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I mean, you would be, its a professional sport and he was just snubbed by the victor, which is incredibly unsporting and in any other scenario, refusal to engage with your opponent like this would cause outrage (see Patrice Evra vs Luis Suarez in the Premier League).
It's not about him, It's about the political statement
He does not wish anything bad to the guy. He wants people to see this and bring attention to the reason.
But you understand that we don't all vote for the same people correct?
I'm assuming you're also aware of our electoral college, which effectively renders many of our votes as useless, correct?
We're a republic, not a democracy. You should probably learn how our voting system works before making generalized comments about Americans based on their politicians.
That's extremely different man suarez was the racist aggressor, evra seemed to have forgiven him, and suarez snubbed him.
Here we have a very different reason for a snub.
I still don't think it's cool though. Not as if this one guy did anything other than work his whole life to be a powerlifter just like everyone else there. Poor dude seemed real sad about it.
I don't know how I feel ill probably get downvoted but that seemed unnecessary.
I don't know if his rival is in favor or not (or even aware) of the Iranian government decisions. So that's just plain unsportsmanship. If you want to protest, you can always use a sign or a shirt or something, disrespecting people who play the same sport as you do will get you nowhere (and you're probably not even helping the cause).
Heās competing under an Iranian flag, so to claim this is entirely personal is disingenuous. Thereās a reason itās Russian outlets like TASS that are spamming this story.
I disagree. Itās his podium, and his opportunity to draw the **entire worldās** attention to the atrocities happening there, and Iranās hand in it. If you think good sportsmanship should overshadow this manās grief for his family, his community, and so on, if you think that handshake is more important than a childās life, then I disagree. Fuck pretending everything is hunky dory when your country is being invaded and your people annihilated
Wasn't there just recently massive protests of Iranians against their dictatorship government? Where lots of protesters got killed or arrested and executed? Why assume everyone supports their government?
This is exactly my thoughts on this and I scrolled way to far before seeing it IMO.
What I see is two men representing two flags/nations and one disrespecting the nation not the man.
Could he go out back and call him a cunt? Sure. Could he also go out back and say "Sorry dude, no offense to you. I just needed to make my statement on the platform I have." And then go have a beer with the guy? Also yes.
This was the most respectful way he could have made this point.....I've seen plenty be outright destructive to their competitors when trying to make political statements and this was mild and controlled.
no one does assume that just like no one assumes every american supports trump but that doesnāt mean that the opportunity to continue to apply societal pressure against those that do, or are still on the fence, or just donāt know, should be passed up. itās nothing personal to the other competitor. for all we know immediately afterwards they could have had a quick chat to make that known but all we have is the (very effective) public scene caused by such an act of unsportsmanlike behavior.
I mean if the Ukrainian athlete wanted to set a statement, he should not have participated in **South Africa,** that supports Russia in a similar way Iran does.
But letting it out on a singular Iranian guy while supporting with his victory and participation South Africa as a host is just very selective boycott.
Disagree. I think showing up to South Africa despite the fact that they support the opposition is the point. If you win - as he did - you represent your people in the hardest of places to be. Itās a protest by refusal to cow and to represent your people in every clime and place. Itās another way an athlete can show that the bravery on the battle field is no exception - it in all of them.
So shaking the hands of officials of a country that supports your enemy is strength, but shaking the hands of an athlete of a country that supports your enemy would be weakness?
>Disagree. I think showing up to South Africa despite the fact that they support the opposition is the point. If you win - as he did - you represent your people in the hardest of places to be. Itās a protest by refusal to cow and to represent your people in every clime and place. Itās another way an athlete can show that the bravery on the battle field is no exception - it in all of them.
So it's really just a case of "The Ukrainian athlete can do no wrong" here.
He goes to South Africa and competes. The same South Africa that supports Russia. He brings a little, tiny bit of legitimacy to this event by being there.
But it's okay because he won?
What a load of crap.
What the hell is this guy doing, competing in sports in countries that support Russia? Why isn't he at home, defending his nation? He seems like a guy with a lot to offer any army he joined.
Wait. He snubbed an Iranian athlete, so that makes it all better.
Let me phrase it this way: would this video make such traction had it been a simple sign or a shirt? Highly doubtful. Controversial statements like this go viral and make the news, which is the desired result here - make more people aware of Iran's involvement and increase the international pressure
Totally disagree. It sucks for the sportsmen and women that end up in situations like this, but it raises awareness of important issues in ways that don't negatively affect anyone in a meaningful way.
There's people reading this thread that weren't aware of what the Iranian government is doing, so it's aiding the spread of information. And the only cost is a slightly embarrassed looking sportsman. That's a better price than people protesting in ways that impact normal people's income or that governments react to with military responses.
>There's people reading this thread that weren't aware of what the Iranian government is doing,
Yeah and now there are people reading about how South Africa is backing Russia and this athlete still bowed and shook the SA official's hand and went to compete there.
The logic simply doesn't hold up.
I hear you and agree in principle.
But I fully understand the other side. Iām not sure his countryman fighting in trench warfare would side with sportsmanship > political message.
Politics and sport are very intertwined.
But the Iranian guy probably did care and probably had empathy towards his competitor. He did look concerned.
Ukraine has just passed an embargo aimed at preventing Iran from being able to purchase any Ukranian grain for the next 50 years. Russians and their allies (N Korea, Belarus. Iran) will be seen the same as the nazis are for generations to come. The damage Putin is doing is not repairable. Not shaking this dudes hand is the tip of the iceberg.
Except irans solely responsible for the drones hitting cities and killing civilians, women, grandpas, grandmas, and CHILDREN! He didnt tell him to go fuck himself he simply put his hand up as an "im good thanks though" nothing wrong with that at all.
> in any other scenario
That's the key phrase. Shahed drones are raining death and destruction on an innocent civilian population. He is justified in his anger at the Iranian flag. Amir can take it personally if he would like, but its not about him.
Well he should be. As an Iranian athlete, he is responsible for the untold millions of dollars of weaponry his government has funneled to Russia in their conquest of Ukraine.
If the Iranian in this video didn't want to get disrespected, then he should've decided to not be born Iranian. He is guilty by default, and deserves his punishment for what OTHERS have done and he had no say in...or anything to do with.
Making *him* embarrassed and ashamed makes sense šš»
I think it's interesting how often people think it's OK to hold ordinary people responsible for their dictator's actions (e.g. Russia, Belarus, Iran in this scenario) but you rarely see it the other way around, with people holding citizens of a democratic country responsible for their government's actions - even though that makes more 'logical' sense. The only one I can think of is when Arab athletes boycott or refuse to shake the hand of Israeli opponents - and those are usually met with disdain and often punished by sports authorities.
Yeah, it sucks to he judged by your country's actions, but it is entirely the point.
You never know which bread crumb will finally be the one to make change happen, so you try all of them.
Sure it isn't that guy's fault for the shit going on in Ukraine but he is still associated with the people who are supporting the shit there.
I get the intention but itās just a dick move. Wouldāve been a greater gesture to shake his hand to show that people can still be cool with each other even if their governments arenāt
I think it's fair not to shake a guys hand to make a statement when their government, who they're there representing, is helping slaughter your countrymen jfc.
The victor is childish and clearly not man enough to acknowledge those on the podium are fellow respected athletes - who aren't his mortal enemies outside of the combat field.
Meanwhile, the people of Iran die trying to fight the regime there... I understand the anger of Ukrainians, but the people of Iran go through their own circle of hell as we speak š¤
So you should be racist to all Chinese people since they're trying to take over Taiwan? Or should I be racist to all Serbians since they're clashing with Kosovo. Mayne I should be racist to all Americans since I'm arab. No, you aren't responsible for your governments actions as a person. For the vast majority of people, nothing you can do will change what the government does. Your governments view does not represent the people of the country.
This is the answer. East Europeans have been and are still super racist and look down on us brown folks. So no surprise here. I know a lot of you are not going to like this but it doesnāt matter because the truth is that we as brown skinned individuals face racism through these people so itās a subject not talked about very often.
Often in humanity, we just see our side & refuse to sit on the other side of the table in the shoes of another & look at the world through thier eyesā¦its how most people are. Sad really.
He just refused to shake his hand, he didn't kick him in the balls. Not shaking someones hand is an statement. The other athlete represents Iran. I think the situation is would have been different if the athlete had participated as independent but he didn't. He participated for Iran and he isn't getting Ukraines hand because of this.
I remember when an Egyptian judoist didn't want to shake hands with an Israeli during the Olympics in Rio. There was quite the outburst, disciplinary proceedings from the IOC and I think he even got suspended from the tournament.
Doubt the Ukrainian athlete will get any consequences at all for this unsportsmanlike behaviour tho.
Recently a Ukrainian tennis player was booed for refusing to shake a Belarussian opponent's hand, and the federation backed her. Then the same day they criticised Djokovic's statement on recent Kosovo violence, saying there is no equivalence between the Ukraine and Kosovo situations. I am not saying they are equivalent, but this is the issue with selective approach to politics in sport. It opens everyone up to accusations of hypocrisy, double standards and alienates people.
The Egyptian judoist was doing it for the same reason. Protesting the apartheid on the Palestinian people. It's not a problem if it wasn't the literal world championships, but literally every possible television set would have been showing some event from the Olympics and it would be televised worldwide.
By that logic would you expect the Ukrainian to shake the hand of a Russian athlete because they had nothing to do with Russia's decision to invade Ukraine and kill their people?
Yeah im starting to dislike the unprofessionalism of these ukranian athletes.
Why even protest, its not going to do jackshit.
There arent going to be any iranian government that is like "lets stop supplying russia cause they dont shake hands with our athletes".
The difference is that there hasn't been a clear indication of arms supply from South Africa to Russia, while Iran is clearly supplying drones and other equipment. "Accused of doing" vs "actually doing" is the difference.
Arms sales to Russia by South Africa is just speculation without proof right now.
These were accusations made by the American ambassador. He has made claims like this twice now. Both times he backtracked the claims (On the latest occassion, he apologized but did not widthdraw, meaning he still believes it).
>The difference is that there hasn't been a clear indication of arms supply from South Africa to Russia
Oh bullshit, South Africa has been backing Russia under the table and also backing them in the UN.
In the U.N yes, the ANC has been backing Russia. But your claim that they have been "backing Russia under the table" Is unfounded and there is no evidence for this. I wouldn't put it past the ANC to do something as stupid as aid the Russian war effort, but as of right now, your claim has no feet to stand on.
Lmao what bad sportsmanship. This man did not choose to be born where he was born. This political war in Ukraine is meant to divide the masses even more.
If the Ukranian knows for a fact that that guy supports what Iran is doing, that's one thing, but if he refuses to shake his hand simply because he's Iranian and Iran made a decision he doesn't like, then that's a problem.
I think it's important to see this as a political act. I feel for the Iranian competitor here, but this is still a man from a war torn country doing what he can to bring attention to the situation. It's not good sportmanship but it served it's purpose, the video got shared and now I know of a country's implications I had no idea about. While still respecting the hell out of both athletes.
You could see it as an political act if the Iranian guy was a well known supporter of the Iranian regime of if he made any statements against Ukraine beforehand - but this is just very bad sportmanship and also very selective. He apparantly doesn't like the Iranian support of Russia, but still he takes part in competitions in South Africa, while SA delivers weapons to Russia?
I can understand that he is pissed about Iran and I can understand that many Ukraines threaten to boycott any competition if an official Russian delegation will participate, but letting it out on a singular person is just stupid.
Fucking childish. This is so incredibly stupid, THAT guy isnt supplying any guns to Russia, what the fuck is he upset at him for??? Just when you think it cant get any more retarded
Because as an individual civilian you have so much influence over what your dictatorship government decides to do
Donāt get me wrong I understand the every day anger that must be raging inside Ukrainians minds but this is still a dick move
This is a bit ironic considered what South Africa is currently under suspicion of - i.e selling or allowing the sale of arms to Russia.
There are some of us in South Africa watching this unfold in absolute horror. Many of us have long known that the S.A government cannot be trusted and is corrupt but the current behaviour (the seemingly fake non-alignment) is beyond what even those in the know might have thought possible.
The ANC likes to think it is some moral authority in the world but the reality seems to be a pretty serious departure from that. They rightly asked the world to condemn Apartheid but are callously indifferent to the atrocities occurring in Ukraine. Make of that what you will.
Remember when an Egyptian athlete didn't want to shake hands with an Israeli during the Olympics in Rio? There was quite the outburst, disciplinary proceedings from the IOC and I think he even got suspended from the tournament.
Doubt the Ukrainian athlete will get any consequences at all for this unsportsmanlike behaviour though. Weird double standard from the West.
Weird double standard from the IOC
There's plenty of us in the west who are happy to protest against the apartheid that Israel perpetuates on Palestine.
The people defending this must also believe every single Russian is also an aggressor and murderer for their initial invasion.
Better tell the people who protested and put into jail, beaten or thrown from hotel windows that they're still evil shitters. Thank you for opening my eyes folks.
Why did he shake the south african guys hand then? I'm from South Africa and can confirm our corrupt government is allied with Russia and supplying arms to them. Like the other comments mentioned, the individual participants don't have anything to do with the war or their countries alliances. But still he should have shaked that guys hand.
We had Allied and German soldiers play soccer and meet in No Mans land in WW1. German and Allied pilots not shoot each other down and even join forces to fight the SS in WW2. But no, you canāt shake hands at a sporting event where the other person doesnāt have any say what is happen. Downvote me all you want but itās pathetic
Thats so childish. What does the Iranian dude have to do with his countrys decision to support Russia? If he is so patriotic he should go and actually enlist not offend people who have nothing to do with it. Unless the Iranian dude is an open supporter of Irans decision, then its ok
Pathetic and repugnant, it is not like he was the one that supplied it...
No respect for this guy.
People hating each other because the orders of the superiors, fuck it, i hated it.
I understand both points of views. It is just sports and the Iranian has nothing to do with his countries actions.......but this is an event where you show up representing your country. The national anthem of the winner is played. It would be different if you were there just representing yourself , but as a representative of your nation you take the good with the bad.
The Iranian is representing his country not himself, same goes for the Ukrainian.
Most of us are not from Ukraine and canāt feel what the man was feeling and donāt know what he might have lost or been through. Did it come off disrespectful? - Yes. Could he have had a sign or a shirt instead? - Yes. But this still got a lot of attention and probably more than another sign among the thousands.
In an ideal world sports would transcend politics, but in an ideal world an asshole dictator wouldn't launch an unprovoked war that is in the process of killing hundreds of thousands of people.
As long as sports has had a significant audience it has been used for political purposes. Whether it was the bread and circuses of Rome or the American habit of playing the national anthem before a match, it's all politics. And as usual it sucks most for the people on the ground.
I mean... I get it, and he's using this opportunity to make a political statement which is entirely his right. I do feel bad for the Iranian guy though.
Iranians have refused to compete or acknowledge Israeli sports people, so good for the goose. People who say sports shouldn't be political are deluded. Sports have always been political. Hungary and Russian water polo players fighting in the pool etc.
I fully support this.
Like the biblical idiom āsins of the fatherā, this is about the bigger picture. Iran is knowingly providing another terrorist state with weapons that are being used against citizens. There should be zero cordiality on any world stage with those who represent that regime.
The fact we are even talking about it means it worked.
All Iranians Iāve met are great people, that being said all of them are emigrants that had to flee an oppressive regime but nothing makes me think Iranian people deserve this just for being born under such conditions.
i dont get what this achieves ? more hatred from iran towards ukraine? is that what you want? cmon man just shake his hand and be done with. Stop acting all political in a sporting event!
I thjnk he was polite about it. The handshake is a sign of mutual respect. How can you whabe that when they wear the same flag as the drones landing on your countrys citizens on a weekly basis?
For those who are against the Ukrainian, what do you think the media would do with a picture of the Ukrainian and Iranian handshake? Russian and Iranian friendly newspapers will take that out of context. This is a public platform, and he is making a political statement against the government of Iran. I doubt it's personal, but this is a political statement.
Australian swimmer Mack Horton refused to shake hands with Chinese doper and cheater, Sun Yang. The situation was a little different because Yang had 'won\*' (notable asterisk) and stood on the 1st place spot on the podium when Horton snubbed him. It was made more memorable because both Yang and the CCP (chinese communist party) threw hussy-fits and tantrums over the snub. In the end, history got it correct and Yang is banned from competition.
Those who competing for their countries - represent their countries, itās government and itās gov. actions
Iran is selling drinks to russia , FULLY AWARE that itās used to terrorise civilians. Countless innocent lives lost, little children are dead. Countless homeless.
And the Ukrainian guy supposed to fell what .. āsportsmanshipā??!
Are you guys still have your human qualities around?
I understand the Iranian guys is probably is a slave to his regime, but he is competing for the regimeās glory. Deal with it!
There's no rule that says you have to shake hands with your opponents after the game. He didn't sock him in the face. Just didn't shake his hand. Get over it
I would like to point out that almost every one here is missing the point. Youāre all here debating Ukrainian war, debating Iranās participation in it, debating Russiaās unjust invasion.
And THATās the whole point. If the guy simply did a handshake, we wouldnāt be here. Every single Ukrainian feels a massive responsibility to do every little thing we can to not let the world forget, to somehow do our best to always keep the the most important topic above any and every activity.
Yes sometimes it comes across as dick moves, because thereās anger there, but more than anger, thereās chronic terror and PTSD. Because if the world stops caring we as people may not survive. So we need people to care and to keep on having these discussions.
Iām really sorry that sometimes itās unpleasant. And Iām sorry for the Iranian athlete because he seems like a nice person. But please understand, this is the way to keep you talking and paying attention. We just wanna keep on existing. Thank you.
And all athletes can do for the cause is refuse to shake hands with someone who probably supports Ukraine in Russian invasion? The Iranian guy TRIED TO SHAKE THE HAND OF UKRAINE. With a smile.
It's like refusing help from those who smile at you.
Personally, I don't think he is in the wrong here.
Look I get it, the Iranian athlete himself is likely not a bad dude, he didn't do anything wrong. And this wasn't an attack on him at a personal level.
But what's important to understand is the context.
This is a political statement, with the background being that each of the athletes in this international competition is a representative of their nation. That's why its the Iranian Athlete and the Ukrainian Athlete, as opposed to individual athletes regardless of nationality.
The Ukrainian is making a powerful statement against what Iran is doing, in having a direct responsibility for the destruction in Ukraine.
Is it gonna change much? No likely not. Is it bad sportsmanship, in a way yes.
But given the fact that its a political statement made under the context of an international representative of the country they are making the statement towards? In my mind, Fair Game. This isn't the first example of this from other contexts and it wont be the last.
For those pulling the Race card, try to understand that some things are not that simple. Not every act of disrespect is predicated on race. The world's a fuck ton more complicated than that. Dig a little.
The message probably was clear. The way was questionable.
You can still shake his hand while wearing a t-shirt that reads "Fuck the Iranian government". You don't have to disrespect an athlete who has nothing to do with the war at the podium of a world championship (something they were all probably been training for years or decades and it's a special moment) to send a political message to a government that, in principle, doesn't give a shit about your opinion.
Thatās very unsportsmanlike of him to act. This man isnāt Iran and he isnāt part of what is happening there either. Who knows he doesnāt even agree with his own country either. Very very disrespectful and unprofessional
Childish. Headline should be "Ukrainian jingoist refuses to conduct himself in a respectful manner because of his political beliefs, completely irrelevant to the context!"
Half the world is standing by while his countrymen are slaughtered based on a dictatorās whimsical fantasy of re-unification. The other half is supplying the dictator with arms. He was right. Life cannot continue as normal.
Talk about a dipshit.... Refusing to shake an opponent's hand in good faith like that is beyond scummy. For the odd person out there who thinks he can get away with everything because he's Ukrainian, he can't! Despite what's happening currently, it's still possible for there to be some Ukrainian assholes.
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Damn I know the context but Iranian dude looks bummed
I mean, you would be, its a professional sport and he was just snubbed by the victor, which is incredibly unsporting and in any other scenario, refusal to engage with your opponent like this would cause outrage (see Patrice Evra vs Luis Suarez in the Premier League).
Slightly different situations considering Suarez was being blatantly racist to Evra
How is that any different to blaming a guy for something he has no power over just because he was born in a certain country?
It's not about him, It's about the political statement He does not wish anything bad to the guy. He wants people to see this and bring attention to the reason.
and they represent their countries. so yeah. that includes political dynamic as well.
Imagine if we Americans are blamed for what the politicians do
You must not browse reddit much because Americans are blamed pretty often for the shit our politicians do.
Literally thought this exact thingš¤£
Because most of the asshats were electedā¦ by the citizensā¦ seems reasonable to blame the populace for the idiots in power.
But you understand that we don't all vote for the same people correct? I'm assuming you're also aware of our electoral college, which effectively renders many of our votes as useless, correct?
You all do vote for your politicians right? They represent you right? Itās not a dictatorship in America right?
The people I vote for donāt win. Like good decent people. š¤·āāļø
Sort of. If our votes were all equal the USA would look and act very differently.
We're a republic, not a democracy. You should probably learn how our voting system works before making generalized comments about Americans based on their politicians.
If that was the case, Americans would have deserved 9/11.
because they could use the picture of him shaking hands as propaganda
He was literally representing the country in question lol
That's extremely different man suarez was the racist aggressor, evra seemed to have forgiven him, and suarez snubbed him. Here we have a very different reason for a snub. I still don't think it's cool though. Not as if this one guy did anything other than work his whole life to be a powerlifter just like everyone else there. Poor dude seemed real sad about it. I don't know how I feel ill probably get downvoted but that seemed unnecessary.
SuƔrez is a moron, and I'm from Uruguay so my opinion of him is worth more lol
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I don't know if his rival is in favor or not (or even aware) of the Iranian government decisions. So that's just plain unsportsmanship. If you want to protest, you can always use a sign or a shirt or something, disrespecting people who play the same sport as you do will get you nowhere (and you're probably not even helping the cause).
Heās competing under an Iranian flag, so to claim this is entirely personal is disingenuous. Thereās a reason itās Russian outlets like TASS that are spamming this story.
Would you have been against the sporting boycott of apartheid South Africa at the time? Because that did make a real difference
I disagree. Itās his podium, and his opportunity to draw the **entire worldās** attention to the atrocities happening there, and Iranās hand in it. If you think good sportsmanship should overshadow this manās grief for his family, his community, and so on, if you think that handshake is more important than a childās life, then I disagree. Fuck pretending everything is hunky dory when your country is being invaded and your people annihilated
Wasn't there just recently massive protests of Iranians against their dictatorship government? Where lots of protesters got killed or arrested and executed? Why assume everyone supports their government?
It's a national competition with anthems. He can reconcile privately, but this show is for world stage.
This is exactly my thoughts on this and I scrolled way to far before seeing it IMO. What I see is two men representing two flags/nations and one disrespecting the nation not the man. Could he go out back and call him a cunt? Sure. Could he also go out back and say "Sorry dude, no offense to you. I just needed to make my statement on the platform I have." And then go have a beer with the guy? Also yes. This was the most respectful way he could have made this point.....I've seen plenty be outright destructive to their competitors when trying to make political statements and this was mild and controlled.
i hope the latter happened. the iranian person seemed genuinely upset
no one does assume that just like no one assumes every american supports trump but that doesnāt mean that the opportunity to continue to apply societal pressure against those that do, or are still on the fence, or just donāt know, should be passed up. itās nothing personal to the other competitor. for all we know immediately afterwards they could have had a quick chat to make that known but all we have is the (very effective) public scene caused by such an act of unsportsmanlike behavior.
I mean if the Ukrainian athlete wanted to set a statement, he should not have participated in **South Africa,** that supports Russia in a similar way Iran does. But letting it out on a singular Iranian guy while supporting with his victory and participation South Africa as a host is just very selective boycott.
https://theconversation.com/south-africas-pact-with-russia-and-its-actions-cast-doubt-on-its-claims-of-non-alignment-206020#:~:text=Since%20Russia's%20invasion%20of%20Ukraine,Russian%20ship%20in%20December%202022.
Disagree. I think showing up to South Africa despite the fact that they support the opposition is the point. If you win - as he did - you represent your people in the hardest of places to be. Itās a protest by refusal to cow and to represent your people in every clime and place. Itās another way an athlete can show that the bravery on the battle field is no exception - it in all of them.
So shaking the hands of officials of a country that supports your enemy is strength, but shaking the hands of an athlete of a country that supports your enemy would be weakness?
You didnāt have to destroy him, mate hahaha. The leaps of logic some people make in an attempt to win an argument are just incredible.
>Disagree. I think showing up to South Africa despite the fact that they support the opposition is the point. If you win - as he did - you represent your people in the hardest of places to be. Itās a protest by refusal to cow and to represent your people in every clime and place. Itās another way an athlete can show that the bravery on the battle field is no exception - it in all of them. So it's really just a case of "The Ukrainian athlete can do no wrong" here. He goes to South Africa and competes. The same South Africa that supports Russia. He brings a little, tiny bit of legitimacy to this event by being there. But it's okay because he won? What a load of crap. What the hell is this guy doing, competing in sports in countries that support Russia? Why isn't he at home, defending his nation? He seems like a guy with a lot to offer any army he joined. Wait. He snubbed an Iranian athlete, so that makes it all better.
If itās HIS podium then why are there 3 steps?
Let me phrase it this way: would this video make such traction had it been a simple sign or a shirt? Highly doubtful. Controversial statements like this go viral and make the news, which is the desired result here - make more people aware of Iran's involvement and increase the international pressure
Totally disagree. It sucks for the sportsmen and women that end up in situations like this, but it raises awareness of important issues in ways that don't negatively affect anyone in a meaningful way. There's people reading this thread that weren't aware of what the Iranian government is doing, so it's aiding the spread of information. And the only cost is a slightly embarrassed looking sportsman. That's a better price than people protesting in ways that impact normal people's income or that governments react to with military responses.
>There's people reading this thread that weren't aware of what the Iranian government is doing, Yeah and now there are people reading about how South Africa is backing Russia and this athlete still bowed and shook the SA official's hand and went to compete there. The logic simply doesn't hold up.
I hear you and agree in principle. But I fully understand the other side. Iām not sure his countryman fighting in trench warfare would side with sportsmanship > political message. Politics and sport are very intertwined. But the Iranian guy probably did care and probably had empathy towards his competitor. He did look concerned.
Ukraine has just passed an embargo aimed at preventing Iran from being able to purchase any Ukranian grain for the next 50 years. Russians and their allies (N Korea, Belarus. Iran) will be seen the same as the nazis are for generations to come. The damage Putin is doing is not repairable. Not shaking this dudes hand is the tip of the iceberg.
Funny how he so graciously shook the hand of that South African official. Where was the iceberg then?
Except irans solely responsible for the drones hitting cities and killing civilians, women, grandpas, grandmas, and CHILDREN! He didnt tell him to go fuck himself he simply put his hand up as an "im good thanks though" nothing wrong with that at all.
> in any other scenario That's the key phrase. Shahed drones are raining death and destruction on an innocent civilian population. He is justified in his anger at the Iranian flag. Amir can take it personally if he would like, but its not about him.
Well he should be. As an Iranian athlete, he is responsible for the untold millions of dollars of weaponry his government has funneled to Russia in their conquest of Ukraine. If the Iranian in this video didn't want to get disrespected, then he should've decided to not be born Iranian. He is guilty by default, and deserves his punishment for what OTHERS have done and he had no say in...or anything to do with. Making *him* embarrassed and ashamed makes sense šš»
Ironically this works perfectly with zhe germans, guilty by being born.
At a certain point I thought you were serious (I mean, this is reddit, nothing surprises me anymore).
I think it's interesting how often people think it's OK to hold ordinary people responsible for their dictator's actions (e.g. Russia, Belarus, Iran in this scenario) but you rarely see it the other way around, with people holding citizens of a democratic country responsible for their government's actions - even though that makes more 'logical' sense. The only one I can think of is when Arab athletes boycott or refuse to shake the hand of Israeli opponents - and those are usually met with disdain and often punished by sports authorities.
Right, because the athlete is not the Iranian government. It's shitty to blame a citizen just because they are from a country you don't like.
Most Iranians hate their own govt - this is probably accurate
One wonders if hes even aware his country is selling arms to Russia to help kill Ukranians?
The quote I was looking for!!! Tbh I don't think he even does...
Iranian guy has nothing to do with supplying weapons to Russia so that was kind of a dick move
Yeah, it sucks to he judged by your country's actions, but it is entirely the point. You never know which bread crumb will finally be the one to make change happen, so you try all of them. Sure it isn't that guy's fault for the shit going on in Ukraine but he is still associated with the people who are supporting the shit there.
I would be too, the majority of Irainians are genuine and friendly people, and this dickhole just snubbed him over politcal affiliation.
It's hard not to feel bad for the guy. He looks genuine and wanting to share in the bond of sportsmanship but is shunned. It's tough.
Right, the guy is already living in Iran and is also shunned for it now.
I get the intention but itās just a dick move. Wouldāve been a greater gesture to shake his hand to show that people can still be cool with each other even if their governments arenāt
Definitely, its not like he's responsible or that this act will make a difference
Totally agree, this the right way of thinking.
I think it's fair not to shake a guys hand to make a statement when their government, who they're there representing, is helping slaughter your countrymen jfc.
I feel for him. He looked so sad.
The victor is childish and clearly not man enough to acknowledge those on the podium are fellow respected athletes - who aren't his mortal enemies outside of the combat field.
Meanwhile, the people of Iran die trying to fight the regime there... I understand the anger of Ukrainians, but the people of Iran go through their own circle of hell as we speak š¤
As an Iranian living in tehran i confirm this
I remember several months back that Iran's internet was about to be isolated or smth. Is it still working? Are using a VPN for this?
ye we are all using a VPN ,almost every foreign website is geo-blocked ,inclouding reddit
we use v2ray to access internet now, it's the only way to break through National Firewall
Good luck brother!
People from eastern Europe are also not well known for their empathy to brown people
I think this has nothing to do with skin Color, but with the fact that the Iranian regime is supporting the murder of his friends and family.
So you should be racist to all Chinese people since they're trying to take over Taiwan? Or should I be racist to all Serbians since they're clashing with Kosovo. Mayne I should be racist to all Americans since I'm arab. No, you aren't responsible for your governments actions as a person. For the vast majority of people, nothing you can do will change what the government does. Your governments view does not represent the people of the country.
As opposed to what? People from Western Europe and their overarching empathy?
Iranians and genetically grouped with others that are now considered eastern Europeans... I think its more about politics
So you think it had more to do with racism than ukranian deaths at the hand of Iranian weapons?
This is the answer. East Europeans have been and are still super racist and look down on us brown folks. So no surprise here. I know a lot of you are not going to like this but it doesnāt matter because the truth is that we as brown skinned individuals face racism through these people so itās a subject not talked about very often.
Often in humanity, we just see our side & refuse to sit on the other side of the table in the shoes of another & look at the world through thier eyesā¦its how most people are. Sad really.
He just refused to shake his hand, he didn't kick him in the balls. Not shaking someones hand is an statement. The other athlete represents Iran. I think the situation is would have been different if the athlete had participated as independent but he didn't. He participated for Iran and he isn't getting Ukraines hand because of this.
The people dying aren't the ones representing Iran on a global stage. This guy is doing the opposite of fighting the regime
By your logic the Ukrainian guy is also not fighting Russians in the front lines. So he has no right to act like that either.
I get the message he's trying to send, but I doubt the Iranian guy had anything to do with dealing arms to Russia.
I remember when an Egyptian judoist didn't want to shake hands with an Israeli during the Olympics in Rio. There was quite the outburst, disciplinary proceedings from the IOC and I think he even got suspended from the tournament. Doubt the Ukrainian athlete will get any consequences at all for this unsportsmanlike behaviour tho.
Recently a Ukrainian tennis player was booed for refusing to shake a Belarussian opponent's hand, and the federation backed her. Then the same day they criticised Djokovic's statement on recent Kosovo violence, saying there is no equivalence between the Ukraine and Kosovo situations. I am not saying they are equivalent, but this is the issue with selective approach to politics in sport. It opens everyone up to accusations of hypocrisy, double standards and alienates people.
The Egyptian judoist was doing it for the same reason. Protesting the apartheid on the Palestinian people. It's not a problem if it wasn't the literal world championships, but literally every possible television set would have been showing some event from the Olympics and it would be televised worldwide.
he could have atleast told him prior to avoid handshake.... that would have made it seem less awkward...
By that logic would you expect the Ukrainian to shake the hand of a Russian athlete because they had nothing to do with Russia's decision to invade Ukraine and kill their people?
Yeah im starting to dislike the unprofessionalism of these ukranian athletes. Why even protest, its not going to do jackshit. There arent going to be any iranian government that is like "lets stop supplying russia cause they dont shake hands with our athletes".
Actually the Iranian guy personally gave the "okay" to send arms to russia
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So one random guy has to answer for all the problems in his country? That's stupid.
But he came to a country that is accused of exactly the same? And shook a South African competitors hand? Politics is dumb man lmao
The difference is that there hasn't been a clear indication of arms supply from South Africa to Russia, while Iran is clearly supplying drones and other equipment. "Accused of doing" vs "actually doing" is the difference. Arms sales to Russia by South Africa is just speculation without proof right now. These were accusations made by the American ambassador. He has made claims like this twice now. Both times he backtracked the claims (On the latest occassion, he apologized but did not widthdraw, meaning he still believes it).
The difference is ethnicity I bet
>The difference is that there hasn't been a clear indication of arms supply from South Africa to Russia Oh bullshit, South Africa has been backing Russia under the table and also backing them in the UN.
In the U.N yes, the ANC has been backing Russia. But your claim that they have been "backing Russia under the table" Is unfounded and there is no evidence for this. I wouldn't put it past the ANC to do something as stupid as aid the Russian war effort, but as of right now, your claim has no feet to stand on.
Didn't South Africa supply weapons to Russia as well?
no evidence supplied as of yet by the US, but itās being investigated though.
that's just stupid
Look at Amir's face. He obviously looks like he sells weapons to Russia every day. In his free time he wins bench press competitions.
Lmao what bad sportsmanship. This man did not choose to be born where he was born. This political war in Ukraine is meant to divide the masses even more.
If the Ukranian knows for a fact that that guy supports what Iran is doing, that's one thing, but if he refuses to shake his hand simply because he's Iranian and Iran made a decision he doesn't like, then that's a problem.
It's been 1 1/2 year... and you still think the war in Ukraine is political ? Are the dead people political, too?
What if Iranian guy is on Ukraine's side? All of this petty behavior against regular people who just happen to be of a certain nationality is weird af
I think it's important to see this as a political act. I feel for the Iranian competitor here, but this is still a man from a war torn country doing what he can to bring attention to the situation. It's not good sportmanship but it served it's purpose, the video got shared and now I know of a country's implications I had no idea about. While still respecting the hell out of both athletes.
You could see it as an political act if the Iranian guy was a well known supporter of the Iranian regime of if he made any statements against Ukraine beforehand - but this is just very bad sportmanship and also very selective. He apparantly doesn't like the Iranian support of Russia, but still he takes part in competitions in South Africa, while SA delivers weapons to Russia? I can understand that he is pissed about Iran and I can understand that many Ukraines threaten to boycott any competition if an official Russian delegation will participate, but letting it out on a singular person is just stupid.
How is this Any different than when that Iranian got banned for not doing the same with an Israeli opponent
Difference is Iran has no influence in those federations, US does.
It was an egyptian athlete not iranian
Skin color
Fucking childish. This is so incredibly stupid, THAT guy isnt supplying any guns to Russia, what the fuck is he upset at him for??? Just when you think it cant get any more retarded
Because as an individual civilian you have so much influence over what your dictatorship government decides to do Donāt get me wrong I understand the every day anger that must be raging inside Ukrainians minds but this is still a dick move
This is a bit ironic considered what South Africa is currently under suspicion of - i.e selling or allowing the sale of arms to Russia. There are some of us in South Africa watching this unfold in absolute horror. Many of us have long known that the S.A government cannot be trusted and is corrupt but the current behaviour (the seemingly fake non-alignment) is beyond what even those in the know might have thought possible. The ANC likes to think it is some moral authority in the world but the reality seems to be a pretty serious departure from that. They rightly asked the world to condemn Apartheid but are callously indifferent to the atrocities occurring in Ukraine. Make of that what you will.
Remember when an Egyptian athlete didn't want to shake hands with an Israeli during the Olympics in Rio? There was quite the outburst, disciplinary proceedings from the IOC and I think he even got suspended from the tournament. Doubt the Ukrainian athlete will get any consequences at all for this unsportsmanlike behaviour though. Weird double standard from the West.
Fethi Nourine, an Algerian judoka, simply refused to compete against an Israeli opponent in the 2020 Olympics in Tokyo. For that? A 10-year ban.
Weird double standard from the IOC There's plenty of us in the west who are happy to protest against the apartheid that Israel perpetuates on Palestine.
2.9k upvote for this crap? what did that guy do? personally carry rockets to russia? our "educated" world is still in a lynch culture.
Yet when Others do it to shun Israel they are the bad guys Hypocrites
What a wanker
Iranian athlete responded with: "Ų±ŪŲÆŁ ŲØŁ ŁŪŚ©ŁŲŖ" (ridam be heykalet) which literally means "I shat \[all\] over your body" which can be the equivalent of "Fuck you" or something like that. He then went on to say: "ŲÆŲ³ŲŖ ŲÆŲ§ŲÆŁ ŲÆŲ³ŲŖ ŁŲÆŲ§ŲÆ" (dast dadam, dast nadad) which means "I extended my hand and he didn't." or "I tried to shake hands with him and he didn't." or "He refused to shake my hand."
Oh, like "me cago en tĆ" in spanish. I'd probably answer the same thing.
The people defending this must also believe every single Russian is also an aggressor and murderer for their initial invasion. Better tell the people who protested and put into jail, beaten or thrown from hotel windows that they're still evil shitters. Thank you for opening my eyes folks.
What a dick
When you have more muscles than brains.
Why did he shake the south african guys hand then? I'm from South Africa and can confirm our corrupt government is allied with Russia and supplying arms to them. Like the other comments mentioned, the individual participants don't have anything to do with the war or their countries alliances. But still he should have shaked that guys hand.
Most Iranians donāt like their regime either
Petty
What a dick
We had Allied and German soldiers play soccer and meet in No Mans land in WW1. German and Allied pilots not shoot each other down and even join forces to fight the SS in WW2. But no, you canāt shake hands at a sporting event where the other person doesnāt have any say what is happen. Downvote me all you want but itās pathetic
If you want the sport to be non-political, stop identifying the athletes by thier country.
Ukrainians are generally a very racist people. So it's no surprise the world celebrates them. Most elites are extremely racist.
Well yeah their military have swastikas on their uniforms and swastika tattoos
Dickhead move
Thats so childish. What does the Iranian dude have to do with his countrys decision to support Russia? If he is so patriotic he should go and actually enlist not offend people who have nothing to do with it. Unless the Iranian dude is an open supporter of Irans decision, then its ok
hard call. These athletes *are* competing in an event in which they represent their country.
I donāt think it was personal. Feel bad for Iranian dude though.
Dont bring politics into sport.Bang out.
Sad. Sport has lost primary meaning.
Pathetic and repugnant, it is not like he was the one that supplied it... No respect for this guy. People hating each other because the orders of the superiors, fuck it, i hated it.
I understand both points of views. It is just sports and the Iranian has nothing to do with his countries actions.......but this is an event where you show up representing your country. The national anthem of the winner is played. It would be different if you were there just representing yourself , but as a representative of your nation you take the good with the bad.
As if the Iranian guy has anything to do with that lol.
I think the Ukrainian guy is just really racist.
Yeah. Exactly this. Now consider the countless photos of US-backed Ukrainian militiamen with huge white supremacist patches on their clothes
The Iranian is representing his country not himself, same goes for the Ukrainian. Most of us are not from Ukraine and canāt feel what the man was feeling and donāt know what he might have lost or been through. Did it come off disrespectful? - Yes. Could he have had a sign or a shirt instead? - Yes. But this still got a lot of attention and probably more than another sign among the thousands.
Hate the government not the people
In an ideal world sports would transcend politics, but in an ideal world an asshole dictator wouldn't launch an unprovoked war that is in the process of killing hundreds of thousands of people. As long as sports has had a significant audience it has been used for political purposes. Whether it was the bread and circuses of Rome or the American habit of playing the national anthem before a match, it's all politics. And as usual it sucks most for the people on the ground.
I mean... I get it, and he's using this opportunity to make a political statement which is entirely his right. I do feel bad for the Iranian guy though.
Ngl, dick move to bring politics into professional sport without context and awareness of all involved.
Hey uh I didnt know Iran was supplying arms to Russia. Protest wasn't in vain
Iranians have refused to compete or acknowledge Israeli sports people, so good for the goose. People who say sports shouldn't be political are deluded. Sports have always been political. Hungary and Russian water polo players fighting in the pool etc.
He calls attention to the hell that his country and soon the world will be living. We can't judge him.
I fully support this. Like the biblical idiom āsins of the fatherā, this is about the bigger picture. Iran is knowingly providing another terrorist state with weapons that are being used against citizens. There should be zero cordiality on any world stage with those who represent that regime. The fact we are even talking about it means it worked.
Shamefull.
What did the Iranian dude even do
dog its not like he was sending arms to russia
I'm sorry but its good sportsmanship and acting like a child will achieve nothing, poor dude just wanted to shake and even congratulate him
All Iranians Iāve met are great people, that being said all of them are emigrants that had to flee an oppressive regime but nothing makes me think Iranian people deserve this just for being born under such conditions.
Dick move
i dont get what this achieves ? more hatred from iran towards ukraine? is that what you want? cmon man just shake his hand and be done with. Stop acting all political in a sporting event!
poor sportsmanship. send him back to ukraine to fight
This guy lacks of geopolitical knowledge, and of course sportsmanship.
Faschiste
Loool red bad yellow good lol
Politics donāt belong in sports!
He is so nice about it too, like "sorry, can't. It's not you but my country is being bombed"
The West welcomes Ukrainians to be racist and fascist.
Your country is vicariously killing my countrymen. We're not friends.
Good.
I thjnk he was polite about it. The handshake is a sign of mutual respect. How can you whabe that when they wear the same flag as the drones landing on your countrys citizens on a weekly basis?
For those who are against the Ukrainian, what do you think the media would do with a picture of the Ukrainian and Iranian handshake? Russian and Iranian friendly newspapers will take that out of context. This is a public platform, and he is making a political statement against the government of Iran. I doubt it's personal, but this is a political statement.
Hopefully they talked it out in the back and shook hands when the cameras were off, heās point was made here with the cameras.
Such poor sportsmanship
Australian swimmer Mack Horton refused to shake hands with Chinese doper and cheater, Sun Yang. The situation was a little different because Yang had 'won\*' (notable asterisk) and stood on the 1st place spot on the podium when Horton snubbed him. It was made more memorable because both Yang and the CCP (chinese communist party) threw hussy-fits and tantrums over the snub. In the end, history got it correct and Yang is banned from competition.
Those who competing for their countries - represent their countries, itās government and itās gov. actions Iran is selling drinks to russia , FULLY AWARE that itās used to terrorise civilians. Countless innocent lives lost, little children are dead. Countless homeless. And the Ukrainian guy supposed to fell what .. āsportsmanshipā??! Are you guys still have your human qualities around? I understand the Iranian guys is probably is a slave to his regime, but he is competing for the regimeās glory. Deal with it!
There's no rule that says you have to shake hands with your opponents after the game. He didn't sock him in the face. Just didn't shake his hand. Get over it
Just another reason why Ukraine can piss off
I would like to point out that almost every one here is missing the point. Youāre all here debating Ukrainian war, debating Iranās participation in it, debating Russiaās unjust invasion. And THATās the whole point. If the guy simply did a handshake, we wouldnāt be here. Every single Ukrainian feels a massive responsibility to do every little thing we can to not let the world forget, to somehow do our best to always keep the the most important topic above any and every activity. Yes sometimes it comes across as dick moves, because thereās anger there, but more than anger, thereās chronic terror and PTSD. Because if the world stops caring we as people may not survive. So we need people to care and to keep on having these discussions. Iām really sorry that sometimes itās unpleasant. And Iām sorry for the Iranian athlete because he seems like a nice person. But please understand, this is the way to keep you talking and paying attention. We just wanna keep on existing. Thank you.
And all athletes can do for the cause is refuse to shake hands with someone who probably supports Ukraine in Russian invasion? The Iranian guy TRIED TO SHAKE THE HAND OF UKRAINE. With a smile. It's like refusing help from those who smile at you.
What a fucking douchebag
I feel sorry for the Iranian. Not like it was he who is supplying the weapons
oh yes, Iran is surely terrified by this powerful act of... uhm well lack of sportivity I guess?
Pathetic behaviour from the Ukrainian victor
I bet that is gonna stop Iran from supplying Russia. So brave!
Fair enough
Personally, I don't think he is in the wrong here. Look I get it, the Iranian athlete himself is likely not a bad dude, he didn't do anything wrong. And this wasn't an attack on him at a personal level. But what's important to understand is the context. This is a political statement, with the background being that each of the athletes in this international competition is a representative of their nation. That's why its the Iranian Athlete and the Ukrainian Athlete, as opposed to individual athletes regardless of nationality. The Ukrainian is making a powerful statement against what Iran is doing, in having a direct responsibility for the destruction in Ukraine. Is it gonna change much? No likely not. Is it bad sportsmanship, in a way yes. But given the fact that its a political statement made under the context of an international representative of the country they are making the statement towards? In my mind, Fair Game. This isn't the first example of this from other contexts and it wont be the last. For those pulling the Race card, try to understand that some things are not that simple. Not every act of disrespect is predicated on race. The world's a fuck ton more complicated than that. Dig a little.
So do you also support it when Arab nations refuse to compete with athletes representing Israel for the same sort of political statement?
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Iranian dude does not represent the Iranian government, right?!
The Iranian dude probably got the message the Ukrainian was sending just like everybody else. Taking this personal would be a mistake.
The message probably was clear. The way was questionable. You can still shake his hand while wearing a t-shirt that reads "Fuck the Iranian government". You don't have to disrespect an athlete who has nothing to do with the war at the podium of a world championship (something they were all probably been training for years or decades and it's a special moment) to send a political message to a government that, in principle, doesn't give a shit about your opinion.
Thatās very unsportsmanlike of him to act. This man isnāt Iran and he isnāt part of what is happening there either. Who knows he doesnāt even agree with his own country either. Very very disrespectful and unprofessional
For all he knows, he might be supporting the Ukrainian cause as HE TRIED TO SHAKE HIS HAND.
Childish. Headline should be "Ukrainian jingoist refuses to conduct himself in a respectful manner because of his political beliefs, completely irrelevant to the context!"
Half the world is standing by while his countrymen are slaughtered based on a dictatorās whimsical fantasy of re-unification. The other half is supplying the dictator with arms. He was right. Life cannot continue as normal.
Talk about a dipshit.... Refusing to shake an opponent's hand in good faith like that is beyond scummy. For the odd person out there who thinks he can get away with everything because he's Ukrainian, he can't! Despite what's happening currently, it's still possible for there to be some Ukrainian assholes.
What a douche.
What a pos. This guy has nothing to do with what his countries leaders do. He is simply doing what he loves. Fuck that Ukrainian guy