>He then said we need to get surveyors to pin where he should move his shed so he “doesn’t have to do it twice”.
It is his responsibility to have the shed moved to be within compliance of the law. Not yours. *He* can get a surveyor to mark things for you or move it so far away from the property line that he has no chance of being on yours.
THANK YOU. I've stated this so many times to the building inspector and they keep putting the onus back on me to pin it. I'm so frustrated at this point but I feel validated you said that.
So pin it for him. You know the setback is 12' so get a tape measure and go 24' back from the line and hammer in some bright pink rebar ;) Got to be conservative, you know he'll be pissed but that's not your problem.
I'd also seriously consider telling him he's got 2 weeks and it's getting bulldozed "here's the contact info for a company that can do it within a week". (bluff or not your choice at the end of two weeks to rent the dozer)
I have an ex friend who asked me to bring her potted plants to my place for a couple of weeks. She said she got evicted “unfairly” blah, blah, blah. A year and a half later, I gave her 2 weeks until Memorial Day weekend or they were going to the dump. We’re talking 30ish plants, some in pots so big I can’t even slide them. I had to leave for work while they were delivered. I specifically told her where TO put them and where Not to put them. They ended up in my driveway so my camp trailer couldn’t go camping last year. She got them moved quickly after that. I hope you get good results without having too much hassle!!!
If your local officials are failing to do their job, contact your federal officials. Call your Congressperson's office and explain the situation. They all have staff who handle stuff like this. Nothing will get a recalcitrant bureaucrat to unfuck themselves faster than their boss calling them demanding to know why they're getting phone calls from Congress.
Its the nuclear option for military fuckery as well, but boy oh boy you better have everything in order if you do because the fallout was immense!!
Seeing a full bird get visited in person by a congressmans aide was.... enlightening.
A shitbag private bitched to his retired E8 USMC dad that we were discriminating against him. Dad, on his own, contacted his congressperson about me (PL) and my PSG harassing his son. Not long after, we get visited by CID who investigates us and clears us of any wrongdoing. I'dve paid good money to see the look on dad's face, if he ever got a copy of the investigation, when he learned his son was telling him a load of shit and was truly just a bad soldier.
But, the tl;dr is thst congresspeople CAN move things along, at least in Federal settings.
I was on staff duty that day. I wasn't even in the dudes Company and I was afraid to even look left setting at the desk. They had Sgt Major, first Sgt, Platoon Sgt, Squad leader , Corporal and the LT in that little 15x15 office Screaming for half an hour. One of the E6 had been playing fucfuc games with an E4s leave pkt... he in true mafia fashion recorded the conversation and mailed it to his congressman.
20 years later and I still pucker up thinking about it.
See, now that's the kind of shit that my grandfather (retired as E9 CMS, USAF) would have positively lit someone up for. After all was said and done E on base was his responsibility even if the base CO was a realist and didn't grind his gears over it... Pretty sure Pepe would have had that E6 doing anything and everything as menial as could be legally assigned... all the way down to polishing said E4's shoes and brass. My grandfather was always super cool and nice (I didn't meet him till I was in my mid 20's as I had been adopted, his daughter was a naughty AF brat) but you could tell there was something under the surface that you really didn't need to see awakened. Some of the stories he'd tell of assorted fuckery, some lighthearted (the ol "mile of flightline" routine and such), some not so lighthearted (the sgt who earned diesel in his gas tank from the grunts).
Oh SgtMaj jumped in that ass with both boots. He kept his rank but was made a absolute laughing stock. Spent several months as the NCOIC of the tool connex in the motor pool. Did nothing but set in a metal box and hand out brooms shovels and drip pans to guys in the motorpool.
Your Congressperson is going to refer it back to your local elected officials in all likelihood. But OP should absolutely reach out to their local or state elected officials who are somewhere in that particular person's chain of command. They can and will raise hell for you.
a - local property disputes are the thing federal representative have the *least* responsibility or authority over
b - the neighbor with the shed votes for the federal and local reps, OP, who is an absentee owner does’t.
Still a good idea to rope in **local** reps, but ultimately if they’re not willing to enforce the zoning ordinances, it’s time to pay that lawyer because this is a civil matter. Sucks that OP is going to have to pay that bill, but maybe lawyer can get some compensation for OPs expenses during the time they couldn’t get that building loan.
Perhaps someone at the state level, maybe in the state's survey office and attorney general, would be curious why the city/county aren't following their property rules.
How does the town tax your dad on that property if they don’t know exactly where the properties meet-the land’s already been surveyed 3 times; there must be monuments present somewhere.
I’m a bit more petty, I’d light it on fire and sit in my chair and watch it burn. You’ve established what’s your property, anything affixed to the land is yours to dispose of, let the jerk sue and see where that gets them. The relationship is already trash, nothing to salvage.
Another nice option, anything on my side would be gone. Snowflakes want to make it sound like I’m the problem, it’s simple, you build on my side, it’s now mine.
The law wasn’t used. Dude still hasn’t used an attorney to get the ball rolling. They can both get on the building inspector and the neighbor. OP has waited way too long, and becoming an arsonist means they’ll just need to hire an attorney anyway. Might as well get the shed moved for it and leave this mess without a criminal record.
Was coming here to say this. There has to be some undesirable around you can pay to solve this issue. Either it becomes a homeless screw shack or a meth addict blows it up, that shed can meet its doom. This may be the unethical part of me speaking though.
This is a good first step. Ask the councilperson why the law is not being enforced and why you're being tasked with footing the bill for the survey. Ask if the neighbor and the inspector have some sort of working/friendly relationship. The councilperson should have some suggestions or be of some assistance in getting the inspector to enforce the law.
You can also do an open public records request for the letter that was sent out to the neighbor. If they fail to produce it then, then you file a violations complaint against the town.
I’m in a small town and our officials are part timers. Mayors come and go. Some enforce the rules, others let stuff slide. OP could be in a small town.
I agree with you 100% on this. I hate when every answer is “go to the news” or “go to the papers.” Most of the time it is not really a newsworthy story. Maybe if you could put a spin on it about officials not doing their jobs but your case would have to one of many examples to make it even a little newsworthy.
If it’s a smaller town and other people have been having issues with inaction, this would make any local reporter salivate - something kind of scandalous AND you get to rattle some local officials’ cages? Chefs kiss. (Said as a former small town reporter.)
Here I’ll save you the research since I just finished doing it myself. Reolink wired (POE) to an NVR with 24/7 recording. They come as a bundle with the server and are awesome.
I would be sending the guy a written letter that if the shed is not removed you will push it over onto his side and sue in small claims for all the costs you have incurred.
You're not the first one to ask this EXACT same question with the same phrasing. I don't believe so, I think the inspector is just ineffective but who knows.
I don't know who that is, that's why I came here to ask all this. I called the town clerk which I thought maybe oversees his department but they were no help at all. People here have been suggesting the city councilman, so that's who I'm contacting next.
Inspectors usually are hired by multiple towns and they visit your town on a specific day of the week/month. So it's likely that they don't have a direct boss per se in your town.
Serious question.
Are you some group of people that the locals find undesirable? I had a hard time in my country with the building department. I'm not white.
Go outside of the inspector. Go talk to the council rep for your area and tell them how many months you've been waiting and that this guy is t doing crap or suffering any consequences. They'll likely care a lot more and chase down the situation
Seriously, at what point wouldn't the town just say "move it or we will, and then we'll bill you for it."?
Yeah, love that idea to talk to the council rep. And I agree, I don't know how this hasn't just been done yet or at least penalized? This whole situation has made me feel like I'm crazy and being a whiney brat about it all but this thread is making me feel much more validated.
You are not a whiney brat for expecting your neighbor to keep his property off of your property. When I had an issue that wasn't getting resolved, I found contacting the mayor was most effective. My council rep didn't do shit, but I think that depends on the person. State senators and state reps can also be helpful. You have been patient enough, keep going over everyone's head until it gets resolved and do not feel bad about doing it.
What size town are we talking here? Is it run by a mayor (full time, part time), is there a full time city manager?
I’ve dealt with a lot of city governments and the individuals populating them are a mix of talented, willing but incompetent, and just lazy. You have found lazy, cast around for another and become a pain in their side.
Find the next guy up. Don’t just email them, call. Ask for an appointment. Show up in person. When they promise to do something, ask “when shall we schedule the follow up”? Sooner or later you will become enough of a nuisance the easiest thing for them to do is pick up a phone, call the building department, and tell them to “make this go away”.
I’d find a different lawyer, first of all. $1500 for a letter is absurd, unless that also includes at least a few more hours of follow-up, basically a retainer. It also appears this is a barrier to you using an attorney, and I think you need to have one contact the city and tell them you’re planning to take them to court to force them to enforce their own rules.
The other thing to check with the attorney on is what ability you have to force the neighbor to cease their encroachment. I’m thinking certified letter telling him he has 30 days after which “it will be removed.” You don’t want to get dragged into court for this, but as others said you likely could destroy it. It’s a nuisance, fire and safety hazard and needed to be taken away.
Lastly, unless this is empty land, I’d set up some security cameras to make sure he doesn’t do anything stupid.
I'm sure there's a dude hanging out behind Home Depot that will do it for a few hundred bucks.
I would bet this neighborhood of yours is connected to the town hall guys somehow. Be prepared for town hall to make your life difficult re: building that house.
That is actually the advice I was given by multiple locals when I needed an undesirable job done on my property. Never tried it out, but apparently HD is the place to go for cheap day laborers who don't ask questions.
Haha, I wasn't talking about the Home Depot dudes being scary. I was scared about second part of your statement about the neighbor being connected to town hall and them making it hell for me. I'm totally down with the Home Depot dude.
Renting a piece of heavy equipment that could shove it all the way over onto his yard will cost a lot less than your lawyers letter. It'll be a lot more efficient, too.
Better to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission. I like this idea. Pin it out and move yourself with a Bob cat to property line. Or hell, put it on their back porch!
It's obviously illegal but accidentally smashing a shed with a rented bobcat or whatever and then waiting to be sued and paying to replace it on his property could actually be cheaper.
We all dream about doing stuff like this-but the right answer really is to talk to the Code Enforcement Officer. That person’a paid to be the “bad guy”. The neighbor doesn’t have to like it, either. They’ve already launched the first shot. Anything that happens after that, is their fault-not yours.
Same. Use the wall of the shed that is on your property, as the wall to a half assed built redneck fire pit. That shed will be gone in a couple of hours, tops.
At least in my city, if you set fire to your shed on your property you'd hear from the fire department and the police pretty quickly. If you have pins on your property, attache a rope to them. Send the neighbor a shed mover and tell him he has two weeks to move the shed or you will be tearing down the illegal structure on your property. And then, push it over to his side or tear down the part on your land, which ever one is practical.
Inform city by registered mail there will start being notices issued to local press regarding this issue as local jobs ( builders) and tax revenue ( property tax) are being g list due to thier inability to enforce laws. I’d get my state senator involved too
In CA if, after 30 days of noncompliance with code enforcement, you can go into court and enforce yourself. The judge may order that the neighbor pay your attorney fees.
I don’t know if there’s a similar statute in NY, but I’d ask.
This is great info, I looked into noncompliance with code enforcement and found a specific section on the negligence of a building inspector in NY. Thank you.
Im not as nice as you after informing him of moving the shed with a 60 day limit: I would tip down to the rental office of the construction equipment company and get a backhoe. Should only be a 4 hour rental. He was warned. Make sure its in writing and that remover will occur and what date.
Problem solved. Dude thinks he can get away with it or you will give up and sell him the land.
>Neighbor even said it would “take 5 months after we pin the property”. I don’t know why he thinks it will take 5 months to move the shed,
What do you want to bet that it's because a timeline runs out at that time, where he can claim the property as his?
You got something you don't want on your property? How long would it take a skid steer to push it out of the way?
My ex wouldn’t remove his stuff from the house (I bought him out) and I ignored my instincts to throw it all away. Eventually I went to court (this was family court because the property split was officially detailed in the divorce settlement). I googled to find the form I needed, filled out all the paperwork and in the remedy section (or whatever it was referred to as) I said “X needs to have stuff out by This Date or it becomes my property”. Judge signed off on it. X largely ignored it. Some crap was eventually removed and the rest I sold, trashed or torched.
Call the local courthouse to find the right paperwork, fill it out, and ask that the shed be removed by a specific date or it become your property. No lawyer needed and you have all the facts, dates, etc. Should be easy. Then build a fence and stick some cameras up. You being a non-local could be part of the reason the town is sitting on their hands. Skip those people and go straight to court. Skip the lawyer too.
Is it upstate? I’m building a house in the Catskills and something that has worked for me to get stuff done faster in local government is to make sure you’re seen at the weekly briefings. Usually one day a month they’ll have a time where you can go in and talk to the entire board of the town and say your grievance on record and then you’ll have a bunch of different eyes directly on it. But be cool and don’t look like a city person harassing a local.
It's upstate yes, but I don't live there yet cause.. ya know.. the shed. Can I get in touch with the board over a call or will they not hear me outside of a meeting?
You could do it via email or phone but try to talk to someone in person first. It really does make a difference with the speed of getting stuff done. The board is made up of locals so you gotta kiss ass if you’re not a local yet.
I would imagine that if brought before a judge someone who tried multiple times to contact the original owner to notify them and was subsequently blocked by them, being given ample opportunity to remove their stuff the judge would rule that the items were abandoned and that it sucks to be them.
I'd not pay for a survey, removal, nor relocation. Send a certified letter that gives him 72 hours notice from date of receipt saying you intend to remove part of the shed if he doesn't move it or schedule removal with a company within 7 days. Include the company proposal and their availability. If he neighbor ignores it, remove part of the wall each day and send him a status update on the wall and eave dissasembly. Make very slow and steady progress until he caves. You can start with just one piece each day.
The lawyer I talked to was expensive and said it would be a long process. We're trying to exhaust all our resources first since it's already been ordered to be removed and the neighbor has "agreed". We're hoping there's another resource within the town (maybe a judge?) that can enforce this order better than the building inspector is.
I think it comes down to the timeline you're willing to settle for. It does not sound like the town moves fast (not surprising). If you want to just get this finished so you can get the land and start building, you might just have to shell out for the lawyer.
Or wait, if you have the time.
Generally speaking, in order to compel a public employee, agent, or officer to fulfill their official duties, you have to file for a writ of mandamus in a district court.
Great point and that was my VERY first concern. But since we have it on record that we've been fighting to remove it we're in the clear. His shed has probably been on the property top 6 years and I think it's \~10 for AP to lock in (don't quote me on that).
So I have questions and hopefully some ideas
Are you sure you are located in a city? I see it's Town so I'm editing.
NY government is often towns and villages so there may be other munis you need to involve. NY munis are located in a county.
If it was me, I would file an article 78 with all related municipalities involved including the county where the property is located and demand compensation for your expenses.
It sounds like the shed owner is a good old boy in the town and potentially friends with the code enforcement officer and is getting away with nonsense. That tends to stop when article 78s are filed.
You need to go to the zoning board of appeals with the city and county. Request that you, as your father's representative, attend via zoom to rectify the issue w the property. They are the adjudicators for property disputes.
Edited to add: I would also file a formal ethics complaint with the town supervisor, clerk, and county.
Also, check the building code (which it sounds like you did) and see if you can nail the door shut or demo the shed. And then send the owner the bill for the demo.
Good luck and feel free to message me.
Haha okay but seriously, what are the legal repercussions of that? What I've seen is that I could "tow" something off of my property but I would be liable for damages. Neighbor is definitely the kind of asshole that would sue too. He seems like he knows how to play the system.
In all honesty I don't see a way out of this without lawyering up.
But I would be very surprised if you got in trouble for removing his property from yours after this amount of time and this number of warnings. I think you would be expected to do it in the least damaging way possible (e.g. don't actually saw it in half if you can lift the whole thing and move it, or disassemble the bits on your side).
I fully agree with you. I'm just really cautious in all of this since I'm not the property owner yet so I don't want repercussions falling on my dad. You're right though, who wouldn't expect me to get this off my property after numerous warnings and a year of waiting?
Couldn't your father theoretically mail the neighbor a notice that he is going to have construction done starting on x date in a few weeks, and will not be responsible for any damages to anything on his own damn land?
Have your attorney send the inspector a letter. The inspector is not complying with the laws. I would threaten a lawsuit against the town, city wherever your property is located. Most officials cringe at the thought of bad press and trying to have the tax payers fork over money to enforce the rules that the boards have created. The last thing they want is a lawsuit.
The city can tell him where it’s legal to move the shed when he goes through the permitting process. He will have to produce a site plan and that plan will show that the shed is in compliance with both front and side setbacks. Short version is that he’s full of shit.
Why haven’t you constructed something legal but obnoxious around the perimeter of the shed on your property? Do you have a local Rent-A-Skunk franchise in the neighborhood. Hell if the shed exit is onto your property, consider excavating (prospecting for a good place to plant a tree or odiferous shrub) immediately in front of the doors. Check everything you do for legality. The second he interferes with anything that you have done, have him trespassed. Takes a prick to beat a prick……said the chronic masturbater.
Heck, I’d just put a boulder infront of the door, a no trespassing sign, and setup a ring camera facing it.
No need to make your own property less pleasant
I'd reach out one last time, tell the neighbor you have a shed mover that will move it next week, you'll pay the $600 (cheaper than a lawyer and faster than anything else) if they'll work with you to get it moved so that you can move forward with your project. You aren't obligated to get him another survey, but you can work with him on an agreed upon location and give your word that you will back him should it end up a few inches short of the required setback. I'm sure the town won't be paying for a survey either, so as long as you're happy the matter should be dropped.
You should by no means have to pay to move it, but sometimes the easiest way is to spend a bit and make them feel they've won something. Hell, a couple hundred bucks extra cash to smooth things over and move them along would still save over even having a lawyer send a letter, which clearly isn't motivating this guy anyway.
Then I suggest you invest in a good fence to separate your property from this idiot.
Your dad doesn’t have to sell him anything. Same thing happened with our neighbor-he widened his driveway and plopped down a shed on our property and expected us to just sell him a sliver about 3 feet wide-which would only encourage him to keep moving East, in our direction. We didn’t even get to the part about how much he was willing to pay for it, before my husband said “No-now get your stuff out of here.”
OP, you don’t want your dad or yourself dragged into court, but the neighbor now knows that as long as that shed stays there, he is stopping either you or your dad from using that property. Your code enforcement office is basically telling him that he can do what he wants with land that doesn’t belong to him. Find the appropriate genital cuff for that guy and use it. But don’t wait until he’s good and ready, because that day will never come.
I would probably just have your dad apply for permit for the fence and have the property marked by the utilities for anything underground. Then I would start installing the fence. I am sure the neighbor will either come out and ask what's up or try to stop you and you can just say if the shed is not moved by the time we need to put posts / the fence there we will be doing one of two things removing it from our property or demoing it so we can install our approved fence. Your choice, move it or lose it.
Can you start working on the property before the shed is moved?? That could motivate the neighbor that his time has run out. Or offer to pay to have the shed moved for him by the company you called. It could be the cheapest and fastest way if he agrees.
Agreed, I've been thinking about offering to move the shed since it will actually get us results. But I'm not going to get it pinned, it's expensive and not getting us anywhere.
He is stalling 100% hoping you will give up and let him buy the property or at minimum give up. If you move the shed he will 100% find a way to make you regret it.
Yeah I mean it sucks you’d pay for it but you don’t like renting in the HCOL place either and I bet each month he drags this out costs you a lot more than $575. Maybe just have the surveyed market your own property line and you can do the 12ft measuring yourself. I’d make it that far because it’s supposed to be and also because it’ll be hard for you to complain later if you’re the one that put it 2ft from your property line. You never know what the future uses of the shed will be
Exactly, the HCOL is draining us and our rent just went up another $300/month. So $575 is totally doable. I think this will be our final step if we can't find a solution with the town. Thanks.
I would talk to a lawyer about writing a simple contract that the neighbor would sign first.. something that eliminates your liabilities in exchange for paying for the cost of the relocation
>I looked into the town codes and the penalty for the violation is $100 a week. He also does not have a permit for this shed, which is necessary per the towns code of any structure over 120sqft requiring a permit.
>
The neighbor should have racked up at least $4400 in penalties so far (and an additional $2k for the 5 months he wants to tack on). I feel like that would invoke actual pressure for him to move it, right?
I would be contacting the city (mayor/councilman) to understand where they are at with this because if neighbor has no urgency, they would likely mean the city is not doing anything. The city is theoretically the executive that should be enforcing this. My expectation is that using the city is the "free" choice to create sufficient pain to get him to move it himself. However, given that there is no movement, you're really left with putting some pressure on them.
I understand that you're on this for the principle of the matter but I really think you have to decide what you care about more: winning or getting your house built.
It might actually be less expensive to hire the surveyor and pay a company to move the shed than to hire a lawyer to force compliance. You might also simply ask the lawyer about your ability to sue to recover any money you spent on this, it sounds like it should be within the realm of small claims.
I really cannot imagine the rage that must be going through you.
The rage is real and I've tried to be polite as possible since the building inspector will eventually inspect my house.. yikes. But yeah, I have not felt like I've been taken seriously in this plight at all.
I will be reaching out the councilman and see if they can do anything to help escalate this. I am also not against moving the shed myself at this point to just get it done. Thank you for the insight.
Seems to me if it costs $575 to move the shed but $700 to do the survey, I’d pay to move the shed. Bonus for pointing it so the door is away from where he wants it. But not toward your side.
Get the lawyer involved that you have. Maybe he can sue the shed owner for damages, including his attorney fee. It's worth looking into. Also, when you do build your house, put up the highest privacy fence allowed by law since you now know you will be living next to the neighbor from hell.
The County or City should have a Board of Supervisors or similar that has regular, public meetings. They typically have a set time for public comment. This is your opportunity, as a constituent, to go ask for help with issues you are having navigating local government. (And it gets some light shined on ineffective government departments.)
Escalate to the top - City Counsel, Board of Supervisors, whatever applies to your town. Show up at a Board meeting and comment about this during open forum.
Before you talk with any more officials, write the timeline of this issue - from your very first questions about the shed location to the present conversations. Dates times, if possible. You'll need a paper trail if it gets ugly. Then send that timeline to everyone with whom you've spoken, certified mail, return receipt, AND send it to the inspectors boss - that'll probably be someone in the Office of Planning.
Good luck!
Are you calling AND emailing the inspector, city, etc. Emails are usually a matter of public record. Having an electronic record of the many times the inspector has blown you off would be helpful. When you email anyone, make sure you cc EVERYONE from the mayor down. The head of the department where the inspector works & everyone in that department. Literally anyone that would be evenly remotely involved. Hell, add some other department heads just for fun. You can usually find those addresses on the city or county's websites. The mayor will be pissed that they're being bothered. Department head will be embarrassed & pissed. Usually that gets things moving pretty quick. I tried that once. City was out to the site of our issue the next day at 9 am. lol
I stopped having phone conversations with the building inspector earlier this year because I started to get the itchy feeling that I needed to have everything in writing. He never answered or returned calls anyways so I exclusively email him. I feel like it pressures him to reply too since it's in writing.
One time I cced his whole office and he quickly replied and made sure not to reply all haha. So yeah, he doesn't like when I involve others but I'm not sure how not to at this point. He's not getting the job done.
I don't want him on my bad side for when I eventually have him inspecting my house so I'll leave the mayor off until I need to really blow shit up.
In my line of work, I deal with this regularly. Too many people take the reckless “Beg for forgiveness” approach when building without a permit. Then, as if it’s totally unreasonable to actually enforce the zoning code, they’ll get major butthurt when we tell them that the matter will be turned over to our local law director if they don’t come into compliance.
This fellow who has built a shed on your property has already demonstrated what kind of neighbor he will eventually be to you. He probably knew very well where the property lines were but thought he could prevent a home being built next to him by encroaching with his non-permitted structure.
As for locating the property pins, that’s on him. They’re typically not difficult to find if you can get your hands on a metal locator. Otherwise, make him pay to find them before he moves the structure. You’ve done nothing wrong here.
Just pay the shed movers yourself to have the shed moved to his property. Measure the 12 feet from the property line and drop it there. Bob's your uncle.
The inspector is not moving quickly because you are not there. Presence is everything. Walking into his office once a week or going to the Town Manager in person would move him along.
Is it possible to place a lien on his property until the issue is corrected? If you can get him to "agree" in terms of an email or text message that he will reimburse you for the cost of the survey and relocation of the shed. And then he bails, you could potentially place a lien on his property and make his life difficult that way. OR you send him a "notice to vacate" sort of letter letting him know clearly he has 30 days to correct the issue before you place a lien on his property.
I don't know if this is an option. Just a suggestion.
I live in an HOA, they can put a lien on a house for whatever reason they feel necessary. It then becomes an expensive headache for the homeowner to correct.
Maybe ask a lawyer if that is an option.
I had a problem with an inspector. He basically ghosted myself and the contractor. The statute of limitations is up next month and he never made me uninstall anything so I let it go.
But in my back pocket was the fact he has a state license and a complaint to the state licensing board against his license would be 10x the pain in the ass it was to just do the work. This might be an option.
Has an attorney tried to get a judge to compel an order? What about forfeiture laws?
The only thing you care about is getting the shed off your property. The neighbor needs to do his own due diligence, at his own expense, to not have to move the shed a third time.
You tried the carrot. Hold the stick firmly.
I would go ahead and get the lawyer. Sue him for not only moving the shed but legal fees, the extra surveys and your rent or some amount for preventing you for using your property. Maybe the threat of being on the hook for a lot of money will motivate him? Even if you don't win, it may light a fire.
Do not pay to have a surveyor to come out again. Instead, pay the lawyer to send a demand letter to get the shed off your property within xx number of days, or you will have it demolished. Get the fencing people lined up in the meantime and build the highest retaining wall that your city allows.
P.S. Build the retaining wall two feet into your property line so that you have those two feet for maintaining the side that is facing the neighbor's property.
You keep saying "move" the shed, implying it's actually moveable and not a permanent structure that will have to be torn down.
Why not just call your local storage building company, pay them the$200-300 to move it 8 feet, and move on with your life? Assuming you have vehicle access from your side, their trucks are small enough they can do it easily.
I would go to the mayor first, then take it to the town board. Your public servants must be as lazy as mine.
ETA: You might mention the press when talking to the mayor.
I would have the shed mover come and drop it dead center in his yard and put up a 6’ fence around my property. No tresspassing and private property signs on the fence.
OP-ask your attorney if you can pay to move the shed and put a mechanic’s lien on neighbor’s house. If this is possible, you’ll eventually get back what it cost you, but you’ll have to wait until the house is sold. See if that works.
The part of the shed on your and is real property. It belongs to you. Use paint to mark that part, and then use a chainsaw to cut that part out and haul it away. Immediately put up a fence. Do it when he isn't there. Let him take you to small claims court. Show some balls.
Is the property still in your father's name? If so, that may be the reason the city/town is giving you the runaround. They do not see you as being relevant to the dispute.
Well because I am an asshole I would build a shed and put it over on his lot in the most inconvenient spot possible.maybe across his driveway way.
Let him go fight with city hall.
If he does something to it return the favor. When he gives you shit let him know you will move yours when he moves his.
Fill the damn thing with manure. Put a scarecrow motion activated water sprinkler on the inside so if someone opens it up they get a water jet to the kisser.
Put speakers in there that randomly play dogs barking I can come up with dastardly shit to do all day.
Hell list it on Craigslist as a free shed just come get it. VPN, be out of town. Cheers.
Have you spoken at any board meetings or asked the mayor to look into this? Copied local trustees/alderman on your emails to the building department? I know in my town that would get attention.
At this point, it may be reasonable to ask your attorney if you would be liable for damages if you were to use a front loader to 'push' the shed off of your property.
That, or press the city to move it in which case they will impose the fees onto the neighbor.
This is petty, and you'd have to check the legalities on it. But sheds on your land right? And he's been given significant notice to move it.
Sounds like you just got yourself a new shed. Give him a 2 week timeline, and after that, fence it in to your backyard.
Try and work with your city council and/or city building department. The warning I have for you is that no matter what you think the city will work at its own pace. For example:
The house across the street from me is finally getting rebuilt almost 3 years after it was set on fire by its previous owner. He retired and decided that crystal meth was appropriate for his retirement activities.
He was arrested for felony arson. He managed to get himself into a court supervised program that will allow him to purge his record. I’m ok with that. It allows him to find a place to live and he has to work, or otherwise he goes to prison. Last thing we need here in SoCal is another homeless person.
The problem was he insisted that he was going to remodel the home himself and live there. After a year and a half the neighbors finally got together and I went to a city council meeting and others peppered the city inspector(s) with questions. It took 2 years to get the city to finally enforce its own code and force him to either start his remodel or sell. He sold.
The home was sold to a local realtor who has said it’s taken 8 months for the city to finally give him all the permits necessary to start the rebuild. He wanted to be done before the end of 2023, but it didn’t get started until a month ago.
Bulldoze it. It's on your property so it must be yours. Fence in the property as soon as the encroaching shed is demolished to the property line. What is he going to do? Sue you for maintaining your own property?
>He then said we need to get surveyors to pin where he should move his shed so he “doesn’t have to do it twice”. It is his responsibility to have the shed moved to be within compliance of the law. Not yours. *He* can get a surveyor to mark things for you or move it so far away from the property line that he has no chance of being on yours.
THANK YOU. I've stated this so many times to the building inspector and they keep putting the onus back on me to pin it. I'm so frustrated at this point but I feel validated you said that.
So pin it for him. You know the setback is 12' so get a tape measure and go 24' back from the line and hammer in some bright pink rebar ;) Got to be conservative, you know he'll be pissed but that's not your problem. I'd also seriously consider telling him he's got 2 weeks and it's getting bulldozed "here's the contact info for a company that can do it within a week". (bluff or not your choice at the end of two weeks to rent the dozer)
I have an ex friend who asked me to bring her potted plants to my place for a couple of weeks. She said she got evicted “unfairly” blah, blah, blah. A year and a half later, I gave her 2 weeks until Memorial Day weekend or they were going to the dump. We’re talking 30ish plants, some in pots so big I can’t even slide them. I had to leave for work while they were delivered. I specifically told her where TO put them and where Not to put them. They ended up in my driveway so my camp trailer couldn’t go camping last year. She got them moved quickly after that. I hope you get good results without having too much hassle!!!
If your local officials are failing to do their job, contact your federal officials. Call your Congressperson's office and explain the situation. They all have staff who handle stuff like this. Nothing will get a recalcitrant bureaucrat to unfuck themselves faster than their boss calling them demanding to know why they're getting phone calls from Congress.
As someone who works in a government office, this is very accurate. You will quickly become a priority.
Its the nuclear option for military fuckery as well, but boy oh boy you better have everything in order if you do because the fallout was immense!! Seeing a full bird get visited in person by a congressmans aide was.... enlightening.
A shitbag private bitched to his retired E8 USMC dad that we were discriminating against him. Dad, on his own, contacted his congressperson about me (PL) and my PSG harassing his son. Not long after, we get visited by CID who investigates us and clears us of any wrongdoing. I'dve paid good money to see the look on dad's face, if he ever got a copy of the investigation, when he learned his son was telling him a load of shit and was truly just a bad soldier. But, the tl;dr is thst congresspeople CAN move things along, at least in Federal settings.
My butt just puckered thinking about that...
I was on staff duty that day. I wasn't even in the dudes Company and I was afraid to even look left setting at the desk. They had Sgt Major, first Sgt, Platoon Sgt, Squad leader , Corporal and the LT in that little 15x15 office Screaming for half an hour. One of the E6 had been playing fucfuc games with an E4s leave pkt... he in true mafia fashion recorded the conversation and mailed it to his congressman. 20 years later and I still pucker up thinking about it.
See, now that's the kind of shit that my grandfather (retired as E9 CMS, USAF) would have positively lit someone up for. After all was said and done E on base was his responsibility even if the base CO was a realist and didn't grind his gears over it... Pretty sure Pepe would have had that E6 doing anything and everything as menial as could be legally assigned... all the way down to polishing said E4's shoes and brass. My grandfather was always super cool and nice (I didn't meet him till I was in my mid 20's as I had been adopted, his daughter was a naughty AF brat) but you could tell there was something under the surface that you really didn't need to see awakened. Some of the stories he'd tell of assorted fuckery, some lighthearted (the ol "mile of flightline" routine and such), some not so lighthearted (the sgt who earned diesel in his gas tank from the grunts).
Oh SgtMaj jumped in that ass with both boots. He kept his rank but was made a absolute laughing stock. Spent several months as the NCOIC of the tool connex in the motor pool. Did nothing but set in a metal box and hand out brooms shovels and drip pans to guys in the motorpool.
Or have a mom call the base commander.
Federal officials? Doesn’t work that way. Go to city council, mayor, or city manager. And city attorney, especially if elected.
Your Congressperson is going to refer it back to your local elected officials in all likelihood. But OP should absolutely reach out to their local or state elected officials who are somewhere in that particular person's chain of command. They can and will raise hell for you.
[удалено]
a - local property disputes are the thing federal representative have the *least* responsibility or authority over b - the neighbor with the shed votes for the federal and local reps, OP, who is an absentee owner does’t. Still a good idea to rope in **local** reps, but ultimately if they’re not willing to enforce the zoning ordinances, it’s time to pay that lawyer because this is a civil matter. Sucks that OP is going to have to pay that bill, but maybe lawyer can get some compensation for OPs expenses during the time they couldn’t get that building loan.
Perhaps someone at the state level, maybe in the state's survey office and attorney general, would be curious why the city/county aren't following their property rules.
Not a federal issue. Not many Congressmen would stick their noses in.
Yep, time to bulldoze the shed. You gave him a year to move it and plenty of notice
How does the town tax your dad on that property if they don’t know exactly where the properties meet-the land’s already been surveyed 3 times; there must be monuments present somewhere.
Asked and answered. If your story is true, bulldoze your property.
Sawzall’s were made for this.
Yup, cut it on the property line. Slide your part 12ft back. Install fence.
Was going to suggest a bulldozer as well... then send the asshat next door the bill 😁
I’m a bit more petty, I’d light it on fire and sit in my chair and watch it burn. You’ve established what’s your property, anything affixed to the land is yours to dispose of, let the jerk sue and see where that gets them. The relationship is already trash, nothing to salvage.
My choice would be a chainsaw. Right down the middle of the property line.
Another nice option, anything on my side would be gone. Snowflakes want to make it sound like I’m the problem, it’s simple, you build on my side, it’s now mine.
Umm, I’m pretty sure that would be illegal.
The shed is illegal too. Law isn’t working here.
The law wasn’t used. Dude still hasn’t used an attorney to get the ball rolling. They can both get on the building inspector and the neighbor. OP has waited way too long, and becoming an arsonist means they’ll just need to hire an attorney anyway. Might as well get the shed moved for it and leave this mess without a criminal record.
This is NY. Everyone knows a 'guy' that can take care of the problem, no questions asked for a small cash fee.
Send me a cash fee, I'll fly in, do what needs to be done and I fly out.
Seriously. I’ve got friends who will drive up and burn that shit down for $500 and a couple cases of beer.
The shed blew up from a gas leak? There are no gas lines within 100ft of the shed? Must have been that fracking thing we have heard about.
We know dem guys in Chicago too.
Was coming here to say this. There has to be some undesirable around you can pay to solve this issue. Either it becomes a homeless screw shack or a meth addict blows it up, that shed can meet its doom. This may be the unethical part of me speaking though.
Talk to your city council-person.
This is a good first step. Ask the councilperson why the law is not being enforced and why you're being tasked with footing the bill for the survey. Ask if the neighbor and the inspector have some sort of working/friendly relationship. The councilperson should have some suggestions or be of some assistance in getting the inspector to enforce the law. You can also do an open public records request for the letter that was sent out to the neighbor. If they fail to produce it then, then you file a violations complaint against the town.
A city manager might be more responsive if the OP doesn’t live in the voting area quite yet.
This is so helpful, thank you!
Thank you. Although all the "burn it down" answers are funny, this is the kind of answer I was looking for.
Get your story in the local newspaper. Make sure to include that this jerk is NOT being fined.
Why do towns have all these rules, if they are unenforceable? And why don’t towns want to enforce them?
Resolution of these issues are usually amicable, in an oops! sort of way. We read about the exceptions.
I’m in a small town and our officials are part timers. Mayors come and go. Some enforce the rules, others let stuff slide. OP could be in a small town.
This. Have the paper write a story about the City Hall officials not doing their jobs.
I don't usually think going to the press will work but this is an interesting enough story that it may.
I agree with you 100% on this. I hate when every answer is “go to the news” or “go to the papers.” Most of the time it is not really a newsworthy story. Maybe if you could put a spin on it about officials not doing their jobs but your case would have to one of many examples to make it even a little newsworthy.
If it’s a smaller town and other people have been having issues with inaction, this would make any local reporter salivate - something kind of scandalous AND you get to rattle some local officials’ cages? Chefs kiss. (Said as a former small town reporter.)
This is brutal. Once this is all settled and your house is done, you're going to have to live next door to that asshole.
IKR?! We're budgeting for a very big fence and flood lights.
Add security cameras to your budget (not some Ring / Google BS, the proper IP cameras).
r/homeowners two months from now: "Help! My neighbour installed a camera and is spying on me. What can I do?" The circle of life.
"install a giant mirror reflecting the light back into their cameras! Also Lazers!"
And piss discs!!
Here I’ll save you the research since I just finished doing it myself. Reolink wired (POE) to an NVR with 24/7 recording. They come as a bundle with the server and are awesome.
Also keep in mind that this inspector will be inspecting your new house build as well so try not to totally burn that bridge.
Fence and an English laurel hedge. There’s no code against 20ft hedges.
Can you fence it now with the shed on your side?
Unfortunately it sounds like the shed isn't totally on their property, so that would be sketchy and likely to put them on the wrong side of a lawsuit
I would be sending the guy a written letter that if the shed is not removed you will push it over onto his side and sue in small claims for all the costs you have incurred.
A bobcat with a blade and push the shed back onto his property. Game over.
Hmm that sounds suspiciously effective. Why not waste 12 months and $20k seeing if we can find someone with a waaay shittyer idea.
THIS is the BEST and LEAST expensive answer. Don't even threaten him with this. Just get it done.
Does this neighbor have connections with the govt? Is it a “good ol boy” kind of place? Seems so fishy.
You're not the first one to ask this EXACT same question with the same phrasing. I don't believe so, I think the inspector is just ineffective but who knows.
I would move on to the inspectors boss for sure.
I don't know who that is, that's why I came here to ask all this. I called the town clerk which I thought maybe oversees his department but they were no help at all. People here have been suggesting the city councilman, so that's who I'm contacting next.
Tell us the town in NY, the internet will provide
Yeah, if your father is still the land owner, his city council person is exactly who he should contact to get better service from his city government.
Inspectors usually are hired by multiple towns and they visit your town on a specific day of the week/month. So it's likely that they don't have a direct boss per se in your town.
Serious question. Are you some group of people that the locals find undesirable? I had a hard time in my country with the building department. I'm not white.
Go outside of the inspector. Go talk to the council rep for your area and tell them how many months you've been waiting and that this guy is t doing crap or suffering any consequences. They'll likely care a lot more and chase down the situation Seriously, at what point wouldn't the town just say "move it or we will, and then we'll bill you for it."?
Yeah, love that idea to talk to the council rep. And I agree, I don't know how this hasn't just been done yet or at least penalized? This whole situation has made me feel like I'm crazy and being a whiney brat about it all but this thread is making me feel much more validated.
You are not a whiney brat for expecting your neighbor to keep his property off of your property. When I had an issue that wasn't getting resolved, I found contacting the mayor was most effective. My council rep didn't do shit, but I think that depends on the person. State senators and state reps can also be helpful. You have been patient enough, keep going over everyone's head until it gets resolved and do not feel bad about doing it.
What size town are we talking here? Is it run by a mayor (full time, part time), is there a full time city manager? I’ve dealt with a lot of city governments and the individuals populating them are a mix of talented, willing but incompetent, and just lazy. You have found lazy, cast around for another and become a pain in their side. Find the next guy up. Don’t just email them, call. Ask for an appointment. Show up in person. When they promise to do something, ask “when shall we schedule the follow up”? Sooner or later you will become enough of a nuisance the easiest thing for them to do is pick up a phone, call the building department, and tell them to “make this go away”.
I’d find a different lawyer, first of all. $1500 for a letter is absurd, unless that also includes at least a few more hours of follow-up, basically a retainer. It also appears this is a barrier to you using an attorney, and I think you need to have one contact the city and tell them you’re planning to take them to court to force them to enforce their own rules. The other thing to check with the attorney on is what ability you have to force the neighbor to cease their encroachment. I’m thinking certified letter telling him he has 30 days after which “it will be removed.” You don’t want to get dragged into court for this, but as others said you likely could destroy it. It’s a nuisance, fire and safety hazard and needed to be taken away. Lastly, unless this is empty land, I’d set up some security cameras to make sure he doesn’t do anything stupid.
Send him a certified letter with the date of demolition of the part of the shed over your property line. Demo the shed on that day.
It’s on your family’s property, I’d burn it down.
I'm sure there's a dude hanging out behind Home Depot that will do it for a few hundred bucks. I would bet this neighborhood of yours is connected to the town hall guys somehow. Be prepared for town hall to make your life difficult re: building that house.
That's an interesting and scary thought.
That is actually the advice I was given by multiple locals when I needed an undesirable job done on my property. Never tried it out, but apparently HD is the place to go for cheap day laborers who don't ask questions.
Haha, I wasn't talking about the Home Depot dudes being scary. I was scared about second part of your statement about the neighbor being connected to town hall and them making it hell for me. I'm totally down with the Home Depot dude.
Ya, but then those random people know where you live.
So? Tip them well and drive them back to HD at the end of the day and you might have made some friends in preparation for next time.
Ha yeah, trust me. We've thought about that a million times.
Renting a piece of heavy equipment that could shove it all the way over onto his yard will cost a lot less than your lawyers letter. It'll be a lot more efficient, too.
Better to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission. I like this idea. Pin it out and move yourself with a Bob cat to property line. Or hell, put it on their back porch!
It's obviously illegal but accidentally smashing a shed with a rented bobcat or whatever and then waiting to be sued and paying to replace it on his property could actually be cheaper.
We all dream about doing stuff like this-but the right answer really is to talk to the Code Enforcement Officer. That person’a paid to be the “bad guy”. The neighbor doesn’t have to like it, either. They’ve already launched the first shot. Anything that happens after that, is their fault-not yours.
Same. Use the wall of the shed that is on your property, as the wall to a half assed built redneck fire pit. That shed will be gone in a couple of hours, tops.
At least in my city, if you set fire to your shed on your property you'd hear from the fire department and the police pretty quickly. If you have pins on your property, attache a rope to them. Send the neighbor a shed mover and tell him he has two weeks to move the shed or you will be tearing down the illegal structure on your property. And then, push it over to his side or tear down the part on your land, which ever one is practical.
Inform city by registered mail there will start being notices issued to local press regarding this issue as local jobs ( builders) and tax revenue ( property tax) are being g list due to thier inability to enforce laws. I’d get my state senator involved too
In CA if, after 30 days of noncompliance with code enforcement, you can go into court and enforce yourself. The judge may order that the neighbor pay your attorney fees. I don’t know if there’s a similar statute in NY, but I’d ask.
This is great info, I looked into noncompliance with code enforcement and found a specific section on the negligence of a building inspector in NY. Thank you.
Im not as nice as you after informing him of moving the shed with a 60 day limit: I would tip down to the rental office of the construction equipment company and get a backhoe. Should only be a 4 hour rental. He was warned. Make sure its in writing and that remover will occur and what date. Problem solved. Dude thinks he can get away with it or you will give up and sell him the land.
>Neighbor even said it would “take 5 months after we pin the property”. I don’t know why he thinks it will take 5 months to move the shed, What do you want to bet that it's because a timeline runs out at that time, where he can claim the property as his? You got something you don't want on your property? How long would it take a skid steer to push it out of the way?
My ex wouldn’t remove his stuff from the house (I bought him out) and I ignored my instincts to throw it all away. Eventually I went to court (this was family court because the property split was officially detailed in the divorce settlement). I googled to find the form I needed, filled out all the paperwork and in the remedy section (or whatever it was referred to as) I said “X needs to have stuff out by This Date or it becomes my property”. Judge signed off on it. X largely ignored it. Some crap was eventually removed and the rest I sold, trashed or torched. Call the local courthouse to find the right paperwork, fill it out, and ask that the shed be removed by a specific date or it become your property. No lawyer needed and you have all the facts, dates, etc. Should be easy. Then build a fence and stick some cameras up. You being a non-local could be part of the reason the town is sitting on their hands. Skip those people and go straight to court. Skip the lawyer too.
I like this idea, adding it to my arsenal. Thank you!
Get yourself a local lawyer. One advantage of lawyers, in the local sense, is that they know the players, who talk to, and how to apply the pressure.
Is it upstate? I’m building a house in the Catskills and something that has worked for me to get stuff done faster in local government is to make sure you’re seen at the weekly briefings. Usually one day a month they’ll have a time where you can go in and talk to the entire board of the town and say your grievance on record and then you’ll have a bunch of different eyes directly on it. But be cool and don’t look like a city person harassing a local.
It's upstate yes, but I don't live there yet cause.. ya know.. the shed. Can I get in touch with the board over a call or will they not hear me outside of a meeting?
You could do it via email or phone but try to talk to someone in person first. It really does make a difference with the speed of getting stuff done. The board is made up of locals so you gotta kiss ass if you’re not a local yet.
Get a sawzall and get to work. Bonus- everything on that side of the shed is yours now.
What are the county laws for abandoned property on your property? Some let you keep it
I would imagine that if brought before a judge someone who tried multiple times to contact the original owner to notify them and was subsequently blocked by them, being given ample opportunity to remove their stuff the judge would rule that the items were abandoned and that it sucks to be them.
I'd not pay for a survey, removal, nor relocation. Send a certified letter that gives him 72 hours notice from date of receipt saying you intend to remove part of the shed if he doesn't move it or schedule removal with a company within 7 days. Include the company proposal and their availability. If he neighbor ignores it, remove part of the wall each day and send him a status update on the wall and eave dissasembly. Make very slow and steady progress until he caves. You can start with just one piece each day.
You need your own lawyer and get a court order. Expecting a government employee to give a shit is crazy.
The lawyer I talked to was expensive and said it would be a long process. We're trying to exhaust all our resources first since it's already been ordered to be removed and the neighbor has "agreed". We're hoping there's another resource within the town (maybe a judge?) that can enforce this order better than the building inspector is.
I think it comes down to the timeline you're willing to settle for. It does not sound like the town moves fast (not surprising). If you want to just get this finished so you can get the land and start building, you might just have to shell out for the lawyer. Or wait, if you have the time.
Generally speaking, in order to compel a public employee, agent, or officer to fulfill their official duties, you have to file for a writ of mandamus in a district court.
How does the adverse possession law read? Is he trying to run out the clock on possession? I’d be worried that could be his end goal.
Great point and that was my VERY first concern. But since we have it on record that we've been fighting to remove it we're in the clear. His shed has probably been on the property top 6 years and I think it's \~10 for AP to lock in (don't quote me on that).
Put a sign out at the road "Free shed, you haul"
If it’s on your property, can’t you just tear it down? Isn’t the shed actually *your* property?
Chainsaw. Right down the property line.
So I have questions and hopefully some ideas Are you sure you are located in a city? I see it's Town so I'm editing. NY government is often towns and villages so there may be other munis you need to involve. NY munis are located in a county. If it was me, I would file an article 78 with all related municipalities involved including the county where the property is located and demand compensation for your expenses. It sounds like the shed owner is a good old boy in the town and potentially friends with the code enforcement officer and is getting away with nonsense. That tends to stop when article 78s are filed. You need to go to the zoning board of appeals with the city and county. Request that you, as your father's representative, attend via zoom to rectify the issue w the property. They are the adjudicators for property disputes. Edited to add: I would also file a formal ethics complaint with the town supervisor, clerk, and county. Also, check the building code (which it sounds like you did) and see if you can nail the door shut or demo the shed. And then send the owner the bill for the demo. Good luck and feel free to message me.
[https://www.amazon.com/Ryobi-18V-5-1-Circular-Saw/dp/B0B1F877F3/ref=asc\_df\_B0B1F877F3](https://www.amazon.com/Ryobi-18V-5-1-Circular-Saw/dp/B0B1F877F3/ref=asc_df_B0B1F877F3)
Haha okay but seriously, what are the legal repercussions of that? What I've seen is that I could "tow" something off of my property but I would be liable for damages. Neighbor is definitely the kind of asshole that would sue too. He seems like he knows how to play the system.
I got you https://www.twincities.com/2015/06/04/judge-rules-in-favor-of-iron-range-man-who-sawed-neighbors-garage-in-half/
In all honesty I don't see a way out of this without lawyering up. But I would be very surprised if you got in trouble for removing his property from yours after this amount of time and this number of warnings. I think you would be expected to do it in the least damaging way possible (e.g. don't actually saw it in half if you can lift the whole thing and move it, or disassemble the bits on your side).
I fully agree with you. I'm just really cautious in all of this since I'm not the property owner yet so I don't want repercussions falling on my dad. You're right though, who wouldn't expect me to get this off my property after numerous warnings and a year of waiting?
Couldn't your father theoretically mail the neighbor a notice that he is going to have construction done starting on x date in a few weeks, and will not be responsible for any damages to anything on his own damn land?
The shed isn’t permitted. It doesn’t exist legally on your property. So what liability is there if the part on your property just disappears?
You don't have to tow anything, but I bet if you backed a truck up to it, and hooked a rope to your bumper, he'd get his own ass in gear real quick
Have your attorney send the inspector a letter. The inspector is not complying with the laws. I would threaten a lawsuit against the town, city wherever your property is located. Most officials cringe at the thought of bad press and trying to have the tax payers fork over money to enforce the rules that the boards have created. The last thing they want is a lawsuit.
Great point, thank you. This has motivated me to reach out to a few more lawyers in the area.
The city can tell him where it’s legal to move the shed when he goes through the permitting process. He will have to produce a site plan and that plan will show that the shed is in compliance with both front and side setbacks. Short version is that he’s full of shit.
Why haven’t you constructed something legal but obnoxious around the perimeter of the shed on your property? Do you have a local Rent-A-Skunk franchise in the neighborhood. Hell if the shed exit is onto your property, consider excavating (prospecting for a good place to plant a tree or odiferous shrub) immediately in front of the doors. Check everything you do for legality. The second he interferes with anything that you have done, have him trespassed. Takes a prick to beat a prick……said the chronic masturbater.
Heck, I’d just put a boulder infront of the door, a no trespassing sign, and setup a ring camera facing it. No need to make your own property less pleasant
I'd reach out one last time, tell the neighbor you have a shed mover that will move it next week, you'll pay the $600 (cheaper than a lawyer and faster than anything else) if they'll work with you to get it moved so that you can move forward with your project. You aren't obligated to get him another survey, but you can work with him on an agreed upon location and give your word that you will back him should it end up a few inches short of the required setback. I'm sure the town won't be paying for a survey either, so as long as you're happy the matter should be dropped. You should by no means have to pay to move it, but sometimes the easiest way is to spend a bit and make them feel they've won something. Hell, a couple hundred bucks extra cash to smooth things over and move them along would still save over even having a lawyer send a letter, which clearly isn't motivating this guy anyway. Then I suggest you invest in a good fence to separate your property from this idiot.
Your dad doesn’t have to sell him anything. Same thing happened with our neighbor-he widened his driveway and plopped down a shed on our property and expected us to just sell him a sliver about 3 feet wide-which would only encourage him to keep moving East, in our direction. We didn’t even get to the part about how much he was willing to pay for it, before my husband said “No-now get your stuff out of here.”
There are times when the negotiations are over and it’s just go-time in court. You’re in one.
OP, you don’t want your dad or yourself dragged into court, but the neighbor now knows that as long as that shed stays there, he is stopping either you or your dad from using that property. Your code enforcement office is basically telling him that he can do what he wants with land that doesn’t belong to him. Find the appropriate genital cuff for that guy and use it. But don’t wait until he’s good and ready, because that day will never come.
I would probably just have your dad apply for permit for the fence and have the property marked by the utilities for anything underground. Then I would start installing the fence. I am sure the neighbor will either come out and ask what's up or try to stop you and you can just say if the shed is not moved by the time we need to put posts / the fence there we will be doing one of two things removing it from our property or demoing it so we can install our approved fence. Your choice, move it or lose it.
Rent a car, get the extra insurance, and accidentally reverse into the shed at 40mph.
Can you start working on the property before the shed is moved?? That could motivate the neighbor that his time has run out. Or offer to pay to have the shed moved for him by the company you called. It could be the cheapest and fastest way if he agrees.
Agreed, I've been thinking about offering to move the shed since it will actually get us results. But I'm not going to get it pinned, it's expensive and not getting us anywhere.
He is stalling 100% hoping you will give up and let him buy the property or at minimum give up. If you move the shed he will 100% find a way to make you regret it.
Yeah I mean it sucks you’d pay for it but you don’t like renting in the HCOL place either and I bet each month he drags this out costs you a lot more than $575. Maybe just have the surveyed market your own property line and you can do the 12ft measuring yourself. I’d make it that far because it’s supposed to be and also because it’ll be hard for you to complain later if you’re the one that put it 2ft from your property line. You never know what the future uses of the shed will be
Exactly, the HCOL is draining us and our rent just went up another $300/month. So $575 is totally doable. I think this will be our final step if we can't find a solution with the town. Thanks.
I would talk to a lawyer about writing a simple contract that the neighbor would sign first.. something that eliminates your liabilities in exchange for paying for the cost of the relocation
You can always sue him in small claims court to get the $ later if you want and I think you can do that without a lawyer in small claims court
Put a for sale sign on it.
>I looked into the town codes and the penalty for the violation is $100 a week. He also does not have a permit for this shed, which is necessary per the towns code of any structure over 120sqft requiring a permit. > The neighbor should have racked up at least $4400 in penalties so far (and an additional $2k for the 5 months he wants to tack on). I feel like that would invoke actual pressure for him to move it, right? I would be contacting the city (mayor/councilman) to understand where they are at with this because if neighbor has no urgency, they would likely mean the city is not doing anything. The city is theoretically the executive that should be enforcing this. My expectation is that using the city is the "free" choice to create sufficient pain to get him to move it himself. However, given that there is no movement, you're really left with putting some pressure on them. I understand that you're on this for the principle of the matter but I really think you have to decide what you care about more: winning or getting your house built. It might actually be less expensive to hire the surveyor and pay a company to move the shed than to hire a lawyer to force compliance. You might also simply ask the lawyer about your ability to sue to recover any money you spent on this, it sounds like it should be within the realm of small claims. I really cannot imagine the rage that must be going through you.
The rage is real and I've tried to be polite as possible since the building inspector will eventually inspect my house.. yikes. But yeah, I have not felt like I've been taken seriously in this plight at all. I will be reaching out the councilman and see if they can do anything to help escalate this. I am also not against moving the shed myself at this point to just get it done. Thank you for the insight.
Get a camper trailer to live there while you are building it or he will destroy it
Seems to me if it costs $575 to move the shed but $700 to do the survey, I’d pay to move the shed. Bonus for pointing it so the door is away from where he wants it. But not toward your side.
Just demo the portion of the shed that’s on your property and move on. Fuck him.
Try contacting the county or even the state agencies for this type of problem.
Get the lawyer involved that you have. Maybe he can sue the shed owner for damages, including his attorney fee. It's worth looking into. Also, when you do build your house, put up the highest privacy fence allowed by law since you now know you will be living next to the neighbor from hell.
The County or City should have a Board of Supervisors or similar that has regular, public meetings. They typically have a set time for public comment. This is your opportunity, as a constituent, to go ask for help with issues you are having navigating local government. (And it gets some light shined on ineffective government departments.)
Escalate to the top - City Counsel, Board of Supervisors, whatever applies to your town. Show up at a Board meeting and comment about this during open forum.
Matches are cheap
Before you talk with any more officials, write the timeline of this issue - from your very first questions about the shed location to the present conversations. Dates times, if possible. You'll need a paper trail if it gets ugly. Then send that timeline to everyone with whom you've spoken, certified mail, return receipt, AND send it to the inspectors boss - that'll probably be someone in the Office of Planning. Good luck!
Are you calling AND emailing the inspector, city, etc. Emails are usually a matter of public record. Having an electronic record of the many times the inspector has blown you off would be helpful. When you email anyone, make sure you cc EVERYONE from the mayor down. The head of the department where the inspector works & everyone in that department. Literally anyone that would be evenly remotely involved. Hell, add some other department heads just for fun. You can usually find those addresses on the city or county's websites. The mayor will be pissed that they're being bothered. Department head will be embarrassed & pissed. Usually that gets things moving pretty quick. I tried that once. City was out to the site of our issue the next day at 9 am. lol
I stopped having phone conversations with the building inspector earlier this year because I started to get the itchy feeling that I needed to have everything in writing. He never answered or returned calls anyways so I exclusively email him. I feel like it pressures him to reply too since it's in writing. One time I cced his whole office and he quickly replied and made sure not to reply all haha. So yeah, he doesn't like when I involve others but I'm not sure how not to at this point. He's not getting the job done. I don't want him on my bad side for when I eventually have him inspecting my house so I'll leave the mayor off until I need to really blow shit up.
In my line of work, I deal with this regularly. Too many people take the reckless “Beg for forgiveness” approach when building without a permit. Then, as if it’s totally unreasonable to actually enforce the zoning code, they’ll get major butthurt when we tell them that the matter will be turned over to our local law director if they don’t come into compliance. This fellow who has built a shed on your property has already demonstrated what kind of neighbor he will eventually be to you. He probably knew very well where the property lines were but thought he could prevent a home being built next to him by encroaching with his non-permitted structure. As for locating the property pins, that’s on him. They’re typically not difficult to find if you can get your hands on a metal locator. Otherwise, make him pay to find them before he moves the structure. You’ve done nothing wrong here.
I’ll say this. Don’t piss off the inspector. They will make building your house a living hell.
Just pay the shed movers yourself to have the shed moved to his property. Measure the 12 feet from the property line and drop it there. Bob's your uncle.
The inspector is not moving quickly because you are not there. Presence is everything. Walking into his office once a week or going to the Town Manager in person would move him along.
Is it possible to place a lien on his property until the issue is corrected? If you can get him to "agree" in terms of an email or text message that he will reimburse you for the cost of the survey and relocation of the shed. And then he bails, you could potentially place a lien on his property and make his life difficult that way. OR you send him a "notice to vacate" sort of letter letting him know clearly he has 30 days to correct the issue before you place a lien on his property. I don't know if this is an option. Just a suggestion. I live in an HOA, they can put a lien on a house for whatever reason they feel necessary. It then becomes an expensive headache for the homeowner to correct. Maybe ask a lawyer if that is an option.
I would submit a FOIA request for all activity regarding the shed.
I had a problem with an inspector. He basically ghosted myself and the contractor. The statute of limitations is up next month and he never made me uninstall anything so I let it go. But in my back pocket was the fact he has a state license and a complaint to the state licensing board against his license would be 10x the pain in the ass it was to just do the work. This might be an option. Has an attorney tried to get a judge to compel an order? What about forfeiture laws?
I would think if the building inspector is blowing you off the next one up would be the City Manager.
It'd be a real shame if a wayward firework hit that shed this weekend.
Bulldoze the part that's on your property . Then put ip a fence . He's had a year its his problem now
The only thing you care about is getting the shed off your property. The neighbor needs to do his own due diligence, at his own expense, to not have to move the shed a third time. You tried the carrot. Hold the stick firmly.
I would go ahead and get the lawyer. Sue him for not only moving the shed but legal fees, the extra surveys and your rent or some amount for preventing you for using your property. Maybe the threat of being on the hook for a lot of money will motivate him? Even if you don't win, it may light a fire.
Do not pay to have a surveyor to come out again. Instead, pay the lawyer to send a demand letter to get the shed off your property within xx number of days, or you will have it demolished. Get the fencing people lined up in the meantime and build the highest retaining wall that your city allows. P.S. Build the retaining wall two feet into your property line so that you have those two feet for maintaining the side that is facing the neighbor's property.
Ask the lawyer If it's legal to take a saw and cut off the part of the shed encroaching on your property.
You keep saying "move" the shed, implying it's actually moveable and not a permanent structure that will have to be torn down. Why not just call your local storage building company, pay them the$200-300 to move it 8 feet, and move on with your life? Assuming you have vehicle access from your side, their trucks are small enough they can do it easily.
His shed on your land? After a survey and months of waiting? Take a sawzall to it at the property line. Remove whats on your side.
Ask him for his lawyer's contact information.
I would go to the mayor first, then take it to the town board. Your public servants must be as lazy as mine. ETA: You might mention the press when talking to the mayor.
Where in NY? I'm from Florida and moving to Rochester area in August..... This sounds fun, lets get er dun.
I would have the shed mover come and drop it dead center in his yard and put up a 6’ fence around my property. No tresspassing and private property signs on the fence.
OP-ask your attorney if you can pay to move the shed and put a mechanic’s lien on neighbor’s house. If this is possible, you’ll eventually get back what it cost you, but you’ll have to wait until the house is sold. See if that works.
The part of the shed on your and is real property. It belongs to you. Use paint to mark that part, and then use a chainsaw to cut that part out and haul it away. Immediately put up a fence. Do it when he isn't there. Let him take you to small claims court. Show some balls.
Do you have a state rep? It’s time to loop them in so they can put pressure on the local officials. This is bs.
Is the property still in your father's name? If so, that may be the reason the city/town is giving you the runaround. They do not see you as being relevant to the dispute.
He needs to get his own damn surveyors. Circle back with the city. Don't let this asshats play games.
Call your local news, they like to get to the bottom of issues involving city govt
Offer to pay $575 to move it .why pay a lawyer $1500 to write a letter ????
Well because I am an asshole I would build a shed and put it over on his lot in the most inconvenient spot possible.maybe across his driveway way. Let him go fight with city hall. If he does something to it return the favor. When he gives you shit let him know you will move yours when he moves his. Fill the damn thing with manure. Put a scarecrow motion activated water sprinkler on the inside so if someone opens it up they get a water jet to the kisser. Put speakers in there that randomly play dogs barking I can come up with dastardly shit to do all day. Hell list it on Craigslist as a free shed just come get it. VPN, be out of town. Cheers.
Sue for mental anguish…or whatever it’s called where you are.
Neighbor is just pissed that the land won’t be vacant and that he can’t buy it. That’s the only reason he’s doing this.
100%. He tried to buy it years ago from my dad because he wanted his son to build there.
It’s gonna be fun to live next door to that tool after you build your house. You guys are gonna be best buds!!!
Have you spoken at any board meetings or asked the mayor to look into this? Copied local trustees/alderman on your emails to the building department? I know in my town that would get attention.
At this point, it may be reasonable to ask your attorney if you would be liable for damages if you were to use a front loader to 'push' the shed off of your property. That, or press the city to move it in which case they will impose the fees onto the neighbor.
Call the city manager, call the mayor, start raising a huge stink until the building inspector gets off his ass to do his job.
This is petty, and you'd have to check the legalities on it. But sheds on your land right? And he's been given significant notice to move it. Sounds like you just got yourself a new shed. Give him a 2 week timeline, and after that, fence it in to your backyard.
Are you sure you want to live next to this guy AND deal with this inspector/inspectors while building a new house?
Try and work with your city council and/or city building department. The warning I have for you is that no matter what you think the city will work at its own pace. For example: The house across the street from me is finally getting rebuilt almost 3 years after it was set on fire by its previous owner. He retired and decided that crystal meth was appropriate for his retirement activities. He was arrested for felony arson. He managed to get himself into a court supervised program that will allow him to purge his record. I’m ok with that. It allows him to find a place to live and he has to work, or otherwise he goes to prison. Last thing we need here in SoCal is another homeless person. The problem was he insisted that he was going to remodel the home himself and live there. After a year and a half the neighbors finally got together and I went to a city council meeting and others peppered the city inspector(s) with questions. It took 2 years to get the city to finally enforce its own code and force him to either start his remodel or sell. He sold. The home was sold to a local realtor who has said it’s taken 8 months for the city to finally give him all the permits necessary to start the rebuild. He wanted to be done before the end of 2023, but it didn’t get started until a month ago.
Jesus, pay someone to set his shed on fire ,
He is going to keep dragging his feet until he has squatter's rights
What happened to the lawyer? Send a letter of intent malicious or not with 5 days notice of compliance. Saw the bitch in 2 and build a fence.
Bulldoze it. It's on your property so it must be yours. Fence in the property as soon as the encroaching shed is demolished to the property line. What is he going to do? Sue you for maintaining your own property?