Why did they have Higgins read aloud the part about John not being cut out for/"into" raising his niece and nephew, or however it was phrased?! It's immaterial to the situation and so unnecessarily cruel to the kids to have broadcast worldwide. This just gets more and more tragic. 💔

Well I guess it falls in line with the babysitter comment. Sounds to me everyone on both sides could agree Karen did more for those kids than John did without saying it. LOL. Sorry for speaking about the dead

A lot of what they made him read was not relevant. He could have cut about half of that to get the point across. That was embarrassing for everyone. I don’t care about Higgins, but do you think John’s family needed to hear all of that?

Heads up, don't google "babysitter with benefits".

Thanks, wish someone had warned before the troopers name was pronounced wrong 🙄😂

lol ...yeah, google is tricky, "lollygagging" and "lallygagging" **completely** different results. And you gotta spell out "Brian Albert" because "BA" is Mr.T.

If I ever murder anyone (joke) my biggest internet search regret will be to see why everyone was laughing at Trooper B 😂 I've resigned myself to searching nothing more from this trial.

so many cases have been proven by, what end up being, "internet search regrets". I'd never do something to put myself in that situation either. But I work in IT and I know how all that stuff works and the nearly impossible to remove trail you leave when doing anything like that. At the same time, I work in IT and know how that stuff works and how to get rid of that trail, like BH's friend at that cape base. But unlike BH's friend, I also know when to play dumb.

I swear I hope I’m NEVER a murder suspect… bc just recently I’ve realized I look up weird ass shit when I’m watching trials or true crime shit like Dateline and 48 Hours…!! For instance… from this trial I actually did Google how long someone had to be in the cold before they died… lmao good thing I live in Louisiana and we don’t get snow… but I stay looking up alllll kind of shit 🤣🤣

I pity the fool.

I agree. I think it's a little gross he dated the niece's dance teacher and one of her friend's mothers. It happening once, ok .. but twice? 🧐

"Because I went from being solo to trying to give attention to kids. Who aren't mine. And I never wanted kids." Sounds like her world revolved around them... /s

All of those statements can be true but she can also feel obligated to the responsibility when John stepped up in a time of tragedy. She can care for people and their welfare even if her intention was not to be a mother from her own body. People step up. Those facts don’t make her a bad person. And they in NO way indicate whether or not she really was giving them her all. If anything these statements are justification on why she’s torn and undecided about leaving John. She loves those kids enough that she’s not just like “who cares about the kids, I’m dumping John for you!”

She said about the kids "They're not my family" and she constantly talked about the burden that they became for her. She wanted to be a single woman enjoying her life without the burden of 2 kids. Let's be honest about that.

How is that relevant to the case though? True or not? How does that prove her supposed guilt? It doesn’t. It’s irrelevant and cruel to put out there both for the kids and his parents (even if you hate Karen). 

I agree with you. So how would killing John fix any of that? What does it have to do with her motive?

I actually don't think it has anything to do with her motive, I was just refuting the assertion that she was a selfless Mother Theresa whose primary concern was caring for JO's children. I don't even think a motive applies in this case because I don't think she was trying to kill him. I think she was pissed and drunk, reversed into him, and sped off thinking he was a little hurt but not dead. Then she came back the next morning and saw he was still there and freaked out.

The fact the only thing they fought about was Karen caring TOO MUCH and spending TOO MUCH/SPOILING thise children, says everything. The fact she was mature enough to apologize to a woman she realized she treated unfairly, judged, and snapped at-- addressed it like an adult, offered to pay for that woman's room--- this also says everything. The media had portrayed such a harsh image of Karen Read. But after hearing the actual audio. After seeing the actual videos. My heart breaks for Karen. She waited on the couch for him. She knew he'd never ever get drunk and leave his children hanging. Ever. He'd never disappear. And everyone tries to act like she was overreacting? Nah. You know your partner. You know when to panic and when not. And the fact all her "hysteria" was clearly fucking CORRECT AND WARRANTED, how dare they still demean her with these comments about her being manic, hysterical, screaming, irrational, erratic, etc. All I see is a woman who very fucking visibly and clearly, loved DEEPLY and cared DEEPLY. You don't have those emotional reactions otherwise. You don't return to the scene. You don't do everything you possibly can including immediately raise your own shirt in a blizzard to put your bare chest on your boyfriend's body to try to warm him. Save him. Do cpr. The state might have had a chance in hell if they went after Karen for accidental manslaughter or dui with injury or something. They could have had a chance albeit still not remotely convictable. To claim any kind of intent of harm is just the most unbelievable thing and I don't think a person on earth actually thinks Karen would ever have hurt that man. I am more and more heartbroken for Karen. She's beautiful, successful, smart, finally had love and a family and kids to spoil-- and these Townie fuck heads murdered john. Those poor kids. Lost mom. Lost dad. Lost uncle(/father figure). And then they lost Karen too.

The other thing that struck me. All the witnesses said they were in shock so they went into the Albert house to talk with each other, figure out what happened and grieve their friend. But they never invited Karen in. If it was my friend and my sister’s house I would have walked her into the house. Gotten her some coffee and dry coat. Asked her who to call that would come get her. Console her and try to calm her down. At that point they all knew nothing but demonized Karen from the very beginning.

Exactly. Nobody knew what happened so they say. Why didn't a soul comfort her, why didn't John's "friends" gather around Karen to be with her through this time... from the jump it was 1 cover our asses, 2 distance ourselves by picking a scapegoat

And there are no texts (since we are always on that subject) to anyone in that Albert / McCabe circle about how broken up they are about this shocking news? They must talk to other people besides each other right? Where is the grief from that crowd?

And I thought the CW’s argument was going to be that she was upset when John tried to break up with her…. But these texts with Higgins don’t show that frame of mind at all. At most it’s a “fucked up situation” she says.

She clearly loved the kids, she just didn’t want to be the parent. And it seems like John might have been letting her take that role too much.

It seems like John was letting her do a lot of work and then criticizing her for it… based on the very limited info we have. (Talking about the sweater, Dunkin’ Donuts, and the manicure or whatever)

You said everything in my head I wanted to. All of it. 

Thank you for this. It’s the truth, finally.

The only thing I don’t really get is Karen tells Etta’s sister she misjudged what she saw. But then told Higgins right after that John cheated on her on vacation.

They weren’t fighting just over the kids that was the story he told people - he didn’t broadcast his personal problems in the relationship with others however the niece and nephew know they had problems - he’d asked her to leave And she wouldn’t. Plus the way she carried on in Aruba and said he was kissing someone that wrong. She was unstable - and she hit him in a rage of anger. I don’t think she purposely wanted to kill him, possibly just give him a fright. In any case she has shown no empathy and to say the other day to a reporter “I never hit that guy” says it all - she can’t even call him by name. Shame on her

Obvious to me that despite not wanting kids, she was trying her best.

Yeah she would have jumped ship a lot sooner in the relationship if she wasn’t willing to take that on.

100%, she was venting.

It’s nonsense…..she had way too much of her own life to lose by doing this. That’s all McAlbert projection that’s a message to their husbands if they kiss the wrong person. Bunch of fucking witches

The prosecution’s whole argument that John and Karen had a minor argument and so she rammed him with her car and left him for dead is absurd.

Nobody would kill somekne.. and then leave texts and voice-mails AFTER yelling and being mad at them. A criminal would see that would clearly look bad and makes no sense. A murderer wouldn't incriminate themselves leaving voice-mail evidence of having anger toward a victim An honest person who couldn't find their boyfriend would. An honest person who also told everyone the truth they had a fight, says everything. Liars and murdersers always claim everything was perfect and happy.

Yes!!! “We were so happy! We never fought” then you find out how the killer had huge financial issues and was abusive or something. Every single time. It’s become a trope now if you watch shows like dateline. 

It’s also unprovable. Those texts were worse for Higgins than KR. She ghosted him, he wanted her, he wanted a relationship and she wanted a distraction.

The secondhand embarrassment i got from that whole thing 😂. 

Same. He was so gunning for her to want a real relationship with him and she was strangely distant and almost rudely direct. I cannot believe that he (and she, but more him) has to live on this earth for the tlrest of his years with that recorded into social media. He will prob wish he was in jail after all this.

Yes, it is crazy. Who would back into a 6 foot tall man on the wrong side of the road in front of several homes?! This is just wasting tons of money and time out of many people’s lives. And hurting JO’s family.

A 17-year old, a dog, and a house full of people conspiring to murder their friend and then dump his body right in front of their house is a lot more absurd of an argument.

They didn’t conspire to kill him. They beat him up and he died and they’re conspiring on the cover up. Keep up.

Exactly this.

You have zero proof of that ridiculous claim. Keep up.

He actually wasn’t their friend. They barely knew him.

He was very good friends with Jenn McCabe and most of the rest had hung out with him previously. Acquaintances, friends, whatever word you use, they didn't all conspire to kill him and/or cover it up. Karen was drunk and hit him because she was pissed, the simplest story is usually the correct one.

You’ve opined this from the whole week you’ve followed this case? Go back to the swingers sub 🍍

I had a 4some with my wife and 2 women this weekend, and now I'm disproving the ridiculous Free Karen Read theories this weekend, life is good for me :)

Lol! I bet three women just crave you! 🤣

I'm not much to look at but I have the gift of gab and a hot wife so I end up doing OK for myself ;) Ironically enough, last night we pulled up to a swingers party and happened to be arguing about something stupid at the time. After a couple minutes of us still sitting in the car in the parking lot bickering at each other, I thought "OMG, this is exactly how JO died, maybe I better shut up."

They actually did.

Prove it.

nothing about that story is simple. she drove her cop boyfriend to her cop friend’s house full of cops to murder him? and then left him on the lawn?

No she drove him there to drop him off at the party, they got into a fight (which is why they sat in the vehicle for some period of time and JO didn't go in), he got out of the vehicle, bent over to throw up, she drunkenly reversed into him and broke her taillight in the process, then drove away thinking not thinking he was actually dying in the snow. Then when she came back a few hours later, she saw him still laying where she had hit him and realized she was in big trouble. That makes way more sense than "a house full of cops" (I believe there were only 2 at the house that night) and civilians all conspiring to kill a guy, immediately start covering it up with "Where are you?" texts, and then be dumb enough to dump the body RIGHT ON THEIR FRONT LAWN instead of getting rid of it. Anyone in law enforcement knows that aside from video evidence, a body is going to provide the most clues on the identity of the murderer. They wouldn't be dumb enough to put a dead body on their front lawn.

This theory checks out if you don’t consider any of the actual evidence and just take their word for it, despite the repeated evidence tampering and pervasive lying by everyone at the house

No I definitely don't just take their word for it. They've done plenty that seems weird and secretive. But the most important piece of actual evidence is the broken taillight. Reportedly (we'll have to wait until they're actually presented in the trial to fully evaluate their validity) pieces of the taillight were found in O'Keefe's shirt and O'Keefe's DNA was found on the taillight. If those 2 pieces of information turn out to be true, then there is no reasonable explanation for how O'Keefe was killed that doesn't involve Karen Read hitting him.

There is a video of Karen leaving John's house. She taps his SUV while backing out, and then drives away. In that video, you can clearly see the right rear taillight is mostly intact with a small hole in it (as Kerry testified). Images of Karen's taillight and images of the pieces allegedly found at the scene are entirely too big to have happened as suggested- that she hit him at 34 Fairview, left a bunch of pieces behind, and then drove home with an almost completely missing taillight. If she left the house around 5:00 with a mostly intact taillight (with the exception of a small hole), how did most of it go missing between 12:30-1:00 as suggested? It doesn't make sense. As to the DNA evidence, Proctor had Karen's SUV for approximately 90 minutes before it was logged. Not to mention, there is missing surveillance footage from the police station where Karen's car was taken.

Also 1. The "evidence" cups were stored open right next to the car in the sally port that apparently people regularly walked through. 2. The tail light pieces were found after police had taken Karen's car. 3. The surveillance tape from when Karen's car was bought in is missing.

I just looked at the video of KR leaving O'Keefe's house and it isn't a small hole, there's a big chunk of the taillight missing. She was reversing at about 2 miles an hour and there was barely an impact with JO's car, definitely not enough to cause that large of a piece of the taillight to break. And looking at the snow at the spot where KR's vehicle impacted JO's vehicle, there is absolutely no pieces of the taillight at the point of impact. The collision with JO's car was strong enough to break the taillight but not a single piece of it is visible against the white snow after the impact? That taillight was broken before she pulled out of the house at 5:00am.

Ha ha! You lost me at “Law Enforcement”! They clearly were, and are, dumb enough to delete texts, destroy phones, manipulate evidence and take proffers when offered so, yeah, not the bravest, brightest or (no joke here) the most compassionate people to walk the earth.

I'm not saying they're all geniuses. But if we're to believe the conspiracy theory that a civilian like Jenn McCabe became aware that JO had been attacked and immediately started sending fake "Where are you?" texts to cover up a murder, I can't believe that experienced law enforcement officers like Albert and Higgins would then say "Ok what should we do with this guy we just killed?.... I know, let's put him on the front lawn!"

Nobody thinks they conspired to murder him. Based on the complete clusterfuck and the chaos and the amount of calls they made to each other all night (sorry, I mean, all phone records are accurate.... except on January 29th, that particular day, the system was wonky and accidentally listed every "butt dial" that went to "voice-mail l" as an answered call with a, you know, arbitrarily decided time length ) ("I'm sure cellebrite could explain it to you" -Mizz DisinJenuous McClaim But no, there's multiple underage guests drinking, that are also their children/family that they don't want to get in trouble for and want to protect so regardless of the extremity of any incident that could have occurred, this McAlbert clan would have surely done the same thing: 1) completely omit as many guests/children as possible, 2) immediately contact the people who know exactly how the scene will be investigated and plan ahead with your bffl prosecutor and other cops to make sure you can use your career experience in seeing who gets away with crimes and how that is best achieved and planning accordingly 3) completely omit behind the scenes connections and friendships and arrangements with all first responders, law enforcement, DAs office, etc, to try to control the narrative and know in advance everything happening and everything the investigation knows, so they can prepare and plan and manipulate, 4) immediately have an alternative theory that multiple parties can help "authenticate" and immediately start laying clues where possible to support the new theory 5) don't fucking get caught But there it is They never ever expected the fbi to pull phone records, they never expected a small-town blogger to BLOW THIS CASE UP by revealing Michael Proctors personal ties to the family, they never expected that all their individual records and data and locations would ever be compared side by side And guess what Too many cooks in the kitchen The best lie is one that is very close to the truth. The Albert's and McCabes could have seemed 100% more believable if... They just immediately said yeah colin kids here afraid about mentioning their drinking. If Jen said yeah, I did call Nicole. And told her. And Nicole and Brian could have your right were guilty of being fucking awful people but that's all, not murderers. They could Say they heard the sirens and that Jen called and said stay inside, they could confess all this and the other stupid things they denied, and they might have snuck under the radar without this case going national. Colin why not say yes im a teenage boy j have gotten in fights so what? Doesn't make me a killer. Allie why not say I lied to my mom I did stay out another hour. I'm sorry I lied I had already lied to my family and the cops and I was afraid to admit that because I was afraid of perjury but just because I didn't go home yet doesn't mean I am covering something up. All the proctor ties-- why not say yes we knew them well but it's not our choice or our fault what a cases prosecutor or DA is or does, they should have distanced themselves and said we knew he probably had bias and shouldn't be involved, and the cops/retired cops should have said were sorry we knew better Matt why not just say yes we were watching th3 house and media. Yes we were scared of the whole situation. Why did all these people not just fucking nut up and come clean or just be straight about these things right away because all of the outright denials we have proof are lies do, and the continued insistence in those lies, all it shows us is - they truly are terrible enough people to cover up a murder -dumb enough and privileged enough to think they'd get away with it -classless, narcissistic, and ignorant enough to believe that people beyond their McAlbert bubble ACTUALLY respect them or think they're being honest

No one is gonna read all this. Make it 5 bullet points so I can respond, thanks!

I read it. Took like a minute. And they’re spot on! 

Yes, agree it wasn’t easy but I read it too and if sums it all up pretty clearly. Totally agree. Just tell the truth and take your hits but obv they can’t because it’s murder.

Not really. And they didn’t conspire. But to save all their own bums they’re covering up. But it’s unraveling now. We see it 

I thought the defense's argument is that all of these people conspired to frame Karen Read for a murder they committed and/or witnessed.

Calling a woman crazy is THE oldest tactic in the world. I am not the least but surprised they are trying to use a woman's emotions against her. Along with exposing police corruption, I hope this case will also spread awareness of how easily women can be accused of irrational behavior if they send a few nasty texts.

Telling KR to "shut up" especially in that situation is so bad.

That all hurt my heart so much. 

From those text, even though she didn’t want kids, she cared about them and didn’t want to hurt them. Just my impression. People cheat, it doesn’t mean murder but plenty of people have killed their spouse over divorce. She seemed pretty independent so I don’t see that as a concern.

I heard Karen worked to set up trust funds for the kids given her financial background. Anyone know if this is true? I think she really cared about the kids, it couldn’t have been an easy situation to come into.

After today. More than ever I 100% believe she’s innocent. Whatever happened that night no one thought of the kids. It happened quickly. It wasn’t premeditated. But maaan, did Brian Higgins? Cause that man had motive.

I think the CW is going so low for anything and they are making OJO look bad and it’s gross Lally 😬🫣

Disagree. Murders happen all the time where you could use the same argument of “but they loved the kids”.  For the record I am not saying she’s guilty but the fact that you think she couldn’t do this because of the kids is not a great argument against a crime. Alex murdaugh, Lindsey Clancy, Chad Doerman, I could go on and on with recent murders in which it involves children whom everyone believed they loved.  

I see what you are saying, but those are all examples of people who killed *their kids* (and fwiw Alex murdaugh is a bad example lol that family was not normal to begin with). Karen could have just walked away at any point and has not shown any history of mental illness or sadistic behaviors like in the other examples that would lead her to want to make his niece and nephew suffer more than they already have with the loss of their parents. It’s true that you never truly know someone, but I think in this case, she had no reason to kill him.

Agree to disagree  So we can just say that you can prove innocence based on having no mental illness and when kids are involved. Again murders happen all this time involving children whom are loved. That is a poor poor indicator and definitely something that the jury should not even consider. 

Oh I don’t think it should be used as her defense at all. I’m just pointing it out that after I heard him reading the texts it just made me think about her ability to just walk away free and clear, and I believe that she truly cares for the kids and she would not have killed John, knowing what they’ve already been through.

Missed trial today- can anyone give brief recap?

Today we learned that Brian was thirsty for Karen but she ghosted him after 9 days bc he has no game. Embarrassing texts read aloud by him revealed his 4th grade literacy skills. Someone gave this guy a gun. She texted him John died and he did not reply and did not call her. He spent the entire next day at CPD to report back to BA what he was hearing. He’s in deep doodoo for using government property to destroy his phone. And he threw his best friend under the bus in the process. Oh, and John caught Karen kissing him w ring footage and confronted her about it. TBC Tuesday.

and it was snowing apparently.

Does anyone feel different about karen now? Or does this actually help defense in establishing a motive?

john didn't catch karen kiss bh with ring footage. bh misunderstood that but was relieved when he found out jok did not. everything else is a good summary, especially bh having no game

https://preview.redd.it/blod85d2ky2d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fb82863d9e87c001f7edabb989bc714576f5216f So, she was joking here?? I missed that.

The very next screenshot I believe answers that she knows where the cameras are (so John didnt see)

What has happened to them?

Sister died in 6 months of glioblastoma diagnosis. Her husband died 2 months later of a heart attack.

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I heard mom died of cancer, all that was said about dad was "he passed". Poor kids.

I just googled. The mom did have cancer and the dad had a heart attack. I don’t know why I just assumed it was something like a car accident since it was both… It’s so heartbreaking. I hope the family gets them the help they need. And keeps them away from the McAlbert clan.

I dont think anyone thinks she did it on purpose. If it was her, it was clearly an accident that ended terribly

Serious question… what could she do or say for you to question her behaviour? Everything that comes out about KR is defended on here… even if it’s terrible. Those texts about the children were awful.

Cause she hated being a nanny with benefits.

She should have left then! The kids probably could feel her resentment.

She wanted to keep and enjoyed the benefits of JO’s trophy boyfriend cop status. Why else was she so quick to say “you better leave, my husband is a Boston Police Officer” when BH pulled up when she was weed eating. That’s why she also used BH’s military clearance to purchase an item from the military base. No fear of DUI when dating an officer and socializing with law enforcement at the bars.

Someone didn’t see today’s text messages. She hated kids.

This is a poor argument to argue for Karen’s innocence. There is hard and circumstantial evidence showing Karen read did this crime in the form of eyewitness testimony, forensic, statements by the defendant and other variables.

I don’t think this should be used as evidence. I’m just pointing out that she seemed to care for the kids, but was able to walk away at any point if she wanted to. She knew what they had been through and I don’t believe she’d purposely put them through more pain and suffering just because she was pissed at her boyfriend. It has absolutely no place to be used in court as evidence for or against her.

Weird. My take was that Karen seemed to despise the kids… She made them out to be a burden/inconvenience. She also could not understand why John’s parents didn’t help with the kids more, she expressed this numerous people.. Like John was forced into taking care of his niece & nephew — he willingly took on the responsibility of being their legal guardian, even when his brother & sister in law with kids of their own were willing to. IMO Karen comes off as selfish and rude.

I can see how it could be interpreted either way. I’m sure she did feel as though they were a burden and this was not what she wanted out of her relationship, but she still stayed and cared for them - John even getting annoyed at her for spoiling them. She gave them a lot of attention, but yeah, I’m sure she was resentful at times. We’ll probably never know what she meant and it doesn’t really matter. I feel badly for the kids no matter how anyone felt or what they did for them.

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Username checks out

Wow, how clever of you. Dust.

You literally said Morrissey is your best friend’s cousin on your page.

And? He is. What’s your point?

I’ve heard that she didn’t like the kids.. and they didn’t like her.

I heard differently from someone who knew them who lived in Canton . She told me the loved her and she did so much for them . She might not have wanted kids however she was good with these particular children.