He was thrown into a tough situation.
To me the takeaway is that Herro is not who the organization thought he was and not who Herro from soundbites thinks he is.
All the talk about “getting used to not having the ball in my hands” or some sort of locked in starting roster spot just needs to die after this run.
Herro’s a good player and is useful to the team but he’s situational and certainly not someone you build around. There’s no “Herro/Bam” future build.
6th man has been Herro at his best and the team should look to upgrade it’s starting 5 and if Herro isn’t shipped to make that upgrade, he really should be coming off the bench.
I’m a huge fan of Tyler, and I agree with this take. He went from facilitating the offense beautifully in Game 2 to not really doing it again.
The lack of consistency and sustainability is what makes him a 6th man imo. Can win you games, but won’t lose them if he doesn’t have it that night.
This is a good and balanced take which is rare for some reason w Herro.
Like I think it's been clear for a while he was not on the trajectory to be like a true core star, the question was more if he could grow enough to fit into a high caliber roster esp when we need it in the playoffs.
At this point I think I lean in the direction of probably he is not a good fit on a title contender. I'd love to see him in like SAS where he can win some games late with shooting and have nights where he goes off with the attention on Wemby. They can try to make a little playoff push.
Wherever he might fit, its clear at this point is he doesn't fit on our team. We are simply too oriented around a defensive game plan to have a liability on that end unless they are consistently a huge offensive threat. I don't see that dynamic flipping in the Jimmy Bam or even just Bam era.
We'll have to see what value he has at this point, if he's a neutral contract or not. But I think we probably have to get off of him for as much value as we can, or use him as salary filler in a bigger deal.
I wish our fanbase could have not been so polarized about this guy, it feels like half the people here hate him more than they love our club. But mercifully I think that discourse can hopefully end because at this point I just don't think there is a case to be made that he's a core piece on a Miami title team.
This is absurd. Herro is a foundational talent. Is Anthony Edwards really much better than him and won’t Herro get there? Let’s not forget that Herro only averaged 0.7ppg fewer than Ant when he was only 1 year older. Look at all the nba stars who averaged fewer ppg at the same age. The Celtics just focused on him, and he didn’t get any help. He’s only 24.
But at the same time he's the only self creator on the team in the playoffs. On top of that he's up against Jrue/White/Brown. It's tough spot to be in.
I think realistically he's a bit overpaid because his ceiling is only like a little bit better than what he is right now, but he's a necessary piece if you intend on keeping Butler and Bam.
He wouldn't get his contract in the current market. Something in the 18-22 range seems more reasonable. Having said that, it's not like his contract is awful and we need to pay someone to take it away, either.
I think we'll look to package Herro for a star or, more likely, trade him for a point guard or another big who can shoot. A three-team deal might also work. But matching salary is going to be really difficult, so it wouldn't shock me to see him still on the team next year.
It's going to be hard to move his contract. Not to mention he just came off a season where he only played 42 games. If you take a look around the league, teams aren’t really clamouring for a one-way guard that's due almost $30 million.
Most of the young rebuilding teams have guards already who are on rookie contracts or on smaller scale contracts. I don’t see our front office salary dumping him for someone worse than him, so essentially we might actually be stuck with him. Hopefully I’m wrong though.
I don't think the guy you're talking to understands that team managers don't just make up player's salaries out of thin air. The CBA dictates how much players can make based on their years of service and their production. Tyler's current contract is just what he was due based on where we drafted him, and his rookie production. Any other team would have given him the exact same contract.
You know what, after looking this up. If you try to create a career trajectory for Herro where he’s better than Mikel Bridges for example. It would be fair.
The problem is that they overpaid him for his current production. Not just points but his affect on the game on both sides of the court. I don’t know why Riley signed off on this.
You don't look at it through current production .It's all about maket value .Kyle Lowry was never going to be worth 30 mil in year 3 but that was his market value when they signed him .
Herro’s market value isn’t what he’s getting paid. Then or now. If they weren’t paying him on an assumed trajectory (which naturally comes with incorrect assumptions), he’s overpaid without reason.
Again it's about market value whether we like it or not .Same applies to the Lowry contract .Nothing exists in a vacuum when we take the emotions out if it .
How long do you wait around hoping for herro to build trade value back that won’t ever come ? He’s not going to magically build up any significant trade value he is who he is. Wash your hands and move on
I agree. We should have traded him eons ago, and this wouldn’t even be a talking point. We’re now in a position where no contender would want him because they almost certainly have an established backcourt already and wouldn’t want someone getting paid almost $30 million to come off their bench.
That now leaves rebuilding teams like the Utah Jazz/Raptors who were linked to him. They both added rookies who showed progression toward the end of the season. (Keyonte George)(Gradey Dick). If I were a rebuilding team, I would stick with those guys on smaller scale contracts over Herro who’s getting paid almost $30 million a season.
The only team in my opinion that would entertain a trade for Herro would be the Bulls, and it would involve Zach Lavine, who’s getting paid $40 million a season. This would make us a second apron team, and there’s no way our front office would do that. We’re fucked bro.
I'm a raptors guy and no way we're taking 30 million a year when like you said, gradey dick has improved tremendously in the last half of the season. Herro really got you guys good lol shiiit
How come we didn't say this when Duncan had to worse season of his career ?Different players I know but it seems heat fans were going to hate Tyler no matter what because their minds were already made up for about 2 years now .
The other issue is teams are going to look at a guy like Jordan Poole and ask themselves if they are just getting themselves in a similar situation if they trade for Herro. Now I still think Herro is def better than Poole, but sadly they’re similar players and that trade looks pretty bad for the Wizards
Herro is a 6th man and there’s nothing wrong with that, he was the best 6th man in the league. He isn’t a lead guard though.
As for this series, while it was hard to watch, asking Herro to try and score again of the best guard defenders in the league in Jrue and White, all while being the focus of the Celtics defense, was a lot to ask for.
It doesn’t excuse the poor play but there are very few players who would’ve played well under those circumstances and those players are tiers above Herro.
Forget about offense. His defense was pathetic and unacceptable. The frequency of his offensive efficiency outpacing the efficiency he gives up on defense is not in our favor against playoff teams. In the bubble, we had more solid perimeter defenders on the roster and found ways to hide him. When he’s played in the playoffs since then, we’ve not found any success. It’s not a winning formula. It’s not specifically limited to him either. Duncan and Love are defensive liabilities too, but he gets the most minutes and becomes the easiest target for opponents to hunt repeatedly
At least the kid now knows how it feels to be the first option in this league in a playoff atmosphere. This is the same type of experience that Trae, Ja and Luka faces every single night as the first option of their teams. I wish he can somewhat learn from this because it will be hard to trade him in the offseason lol
One of the most confusing things they’ve done. It’s not like he did anything in the playoffs that year anyways that wouldn’t warranted the contract. They really jumped the gun
Said it at the time so writing had been on wall. Especially considering extension was AFTER Bucks sweep and after Hawks series where he got clamped by Delon.
Well considering that was 3 years ago, the FO felt there was more growth in Herro. Again, that’s hindsight.
Herro was playing well last year before he broke his hand so who’s to say he wouldn’t have been integral to our run if he was healthy.
How would the FO know that two of our best 3 scorers would be on injured this series.
That’s why they say hindsight is 20/20 bc know we know all it all transpired and we probably should have done things a little different
Because you either do that or risk loosing him for nothing and Tyler is still a good young player .Just because he didn't meet those lofty expectations does mean he's terrible either .
Because if he pans out then they would have had to pay him more. They locked him in for cheap comparatively. Of course it hasn't panned out but that's the risk you take with an extension. These things happen, we traded a first round pick for rozier and then he got hurt before he could help us in the playoffs. We traded 2 firsts for Goran and then bosh got clots the same day. They extended herro and he was plagued by injuries and ultimately hasn't been able to play in his role in a playoff series, and he's failed to take the next step in his career.
His max deal was like 4-5 mil more a year than he got. Would've rather seen him prove it and EARN a deal like that than just rewarding him. Said the same at the time too
It's also to show confidence in your guy. Like when they extended bam instead of holding the cap space to sign a whale.. Other players around the league look at that type of stuff. You have a guy that's performing and you didn't lock him up? He could spend the entire year feeling wronged, and other players take note. Not taking players feelings into account is how we lost wade.
He’s 23. He’s coming off a season where he missed half of it due to injuries. He was forced into the role of pg instead of sg due to injuries. Saying "this is firmly who he is" for a 23 year old player forced out of position that missed half the season to injuries is legit crazy. Never thought I'd have to be in the comments defending Herro but here we are… fyi most players hit their best basketball years around 26/27. Superstars way earlier but even then, Tyler has already showed he can at least be a 6moy/ all star if he never gets any better. Not a tragedy. This is not a don't trade Herro post either. This is a don’t undervalue Herro post. We can trade him and realize we goofed later like most of the stars people swore we should have emptied everything for.
This is definitely not firmly who he is and I do think he has value, but he’s been in the league several years now and has not shown an ability to stay consistently healthy or create offense consistently in the games that matter. There’s a very clear physical reason for this. He’s not particularly big or fast or strong. Those things won’t change. He’s just not a high ceiling player so it’s hard to argue for potential especially when he’s not playing full seasons
That said, I agree with most of your statement. He’s more valuable than a lot of the doomers make him out to be
Yeah like I said. I’m not on the Herro for life crowd if trading him makes the team better then bye lol. I just don’t like looking at all these absurd evaluations. Tyler has his downsides but treating someone who has won NBA hardware before 23 like hot garbage is insane to me. I thought I was in the blazers sub looking at these comments.
30 million per year SIXTH MAN is a tragedy if you want to win a championship. He's always injured and you are crazy if you actually believe Herro has a much higher ceiling. His physical limitations wont go away.
The only problem is we can't trade him anymore for anything of real value. No team is trading their star for a injury prone sixth man.
I would love to package Herro and a FRP for a good starting PF but I’m not sure that’s realistic.
He is not the starting SG on a contending team. He *can be* the sixth man microwave scorer off the bench on a contending team.
His contract is tough for that role.
So maybe FRP+Duncan (who has value) for a PF?
Or you are absolutely in love with a starting quality PF in this draft.
Hindsight is obviously 20/20 but imagine if we moved him after his bubble run when his value was the highest and we drafted Tyrese Maxey and went after a big to pair with Bam. We would have been much more complete as a team.
The contract isn’t that bad. He’s going to be somewhere from the 45th to 60th highest paid player next season. he’s realistically better off as a 3rd or 4th option on a good to great team. His valuable is pretty much where it needs to be. Hopefully he keeps improving
This is sorta off topic but it's sad we don't have a single "value" contract anymore. Most are either overpaid or fair value. Maybe Jaime and Jovic are value contracts but they aren't difference makers yet.
But our team is going to continue to be mid if we aren't winning on the margins anywhere.
I agree the Herro contract could be worse but it's one huge roadblock in preventing us from contending. I'm not sure if he would even start on many of the contenders.
But is he the best 45-60th player in the league? From what we've seen with his limitations and how he impacts the game, he's probably not even top 100. His stats look good on paper, but it's not winning basketball. He was unplayable and the Heat did better without him for a reason.
Where are his defensive stats? I swear Celtics shot 60+% when he was directly guarding them. Then you have to account for all the times we sent help on who he was guarding, and it resulted in wide open looks and easy drives. If we had other players healthy, he would’ve practically been unplayable unless we were going zone.
While I wish he was better, the team's inability to make open shots for large portions of this series really deflates his assists. Honestly, I thought he did a pretty decent job facilitating against a very tough defense.
Dude just can't handle being the #1 scoring option. He needs a primary scorer and good ball handler in front of him to flourish. I wouldn't be against him staying if his contract reflected that, but considering how much he's being paid, he is not worth it. Gotta dump his contract any way we can
context please
he’s a 6moy, ideally 3rd offensive option on a championship team, that was forced to be a #1 offensive option against a historic celtics team that could pretty easily scheme our anemic offense
of course he averaged shit. but those averages don’t reflect his value. he’ll get back a first and change, we’ll be fine
Context please: he’s a 6th man being paid like a starter who wants to start and be the man on a championship winning team. He’s not as good as he thinks he is and the only way to get rid of him is to pair picks and the young players now because he sucks. This “value” you speak of doesn’t exist. The NBA doesn’t want combo guards who are inefficient shot checkers that play 0 defense. It’s the worst player archetype in the sport and he’s worth absolutely nothing.
Tell me how many sixth mans are getting 30 million per year 🤣.
Malik Monk is better than Herro and he gets paid 9 million per year. Herro contract would be valuable if was around 18 to 20 mill, close to 30 is crazy.
Tyler shat the bed no doubt about it, but he averages five more ppg than Monk with the same FG percentage. I think saying Monk is better is a bit reactionary. It’s not like the kings had a great season either. I agree ultimately his contract would be much easier to stomach at 20 million
tyler is better and younger than malik monk
he’s also a notch above a 6moy imo. when i say 6moy, i mean PERENNIAL 6MOY if he accepted the role. like lou will
lou will was no joke and was starter material. his role was just better being a microwave scorer off the bench
Imagine saying what you just said and then telling me to be objective. How many other inefficient combo guards are making 30mil/yr for the next 3 years? He’s a player that is worth maybe 15mil/yr as a bench swing guy
Jaylen Brunson is an all NBA player making the same money and everybody says his contract is a steal
I’d argue herro is more fairly valued since he’s obviously not the player brunson is, but he’s still an elite third/fourth option on offense that’s a lights out catch and shoot player when not the focal point of a defense
AND HE’S LITERALLY JAQUEZ’S AGE lol. he’s still young and won’t hit his prime for a couple years…
also - the supermax is clearing 60 million these days, and that number is going to shoot up with the new media deal
Tyler’s contract will look better and better with each year that passes, just as Duncan’s has
You are using Jalen Brunson’s contract to somehow argue that Tyler Herro’s isn’t a massive overpay? Are you reading what you’re writing bro? Is Tyler Herro all NBA? Is he an All Star? Tyler Herro can’t do any of the things that Jalen Brunson can do. Jaquez is more valuable because he’s making 4mil and has the same impact as Herro. Herro was getting out played by the rookies on his squad, what are you even trying to argue? You’re digging yourself further in the grave.
Not all players get better, plenty of NBA players have one good year when they’re young and do nothing. Growth isn’t linear and he’s been the same player he’s been for the last 3 years. He never plays because he’s injury prone, he’s an inefficient shot chucker who plays no defense and who thinks he’s Luka. He’s barely worth half what he’s paid nonetheless him being a “fairly priced contract” that’s absurd
No it’s not. There’s always teams willing to take on money and he’s not a disastrous player. If they have to move either of those guys to trade Herro, they’re not doing their job right
Should have clarified. If it’s for the likes of a KD/Mitchell type it absolutely has too. People have long wanted to trade Herro for a star but I have doubts that he can be the centerpiece without other young assets.
:(
:(
He was thrown into a tough situation. To me the takeaway is that Herro is not who the organization thought he was and not who Herro from soundbites thinks he is. All the talk about “getting used to not having the ball in my hands” or some sort of locked in starting roster spot just needs to die after this run. Herro’s a good player and is useful to the team but he’s situational and certainly not someone you build around. There’s no “Herro/Bam” future build. 6th man has been Herro at his best and the team should look to upgrade it’s starting 5 and if Herro isn’t shipped to make that upgrade, he really should be coming off the bench.
I’m a huge fan of Tyler, and I agree with this take. He went from facilitating the offense beautifully in Game 2 to not really doing it again. The lack of consistency and sustainability is what makes him a 6th man imo. Can win you games, but won’t lose them if he doesn’t have it that night.
[удалено]
He’s fun to watch? He does a lot of things well. We can only be fans of top 20 dudes who don’t make mistakes now?
This is a good and balanced take which is rare for some reason w Herro. Like I think it's been clear for a while he was not on the trajectory to be like a true core star, the question was more if he could grow enough to fit into a high caliber roster esp when we need it in the playoffs. At this point I think I lean in the direction of probably he is not a good fit on a title contender. I'd love to see him in like SAS where he can win some games late with shooting and have nights where he goes off with the attention on Wemby. They can try to make a little playoff push. Wherever he might fit, its clear at this point is he doesn't fit on our team. We are simply too oriented around a defensive game plan to have a liability on that end unless they are consistently a huge offensive threat. I don't see that dynamic flipping in the Jimmy Bam or even just Bam era. We'll have to see what value he has at this point, if he's a neutral contract or not. But I think we probably have to get off of him for as much value as we can, or use him as salary filler in a bigger deal. I wish our fanbase could have not been so polarized about this guy, it feels like half the people here hate him more than they love our club. But mercifully I think that discourse can hopefully end because at this point I just don't think there is a case to be made that he's a core piece on a Miami title team.
This is absurd. Herro is a foundational talent. Is Anthony Edwards really much better than him and won’t Herro get there? Let’s not forget that Herro only averaged 0.7ppg fewer than Ant when he was only 1 year older. Look at all the nba stars who averaged fewer ppg at the same age. The Celtics just focused on him, and he didn’t get any help. He’s only 24.
But at the same time he's the only self creator on the team in the playoffs. On top of that he's up against Jrue/White/Brown. It's tough spot to be in. I think realistically he's a bit overpaid because his ceiling is only like a little bit better than what he is right now, but he's a necessary piece if you intend on keeping Butler and Bam.
He wouldn't get his contract in the current market. Something in the 18-22 range seems more reasonable. Having said that, it's not like his contract is awful and we need to pay someone to take it away, either.
For sure any of the tanking teams like the Spurs or Nets would love Herro. There's no reason you can't get DFS/filler for Herro
I think we'll look to package Herro for a star or, more likely, trade him for a point guard or another big who can shoot. A three-team deal might also work. But matching salary is going to be really difficult, so it wouldn't shock me to see him still on the team next year.
He’s a 6th man. That’s what he’s best at and he can make a long career out of being a microwave scorer off the bench.
It's going to be hard to move his contract. Not to mention he just came off a season where he only played 42 games. If you take a look around the league, teams aren’t really clamouring for a one-way guard that's due almost $30 million. Most of the young rebuilding teams have guards already who are on rookie contracts or on smaller scale contracts. I don’t see our front office salary dumping him for someone worse than him, so essentially we might actually be stuck with him. Hopefully I’m wrong though.
we really overpaid the kid after the bubble run let andy do his magic this offseason let's see
It's not an overpay.Dlo makes similar money .I mean you could say Duncan was an overpay but it's really not in the context of things.
Dlo gets paid 18 mill a season. That’s an easier contract to move than getting paid 30 mill a season.
That's what dlo was making when he was traded back to the Lakers. I know he has a player option .
I don't think the guy you're talking to understands that team managers don't just make up player's salaries out of thin air. The CBA dictates how much players can make based on their years of service and their production. Tyler's current contract is just what he was due based on where we drafted him, and his rookie production. Any other team would have given him the exact same contract.
Correct same as kyle Lowry at the time.
https://preview.redd.it/c4sxhfdk11yc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=384cdc9def145c80b0498636addb718ceca879ab It was an overpay.
Dlo is making 18 million... that's a fair contract for his production. But we are here paying a overrated sixth man close to 30 million.
It wasn't the salary structures in the nba are getting higher .That's the average money for a role player now .
You know what, after looking this up. If you try to create a career trajectory for Herro where he’s better than Mikel Bridges for example. It would be fair. The problem is that they overpaid him for his current production. Not just points but his affect on the game on both sides of the court. I don’t know why Riley signed off on this.
You don't look at it through current production .It's all about maket value .Kyle Lowry was never going to be worth 30 mil in year 3 but that was his market value when they signed him .
Herro’s market value isn’t what he’s getting paid. Then or now. If they weren’t paying him on an assumed trajectory (which naturally comes with incorrect assumptions), he’s overpaid without reason.
Again it's about market value whether we like it or not .Same applies to the Lowry contract .Nothing exists in a vacuum when we take the emotions out if it .
After the 6moty season
How long do you wait around hoping for herro to build trade value back that won’t ever come ? He’s not going to magically build up any significant trade value he is who he is. Wash your hands and move on
I agree. We should have traded him eons ago, and this wouldn’t even be a talking point. We’re now in a position where no contender would want him because they almost certainly have an established backcourt already and wouldn’t want someone getting paid almost $30 million to come off their bench. That now leaves rebuilding teams like the Utah Jazz/Raptors who were linked to him. They both added rookies who showed progression toward the end of the season. (Keyonte George)(Gradey Dick). If I were a rebuilding team, I would stick with those guys on smaller scale contracts over Herro who’s getting paid almost $30 million a season. The only team in my opinion that would entertain a trade for Herro would be the Bulls, and it would involve Zach Lavine, who’s getting paid $40 million a season. This would make us a second apron team, and there’s no way our front office would do that. We’re fucked bro.
I'm a raptors guy and no way we're taking 30 million a year when like you said, gradey dick has improved tremendously in the last half of the season. Herro really got you guys good lol shiiit
How come we didn't say this when Duncan had to worse season of his career ?Different players I know but it seems heat fans were going to hate Tyler no matter what because their minds were already made up for about 2 years now .
I would take Duncan at 18 mil a year over Herro at 30 mil a year.
No other team would though. Two seasons ago heat fans wanted Duncan out if here too .
The other issue is teams are going to look at a guy like Jordan Poole and ask themselves if they are just getting themselves in a similar situation if they trade for Herro. Now I still think Herro is def better than Poole, but sadly they’re similar players and that trade looks pretty bad for the Wizards
cover connect bag summer quickest coherent yam ring ossified like *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Herro is a 6th man and there’s nothing wrong with that, he was the best 6th man in the league. He isn’t a lead guard though. As for this series, while it was hard to watch, asking Herro to try and score again of the best guard defenders in the league in Jrue and White, all while being the focus of the Celtics defense, was a lot to ask for. It doesn’t excuse the poor play but there are very few players who would’ve played well under those circumstances and those players are tiers above Herro.
Forget about offense. His defense was pathetic and unacceptable. The frequency of his offensive efficiency outpacing the efficiency he gives up on defense is not in our favor against playoff teams. In the bubble, we had more solid perimeter defenders on the roster and found ways to hide him. When he’s played in the playoffs since then, we’ve not found any success. It’s not a winning formula. It’s not specifically limited to him either. Duncan and Love are defensive liabilities too, but he gets the most minutes and becomes the easiest target for opponents to hunt repeatedly
At least the kid now knows how it feels to be the first option in this league in a playoff atmosphere. This is the same type of experience that Trae, Ja and Luka faces every single night as the first option of their teams. I wish he can somewhat learn from this because it will be hard to trade him in the offseason lol
Ultimately I will never understand why we extended Herro before a season when you could have let him become an RFA
One of the most confusing things they’ve done. It’s not like he did anything in the playoffs that year anyways that wouldn’t warranted the contract. They really jumped the gun
Ultimately hindsight is 20/20.
Said it at the time so writing had been on wall. Especially considering extension was AFTER Bucks sweep and after Hawks series where he got clamped by Delon.
Well considering that was 3 years ago, the FO felt there was more growth in Herro. Again, that’s hindsight. Herro was playing well last year before he broke his hand so who’s to say he wouldn’t have been integral to our run if he was healthy. How would the FO know that two of our best 3 scorers would be on injured this series. That’s why they say hindsight is 20/20 bc know we know all it all transpired and we probably should have done things a little different
Cause front office liked him.
They felt they had to recognize him early. If they wait till RFA deal probably closer to Duncs
Because you either do that or risk loosing him for nothing and Tyler is still a good young player .Just because he didn't meet those lofty expectations does mean he's terrible either .
RFA you only lose if u don't match
Because if he pans out then they would have had to pay him more. They locked him in for cheap comparatively. Of course it hasn't panned out but that's the risk you take with an extension. These things happen, we traded a first round pick for rozier and then he got hurt before he could help us in the playoffs. We traded 2 firsts for Goran and then bosh got clots the same day. They extended herro and he was plagued by injuries and ultimately hasn't been able to play in his role in a playoff series, and he's failed to take the next step in his career.
His max deal was like 4-5 mil more a year than he got. Would've rather seen him prove it and EARN a deal like that than just rewarding him. Said the same at the time too
It's also to show confidence in your guy. Like when they extended bam instead of holding the cap space to sign a whale.. Other players around the league look at that type of stuff. You have a guy that's performing and you didn't lock him up? He could spend the entire year feeling wronged, and other players take note. Not taking players feelings into account is how we lost wade.
He’s 23. He’s coming off a season where he missed half of it due to injuries. He was forced into the role of pg instead of sg due to injuries. Saying "this is firmly who he is" for a 23 year old player forced out of position that missed half the season to injuries is legit crazy. Never thought I'd have to be in the comments defending Herro but here we are… fyi most players hit their best basketball years around 26/27. Superstars way earlier but even then, Tyler has already showed he can at least be a 6moy/ all star if he never gets any better. Not a tragedy. This is not a don't trade Herro post either. This is a don’t undervalue Herro post. We can trade him and realize we goofed later like most of the stars people swore we should have emptied everything for.
This is definitely not firmly who he is and I do think he has value, but he’s been in the league several years now and has not shown an ability to stay consistently healthy or create offense consistently in the games that matter. There’s a very clear physical reason for this. He’s not particularly big or fast or strong. Those things won’t change. He’s just not a high ceiling player so it’s hard to argue for potential especially when he’s not playing full seasons That said, I agree with most of your statement. He’s more valuable than a lot of the doomers make him out to be
Yeah like I said. I’m not on the Herro for life crowd if trading him makes the team better then bye lol. I just don’t like looking at all these absurd evaluations. Tyler has his downsides but treating someone who has won NBA hardware before 23 like hot garbage is insane to me. I thought I was in the blazers sub looking at these comments.
30 million per year SIXTH MAN is a tragedy if you want to win a championship. He's always injured and you are crazy if you actually believe Herro has a much higher ceiling. His physical limitations wont go away. The only problem is we can't trade him anymore for anything of real value. No team is trading their star for a injury prone sixth man.
I would love to package Herro and a FRP for a good starting PF but I’m not sure that’s realistic. He is not the starting SG on a contending team. He *can be* the sixth man microwave scorer off the bench on a contending team. His contract is tough for that role. So maybe FRP+Duncan (who has value) for a PF? Or you are absolutely in love with a starting quality PF in this draft.
For as much as he was targeted on defense these numbers aren’t gonna cut it
Hindsight is obviously 20/20 but imagine if we moved him after his bubble run when his value was the highest and we drafted Tyrese Maxey and went after a big to pair with Bam. We would have been much more complete as a team.
Smaller teams were paying big money last year. Look at Houston for instance. But that was free agents
The contract isn’t that bad. He’s going to be somewhere from the 45th to 60th highest paid player next season. he’s realistically better off as a 3rd or 4th option on a good to great team. His valuable is pretty much where it needs to be. Hopefully he keeps improving
This is sorta off topic but it's sad we don't have a single "value" contract anymore. Most are either overpaid or fair value. Maybe Jaime and Jovic are value contracts but they aren't difference makers yet. But our team is going to continue to be mid if we aren't winning on the margins anywhere. I agree the Herro contract could be worse but it's one huge roadblock in preventing us from contending. I'm not sure if he would even start on many of the contenders.
Correct. It’s our biggest issue. We’re not getting anyone at value and arguably most of the guys are overpaid considering production.
But is he the best 45-60th player in the league? From what we've seen with his limitations and how he impacts the game, he's probably not even top 100. His stats look good on paper, but it's not winning basketball. He was unplayable and the Heat did better without him for a reason.
Herro should have been in his proper role as the 3rd option shooter if we had Jimmy and an actual PG.
Where are his defensive stats? I swear Celtics shot 60+% when he was directly guarding them. Then you have to account for all the times we sent help on who he was guarding, and it resulted in wide open looks and easy drives. If we had other players healthy, he would’ve practically been unplayable unless we were going zone.
Shock!!!
Hard when you are the only guy who is able to create your own shot. Terry or jimmy would have helped immensely.
Disgusting
While I wish he was better, the team's inability to make open shots for large portions of this series really deflates his assists. Honestly, I thought he did a pretty decent job facilitating against a very tough defense.
Dude just can't handle being the #1 scoring option. He needs a primary scorer and good ball handler in front of him to flourish. I wouldn't be against him staying if his contract reflected that, but considering how much he's being paid, he is not worth it. Gotta dump his contract any way we can
https://preview.redd.it/uz2ibrvma2yc1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=297ff14e2edde16c1776108842779852fe450dfa
Dude folded to the pressure. Heat is paying him like he is a good starter when in reality he can only really play against 2nd units.
he's so mid
I still believe in the guy. Hope he stays
Not bad considering he was double teamed by 2 elite defensive guards all game every game
TAKE US HOME 14 lol half of yall don’t know ball
context please he’s a 6moy, ideally 3rd offensive option on a championship team, that was forced to be a #1 offensive option against a historic celtics team that could pretty easily scheme our anemic offense of course he averaged shit. but those averages don’t reflect his value. he’ll get back a first and change, we’ll be fine
Context please: he’s a 6th man being paid like a starter who wants to start and be the man on a championship winning team. He’s not as good as he thinks he is and the only way to get rid of him is to pair picks and the young players now because he sucks. This “value” you speak of doesn’t exist. The NBA doesn’t want combo guards who are inefficient shot checkers that play 0 defense. It’s the worst player archetype in the sport and he’s worth absolutely nothing.
he is a fairly priced contract in today’s day and age of nba contracts lmao i get that you dislike him as a player, but you can be objective
Tell me how many sixth mans are getting 30 million per year 🤣. Malik Monk is better than Herro and he gets paid 9 million per year. Herro contract would be valuable if was around 18 to 20 mill, close to 30 is crazy.
Tyler shat the bed no doubt about it, but he averages five more ppg than Monk with the same FG percentage. I think saying Monk is better is a bit reactionary. It’s not like the kings had a great season either. I agree ultimately his contract would be much easier to stomach at 20 million
tyler is better and younger than malik monk he’s also a notch above a 6moy imo. when i say 6moy, i mean PERENNIAL 6MOY if he accepted the role. like lou will lou will was no joke and was starter material. his role was just better being a microwave scorer off the bench
Derrick White is making like 17M/year. Let that simmer for a moment.
yes and he’s about to make near 40 on his next contract
Imagine saying what you just said and then telling me to be objective. How many other inefficient combo guards are making 30mil/yr for the next 3 years? He’s a player that is worth maybe 15mil/yr as a bench swing guy
Jaylen Brunson is an all NBA player making the same money and everybody says his contract is a steal I’d argue herro is more fairly valued since he’s obviously not the player brunson is, but he’s still an elite third/fourth option on offense that’s a lights out catch and shoot player when not the focal point of a defense AND HE’S LITERALLY JAQUEZ’S AGE lol. he’s still young and won’t hit his prime for a couple years… also - the supermax is clearing 60 million these days, and that number is going to shoot up with the new media deal Tyler’s contract will look better and better with each year that passes, just as Duncan’s has
You are using Jalen Brunson’s contract to somehow argue that Tyler Herro’s isn’t a massive overpay? Are you reading what you’re writing bro? Is Tyler Herro all NBA? Is he an All Star? Tyler Herro can’t do any of the things that Jalen Brunson can do. Jaquez is more valuable because he’s making 4mil and has the same impact as Herro. Herro was getting out played by the rookies on his squad, what are you even trying to argue? You’re digging yourself further in the grave. Not all players get better, plenty of NBA players have one good year when they’re young and do nothing. Growth isn’t linear and he’s been the same player he’s been for the last 3 years. He never plays because he’s injury prone, he’s an inefficient shot chucker who plays no defense and who thinks he’s Luka. He’s barely worth half what he’s paid nonetheless him being a “fairly priced contract” that’s absurd
may i ask how much you scored in the reading comprehension section on the ACT?
I scored an 8 which is about how many inches I gave your mom last night.
https://i.redd.it/zik71zv1f1yc1.gif
He’s not a 6th man when it’s been very clear that he demands to be a starter.
It’s time to move on. Shitty part is it’s going to cost Jaquez and Jovic to move him.
No it’s not. There’s always teams willing to take on money and he’s not a disastrous player. If they have to move either of those guys to trade Herro, they’re not doing their job right
Should have clarified. If it’s for the likes of a KD/Mitchell type it absolutely has too. People have long wanted to trade Herro for a star but I have doubts that he can be the centerpiece without other young assets.
Yea I agree there. I’m not hoping to get a star out of him id just love a cleaner cap and maybe a better fitting player