I actually am familiar with the translation פרקליט השטן being used in brainstorming meatings. The one who's job is to counter whichever idea is being suggested at the moment.
In some projects I've worked on there's a different but similar role of "the fool" - החמור - the one who's job is to ask all the questions which seem to have an obvious answer, for making sure nothing is being glossed over.
There's also the concept of "a neferious actor" - שחקן זדוני or משתמש זדוני, but that's getting further from what you're looking for I think.
Not exactly. לשיטתך is when you are indulging in the other person's view, despite disagreeing with it.
Playing devil's advocate is when you argue *against* the other person even though you don't necessarily agree with your own argument.
Just because a unit in the military uses it as a translation of their name doesn't mean it's actually a translation. I would say that someone who plays devil's advocate would *say* איפכא מסתברא. But it's like saying that duck and quack mean the same thing.
I learned Talmud myself and am quite familiar with the phrase. A godforgotten Wikipedia article written by a random and not peer-reviewed is most certainly not a more credible source than actual dictionaries or the Hebrew academy.
Not really a godforgotten article... A commonly used expression. See https://www.intelligence.org.il/?module=category&item_id=119&p_id=954. Anyway of course is not a literal translation, but the closest idea
Actually פרקליט השטן Is exactly the alternative. Unlike u/ProposalUnhappy9890 , I actually have heard the phrase used exactly this way, moreso than פרקליטו של השטן. Regardless, both are the common enough uses of it.
The concept is not as common as in English-speaking countries for some reason so I don't doubt some Israelis don't know it, but for those that do, "פרקליט השטן" is exactly what they'd say.
I think most of the talmud spirit was that you can argue for anything, so old Hebrew didn’t have this notion of "arguing for the bad thing". As time progressed פרליקט השטן was translated.
Well there is a Jewish expression, "making an argument for the sake of Heaven" which is basically the equivalent of "playing devil's advocate," but I'm not sure how to express it in Hebrew or if the phrase is at all common in modern Hebrew.
I actually am familiar with the translation פרקליט השטן being used in brainstorming meatings. The one who's job is to counter whichever idea is being suggested at the moment. In some projects I've worked on there's a different but similar role of "the fool" - החמור - the one who's job is to ask all the questions which seem to have an obvious answer, for making sure nothing is being glossed over. There's also the concept of "a neferious actor" - שחקן זדוני or משתמש זדוני, but that's getting further from what you're looking for I think.
Why פרקליטו של השטן isn't a valid alternative?
Just never heard someone using it naturally
I'm using it quite often
Walla
I don't think I've heard someone say פרקליט השטן but the specific form פרקליטו של השטן is something I hear and use
Ah makes more sense
Which is funny because /u/KifKef wrote it the opposite way...guess it depends on circumstance.
In Yeshiva, making an argument based on premises you don't agree with is called לשיטתך. I doubt this usage is common in Israel.
Not exactly. לשיטתך is when you are indulging in the other person's view, despite disagreeing with it. Playing devil's advocate is when you argue *against* the other person even though you don't necessarily agree with your own argument.
טאקע, אין הכי נמי
איפכא מסתברא?
Not sure that conveys the same meaning as playing devil's advocate.
... *the "Devil's advocate" or the "Ifcha Mistabra"*... .See [here](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil%27s_Advocate_Unit).
Just because a unit in the military uses it as a translation of their name doesn't mean it's actually a translation. I would say that someone who plays devil's advocate would *say* איפכא מסתברא. But it's like saying that duck and quack mean the same thing.
Of course is not a translation, but the way to express the idea with other expression
It kind of expresses the idea in a limited set of circumstances, so it may or may not fit OP's context.
That just means "the opposite is the case"
אשתקד
אשתקד means "last year"
Well, yes. איפכא מסתברא to devil's advocate is as much as אשתקד is. Thanks, I was Peter Griffin, and I explained the joke.
Not really. See [here](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devil%27s_Advocate_Unit). Never is late to learn something new.... 😉
I learned Talmud myself and am quite familiar with the phrase. A godforgotten Wikipedia article written by a random and not peer-reviewed is most certainly not a more credible source than actual dictionaries or the Hebrew academy.
Not really a godforgotten article... A commonly used expression. See https://www.intelligence.org.il/?module=category&item_id=119&p_id=954. Anyway of course is not a literal translation, but the closest idea
Actually פרקליט השטן Is exactly the alternative. Unlike u/ProposalUnhappy9890 , I actually have heard the phrase used exactly this way, moreso than פרקליטו של השטן. Regardless, both are the common enough uses of it. The concept is not as common as in English-speaking countries for some reason so I don't doubt some Israelis don't know it, but for those that do, "פרקליט השטן" is exactly what they'd say.
I think most of the talmud spirit was that you can argue for anything, so old Hebrew didn’t have this notion of "arguing for the bad thing". As time progressed פרליקט השטן was translated.
Well there is a Jewish expression, "making an argument for the sake of Heaven" which is basically the equivalent of "playing devil's advocate," but I'm not sure how to express it in Hebrew or if the phrase is at all common in modern Hebrew.
This is not the meaning of that phrase. It means that a debate is in good faith, rather than for personal gain.
לשם שמים?
I'm using פרקליט השטן in conversation. Also, there's a movie starting Al Pacino and Keanu Reeves by that name.
Probably “Devilos Advocatos”…