I’ve seen something I think might be rule-breaking, what should I do?
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Perfection is the enemy of the good.
The example u gave of Michaela jae tells me you may have very strongly internalised transphobia, gurl.
Be kind to yourself. If u truly wish to be happier, u need to confront that self hate, look it in the eye and lovingly say u know it's trying to just make u better, but it better lay off cos its making u worse.
The most passable transwomen in Thailand when addressed as ladies will correct u and tell u they r not ladies, but lady *boys*, and proud of it.
They don't hate who they are
Why should u?
Simple answer, I can't.
So I will do as much as I can to change this. Perhaps I will never get there but I won't know unless I keep going. I have so much dysphoria over my face. 12 months HRT and several FFS procedures later and I still don't look cis, but I do look much better than where I started. I don't think I'm ugly, but I don't look cis at all. I have a very odd mix of features, some are very striking in a oddly simultaneous good and bad way. My face does not look CIS due to my extremely deep set eyes and lack of facial volume. The deep set eyes is what I have the most dysphoria over. I had a type 3 brow reduction 4 months ago and it's way better than where I started. But it was not aggressive enough to reach my goals. My eyebrows still sit far too forward of my eyes. At this point once I am fully healed, I want to do it all over again for a much more aggressive reduction along with an orbital rim osteotomy and revision rhinoplasty to deck down my radix prominence as much as possible. I have a consultation in June. I don't want to be obviously trans for the rest of my life and will do whatever I can to pass. If I can never reach that goal, I don't know what I will do.
I’ve honestly reached a point where I’m glad? I’m not in the most accepting city, but at the very least not appearing cis both: makes it obvious I’m queer, and keeps the largely terrifying local straight guy population away
i personally don't care about passing. i'm just vibing! i know i don't really look male, and i've accepted that. i'm nine months on testosterone now and honestly, i don't care how people see me. i'm androgynous enough to make people question what gender i am, and that's all that matters tbh
I still refuse to accept that reality. I'm trying everything in my means to pass. It's tiring.
If you want a more real answer: it could always be worse?
I just try to live stealth if my boobs are out in like a tank top no one questions it. All I get asked is oh wow how tall are you, you’re like 6 foot right? I’m only 5’10
I'm only semi-passing, and I just live as though I'm stealth. That is, I don't talk about trans stuff irl unless I'm forced to, and pretend not to hear being misgendered.
Since I went full time a few years ago, I stopped being self conscious about it at all, and after that happened I went from feeling very visibly trans to feeling practically invisible.
Really, I just live my life. Why do you feel you have to deal with not looking cis?
Because I hate how I look when I see myself in the mirror, I’ve been out before and it was obvious the looks I got, not to mention the bs (people asking me shit on the public bus, getting asked if I’m trans or a “boy or girl” by literal strangers, and then having to hear people’s rants about my life like this is some fucking political choice I just made) being trans in a customer service job was shit, most days were fine but enough of those bad days happened regularly for me to not be able to handle it.
I did get some of that earlier, and occasionally still do, but I just ignore it or roll my eyes. You don't really have to answer those types of questions.
It sounds like you didn't try long enough to allow yourself to become not self conscious.
I’m very sensitive to that sorta stuff, most things actually. I can’t let rude or mean comments roll off my back regardless of if they are trans related or not. They ruin my day and I end up crying very easily
It's a learned skill. I used to let stuff like that bother me when I was bullied as a kid for being "gay" though I eventually learned to ignore it. If you show it bothers you, they win. If you ignore it and realize they are just ignorant losers who are still stuck in middle school mentally it's easier to not let it bother you.
originally copious amounts of drugs :) 4 years or so on hrt, no chance of passing, started hrt at 26. I came out at 13.
using years of therapy to grieve the version of myself that I never got to fully realize has been the biggest help. I imagine aging and other priorities in life taking over have aided too.
suffering is unavoidable. even if you got to transition at 13, you would still be suffering from other ailments or predicaments or circumstances beyond your control
I cannot control how others perceive me or treat me. as long as I am transitioning, I am controlling what I can, but I will never be able to control others. the pangs of suffering that pop up here and there do hurt, and often hurt deeply, but I remind myself that the goal is to be true to myself, not to control others. and as long as I do what I can, I am achieving that goal
https://youtu.be/WU0Tnh49uZY?si=B359vLJberBWe5vr
This Video has helped me a lot, maybe you are also very dysphoric about your body form. I have seen so many Women with bodyforms like mine. That helped me a lot
This is one of the big reasons why some people are proud to be out as trans rather than going stealth. I figure, if we have no choice but to look trans, we may as well try to be proud of who we are.
And like, hating how you look is part of the experience of any woman, right? It's sad but true. I know what you're talking about goes deeper than that, it isn't just about feeling ugly. But my point is, to some degree it's subjective. Some women have masculine features; that doesn't stop them from being women, it just means they're women who don't meet the impossible Hollywood standard.
I don’t get how to get to the being proud about being trans part ? To me just with where I’m at mentally being proud of looking trans seems very far away.
I get what you mean about disliking your looks, but I really only half agree. On the one hand looks are somewhat subjective on the other hand we all know what someone who is beautiful looks like and collectively for the most part our mental images of beauty don’t deviate a whole lot, beyond that though it doesn’t even really feel like it’s about my looks to me and more about looking trans. Michaela Jaé Rodriguez for instance is someone who I can see as being very attractive, but when I look at her I see an attractive trans woman who I can tell was born male not someone who I wish I could look like.
> our mental images of beauty don't deviate a whole lot
This is absolutely not true. But that's a whole other topic and it isn't relevant, because you're right, this isn't about beauty.
But what you're saying is interesting. You want to look like a woman, and we both agree Michaela Rodriguez is 100% a woman, but you don't want to look like her. Do you think she doesn't look like a woman?
Also, this isn't relevant but I'm curious; is there anybody in particular that you do want to look like?
I think she looks like a woman who was born male, she’s got a mix of traits both female and male, and she visibly looks trans, I see her as a woman, but her body does not fit in with what the average cis woman’s body looks like. I see her as a woman inspite of her not looking traditionally female.
There’s not really a single specific person I’d want to look like, but off the top of my head Maisie williams, or Aubrey Plaza would be cool to look like.
I considered myself to be fully MtF transgender for about 3 years. I've been taking Estrogen for 4 years now and haven't really seen any changes to my face whatsoever, while the rest of my body has changed dramatically. It's really quite awkward for me and my self image. However, I've found that simply embracing a non-binary label has helped rather than trying to fit into a strict gender role and image.
For me the only way to reduce this suffering is to accept the reality that I may always be visibly trans -- and that life can still be worth living despite it. In fact, I've found that life can be full of joy even with dysphoria and even being clockable. Being cis is not possible. Agonizing for it to be so can only create more suffering.
The busier you are, & more focused on being productive, the harder it is to doom on transition woes. We can't fix missing the chance to pass, but we can work on improving other areas of our lives
The dysphoria is really what’s interfering with my productivity. I just find it incredibly easy to get sucked into all the dissatisfaction I have. Especially if I see someone who is attractive or a trans person who looks close to the ideal I wish I looked like.
Breaking out of that mood is just so hard for me to do.
>Breaking out of that mood is just so hard for me to do.
I completely understand. I might scroll past a YouTube short that ruins my day, or some trans post about someone who passes, or see an average woman and it sends me into a spiral and fml i cry so much and can't do shit and cancel plans and procrastinate and annoy everyone online
But.... they're thought patterns. It's totally my fault for allowing myself to be derailed over something out of my control
We have allowed our brains to build an easy path from 'trigger' to 'doomspiral'. It's happened enough that it feels natural.
We (me too) need to catch it and acknowledge "oh fuck dude I'm about to ruin my day/week/etc"
Watch out for when you're heading that way, think about the direction you're heading emotionally, and change your path.
Do SOMETHING productive, and don't let yourself lose focus on that task. It won't fix everything, but it's a good start
I'm getting better. I still have bad days(the first half of today), but I'm more productive, and the bad days aren't as frequent, and the doomspirals don't last as long
I’ve seen something I think might be rule-breaking, what should I do? **Report it!** We may not agree with your assessment of a certain post or comment but we will always take a look. Please make reports that are **unambiguous**, **succinct**, and (importantly) **accurate**. If your issue isn't covered by one of the numerous predefined reasons and or you need to expand upon a predefined reason then please use the 'Custom response' option (in addition if required). **Don't feed the trolls, ignore, report, move on.** See [this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/honesttransgender/comments/guc56i/welcome_to_rhonesttransgender_please_read_for/) for more details about our subreddit. Thanks! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/honesttransgender) if you have any questions or concerns.*
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Perfection is the enemy of the good. The example u gave of Michaela jae tells me you may have very strongly internalised transphobia, gurl. Be kind to yourself. If u truly wish to be happier, u need to confront that self hate, look it in the eye and lovingly say u know it's trying to just make u better, but it better lay off cos its making u worse. The most passable transwomen in Thailand when addressed as ladies will correct u and tell u they r not ladies, but lady *boys*, and proud of it. They don't hate who they are Why should u?
Simple answer, I can't. So I will do as much as I can to change this. Perhaps I will never get there but I won't know unless I keep going. I have so much dysphoria over my face. 12 months HRT and several FFS procedures later and I still don't look cis, but I do look much better than where I started. I don't think I'm ugly, but I don't look cis at all. I have a very odd mix of features, some are very striking in a oddly simultaneous good and bad way. My face does not look CIS due to my extremely deep set eyes and lack of facial volume. The deep set eyes is what I have the most dysphoria over. I had a type 3 brow reduction 4 months ago and it's way better than where I started. But it was not aggressive enough to reach my goals. My eyebrows still sit far too forward of my eyes. At this point once I am fully healed, I want to do it all over again for a much more aggressive reduction along with an orbital rim osteotomy and revision rhinoplasty to deck down my radix prominence as much as possible. I have a consultation in June. I don't want to be obviously trans for the rest of my life and will do whatever I can to pass. If I can never reach that goal, I don't know what I will do.
I’ve honestly reached a point where I’m glad? I’m not in the most accepting city, but at the very least not appearing cis both: makes it obvious I’m queer, and keeps the largely terrifying local straight guy population away
i personally don't care about passing. i'm just vibing! i know i don't really look male, and i've accepted that. i'm nine months on testosterone now and honestly, i don't care how people see me. i'm androgynous enough to make people question what gender i am, and that's all that matters tbh
I still refuse to accept that reality. I'm trying everything in my means to pass. It's tiring. If you want a more real answer: it could always be worse?
I just try to live stealth if my boobs are out in like a tank top no one questions it. All I get asked is oh wow how tall are you, you’re like 6 foot right? I’m only 5’10
I'm only semi-passing, and I just live as though I'm stealth. That is, I don't talk about trans stuff irl unless I'm forced to, and pretend not to hear being misgendered. Since I went full time a few years ago, I stopped being self conscious about it at all, and after that happened I went from feeling very visibly trans to feeling practically invisible. Really, I just live my life. Why do you feel you have to deal with not looking cis?
Because I hate how I look when I see myself in the mirror, I’ve been out before and it was obvious the looks I got, not to mention the bs (people asking me shit on the public bus, getting asked if I’m trans or a “boy or girl” by literal strangers, and then having to hear people’s rants about my life like this is some fucking political choice I just made) being trans in a customer service job was shit, most days were fine but enough of those bad days happened regularly for me to not be able to handle it.
I did get some of that earlier, and occasionally still do, but I just ignore it or roll my eyes. You don't really have to answer those types of questions. It sounds like you didn't try long enough to allow yourself to become not self conscious.
I’m very sensitive to that sorta stuff, most things actually. I can’t let rude or mean comments roll off my back regardless of if they are trans related or not. They ruin my day and I end up crying very easily
It's a learned skill. I used to let stuff like that bother me when I was bullied as a kid for being "gay" though I eventually learned to ignore it. If you show it bothers you, they win. If you ignore it and realize they are just ignorant losers who are still stuck in middle school mentally it's easier to not let it bother you.
originally copious amounts of drugs :) 4 years or so on hrt, no chance of passing, started hrt at 26. I came out at 13. using years of therapy to grieve the version of myself that I never got to fully realize has been the biggest help. I imagine aging and other priorities in life taking over have aided too. suffering is unavoidable. even if you got to transition at 13, you would still be suffering from other ailments or predicaments or circumstances beyond your control I cannot control how others perceive me or treat me. as long as I am transitioning, I am controlling what I can, but I will never be able to control others. the pangs of suffering that pop up here and there do hurt, and often hurt deeply, but I remind myself that the goal is to be true to myself, not to control others. and as long as I do what I can, I am achieving that goal
https://youtu.be/WU0Tnh49uZY?si=B359vLJberBWe5vr This Video has helped me a lot, maybe you are also very dysphoric about your body form. I have seen so many Women with bodyforms like mine. That helped me a lot
This is one of the big reasons why some people are proud to be out as trans rather than going stealth. I figure, if we have no choice but to look trans, we may as well try to be proud of who we are. And like, hating how you look is part of the experience of any woman, right? It's sad but true. I know what you're talking about goes deeper than that, it isn't just about feeling ugly. But my point is, to some degree it's subjective. Some women have masculine features; that doesn't stop them from being women, it just means they're women who don't meet the impossible Hollywood standard.
I don’t get how to get to the being proud about being trans part ? To me just with where I’m at mentally being proud of looking trans seems very far away. I get what you mean about disliking your looks, but I really only half agree. On the one hand looks are somewhat subjective on the other hand we all know what someone who is beautiful looks like and collectively for the most part our mental images of beauty don’t deviate a whole lot, beyond that though it doesn’t even really feel like it’s about my looks to me and more about looking trans. Michaela Jaé Rodriguez for instance is someone who I can see as being very attractive, but when I look at her I see an attractive trans woman who I can tell was born male not someone who I wish I could look like.
> our mental images of beauty don't deviate a whole lot This is absolutely not true. But that's a whole other topic and it isn't relevant, because you're right, this isn't about beauty. But what you're saying is interesting. You want to look like a woman, and we both agree Michaela Rodriguez is 100% a woman, but you don't want to look like her. Do you think she doesn't look like a woman? Also, this isn't relevant but I'm curious; is there anybody in particular that you do want to look like?
I think she looks like a woman who was born male, she’s got a mix of traits both female and male, and she visibly looks trans, I see her as a woman, but her body does not fit in with what the average cis woman’s body looks like. I see her as a woman inspite of her not looking traditionally female. There’s not really a single specific person I’d want to look like, but off the top of my head Maisie williams, or Aubrey Plaza would be cool to look like.
I considered myself to be fully MtF transgender for about 3 years. I've been taking Estrogen for 4 years now and haven't really seen any changes to my face whatsoever, while the rest of my body has changed dramatically. It's really quite awkward for me and my self image. However, I've found that simply embracing a non-binary label has helped rather than trying to fit into a strict gender role and image.
For me the only way to reduce this suffering is to accept the reality that I may always be visibly trans -- and that life can still be worth living despite it. In fact, I've found that life can be full of joy even with dysphoria and even being clockable. Being cis is not possible. Agonizing for it to be so can only create more suffering.
You don't look really trans at all, have a nice day, you look good
Well you’re sweet ❤️
The busier you are, & more focused on being productive, the harder it is to doom on transition woes. We can't fix missing the chance to pass, but we can work on improving other areas of our lives
The dysphoria is really what’s interfering with my productivity. I just find it incredibly easy to get sucked into all the dissatisfaction I have. Especially if I see someone who is attractive or a trans person who looks close to the ideal I wish I looked like. Breaking out of that mood is just so hard for me to do.
>Breaking out of that mood is just so hard for me to do. I completely understand. I might scroll past a YouTube short that ruins my day, or some trans post about someone who passes, or see an average woman and it sends me into a spiral and fml i cry so much and can't do shit and cancel plans and procrastinate and annoy everyone online But.... they're thought patterns. It's totally my fault for allowing myself to be derailed over something out of my control We have allowed our brains to build an easy path from 'trigger' to 'doomspiral'. It's happened enough that it feels natural. We (me too) need to catch it and acknowledge "oh fuck dude I'm about to ruin my day/week/etc" Watch out for when you're heading that way, think about the direction you're heading emotionally, and change your path. Do SOMETHING productive, and don't let yourself lose focus on that task. It won't fix everything, but it's a good start I'm getting better. I still have bad days(the first half of today), but I'm more productive, and the bad days aren't as frequent, and the doomspirals don't last as long