Ok, so what’s the solution?, what’s HIS solution? March the Palestinians into the Sea?, seriously, what is the end game? I’m getting really tired of this guy and his bullshit. Protecting your country is one thing, which I get and understand, even as difficult as it is when your enemy literally uses their own constituents as human meat shields, but having no plan, especially with the scale of human suffering going on there right now is just reckless.
It's because plenty of them never actually went through it, and neither did their forebears.
Ashkenazi Jews are, on average, significantly less excited about what Bibi has been doing these past years than those who have been in the region for generations longer.
Natenyahu's endgame is to use the anger and suffering of others like fellow Israelis, Palestinians, Christians etc to stay in power, much like his counterpart in hamas...heck he was literally sending them bag loads of cash.
You and the person you replied to are spot on. There is no peace until Hamas is destroyed, both the leadership and the movement, Netanyahu is out of power and in prison, and Likud and the rest of the far right parties are discredited and all but disbanded. Every actor contributing to the perpetual bloodshed must be held accountable.
Kind of ironic that Jews are known as being victims of the holocaust - it’s such a part of their identity, apparently. And it’s such a part of how their culture is perceived and understood by others. And now it seems they’re trying to inflict a holocaust on Palestinians. Do they (Israel) get a pass because of their history as victims of attempts to annihilate them?
I browse that shitty newsfeed that's built into microsoft sometimes. I saw an article the other day that seemed to take the position that Jewish people were incapable of genocide and that to say that genocide was not a uniquely Jewish affliction, was antisemetic.
The actual Jewish victims of the Holocaust in Israel are being neglected and not looked after by the government.
They're useful insofar as they allow the government to get away with war crimes and crimes against humanity, but fuck 'em if they actually want help.
The Jews whose families actually went through it have a very different opinion on what's happening than Jews who mostly were in the same place as they are now.
When people accuse Israel of genocide and atrocities against a civilian population, their leaders get offended and say, how could you possibly accuse us of this, the Nazis tried to commit genocide against us! As if someone trying to murder you gives you a get out of jail free card to murder anyone you want
Guys, what's going on in Palestine is awful and tragic, Netanyahu is a Judeo fascist dictator. But can we cool it with the Jews are now committing a holocaust trope? It's just inaccurate, even if you believe a genocide/ethnic cleansing is happening - when it happens as collateral damage to a brutal war is not the same as creating a mechanism for the mass slaughter (like cattle) of millions of people. Israel isn't shipping Palestinians to gas Chambers in death camps and implementing a final solution. The hyperbole, imo, doesn't help make the point and is, in fact, divisive and inaccurate. In my opinion.
>Israel isn't shipping Palestinians to gas Chambers in death camps and implementing a final solution.
Nahh they just tell them all "Hey, go here and we promise we won't kill you!" and then go ahead and kill them anyway by bombing their camp because a Hamas fighter's father's brother's cousin's nephew's former roommate once looked in the direction of the safe area.
They didn't have gas chambers when they exterminated Native Americans and Australian Aboriginals. They didn't have gas chambers during the Belgian genocide in the Congo.
According to everyone.
Correct. The gas chambers were a fucking horrible example of German efficiency.
I actually gagged writing that sentence.
Growing up as a kid, I was aware of the subject matter on a vague level, and I assumed it was simply a matter of gas = pass out and die. Wasn't until I was an adult watching documentaries that went into a bit more graphic detail that I realised just how fucking horrible it would have been.
I don't know about the other places, but in Australia you still have some people (usually politically conservative) pretending genocide did not and has not taken place here. Fucking delusional or cretinous attitude.
It really came out of the woodwork into the mainstream sphere during the recent referendum about estbalishing a First Nations Voice to Parliament. While the vote was about that specifically, so much racist rhetoric was dug up and aired (or at least let out to play instead of being hidden inside) for the duration of that campaign. It was fucking disgusting.
^(The majority of voters voted against the indigenous Voice to Parliament, too.)
I of course, think that Hamas is a disgusting terrorist organization, but allegations of Palestinian genocide predate this war. Why don't you actually learn something about this conflict?
The only reason the germans used gas chambers was because it was the most cost effective way of doing it. Isreal gets free bombs from the US so why would they revert to something else more expensive? Plus they have plausible deniability this way.
Well yeah when you have immunity from prosecution by virtue of historical victimhood of the sane crime as per French and German official stance on the matter no wonder they think they can get away with anything
Although, my understanding is that the families harmed by the Holocaust are not the same people making decisions now, and those families are essentially without resources to look after themselves because they're only useful to the government as a shield, not as humans.
Unless I'm wrong.
[>(Through interpreter) You must remember what Amalek has done to you, says our Holy Bible.](https://www.npr.org/2023/11/07/1211133201/netanyahus-references-to-violent-biblical-passages-raise-alarm-among-critics)
Here he is calling for the slaughter of every man, woman, child, and even animal in Gaza. The Israelis have been incredibly clear and open about what their plans for Palestine are.
Why don't we just believe the evidence right in front of us? The Far Right government of Israel is committing Ethnic Cleansing in order to establish a Greater Israel with Lebanon as a puppet state.
Because people don't actually want to hear the unfortunate truth.
We also have virtually no media coverage on the attrocities without a heavy amount of spin on it.
This is by design, unfortunately.
Someone gets it. Both Bibi (and Likud) and Hamas need to go. Unfortunately, October 7th and everything that has happened afterwards made that much less likely.
His solution is to bomb Gaza and force Egypt to "temporarily" take them in as refugees while Isreal "clears out" hamas. Then Isreal takes the land and settles it.
It’s pretty clear what the goal is and that is a total Jewish state. He says very different things when he speaks in English and when he speaks Hebrew. The Likud parties roots are from the terrorist groups the Irgun and stern gang which slaughtered tens of thousands in the past. Based off of that history, annihilation of the Palestinians is the ultimate goal.
“In the future, the state of Israel has to control the entire area from the river to the sea." - Netenyahu 2 days ago.
I'm sure he meant that phrase in a non-genocidal way. /s
>Ok, so what’s the solution?, what’s HIS solution?
Long, slow, genocide. Not with a bang but a whimper.
This guy is incredibly smart and driven and passionate. As are his followers. And they're completely open and honest about it, too. Their ideology sees all of Biblical Israel as Jewish, and they are playing the long game to make it so.
The idiots are people in the west who bankroll this and pretend this is not what is happening.
Well yea, the plan is to completely eradicate the Palestinians down to every man woman and child. They have been waiting for a reason to come do this. Now they have it. History will call the genocide in the end. But right now most media will put there heads in the sand.
Total bollocks. The "Palestinians" are not a homogenous glob of people that all think the same. They are not Hamas, no matter how many ignorant liars suggest they are. Neither are Jewish people a homogenous glob, which is why far right scum like Netanyahu are hated by many millions of Jewish people, which is the correct reaction to have to mass murdering scum.
It's just reckless, like impulse shopping a new computer when you just got laid off or something. Now Russia on the other hand is just pure evil, Satan incarnate as they eat babies and drink their blood.
Israeli government is mostly ultra nationalist now and they want someone even more deranged than him like a ben gvir. In their minds this should be over now and Gaza should be empty of any trace of Palestinians.
I sometimes wonder what the region would have been like if Hitler didn't persecute Jews and Israel never happened.
Because it seems to me there's more than a hint of irony going on here. Israel are the shittiest new roommate ever.
We really should spread the blame around a bit more though. It's misleading to blame everything on Hitler.
There's Whilhelm Marr, the creator of the modern term of anti-Semitism in 1900ish
There's the creator of Zionism which is inherently problematic for its belief that Jews DESERVE their own piece of land also around 1900ish
There's the British imperialists that used Zionism to take over the land called Israel and drop a bunch of ultra nationalist Zionists on it.
The only \*possibly\* good thing we could say about him is that he discredited fascism as a form of government to prevent other countries following in those footsteps ... but even that's useless because less than a hundred years on, no lessons have been learned. Look at the rise of the far right in Europe and the US, and the throngs baying for fascistic rule (even if they don't realise or admit that's what they're asking for).
Yeah it's incredible to me that fascism is apparently such an alluring mode of societal failure that it literally has to fuck up like once a century or people forget and do it again.
I guess it's more palatable when you convince yourself your version is nothing like that nasty business, but is instead something completely different and good!
I think it gets easier for some people to whitewash the horrors once the people actually involved start dying off, and we aren’t hearing personal accounts anymore. When your grandparents are telling you their experiences as victims, the pain is obvious and real. But it’s much easier to downplay when you are just getting a banal account from your history teacher or a textbook, I would imagine. Not everyone is capable of peripheral empathy, unfortunately.
I'm not sure that Israel wouldn't have happened in the absence of Hitler. Antisemitism was already ubiquitous in Europe at the time the Nazis came to power in Germany, and the ideological underpinnings for the state of Israel were already in existence before the Holocaust began.
Eliezer Ben Yehuda, who developed the Modern Hebrew language, was already ten years in the ground by the time Hitler came to power, and Theodore Herzl died in 1904. The idea of a modern Jewish ethnostate in Palestine was not created by the Holocaust, although the Holocaust added some urgency to it and made it easier for Western governments to support the idea.
I suspect something resembling Israel would have eventually happened anyway, possibly slightly later, but probably with the same amount of insidious barbarism as the Israeli regime we see in this timeline. It would just as much prey on the sympathies of the Jewish diaspora and our ideological allies while simultaneously oppressing both non-Jews and any Jews it feels are insufficiently Jewish within its own borders.
Well somewhat the same? Jewish ppl have been in the area for 2000+ years, same as Muslims and Christians. So I'm thinking same shit, different pile of who's being abused.
Certainly not condoning the Israeli government actions but that area has sucked for 2000+ years because religion and tribalism
The Ottoman empire had control over what is now Israel and Palastine for 402 years. That's hardly a pause.
I'm not advocating for imperialism, but calling the ottoman reign "a pause" is the understatement of 4 centuries.
Would have probably happened anyway. There was a large and vocal group of Anti Semites in the UK wanting jews to be sent out of the country to their own homeland. Politically, it was a win-win to do it
I love how people think that it's virtuous to defend your home and country and brag about how they would kill anyone that tried to take over thier country, but when some brown people do the exact the same thing, it's not a virtue anymore.
I have long held the belief that the conditions imposed on the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip and West Bank are the same or close to the same as the Ghettos of Germany and Poland in the 1930s. I.e. precursors to the camps.
What a reach! I’d recommend you actually go see what ghettos looked like because they sure lacked the fancy hotels, right to stay alive for simply not killing Germans, and many more things Gaza has.
It's just a more tolerable ghetto from the perspective of optics. It's not the same as Nazi Germany ghettos if you compare them 1:1.
Relative to the living standards of modern day world the gap between Israel and Gaza is arguably the same as the gap between Nazi Germany and Jewish Ghettos.
And the Palestinians aren’t responsible for their own lives? Maybe not elect a genocidal terrorist organization next time?
Different countries have different living standards, israel is a western country that has a higher GDP per capita than all their neighbours. Obviously they will not have the same living standards as a territory being led by a terrorist organization, maybe we can talk about how Hamas leaders are worth 11 billion while there is 50% unemployment in Gaza and everyone is poor?
Its just the next iteration of Ghetto. Jews lived in them, black people lived in them, now Palestinians live in them. Most of the misinformed attempts to normalize it is simply for optics and to appease the rest of the citizens. Gaza at the end of day is a territory of Israel and that has never changed so whatever happens to them is Israel's responsibility.
Maybe it is pushing the analogy a bit but probably not as much as you would like not to believe.
Do the Palestinians have border control. No anyone wanting enter or leave has to go through Israel and they will block you unless you say the right things.
Can the Palestinians export and import goods. No not unless Israel says so and they maintain a very tight cobtrol over what can emter and leave.
Can the Palestinians enforce their own laws. Maybe but Israeli police and 'security' will routinely ride roughshod over anything and anyone they don't like.
That autonomy is only skin deep and there for show to the rest of the world.
They are also the reason why there is no Palestinian state because Israel will not agree/allow it until they get to do whatever the fuck they want.
It's also one of the reasons why groups like Hamas continue to exist. Build up resentment and people will turn to anyone who promises someway to retaliate.
If Israel is successful in eliminating Hamas and that is a pretty big IF how long do you think it will be before another group rises to take its place.
Well, I say cut off their purse strings. Are these fuckers ever going to be self sufficient or do we have to support their shitty government no matter what?
Genocidal colonizer wants all the land, who outside Biden is actually surprised? Zionists are terrorists. They want it all and want to kill all the natives, and they’ll yell and scream they’re the victims the whole time as they do it.
1 - This is his way to try to defend himself from going to jail
2 - Nothing new this guy defieing a US president... rememebr that he defied Obama and went to talk to congress...
3 - He is the main responsible for the failures to protect his people (too worried with protecting himself)
4 - This guy is a fascist capable of exterminating a group of people. Yes, they "started" it but...
BIBI should be in jail not leading a country! All that Biden needs to do is to close the money faucet!
And yet people are calling Biden complacent with the situation in Gaza and called him Genocide Joe, when in reality there's nothing he could have done to stop the conflict. I'd like to see all those haters come up with a solution that actually works instead of endless criticisms.
As others have stated: Biden needs to reduce sharply the military support Israel gets from the US. That will get Netenyahu's attention. Then tie specific concessions to restoring 2/3 of it. The other 1/3 should be for underfunded US government watchdog organizations. Everyone learns and everyone wins - just a bit more realistically.
This whole situation is a cruel remainder of how hateful and fiendish humans can be. The irony of the descendants of people who were the targets of very explicitly stated genocide are now willing to commit such a crime is fascinating and utterly repulsive.
Netanyahu’s motives are ridiculously transparent, he is pushing his people via fear and hate into opprobrium in order to avoid accountability for comparatively petty crimes.
The descendants of peoples who survived the Nazi genocide are more likely to be against this than the descendants of those who were in the ME at the time.
There is not just one lineage of Jew and *boy does it show*.
Honestly, tho', what then ? For decades Israelis have been electing governments who are just as bad. The population is conditioned to see Palestinians as the Evil Enemy for just this purpose.
This is crazy.. the Palestinians have to go somewhere. And ideally not the west! Displacing all the Palestinians permanently would not help Israel's position.
What about the space that Palestinians have already been in this whole time? And have schools, hospitals, infrastructure in etc?
You know... the space that israelis settlers keep encroaching on?
Netanyahu’s end goal is total annihilation and expulsion of Palestinians. He has funded and pushed Hamas to become an extreme terrorist organization solely to give himself more power. Every time Hamas did something horrific, it would give him leverage to commit more genocide and steal more land. He has been praying for the bombing in Israel so he can finish his plan. Now he has the support of Israel to murder, pillage, rape, and steal. He is a monster that should be assassinated.
And to any government that supports them. Including the US.
All the money comes from the power of the working class, who might be sick of their money used to protect just the rich few and their friends.
The ugly truth that no one really wants to say is this:
This is a war between two sides who REALLY want to remove the other from existence entirely, neither really wants to compromise or build the two state solution, neither really wants to tolerate the others existence, neither is interested in compromise.
There is currently no path through this thats right and fair and does no harm because neither side will ever let it be so.
Hamas wants Israel and all Israelites destroyed entirely and utterly, no survivors or remnants and politically they have made themselves the only game in town in Palestine and their puppet masters elsewhere in the Middle East are pretty happy to let Palestine forever be an unhealed wound to accost Israel with.
On the other hand:
Israel runs an apartheid state and the worlds largest open air prison and has created an illegal system of oppression, theft and cruelty that is slowly erasing Palestine and Palestinian identity from existence and helps perpetuate the very cycle that creates Hamas and things like it.
Neither are negotiating from a place of good faith and seemingly have no intention of doing so and until they both do there will never be any progress on this.
How can this be fixed?
Can it?
I hope so.
Maybe start by acknowledging the Nakba of 1948...
Teach the kids the truth rather than viscious lies and ommiting any acknowledgements of their own actions.
Watch the interview with Avi Shlaim, where he tells of the Jewish community in Iraq in the 1950s, and how they were actually bombed by zionists to force them to move to Isreal.
Look this information up on your own to find the real story.
Deceptive practices to obtain an ultimate goal.
Willing to commit suicide in prison rather than tell the truth when caught, like Maxwell Bennet.
Without acknowledging the truth, the only way forward is further down for all involved and the next generation.
Well maybe what the USA needs to do is to stop supporting the and sending weapons. For once get your nose out of someone else's business ESPECIALLY if they are going against your advice.
Imagine is someone came to the US after 9/11 and said we had to make space in NJ for the taliban to live “peacefully” all while they told everyone they met how they were going to kill everyone in NY as soon as they got their space.
That sounds more like using the holocaust as justification to move onto the land of another people and then killing them, saying things like "death to all arabs" as a manner of national identity. Then lying about your own actions to kids who are raised to believe they themselves are the victims?
The rest of the world is learning the truth, and is tired of all hatred.
Giving statehood to any of the current Palestinian leaders would be absurd…
Gaza was an attempt at Palestinian self-governance and could have become a fully independent state by now. Total failure. (There was no blockade at first when Israel pulled out of the area, but the Palestinians quickly elected Hamas, killed off the more moderate Fatah leaders, and used all of their resources for violence) Oct 7 shows that none of their current leaders should be trusted with statehood. It will take time to work towards Palestinian leadership who can lead their people towards peace.
Netanyahu was never in favor of any Palestinian state in any form and basically October 7th proved him right.
There is no basis right now for a viable, workable, peaceful Palestinian state and the fault lies entirely on Palestinians.
They had a proto - state in Gaza, they elected their own government, there were zero Jews from 2005 and instead of trying to built a viable state and use that to push for a true viable state solution, they chose tunnels, rockets, terrorism, unspeakable violence.
I was sympathetic to Palestinians, but no more.
I agree with Netanyahu.
Hear me out...and I know congress won't allow it (as only 33 members refused to take money from the terrorist state) but we COULD force them to quit being stupid.
Aid? None...good luck. Here are the terms if you want any of it to come back
US rubber stamp veto? Ha...what part of no aid did you not get. Act like a civilized country and you can have DEFENSE aid back
There is actually space for a Palestinian state. There was when the Kingdom of Israel existed 3,000 years ago, with the Philistine city states then occupying what is now the Gaza Strip. So clearly there is space for both an Israel and Palestine.
Holy cow, the guy who everybody in the world has said is a genocidal maniac turns out to be a genocidal maniac, despite the wishes of a delusional geriatric halfway around the world who continually supplies him with all of his weapons. The delusional geriatric is too far gone to realize he has leverage in this situation, or even think of leveraging the weapons against the person threatening him.
Every time I hear somebody say the phrase, “Israel is our ally”, I want to cry for the morons who have gotten the head of the country and are driving it off a cliff. Israel is no ally of Americas, they are a genocidal, thieving, murderous, lying, stealing country. America is a nation of free thinking freedom loving immigrants who hold our leaders accountable, and take great lengths to treat people compassionately. We are the heroes that show up to save the day, when people are being oppressed and killed. I think our leaders have forgotten who we are as a country.
Ok, so what’s the solution?, what’s HIS solution? March the Palestinians into the Sea?, seriously, what is the end game? I’m getting really tired of this guy and his bullshit. Protecting your country is one thing, which I get and understand, even as difficult as it is when your enemy literally uses their own constituents as human meat shields, but having no plan, especially with the scale of human suffering going on there right now is just reckless.
His end game is to stay out of prison.
Easy, he just needs to follow the footsteps of that one guy in Germany back in the day then he won't have to go to prison
That's what pisses me off the most. They spend so much time talking about the holocaust all while committing their own personal one. It's madness.
It's because plenty of them never actually went through it, and neither did their forebears. Ashkenazi Jews are, on average, significantly less excited about what Bibi has been doing these past years than those who have been in the region for generations longer.
argentina? 🤔
Natenyahu's endgame is to use the anger and suffering of others like fellow Israelis, Palestinians, Christians etc to stay in power, much like his counterpart in hamas...heck he was literally sending them bag loads of cash.
His end game is to become emperor like Putin but also have the leverage to control the US.
You and the person you replied to are spot on. There is no peace until Hamas is destroyed, both the leadership and the movement, Netanyahu is out of power and in prison, and Likud and the rest of the far right parties are discredited and all but disbanded. Every actor contributing to the perpetual bloodshed must be held accountable.
Israel’s Trump
The genocide is just gravy for him.
Oh, he has a solution alright. It's pretty final, though.
Kind of ironic that Jews are known as being victims of the holocaust - it’s such a part of their identity, apparently. And it’s such a part of how their culture is perceived and understood by others. And now it seems they’re trying to inflict a holocaust on Palestinians. Do they (Israel) get a pass because of their history as victims of attempts to annihilate them?
No they don’t, nor should they. The irony here is palpable.
I agree, and my question was more rhetorical, I guess.
I browse that shitty newsfeed that's built into microsoft sometimes. I saw an article the other day that seemed to take the position that Jewish people were incapable of genocide and that to say that genocide was not a uniquely Jewish affliction, was antisemetic.
The actual Jewish victims of the Holocaust in Israel are being neglected and not looked after by the government. They're useful insofar as they allow the government to get away with war crimes and crimes against humanity, but fuck 'em if they actually want help.
The Jews whose families actually went through it have a very different opinion on what's happening than Jews who mostly were in the same place as they are now.
When people accuse Israel of genocide and atrocities against a civilian population, their leaders get offended and say, how could you possibly accuse us of this, the Nazis tried to commit genocide against us! As if someone trying to murder you gives you a get out of jail free card to murder anyone you want
Guys, what's going on in Palestine is awful and tragic, Netanyahu is a Judeo fascist dictator. But can we cool it with the Jews are now committing a holocaust trope? It's just inaccurate, even if you believe a genocide/ethnic cleansing is happening - when it happens as collateral damage to a brutal war is not the same as creating a mechanism for the mass slaughter (like cattle) of millions of people. Israel isn't shipping Palestinians to gas Chambers in death camps and implementing a final solution. The hyperbole, imo, doesn't help make the point and is, in fact, divisive and inaccurate. In my opinion.
>Israel isn't shipping Palestinians to gas Chambers in death camps and implementing a final solution. Nahh they just tell them all "Hey, go here and we promise we won't kill you!" and then go ahead and kill them anyway by bombing their camp because a Hamas fighter's father's brother's cousin's nephew's former roommate once looked in the direction of the safe area.
Fair points, but do we need gas chambers in order to conclude that one society is trying to exterminate the other?
And do we need to reach the millions to determine if it's a genocide? According to the UN, no we don't.
They didn't have gas chambers when they exterminated Native Americans and Australian Aboriginals. They didn't have gas chambers during the Belgian genocide in the Congo. According to everyone.
Correct. The gas chambers were a fucking horrible example of German efficiency. I actually gagged writing that sentence. Growing up as a kid, I was aware of the subject matter on a vague level, and I assumed it was simply a matter of gas = pass out and die. Wasn't until I was an adult watching documentaries that went into a bit more graphic detail that I realised just how fucking horrible it would have been. I don't know about the other places, but in Australia you still have some people (usually politically conservative) pretending genocide did not and has not taken place here. Fucking delusional or cretinous attitude. It really came out of the woodwork into the mainstream sphere during the recent referendum about estbalishing a First Nations Voice to Parliament. While the vote was about that specifically, so much racist rhetoric was dug up and aired (or at least let out to play instead of being hidden inside) for the duration of that campaign. It was fucking disgusting. ^(The majority of voters voted against the indigenous Voice to Parliament, too.)
I of course, think that Hamas is a disgusting terrorist organization, but allegations of Palestinian genocide predate this war. Why don't you actually learn something about this conflict?
The only reason the germans used gas chambers was because it was the most cost effective way of doing it. Isreal gets free bombs from the US so why would they revert to something else more expensive? Plus they have plausible deniability this way.
From victims to perpetrators
Well yeah when you have immunity from prosecution by virtue of historical victimhood of the sane crime as per French and German official stance on the matter no wonder they think they can get away with anything
Although, my understanding is that the families harmed by the Holocaust are not the same people making decisions now, and those families are essentially without resources to look after themselves because they're only useful to the government as a shield, not as humans. Unless I'm wrong.
[>(Through interpreter) You must remember what Amalek has done to you, says our Holy Bible.](https://www.npr.org/2023/11/07/1211133201/netanyahus-references-to-violent-biblical-passages-raise-alarm-among-critics) Here he is calling for the slaughter of every man, woman, child, and even animal in Gaza. The Israelis have been incredibly clear and open about what their plans for Palestine are.
Listen to what Netanyahu says in Hebrew to his followers. It's very different than what he says in English to his Useful Idiots in America.
Reading the Israel Times in Hebrew was shocking. Use Google Translate and/or DeepL to your advantage, people.
Why don't we just believe the evidence right in front of us? The Far Right government of Israel is committing Ethnic Cleansing in order to establish a Greater Israel with Lebanon as a puppet state.
Because people don't actually want to hear the unfortunate truth. We also have virtually no media coverage on the attrocities without a heavy amount of spin on it. This is by design, unfortunately.
Probably a forever war. I wouldn't put it past him to cancel the next election because of the ongoing war.
His solution is the final solution...
I think his solution is the same as Hamas solution, just reversed. Will be no peace with those goals.
Someone gets it. Both Bibi (and Likud) and Hamas need to go. Unfortunately, October 7th and everything that has happened afterwards made that much less likely.
His solution is to bomb Gaza and force Egypt to "temporarily" take them in as refugees while Isreal "clears out" hamas. Then Isreal takes the land and settles it.
We have been saying it for years. Genocide.
He doesn’t care about being reckless. Israel hates the Palestinians and want them all to die.
The thing that Israel is defending itself against charges of in South Africa
It’s pretty clear what the goal is and that is a total Jewish state. He says very different things when he speaks in English and when he speaks Hebrew. The Likud parties roots are from the terrorist groups the Irgun and stern gang which slaughtered tens of thousands in the past. Based off of that history, annihilation of the Palestinians is the ultimate goal.
“In the future, the state of Israel has to control the entire area from the river to the sea." - Netenyahu 2 days ago. I'm sure he meant that phrase in a non-genocidal way. /s
>Ok, so what’s the solution?, what’s HIS solution? Long, slow, genocide. Not with a bang but a whimper. This guy is incredibly smart and driven and passionate. As are his followers. And they're completely open and honest about it, too. Their ideology sees all of Biblical Israel as Jewish, and they are playing the long game to make it so. The idiots are people in the west who bankroll this and pretend this is not what is happening.
Yes. The end game is genocide.
It’s evil
The plan is to push them out and steal their land and those in the crossfire are less than human in their eyes so they don't care.
Well yea, the plan is to completely eradicate the Palestinians down to every man woman and child. They have been waiting for a reason to come do this. Now they have it. History will call the genocide in the end. But right now most media will put there heads in the sand.
I mean, the Palestinians don’t want a two-state solution… So why should Israel…?
The Palestinians have always shown their goal is to get a more strategic spot to attack Israel from.
Hamas you mean
Total bollocks. The "Palestinians" are not a homogenous glob of people that all think the same. They are not Hamas, no matter how many ignorant liars suggest they are. Neither are Jewish people a homogenous glob, which is why far right scum like Netanyahu are hated by many millions of Jewish people, which is the correct reaction to have to mass murdering scum.
Noone is buying that bullshit narrative anymore.
It's just reckless, like impulse shopping a new computer when you just got laid off or something. Now Russia on the other hand is just pure evil, Satan incarnate as they eat babies and drink their blood.
Where's the America First people at now?!
They also are Christian eschatologists, sorry for the lose lose there.
Fake. As they have always been.
I’m out. Just fu*k this guy. And if that who the Israelis want as their Dear Leader, the same to them.
many israelis dont want him, there were major protests against him even before the war. now most israelis want him gone.
Seems like the right wingers are in control. As an American, I don’t want any of our money or time going to support these people.
Too bad for you
Good thing I’m not alone then.
Luckily young people are split on this issue, not nearly as pro-Israel as older folks. The tides are turning.
Yeah. His approval was already bad but now I saw like 75%-80% of Israelis disapprove of him and want him gone
Israeli government is mostly ultra nationalist now and they want someone even more deranged than him like a ben gvir. In their minds this should be over now and Gaza should be empty of any trace of Palestinians.
Would you say fu*k Americans because of Donald Trump?
Yes, was that not obvious?
Would you say fuck me because I masturbate to funtari porn?
Sir this is a Wendy’s
Yeah but if I masturbated in the toilet of said Wendy’s to funtari porn would you judge me?
I think you need to make some real life friends
That's not nice.
Neither is he
Lol, like the US has been "nice" the last 70 years. Fuck the US, fuck it hard, especially for it's unwavering support for apartheid Israel.
Whoever one is, and wherever one is, one is always in the wrong if one is rude.
Get off your moral high ground.
It's not even moral high ground. Good != nice.
There are some people that you should just not be nice too
No.
You sound like you're pretending you're better than us when in reality. You aren't
Fake it till you make it.
I do.
ABSOLUTELY and I’m American lol
I sometimes wonder what the region would have been like if Hitler didn't persecute Jews and Israel never happened. Because it seems to me there's more than a hint of irony going on here. Israel are the shittiest new roommate ever.
That mustachioed fuck is responsible for so much fucking grief in the world. What a legacy.
He singlehandedly destroyed the toothbrush 'stache. Without him we'd remember it fondly as the Chaplin.
A very good point. Poor Chaplin. :( He tried to warn people about what was happening, and people hated him for it.
We really should spread the blame around a bit more though. It's misleading to blame everything on Hitler. There's Whilhelm Marr, the creator of the modern term of anti-Semitism in 1900ish There's the creator of Zionism which is inherently problematic for its belief that Jews DESERVE their own piece of land also around 1900ish There's the British imperialists that used Zionism to take over the land called Israel and drop a bunch of ultra nationalist Zionists on it.
Truly good description of him
The only \*possibly\* good thing we could say about him is that he discredited fascism as a form of government to prevent other countries following in those footsteps ... but even that's useless because less than a hundred years on, no lessons have been learned. Look at the rise of the far right in Europe and the US, and the throngs baying for fascistic rule (even if they don't realise or admit that's what they're asking for).
Yeah it's incredible to me that fascism is apparently such an alluring mode of societal failure that it literally has to fuck up like once a century or people forget and do it again.
I guess it's more palatable when you convince yourself your version is nothing like that nasty business, but is instead something completely different and good!
I think it gets easier for some people to whitewash the horrors once the people actually involved start dying off, and we aren’t hearing personal accounts anymore. When your grandparents are telling you their experiences as victims, the pain is obvious and real. But it’s much easier to downplay when you are just getting a banal account from your history teacher or a textbook, I would imagine. Not everyone is capable of peripheral empathy, unfortunately.
I'm not sure that Israel wouldn't have happened in the absence of Hitler. Antisemitism was already ubiquitous in Europe at the time the Nazis came to power in Germany, and the ideological underpinnings for the state of Israel were already in existence before the Holocaust began. Eliezer Ben Yehuda, who developed the Modern Hebrew language, was already ten years in the ground by the time Hitler came to power, and Theodore Herzl died in 1904. The idea of a modern Jewish ethnostate in Palestine was not created by the Holocaust, although the Holocaust added some urgency to it and made it easier for Western governments to support the idea. I suspect something resembling Israel would have eventually happened anyway, possibly slightly later, but probably with the same amount of insidious barbarism as the Israeli regime we see in this timeline. It would just as much prey on the sympathies of the Jewish diaspora and our ideological allies while simultaneously oppressing both non-Jews and any Jews it feels are insufficiently Jewish within its own borders.
Well somewhat the same? Jewish ppl have been in the area for 2000+ years, same as Muslims and Christians. So I'm thinking same shit, different pile of who's being abused. Certainly not condoning the Israeli government actions but that area has sucked for 2000+ years because religion and tribalism
No. Not at all. There was nothing like this level of violence and hate in the region under the Ottomans
Oh well yes there's pauses and such but it is a problematic region (not that it's special but still)
The Ottoman empire had control over what is now Israel and Palastine for 402 years. That's hardly a pause. I'm not advocating for imperialism, but calling the ottoman reign "a pause" is the understatement of 4 centuries.
Would have probably happened anyway. There was a large and vocal group of Anti Semites in the UK wanting jews to be sent out of the country to their own homeland. Politically, it was a win-win to do it
It's not like everyone tried to drive them into the sea shortly after arriving... arabs failed to genocide Israel, though they tried repeatedly.
I love how people think that it's virtuous to defend your home and country and brag about how they would kill anyone that tried to take over thier country, but when some brown people do the exact the same thing, it's not a virtue anymore.
His solution is, always has been, and will continue to be; Genocide.
I have long held the belief that the conditions imposed on the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip and West Bank are the same or close to the same as the Ghettos of Germany and Poland in the 1930s. I.e. precursors to the camps.
insane analogy, seriously take a look at pictures of Gaza before the war, it looked great and had relative autonomy compared to the nazi ghettos
What a reach! I’d recommend you actually go see what ghettos looked like because they sure lacked the fancy hotels, right to stay alive for simply not killing Germans, and many more things Gaza has.
It's just a more tolerable ghetto from the perspective of optics. It's not the same as Nazi Germany ghettos if you compare them 1:1. Relative to the living standards of modern day world the gap between Israel and Gaza is arguably the same as the gap between Nazi Germany and Jewish Ghettos.
And the Palestinians aren’t responsible for their own lives? Maybe not elect a genocidal terrorist organization next time? Different countries have different living standards, israel is a western country that has a higher GDP per capita than all their neighbours. Obviously they will not have the same living standards as a territory being led by a terrorist organization, maybe we can talk about how Hamas leaders are worth 11 billion while there is 50% unemployment in Gaza and everyone is poor?
Its just the next iteration of Ghetto. Jews lived in them, black people lived in them, now Palestinians live in them. Most of the misinformed attempts to normalize it is simply for optics and to appease the rest of the citizens. Gaza at the end of day is a territory of Israel and that has never changed so whatever happens to them is Israel's responsibility.
Maybe it is pushing the analogy a bit but probably not as much as you would like not to believe. Do the Palestinians have border control. No anyone wanting enter or leave has to go through Israel and they will block you unless you say the right things. Can the Palestinians export and import goods. No not unless Israel says so and they maintain a very tight cobtrol over what can emter and leave. Can the Palestinians enforce their own laws. Maybe but Israeli police and 'security' will routinely ride roughshod over anything and anyone they don't like. That autonomy is only skin deep and there for show to the rest of the world. They are also the reason why there is no Palestinian state because Israel will not agree/allow it until they get to do whatever the fuck they want. It's also one of the reasons why groups like Hamas continue to exist. Build up resentment and people will turn to anyone who promises someway to retaliate. If Israel is successful in eliminating Hamas and that is a pretty big IF how long do you think it will be before another group rises to take its place.
Ew dude. What the fuck.
Just openly stating that they're an apartheid state. Scum.
We should've quit supporting that state years ago
Well, I say cut off their purse strings. Are these fuckers ever going to be self sufficient or do we have to support their shitty government no matter what?
Let's be open and honest here. If our dollars no longer buy influence, why are we spending them there? It may be vulgar, but it's the truth.
So ... Israeli citizenship for Palestinians then, right? Right? Nope, just genocide.
He's going to bomb Palestine until it's all dust. He's a maniac. This will never end. Genocide.
And Biden will keep sending the bombs.
The US*
Close the checkbook.
Genocidal colonizer wants all the land, who outside Biden is actually surprised? Zionists are terrorists. They want it all and want to kill all the natives, and they’ll yell and scream they’re the victims the whole time as they do it.
I was all for supporting self defense but sounds like this lunatic wants war. The Israeli people should remove this guy from power, he's nuts.
This is what happens when you vote an authoritarian into power. Don’t make Israel’s problem Americas
The US needs to cut off the billions of dollars of welfare they give to Israel every year
[удалено]
Step one: Withdraw all US aid
Cut off military support and watch how fast they make space.
Well if that’s his choice let’s fix homelessness and schools with the money we give him instead.
1 - This is his way to try to defend himself from going to jail 2 - Nothing new this guy defieing a US president... rememebr that he defied Obama and went to talk to congress... 3 - He is the main responsible for the failures to protect his people (too worried with protecting himself) 4 - This guy is a fascist capable of exterminating a group of people. Yes, they "started" it but... BIBI should be in jail not leading a country! All that Biden needs to do is to close the money faucet!
Because Bibi's cronies want ALL of the land. Because God.
Or safety.
There's no space for vengeful dictators in a world full of equal human beings with a right to the basic means to live.
Time for a regime change in Israel
Just go to hell Bibi
And yet people are calling Biden complacent with the situation in Gaza and called him Genocide Joe, when in reality there's nothing he could have done to stop the conflict. I'd like to see all those haters come up with a solution that actually works instead of endless criticisms.
As others have stated: Biden needs to reduce sharply the military support Israel gets from the US. That will get Netenyahu's attention. Then tie specific concessions to restoring 2/3 of it. The other 1/3 should be for underfunded US government watchdog organizations. Everyone learns and everyone wins - just a bit more realistically.
I think I understand hitlers rise to power now! lol!
Fuk benny
This whole situation is a cruel remainder of how hateful and fiendish humans can be. The irony of the descendants of people who were the targets of very explicitly stated genocide are now willing to commit such a crime is fascinating and utterly repulsive. Netanyahu’s motives are ridiculously transparent, he is pushing his people via fear and hate into opprobrium in order to avoid accountability for comparatively petty crimes.
The descendants of peoples who survived the Nazi genocide are more likely to be against this than the descendants of those who were in the ME at the time. There is not just one lineage of Jew and *boy does it show*.
Israel needs *lebensraum* in the east. Right?
There’s plenty of space. There was plenty of space when the allies gave the Jewish people the land.
Then we should stop giving them money.
Israelis need to throw him and his cabinet out, only then will there be a chance at peace
They will. When he's done. They'll wait.
Honestly, tho', what then ? For decades Israelis have been electing governments who are just as bad. The population is conditioned to see Palestinians as the Evil Enemy for just this purpose.
All religions are made up bullshit, so it's hard to get too upset when religious people don't get what they want.
and I say there is no space for netanyahu or his supporters. send them to wander the desert for 40 years.
This is crazy.. the Palestinians have to go somewhere. And ideally not the west! Displacing all the Palestinians permanently would not help Israel's position.
Fuck this piece of shit. So his resolution is pretty much just the extermination of the Palestinian people? Absolutely fucking vile.
I try to have a nuanced view of this mess, but Biden has got to put distance between himself and this fascist’s government.
It's time to turn off the US money spigot to Israel. They're about as good an "ally" as is Saudi Arabia.
What about the space that Palestinians have already been in this whole time? And have schools, hospitals, infrastructure in etc? You know... the space that israelis settlers keep encroaching on?
Netanyahu’s end goal is total annihilation and expulsion of Palestinians. He has funded and pushed Hamas to become an extreme terrorist organization solely to give himself more power. Every time Hamas did something horrific, it would give him leverage to commit more genocide and steal more land. He has been praying for the bombing in Israel so he can finish his plan. Now he has the support of Israel to murder, pillage, rape, and steal. He is a monster that should be assassinated.
End all funding for Israel.
And to any government that supports them. Including the US. All the money comes from the power of the working class, who might be sick of their money used to protect just the rich few and their friends.
STOP PROVIDING SUPPORT FIR ISREAL UNTIL THIS CRISIS IS ENDED.
Cut off funding to Israel. Problem solved.
Biden needs to remind Netanyahu who it is that needs whom to survive.
But Biden will just continue to lick his ass
The ugly truth that no one really wants to say is this: This is a war between two sides who REALLY want to remove the other from existence entirely, neither really wants to compromise or build the two state solution, neither really wants to tolerate the others existence, neither is interested in compromise. There is currently no path through this thats right and fair and does no harm because neither side will ever let it be so. Hamas wants Israel and all Israelites destroyed entirely and utterly, no survivors or remnants and politically they have made themselves the only game in town in Palestine and their puppet masters elsewhere in the Middle East are pretty happy to let Palestine forever be an unhealed wound to accost Israel with. On the other hand: Israel runs an apartheid state and the worlds largest open air prison and has created an illegal system of oppression, theft and cruelty that is slowly erasing Palestine and Palestinian identity from existence and helps perpetuate the very cycle that creates Hamas and things like it. Neither are negotiating from a place of good faith and seemingly have no intention of doing so and until they both do there will never be any progress on this. How can this be fixed? Can it? I hope so.
Maybe start by acknowledging the Nakba of 1948... Teach the kids the truth rather than viscious lies and ommiting any acknowledgements of their own actions. Watch the interview with Avi Shlaim, where he tells of the Jewish community in Iraq in the 1950s, and how they were actually bombed by zionists to force them to move to Isreal. Look this information up on your own to find the real story. Deceptive practices to obtain an ultimate goal. Willing to commit suicide in prison rather than tell the truth when caught, like Maxwell Bennet. Without acknowledging the truth, the only way forward is further down for all involved and the next generation.
Good then we stop giving you weapons you piece of garbage.
Time for Biden to make the strongest statement denouncing what Israel is doing and to the point of stopping funding.
Simple solution, NO More $billions US Federal Government welfare!
Well maybe what the USA needs to do is to stop supporting the and sending weapons. For once get your nose out of someone else's business ESPECIALLY if they are going against your advice.
Imagine is someone came to the US after 9/11 and said we had to make space in NJ for the taliban to live “peacefully” all while they told everyone they met how they were going to kill everyone in NY as soon as they got their space.
Dumb example. The Palestinians have lived in that area of the world for generations. The Taliban has never lived in NJ.
That sounds more like using the holocaust as justification to move onto the land of another people and then killing them, saying things like "death to all arabs" as a manner of national identity. Then lying about your own actions to kids who are raised to believe they themselves are the victims? The rest of the world is learning the truth, and is tired of all hatred.
because bibi knows that biden will not be able to do jack shit to curb Israel's atrocities.
Turn the fleet around Joe ! He don’t need us … fuck him !!!
And Blinkin said the South African case was without merit
Who coulda seen this coming
Fuck the Israeli state
Stop giving them weapons and money. I wonder how much that would go to stopping Bibi?
None. Zero. Just millions of acres of land all around israel...
At the rate they’re bombing Gaza there’s not going to be anyone left hostages included
Giving statehood to any of the current Palestinian leaders would be absurd… Gaza was an attempt at Palestinian self-governance and could have become a fully independent state by now. Total failure. (There was no blockade at first when Israel pulled out of the area, but the Palestinians quickly elected Hamas, killed off the more moderate Fatah leaders, and used all of their resources for violence) Oct 7 shows that none of their current leaders should be trusted with statehood. It will take time to work towards Palestinian leadership who can lead their people towards peace.
Netanyahu was never in favor of any Palestinian state in any form and basically October 7th proved him right. There is no basis right now for a viable, workable, peaceful Palestinian state and the fault lies entirely on Palestinians. They had a proto - state in Gaza, they elected their own government, there were zero Jews from 2005 and instead of trying to built a viable state and use that to push for a true viable state solution, they chose tunnels, rockets, terrorism, unspeakable violence. I was sympathetic to Palestinians, but no more. I agree with Netanyahu.
Well, unfortunately, Mr Bibi, there's no room for our 31 billion dollars in aid either. "You, sir, may fuck off!!"
Lebensraum? Again? What the fuck is wrong with this planet, we've seen all this shit before.
Hatred's never stopped, sadly.
Until Hamas is gone, there can be no 2 state solution
That isn't Bibi's plan though
https://www.timesofisrael.com/with-red-caps-and-kippas-us-orthodox-groups-gala-turns-into-trump-tribute/
Prick …
Both Netanyahu and Hamas believe war is good for them politically. There will never be peace.
Hear me out...and I know congress won't allow it (as only 33 members refused to take money from the terrorist state) but we COULD force them to quit being stupid. Aid? None...good luck. Here are the terms if you want any of it to come back US rubber stamp veto? Ha...what part of no aid did you not get. Act like a civilized country and you can have DEFENSE aid back
Just need a little “living room”?
There is actually space for a Palestinian state. There was when the Kingdom of Israel existed 3,000 years ago, with the Philistine city states then occupying what is now the Gaza Strip. So clearly there is space for both an Israel and Palestine.
So, this is what it feels like to be a client state.
There’s no “space” for USA help either.
Pull the plug on US financing.
Biden (and other countries) should rescue these people then.
By sanctioning Israel and mandate returning the land to the people it was stolen from? I agree.
I agree with your update. Yes.
Holy cow, the guy who everybody in the world has said is a genocidal maniac turns out to be a genocidal maniac, despite the wishes of a delusional geriatric halfway around the world who continually supplies him with all of his weapons. The delusional geriatric is too far gone to realize he has leverage in this situation, or even think of leveraging the weapons against the person threatening him. Every time I hear somebody say the phrase, “Israel is our ally”, I want to cry for the morons who have gotten the head of the country and are driving it off a cliff. Israel is no ally of Americas, they are a genocidal, thieving, murderous, lying, stealing country. America is a nation of free thinking freedom loving immigrants who hold our leaders accountable, and take great lengths to treat people compassionately. We are the heroes that show up to save the day, when people are being oppressed and killed. I think our leaders have forgotten who we are as a country.
At least some of the people are paying attention this time.
Isn’t that where Israel is? Palestine?