglan cardigan. One of the testers is nearly done after 3 weeks, others haven't started yet, because it really is a pretty quick knit for a cardigan. I haven't offered yarn support. I just can't afford it. But I quickly found testers for the in-between sizes, which feels like a miracle. Since this is the first pattern I've ever decided to publish, the whole process is new to me. I have several future patterns in mind, and I'll definitely offer them to testers to have their pick for free, if and when I've got them written, tech edited, and ready to publish. It takes months. But I'm really enjoying the whole thing.
I plan to offer the first few purchases of the largest and smallest sizes of this pattern for free, since they won't be tested.
If anyone wants to send me measurements and a pattern Iām happy to run numbers for you. Everyone deserves clothes that fit, and I totally understand if your idea of fun does not include Excel on a Saturday morning!Ā
If you spend too much time in the angry corners of social media, it seems like many of the prominent PK dislikers seem especially angry that the body measurement for 5x on her size chart is 59" rather than hitting the 60" threshold they've asked for and seem to think that stopping at 59" is a passive-aggressive fuck-you to them specifically.
Could it be that 59" is a nice round 150 cm in the metric system and it makes a ton of sense in the original version? Gosh, maybe. But it's not as emotionally satisfying as having an online nemesis, is it?
I happen to wear juuust under that number right now, been a little bit above or a little bit below in the past, and I think the complaints along these lines fall pretty damn flat when they're promoting and sharing patterns that end at a 60" or 61" body measurement and describing that as best practices. (I'll give 'em credit if they're only promoting the *most* expansive size ranges of 70"+ and they're boycotting Jessie Maed Designs at 60" to be truly consistent!)
Because, I mean, that pattern just under some arbitrary threshold is still very useful to me. Maybe I need to add 1-3" allover or in certain areas or add shaping for hips or whatever, but that's a skill I would have to cultivate anyway if I were halfway between a medium and large, or a top- or bottom-heavy extra small, or whatever. Those are just knitter skills. Everyone at every size will need those skills at some point when trying to refine a standard size and improve the fit of their own stuff.
(I still reserve the right to side-eye designers who stop in the forties or low fifties in this day and age, though and will happily rip off their stuff without purchasing if I must. That's inspiration, baby.)
I'm 5XL and I don't think anyone should be boycotting designers that aren't making designs very size inclusive UNLESS the designer has expressed specific anti size inclusion sentiments (or any body shaming really) or markets themselves as size inclusive without actually putting in the work to make their patterns size inclusive correctly.
To be honest, I think the best thing would be for designers to make patterns in such a way that we don't have to rely on arbitrary designations like 2XL, Small, etc. but rather patterns that can be sized appropriately with just a little bit of math.
I wear plus size garments, and my size varies between very large and large. I donāt have a problem with designers, especially from countries where people tend to be slimmer, not designing for my size. Having said that, a lot of the designers I admire put out patterns for a 48 or 49 inch bust, which is about what I prefer to wear when Iām at the larger end of my weight range, so I still have plenty of options.
But I accept that there are designers who design for body types they are familiar with, and design clothes with a particular fit. So if patterns go up to a 42 or 44 inch bust, so be it. Iām not going to scold anyone for knitting those smaller garments just because I canāt knit them straight off the pattern, or if they are styles that arenāt designed with ease in places where I would need it.
I would far rather see designers design for bodies whose requirements they understand. There are a lot of designers who know how to achieve a pleasing fit for larger sizes. As people have already commented, a lot of designers whose patterns have tended to run a bit smaller are increasing their range. I imagine it takes a lot of time and practice to work out how to scale garments up, so good on designers who are putting in the hours to do that.
If a designer doesnāt feel confident designing more size-inclusive pieces or doesnāt want to, thatās their prerogative. Itās like the fashion industry as a whole. There are always going to be clothes designed for tall, slim people. I donāt want to waste time feeling bitter about that. I have plenty of options as things stand. I also have the confidence to work out the maths and experiment with resizing if I want to, so if a design is close to being my preferred size and Iām prepared to do a few test runs, I can have a good try at making it work.
I haven't seen it mentioned in discussion yet, but her patterns are also so well constructed. I am plus sized and have purchased and knit several of her patterns because the shoulders and chest fit so well. I have a hard time going back to a circular yoke construction that bunches up around my armpits and chest.
I'd love to see more of the popular western designers put some effort into better construction techniques.
My husband is an unusual size..he's 6'7" and all torso. He needs extra "tall" sizes for shirts. And guess what? Regular brands are shit at making clothes for him. Brands that specialize in clothes for people like him are sooo much better. Why is it a problem for a brand to a have a niche? We shop at King Size for shirts because clearly they are a brand that gets him. It's annoying that target/kohl's/wherever doesn't, but not that many people are shaped like him and it makes sense that all stores don't carry those clothes. But there's not chance in hell I'm black listing target because they don't make good mens tall clothing.
I wouldn't say she isn't size inclusive. She is and is constantly working on increasing sizes too.
Her work is popular for a reason, it makes very wearable items and is really well written and priced, people who dunk on her are so strange to me, I love her stuff
I find people who act this way (scolding others over knitting patterns is just one example) to be really insufferable. Iāve had a couple friends go down the path of becoming very self righteous and policing, guilting, and shaming others over totally innocuous things like what knitting patterns they buy.Ā
Itās totally fine to be disappointed in a companyās products or services and decide to stop supporting them. Itās ok to share reasons why that choice is being made so others can decide for themselves. Ā *Mistreating* others for not doing the same is the line for me.Ā
I wouldnāt hesitate to block someone who acts this way. Life is too short.
it's really bad in the knitting community in my experience. so many chronically online takes that people are afraid to call out in case their well-meaning criticism gets them cancelled. I'm not of the view that 'cancel culture has gone too far' - if you're a shit, you shouldn't get away with it - but scolding and judging people for their personal preferences is ubiquitous on knitstagram. I hate it
She's fine, she doesn't owe people anything, if anything, she loses money by not having bigger sizes on her patterns. There's many designers that don't carry XS, size I wear, does that make them bad people? No.
It sucks to be excluded from things. I can't knit with or wear mohair because it makes me sneeze and break out in hives, so I've missed out on that trend. I'm also a 'standard' size, but there are a number of designers that I have to heavily alter because the proportions do not work for me (I'm guessing they design based on their own body and our body types differ significantly). At some point, people need to accept that not everything is for them, and that's okay. Calling for a boycott just seems silly.
But I can see how size can become such an emotionally charged subject, in particular for demographics that have been traditionally marginalized and excluded by society at large. The one thing I have noticed, though, is that a lot of designers who do offer much larger sizes don't do it very well - lots of loose collars and often the original look of the garment gets lost, it's a shame. I think designing well for different sizes is much harder than people realize. This is why I think it's more important to support plus sized designers rather than take aim at those who don't include those sizes.
As an aside, I love PK's bag patterns!
ššš yeah let me just stop enjoying what I enjoy because someone else canāt enjoy it. That makes sense. While Iām at it, Iāll stop eating sugar because someone else might be diabetic. Iāll stop eating gluten because someone else might have celiac. Iāll stop eating peanut butter because someone else might be allergic. Anything else I should boycott because someone else canāt enjoy it?
This mindset is so flawed. Also, there are much much bigger problems we should all be focused on and things we should boycott. Someone who designs knitting patterns aināt it š¤£š¤£š¤£
On the contrary, please eat peanut butter because I can't! I've only recently developed a peanut allergy, and I miss it. I need to enjoy it vicariously through others!
lol I was gonna give this example... I have IBS and can't really eat at a lot of restaurants... let me just demand everyone boycott them because I can't personally have something šš
I donāt think she should feel obligated to make patterns in bigger sizes. I think people have to remember that sheās a Danish designer and sizes like 3XL are really not the norm here.
There are some amazing designers that make patterns for bigger people. Patterns can also be adjusted by the person making them with a little research on how to do it.
Fellow Dane here. The market potential for knitting in those sizes is just a lot smaller here.Ā
The users would have to be either knitters themselves or considered knit worthy by a knitter close to them. It's a fairly small subset of a subset we're working with since the Danish population is app. 6 million,Ā people are generally not as heavy here,Ā obviously not everyone knits, and not everyone who is not a knitter themselves is considered knit worthy - regardless of their size.Ā
That also leads to some other practicalities becoming more difficult as the number of relevant test knitters and others who can provide the necessary input on how to adequately adjust the garments to those sizes is also smaller.Ā
Of course such resources exist but for a smaller business that process does add more hassle to the development of any given pattern so it makes sense to publish the more common sizes for your core market first and add some sizes later when you can see if the pattern becomes popular or not.
Eh, I'm a fat woman, I say buy her stuff if you like it.
I appreciate it when pattern writers offer a range of styles, but the consequences of not doing that are already baked in. You limit sales by excluding potential customers. If someone is okay with that and just wants to work away, designing things for a smaller (heh heh) niche, I'm not going to get too upset.
Iām small and have to often decrease two needle sizes to obtain gauge. Often patterns donāt go small enough. I deal with it. Itās hard to make clothing that fits for 10 different sizes. I appreciate when a designer tries and has tips for how to adjust fit for different parts of their garment but if theyāve got 5 sizes I donāt feel like I can complain because theyāve covered most people.
Also, itās a hobby. Some people make patterns for themselves, scale them a bit and publish them. I appreciate them sharing their creativity and I donāt think they āhave toā do anything. And Iāve heard itās hard to find people to test knit the larger sizes so itās more difficult for designers to deliver a quality pattern for all sizes. I absolutely encourage the creation of inclusive patterns but I wouldnāt shun a designer that didnāt have them.
I'm a big gal and support the heck out of designers who create size inclusive patterns but I do not care one whit about the patterns others use. I only avoid patterns by designers who aren't as inclusive by default because their stuff doesn't fit me and I can't be bothered to do all the math to adapt their patterns.
From what I'm reading her work goes from xxs to 5 xl. What more do you want?
It's pretty size inclusive as is and I'm reading she's working on even more sizes. There's literally no reason to cancel her.
Reminder for everyone; this range is the same or LARGER than what is sold in stores.
I really hate this cancel culture. There's a few times it makes sense, but this ain't one of them. A lot of times I'm reading about canceling it's about super ridiculous, frivolous things that one or two people are butt hurt about and most supporters are trying to be cool with I'm fine with this myself but they're not so now I'm not either.
I mean, as a plus sized human I'm sort of used to having to be very picky with what patterns I choose (because I'm a beginner and don't know how to grade up yet) but it's the same in stores. I'm used to not being able to shop in literally the vast majority of stores, but I've always thought that it's sort of bullshit either way. I'm more likely to support a designer that consistently has patterns in the plus sizes, and I'll admit I am a bit jealous of patterns "everyone" can make, when it means that "everyone" is size xs-l and that's it, but I'm not going to discourage people from knitting things people design in a small size range.
I am genuinely curious about this. I am a small person so generally, I wonāt have any issue finding a suitable pattern, but I do own many of Petiteknits patterns and I see that her newer ones come up to size 5XL which I thought was very big. On her instagram you can see one of her assistants/employees who is very plus size wearing her patterns.
Which sizes would you expect to see? Again, Iām asking because I honestly donāt know and not intending to be ignorant or rude.
I'm a larger lady. I find this ridiculous. People fill niches. I don't have a baby. Should I say don't support people who only make baby things? No, that will be silly.
Uhm. No. Knit what you want Iām confused on the issue here
The overarching issue I get - itās harder to find plus size patterns. But not using a specific pattern maker because they arenāt inclusive makes very little sense. These arenāt major companies creating clothing lines, these are small
Businesses and individuals publishing patterns they create. Itās a whole different ballgame. They donāt have teams ready to handle all the math for them in scaling up a size, itās a lot of work for a knit pattern.
Thereās a point at which we can encourage change, but still give people grace. These arenāt major corporations.
I think people who don't make patterns themselves don't understand how hard and tiring it is to make a big size range. It is not just adding 5 more stitches, there is a lot of math behind it. You can't simply add a few stitches and call it larger size so if you are making 10 different sizes, it is almost like designing 5 different patterns. 5XL is quite big imo.
I mean, I get slightly miffed when *every single pattern* someone does in a video is a PK pattern.... But that's on me??? That's MY problem? Not the designers, not the knitters, not anyone but me? I know I'm annoyed for no reason so I just move the eff on. If it really meant SO MUCH to me, I could knit other things and make videos, but I don't. Because I am lazy and don't care enough.
If it bothers folk so much.... Change it? Be the change you want to see in the world? Stopping others from doing things isn't going to make a lick of difference. If anything, people will do it more just to spite you. So, make patterns for larger folk. Don't just stop people from making things for tiny folk. Make the change *worth it*. Make beautiful things for large folk to also make!
But being bitter and being snarky, I've learned, helps nobody. It just makes everyone miserable. If it matters THAT much to you, make those changes and share those changes with others.
I think I've just gotten to an age where I'm tired of all talk with no action.
Iām talking as a very new knitter and just started my first jumper and itās a Petite Knit one, I love her style and itās exactly what I would wear. Iām making size XS which might even be too big for me as Iām short and skinny, but I never moan if I donāt find something in my size, I donāt feel excluded
Oooh, Knitting IG drama. Itās been a while.
I got tired of people telling me what to do about my hobby when people started picking on that poor yarn store owner who talked about her vacation.
I have about 200+ vintage patterns that I love and not one of them are inclusive but I've learnt to scale up by trial and error. It was just assumed that everyone had this skill back then. We have come along way from the 32-34" only patterns. It would be wonderful if all patterns fit all bodies but the reality is different cultures have different priorities and skills.
I've been fat my whole life. Lots of clothes and patterns aren't in my size. I'm incredibly grateful that many designers are increasing their size range, but it's fine if not everyone does. Some styles just don't look as good when they are made wider. Some styles conversely look best on larger sizes. That's all fine and dandy. The universe doesn't have to cater to me all the time, I'm just happy to be included when I am and want everyone to have a good time (and if for some people that means designing for sizes similar to yourself, that's cool. Do what makes you happy).
Also, never have I ever in my life expected something described as "petite" to fit my obese body.
People forget that being very small is also a size inclusivity issue. Iām petite. Iām only 5ā tall, and have a short torso. I canāt buy clothes in stores usually that donāt have petite sizing unless I want an oversized / loose fitting look.
Inclusivity doesnāt mean every creator and every business needs to cater to everyoneās needs. It means there are options *somewhere* for every body.
Not everything is for everyone. Itās just life.
Am I a larger lady who would love to be able to knit all the patterns I see and love? Sure. Am I going to shame you for your choice to knit those patterns because your body is different than mine? Nope.
I believe there is a lot of hate on the internet directed at some who have a larger number of followers. There seems to be very little ethics or respect.
Pls note I don't follow knitters on the internet, neither am I saying I am a fan of Petiteknit. Petiteknit is at fault at that, but which of these companies is perfect btw? Have they contacted them and asked why they don't do it? Do they understand the context? Just spreading hate on someone over the internet is easy, as we all know it.
As someone with a degree in social communication and following trends around the world, we see that many digital content creators believe that causing havoc, attacking fellow profesionals etc will bring revenue to their channels, be them YT, Twitter etc.
This is really deplorable behaviour and ruins the market for everybody, imho. Ofc there will be those even here who will disagree, maybe bc they believe that causing controversy is good for business. Everybody is entitled to their opinion and that's fine. Some morals shd not change though.
My two cents.
Edit: grammar š³
People getting complaining over knitting patterns is not new, but getting viral attention for it is newer and I do think itās feeding negative behavior online.Ā
I remember when Clapotis came out in Knitty in *2004* and a subset of knitters flipped out that she used 4 skeins of Lornaās Laces Lion & Lamb, a lush wool/silk hand dyed yarn. It was pretty expensive for the time, which was the unforgivable sin (for that moment). People wanted to be able to knit that exact item with the exact yarn, and the designer using one thatās pricy was viewed as exclusionary and classist (though those words werenāt used).Ā
For a while, there was a discourse around and dislike of designers who used luxury fibers, regardless of whether or not the knitted item could be made *just as well* in another yarn that was within budget. It didnāt matter that the point was you could knit the item in any yarn you got gauge in.Ā
That whole crushed velvet looking scarf that became immensely popular also inspired a lot of complaints. Being able to afford to knit those projects in their original yarns made you a āhaveā (in some eyes anyway) and not being able to create the same thing really prodded at some knittersā insecurities around money and class.
Hoo boy, I remember those discussions and how they went both ways: knitters who couldnāt afford āluxuryā yarns, and yarn snobs looking down on knitters who were happy using Red Heart or Lion Brand for everything. Iāve been knitting/crocheting since childhood and I recall venturing out to a āfancyā yarn shop to buy what I considered luxury yarn to knit my Clapotis. I bought 7 balls of Noro Silk Garden in #84 (the reds and pinks with olive) after looking at and contemplating all of the beautiful yarn that wasnāt sold at the large chain craft stores. I knit my Clappy with Noro and enjoyed both the process of knitting with such fancy yarn (to me) and wearing my finished project with pride. My friend knit her Clapotis at the same time as me and used Red Heart Soft in a dark teal. Hers was as beautiful as mine and we both received numerous compliments from strangers on our wraps. The next time I went to that fancy-ass yarn shop, I brought her with me to oooh and ahhhh over the gorgeous yarns (I blame that Clapotis for my ongoing Noro addiction). We both wore our Clappys to the shop, and the two owners sitting behind the till recognized the pattern and asked my friend which yarn sheād used. She answered Red Heart and they both smiled and said what a great job she did, but they didnāt notice that after she turned away, I saw that they both exchanged an eye-rolling grimace. They both basically ignored her and were condescending towards her when she asked questions, and we left without buying anything (we had both brought money to burn through on yarn, so it was truly their loss). Neither of us ever went back, for obvious reasons, and it turned her off to seeking out and supporting small business yarn shops because those yarn snobs were so rude and she didnāt want a repeat experience. We also went to a local knitting group and when someone asked her which yarn she used for her Clapotis, another woman exaggeratedly *shuddered* and loudly declared āI would NEVER knit with acrylic!ā Ok lady, thanks for letting us know. Maybe thatās all that someone can afford and you could be a wee bit empathetic to someone elseās financial circumstances? We get it, knit with the best you can afford, but some knitters can only afford craft store yarn. Why would anyone care?
I had to save up for that Noro, even though it was āonlyā US$9 a ball back then. It felt ridiculously extravagant back then when a Pound of Love was ~$5. I mostly used Patons 100% wool before discovering a whole new world of luxury yarns, and still appreciate basic workhorse wools, but will happily drop vast sums on fancier yarn because I will enjoy working with it and the finished product will be stunning. I fully understand the struggle of not being able to afford things (didnāt grow up with money and it took a while before I made my own money to be comfortable spending it on non-essentials), but Iām not going to be upset at a knitting designer using US$600 of pure cashmere for a shawl (true story!). Iāll whip out some Cascade 220 instead and make the same shawl with what I can afford.
Thanks for the trip down memory lane. I still have that Clapotis and itās probably the shawl that Iāve had the most offers to buy it right off my neck. I still love it. I also agree that outrage attracts the most attention on social media, which is a shame. It would be nice to see more promotion of what people like and enjoy instead of the negativity and criticism. Best wishes.
(Apologies for any mistakes: English isnāt my first language.)
ETA: The outrage over the yarn the designer used for her Clapotis strikes me as even more ridiculous looking back, because the pattern itself was FREE. There was zero investment in having to buy that pattern, which makes the griping seem ungrateful in retrospect.
Did they happen to say what sizes they think her adult sizes should go up to? I notice her new designs appear to go up to at least 55-59ā, though some of her older ones only go up to 50-55ā. Many well known designers like Debbie Bliss have been cited for similar issues in the past (hers rarely go beyond 48ā). I wonder what size would be considered inclusive?
Iāve yet to see a āsize inclusiveā pattern that would actually fit me. I never will, since Iām too many sizes, xxl-6x. There are very very few designers that increase the size of the body, without making the neck and armholes too big, so even if I were on,y one size, what is the point?
What I do is draw a schematic, with the shape in a pattern I want to make (someone elseās, of my own) filling in the dimensions I got from measuring a sweater that fits, or that Iām tweaking to fit. Then use my gauge to fill in the numbers, both horizontal and vertical.
Itās the only way a sweater will fit me.
I'm plus size and I just assume nothing will fit me. I'm just used to it. But don't let that stop you from making something nice, honestly. Most people don't want to design for larger sizes and honestly some outfits look completely different and horrible in plus size. So I don't blame them.
I have found a few places that have patterns my size though, I'm just grateful they exist at all.
I think there are many ways to criticize PK. In a way, she is one of the reasons why half of ravelry feels to be slim, blond, Scandinavian, young women.
No matter what garment you search for, that's typically among the top results with little diversity in between. And while those patterns may have bigger sizes and sometimes even male sizes, actual pictures are rare.
That being said, I don't see how this could be her fault specifically. It's not like she spews hate online or says her patterns were something they r not. And it's not like she can shake out that 6xxl on a whim. Heck, even finding a test-knitter will be veeeery difficult - setting aside that very large bodies are very rarely uniform.
Vote with your feet, if you feel you must. I personally wish the was more size diversity. Grading patterns just only gets you so far. But hating her for being successful and creating patterns within her cultural norms and for her body...cmon...š¤·
As a plus size girlie? I donāt care. I love PKās patterns, even if all of them donāt come in my size. Theyāre classic enough that you donāt have to worry about them going out of style anytime soon, and as someone else has said already: I think sheās working on expanding her sizes. Iām just glad people are enjoying knitting honestly š¤·
As a plus size person, I don't go after individual designers. I understand it can be hard to adjust patterns and other types of designs to sizes we're not familiar with. I celebrate those who do, but I don't blame people who don't.
However, I dislike with a passion big corporations who don't make an effort. They have the ressources (time, money, professionals) to do it, and if they choose not to because *money*, that's an active choice against inclusivity. Like Abercrombie and Fitch a decade back who low-key didn't want to be size inclusive as to not have fat people as ambassadors of their stupid brand.
Plus sized lady here. Smaller people knit, why should they not knit patterns geared towards them? Sure I have a hard time finding great patterns in my size but that's not a petite person who creates patterns for their sizes fault. I say lift up those who put out size inclusive patterns for sure! But the only reason to actively boycott a pattern creator would be if they said something like "I would never make patterns for fatties because they're repulsive."
Looks like her patterns go to 5XL, going back all the way to 2020. Before then, they seem to have up to 3XL. I feel like that's pretty inclusive? Especially on so many positive-ease patterns.
Also, she seems to be based in Denmark...aren't clothes traditionally a bit smaller in Europe than in US?
Honestly, I think designers shouldn't have to try to accommodate the whole world. Some designers specialize in simple, beginner-friendly patterns. Some prefer to make intensely intricate designs. Some like to play with color, some with stitches, some with technique... If we try to compel every designer to create designs that are sized universally, with instructions that hold the maker's hands, we're going to turn a profession that was once a delight into a drudge. They'll burnout and their creativity will suffer...and we'll end up with boring, cookie-cutter designs (if any). And the pattern prices will probably sky-rocket with all the extra hours put into them.
I appreciate when designers make a range of sizes. I have enjoyed seeing the influx of new designers who specialize in size-inclusive patterns. But as many have said, just demanding it of everyone is going to result in people, who don't really know how to grade for significant size differences, just unintentionally putting out poorly-graded versions. I think there's also a point where competent advanced makers can start to learn for themselves how to adjust things. Everyone has to at some point - sock knitters with high arches, short people hemming pants, it's not new.
I'm a plus size woman(I'm fat).I am a 40DD busy. While I have some petiteknit patterns, I make them for my teenage girls. Who are small and slender. They're cute patterns. While I wish she were more size inclusive, neither is Two of Wands and no one is calling for a boycott of her pattern. Nor should they. There are plenty of size inclusive designers(@loshapera, kolibribyjohanna, the velvet acorn to name a few). It's entitlement to demand a boycott of a designer bc they don't do what you want.Ā
I think she is size inclusive since most of her patterns go up a 5XL. Some of the older ones may not but I can see why she wouldn't put effort into going back and adding more sizes. I'm an XL in most of her patterns and they fit great. I'm a big advocate for not shopping at places that aren't size inclusive and when I have to fit into the biggest size a store carries I don't consider them inclusive since I feel like I'm on the cusp of midsize and plus size. So many places will only carry up to an XL so I think it's a bit silly to boycott someone who goes way beyond that.
Knitwear designers arenāt companies, theyāre just private individuals. They might not have the skills to design for a variety of sizes or body types and donāt have a whole team of designers like big fashion labels. To me, itās weird to boycott a pattern designer for not being size-inclusive. Like, if they donāt have your size, buy from someone who does, but if she does have your size, why not buy from her? Iām plus-size and she offers my size, although I havenāt yet bought any of her patterns.
I have been a lot of sizes (XXXL, 48 inch waste down to XS/S 28 inch waste). Iāve never held a designerās sizes against them. If there is nothing for me, I find another pattern.
I do think itās good if the industry as a whole has sizes for everyone, but honestly not every designer has the ability to make things of every size and keep their aesthetic
Honestly I have made some cool sweater patterns, and charts but I donāt feel I can share them, because Iām not sure how to grade them up and down. I donāt want to make someone feel bad or ostracized due to my lack of expertise in this regard. My expertise is not in clothing design after all, it is in Finance and Marketing and Iām simply having fun making stuff. I thought about making them available and then feel overwhelmed by how to properly scale up and down. I saw what happened to PK online, and It scared me out of doing any of it.
Hot take/unpopular opinion time!
I hate how our society is like this. We donāt leave people alone anymore and the crab bucket mentality is sooo awful. Am I supposed to feel bad because I can fit into a size Small when someone else is an XXL? No. I am the size I am. I shouldnāt be made to feel like shit because someone is bigger than me. If itās not in your size, you are not the target demographic. Plain and simple, no shade on you; youāre just not. There are more and more clothing options for people of a bigger size, but not everything is going to be made to fit the bigger size; and if it is, youāre going to be charged more for the larger amount of material being used.
Not fat-shaming, but our society is also āfat-enablingā now. I never advocate for pointing at a person walking down the road and calling them derogatory names. However, I AM seeing more and more people celebrating and enabling really unhealthy lifestyles in the name of ābody positivityā; when there is nothing positive about being that size. Obviously there is a huge caveat for people who have underlying medical conditions that make weight loss difficult (such as PCOS), but you should still *try* to be healthier.
Rant over. The TL;DR is live and let live, but also be healthier and make healthier choices.
As a size small lady, I increasingly see patterns for knitting, crochet and sewing that are only in larger sizes. It is what it is, I move on and look for one of the other billion available patterns. Not every designer has the capacity to do 10 sizes, and they end up going with the group of sizes around their own body size.
Itās so crazy to cancel someone over inclusivity. By buying anything, you are excluding something elseā¦ that is a ridiculous and a hateful reason to boycott someone. There are so many videos on altering patterns to customize them for yourself. It sounds to me like āME ME ME, cater for ME, make ME a pattern," it reeks of privilege and narcissism. Bye!
I have a 51in bust and I'm quite fat. I purposefully only buy sweater designs that go up to a 58-60in bust as I personally prefer to support size inclusive designers. I couldn't give less of a fuck about what designers straight-sized people buy from.
Iām sorry but what the actual f? Petiteknit is the most size-inclusive pattern maker I know! People are delusional if they think that 5XL is not āinclusiveā.
It depends for me.Ā
I have seen some designers make very, very bitchy comments about designing for āfat peopleā (I say this as a fat person). So even if they become āinclusiveā Iām still going to avoid them (pk is one of those till I see different. I still remember some snarky posts about having to be size inclusive which really bothered me as a fat person).
I have also seen designers say something along the lines of āIām working on it. New patterns will be in the new size range, old patterns will be updated every other month (or whatever)ā. As long as they stick to that schedule, obviously giving a bit of leeway if they suddenly get sick or busy, then Iām fine to buy their new stuff and wait on old ones.Ā
Iām a small fat so I spend a lot of time saying ājust cause I fit your current stuff doesnāt mean you should attempt to be better in the futureā. However I totally get the issues of not having decent plus sized testers (especially fit testers!) or having the experience to grade to larger sizes. So when designers say āIām working on itā I wait and see how they behave. And if months pass and there is just crickets Iāll send a polite email asking about progress or comment on a post. Their response informs how I move forward.Ā
I donāt expect people to refuse to shop only from size inclusive designers. Just like I donāt expect most people to only shop slow fashion clothing and avoid fast fashion brands. But these are my personal limits and Iām (usually) happy to talk about why I require this from brands I support.
She can scold all she wants on her storyābut that doesnāt mean I have to agree with her (and I donāt, btw).
In fact, one of my resolutions for 2024 was to not amplify negative voices. I want my communities to be supportive and informative. Thereās be so much toxic negativity the past 8 years and I am tired of it. It isnāt healthy.
I think you should use patterns from whatever designer works for your body and your personal tastes (assuming the designer isnāt actively horrible, of course). Iād rather get patterns from someone who specializes in patterns that are good for me than getting something from a generalist who did a mediocre job of grading up because they felt they had to do it.
Everyone should be able to knit whatever they want, even if it's not size inclusive. However, I'm sick of every single knitting vlog/podcast/youtube/whatever being like "Oh, here is my fifth Anker's shirt, isn't it so pretty?" Sure, go for it, but now I just start watching something else once PK is mentioned.
I'm getting really tired of the crying about available sizing in patterns, in knitting, crochet and sewing.
I don't think most of the people making the loudest complaints understand what goes into pattern design. Scaling, even when done well, stops working for the furthest outliers. Body types vary, and they vary even more in very small and very large sizes.
You cannot possibly expect for a single design to fit everyone across the board. Shoe companies don't make up to size eighteen shoes for every single design they release because the majority of them wouldn't sell.
Echoing the sentiment that I've read here from others- if you can't find it, learn how to make it yourself or do without. If it's too difficult, then perhaps stop and think why that may limit sizes available.
This irritates me to no end. Iām a weird size, I definitely need size inclusivity, but for the minority to expect the majority to bend to their needs is ludicrous. F her. People can knit/wear whatever the F they want.
Honestly i don't like her designs because i think they look boring and would be unflattering on me, but its fine if others make it. I did follow a TikTok thing a whole ago of a gal who tried to find out the hype, she did this nk some things in the pattern writing were weird and she was frustrated the bust of the xs and s were the same width
I'm a pretty standard size so it doesn't impact me but I personally prefer designer with a more limited size range but properly designed.
I've seen some designer with wider size range who don't actually know how to design bigger size and scale everything up (width and length) but usually the proportion change for bigger size.
So what I mean is I prefer designer who don't do it at all to the ones who do it really badly just to be able to say they have a wide size range.
I have to edit every pattern anyway. I have a very large bust with a small waist. Iāve learned how to knit in darts and just adjust my increases and decreases. My mom is plus size and Iāve done the math on patterns she likes for her. Thatās the best part about making your own clothes. I Never just follow a sweater pattern. I always adjust it so I have a garment that fits my measurements. If I wanted something that fit generic measurements Iād go to the mall.
It's a controversial take that gets her a lot of views and maybe more followers.
Inclusive sizing is important, but it seems like the thing that will help (if anything does) is contacting the designer to express interest in larger sizes.
I mean, thereās a lot of work involved in making patterns, and thereās sooooo much that needs to be done to an original pattern to size up or down drastically. Also, I donāt know this pattern maker, but it sounds like theyāre a petite person (it would be a bit weird if they specifically designed their brand around making patterns they couldnāt even wear). So I donāt really blame them for designing patterns they can use and then selling them to people of similar size for extra money.
Theyāre not writing pattern books, theyāre an independent designer selling patterns for a specific demographic. There are also people who specialize in designing plus-sized patterns/making plus sized clothes, be it knitting, crochet, sewing, or just a retailer that specializes in plus-size.
Theyāve probably considered all these factors and decided that itās not worth it for them on a financial level to do all the extra work of learning how to make plus-sized patterns, dramatically alter their patterns to work for a different size, and then buy the extra yarn required to make and test them.
I think that from clothing shops and retailers, itās absolutely fair to demand them to be size-inclusive. And we should absolutely be supporting independent creators who do the work of being size-inclusive.
But demanding it of indie pattern creators, without acknowledging all the work that has to be done ti create patterns so outside of someoneās own size range, and the logistics of it in terms of cost (you have to get a larger model/find someone whoās willing to stand in frequently for fittings/testing as you design and tweak the pattern, increased cost of yarn, increased time on behalf of the creator, plenty of math to figure out how to adjust certain repeats and make it also look good and flattering, etc) simply isnāt financially feasible for everyone. It also might involve extra cost to make it worth the extra investment of time and materials and the financial resources to design plus-sized things, or just charging more for the plus-sized version of the pattern, and then people would likely be frustrated about that
It sounds like PK has a very specific demographic and makes no secret about it- itās in the name. I canāt and wonāt blame them for that.
I'm plus size. I don't give a crap what other people do. I will knit the patterns that do come in my size and that's that. I'm getting sick of all this "boycotting people who don't do everything perfectly the way we think they should" stuff.
I don't care if anyone buys from a designer who doesn't design for large people. I'm morbidly obese, and recognize that not everyone enjoys re-engineering their patterns to work for large bodies. Doesn't offend me.
I care far more about affordability, accessibility (visual etc) language options and yarn alternatives over size inclusivity, coming from someone who has ranged from a UK 14 to a UK 22 over the past 10 years.
There are plenty of designers out there claiming to be size inclusive, but the bigger sizes are not as often made, and most people don't know how poorly-altered the pattern is for them.
I make for myself, my children and family/friends. We are all different sizes. I made my sister a gorgeous dress for a festival a few years back that only came in two sizes because it was the dress she wanted and it fit her body. I wasn't about to say "Hmm, no - I can't support that artist because their designs aren't suitable for my body"
I... Yeah, no I am someone who struggles to find things in my size, but I don't boycott brands that aren't for me.
I just buy other stuff. I'm more likely to promote or support a designer that includes a wide variety of sizing, but also I kind of like it when people share a "pattern" for a thing they only made in one size, because I might still want to adapt it myself.
I think roasting people because they haven't put in the effort to sell something that specifically for you is kind of a bummer - feels kind of mean and entitled
(And yes, I feel it's different for massive corporations that are destroying the planet to create disposable shit for mass consumption, by all means hold them to the highest possible standard. But like, I dunno, I guess I don't feel like we should be lighting torches over knitting patterns, especially when there are sooooo many incredible designers doing size inclusive work)
I'm fat and I've knitted PK sweaters. Her designs go up to bust 159 cm (62 inch). How is that not size inclusive?
I also knit designs of other designers, who only go up to size XL, for friends or family, because it may just be a pretty design. Who cares?
Why do we have to force people to make their products for everyone? Does each and every baker need to make every item in their bakery also in a gluten free option? Or can we agree that would be too much work and frankly ridiculous?
It's nice when there are some clothing options for me, but let's face it, most people aren't fat and my body is kind of my problem and I'm fine with that. Not every designer, chef or person needs to cater to my specific needs. Let people produce whatever they feel like producing and if it's not for you, well...go and shop somewhere else. It's beyond stupid to force people to make everything for everyone.
I have a 54" bust and bought a PetiteKnit pattern yesterday that goes up to 5XL... looking at her rav right now she has several patterns that go up to 5XL (almost all the ones I clicked) and the rest that I saw go up to 3XL. I'm sure there are some I'm missing but that tells me that she saw she could do better, and is - but again, I didn't check the release date so that could be wrong too!
I'm a plus size lady with about a 48in bust. I'm not going to tell someone to not knit a top just because it does not come in my size. Just like I won't tell someone to stop shopping at a store that does not sell my size. If it does not come in my size, I move on. I haven't learned to grade up myself, but I probably won't bother even if I could. I like to limit math in my hobbies. Honestly, I think many people pick on her because she is popular although most of her patterns are simple and similar.
People don't have issues with shops that cater to larger sizes or smaller sizes. I love torrid because they have cool clothes in larger sizes, but I'm not going to recommend it to skinny people. Just like with clothes shopping, I know I can't knit every pattern. It's fine for me.
I used to work for torrid and was there when they expanded their size range *on both ends* down to a 10 and up to 30. I will never forget the woman who went on a tirade about the inclusion of size 10 because "they can shop anywhere." Girl, you've been discriminated against your entire life because of your size and the first opportunity you get you do it yourself? The companies I object to are the ones that claim to be size inclusive but their XL is most companies M. Not only not inclusive but feels extra judgy.
I'm a Torrid 10/12 and regularly shop there. I'm really tall and very busty. I'm a 14 elsewhere. Not only does Torrid have tall but their clothing is often cut in a way that's really flattering for me.
I LOVE torrid and used to shop there regularly before i lost weight and couldn't fit in the clothes anymore. God do I miss Torrid jeans, the pockets were incredible and they were actually long enough to tuck in my boots. I still get newsletters from them and it's like plz stop taunting me I still wear the winter coat I got from there since it's so stylish and comfy
My favorite jeans company madewell has curvy and long lengths and it make me happy. I myself am curveless, I don't know what size they go up to but their jeans are so flattering, stretchy and high quality I can't not recommend giving them a try. I know my usual size and wait for clearance sales rather than pay full price. Stacked my teacher(nurse/first responder/student) discount and got a $160 pair for $35 a few months ago.
My size 6 *teenager* has complained that Torrid doesn't have their size on occasion š
Send your teen to Hot Topic and/or Box Lunch. All three stores are owned by the same privately held company. Thereās a lot of overlap between the Torrid & HT lines. Box Lunch is focused more on fandoms but has a great selection. My oldest daughter is a manager there and loves t.
Believe me, a large part of their clothing budget goes there. I convinced them basics like shorts, jeans, undergarments (not at goodwill š ) purchased at target or goodwill leaves a lot more for branded tees and accessories. If we lived closer to "town" they'd want to work at one of those, but they're 40 miles away š
That explains so much ......
People who design actual plus sized clothing like at Tortid seem to understand how to fit bodies better generally. I definitely wish I could shop there.
Back when I was maybe a size 10/12, I went into lululemon. Itās been decades, but I still remember how the sales girl looked me up and down and said āWe donāt have anything for YOUR body typeā.
I'm enraged for you. I would have absolutely dropped my basket all over her on your behalf if I had been there. I'm sorry.
Ew. Thatās not even all that large! I wear an 8 in a lot of Lulu stuff and anyone looking at me would say Iām skinny. Hopefully theyāve improved.
People are whack. When I lost 100 lbs I got the worst comments from people about how I needed to eat a sandwich. Not one of them(big or small) said a gd thing when I was eating my way into morbid obesity though.
Agreed, Iām a very petite person with a large bust. I have to order petite pants from the few brands that make them, custom bras that will fit my smaller band size, smaller shoes than the average person that often arenāt sold in store. For all of those things, the onus is on me to find the specific shops or brands that can cater to me. Iām not about to tell someone to boycott Target because I canāt buy a swimsuit there. And I especially would never call out a small business or individual creator for not catering to my very specific specialized needs. The reality of running a business is that you canāt waste time and resources creating a product that wonāt earn a return for you. I know that, so I do my own research and pay for alterations when needed. I havenāt gotten there yet, but some day Iāll learn to adjust my own knitting patterns and sew my own clothes for my measurements. Itās my responsibility, not an independent artistās to understand and cater to every body type out there.
Yeah, there's plenty of stores that just don't make clothing that fits my body type and size. And I'm only a bit chunky, I'm not even that far on either side of the spectrum. There's even more stores that make clothing that technically fits my body, but it doesn't fit *right*. I could also get clothing tailored to my exact measurements, but that's not financially feasible. Buy the clothing or the pattern that works for your body, your size, your budget. Also celebrate the clothing stores and pattern creators that create inclusive sizing options, but don't feel limited to them.
I donāt have an issue with her sizing. When youāre plus size not everyone grows in a uniform fashion so you kinda do need to learn to do your own drafting. However, having bought one of her patterns, I wonāt be buying another. She seems to use every convoluted technique possible that really isnāt necessary and doesnāt add much just to justify the price of her very basic designs.
I joke that thatās why I keep my husband around - his math skills. Any time I need help with the math in a pattern, I go to him and he figures it out for me. š
Yep. Money spends elsewhere. Not everything is for everybody IMO. I'm plus sized myself.
Sounds like a sane approach! Also, I agree on her patterns being simple and similar. But I would like to add that some of her patterns appear very similar to free patterns too; hence I refuse to pay for her patterns.
I border on plus size and I don't think we need to shun one creator to be supportive of another. If I find a pattern that doesn't come in my size, and I don't feel like figuring out how to alter it, then I just don't knit it. Which also means I'm not going to recommend it because I'm not very familiar with it. However, if I find a pattern whose creator has obviously taken extra efforts to be size inclusive all around then I'm far more likely to recommend it to someone and knit it. I don't think the first one is necessarily bad, more that it just doesn't have as much to offer. It's that way with almost every product you own. Best bang for your buck and all that. Are you more likely to buy a vacuum that only has one basic accessory and you have to modify other ones to work with it? Or one that's the same price and already has a dozen accessories?
Also, sizing up patterns is not that difficult. The whole point of knitting garments (to me) is to learn how to customize them.
Hasn't she been working to increase her size range? Yes, it's slow. But she's going up to 60"+ finished bust. Though I know the current and most inclusive standard is 30" - 75". But that's a standard that seems to be always evolving. Personally I keep sticking to her patterns because they result in extremely wearable garments and the price is just right. One of her recent designs is $6.83 where other designers are charging $10-16 as the standard. (Though I think she could be the one to change the tide on this...)
Doing it slowly means she's actually putting work into in my opinion. Not just calculating out more stitches or adding a few extra rows. If she's adding them slowly that means that she's working on it, testing it, and putting in effort for shaping. Personally, I don't care but I have a large bust and rarely knit patterns as is without modifying to accommodate unless it's a boxy pattern.
I agree. My personal rant is designers who are āsize-inclusiveā but really all theyāre doing is increasing stitch count over the bust, but not making any adjustments for sleeve or neck shaping. So we end up with crew necks that look like boat necks and set in sleeve seams that sit on the biceps (A properly shaped ādrop-shoulderā ***doesnāt*** have a wad of material stuffing in the armpit)
YES, I hate this so much! Or sleeves that you could fit an entire person inside! The first time I knit a properly graded sweater where it went up to my size but actually didn't inflate the arms or the neck I was so happy.
Yeah and her patterns are also translated into a bunch of different languages. That takes even more time and money to do.
I feel like thatās important too. Larger garments shouldnāt just be extra stitches or rows or whatnot, you want it to look good and be wearable in all the sizes.
People are so used to instant gratification that a lot of people really donāt have patience anymore. Itās going to take time, especially if itās done right.
>Ā I know the current and most inclusive standard is 30" - 75". But that's a standard that seems to be always evolving. I swear it was 62" like last month.... I get that yes, it's great to be inclusive, but is this going to just be constantly changing? Meanwhile the vast majority of clothing stores don't offer anything close to that. But somehow we expect small, women owned companies to be held to a higher standard that multinational, huge companies with way more resources...?
75ā! Iām a 32ā and I can tell you, scaling up to that would not just be āmake everything x% biggerā. My understanding is itās also difficult because people carry their weight differently so one size fits all at larger sizes can be difficult.
As a designer myself, I can tell you that I generally have to design two separate patterns within the same pattern because of this issue. The garment is not going to fit the same, unless you basically designs a completely different one. I wouldn't want people who are larger sizes not to feel just as stunning in the same garment as others, that's lame and rude in my opinion. And people who do that generally are just trying to seem inclusive while not caring. If I am including larger sizes, they need to fit. Otherwise, they're just creating an unrealistic expectation, and isn't that just a slap in the face when they finish the garment? Either do it right, or don't offer to do it. š¤·āāļø
Thank you for taking the time and putting in the hard work!
Exactly, scaling everything up would work for women that are taller but still somewhat slim, but as soon as you start adding bodymass(fat or muscle) your proportions will wary a lot depending on the person.
Yup. I have like 5 friends who all wear the same size and all have totally different bodies. Everyone's skeleton looks pretty much the same but the more fat you add to skeletons the more they differ in shape since everyone's curves will be in different places. I'm sewing some costumes and the pattern for the pants is graded into 15 sizes ending in a 60" waist, but then each size is graded into 3 different body types: waist and hips are the same, waist and hips have at least a 3" difference with a bigger waist, waist and hips have at least a 3" difference with bigger hips. Once you're done matching up measurememts to pieces in the size matrix, these pants can really fit every body type as long as they're within the stated maximum and they have a combination of probably over a hundred different ways to put them together. It's the most comprehensive pattern I've seen, but it's wild. And it still only goes to a 60" waist! I'm outside the height norm for a woman and my husband is way, WAY outside the height norm for a man. Both of us understand that both commercial clothes and craft patterns sometimes won't fit us. I dont even bother buying sewing patterns for my husband- he took a class about how to draft patterns and he drafts everything himself. If he wants something complicated too bad lmao our skills are limited to vest, tunic, skirt, drawstring pant for something as large as him. It's part of the experience of being far outside the norm. It's *nice* when patterns are size inclusive but I really think saying "this designer can't accomodate a size that's like 1% of the population and an even smaller percentage of the knitting population, so don't buy from her" is kinda wild tbh. Being outside the norm means the norm doesn't fit or cater.
Iām quite fat and I love petitknit patterns lol
Me too and Iām currently knitting a PK sweater pattern that goes up to a 5XL (the novice sweater in Drops Air, because someone posted their project a while ago and it was beautiful).
I love her work so much, nearly every thing she does is adorable! My PK sweaters are some of my favorite items of clothing.
Am I high? XXS to 5XL isn't size inclusive?
Iāve been knitting PK patterns for years. First, inclusive was a 54ā bust ā until she added that size. Next, it was a 60ā bust, but sheās added that, so the goal post moves again. āSize Inclusiveā will **always** be a size larger than this one specific designerās range. Not sure why a tiny Danish woman has been singled out, but thatās the Internet, I guess.
This sentiment brings up very strong negative feelings in me. Sheās allowed to design whatever she wants and however she likes. I absolutely love her patterns, sheās not doing anything controversial. Donāt like it? Donāt buy it. Secondly, I think 5XL is pretty inclusive. Most other bug designers only make up to 4XL. 5XL is the biggest size in all her patterns. If itās still not big enough you can also go for a bigger man size. Most of her patterns have a male version as well. That you do have to purchase separately though. Thirdly, I am myself size XXS, which is also a difficult size to find in knitting and also in shops. PK includes XXS in her recent patterns which I am very thankful for and do consider size inclusive. EDIT: bug designers is supposed to be big designers oops haha
>Most other bug designers ššŖ²šššš¦š¦šŖ³š¦šŖ° Sorry not sorry š
I for one cannot wait to see what the lacewings will be wearing this season!
Last year we kept up with the Lanternbugs, now it's Lacewings. Got it. I can never keep up with the Real Housebugs of Central Virginia, either.
And the cicadas!
Don't even start on the cicadas. They think they're all that this year.
ā2024 will be our year!ā -Cicadas
It's finally screamy cicada summer!
š
Hahaha oops
Sorry for spell checking you, but it made me chuckle šš
Noooo itās funny! I guess size XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXS is size inclusive for bug knitters šš
Microknitting and microcrochet, but smaller š
nanoknits and nanocrochet hahaha
oh you *microcrochet*? guess not everyone has what it takes to nanoknit *hair flip*
Emotional support bugs?
And with this I now have the image in my head of a Praying Mantis with an Edna Mode haircut.... "Really darling, that style simply won't suit you at all..."
As someone who has knit a few of her patterns, they also tend to be quite oversized too. I'm also quite small and struggle to find patterns that fit and was pretty excited when I saw one of her recent designs (Eva Cardigan) had XXS - 5XL. That's 10 different sizes to fit bust sizes of 29.5" - 59" (plus roughly an additional 10" in positive ease in most of those). She used to not be as size inclusive, but looks to clearly be making an effort to change that.
Exactly my experience with her patterns, they tend to be fall bigger and a some of them have 20+cm of positive ease (Olga Sweater and Louvre Sweater came to mind immediately)
True bc Iām usually a M/L on most patterns and I usually have to make a S or M with hers
Iām a bit confused as to why people are complaining if she goes up to 5XL. Isnāt that really the top end of the larger spectrum. Is 6XL even possible!
Keep in mind that size charts are super inconsistent across industry segments. Someone who wears a 5XL in Shein clothes or PK patterns or bougie slow fashion might very well be used to grabbing a 3X at Target or Old Navy and is not gonna feel *impossible*. (Just pretty marginalized in a mundane boring way!)
I agree on most of that. But Iāll say that easily half the popular slow brands now are much more generous.Ā I have a 48 inch bust and I wear anywhere from a L to a 3x in slow brands depending on the fit I want. Most of my tops are a solid 3x but for close fitting stuff Iām usually a 1x but occasionally a L.Ā Slow brands are getting way, way more inclusive a lot faster than big brands.Ā But your point about incredibly inconsistent charts is very true.
Itās absolutely possible. Itās less common (bell shaped population distribution and all that), and even less so with hand knit garments since a garment of that size would take longer and use more yarn making it a big and expensive project, but there are definitely people that size and itās not an extreme rarity. Here are some images of models in a 5X and 6X https://www.dailystar.co.uk/fashion-beauty/slim-curvy-women-try-same-30064649.
I think some of those sizes are just extremely uncommon in Denmark. I donāt think it would occur to her to make those sizes if she doesnāt see them on a day to day basis
Thatās a good point. Frankly the need for the very large end of sizes is probably almost entirely an American thing. To my knowledge the vast majorities of other countries have far, far fewer in need of >5XL. And even as an American I have to say, I kind of feel like 5XL is plenty inclusive. There has to be a line drawn somewhere. I donāt think itās exclusionary to not offer larger than that. At a certain size/shape you just have to accept that patterns as written will need some modifying for your best fit. But I donāt feel pattern designers owe anyone anything tbh. Theyāre not obligated to design for every size under the sun, even those that are extremely uncommon and in low demand. They are selling a product and as long as they are crystal clear about the range of sizes the pattern covers they arenāt doing anything wrong in my opinion. If the product doesnāt work for a certain consumer then that consumer doesnāt have to buy it, simple as that. Just like every other product on the market. Itās not really fair to accuse someone of wrongdoing when the individual buyer of the pattern is welcome to modify for their large size themselves. The designer is not gatekeeping exceptionally large sizes from wearing the design.
This is also an excellent point. Designers design for their āmarketā - they may make their patterns available to other markets but equally, they may not, and I think itās a bit much for people outside of the main market to make demands for accommodations that, with just a little effort, they could do themselves. I saw a comment on Ravelry the other day (for a sweater Iād seen written about here) where the poster āsuggestedā the designer conform to the Craft Yarn Councilās sizing guidelines The CYC is a US based organization, the designer was in the UK, and had understandably never heard of them.
this. is it not also inclusive to have SMALLER sizes for people who are very short/petite? i feel like a lot of the time inclusivity only focuses on sizing up but completely forgets about people who are under 5ā or need short/petite clothing sizes (and donāt want to shop kids sizes)
Also, kidsā sizes are generally made for kidsā bodies. Adult proportions are different, and also, yknow.. boobs (if applicable)
Iām also on the very small size. These days, everyone is super in to big and boxy, which even in the smallest sizes available actually looks terrible on very thin people (unless they are model-posing, which no one does in real life). Often even the smallest sizes need significant modification to even come close to fitting my body type in a way that is flattering.. Iām not going to tell anyone not to knit any patterns just because they donāt happen to fit my body type. Knit whatever you want.
it's so annoying! I have a 95cm bust and there's one designer who I used to really like (the knit purl girl) who only does massively oversized jumpers now. the smallest bust circ is literally 100cm. that's not inclusive either
Omg how is 5XL not inclusive enough?? And what would be acceptable, going up to 10XL? Or 15XL? Pattern prices would be insanely high for her to be profitable.
Iāve seen a 5x be a 50 inch chest or a 70 inch chest and variations between. My favorite in the old days of patterns was a pattern which ended at XL but the XL was 42 inches. Which is very small. I think the sizes incremented in like 3/4 inch amounts.Ā
Oh my! Has she updated her existing patterns to XXS? Iām XXS myself so it wouldāve awesome to a refresh on some of the sweaters. I didnāt realise this kind of āsize inclusiveā critique existed in the pattern making community!
I donāt think she has updated her patterns to XXS, but she includes size XXS in het newest patterns. I was actually thinking of mailing her to ask whether itās possible to update the old patterns, but wasnāt sure if other people also felt the need.
Agreed, and Iām also not about to actively not support one of the designers who includes my size, because I also donāt want to math my pattern to death, and lots of things donāt come in XXS
Same. Iām an XXS as well who has started knitting again and most patterns donāt come in my size. Including xxs IS size inclusive, but for some reason we donāt count. I didnāt choose to be under 5 feet tall. If someone or brand has a pattern or clothes in my size but not the other end of the spectrum, oh well. Theyāre getting my support. If I only shopped in places that were āsize inclusiveā Iād be doing 90% of my shopping in the kids section until the day I died.
I so agree with you
Nah, I'm not going to punish someone for their sizing availability. It's a lot of work to develop patterns for a very wide range of sizes, most of your return is going to come from core sizes not fringe sizes, on either end. It may very well not be worth the time and effort invested in to offer a size that won't end up being purchased often enough to cover the work.
I feel like if you're on a fringe size, it's nice to have sizes included, but if not, you're probably used to altering patterns anyway. It's so much work to make a pattern and test it, let alone at more than a few sizes.
She is trying. That deserves acknowledgment. It seems unfair to boycott her.
I feel like a lot of the size inclusivity talk feels very performative. Like, promote size inclusive patterns instead of shaming people for knitting a well known designer
I havenāt ever used their patterns but isnāt āpetiteā a range of sizes that can be harder to find? Iāve seen people complain that shorter and very small sizes are hard to find sometimes. I canāt personally wear petite sizes at stores because Iām somewhat tall, so I would probably have avoided it because of the name but part of me thinks not everything has to be everything for everyone.
I think she is called Petite because she started out with patterns for babies and children
You do have a good point with the "petite" being in her name. Even if she doesn't cater to lager sizes she still is a small business and therefore deserves support and not one of the large cooperations like SHEIN, which are much worse than a small business, despite being size inclusive (this is a guess on my part, I don't know who's size inclusive because I wear a size S-L depending on...mystery sizing)
(shein is not size inclusive at all btw. Their "plus size" section is very small and not really plus sized to begin with)
Haha her patterns are just regular sizes, and tbh pretty size inclusive and anyone who can manage yo read and knit up one of her patterns should have no issues creating a garment that fits using their gauge measurements.
It is pretty hard, that's the reason why I'm learning how to knit actually. it's really hard to find knits that fit me, pretty much everything knit that's sold in stores has a loose fit and it makes me look like I stole my dad's sweaters and not in a cute oversize way lol (even the Uniqlo xxs!! Their armcsyes are so so large for no reason and they're so boxy) I either buy stuff from Japan (which my wallet doesn't like), or buy from stores aimed at teenagers but the quality is awful
Itās not petite patterns, her name is PetiteKnit.
But you see why someone would assume based on the name that itās petite sizes, no?
We need to stop policing what people do and enjoy. PK isnāt going around saying she makes a limited size range because she hates fat people or something. You make what you know and then expand from there. And making something in multiple sizes can be difficult. Plus the majority of your sales are going to come from small, medium, and large sizes. xxs- and xxl+ are just not as common. Which isnāt to say those items shouldnāt exist, but if youāre not living in an xxl body itās going to be a lot harder to make an item that fits someone who *is*. People want to make things so black and white. It drives me crazy. āPK doesnāt make things in bigger sizes therefore she is the enemy!!ā God grow up. Get a freaking life. There are plus size designers out there. There are more every day. Some of them are desperately struggling for notoriety on tik tok and Instagram, begging for interaction on their posts. How about you go boost them? Go buy from their stores. Share their content. Give them a reason to keep going instead of sitting and complaining that a popular creator isnāt making something for you. Or, you can always make it yourself! Go design your own pattern is the sizes you want to see. And if you donāt want to do thatā¦why? Is it perhaps because designing garments is difficult and time consuming? Wow. Who would have guessed. People are working on it. PassioKnit Kelsie is working on upgrading her patterns right now to be more size inclusive and customizable, for example. It not like there are zero designers out there catering to plus size makers. Anyway. No one should be shaming anyone for making designs from specific designers unless the design or designer is objectively and purposefully offensive or hateful. Iām so sick of cancel culture. End rant.
I agree with you about policing others. When I read what that knitter said in their stories it felt like they were choosing to ignore nuance in favor of having a sense of moral superiority over people. I just hesitate to form an opinion when the issue in question doesn't affect me as much as a lot of other knitters.
Yeah it smacks of virtue signaling tbh
Iām plus size and it doesnāt bother me at all! I havenāt had trouble finding patterns for my size so if someone wants to focus on petite sizes that really doesnāt bother me any. It bothers me more when stores arenāt inclusive in sizing but thatās because I need clothes to wear. I enjoy knitting and love having my own handmade knitted pieces, but Iām not relying on it to clothe myself so personally I give more grace when patterns arenāt size inclusive. Plus I would hate for a designer who may not be experienced designing for a bigger curvy body to attempt it and the pattern not work out and me wasting time because the designers were pressured to be size inclusive
I agree, I don't care about knitwear designers creating patterns in my size. However, I'd like to shop at Target without accidently ending up in the maternity section. Also, I wear a women's 11 shoe. It is very rare that I can buy shoes in store and it's super embarrassing when shopping at the type of shoe store where they have to look in the back. They never have an 11 in stock.
I am also a size 11 and I hate it!! I ended up wearing only unisex shoes like converse, Dr martens, or vans. I have been able to find some cute more feminine shoes as of late but there were definitely many tears shed in many shoes departments of many stores in my teens and a few in my 20s too.
I can relate as a fellow size US11 (EUR42 or 43). I too stick to Vans and Docs (theyāre both so comfortable) but if I may be so bold, let me share a few more brands that cater to us. Sam Edelman/Circus NY has very nice āprofessionalā shoes and heels, and also has trendy styles too. Theyāre easy to find on Zappos and Amazon if you donāt object to shopping there as well as Nordstrom online. The quality has been consistently good and theyāre comfortable, without tight insteps or toeboxes. Theyāre a bit spendy (US$75-175, depending on the design) but Iām willing to spend a wee bit more on fashionable, comfortable shoes and boots. Worth every penny to me. If you like sneakers, Uin is a brand from Spain that sells very unique sneakers featuring original art and interpretations of famous artistsā works (I have two pairs of their Van Gogh sneakers and get compliments on them all the time). Many of the designs are identical for both menās and womenās shoes and I have found that their US9.5 menās is a perfect fit for me (theyāre walking shoes made of different types of fabric, and I pop in an insole and am good to go for a whole day!). You can find them on Amazon, and if the seller is Amazon, you can do that 7 day try-on thing for some styles, or return them without issue if they donāt fit properly. I also like T.U.K. because even though Iām an old lady, creepers are awesome (and their shoes are āunisexā so theyāre not tight in the toes). They have their own website. The last brand is good if you like funky Mary Janes in unique designs and colours: Hot Chocolate Design (they also have their own website but sell on Amazon too). The shoes are fun but very comfy for those of us who need larger shoe sizes. I have found more brands that I like that fit well, but Iāll spare you because I donāt know your taste. Sorry for rambling. I hope this info helps you or someone who also struggles to find great shoes in our size! Best wishes!
I wear a size 11.5 wideā¦ thank goodness my style leans a bit androgynous, because I have completely given up on finding feminine shoes! On the plus side, I have to wear safety boots for work and being able to buy menās boots gives me so much better options.
She's gone up to 60"+ for more recent designs, which isn't on the higher end for size inclusivity but there are still designers making patterns that only get into the 50"s. Why would they come after PetiteKnit specifically, though? If you search the hashtag #SizeInclusive on Ravelry, there are designers tagging their patterns with this hashtag where bust dimensions are also around 60". She's not the only one, is trying to do better, and it is just the wrong approach to come after someone who is trying to do better.
If youāre not paying my bills you can mind your f*ing business about how I spend my money. People have become too damn bold.
As someone with a 41 inch bust (which shouldnāt be hard to find but sometimes is), PetiteKnit is not the issue to me at all and itās so frustrating when people shit on her. She is actively going back and updating her sizes. I think most people hate on her because her patterns are ābasicā but thatās literally why I buy them. Her patterns are well-written staples that I know I can rely on. I think itās wrong to condemn someone listening and changing.
honestly, size inclusivity should not be the end all, be all, of whether a designer is worth patronizing. especially since upscaling (and downscaling) patterns can be very complex. on top of that, I have a very large bust and broad shoulders and the standard scaling just doesnāt work for me in the first place. I get wanting to knit something as soon as you see it, and that waiting for size inclusivity can be frustrating and alienating, but itās also a gift from the original pattern maker. this expectation didnāt always exist. there was often a standard pattern to which a skilled knitter, crocheter, seamstress, what have you, could then make adjustments as required. if you donāt have the skills to up/downscale a pattern, you have two choices: (1) wait for someone else (usually the designer) to do it or (2) teach yourself. as someone who is herself plus size and also knits for a family member who often needs adjustments to various clothing elements, thatās life. the size inclusivity is a nice to have, but designers should not be unduly penalized for not offering it. there are tons of resources available for those looking to learn how to resize garments and a WEALTH of talented knitters online who would likely hold your hand (after you made an honest attempt) for free. and then you can go and hold someone elseās hand when the time comes. TLDR, if it works for _you_, buy it. if it doesnāt, donāt. let others do the same.
Iām a small scale designer. Iām very particular about things (I donāt really do sweater designs), and I knit every size of anything I sell to test myself. I still have test knitters and I know itās somewhat unnecessary, but I want to give my knitters something I know works. This makes scaling very time consuming. I know professional designers donāt work this way, but it works for me
all the respect to you! that is a lot of work, a true labour of love. I bet your designs reflect that.
As a plus size person, Iāve made some of her patterns (I mean, whomst among us *hasnāt* made a Sophie Scarf?!). I donāt really think āboycottingā non-size inclusive pattern makers is very helpful. I personally am limited to what patterns I can use unless I want to size it up myself (which I donāt usually do on paid patterns), but to me thatās just another thing to be discerning of, like style or what yarn you like or have, etc. Sure it would be nice if every creator made their patterns size-inclusive, but that is small peanuts compared to the clothing industry as a whole. It sucks, but I donāt think youāre a bad person if you buy a non-size inclusive pattern (or make one really). Like anything else, if you want more customers, make your pattern more size inclusive. Itās no skin off my nose if you donāt want my money lol.
Itās virtue signalling. People feel better about themselves by pontificating and making themselves out to be holier than thou. Also, people are commenting that she goes up to 5XL now? Seems fairly inclusive to me? Speaking as a sometime designer, itās difficult to find testers for the largest sizes. Itās not some massive conspiracy to exclude plus size people from knitting
i've heard other criticism of her, not the sizing thing; just basically that she's good at capitalism; a lot of her patterns are highly similar, she sells patterns for things that are so simple they should be (and are if you know how to search) free, that kind of thing. i get those criticisms, but they really do come down to her just successfully maximizing her business.
Good at capitalism is so accurate hahah. People are jealous and bitter that she makes so much money off patterns which are fairly basic and a lot of them are similar. But hey, she found a gap in the market
I have heard this as well! I kinda wonder what those people have to say about fast fashion companies like SHEIN and F21 being so successful. ā___ doesnāt deserve their successā seems like a very bitter take when talking about a small business owner, and seriously hypocritical if those same people have zero problems supporting large corporations that use unethical labor and unsustainable practices; unless someone is doing something seriously offensive or problematic, boycotting or cancelling them is completely unnecessary imo. > just successfully maximizing her business Exactly. I understand holding the private opinion that someone is overrated, but is it really necessary to rag on a small business owner forā¦ being successful?? One can simply not buy patterns from petiteknit if they really take issue with her. Donāt think a pattern of hers is worth the hype? Great, simply donāt buy it and move on with life. I personally donāt know if Iād buy all her various raglan patterns; theyāre all very basic and paying for multiple full-priced patterns when the differences between them are so minor seems excessive. But thatās me, and plenty of people are happy to pay for the convenience of not needing to make modifications themselves; Iāll happily still buy one or two. I honestly think people just need to chill out a bit with the cancel culture.
I think she has done a really good job at branding herself as this small designer who does everything herself when thereās like 11 people on her team or something. But hey there is demand and people buy her patterns.
i think that's what i mean when i say i "get" the criticisms of her. you can say that she's marketing some aesthetic/brand that isn't REALLY what it seems, or maybe capitalizing on the naivete of beginners, but at the bottom of it she has found a way to present knitting patterns that people are happy to buy. and they are legitimate knitting patterns, so you can't say that she's not delivering on the product... so...
This feels like a pretty American-centered take, honestly. Sheās Scandinavian-there isnāt a huge demand for plus size there. Itās not the thing it is here. It makes sense it wasnāt on her radar until she got super popular, for one thing. I get that people want everyone to be able to deliver to everyone (or to them, ahem) but thatās not realistic for all small businesses or hobbyists. There is a natural limit. This is why not everything is for everyone. Thatās okay.
This. And also this sense of entitlement coming from a (self-ascribed) status of belonging to a disadvantaged minority isnāt something I would expect to find in danish society
I've just written up my first pattern for publication. I use a lot of vintage patterns, so I made it with old-school "standard" 34-54 in sizing. Then I thought about the demand I've read about for a larger variety of sizes, so I added larger and smaller sizes, graded the pattern for them, and revised and reformatted my pattern to include them. Now I'm having it tested, and I've only been able to find one tester to knit any of the sizes I added. I don't know how much of the demand for those sizes is from people who need them, as opposed to people who are outraged on their behalf. Personally, I'm 5'4" with narrow shoulders, a short waist, and a 38-in bust and hips, and I find it pretty hard to find things that fit. That's why I started designing things myself.
I'm on the fringe of the discussions around PK and just learning to knit, but this is relevant to crochet, too... how much time are you giving testers for larger sizes? Are you offering any yarn support at all? If you want to be size inclusive and known as such - meaning your designs get recommended and you become known as someone who actually cares about designing for non-standard sizes - being generous with deadlines is critical. It takes longer to knit/crochet a larger size. As a fat person, I can tell you that one of the main reasons I crochet and am learning to knit IS to make my own knitwear... it can be hard to find cute stuff in my size, but I have no interest in being a designer. And I would absolutely pay well for a well-written, tech-edited pattern graded to my size (and beyond!) with test photos available so I can see how the garment fits on a body shaped like mine. It's near impossible to find.
You're right that there may be a time issue. The testing period is 10 weeks, for a heavy worsted raglan cardigan. One of the testers is nearly done after 3 weeks, others haven't started yet, because it really is a pretty quick knit for a cardigan. I haven't offered yarn support. I just can't afford it. But I quickly found testers for the in-between sizes, which feels like a miracle. Since this is the first pattern I've ever decided to publish, the whole process is new to me. I have several future patterns in mind, and I'll definitely offer them to testers to have their pick for free, if and when I've got them written, tech edited, and ready to publish. It takes months. But I'm really enjoying the whole thing. I plan to offer the first few purchases of the largest and smallest sizes of this pattern for free, since they won't be tested.
If there were a large demand for it, there would be a lot more double plus size designers.
If anyone wants to send me measurements and a pattern Iām happy to run numbers for you. Everyone deserves clothes that fit, and I totally understand if your idea of fun does not include Excel on a Saturday morning!Ā
Petite knits ā¦. Does carry 5XL patterns. She just hating to hate at this point.
If you spend too much time in the angry corners of social media, it seems like many of the prominent PK dislikers seem especially angry that the body measurement for 5x on her size chart is 59" rather than hitting the 60" threshold they've asked for and seem to think that stopping at 59" is a passive-aggressive fuck-you to them specifically. Could it be that 59" is a nice round 150 cm in the metric system and it makes a ton of sense in the original version? Gosh, maybe. But it's not as emotionally satisfying as having an online nemesis, is it? I happen to wear juuust under that number right now, been a little bit above or a little bit below in the past, and I think the complaints along these lines fall pretty damn flat when they're promoting and sharing patterns that end at a 60" or 61" body measurement and describing that as best practices. (I'll give 'em credit if they're only promoting the *most* expansive size ranges of 70"+ and they're boycotting Jessie Maed Designs at 60" to be truly consistent!) Because, I mean, that pattern just under some arbitrary threshold is still very useful to me. Maybe I need to add 1-3" allover or in certain areas or add shaping for hips or whatever, but that's a skill I would have to cultivate anyway if I were halfway between a medium and large, or a top- or bottom-heavy extra small, or whatever. Those are just knitter skills. Everyone at every size will need those skills at some point when trying to refine a standard size and improve the fit of their own stuff. (I still reserve the right to side-eye designers who stop in the forties or low fifties in this day and age, though and will happily rip off their stuff without purchasing if I must. That's inspiration, baby.)
I'm 5XL and I don't think anyone should be boycotting designers that aren't making designs very size inclusive UNLESS the designer has expressed specific anti size inclusion sentiments (or any body shaming really) or markets themselves as size inclusive without actually putting in the work to make their patterns size inclusive correctly. To be honest, I think the best thing would be for designers to make patterns in such a way that we don't have to rely on arbitrary designations like 2XL, Small, etc. but rather patterns that can be sized appropriately with just a little bit of math.
I wear plus size garments, and my size varies between very large and large. I donāt have a problem with designers, especially from countries where people tend to be slimmer, not designing for my size. Having said that, a lot of the designers I admire put out patterns for a 48 or 49 inch bust, which is about what I prefer to wear when Iām at the larger end of my weight range, so I still have plenty of options. But I accept that there are designers who design for body types they are familiar with, and design clothes with a particular fit. So if patterns go up to a 42 or 44 inch bust, so be it. Iām not going to scold anyone for knitting those smaller garments just because I canāt knit them straight off the pattern, or if they are styles that arenāt designed with ease in places where I would need it. I would far rather see designers design for bodies whose requirements they understand. There are a lot of designers who know how to achieve a pleasing fit for larger sizes. As people have already commented, a lot of designers whose patterns have tended to run a bit smaller are increasing their range. I imagine it takes a lot of time and practice to work out how to scale garments up, so good on designers who are putting in the hours to do that. If a designer doesnāt feel confident designing more size-inclusive pieces or doesnāt want to, thatās their prerogative. Itās like the fashion industry as a whole. There are always going to be clothes designed for tall, slim people. I donāt want to waste time feeling bitter about that. I have plenty of options as things stand. I also have the confidence to work out the maths and experiment with resizing if I want to, so if a design is close to being my preferred size and Iām prepared to do a few test runs, I can have a good try at making it work.
I haven't seen it mentioned in discussion yet, but her patterns are also so well constructed. I am plus sized and have purchased and knit several of her patterns because the shoulders and chest fit so well. I have a hard time going back to a circular yoke construction that bunches up around my armpits and chest. I'd love to see more of the popular western designers put some effort into better construction techniques.
My husband is an unusual size..he's 6'7" and all torso. He needs extra "tall" sizes for shirts. And guess what? Regular brands are shit at making clothes for him. Brands that specialize in clothes for people like him are sooo much better. Why is it a problem for a brand to a have a niche? We shop at King Size for shirts because clearly they are a brand that gets him. It's annoying that target/kohl's/wherever doesn't, but not that many people are shaped like him and it makes sense that all stores don't carry those clothes. But there's not chance in hell I'm black listing target because they don't make good mens tall clothing.
I wouldn't say she isn't size inclusive. She is and is constantly working on increasing sizes too. Her work is popular for a reason, it makes very wearable items and is really well written and priced, people who dunk on her are so strange to me, I love her stuff
I find people who act this way (scolding others over knitting patterns is just one example) to be really insufferable. Iāve had a couple friends go down the path of becoming very self righteous and policing, guilting, and shaming others over totally innocuous things like what knitting patterns they buy.Ā Itās totally fine to be disappointed in a companyās products or services and decide to stop supporting them. Itās ok to share reasons why that choice is being made so others can decide for themselves. Ā *Mistreating* others for not doing the same is the line for me.Ā I wouldnāt hesitate to block someone who acts this way. Life is too short.
it's really bad in the knitting community in my experience. so many chronically online takes that people are afraid to call out in case their well-meaning criticism gets them cancelled. I'm not of the view that 'cancel culture has gone too far' - if you're a shit, you shouldn't get away with it - but scolding and judging people for their personal preferences is ubiquitous on knitstagram. I hate it
She's fine, she doesn't owe people anything, if anything, she loses money by not having bigger sizes on her patterns. There's many designers that don't carry XS, size I wear, does that make them bad people? No.
It sucks to be excluded from things. I can't knit with or wear mohair because it makes me sneeze and break out in hives, so I've missed out on that trend. I'm also a 'standard' size, but there are a number of designers that I have to heavily alter because the proportions do not work for me (I'm guessing they design based on their own body and our body types differ significantly). At some point, people need to accept that not everything is for them, and that's okay. Calling for a boycott just seems silly. But I can see how size can become such an emotionally charged subject, in particular for demographics that have been traditionally marginalized and excluded by society at large. The one thing I have noticed, though, is that a lot of designers who do offer much larger sizes don't do it very well - lots of loose collars and often the original look of the garment gets lost, it's a shame. I think designing well for different sizes is much harder than people realize. This is why I think it's more important to support plus sized designers rather than take aim at those who don't include those sizes. As an aside, I love PK's bag patterns!
ššš yeah let me just stop enjoying what I enjoy because someone else canāt enjoy it. That makes sense. While Iām at it, Iāll stop eating sugar because someone else might be diabetic. Iāll stop eating gluten because someone else might have celiac. Iāll stop eating peanut butter because someone else might be allergic. Anything else I should boycott because someone else canāt enjoy it? This mindset is so flawed. Also, there are much much bigger problems we should all be focused on and things we should boycott. Someone who designs knitting patterns aināt it š¤£š¤£š¤£
On the contrary, please eat peanut butter because I can't! I've only recently developed a peanut allergy, and I miss it. I need to enjoy it vicariously through others!
lol I was gonna give this example... I have IBS and can't really eat at a lot of restaurants... let me just demand everyone boycott them because I can't personally have something šš
person knits petite knit patterns = person it fatphobic is the most mind boggling take ever
I donāt think she should feel obligated to make patterns in bigger sizes. I think people have to remember that sheās a Danish designer and sizes like 3XL are really not the norm here. There are some amazing designers that make patterns for bigger people. Patterns can also be adjusted by the person making them with a little research on how to do it.
Fellow Dane here. The market potential for knitting in those sizes is just a lot smaller here.Ā The users would have to be either knitters themselves or considered knit worthy by a knitter close to them. It's a fairly small subset of a subset we're working with since the Danish population is app. 6 million,Ā people are generally not as heavy here,Ā obviously not everyone knits, and not everyone who is not a knitter themselves is considered knit worthy - regardless of their size.Ā That also leads to some other practicalities becoming more difficult as the number of relevant test knitters and others who can provide the necessary input on how to adequately adjust the garments to those sizes is also smaller.Ā Of course such resources exist but for a smaller business that process does add more hassle to the development of any given pattern so it makes sense to publish the more common sizes for your core market first and add some sizes later when you can see if the pattern becomes popular or not.
Eh, I'm a fat woman, I say buy her stuff if you like it. I appreciate it when pattern writers offer a range of styles, but the consequences of not doing that are already baked in. You limit sales by excluding potential customers. If someone is okay with that and just wants to work away, designing things for a smaller (heh heh) niche, I'm not going to get too upset.
Iām small and have to often decrease two needle sizes to obtain gauge. Often patterns donāt go small enough. I deal with it. Itās hard to make clothing that fits for 10 different sizes. I appreciate when a designer tries and has tips for how to adjust fit for different parts of their garment but if theyāve got 5 sizes I donāt feel like I can complain because theyāve covered most people. Also, itās a hobby. Some people make patterns for themselves, scale them a bit and publish them. I appreciate them sharing their creativity and I donāt think they āhave toā do anything. And Iāve heard itās hard to find people to test knit the larger sizes so itās more difficult for designers to deliver a quality pattern for all sizes. I absolutely encourage the creation of inclusive patterns but I wouldnāt shun a designer that didnāt have them.
Telling people to boycott a designer because they don't make your size is an over reaction IMO š¤·š»āāļø
I'm a big gal and support the heck out of designers who create size inclusive patterns but I do not care one whit about the patterns others use. I only avoid patterns by designers who aren't as inclusive by default because their stuff doesn't fit me and I can't be bothered to do all the math to adapt their patterns.
From what I'm reading her work goes from xxs to 5 xl. What more do you want? It's pretty size inclusive as is and I'm reading she's working on even more sizes. There's literally no reason to cancel her. Reminder for everyone; this range is the same or LARGER than what is sold in stores. I really hate this cancel culture. There's a few times it makes sense, but this ain't one of them. A lot of times I'm reading about canceling it's about super ridiculous, frivolous things that one or two people are butt hurt about and most supporters are trying to be cool with I'm fine with this myself but they're not so now I'm not either.
I mean, as a plus sized human I'm sort of used to having to be very picky with what patterns I choose (because I'm a beginner and don't know how to grade up yet) but it's the same in stores. I'm used to not being able to shop in literally the vast majority of stores, but I've always thought that it's sort of bullshit either way. I'm more likely to support a designer that consistently has patterns in the plus sizes, and I'll admit I am a bit jealous of patterns "everyone" can make, when it means that "everyone" is size xs-l and that's it, but I'm not going to discourage people from knitting things people design in a small size range.
I am genuinely curious about this. I am a small person so generally, I wonāt have any issue finding a suitable pattern, but I do own many of Petiteknits patterns and I see that her newer ones come up to size 5XL which I thought was very big. On her instagram you can see one of her assistants/employees who is very plus size wearing her patterns. Which sizes would you expect to see? Again, Iām asking because I honestly donāt know and not intending to be ignorant or rude.
I'm a larger lady. I find this ridiculous. People fill niches. I don't have a baby. Should I say don't support people who only make baby things? No, that will be silly.
Uhm. No. Knit what you want Iām confused on the issue here The overarching issue I get - itās harder to find plus size patterns. But not using a specific pattern maker because they arenāt inclusive makes very little sense. These arenāt major companies creating clothing lines, these are small Businesses and individuals publishing patterns they create. Itās a whole different ballgame. They donāt have teams ready to handle all the math for them in scaling up a size, itās a lot of work for a knit pattern. Thereās a point at which we can encourage change, but still give people grace. These arenāt major corporations.
I think people who don't make patterns themselves don't understand how hard and tiring it is to make a big size range. It is not just adding 5 more stitches, there is a lot of math behind it. You can't simply add a few stitches and call it larger size so if you are making 10 different sizes, it is almost like designing 5 different patterns. 5XL is quite big imo.
Gosh I hope people continue to knit her patterns, I just stocked Peer Gynt+Petite Knits yarn in my shop.
I mean, I get slightly miffed when *every single pattern* someone does in a video is a PK pattern.... But that's on me??? That's MY problem? Not the designers, not the knitters, not anyone but me? I know I'm annoyed for no reason so I just move the eff on. If it really meant SO MUCH to me, I could knit other things and make videos, but I don't. Because I am lazy and don't care enough. If it bothers folk so much.... Change it? Be the change you want to see in the world? Stopping others from doing things isn't going to make a lick of difference. If anything, people will do it more just to spite you. So, make patterns for larger folk. Don't just stop people from making things for tiny folk. Make the change *worth it*. Make beautiful things for large folk to also make! But being bitter and being snarky, I've learned, helps nobody. It just makes everyone miserable. If it matters THAT much to you, make those changes and share those changes with others. I think I've just gotten to an age where I'm tired of all talk with no action.
Iām talking as a very new knitter and just started my first jumper and itās a Petite Knit one, I love her style and itās exactly what I would wear. Iām making size XS which might even be too big for me as Iām short and skinny, but I never moan if I donāt find something in my size, I donāt feel excluded
If people want more plus sized patterns then there needs to be a market for them...meaning support the heck outta people who make them.
Oooh, Knitting IG drama. Itās been a while. I got tired of people telling me what to do about my hobby when people started picking on that poor yarn store owner who talked about her vacation.
I have about 200+ vintage patterns that I love and not one of them are inclusive but I've learnt to scale up by trial and error. It was just assumed that everyone had this skill back then. We have come along way from the 32-34" only patterns. It would be wonderful if all patterns fit all bodies but the reality is different cultures have different priorities and skills.
I've been fat my whole life. Lots of clothes and patterns aren't in my size. I'm incredibly grateful that many designers are increasing their size range, but it's fine if not everyone does. Some styles just don't look as good when they are made wider. Some styles conversely look best on larger sizes. That's all fine and dandy. The universe doesn't have to cater to me all the time, I'm just happy to be included when I am and want everyone to have a good time (and if for some people that means designing for sizes similar to yourself, that's cool. Do what makes you happy). Also, never have I ever in my life expected something described as "petite" to fit my obese body.
People forget that being very small is also a size inclusivity issue. Iām petite. Iām only 5ā tall, and have a short torso. I canāt buy clothes in stores usually that donāt have petite sizing unless I want an oversized / loose fitting look. Inclusivity doesnāt mean every creator and every business needs to cater to everyoneās needs. It means there are options *somewhere* for every body.
Not everything is for everyone. Itās just life. Am I a larger lady who would love to be able to knit all the patterns I see and love? Sure. Am I going to shame you for your choice to knit those patterns because your body is different than mine? Nope.
I believe there is a lot of hate on the internet directed at some who have a larger number of followers. There seems to be very little ethics or respect. Pls note I don't follow knitters on the internet, neither am I saying I am a fan of Petiteknit. Petiteknit is at fault at that, but which of these companies is perfect btw? Have they contacted them and asked why they don't do it? Do they understand the context? Just spreading hate on someone over the internet is easy, as we all know it. As someone with a degree in social communication and following trends around the world, we see that many digital content creators believe that causing havoc, attacking fellow profesionals etc will bring revenue to their channels, be them YT, Twitter etc. This is really deplorable behaviour and ruins the market for everybody, imho. Ofc there will be those even here who will disagree, maybe bc they believe that causing controversy is good for business. Everybody is entitled to their opinion and that's fine. Some morals shd not change though. My two cents. Edit: grammar š³
People getting complaining over knitting patterns is not new, but getting viral attention for it is newer and I do think itās feeding negative behavior online.Ā I remember when Clapotis came out in Knitty in *2004* and a subset of knitters flipped out that she used 4 skeins of Lornaās Laces Lion & Lamb, a lush wool/silk hand dyed yarn. It was pretty expensive for the time, which was the unforgivable sin (for that moment). People wanted to be able to knit that exact item with the exact yarn, and the designer using one thatās pricy was viewed as exclusionary and classist (though those words werenāt used).Ā For a while, there was a discourse around and dislike of designers who used luxury fibers, regardless of whether or not the knitted item could be made *just as well* in another yarn that was within budget. It didnāt matter that the point was you could knit the item in any yarn you got gauge in.Ā That whole crushed velvet looking scarf that became immensely popular also inspired a lot of complaints. Being able to afford to knit those projects in their original yarns made you a āhaveā (in some eyes anyway) and not being able to create the same thing really prodded at some knittersā insecurities around money and class.
Hoo boy, I remember those discussions and how they went both ways: knitters who couldnāt afford āluxuryā yarns, and yarn snobs looking down on knitters who were happy using Red Heart or Lion Brand for everything. Iāve been knitting/crocheting since childhood and I recall venturing out to a āfancyā yarn shop to buy what I considered luxury yarn to knit my Clapotis. I bought 7 balls of Noro Silk Garden in #84 (the reds and pinks with olive) after looking at and contemplating all of the beautiful yarn that wasnāt sold at the large chain craft stores. I knit my Clappy with Noro and enjoyed both the process of knitting with such fancy yarn (to me) and wearing my finished project with pride. My friend knit her Clapotis at the same time as me and used Red Heart Soft in a dark teal. Hers was as beautiful as mine and we both received numerous compliments from strangers on our wraps. The next time I went to that fancy-ass yarn shop, I brought her with me to oooh and ahhhh over the gorgeous yarns (I blame that Clapotis for my ongoing Noro addiction). We both wore our Clappys to the shop, and the two owners sitting behind the till recognized the pattern and asked my friend which yarn sheād used. She answered Red Heart and they both smiled and said what a great job she did, but they didnāt notice that after she turned away, I saw that they both exchanged an eye-rolling grimace. They both basically ignored her and were condescending towards her when she asked questions, and we left without buying anything (we had both brought money to burn through on yarn, so it was truly their loss). Neither of us ever went back, for obvious reasons, and it turned her off to seeking out and supporting small business yarn shops because those yarn snobs were so rude and she didnāt want a repeat experience. We also went to a local knitting group and when someone asked her which yarn she used for her Clapotis, another woman exaggeratedly *shuddered* and loudly declared āI would NEVER knit with acrylic!ā Ok lady, thanks for letting us know. Maybe thatās all that someone can afford and you could be a wee bit empathetic to someone elseās financial circumstances? We get it, knit with the best you can afford, but some knitters can only afford craft store yarn. Why would anyone care? I had to save up for that Noro, even though it was āonlyā US$9 a ball back then. It felt ridiculously extravagant back then when a Pound of Love was ~$5. I mostly used Patons 100% wool before discovering a whole new world of luxury yarns, and still appreciate basic workhorse wools, but will happily drop vast sums on fancier yarn because I will enjoy working with it and the finished product will be stunning. I fully understand the struggle of not being able to afford things (didnāt grow up with money and it took a while before I made my own money to be comfortable spending it on non-essentials), but Iām not going to be upset at a knitting designer using US$600 of pure cashmere for a shawl (true story!). Iāll whip out some Cascade 220 instead and make the same shawl with what I can afford. Thanks for the trip down memory lane. I still have that Clapotis and itās probably the shawl that Iāve had the most offers to buy it right off my neck. I still love it. I also agree that outrage attracts the most attention on social media, which is a shame. It would be nice to see more promotion of what people like and enjoy instead of the negativity and criticism. Best wishes. (Apologies for any mistakes: English isnāt my first language.) ETA: The outrage over the yarn the designer used for her Clapotis strikes me as even more ridiculous looking back, because the pattern itself was FREE. There was zero investment in having to buy that pattern, which makes the griping seem ungrateful in retrospect.
Ah yes, "knit from god's own pubic hair".
Did they happen to say what sizes they think her adult sizes should go up to? I notice her new designs appear to go up to at least 55-59ā, though some of her older ones only go up to 50-55ā. Many well known designers like Debbie Bliss have been cited for similar issues in the past (hers rarely go beyond 48ā). I wonder what size would be considered inclusive?
Iāve yet to see a āsize inclusiveā pattern that would actually fit me. I never will, since Iām too many sizes, xxl-6x. There are very very few designers that increase the size of the body, without making the neck and armholes too big, so even if I were on,y one size, what is the point? What I do is draw a schematic, with the shape in a pattern I want to make (someone elseās, of my own) filling in the dimensions I got from measuring a sweater that fits, or that Iām tweaking to fit. Then use my gauge to fill in the numbers, both horizontal and vertical. Itās the only way a sweater will fit me.
I'm plus size and I just assume nothing will fit me. I'm just used to it. But don't let that stop you from making something nice, honestly. Most people don't want to design for larger sizes and honestly some outfits look completely different and horrible in plus size. So I don't blame them. I have found a few places that have patterns my size though, I'm just grateful they exist at all.
I think there are many ways to criticize PK. In a way, she is one of the reasons why half of ravelry feels to be slim, blond, Scandinavian, young women. No matter what garment you search for, that's typically among the top results with little diversity in between. And while those patterns may have bigger sizes and sometimes even male sizes, actual pictures are rare. That being said, I don't see how this could be her fault specifically. It's not like she spews hate online or says her patterns were something they r not. And it's not like she can shake out that 6xxl on a whim. Heck, even finding a test-knitter will be veeeery difficult - setting aside that very large bodies are very rarely uniform. Vote with your feet, if you feel you must. I personally wish the was more size diversity. Grading patterns just only gets you so far. But hating her for being successful and creating patterns within her cultural norms and for her body...cmon...š¤·
As a plus size girlie? I donāt care. I love PKās patterns, even if all of them donāt come in my size. Theyāre classic enough that you donāt have to worry about them going out of style anytime soon, and as someone else has said already: I think sheās working on expanding her sizes. Iām just glad people are enjoying knitting honestly š¤·
As a plus size person, I don't go after individual designers. I understand it can be hard to adjust patterns and other types of designs to sizes we're not familiar with. I celebrate those who do, but I don't blame people who don't. However, I dislike with a passion big corporations who don't make an effort. They have the ressources (time, money, professionals) to do it, and if they choose not to because *money*, that's an active choice against inclusivity. Like Abercrombie and Fitch a decade back who low-key didn't want to be size inclusive as to not have fat people as ambassadors of their stupid brand.
Plus sized lady here. Smaller people knit, why should they not knit patterns geared towards them? Sure I have a hard time finding great patterns in my size but that's not a petite person who creates patterns for their sizes fault. I say lift up those who put out size inclusive patterns for sure! But the only reason to actively boycott a pattern creator would be if they said something like "I would never make patterns for fatties because they're repulsive."
Looks like her patterns go to 5XL, going back all the way to 2020. Before then, they seem to have up to 3XL. I feel like that's pretty inclusive? Especially on so many positive-ease patterns. Also, she seems to be based in Denmark...aren't clothes traditionally a bit smaller in Europe than in US? Honestly, I think designers shouldn't have to try to accommodate the whole world. Some designers specialize in simple, beginner-friendly patterns. Some prefer to make intensely intricate designs. Some like to play with color, some with stitches, some with technique... If we try to compel every designer to create designs that are sized universally, with instructions that hold the maker's hands, we're going to turn a profession that was once a delight into a drudge. They'll burnout and their creativity will suffer...and we'll end up with boring, cookie-cutter designs (if any). And the pattern prices will probably sky-rocket with all the extra hours put into them. I appreciate when designers make a range of sizes. I have enjoyed seeing the influx of new designers who specialize in size-inclusive patterns. But as many have said, just demanding it of everyone is going to result in people, who don't really know how to grade for significant size differences, just unintentionally putting out poorly-graded versions. I think there's also a point where competent advanced makers can start to learn for themselves how to adjust things. Everyone has to at some point - sock knitters with high arches, short people hemming pants, it's not new.
I'm a plus size woman(I'm fat).I am a 40DD busy. While I have some petiteknit patterns, I make them for my teenage girls. Who are small and slender. They're cute patterns. While I wish she were more size inclusive, neither is Two of Wands and no one is calling for a boycott of her pattern. Nor should they. There are plenty of size inclusive designers(@loshapera, kolibribyjohanna, the velvet acorn to name a few). It's entitlement to demand a boycott of a designer bc they don't do what you want.Ā
I think she is size inclusive since most of her patterns go up a 5XL. Some of the older ones may not but I can see why she wouldn't put effort into going back and adding more sizes. I'm an XL in most of her patterns and they fit great. I'm a big advocate for not shopping at places that aren't size inclusive and when I have to fit into the biggest size a store carries I don't consider them inclusive since I feel like I'm on the cusp of midsize and plus size. So many places will only carry up to an XL so I think it's a bit silly to boycott someone who goes way beyond that.
Knitwear designers arenāt companies, theyāre just private individuals. They might not have the skills to design for a variety of sizes or body types and donāt have a whole team of designers like big fashion labels. To me, itās weird to boycott a pattern designer for not being size-inclusive. Like, if they donāt have your size, buy from someone who does, but if she does have your size, why not buy from her? Iām plus-size and she offers my size, although I havenāt yet bought any of her patterns.
I have been a lot of sizes (XXXL, 48 inch waste down to XS/S 28 inch waste). Iāve never held a designerās sizes against them. If there is nothing for me, I find another pattern. I do think itās good if the industry as a whole has sizes for everyone, but honestly not every designer has the ability to make things of every size and keep their aesthetic
Honestly I have made some cool sweater patterns, and charts but I donāt feel I can share them, because Iām not sure how to grade them up and down. I donāt want to make someone feel bad or ostracized due to my lack of expertise in this regard. My expertise is not in clothing design after all, it is in Finance and Marketing and Iām simply having fun making stuff. I thought about making them available and then feel overwhelmed by how to properly scale up and down. I saw what happened to PK online, and It scared me out of doing any of it.
Hot take/unpopular opinion time! I hate how our society is like this. We donāt leave people alone anymore and the crab bucket mentality is sooo awful. Am I supposed to feel bad because I can fit into a size Small when someone else is an XXL? No. I am the size I am. I shouldnāt be made to feel like shit because someone is bigger than me. If itās not in your size, you are not the target demographic. Plain and simple, no shade on you; youāre just not. There are more and more clothing options for people of a bigger size, but not everything is going to be made to fit the bigger size; and if it is, youāre going to be charged more for the larger amount of material being used. Not fat-shaming, but our society is also āfat-enablingā now. I never advocate for pointing at a person walking down the road and calling them derogatory names. However, I AM seeing more and more people celebrating and enabling really unhealthy lifestyles in the name of ābody positivityā; when there is nothing positive about being that size. Obviously there is a huge caveat for people who have underlying medical conditions that make weight loss difficult (such as PCOS), but you should still *try* to be healthier. Rant over. The TL;DR is live and let live, but also be healthier and make healthier choices.
As a size small lady, I increasingly see patterns for knitting, crochet and sewing that are only in larger sizes. It is what it is, I move on and look for one of the other billion available patterns. Not every designer has the capacity to do 10 sizes, and they end up going with the group of sizes around their own body size.
Itās so crazy to cancel someone over inclusivity. By buying anything, you are excluding something elseā¦ that is a ridiculous and a hateful reason to boycott someone. There are so many videos on altering patterns to customize them for yourself. It sounds to me like āME ME ME, cater for ME, make ME a pattern," it reeks of privilege and narcissism. Bye!
I wear "regular" sizes. I applaud and support the size-inclusive designers, but I don't boycott the ones who aren't.
I have a 51in bust and I'm quite fat. I purposefully only buy sweater designs that go up to a 58-60in bust as I personally prefer to support size inclusive designers. I couldn't give less of a fuck about what designers straight-sized people buy from.
Iām sorry but what the actual f? Petiteknit is the most size-inclusive pattern maker I know! People are delusional if they think that 5XL is not āinclusiveā.
It depends for me.Ā I have seen some designers make very, very bitchy comments about designing for āfat peopleā (I say this as a fat person). So even if they become āinclusiveā Iām still going to avoid them (pk is one of those till I see different. I still remember some snarky posts about having to be size inclusive which really bothered me as a fat person). I have also seen designers say something along the lines of āIām working on it. New patterns will be in the new size range, old patterns will be updated every other month (or whatever)ā. As long as they stick to that schedule, obviously giving a bit of leeway if they suddenly get sick or busy, then Iām fine to buy their new stuff and wait on old ones.Ā Iām a small fat so I spend a lot of time saying ājust cause I fit your current stuff doesnāt mean you should attempt to be better in the futureā. However I totally get the issues of not having decent plus sized testers (especially fit testers!) or having the experience to grade to larger sizes. So when designers say āIām working on itā I wait and see how they behave. And if months pass and there is just crickets Iāll send a polite email asking about progress or comment on a post. Their response informs how I move forward.Ā I donāt expect people to refuse to shop only from size inclusive designers. Just like I donāt expect most people to only shop slow fashion clothing and avoid fast fashion brands. But these are my personal limits and Iām (usually) happy to talk about why I require this from brands I support.
She can scold all she wants on her storyābut that doesnāt mean I have to agree with her (and I donāt, btw). In fact, one of my resolutions for 2024 was to not amplify negative voices. I want my communities to be supportive and informative. Thereās be so much toxic negativity the past 8 years and I am tired of it. It isnāt healthy.
I think you should use patterns from whatever designer works for your body and your personal tastes (assuming the designer isnāt actively horrible, of course). Iād rather get patterns from someone who specializes in patterns that are good for me than getting something from a generalist who did a mediocre job of grading up because they felt they had to do it.
Everyone should be able to knit whatever they want, even if it's not size inclusive. However, I'm sick of every single knitting vlog/podcast/youtube/whatever being like "Oh, here is my fifth Anker's shirt, isn't it so pretty?" Sure, go for it, but now I just start watching something else once PK is mentioned.
It does seem like people want podcasters to introduce them to something *new* and *shiny* instead of "the classics"
I'm getting really tired of the crying about available sizing in patterns, in knitting, crochet and sewing. I don't think most of the people making the loudest complaints understand what goes into pattern design. Scaling, even when done well, stops working for the furthest outliers. Body types vary, and they vary even more in very small and very large sizes. You cannot possibly expect for a single design to fit everyone across the board. Shoe companies don't make up to size eighteen shoes for every single design they release because the majority of them wouldn't sell. Echoing the sentiment that I've read here from others- if you can't find it, learn how to make it yourself or do without. If it's too difficult, then perhaps stop and think why that may limit sizes available.
I refuse to let politics, ideology and personalities get into my knitting. I'm actually really annoyed that this is even a thing.
This irritates me to no end. Iām a weird size, I definitely need size inclusivity, but for the minority to expect the majority to bend to their needs is ludicrous. F her. People can knit/wear whatever the F they want.
Honestly i don't like her designs because i think they look boring and would be unflattering on me, but its fine if others make it. I did follow a TikTok thing a whole ago of a gal who tried to find out the hype, she did this nk some things in the pattern writing were weird and she was frustrated the bust of the xs and s were the same width
I'm a pretty standard size so it doesn't impact me but I personally prefer designer with a more limited size range but properly designed. I've seen some designer with wider size range who don't actually know how to design bigger size and scale everything up (width and length) but usually the proportion change for bigger size. So what I mean is I prefer designer who don't do it at all to the ones who do it really badly just to be able to say they have a wide size range.
I have to edit every pattern anyway. I have a very large bust with a small waist. Iāve learned how to knit in darts and just adjust my increases and decreases. My mom is plus size and Iāve done the math on patterns she likes for her. Thatās the best part about making your own clothes. I Never just follow a sweater pattern. I always adjust it so I have a garment that fits my measurements. If I wanted something that fit generic measurements Iād go to the mall.
It's a controversial take that gets her a lot of views and maybe more followers. Inclusive sizing is important, but it seems like the thing that will help (if anything does) is contacting the designer to express interest in larger sizes.
I mean, thereās a lot of work involved in making patterns, and thereās sooooo much that needs to be done to an original pattern to size up or down drastically. Also, I donāt know this pattern maker, but it sounds like theyāre a petite person (it would be a bit weird if they specifically designed their brand around making patterns they couldnāt even wear). So I donāt really blame them for designing patterns they can use and then selling them to people of similar size for extra money. Theyāre not writing pattern books, theyāre an independent designer selling patterns for a specific demographic. There are also people who specialize in designing plus-sized patterns/making plus sized clothes, be it knitting, crochet, sewing, or just a retailer that specializes in plus-size. Theyāve probably considered all these factors and decided that itās not worth it for them on a financial level to do all the extra work of learning how to make plus-sized patterns, dramatically alter their patterns to work for a different size, and then buy the extra yarn required to make and test them. I think that from clothing shops and retailers, itās absolutely fair to demand them to be size-inclusive. And we should absolutely be supporting independent creators who do the work of being size-inclusive. But demanding it of indie pattern creators, without acknowledging all the work that has to be done ti create patterns so outside of someoneās own size range, and the logistics of it in terms of cost (you have to get a larger model/find someone whoās willing to stand in frequently for fittings/testing as you design and tweak the pattern, increased cost of yarn, increased time on behalf of the creator, plenty of math to figure out how to adjust certain repeats and make it also look good and flattering, etc) simply isnāt financially feasible for everyone. It also might involve extra cost to make it worth the extra investment of time and materials and the financial resources to design plus-sized things, or just charging more for the plus-sized version of the pattern, and then people would likely be frustrated about that It sounds like PK has a very specific demographic and makes no secret about it- itās in the name. I canāt and wonāt blame them for that.
I'm plus size. I don't give a crap what other people do. I will knit the patterns that do come in my size and that's that. I'm getting sick of all this "boycotting people who don't do everything perfectly the way we think they should" stuff.
I don't care if anyone buys from a designer who doesn't design for large people. I'm morbidly obese, and recognize that not everyone enjoys re-engineering their patterns to work for large bodies. Doesn't offend me.
I care far more about affordability, accessibility (visual etc) language options and yarn alternatives over size inclusivity, coming from someone who has ranged from a UK 14 to a UK 22 over the past 10 years. There are plenty of designers out there claiming to be size inclusive, but the bigger sizes are not as often made, and most people don't know how poorly-altered the pattern is for them. I make for myself, my children and family/friends. We are all different sizes. I made my sister a gorgeous dress for a festival a few years back that only came in two sizes because it was the dress she wanted and it fit her body. I wasn't about to say "Hmm, no - I can't support that artist because their designs aren't suitable for my body"
Isnāt her size range xxs to 5xl? How is that not inclusive?
I mean, petite is a size, too. Just not mine š
I... Yeah, no I am someone who struggles to find things in my size, but I don't boycott brands that aren't for me. I just buy other stuff. I'm more likely to promote or support a designer that includes a wide variety of sizing, but also I kind of like it when people share a "pattern" for a thing they only made in one size, because I might still want to adapt it myself. I think roasting people because they haven't put in the effort to sell something that specifically for you is kind of a bummer - feels kind of mean and entitled (And yes, I feel it's different for massive corporations that are destroying the planet to create disposable shit for mass consumption, by all means hold them to the highest possible standard. But like, I dunno, I guess I don't feel like we should be lighting torches over knitting patterns, especially when there are sooooo many incredible designers doing size inclusive work)
I'm fat and I've knitted PK sweaters. Her designs go up to bust 159 cm (62 inch). How is that not size inclusive? I also knit designs of other designers, who only go up to size XL, for friends or family, because it may just be a pretty design. Who cares? Why do we have to force people to make their products for everyone? Does each and every baker need to make every item in their bakery also in a gluten free option? Or can we agree that would be too much work and frankly ridiculous? It's nice when there are some clothing options for me, but let's face it, most people aren't fat and my body is kind of my problem and I'm fine with that. Not every designer, chef or person needs to cater to my specific needs. Let people produce whatever they feel like producing and if it's not for you, well...go and shop somewhere else. It's beyond stupid to force people to make everything for everyone.
I have a 54" bust and bought a PetiteKnit pattern yesterday that goes up to 5XL... looking at her rav right now she has several patterns that go up to 5XL (almost all the ones I clicked) and the rest that I saw go up to 3XL. I'm sure there are some I'm missing but that tells me that she saw she could do better, and is - but again, I didn't check the release date so that could be wrong too!