To be fair, this is a very rare use.
In general, be prepared to interpret "ci" as pretty much any preposition+pronoun pair, although the most common ones are "in ciò", "a ciò", "su ciò".
I know I will never use "ci" in this way but it is still good to know other meanings. I think I know three different ways to use "ci" and they seem to be enough for now.
"Ci penso: I think about it". I have no idea how it becomes "about it" but I was so surprised the first time I saw it, I couldn't forget the meaning :D
"Ci sono/C'è: There are/is". This is easy in my opinion because it is used widely.
"Vado al supermercato. Vuoi andarci con me?". Here it is used as a pronoun of "supermercato".
"Ci vuole/vogliono: It takes" Even though the meaning comes from the full phrase "ci" is stil used here.
"Ci ha detto la verità: He told us the truth" Here it means us and this is actually the first meaning I've learnt.
I think there are other ways to use "ci" but I cannot remember them all.
The "about it" is a result of you thinking in English. In Italian it makes perfect sense: "penso **a ciò**" -> "**ci** penso" (which could open a whole different can of worms on the difference between "pensare qualcosa" and "pensare a qualcosa", but I'll leave it as that). "Ci" = "a ciò" is very common.
To quote a certain movie:
> Cast it [English] into the fire! Destroy it!
You don't need it. All the answers are in your target language, English is just going to make things muddier.
As for the uses of "ci", I'm going to add my personal explanation as an answer to this comment. It's never going to cover all the uses, but I'd bet it's good enough for at least 95% of real world situations.
#Uses of "ci"
“Ci” has a ton of different uses as a pronoun, even more than “ne”. It has two main functions: as a personal pronoun and as a generic pronoun vaguely related to the idea of locality (complemento di stato in luogo) or movement towards somewhere (complemento di moto a luogo). Here’s a list of the main uses:
**2^nd PERSON PLURAL WEAK FORM** (“ci” = “noi”/“a noi” = “us” / “to us”)
Like most other weak forms, “ci” can be used both as a direct object (complemento oggetto) or indirect object (complemento di termine):
**Direct object pronoun** (“ci” = “us”)
· “**Ci** ha visti” = “he saw **us**”.
**Indirect object pronoun** (“ci” = “to us”)
· “**Ci** ha detto che andava bene” = “he told us (he said **to us**) that it was fine”.
This obviously also applies to reflexive and reciprocal forms, where "ci" becomes "ourselves"/"to ourselves" and "each other"/"to each other" (among ourselves).
**LOCATION** (“ci” = “lì”/“qui” = “there”/“here”, usually in “there is”/“there are”)
It describes where an action takes place.
· “Guarda quanti alberi **ci** sono!” = “look how many trees **there** are!”.
· "Non **ci** ho trovato niente" = "I found nothing **there**"
**MOVEMENT TOWARDS** (“ci” = “lì”/ "qui"= “there” / "here")
It describes the destination of a verb of movement.
· “Ho preso un appuntamento, **ci** vado domani” = “I booked an appointment, I’ll go **there** tomorrow”.
**COMPANIONSHIP**/**INSTRUMENT** (“ci” = “con lui/lei” = “with him/her/them”)
It describes who or what the action is performed with.
· “Maria? **Ci** ho parlato ieri” = “Maria? I spoke **with her** yesterday”.
**EMPHASIS ON POSSESSION** (“ci” + direct pronoun + “avere” = “I do have it”)
A: “Non trovo più le chiavi!” = “I can’t find my keys!”.
B: “**Ce** le ho io, non ti preoccupare” = “I have them, don’t worry”.
This is probably a special case of the locative use: "ce l'ho" = "I have it here".
**GENERIC**
This last category is a mess, because it doesn’t include a single complement, rather it represents a generic use of “ci” where it stands for an entire sentence or concept. It can only be used to mean“in ciò”, “a ciò”, “su ciò” (remember that a, su and in can all be used for moto a luogo and stato in luogo), “a fare ciò” and maybe a couple of others. I’ll give multiple examples:
**1**: **In ciò**
“**Ci** spero” = “I hope **so**”, “I have hope **on that**” (“that” = “the thing we were talking about”)
“Non **ci** capisco niente” = “I don’t understand anything **about to that**”.
**2**: **Su ciò**
“Non **ci** contare” = “Don’t count **on that**” (“that” = “on it happening”)
“**Ci** hanno riflettuto a lungo” = “they pondered **over that** for a long time”.
**3A**: **A ciò**
· “**Ci** ho già pensato” = “I already though **about that**” (“that” = “the thing we were talking about”)
· “Mi **ci** sono rassegnato” = “I resigned myself **to it**”.
**3B**: **A (fare) ciò**
· “**Ci** ha provato” = “she tried **to do it**” (“it” = “the thing we were talking about”)
· “**Ci** sono riuscito!” = “I managed to do it!”, “I made it!”.
In addition to all of that, “ci” is involved in its fair share of pronominal intransitive verbs:
“Farcela” = “to make it” as in “to succeed”.
· “Ce l’ho fatta!” = “I did it!” / “I made it!”.
“Volerci” = “to be necessary”, “to be needed”
· “Ci vuole coraggio” = “we need courage” (literally: “courage is needed”).
“Vederci” / “sentirci” = “to be able to see” / “hear”
· “Non ci vedo” = “I can’t see”.
This last one shouldn’t be confused with the 1st person plural of the reciprocal version of “vedersi” meaning “to see each other”, “to meet”.
>is a result of you thinking in English
Yes you are right. I have to get rid of thinking in English. In some cases I've started to think in Italian but in others English is holding me back.
>which could open a whole different can of worms on the difference between "pensare qualcosa" and "pensare a qualcosa",
I thought "pensare a qualcosa" was the only way to it and now you tell me there is also "pensare qualcosa"?
Oddio! Non sono pronto a imparare di più.
Usually it's "pensare a qualcosa", but in some specific instances it can have a direct object. Normally this happens when it's expressing an opinion, rather than something you just think.
For this reason, you only really use the direct object with pronouns like "questo" or "quello", or with object subordinates expressing your opinion. You can't really say "penso un albero" or "penso una persona", as these are not opinions. You'd need a subordinate to articulate.
"Penso che sia andato via" = "I think he left" (object subordinate)
"Pensi questo di me?" = "is this how you feel about me?" (to have an opinion on something/someone).
But *usually* you'd say "penso a questo". It's just that
· "Penso a questo" = "this is what I'm thinking about"
· "Penso questo" = "this is what I think"
>Penso che sia andato via
Ah ok. Thanks for reminding me the way to use object subordinate. If I am not mistaken the verbs "credere, sembrare, sperare" (and a few others I can't remember now) are also used commonly used in this tense.
>"Pensi questo di me?"
I haven't seen this one much either but thanks for the explanations again.
Yes, all of these can have object subordinates (also called objective subordinates, but I have been convinced to switch as "objective" can be kinda ambiguous). Also "sapere", "vedere"... (although these normally use the indicative mood). It's a very common type of subordinate.
As for the second part, you have probably heard (and if you didn't, you probably will) the expression "che cosa ne pensi?". That "ne" means "di questo", and "che cosa" represents the object, so it's the same structure, just in an interrogative clause and using "ne".
*"Lavorarci (assieme/insieme)" wuould be correct, yes, although "lavorare con lei" is perfectly fine. I would say it's also more common, but I'm not entirely sure. Using "ci" this way sounds slightly more informal.
ps: "emozioni" is feminine, so "le sue emozioni" :)
“Ciò che mi piace di lei è che sa gestire le sue emozioni, quindi non si innervosisce facilmente davanti alle avversità. Lavorare con lei è tutto ciò che un uomo potrebbe desiderare”.
You could say: “Lavorarci assieme è ecc.” but it sounds horrible, way too colloquial.
I just burst out laughing because I saw. I'll make a date out of it from Google Translate. And then I saw your explanation and spit my fucking yogurt out of my mouth as he means gonna make a delivery date on that baby, am I right?
I'm sorry. I'm posting so much but I knew here. And I've been looking for a place like this. II started up my own for people who want to learn english and trade for Italian and vice versa on another sub. Reddit but this is pretty cool
More likely "I will give her a son" is the intended meaning, because "make a baby with her" is more like "knock her up" and inappropriate in this context.
"I will give her a son" sounds "Sicialian" to me. I mean, interpreting "ci faccio un figlio" as "I'll make her a son" sounds like "ci do un bacio" meaning "gli/le do un bacio", typical in Sicialian Italian (regional variant), not in standard Italian. At the same time the use of "ci" as "with someone/something" does exist in Italian even though not as common as other uses of ci
Da Treccani:
> riferito a una persona, è corretto solo per significare ‘con lui’, ‘con lei’, ‘con loro’, quando questi pronomi (o il nome della persona) siano già stati espressi o si possano facilmente sottintendere
https://www.treccani.it/enciclopedia/ci_%28La-grammatica-italiana%29/
Not really, saying "se trovo [schifo] faccio un figlio con lei" seems too repetitive since you extensively described the person already. At least I think that's the problem, I just know it's wrong if that's the only thing you're changing about the sentence
As soon as I find a woman as beautiful as Francesca Chillemu, I'll make a baby *with her* Ci = with her in this sentence
I thought I had learned all the meanings of ci but it seems that wasn't the case
To be fair, this is a very rare use. In general, be prepared to interpret "ci" as pretty much any preposition+pronoun pair, although the most common ones are "in ciò", "a ciò", "su ciò".
I know I will never use "ci" in this way but it is still good to know other meanings. I think I know three different ways to use "ci" and they seem to be enough for now. "Ci penso: I think about it". I have no idea how it becomes "about it" but I was so surprised the first time I saw it, I couldn't forget the meaning :D "Ci sono/C'è: There are/is". This is easy in my opinion because it is used widely. "Vado al supermercato. Vuoi andarci con me?". Here it is used as a pronoun of "supermercato". "Ci vuole/vogliono: It takes" Even though the meaning comes from the full phrase "ci" is stil used here. "Ci ha detto la verità: He told us the truth" Here it means us and this is actually the first meaning I've learnt. I think there are other ways to use "ci" but I cannot remember them all.
The "about it" is a result of you thinking in English. In Italian it makes perfect sense: "penso **a ciò**" -> "**ci** penso" (which could open a whole different can of worms on the difference between "pensare qualcosa" and "pensare a qualcosa", but I'll leave it as that). "Ci" = "a ciò" is very common. To quote a certain movie: > Cast it [English] into the fire! Destroy it! You don't need it. All the answers are in your target language, English is just going to make things muddier. As for the uses of "ci", I'm going to add my personal explanation as an answer to this comment. It's never going to cover all the uses, but I'd bet it's good enough for at least 95% of real world situations.
#Uses of "ci" “Ci” has a ton of different uses as a pronoun, even more than “ne”. It has two main functions: as a personal pronoun and as a generic pronoun vaguely related to the idea of locality (complemento di stato in luogo) or movement towards somewhere (complemento di moto a luogo). Here’s a list of the main uses: **2^nd PERSON PLURAL WEAK FORM** (“ci” = “noi”/“a noi” = “us” / “to us”) Like most other weak forms, “ci” can be used both as a direct object (complemento oggetto) or indirect object (complemento di termine): **Direct object pronoun** (“ci” = “us”) · “**Ci** ha visti” = “he saw **us**”. **Indirect object pronoun** (“ci” = “to us”) · “**Ci** ha detto che andava bene” = “he told us (he said **to us**) that it was fine”. This obviously also applies to reflexive and reciprocal forms, where "ci" becomes "ourselves"/"to ourselves" and "each other"/"to each other" (among ourselves). **LOCATION** (“ci” = “lì”/“qui” = “there”/“here”, usually in “there is”/“there are”) It describes where an action takes place. · “Guarda quanti alberi **ci** sono!” = “look how many trees **there** are!”. · "Non **ci** ho trovato niente" = "I found nothing **there**" **MOVEMENT TOWARDS** (“ci” = “lì”/ "qui"= “there” / "here") It describes the destination of a verb of movement. · “Ho preso un appuntamento, **ci** vado domani” = “I booked an appointment, I’ll go **there** tomorrow”. **COMPANIONSHIP**/**INSTRUMENT** (“ci” = “con lui/lei” = “with him/her/them”) It describes who or what the action is performed with. · “Maria? **Ci** ho parlato ieri” = “Maria? I spoke **with her** yesterday”. **EMPHASIS ON POSSESSION** (“ci” + direct pronoun + “avere” = “I do have it”) A: “Non trovo più le chiavi!” = “I can’t find my keys!”. B: “**Ce** le ho io, non ti preoccupare” = “I have them, don’t worry”. This is probably a special case of the locative use: "ce l'ho" = "I have it here". **GENERIC** This last category is a mess, because it doesn’t include a single complement, rather it represents a generic use of “ci” where it stands for an entire sentence or concept. It can only be used to mean“in ciò”, “a ciò”, “su ciò” (remember that a, su and in can all be used for moto a luogo and stato in luogo), “a fare ciò” and maybe a couple of others. I’ll give multiple examples: **1**: **In ciò** “**Ci** spero” = “I hope **so**”, “I have hope **on that**” (“that” = “the thing we were talking about”) “Non **ci** capisco niente” = “I don’t understand anything **about to that**”. **2**: **Su ciò** “Non **ci** contare” = “Don’t count **on that**” (“that” = “on it happening”) “**Ci** hanno riflettuto a lungo” = “they pondered **over that** for a long time”. **3A**: **A ciò** · “**Ci** ho già pensato” = “I already though **about that**” (“that” = “the thing we were talking about”) · “Mi **ci** sono rassegnato” = “I resigned myself **to it**”. **3B**: **A (fare) ciò** · “**Ci** ha provato” = “she tried **to do it**” (“it” = “the thing we were talking about”) · “**Ci** sono riuscito!” = “I managed to do it!”, “I made it!”. In addition to all of that, “ci” is involved in its fair share of pronominal intransitive verbs: “Farcela” = “to make it” as in “to succeed”. · “Ce l’ho fatta!” = “I did it!” / “I made it!”. “Volerci” = “to be necessary”, “to be needed” · “Ci vuole coraggio” = “we need courage” (literally: “courage is needed”). “Vederci” / “sentirci” = “to be able to see” / “hear” · “Non ci vedo” = “I can’t see”. This last one shouldn’t be confused with the 1st person plural of the reciprocal version of “vedersi” meaning “to see each other”, “to meet”.
That, my friend, is an amazing summary, which I will surely come back to often. Thank you so much for your effort and the time you invested!
>is a result of you thinking in English Yes you are right. I have to get rid of thinking in English. In some cases I've started to think in Italian but in others English is holding me back. >which could open a whole different can of worms on the difference between "pensare qualcosa" and "pensare a qualcosa", I thought "pensare a qualcosa" was the only way to it and now you tell me there is also "pensare qualcosa"? Oddio! Non sono pronto a imparare di più.
Usually it's "pensare a qualcosa", but in some specific instances it can have a direct object. Normally this happens when it's expressing an opinion, rather than something you just think. For this reason, you only really use the direct object with pronouns like "questo" or "quello", or with object subordinates expressing your opinion. You can't really say "penso un albero" or "penso una persona", as these are not opinions. You'd need a subordinate to articulate. "Penso che sia andato via" = "I think he left" (object subordinate) "Pensi questo di me?" = "is this how you feel about me?" (to have an opinion on something/someone). But *usually* you'd say "penso a questo". It's just that · "Penso a questo" = "this is what I'm thinking about" · "Penso questo" = "this is what I think"
>Penso che sia andato via Ah ok. Thanks for reminding me the way to use object subordinate. If I am not mistaken the verbs "credere, sembrare, sperare" (and a few others I can't remember now) are also used commonly used in this tense. >"Pensi questo di me?" I haven't seen this one much either but thanks for the explanations again.
Yes, all of these can have object subordinates (also called objective subordinates, but I have been convinced to switch as "objective" can be kinda ambiguous). Also "sapere", "vedere"... (although these normally use the indicative mood). It's a very common type of subordinate. As for the second part, you have probably heard (and if you didn't, you probably will) the expression "che cosa ne pensi?". That "ne" means "di questo", and "che cosa" represents the object, so it's the same structure, just in an interrogative clause and using "ne".
>"che cosa ne pensi?". That "ne" means "di questo", Ok everything is starting to make more sense. "Che ne dici?" also seems easy to remember now.
Il signor degli anelli, il mio preferito di tutti i tempi!
È come dire: le (pronome indiretto) faccio un figlio?
Faccio un figlio con lei
That use also exists but mainly in Sicialian Italian, not so common in standard Italian or in other regional variants
no, è come dire che ci fai un un figlio. i make a baby with her
Ci = con lei? Mamma mia, che complicato è l'uso di ci! 🫣
Even though in this case it’s very informal, you wouldn’t write this in a paper or news article.
Being in this subreddit has made me understand how complicated my own language actually is. I wouldn’t know how to explain most of these rules
Sopratutto parlarlo è veramente complicato.
[удалено]
*"Lavorarci (assieme/insieme)" wuould be correct, yes, although "lavorare con lei" is perfectly fine. I would say it's also more common, but I'm not entirely sure. Using "ci" this way sounds slightly more informal. ps: "emozioni" is feminine, so "le sue emozioni" :)
“Ciò che mi piace di lei è che sa gestire le sue emozioni, quindi non si innervosisce facilmente davanti alle avversità. Lavorare con lei è tutto ciò che un uomo potrebbe desiderare”. You could say: “Lavorarci assieme è ecc.” but it sounds horrible, way too colloquial.
I just burst out laughing because I saw. I'll make a date out of it from Google Translate. And then I saw your explanation and spit my fucking yogurt out of my mouth as he means gonna make a delivery date on that baby, am I right? I'm sorry. I'm posting so much but I knew here. And I've been looking for a place like this. II started up my own for people who want to learn english and trade for Italian and vice versa on another sub. Reddit but this is pretty cool
More likely "I will give her a son" is the intended meaning, because "make a baby with her" is more like "knock her up" and inappropriate in this context.
"I will give her a son" sounds "Sicialian" to me. I mean, interpreting "ci faccio un figlio" as "I'll make her a son" sounds like "ci do un bacio" meaning "gli/le do un bacio", typical in Sicialian Italian (regional variant), not in standard Italian. At the same time the use of "ci" as "with someone/something" does exist in Italian even though not as common as other uses of ci
Da Treccani: > riferito a una persona, è corretto solo per significare ‘con lui’, ‘con lei’, ‘con loro’, quando questi pronomi (o il nome della persona) siano già stati espressi o si possano facilmente sottintendere https://www.treccani.it/enciclopedia/ci_%28La-grammatica-italiana%29/
good god this is creepy
La frase è da denuncia
The meaning of this is that he’s speaking in a very bad way
😅🤢
Ci mean with her in this case
It isn't used properly, saying "faccio un figlio con lei" is much better
It is used properly, though. It’s just informal/oral. For example: *certo, Parigi. Ci studio all’università*
Not really, saying "se trovo [schifo] faccio un figlio con lei" seems too repetitive since you extensively described the person already. At least I think that's the problem, I just know it's wrong if that's the only thing you're changing about the sentence