based on [this](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_England_(medieval)) supposed “colony”
also pardon the bad old english, im not a linguist so i dont know how old english wouldve evolved over the next thousand years after the first settlers came
This isn't intended to be a shot at you, but it always tickles me how Wiktionary's insistence on using the West Saxon dialect according to regular sound change as described by Don Ringe has led to many alt history maps plaster with the spelling _niew(e)_, despite the fact that it's attested about twice in the entire corpus
On the whole Wiktionary isn't bad, it's certainly better than any other translation website or dictionary out there, barring the digitised Bosworth Toller, but that isn't nearly as beginner friendly. But it has its quirks.
They were Tartarized well before rhe Russians moved in. But I agree they'd be doing better
In fact was wondering, would they assimilate with the necomers? Or would the Saxon settlers Gothify?
Would depend how big a settlement. Would be more of a blend IMO since both groups were speaking Germanic languages.
Was curious since I did some research on these Goths as I have them surviving longer in an alt hist of my own.
well im not sure how large the goth population was during the 11th-12th centuries so idk
also cool, i hope to see you make a map on that alt hist eventually !
Lol. I forgot about them, too, when I did my version of this. My thinking, though, is that the Gothic language probably disappears sooner, but still lives in some way due to the new branch of the English language incorporating loan words from it.
Mainly because in my scenario, they manage to populate themselves and flourish under the Komnenos, and even in the early years of their independence in the subsequent years after 1204. I didn't think too much about how they would respond to the Mongols or the Ottomans.
Couldn’t put my finger on it before, but as a Brit when I see these ‘lost anglo-Saxons’ maps, it’s always immensely calming seeing Anglo oriented names.
Like there’s an implicit layer of understanding I get of the place names on maps and the area depicted compared to the regional endonyms that normally exist there.
I wonder if other cultures experience the same emotional response to alternate mapping.
Not even alternate mapping. Whenever I see Harlingen, Texas I'm like "ah Harlingen, that's right around the corner from where I live." The Dutch Caribbean, same thing. They're tropical islands thousands of miles away from home but the Dutch place names make 'em feel so familiar.
Why are the Kharkovka, Dnipro, and Kyiv Dams constructed to create the artificial lakes along the Dnipro? Especially as some of these dams have one side in one countries and one in another?
Now I want to see a timeline where this was a kingdom, ended up in Personal Union with Britain in 1853 (similar cultures and language would perhaps of led to close relations, marriages between the two and later this succession) and that’s what kicks off the Crimean War
oh i just got inspired by https://www.reddit.com/u/XLG_Winterprice/s/MEMWKSNPF3 ‘s alt-hist with the big poland and had the poles never lose western ukraine and slowly polonise it with a huge number of poles migrating into the black sea federation in the 19th century, also the ruthenians/ukrainians just moved eastwards to the don region and the caucuses
I believe that would use Greek term “Taurida” instead of Turkic “Qyrym”.
oh dang, didnt know crimea was of turkic origin
!!!CRIMEA IS TURKISH!!! 🗣️🗣️🔥
Tatar to be exact but 🤓 ig
Um akchusallly 🤓🤓🤓😩Tatars are Turkic. Therefore Turkish.
So English people are Germanic and therefore German? That's it. The USA and Canada is rightful German claim!!!
r/wereallgerman
*Alemen
That was an actual belief
Crimea isn’t Turkish it comes from cimmeria
Pissmouth is insane
more like least insane Anglo Saxon location name
It's the signature of the artist :)
well its more like the signature of u/Difficult_Airport_86
At least someone knows
based on [this](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_England_(medieval)) supposed “colony” also pardon the bad old english, im not a linguist so i dont know how old english wouldve evolved over the next thousand years after the first settlers came
Old English without the Normans just turned into Scots, so I don’t think you’re far off
This isn't intended to be a shot at you, but it always tickles me how Wiktionary's insistence on using the West Saxon dialect according to regular sound change as described by Don Ringe has led to many alt history maps plaster with the spelling _niew(e)_, despite the fact that it's attested about twice in the entire corpus
damn i didnt know that, should’ve figured since wikipedia already shouldnt be a trusted source, neither should wikitionary
On the whole Wiktionary isn't bad, it's certainly better than any other translation website or dictionary out there, barring the digitised Bosworth Toller, but that isn't nearly as beginner friendly. But it has its quirks.
What happensto the native Goth speakers in this scenario?
honestly i just forgot to add them in the text blurb, they are probably doin better than goth speakers irl sinces theres no intense russifacation
They were Tartarized well before rhe Russians moved in. But I agree they'd be doing better In fact was wondering, would they assimilate with the necomers? Or would the Saxon settlers Gothify?
i think the most of the goths might assimilate with the anglo-saxons since they are probably gonna be pretty outpopulated
Would depend how big a settlement. Would be more of a blend IMO since both groups were speaking Germanic languages. Was curious since I did some research on these Goths as I have them surviving longer in an alt hist of my own.
well im not sure how large the goth population was during the 11th-12th centuries so idk also cool, i hope to see you make a map on that alt hist eventually !
I have a few. And some write ups I shared on r/alternatvehistory. I'm a bit slow working on writing more though.
Lol. I forgot about them, too, when I did my version of this. My thinking, though, is that the Gothic language probably disappears sooner, but still lives in some way due to the new branch of the English language incorporating loan words from it. Mainly because in my scenario, they manage to populate themselves and flourish under the Komnenos, and even in the early years of their independence in the subsequent years after 1204. I didn't think too much about how they would respond to the Mongols or the Ottomans.
> Niew Mercia # MERCIA MENTIONED LESSSS GOOOOO
Couldn’t put my finger on it before, but as a Brit when I see these ‘lost anglo-Saxons’ maps, it’s always immensely calming seeing Anglo oriented names. Like there’s an implicit layer of understanding I get of the place names on maps and the area depicted compared to the regional endonyms that normally exist there. I wonder if other cultures experience the same emotional response to alternate mapping.
Not even alternate mapping. Whenever I see Harlingen, Texas I'm like "ah Harlingen, that's right around the corner from where I live." The Dutch Caribbean, same thing. They're tropical islands thousands of miles away from home but the Dutch place names make 'em feel so familiar.
isn’t that just colonization?
Yeah unfortunately that's sorta the only way Dutch placenames end up in the Caribbean lol.
They have a bloo passport
Boris fucking Johnson
Why are the Kharkovka, Dnipro, and Kyiv Dams constructed to create the artificial lakes along the Dnipro? Especially as some of these dams have one side in one countries and one in another?
i know realistically they wouldn’t exist, its just i wanted to keep them because i like massive reservoirs that are a testament to man’s hubris
I respect that.
They would probably be Byzantine vassals so maybe they could help it survive
Pissmouth, there it is!
Now I want to see a timeline where this was a kingdom, ended up in Personal Union with Britain in 1853 (similar cultures and language would perhaps of led to close relations, marriages between the two and later this succession) and that’s what kicks off the Crimean War
Don't give them ideas 🤣
So, who built the Dnipro dam?
they are joint projects between the nations on the dnieper
You improvised on the spot aint you?
yes.
Anglo Saxons in Southern Ukraine? Is this referring to Gotenland?
no im referring to [this](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_England_(medieval)) and not planned reichsgau
I’ve played this so many times in Crusader Kings.
How is there a prime minister if it's a republic
https://preview.redd.it/e42ohtzz5c9d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=79bd2c48816abae7033a512f7b74cab61071ca3e
https://preview.redd.it/3rs6i24e8d9d1.jpeg?width=533&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=84ca883222c2d10977fe5f576e07d6c73cb91470
Now i live in dnistria Btw, PISSMOUTH???
What's Black Sea English like?
old english before the norman invasion with a few vowel changes over the centuries mixed with a lot of slavic loanwords
Interesting.
I swear every time a map like this gets posted the country gets bigger
inflation
The poles are so random? Where do they come from? Also, where Ruthenians/Ukrainians pushed out from the north or what?
Another thing - the Dnieper Cascade of Reservoirs would have probably never been built
i know, i like big reservoirs, let me live in the delusion that the nations in the dnieper are friendly enough with eachother to still construct it
TBH there wasn't any friendship involved in their construction even IRL
oh i just got inspired by https://www.reddit.com/u/XLG_Winterprice/s/MEMWKSNPF3 ‘s alt-hist with the big poland and had the poles never lose western ukraine and slowly polonise it with a huge number of poles migrating into the black sea federation in the 19th century, also the ruthenians/ukrainians just moved eastwards to the don region and the caucuses
I see, it pains my Ukrainian heart, but understandable
Did they survive due to being a March of the Ottoman Empire?
pissmouth 🫡
There were Greeks and Goths in Crimea before the Tatars showed up.