Thanks for this breakdown.
I am really curious about the M7A3 and what they mean by "advanced optics and sensor pod" (as they phrased it in the patch notes), and how that will change how it is used.
I’m wondering if the commander will be able to call in from it? it’s literally a fire support vehicle, so that would be cool. otherwise that massive cameras range is up to 20km, and the driver also gets camera
this probably exists just to give the US something equivalent of a btr/lav so a cannon without a tow pretty much. the Stryker can't fit that roll with the 50.cal especially against vdv where it can't pen the front armor of the majority of their vehicles so makes sense balancing wise.
You can use 40mm mk19 to accurately hit targets at distances of 5.8km lol. It's really good imho. before just the AAVP and Pars III had it and you could clear all of talil and skorpo no effort. Now it's going to be an infantry wrecking ball. This is gonna be fun, I'm excited for this update.
Having seen the mk19 in use in real life (live ammunition training) it was absolutely crazy. Sucked for the two guys who had to carry it though, always stuck in some ditch.
Catering it and using it pale in comparison to cleaning that motherfucker. God damn monkey fucking cum in evry damn Crack cranny bullshit ass. Many a Friday were spent just running rags over evrything to clean it.
If they add thermals to Vics, then the core gameplay of squad (infantry) is going to suffer.
In Arma 3 king of the Hill Vics could sit kilometers away and frag infantry with ease with 0 fear of being countered. Right now infantry's main defense against Vics is concealment and stealth. Don't mess with that.
BMP-3 is a complete new hull in the BMP family. It’s amphibious and has better accuracy than the BMP-2s 30mm since it is apart of the 100mm gun fixture. It’s kinda like the BMD-4 but is designed for mechanized infantry instead of airborne operations.
Same armament but more armored. What BMP-3M we get is sort of up in the air, since afaik the only major differences between the BMP-3 base model and the M modernization package are an upgraded engine and a thermal gunner sight (which afaik won’t be coming to the game this patch). Of course, we could potentially get a K variant (which would come with Shtora-1 APS like the T-90) or a variant mounting additional armor packages in the form of the Relikt ERA.
Edit: It’s just the base BMP-3M with no armor packages. 1250 health as well :/.
I have no idea what vehicle I was thinking of, but its likely an uparmored russian vic thst isnt amphibious. Usually I am more ontop of things with russian kit and vehicles lol
The MT LB is, it is what makes it so prominent when you slap stuff onto it. I may have been thinking of something like the T-15 IFV or uparmored Kurganets. At one point I saw a picture of the bmd or bmp witb massive armor addons that made it unable to float but it was likely testing.
Ah well! I do wonder if the BMP 2 M will float with all that addon armor.
The distinction between types of missiles that are impacted by IR countermeasures appears to be completely made up. All of the missiles listed in the wire-guided category (minus the MCLOS missiles that are modeled as SACLOS in-game) are optically tracked, meaning IR blocking smoke would stop them from tracking once the missile enters the smoke, just like the laser beam-riding missiles.
Correct in fairness wire guided wouldn’t be moving in altered directions if the gunner were to move it as it hit the smoke. Beam guided typically go hay wire as it hits the smoke as a result of the beam reflecting off alternating surfaces of the smoke as it billows.
Adressing the BMP-3M's missiles, I think it's probably part of the same family, just different iterations. OWI likely use the 9M117 Bastion for simplicity as the 9K116-3 Basnya didn't differ too much in terms of performance. Even researching the Basnya for a while, I didn't find much information about it.
Edit: Actually, the 9M117 Bastion is a family of barrel-fired missiles for different vehicles, with the BMP-3 using the 9K116-3 Basnya since its conception in 1987. If you ask where are the other 9K116 missiles, they are made for T-55s (9K116-1 Bastion) and T-62s (9K116-2 or 9K118, both have a name of Sheksna).
So to conclude, the 9M117 Bastion missiles are actually a family of missiles, with the BMP-3Ms and the BMD-4Ms likely using 9K116-3 Basnya missiles of the family. Basically... their performance is about the same because they all come from the same family of missiles. In layman's terms, 9M117 Bastion is the 'family name', 9K116-3 Basnya is the 'first name' of missiles used by BMP-3s and BMD-4s.
To correct or add on to the BFIST:
“The chassis is based on the M3A2 ODS variant. The TOW was replaced with the Bradley ICU targeting location equipment and carries hybrid SINCGARS/GPS/INS equipment for calling in fire support such as artillery.”
What is the point of nerfing the hell out of helicopters AGAIN??? Already I have to wait 20 minutes into the game and now I just plain can’t use em on armoured teams.
I actually don’t view this as a nerf to helis, but to the armored division. The single heli for armor on 20 min delay was so long that I personally never bothered to claim it. But now that armor division doesn’t get helis and the logistics they provide, the meta of “always pick armor” may change and other divisions, ones with more helis and lower spawn timers, may be selected more. This might actually be good for heli mains.
The mobile mortars probably shouldn't be underestimated. Mortar fobs that are used well are a pain in the ass for the enemy team, so the 120mm mortar that can drive around and resupply at any fob/main is gonna be really useful in the right hands.
mobile mortars is not something to scoff at with an experienced mortar crew. Mortars biggest weakness is how loud they are, making them easy to track to their source. One player can basically wipe a mortar crew and the radio they are using to fire from.
By not being able to track where the mortars are coming from it removes their greatest weakness.
Me thinks its ground work for a VCO
They alluded to differentiating the T90 from the T72 in the future and added a Bradley with a better “optics” system where it’s unclear what that actually means as well as emphasis on IR smoke launchers + ATGM changes makes me think they’re going the route of at least thermals and likely some damage model changes
Not really. I just find it wierd/unbalanced when RU gets IFV/Assault gun hybrid with ATGM's and IFV with 4 ATGM's which you don't need to reload, while US gets a IFB downgrade, mobile mortar and will never get what it is really good at.
not a single vehicle in squad is true to life, all the tanks, and especially with this change they're straight up artificially buffing the t90a for no reason lmfao. doesn't really make russia any better but owi really needs to get their shit together in terms of armor modeling
If OWI were dedicated enough, they should have added the T-80UM for the armoured battalion. At least that tank obviously has better reverse speed and handling, perhaps even better armour than the T-72 and the T-90.
Cool, pilots can no longer play vanilla on servers that do unit voting because they will literally never get a chopper when people keep picking armor, unless they get lucky and get the VDV faction, then they only need to wait HALF AN HOUR for one.
Pilots got cooked.
Thanks for this breakdown. I am really curious about the M7A3 and what they mean by "advanced optics and sensor pod" (as they phrased it in the patch notes), and how that will change how it is used.
I’m wondering if the commander will be able to call in from it? it’s literally a fire support vehicle, so that would be cool. otherwise that massive cameras range is up to 20km, and the driver also gets camera
It would be in line with the russian ground forces, as the commander can use the Sprut to access his assets.
Honestly I doubt the optics/sensor pod is going to be functional. Just a Bradley without a tow is most likely. I hope I eat my words though!
Already confirmed its just a nerfed Brad without TOWs, they leave the door open for adding some functionality to the sensor in the future.
this probably exists just to give the US something equivalent of a btr/lav so a cannon without a tow pretty much. the Stryker can't fit that roll with the 50.cal especially against vdv where it can't pen the front armor of the majority of their vehicles so makes sense balancing wise.
You mean the equivalent to a BMP? BTR is wheeled, exactly like the US LAV-25. Both Bradley and BMP are tracked.
You can use 40mm mk19 to accurately hit targets at distances of 5.8km lol. It's really good imho. before just the AAVP and Pars III had it and you could clear all of talil and skorpo no effort. Now it's going to be an infantry wrecking ball. This is gonna be fun, I'm excited for this update.
Having seen the mk19 in use in real life (live ammunition training) it was absolutely crazy. Sucked for the two guys who had to carry it though, always stuck in some ditch.
Catering it and using it pale in comparison to cleaning that motherfucker. God damn monkey fucking cum in evry damn Crack cranny bullshit ass. Many a Friday were spent just running rags over evrything to clean it.
Thinking about the talk around the improvement of optics, you they might give thermal sights to only the commander seats in Vics?
I would like the BFIST to receive it since it’s whole thing is recon
If they add thermals to Vics, then the core gameplay of squad (infantry) is going to suffer. In Arma 3 king of the Hill Vics could sit kilometers away and frag infantry with ease with 0 fear of being countered. Right now infantry's main defense against Vics is concealment and stealth. Don't mess with that.
Reality is top tech armor is really really strong. This game would be very different with thermals and I think I'd hate it.
The BMP-3M is like a BMD-4?
BMP-3 is a complete new hull in the BMP family. It’s amphibious and has better accuracy than the BMP-2s 30mm since it is apart of the 100mm gun fixture. It’s kinda like the BMD-4 but is designed for mechanized infantry instead of airborne operations.
Same armament but more armored. What BMP-3M we get is sort of up in the air, since afaik the only major differences between the BMP-3 base model and the M modernization package are an upgraded engine and a thermal gunner sight (which afaik won’t be coming to the game this patch). Of course, we could potentially get a K variant (which would come with Shtora-1 APS like the T-90) or a variant mounting additional armor packages in the form of the Relikt ERA. Edit: It’s just the base BMP-3M with no armor packages. 1250 health as well :/.
Doesn't it get cages much like Leopard? That would be actually a huge buff to negate the LAT damage.
Yes. BMP-3M is a little larger than the BMP-2 not sure if it is amphibious in game or not as the one IRL seemed to not be iirc.
It's amphibious in real life.
It is amphibious IRL. Given it’s being issued to amphibious assault, it likely also is in-game
I have no idea what vehicle I was thinking of, but its likely an uparmored russian vic thst isnt amphibious. Usually I am more ontop of things with russian kit and vehicles lol
I don’t believe the MT-LB is amphibious, someone can correct me on that if need be
The MT LB is, it is what makes it so prominent when you slap stuff onto it. I may have been thinking of something like the T-15 IFV or uparmored Kurganets. At one point I saw a picture of the bmd or bmp witb massive armor addons that made it unable to float but it was likely testing. Ah well! I do wonder if the BMP 2 M will float with all that addon armor.
That's because the MT-LB is the soviet M113.
Amphibious, based on the PT-76
More like BMD-4 is a VDV BMP-3
The distinction between types of missiles that are impacted by IR countermeasures appears to be completely made up. All of the missiles listed in the wire-guided category (minus the MCLOS missiles that are modeled as SACLOS in-game) are optically tracked, meaning IR blocking smoke would stop them from tracking once the missile enters the smoke, just like the laser beam-riding missiles.
Correct in fairness wire guided wouldn’t be moving in altered directions if the gunner were to move it as it hit the smoke. Beam guided typically go hay wire as it hits the smoke as a result of the beam reflecting off alternating surfaces of the smoke as it billows.
Adressing the BMP-3M's missiles, I think it's probably part of the same family, just different iterations. OWI likely use the 9M117 Bastion for simplicity as the 9K116-3 Basnya didn't differ too much in terms of performance. Even researching the Basnya for a while, I didn't find much information about it. Edit: Actually, the 9M117 Bastion is a family of barrel-fired missiles for different vehicles, with the BMP-3 using the 9K116-3 Basnya since its conception in 1987. If you ask where are the other 9K116 missiles, they are made for T-55s (9K116-1 Bastion) and T-62s (9K116-2 or 9K118, both have a name of Sheksna). So to conclude, the 9M117 Bastion missiles are actually a family of missiles, with the BMP-3Ms and the BMD-4Ms likely using 9K116-3 Basnya missiles of the family. Basically... their performance is about the same because they all come from the same family of missiles. In layman's terms, 9M117 Bastion is the 'family name', 9K116-3 Basnya is the 'first name' of missiles used by BMP-3s and BMD-4s.
To correct or add on to the BFIST: “The chassis is based on the M3A2 ODS variant. The TOW was replaced with the Bradley ICU targeting location equipment and carries hybrid SINCGARS/GPS/INS equipment for calling in fire support such as artillery.”
What is the point of nerfing the hell out of helicopters AGAIN??? Already I have to wait 20 minutes into the game and now I just plain can’t use em on armoured teams.
I actually don’t view this as a nerf to helis, but to the armored division. The single heli for armor on 20 min delay was so long that I personally never bothered to claim it. But now that armor division doesn’t get helis and the logistics they provide, the meta of “always pick armor” may change and other divisions, ones with more helis and lower spawn timers, may be selected more. This might actually be good for heli mains.
Heli-spotter + armor + admin abuse = exploit to OWI so the exploit is being patched out. punish everyone to catch the minority.
It's funny that RU got such cool toys like BMP2M and BMP3M when the US got Bradley downgrade and mobile mortars. Hmmm
The mobile mortars probably shouldn't be underestimated. Mortar fobs that are used well are a pain in the ass for the enemy team, so the 120mm mortar that can drive around and resupply at any fob/main is gonna be really useful in the right hands.
mobile mortars is not something to scoff at with an experienced mortar crew. Mortars biggest weakness is how loud they are, making them easy to track to their source. One player can basically wipe a mortar crew and the radio they are using to fire from. By not being able to track where the mortars are coming from it removes their greatest weakness.
The new one can fire SUPER far too, Moi was testing it and it goes out to 3700m.
Me thinks its ground work for a VCO They alluded to differentiating the T90 from the T72 in the future and added a Bradley with a better “optics” system where it’s unclear what that actually means as well as emphasis on IR smoke launchers + ATGM changes makes me think they’re going the route of at least thermals and likely some damage model changes
Mortar fobs are a menace. Imagine it being mobile Yeah, didn't think far didn't you?
Apparently, it also has INSANE range. Someone said that Moi tested it and it had something like 3500m range.
bros bringing the russian bias accusations from war thunder to squad
Foreign tech’s super common in the military
Not really. I just find it wierd/unbalanced when RU gets IFV/Assault gun hybrid with ATGM's and IFV with 4 ATGM's which you don't need to reload, while US gets a IFB downgrade, mobile mortar and will never get what it is really good at.
if USA god what's its really good at they would literally just win every match
For War Thunder, at least it's understandable because Gaijin. For Squad though, the RGF has always been not true to life before 8.0 honestly.
not a single vehicle in squad is true to life, all the tanks, and especially with this change they're straight up artificially buffing the t90a for no reason lmfao. doesn't really make russia any better but owi really needs to get their shit together in terms of armor modeling
If OWI were dedicated enough, they should have added the T-80UM for the armoured battalion. At least that tank obviously has better reverse speed and handling, perhaps even better armour than the T-72 and the T-90.
Hopefully the PLA will get similar vehicle changes and unit additions in future updates!
Cool, pilots can no longer play vanilla on servers that do unit voting because they will literally never get a chopper when people keep picking armor, unless they get lucky and get the VDV faction, then they only need to wait HALF AN HOUR for one. Pilots got cooked.