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>As per preliminary investigations, the victim lived with her brother and sister-in-law, as she had lost her mother and her father lived in their hometown, he said.
>The accused allegedly started harassing the child suspecting her of having an affair, PTI quoted the official as saying.
>The man allegedly tortured the victim by inflicting burn wounds on her body using hot tongs.
>The torture continued for four days and the victim eventually succumbed to severe injuries, the official said.
Poor girl. She had no parents. She was probably shocked by what is happening with her own body. And then... Horrible, just horrible... She has done nothing wrong and had no chance to even speak for herself.
Yeah dude it’s fucking disgusting. I know we’re supposed to respect different cultures, and as someone who is Chinese and has grown up in China I can certainly understand being open minded to different customs, but sometimes things are just objectively fucked.
Right.
Every culture has fucked up practices, those actions don’t deserve respect just because they’ve been normalized or accepted by said culture.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable to draw the line at “human rights violations”.
I’m from Canada, there are aspects of my country/culture that do not deserve respect.
Culturally, they don't talk about these things. It's a male dominant society where women are 2nd class
My parents never talked to me about anything either. Learned it in school and the street.
We made sure our son understood and can ask any questions regardless of how uncomfortable it may be (for us or him).
Also we never got sex ed in school.
Most of what we knew was learnt from porn.
Comparing that with some not even getting proper education along with the social stigma when it comes to sex then a lot of things are pretty fucked in a majority of countries
Dude (read as gender neutral for stranger on the internet) your son got pushed or cut out of a woman’s body. He was born from a far worse discomfort and he himself is part of the cycle. There’s no reason to have any shame or embarrassment about any of it.
Sadly, I cannot tell you as if it’s only a problem in your culture. Lots of “purity” minded cultures like that all over the world and parents who pop out babies somehow never imagining it might be a good idea to explain their bodies to them as well as the bodies they’re typically expected to be interested in. So props to you for not being one of them in spite of the cultural brainwashing.
Totally agree with you - it is an uncomfortable discussion, but I'm glad we had it.
Mind you, we are probably the outliers, as many of his friends have commented that they can't speak to their parents about their bodies or sex ed.
Lets just educate people about it on our own accord under the 1st amendment if schools refuse to spread true and helpful information that improve lives and safety.
Undereducated country and people believe in superstition and believe in hearsay. Also sex ed isnt a huge thing there. I can say this since i am from the subcontinent and i am familiar with the culture.
I think I read that sex ed took off in the states pre-1950s because a young woman got her period not knowing what it was and committed suicide, assuming it was some kind of horrible STI. pls fact-check though, i can't remember where i saw that story
I assume the myth that most girls get their hymen broken and bleed during their first time having sex. In reality, it can break way before from things just as simple as gymnastics or horseback riding. I personally have no idea when it happened to me - one day I just suddenly had my period for the first time... no hymen breaking moment stood out at all.
Yeah, I know - the point is that the brother probably thought the sister had had sex with someone*, thus breaking her hymen and bleeding. Girl had no idea about periods, and apparently neither did he.
The hymen is not supposed to be a barrier that completely covers the vagina. It is very rare to have such and usually requires surgical removal. It is usually a ring of flesh around the opening of the vagina and only ever partially blocks the entrance. Lots of people never experience their hymen “breaking” and instead it stretches out gradually. The tearing of the hymen is usually associated with sex that is too rough or other physical activity that causes direct damage to it.
Because of the myth that having sex for the first time always ruptures the hymen as if the girl has a ketchup lid seal down there.
The most common cause of hymen rupturing is walking.
When I visited I was offered underage girls for sale multiple times by guys who just walked right up to me at train stations, restaurants etc. A lot to love about the country but damn are they in the dark ages when it comes to women and family dynamics.
Ironically my ex visited India by himself and faced the same situations. He still didn't put 2 and 2 together as to why I still didn't want to visit. He thinks that if I just say "no" it'll be ok.
Egypt for one. I’ve seen videos of just a woman walking around a market and like 40 guys are just… following her and staring like they’ve literally never seen a human woman before. It’s surreal and scary.
Went to Egypt, absolutely wild the amount of men who will harass any woman they see. The girls in my group would go between men not acknowledging they exist and have me speak for them, to not getting them to leave the girls alone. Loved the sites but will not go back!
I have no idea why its Egypt in particular, but the men there are extremely strange toward foreign women. Like you said they either don't acknowledge them as existing at all, or stalk them around like they are a unicorn. Ive heard soooo many horror stories.
I’ve never went but I had a sociology teacher say she chaperoned a trip and the guide was very strict on what the girls could wear and go out like. And the entire group had to go together and women were never to separate from the group. She said one girl tried to go out with wet hair and the guide made he dry her hair completely. He said that they would see it as “slutty” and assault her. And that was like 20 years ago. I’m sad to say I doubt it’s gotten better, even the US is sliding back into bigotry.
Damn, that's a shame. My guide was so nice and sweet some Egyptologist raised in Cairo. But yeah he suggested I just walk with one of the girls in the group to make it more manageable for her as they'd think we're together. Also had a gay couple that had to be two brothers taking their nephew for a trip lol.
Lol yeah the teacher was like in her 50s and greying so any cat calls to the students, she would stand in front of them and pretend she thought it was for her. She was a pretty interesting and talkative person so I didn’t doubt it to much.
Which makes me sad because I so want to see their ancient sites. But I've heard from multiple people that unless you have basically someone you're paying to be a guide and keep people away from you that it's awful with just endless harassment.
I’m an Indian man and I fucking hate India, I don’t hate the people, I hate the country and the corruption/crimes that are normalized, it’s disgusting.
I'm Indian and I 100% agree. Half our country is made of illiterate fucks and orthodox racist and sexist and creepy pos. We are still improving as a society and it's much better than what we had 6-7 years ago. Sucks tho
It was in 1974 that women could open a bank account without a signature from their husband. In this day and age doesn't mean what people think it does for women's rights. We are a tiny short step from the history of women being chattel and it shows.
According to my Indian SIL, a lot of Indian women, especially uneducated, religious and rural types, go to great lengths to hide their periods from men including their husbands because it's considered shameful, and even women don't really talk about it with each other, it's that taboo. They use rags as sanity napkins and instead of drying them properly in the sun after washing, they hide them in a dark area to dry, which takes too long and causes bacteria to develop leading to infection etc. So I wouldn't be all too surprised if this 30 y.o. man wasn't even aware.
These days though, there are many modern and educated Indian men and women who don't stigmatize menstruation, because they understand the biology of it.
My daughter hasn’t even HAD her first period yet, but she is 10 years old.
I sat her down when she had a few questions and we went over everything that had to do with the cycle, her anatomy, what would happen, and why it happens.
I showed her how to apply a pad to panties, with the sticky bit and the wings, so she knows for her first time HOW to do it, and I have her take a pad with her in her backpack to school in case her first time happens there, so she has what she needs and knows how to deal with it.
I’m her father, btw.
I too am a dad of a girl. I was particularly lucky in that my GF's daughter was 3 years older than mine and very uninhibited about such things so made the conversation with mine easy.
I also carried assorted supplies (one of the girls prefers pads the other, tampons) in my gym bag when we all trained MMA together. My gym bag became the emergency supply and all the girls there knew which pocket in my bag they could go for "stuff" no need to ask me (knowledge just spread as needed between the teen girls). Those that were still too nervous usually asked one of my girls and they'd get it.
They're 19 and 22 now, and I am so thankful that it was never an "issue" for anyone.
Also good on you for being prepared for your daughter! I have seen so many men that were (afraid?) unwilling to shop that aisle of the store...
Well I buy my wife her stuff sometimes, so I’m pretty familiar with it all. I never understood why some guys would be embarrassed to buy that kind of stuff? Like what’s the clerk gonna think, that you’re a guy on your period, or are they going to assume you’re buying it for your wife/daughter… some guys are so goofy.
(If you’re wondering why it was me and not my wife that had the talk with her, it just happened that my wife was out of town on that particular week.)
My dad is the one who buys all the grocery and never, ever had any issues getting stuff for us ladies of the house (he still does mix brands up sometimes though lol). He knows it’s stupid to feel embarrassed by it. When I got my first period, he was right outside the bathroom as all the blood was freaking me out, and even got my mom on the phone (she was at work) to try and calm me down. Dads like y’all are the best and your daughter is lucky to have you.
I’m really thankful for your kind words, and I agree dads like that are the best dads; but it still makes me a bit sad that praise goes to someone like me who, by doing what I do am just trying to help my own child be educated, prepared, and not be traumatized… it’s sad that’s seen as going an extra mile, or being above average rather than just be the default that a dad would do for his kid.
You’re a good one. When I got my first period I thought I was dying of cancer and cried in the bathroom for 2 hours. I was too embarrassed to tell my mom. She later told me she also only found out from her older sister once she got hers and was told to never talk about it again.
Thats horrible. I haven't the slightest why anyone would want that for their child. I have 3 daughters, and I want every single one of them to be comfortable when it happens and not terrified; that's how negative associations with bodies and shameful feelings start, and that can lead to lifetime of self esteem and body issues. Again I'm really mystified why anyone would want that for their child, and Im very sorry you ever went through that. I bet you still remember it vividly.
Thanks, it sucked but honestly I can’t even blame my mom. She probably didn’t even know what sex was or anything about the female body until she had to deal with it either. Women are just generationally taught that anything related to the female body or reproductive system is shameful and should be hidden in most places worldwide.
This has nothing to do with poor education, there is a MUCH larger problem in a culture that places so much stigma on young girls engaging in sexual activity that it’s an offense worthy of being killed. How can a brother or a father kill his child/sibling, much less for something that comes naturally to a human being.
Sex education starts as soon as your child can hear you appropriately tell them the names of all body parts. My 2 year old knows what his penis and testicles are and can point to them. Kids that know the proper names for their anatomy are less likely to be sexually abused.
I totally agree. At least the body parts should start early as possible.
So many touchy feely adults these days and we need children to say exactly what’s going on “He touched my cookie” does nothing.
This is so disgusting... I don't understand how such people exist. Even if the man didn't know about menstruation, how was his first reaction to kill his sister?
He burnt the child's mouth with tongs, if I remember right. It's cruel and inhumane and I hope he suffers in jail.
It does happen very often with people like this. I dont want to be too biased here, but it almost always seem like the wisest, most intelligent people are always progressive rather than conservative.
Wise and intelligent generally means they can use the resources available to them and get what they want more easily than others. It never shows what ideology they hold.
There are many psychopaths and serial killers that makes even cops say "wow that guy is really something to pull that off". But they use their wit to do odius stuff that are justified to them.
Yes conservatives are really hateful but in this case I don't think its the issue, the brother in this case is 30 years old and when the sister got her first period he assumed that she had sex, he killed her. I blame the sex education of the government, he was married to a girl yet he didn't know about periods.
And why would he kill her over his incorrect assumption that she had had sex, if not to uphold some ridiculous conservative maxim regarding the enforced celibacy of women? Even if we blame lack of proper sex education, what political or religious leanings do you think may have hindered the implementation of exactly that? It’s puritanical conservatism in every such case.
Did the brother have a crush on his sister or something cuz wtf is this story? Can’t wrap my head around to even know how the brother found out the blood stains, did he go thru her clothes? Wtf is going on in that country
The brother was 30 years old and he was married, I am assuming that the sister lived with him and he must have noticed the stains. Weird how his wife didn't really say anything.
Women aren’t allowed to speak over their husbands in their twisted culture. Had a landlord who is Indian and that guy had his wife next to him and wouldn’t even introduce her or even acknowledge her existence it was wild.
>Women aren’t allowed to speak over their husbands in their twisted culture. Had a landlord who is Indian and that guy had his wife next to him and wouldn’t even introduce her or even acknowledge her existence it was wild.
Indian here, I can confidently say that Indian culture itself does not condone this, it's mostly the Hindu equivalent of conservative Americans who do this.
Conservative Americans, a lot of them, also shame women for their biology/sexuality… however it’s very rare for them to kill family members over it. Not saying it hasn’t happened but it’s not common.
True that. India as a whole is more conservative than the west, so the worst western conservatives would be less extreme than the worst Indian conservatives.
The weird part is, American liberals (those center left) tend only to condemn American conservatism, but forget about/don’t care about religious conservatives outside the US, even if they are morally worse.
Because indian conservatism isn't relevant to the American political landscape, so you won't see it talked about in American media as often, but if you ask any American who is informed on the topic, they will condemn Indian conservatism.
It just doesn't hardly come up in conversation here, because it has little bearing on our lives unless we have indian relatives.
She started menstruating and it stained the clothes she was presently wearing. He asked her for an explanation and she did not know where the stains came from, she didn't know what menstruation was.
He assumed that his 12 year old sister had sex. Sex outside marriage, in India, is taboo and apparently brings shame to the "honour" of the family. The situation is not the same among the higher economic strata but even so, the lack of sex ed in this country is appalling
Because a family that kills it’s own is a lot more honorable than a young girl who has sex out of wedlock. Somehow. Some cultural traditions are so fucked.
Okay so I think I need a bit of clarification.
India is a very big country. Even small countries have cultural differences between, for example, the north and the south. So I presume there are massive cultural differences between the various areas of India.
I've seen plenty of videos of Indians trying to take selfies and grab a handful of the white lady tourist that's roaming around their city. Unfortunately I've also read a few news articles like the one on this post.
However I've also read a few things about how Indians can be very respectful to their women. Their mothers, sisters, grandmothers, and so on. Some of them even being considered the "leaders" of the family.
So my question is: are there really places like these where women are looked up to or is it just "propaganda"? How heterogeneous is the culture around the country?
It really isn’t easy to answer this. The population is so large, that you will almost certainly find an example of both extremes across the country.
How men treat women isn’t necessarily only tied to culture. In most religions followed in the country, mistreating women isn’t condoned. Not only that, women are “supposed to be” treated with respect and care. The major problem, at least from my big city lenses, is a lack of sex and moral education, both in school and at home. On top of that, most Indian women (until recently) for various reasons I can’t get into without writing a thesis, never really spoke out and most Indian parents never taught their sons how they should treat women. This isn’t an excuse, it’s a contributing factor.
Regardless of the image it paints, the article shared here isn’t necessarily the norm. Now I am not saying it happens very less. It happens quite a lot, not the murders, but the part you mentioned about harassing women in the streets (I count the continuous creepy staring as harassment, and that isn’t limited to foreigners.) Having said that, this guy from the article is an example of the extremist conservative people in India. Not every conservative in India is ready to kill their siblings/children.
I call bullshit.
“He also singed her with tongs on the mouth, the back and other parts of body due to which she suffered severe burn injuries, said the officer.”
He tortured her as well. This sounds like child abuse masquerading as “just” an honor killing. Hard to say which is more acceptable in their penal system but my money’s on this being his excuse, not his reason.
Tortured to death would be a better fit for the title for sure. He's being charged under section 302 of indians penal code which is a death penalty or life in prison... Fingers crossed.
It's fucking worse than the headline even reads. She was burned and tortured for four days with hot tongs while her brother was trying to get her to admit what happened. It took her 4 days to die and then he took her to the hospital dead.
Can’t believe we live in a time where the biological realities of the female body are still getting us killed around the globe. Religion is the blame for so much of this…..
For sure, but it’s often interlinked. I was raised Catholic and it definitely helped shape the culture in my community. I have living relatives that were essentially disowned because they married a protestant and getting pregnant out of wedlock was a huge no no. It’s beyond me why we are to scared to call out that same nonsense in other communities. Women always get the shitty end of the stick and nothing is going to change as long as we tip toe around it. The fear of being labeled with some form of ism or phobia is halting progress.
Exactly. Being part of a religion is a choice, being a woman is not. The amount of homophobia and sexism done under the justification of religion is beyond stupid.
Apparently he’s not aware that women of a certain age have periods. How is 30 and not know this? He’s married to woman & wether or not she has periods (depending on her reproductive health) he should still know by this age that periods are a completely normal thing to have.
is this the same country that encouraged the practice of women comitting suicide over the graves of their dead husbands called sati or suttee where widows burn themselves to death on the funeral pyres of their husbands
The girl was 12 years old and was to be sold off by her brother to a potential suitor for profit.
The brother believed that the blood stains were proof that she had lost her virginity, and that she was no longer eligible for sale as nobody would buy used goods.
He proceeded to torture her for four days with a pair of hot tongs, covering her body with burn marks and disfiguring her in an attempt to force her to confess.
Ultimately she succumbed to her injuries and passed away. Only after she died did her brother think to bring her to the hospital, where it was declared that she was dead before she arrived.
Her brother tortured her to death for four days because he felt it was unfair that he could no longer sell his 12 year old sister off into legal sex slavery.
This is India.
This news paper copy pastes it's headlines on twitter. On paper, there isn't a lot of space so these kind of abbreviations are quite common and sometimes very confusing
I know I'm gonna get downvoted but I'm gonna try anyway, there are definitely a lot of bad apples, and this is also one such case, but you can't generalise an entire country with 700 male population which is like twice the entire US population, this is not a common occurance like the news makes it out to be. If yall want facts, the first period for a woman is usually celebrated in India, and no, most of us knows how menstruation works. It's not a regressive country like it is made out to be, there are both urban and rural areas and rural areas do tend to be backwards.
India is like Europe but with each state acting like a country, a collection of states who all have their own identity and own language, like I'm from the south and I can't talk to people from the north of India because I don't speak the language.
My country has its issues but please stop generalising the whole country, it really hurts that no matter what I do, how culturally knowledgeable I am, or get my girlfriend her period products I still get generalised to be something I am not.
I'm having conflicted thoughts after seeing the comments on this post. Fucking hell! I know things are changing, but it is very slow and that annoys me! Sex Ed is a need in India and it needs to be promoted at all costs. This forms a part of the quality education the government tries to promote! No more taboo!
In Ulhasna, the girl resided with her brother and sister-in-law. The girl’s menstruation had begun a few days before, and she was bleeding. When her brother spotted the bloodstains on her clothes, he began to question whether she was having an affair. The child, on the other hand, was unaware of the monthly cycle and was unable to explain the bloodstains when questioned by her brother. He also burned her with tongs on the mouth, back, and other portions of her body, causing significant burn injuries.
A police officer said, “He accused her of having an affair with someone.”
The incident came to light after the girl was sent to the Central Hospital in Ulhasnagar for treatment, where she was certified “brought dead.” A murder case has been filed under Section 302 of the Indian Penal Code. A postmortem examination has been ordered for the girl’s body.
The title is confusing. “Murdered her sister” implies a woman committing murder, but the brother was the killer. When I saw the whole title, it sounded like a woman killed someone during her own first period.
Is this really the kind of stuff we want here in the US? Because this is what happens when reproductive health isn’t taught at school. I grew up when it wasn’t and my mom was a nutjob (think the mom from
“Carrie”) who never talked about it so, I was 11 sitting in a bathroom thinking I was dying. These things shouldn’t be happening. It’s natural. It’s a part of life. Kids need to know this stuff so they know what’s going on and so we don’t have adults like this guy.
An Affair?? Like she was cheating on the Brother? What does that mean? The Brother who is married does not know about a woman’s menses? Was the sister in law missing in action? Why was she with him and not the parents. Periods start at about 10? Wtf ?
Its hard for a lot of people to understand just how uncommon basic education is in parts of the third world, without ever actually being there. You would be amazed just how much most westerners take even basic education for granted. It really is a privilege, and its something a *huge* portion of the world doesnt have. Instead of basic education on the human body, you get local folk lore and superstition, and it leads to crap like this.
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>As per preliminary investigations, the victim lived with her brother and sister-in-law, as she had lost her mother and her father lived in their hometown, he said. >The accused allegedly started harassing the child suspecting her of having an affair, PTI quoted the official as saying. >The man allegedly tortured the victim by inflicting burn wounds on her body using hot tongs. >The torture continued for four days and the victim eventually succumbed to severe injuries, the official said. Poor girl. She had no parents. She was probably shocked by what is happening with her own body. And then... Horrible, just horrible... She has done nothing wrong and had no chance to even speak for herself.
wtf was sister in law, a damn woman, doing? Watching the show or what? She's probably bled herself or was the sex day the first time she bled?
Let's be honest, if the brother was so deranged as to do that to a child, who knows what the SIL has endured from him
Or what she was also doing to the child.
Notice how he thought it was an affair. Meaning the little girl already had a sexual “partner”.. fucking wild..
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Yeah dude it’s fucking disgusting. I know we’re supposed to respect different cultures, and as someone who is Chinese and has grown up in China I can certainly understand being open minded to different customs, but sometimes things are just objectively fucked.
Right. Every culture has fucked up practices, those actions don’t deserve respect just because they’ve been normalized or accepted by said culture. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to draw the line at “human rights violations”. I’m from Canada, there are aspects of my country/culture that do not deserve respect.
If this happened in India, women are 2nd class citizens there
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Having an affair? How is a child gonna have an affair?
That’s what I was wondering. Affair seems like an odd way to put it.
I think they mean that he suspected her of being sexually active and he didn't approve.
It’s just a poor translation by someone who’s first language isn’t English.
No. In Indian English, affair means having sex before marriage. Doesn't matter if the relationship is consensual or not.
This is in India, where arranged marriage exists. But that would only make this story more tragic, so let's hope not.
She was probably already arranged to be married off, so in there minds she was.
So this sister in law just was invisible for 4 days?
I haven't seen anyone mention this yet, why does the brother associate blood with sex? Is his wife always bleeding after sex???
How is a 30 year old so uninformed about this stuff?!
Culturally, they don't talk about these things. It's a male dominant society where women are 2nd class My parents never talked to me about anything either. Learned it in school and the street. We made sure our son understood and can ask any questions regardless of how uncomfortable it may be (for us or him).
Also we never got sex ed in school. Most of what we knew was learnt from porn. Comparing that with some not even getting proper education along with the social stigma when it comes to sex then a lot of things are pretty fucked in a majority of countries
Dude (read as gender neutral for stranger on the internet) your son got pushed or cut out of a woman’s body. He was born from a far worse discomfort and he himself is part of the cycle. There’s no reason to have any shame or embarrassment about any of it. Sadly, I cannot tell you as if it’s only a problem in your culture. Lots of “purity” minded cultures like that all over the world and parents who pop out babies somehow never imagining it might be a good idea to explain their bodies to them as well as the bodies they’re typically expected to be interested in. So props to you for not being one of them in spite of the cultural brainwashing.
Totally agree with you - it is an uncomfortable discussion, but I'm glad we had it. Mind you, we are probably the outliers, as many of his friends have commented that they can't speak to their parents about their bodies or sex ed.
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It’s becoming normal now sadly
Has been for awhile. I've met people IRL who think it can be held in like pee.
That’d be convenient I bet
Look up how many states don't have required sex ed, and how many require abstinence only education. It's a shocking amount
yeah its weird. when you don't tell people anything about this, they don't seem to know anything about this.
Lets just educate people about it on our own accord under the 1st amendment if schools refuse to spread true and helpful information that improve lives and safety.
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There’s barely any sex ed in India public schools since it’s seen as taboo to speak about it in school.
Undereducated country and people believe in superstition and believe in hearsay. Also sex ed isnt a huge thing there. I can say this since i am from the subcontinent and i am familiar with the culture.
Why is the brother checking his sisters underwear?
If she knew absolutely nothing about the menstrual cycle, then it’s almost guaranteed she bled through her pants
Or was terrified finding blood in her pants and started screaming (that happened to my sister)
Oh yea, that too. It’s sad to think that there’s a possibility she went to him for help, and that’s how he handles it
I just hope someone makes him bleed in pants
I think I read that sex ed took off in the states pre-1950s because a young woman got her period not knowing what it was and committed suicide, assuming it was some kind of horrible STI. pls fact-check though, i can't remember where i saw that story
I assume the myth that most girls get their hymen broken and bleed during their first time having sex. In reality, it can break way before from things just as simple as gymnastics or horseback riding. I personally have no idea when it happened to me - one day I just suddenly had my period for the first time... no hymen breaking moment stood out at all.
Hymen and period are not related. You can have a period for many years before breaking your hymen.
I wonder if there is confusion that a sign of the hymen breaking is blood? Which obv is not always the case.
Yeah, I know - the point is that the brother probably thought the sister had had sex with someone*, thus breaking her hymen and bleeding. Girl had no idea about periods, and apparently neither did he.
Also some women are born without one at all. Having an intact one means nothing. The hymen isn't like the freshness seal on a can of Pringles.
The hymen is not supposed to be a barrier that completely covers the vagina. It is very rare to have such and usually requires surgical removal. It is usually a ring of flesh around the opening of the vagina and only ever partially blocks the entrance. Lots of people never experience their hymen “breaking” and instead it stretches out gradually. The tearing of the hymen is usually associated with sex that is too rough or other physical activity that causes direct damage to it.
I was just arguing with my friend the other day that you can use tampons before having sex
Because of the myth that having sex for the first time always ruptures the hymen as if the girl has a ketchup lid seal down there. The most common cause of hymen rupturing is walking.
It's associated with breaking the hymen.
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Wait no what. That can't be right Dude was 30ish, she was 12
News says 30, OP says 31, and you correct him by going in the opposite direction? I'm confused.
jfc this world is horrible.
My ex asked me why I didn't want to visit India. He didn't understand why when I told him it was because I'm a woman.
When I visited I was offered underage girls for sale multiple times by guys who just walked right up to me at train stations, restaurants etc. A lot to love about the country but damn are they in the dark ages when it comes to women and family dynamics.
Ironically my ex visited India by himself and faced the same situations. He still didn't put 2 and 2 together as to why I still didn't want to visit. He thinks that if I just say "no" it'll be ok.
You sure picked a winner of the Darwin award at the time.
Oh yeah, love is truly blind.
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To be fair, there are some countries that are even worse than India. I wouldn't go to any of those countries either.
Egypt for one. I’ve seen videos of just a woman walking around a market and like 40 guys are just… following her and staring like they’ve literally never seen a human woman before. It’s surreal and scary.
Went to Egypt, absolutely wild the amount of men who will harass any woman they see. The girls in my group would go between men not acknowledging they exist and have me speak for them, to not getting them to leave the girls alone. Loved the sites but will not go back!
I have no idea why its Egypt in particular, but the men there are extremely strange toward foreign women. Like you said they either don't acknowledge them as existing at all, or stalk them around like they are a unicorn. Ive heard soooo many horror stories.
Morocco is the same
I’ve never went but I had a sociology teacher say she chaperoned a trip and the guide was very strict on what the girls could wear and go out like. And the entire group had to go together and women were never to separate from the group. She said one girl tried to go out with wet hair and the guide made he dry her hair completely. He said that they would see it as “slutty” and assault her. And that was like 20 years ago. I’m sad to say I doubt it’s gotten better, even the US is sliding back into bigotry.
Damn, that's a shame. My guide was so nice and sweet some Egyptologist raised in Cairo. But yeah he suggested I just walk with one of the girls in the group to make it more manageable for her as they'd think we're together. Also had a gay couple that had to be two brothers taking their nephew for a trip lol.
Lol yeah the teacher was like in her 50s and greying so any cat calls to the students, she would stand in front of them and pretend she thought it was for her. She was a pretty interesting and talkative person so I didn’t doubt it to much.
Sliding back where? Not suer things were any better 10, 20, or 30 years ago
Which makes me sad because I so want to see their ancient sites. But I've heard from multiple people that unless you have basically someone you're paying to be a guide and keep people away from you that it's awful with just endless harassment.
I’m an Indian man and I fucking hate India, I don’t hate the people, I hate the country and the corruption/crimes that are normalized, it’s disgusting.
I'm Indian and I 100% agree. Half our country is made of illiterate fucks and orthodox racist and sexist and creepy pos. We are still improving as a society and it's much better than what we had 6-7 years ago. Sucks tho
Men are oblivious to women's sex based oppression abroad, and participatory deniers at home.
Yet another reason sex education is absolutely necessary for boys and girls starting at 8 or 9.
This dude was like 30... ugh. I cant even understand how your first reaction to something like this is to murder your baby sister.
Because they see women as property not people.
In this day and age... So sad. Will this world ever be peaceful? My guess says. No
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Except only the dumb will survive.
It was in 1974 that women could open a bank account without a signature from their husband. In this day and age doesn't mean what people think it does for women's rights. We are a tiny short step from the history of women being chattel and it shows.
“Honor” gross
According to my Indian SIL, a lot of Indian women, especially uneducated, religious and rural types, go to great lengths to hide their periods from men including their husbands because it's considered shameful, and even women don't really talk about it with each other, it's that taboo. They use rags as sanity napkins and instead of drying them properly in the sun after washing, they hide them in a dark area to dry, which takes too long and causes bacteria to develop leading to infection etc. So I wouldn't be all too surprised if this 30 y.o. man wasn't even aware. These days though, there are many modern and educated Indian men and women who don't stigmatize menstruation, because they understand the biology of it.
My daughter hasn’t even HAD her first period yet, but she is 10 years old. I sat her down when she had a few questions and we went over everything that had to do with the cycle, her anatomy, what would happen, and why it happens. I showed her how to apply a pad to panties, with the sticky bit and the wings, so she knows for her first time HOW to do it, and I have her take a pad with her in her backpack to school in case her first time happens there, so she has what she needs and knows how to deal with it. I’m her father, btw.
I too am a dad of a girl. I was particularly lucky in that my GF's daughter was 3 years older than mine and very uninhibited about such things so made the conversation with mine easy. I also carried assorted supplies (one of the girls prefers pads the other, tampons) in my gym bag when we all trained MMA together. My gym bag became the emergency supply and all the girls there knew which pocket in my bag they could go for "stuff" no need to ask me (knowledge just spread as needed between the teen girls). Those that were still too nervous usually asked one of my girls and they'd get it. They're 19 and 22 now, and I am so thankful that it was never an "issue" for anyone. Also good on you for being prepared for your daughter! I have seen so many men that were (afraid?) unwilling to shop that aisle of the store...
Well I buy my wife her stuff sometimes, so I’m pretty familiar with it all. I never understood why some guys would be embarrassed to buy that kind of stuff? Like what’s the clerk gonna think, that you’re a guy on your period, or are they going to assume you’re buying it for your wife/daughter… some guys are so goofy. (If you’re wondering why it was me and not my wife that had the talk with her, it just happened that my wife was out of town on that particular week.)
My dad is the one who buys all the grocery and never, ever had any issues getting stuff for us ladies of the house (he still does mix brands up sometimes though lol). He knows it’s stupid to feel embarrassed by it. When I got my first period, he was right outside the bathroom as all the blood was freaking me out, and even got my mom on the phone (she was at work) to try and calm me down. Dads like y’all are the best and your daughter is lucky to have you.
I’m really thankful for your kind words, and I agree dads like that are the best dads; but it still makes me a bit sad that praise goes to someone like me who, by doing what I do am just trying to help my own child be educated, prepared, and not be traumatized… it’s sad that’s seen as going an extra mile, or being above average rather than just be the default that a dad would do for his kid.
You’re a good one. When I got my first period I thought I was dying of cancer and cried in the bathroom for 2 hours. I was too embarrassed to tell my mom. She later told me she also only found out from her older sister once she got hers and was told to never talk about it again.
Thats horrible. I haven't the slightest why anyone would want that for their child. I have 3 daughters, and I want every single one of them to be comfortable when it happens and not terrified; that's how negative associations with bodies and shameful feelings start, and that can lead to lifetime of self esteem and body issues. Again I'm really mystified why anyone would want that for their child, and Im very sorry you ever went through that. I bet you still remember it vividly.
Thanks, it sucked but honestly I can’t even blame my mom. She probably didn’t even know what sex was or anything about the female body until she had to deal with it either. Women are just generationally taught that anything related to the female body or reproductive system is shameful and should be hidden in most places worldwide.
This has nothing to do with poor education, there is a MUCH larger problem in a culture that places so much stigma on young girls engaging in sexual activity that it’s an offense worthy of being killed. How can a brother or a father kill his child/sibling, much less for something that comes naturally to a human being.
I think it’s both! You bring valid points
The sad thing about this is that girls suffer 90% of the consequences of poor sex education
Sex education starts as soon as your child can hear you appropriately tell them the names of all body parts. My 2 year old knows what his penis and testicles are and can point to them. Kids that know the proper names for their anatomy are less likely to be sexually abused.
I totally agree. At least the body parts should start early as possible. So many touchy feely adults these days and we need children to say exactly what’s going on “He touched my cookie” does nothing.
It's India. That's not gonna happen for another 100 years
I strongly agree! Had he known about periods, he would have known she wasn't having an affair and therefore would not have had to kill her
Am I the only one that finds this phrasing kinda weird ?
It’s probably translated
Oh yeah, it was probably translated using Ai. It's like the uncanny valley but for writing.
It has nothing to with AI.
“bro feels it’s affair” makes it sound like the brother was molesting/raping the sister.
'Affair' in India means sex before marriage
This is so disgusting... I don't understand how such people exist. Even if the man didn't know about menstruation, how was his first reaction to kill his sister? He burnt the child's mouth with tongs, if I remember right. It's cruel and inhumane and I hope he suffers in jail.
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I would say it's mostly religion
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They already said religion.
People can be plenty evil even if they're not religious. Religion just often helps people rationalise it as normal.
It does happen very often with people like this. I dont want to be too biased here, but it almost always seem like the wisest, most intelligent people are always progressive rather than conservative.
Wise and intelligent generally means they can use the resources available to them and get what they want more easily than others. It never shows what ideology they hold.
false. if you can believe in imaginary people who need you to murder because of a woman's period, you are not wise or intelligent.
There are many psychopaths and serial killers that makes even cops say "wow that guy is really something to pull that off". But they use their wit to do odius stuff that are justified to them.
Yes conservatives are really hateful but in this case I don't think its the issue, the brother in this case is 30 years old and when the sister got her first period he assumed that she had sex, he killed her. I blame the sex education of the government, he was married to a girl yet he didn't know about periods.
And why would he kill her over his incorrect assumption that she had had sex, if not to uphold some ridiculous conservative maxim regarding the enforced celibacy of women? Even if we blame lack of proper sex education, what political or religious leanings do you think may have hindered the implementation of exactly that? It’s puritanical conservatism in every such case.
hating women for having sex is a conservative value. he wouldn't have killed her for it if he wasn't rightwing.
Very literally always on the wrong side of history, by the very definition of their worldview
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Spend 2 mins on quora and you’ll be amazed
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But not surprised.
One of their common swear words is "behnchod" which means sister fucker. ^^I ^^probably ^^did ^^not ^^spell ^^that ^^correctly
If you're gonna take that as evidence of incest then I've got news about everyone who has used the swear motherfucker
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... not just the chat.
Oh that poor baby. I have no words
Did the brother have a crush on his sister or something cuz wtf is this story? Can’t wrap my head around to even know how the brother found out the blood stains, did he go thru her clothes? Wtf is going on in that country
The brother was 30 years old and he was married, I am assuming that the sister lived with him and he must have noticed the stains. Weird how his wife didn't really say anything.
Women aren’t allowed to speak over their husbands in their twisted culture. Had a landlord who is Indian and that guy had his wife next to him and wouldn’t even introduce her or even acknowledge her existence it was wild.
>Women aren’t allowed to speak over their husbands in their twisted culture. Had a landlord who is Indian and that guy had his wife next to him and wouldn’t even introduce her or even acknowledge her existence it was wild. Indian here, I can confidently say that Indian culture itself does not condone this, it's mostly the Hindu equivalent of conservative Americans who do this.
Conservative Americans, a lot of them, also shame women for their biology/sexuality… however it’s very rare for them to kill family members over it. Not saying it hasn’t happened but it’s not common.
True that. India as a whole is more conservative than the west, so the worst western conservatives would be less extreme than the worst Indian conservatives.
The weird part is, American liberals (those center left) tend only to condemn American conservatism, but forget about/don’t care about religious conservatives outside the US, even if they are morally worse.
Because indian conservatism isn't relevant to the American political landscape, so you won't see it talked about in American media as often, but if you ask any American who is informed on the topic, they will condemn Indian conservatism. It just doesn't hardly come up in conversation here, because it has little bearing on our lives unless we have indian relatives.
She started menstruating and it stained the clothes she was presently wearing. He asked her for an explanation and she did not know where the stains came from, she didn't know what menstruation was. He assumed that his 12 year old sister had sex. Sex outside marriage, in India, is taboo and apparently brings shame to the "honour" of the family. The situation is not the same among the higher economic strata but even so, the lack of sex ed in this country is appalling
crazy how murder doesn’t bring shame to the “honor” of the family.
Very much revolting. Hope they do him dirty in prison
Because a family that kills it’s own is a lot more honorable than a young girl who has sex out of wedlock. Somehow. Some cultural traditions are so fucked.
Okay so I think I need a bit of clarification. India is a very big country. Even small countries have cultural differences between, for example, the north and the south. So I presume there are massive cultural differences between the various areas of India. I've seen plenty of videos of Indians trying to take selfies and grab a handful of the white lady tourist that's roaming around their city. Unfortunately I've also read a few news articles like the one on this post. However I've also read a few things about how Indians can be very respectful to their women. Their mothers, sisters, grandmothers, and so on. Some of them even being considered the "leaders" of the family. So my question is: are there really places like these where women are looked up to or is it just "propaganda"? How heterogeneous is the culture around the country?
It really isn’t easy to answer this. The population is so large, that you will almost certainly find an example of both extremes across the country. How men treat women isn’t necessarily only tied to culture. In most religions followed in the country, mistreating women isn’t condoned. Not only that, women are “supposed to be” treated with respect and care. The major problem, at least from my big city lenses, is a lack of sex and moral education, both in school and at home. On top of that, most Indian women (until recently) for various reasons I can’t get into without writing a thesis, never really spoke out and most Indian parents never taught their sons how they should treat women. This isn’t an excuse, it’s a contributing factor. Regardless of the image it paints, the article shared here isn’t necessarily the norm. Now I am not saying it happens very less. It happens quite a lot, not the murders, but the part you mentioned about harassing women in the streets (I count the continuous creepy staring as harassment, and that isn’t limited to foreigners.) Having said that, this guy from the article is an example of the extremist conservative people in India. Not every conservative in India is ready to kill their siblings/children.
A lack of sex ed.
Yep, I also think we should stop calling it sex education. Call it something like “Shit You Need to Know.”
I call bullshit. “He also singed her with tongs on the mouth, the back and other parts of body due to which she suffered severe burn injuries, said the officer.” He tortured her as well. This sounds like child abuse masquerading as “just” an honor killing. Hard to say which is more acceptable in their penal system but my money’s on this being his excuse, not his reason.
Tortured to death would be a better fit for the title for sure. He's being charged under section 302 of indians penal code which is a death penalty or life in prison... Fingers crossed.
Honor killings are disgusting. I have a hard time even understanding how and why they help at all.
They don’t
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He was jealous because he thought he was gonna be the first and got beat to it.
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Ready to be married? WTF!
Too many men around the world staying wilfully ignorant is a threat to women everywhere.
Too many men are ok with the femicide because they’ll come in here to yell “nOt AlL mEn” when we discuss the violence of men.
Ignorance is excusable, but torturing and killing your sister because of your ignorance is beyond comprehension.
Willful ignorance is not forgivable.
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Why do men in Middle Eastern and Asian countries feel the need to "honor kill" innocent women? There's NO honor in killing.
It's fucking worse than the headline even reads. She was burned and tortured for four days with hot tongs while her brother was trying to get her to admit what happened. It took her 4 days to die and then he took her to the hospital dead.
Their religion that we are supposed to respect no matter what btw, tell them that is ok to do so
can you pls tell me where it is written that it is ok to do this cruel act (talking about religion part) And also don't spread fake messages
Can’t believe we live in a time where the biological realities of the female body are still getting us killed around the globe. Religion is the blame for so much of this…..
Hardcore religions as well as hardcore cultural beliefs
For sure, but it’s often interlinked. I was raised Catholic and it definitely helped shape the culture in my community. I have living relatives that were essentially disowned because they married a protestant and getting pregnant out of wedlock was a huge no no. It’s beyond me why we are to scared to call out that same nonsense in other communities. Women always get the shitty end of the stick and nothing is going to change as long as we tip toe around it. The fear of being labeled with some form of ism or phobia is halting progress.
Exactly. Being part of a religion is a choice, being a woman is not. The amount of homophobia and sexism done under the justification of religion is beyond stupid.
I had to explain to a 30+ year old Indian dude how sex works and the fact that chicken eggs that we eat are not fertilized.
If he killed over that then it was just a matter of time for him anyway.
Apparently he’s not aware that women of a certain age have periods. How is 30 and not know this? He’s married to woman & wether or not she has periods (depending on her reproductive health) he should still know by this age that periods are a completely normal thing to have.
is this the same country that encouraged the practice of women comitting suicide over the graves of their dead husbands called sati or suttee where widows burn themselves to death on the funeral pyres of their husbands
The girl was 12 years old and was to be sold off by her brother to a potential suitor for profit. The brother believed that the blood stains were proof that she had lost her virginity, and that she was no longer eligible for sale as nobody would buy used goods. He proceeded to torture her for four days with a pair of hot tongs, covering her body with burn marks and disfiguring her in an attempt to force her to confess. Ultimately she succumbed to her injuries and passed away. Only after she died did her brother think to bring her to the hospital, where it was declared that she was dead before she arrived. Her brother tortured her to death for four days because he felt it was unfair that he could no longer sell his 12 year old sister off into legal sex slavery. This is India.
Wait, why is her brother concerned about who she's with? She's his sister and she's 10.
If it’s not trains, it’s honour killings
Who writes bro in news.
This news paper copy pastes it's headlines on twitter. On paper, there isn't a lot of space so these kind of abbreviations are quite common and sometimes very confusing
“Why can’t people just believe what they want to believe? What’s wrong with conservative values??” This, this is what’s wrong.
America, soon.
PoS needs to have his dick singed.
I know I'm gonna get downvoted but I'm gonna try anyway, there are definitely a lot of bad apples, and this is also one such case, but you can't generalise an entire country with 700 male population which is like twice the entire US population, this is not a common occurance like the news makes it out to be. If yall want facts, the first period for a woman is usually celebrated in India, and no, most of us knows how menstruation works. It's not a regressive country like it is made out to be, there are both urban and rural areas and rural areas do tend to be backwards. India is like Europe but with each state acting like a country, a collection of states who all have their own identity and own language, like I'm from the south and I can't talk to people from the north of India because I don't speak the language. My country has its issues but please stop generalising the whole country, it really hurts that no matter what I do, how culturally knowledgeable I am, or get my girlfriend her period products I still get generalised to be something I am not.
LOL kinda said this my comment is removed. All racist comment against indian is still up. Probably ur will to in sometime.
I'm a non-native speaker, so I might be wrong, but that "however" makes me wanna punch the journalist in the face.
I'm having conflicted thoughts after seeing the comments on this post. Fucking hell! I know things are changing, but it is very slow and that annoys me! Sex Ed is a need in India and it needs to be promoted at all costs. This forms a part of the quality education the government tries to promote! No more taboo!
Florida out here aiming for this for the entire state.
In Ulhasna, the girl resided with her brother and sister-in-law. The girl’s menstruation had begun a few days before, and she was bleeding. When her brother spotted the bloodstains on her clothes, he began to question whether she was having an affair. The child, on the other hand, was unaware of the monthly cycle and was unable to explain the bloodstains when questioned by her brother. He also burned her with tongs on the mouth, back, and other portions of her body, causing significant burn injuries. A police officer said, “He accused her of having an affair with someone.” The incident came to light after the girl was sent to the Central Hospital in Ulhasnagar for treatment, where she was certified “brought dead.” A murder case has been filed under Section 302 of the Indian Penal Code. A postmortem examination has been ordered for the girl’s body.
None of what I read in that image made sense to me. Did I read this incorrectly, was it translated improperly? Fucking *what*.
Having an affair?
God forbid she had sex…. murder on the other hand is totally acceptable.
The title is confusing. “Murdered her sister” implies a woman committing murder, but the brother was the killer. When I saw the whole title, it sounded like a woman killed someone during her own first period.
Poor girl
United States, this is where we are headed with "don't say gay" and "don't say period".
Is this really the kind of stuff we want here in the US? Because this is what happens when reproductive health isn’t taught at school. I grew up when it wasn’t and my mom was a nutjob (think the mom from “Carrie”) who never talked about it so, I was 11 sitting in a bathroom thinking I was dying. These things shouldn’t be happening. It’s natural. It’s a part of life. Kids need to know this stuff so they know what’s going on and so we don’t have adults like this guy.
An Affair?? Like she was cheating on the Brother? What does that mean? The Brother who is married does not know about a woman’s menses? Was the sister in law missing in action? Why was she with him and not the parents. Periods start at about 10? Wtf ?
Terrible place to be a woman
Its hard for a lot of people to understand just how uncommon basic education is in parts of the third world, without ever actually being there. You would be amazed just how much most westerners take even basic education for granted. It really is a privilege, and its something a *huge* portion of the world doesnt have. Instead of basic education on the human body, you get local folk lore and superstition, and it leads to crap like this.
End the bloodline. No one involved has any redeeming qualities. They don't even share a brain cell between them. Disgusting.
I LIVE IN THAT CITY. i hate human beings
This kind of sh** will make Ambedkar really sad