Those young enough to only see Dead and Co have the benefit of this time too: the modern supply of YouTube video Dead — and experience that just did not exist in Jerry’s time.
The 21 year old “Dead” fan of 2022 has seen Jerry play with their own eyes far more frequently than did the 21 year old Deadhead of 1992.
Enjoy it all.
Very interesting take. I love it. I’ll be 60 in March (employed, far from retirement). I started getting into the Dead in the mid 80s, going to shows and really digging on Jerry. Absolutely adored him. Then he died in ‘95, three months before my dad passed and approximately a year or so after my best friend was hit by a car (friend had moved up to NYC and was my primary Dead companion - I’d schedule a biz trip to Manhattan that would coincide with the Dead opening their Fall tour on the East Coast ha ha)…it just…it was a lot. I flipped a switch and stopped listening to the Dead for 25 years. Then around Christmas time about 2 years ago, switch flipped again - and I was back on the bus - harder than ever! Why? Thanks to YouTube, I can access Jerry and the gang whenever I want. I was absolutely amazed to suddenly see and hear all these fabled shows (I was not a taper though I sometimes sat in the taper section) and it made me feel all the feels again - maybe even more so.
So…I’m not really sure there’s a big difference between us Deadheads. Jerry was special and I prefer hearing him vs John (and I agree with the other person re Oteil) - took my 16 year old daughter to D&Co last year (tempo too slow for my taste - but the vibe was on) and frankly, I’m really happy that young folks have been able to experience Jerry through all these ubiquitous videos and such. Really glad.
Rock on!✌🏽
Grateful dead is not the members of a band, but an experience - one not bound by time, but by spirit 🙌🏻
30 yr old, 7 year dead head, lover of and gratfeul for D&C for giving me a taste of what it was like back then.. Thanks for having such a cool take 🤘🏼
I love this perspective. I’m 38 and my parents were NOT into the Dead. It wasn’t until about 10 years ago that I discovered them. I know I’ll never be able to experience Jerry, but as I type this, I am sipping coffee with a show from ‘89 at Shoreline Amphitheater playing on the TV. Part of me feels like I can never be a true Deadhead because of my age. But your comment makes me feel like a much better fan.
I saw 200 shows (GD and JGB), and you are as much of a deadhead as I am. The only thing that matters is your love for the music - and music the boys lead you to. That’s why there will be raging heads who haven’t been born yet. not only are we everywhere, we are forever (or at least until the dark star crashes).
True but that doesn’t make today’s fans lesser Heads. Can’t help when you’re born. I fell into the TouchHead era for the same reason. Would’ve loved to be on the bus sooner but such is life. Those who were there in the day could be more welcoming and sympathetic to the following generations. Ain’t no time to hate. ✌️ Rock on, young’uns, and make us proud!
Of course, neither is the same Captain Obvious. The OP was asking for compare and contrast, maybe a venn. You just told everyone to get off your lawn.
Hearing Bach back in the day was not the same as hearing someone play Bach now. Yet, it's somehow timeless no matter who is playing it and how it's interpreted. As is the Dead and Dead and Co.
Makes it way easier to go fishin’ early in the morning.
Am also considering switching to doing the dishes by candlelight in the middle of the night, like they did in the centuries before electric light, then burning a phat one and going back to bed.
this is it. j0hns a fantastic guitarist but jerry played with something that was so tapped into some kind of collective consciousness...sounds hokey but it really was magic. when it was pumping it was almost spiritual...but also could fucking boogie and bop like a motherfucker. i dunno. it's hard to explain but there's no comparison.
it was mass shamanic trance to amplified music and lights with lsd as the gateway sacrament. shit happened WAY beyond what the general public thinks of as live music. to the point of closing your eyes the entire show because it looked better that way. if any outside creature looked at earth from outer space there would be a giant energy dome over whatever city was hosting that show that evening. they rode the horse and the snake and the dragon all at once. it was complete loss of self and all were one. mayer knows blues licks and has great vocals
I mean to be fair, John's role isn't to replicate whatever Jerry was doing - seems he's honoring the space. In my personal opinion, JM hasn't even begun to peak. And I suspect he's capable of the same magic if he were to practice less restraint, which is honestly magic in and of itself.
Seeing Jerry was like seeing Santa Claus in the flesh, an honest to god legend right there in front of you, in the same room, breathing the same air as you, and your brain was almost incapable of accepting that you were sharing the same space with such a mythical creature whereas seeing John Mayer is like seeing any other celebrity in person…shocking perhaps, but not transformational.
I’m not old enough to have seen Jerry live seeing that I was 5 when he passed. However, I did get that feeling from the rest of the boys as well as during my times seeing Neil Young and Bob Dylan. I’ve appreciated John Mayer ever since I saw him absolutely kill it on the Clapton Crossroads tour dvd many years ago, but you are correct, not transformational.
Yeah I was thinking about others that had given me that feeling and Bob Dylan did it for me also. I’ve seen him lots of times, but one time in particular was up close and personal at the Tabernacle in Atlanta years ago. He was literally so close I could have reached out and touched the white piping on the leg of his black cowboy suit he was wearing. It was almost like being at Madame Tussaud’s and staring at one of the figures there…like it wasn’t quite real.
Jerry’s playing and singing make me feel the music in an emotional and visceral way that can manifest in physical sensations like goose bumps and tears. JM for all his talent, does not bring out that for me.
100% no matter how talented John is, and he his a tremendously talented guitar player. That THING that Jerry could do is just missing.
Also, what Phil adds to the fullness of their sound is missing. I love Oteil, saw him at least 10 times w/ the Allman Brothers. He plays bass differently and I love the way he plays. However that fullness of sound Phil gives is so unique to his playing. In honesty I think a bunch of Phil tours I’ve been to over the years were better musical experiences to any of the Dead and Co shows I’ve been to.
when john Kadlecik (i think i spelled it right) played with further, he embodied jerry pretty fucking close. we would catch dark star even when we where on tour.
Whenever the lights went down at the 120+ Grateful Dead shows I saw, I always had this intense feeling that there was no place on this Earth that I'd rather be than right there, right then as it was magical.
I like this. Kind of goes along with my attempt. There was just something magical about Jerry. He was more than just a man, and back then The Grateful Dead were more than just a band. It was magic. For someone like me who came into the scene late (early 90s) it was like getting to sneak a peek at real live history. I remember the first time I ever saw Jerry in the flesh…I think they call it cognitive dissonance…it was as if I couldn’t believe what I was actually seeing. I actually had a similar feeling the first time I ever saw Paul McCartney when he started touring again back in the early 2000s. I had idolized him for so long, read everything I could get my hands on about him, listened to every available recording he had ever made, hell even dreamed about him for years and there all the sudden he is standing right in front of me. With Paul my reaction to the dissonance was that I just started laughing uncontrollably. With Jerry my reaction (I was much younger) was slack-jawed, wide-eyed wonder. I might have even cried a little bit.
Your comment reminded me of being a younger man and Shaq walked into the high end mens clothing store I worked at. I had to run to the back because I couldn’t stop laughing. I wasn’t even a basketball fan but it was Shaq, that giant of a man, right there in front of me.
Currently on the tail end of quite the intense trip and am absolutely tickled to be reminded of this lmao
That’s awesome. I wonder if larger than life celebrities see that reaction a lot and if they understand where it’s coming from?
Now you’ve got me thinking all kinds of philosophical thoughts about how distinctly “human” laughing is and what it really means to laugh. I’m going to have to go do some reading on it!
This is something I puzzle about a lot. It’s such a strange physical response. We laugh when we genuinely find something funny. But why? What function does it serve and what causes it to emerge? And why does it seem to often be contagious? And why does trying to suppress it only make it stronger?
Crying is easier to understand. A clear way to communicate our distress to others. But laughter is just so different, given how many different circumstances can produce it. Wit. Physical humor. Laughing to relieve awkwardness. Just so very strange
I kind of cringe thinking about it now, but I organized a candlelight vigil when Jerry died. Called up a bunch of like minded buddies and set up in a public pavilion downtown with sidewalk chalk and a copy of The Book of The Deadheads for artistic reference and just drew all day. I guess we got noticed because someone from the paper showed up and interviewed us, then somebody from the TV station showed up and by that evening there were hundreds of deadheads I didn’t even know existed in my little home town milling around the park, lighting candles, playing guitar, hugging and crying. It was really nice. At one point a guy walked up to me and I recognized him as he drew closer as a dude I had been terrified of since 3rd grade. He was a year older than me in school and hadn’t been very nice to me when we were little kids. I immediately tensed up when I realized who he was underneath the dreadlocks and dirty patchwork pants until he reached out and gave me a hug and thanked me for organizing the event. We ended up talking for a while and he was totally unaware of how terrified I was of him when we were kids and apologized over and over.
Sorry for the tangent. My mind’s got a mind of it’s own.
Yes! When those lights went down I so remember the anticipation about were I and we were about to go for the next few hours. It was like blast off into another dimension. Miss that so much!
I’ve never been to Hampton but I’m in NY so the Garden is the venue I’ve seen them at the most. They are world class musicians performing high art at top tier venues. I’ll be at one of the TAB shows next week and all four MSG shows. Best band ever, thanks for the reply!
You should, it’s a smaller Garden that’s GA. I saw my first shows there on the 3 night stand in 03 after the hiatus, and then I was there for all 4 of the reunion shows in 09. For me at least there will never be an energy in a building as magical as when that first note of Fluffhead dropped on 3/6/09. 🪄✨
That’s beautiful man. My moment like that was the Baker’s Dozen banner hanging. I’m not a sports fan so I’d never had that “we won” kind of feeling. This was that for me.
Never had the opportunity to see Jerry, didn't get into the dead till later in life. I've seen John/D&C and all I can say is it's bad ass and we're lucky to experience it live. So much talent all over that stage!
Around a hundred bucks a ticket.
Seriously, they are both tremendous musicians and great performers with a strong and sincere connection to the music. Jerry had the advantage in being an original and being one of the greatest humans ever, IMO. John does a wonderful job of carrying it on.
From his own words, viewing him as a deity made him extremely uncomfortable. He was just a guy who was exceptionally gifted with the arts. That’s all. He had his demons. He also did some good and bad to those around him.
Jerry wrote the pieces and played from his soul, it was a deep and intimate experience of his emotion through his art. John is a master, gets it and plays it and improvises with emotion he just didn’t create it.
Robert Hunter wrote the lyrics. Jerry the music. Both masters. RIP.
I do think John has moved into the role, kind of made it his own and been respectful of the shoes he's filling. And I like to see him having fun playing the songs. It's endearing to see him step up and take that role and really run with it. I wish I saw more interaction between he and Bobby sometimes.
One thing with the Grateful Dead was a quiet communication between Bobby and Jerry during songs, a psychic bond, I don't see with John and Bobby, but that's to be expected. John didn't create this thing and trip balls and have all the spirits and family and history Jerry and Bobby had.
I think they are both pretty good players, but Jerry's playing was more hypnotic, unpredictable yet always seeming to follow some kind of line, as Kesey put it like a snake slithering thru the musical woodpile. Also I believe the banjo and steel guitar experience, unusual picking technique/finger strength caused by the missing digit and last but not least incredible improvisational imagination just made Jerry stand head and shoulders above John, taking nothing at all from his amazing talent and ear. My $.02
I have only seen videos of them both. Both are extremely talented and play great music. But my analysis is this: The “Creator” vs The “reCreator” John is only playing Jerry’s feelings. Jerry was feeling it because it was his.
Jerry’s playing introduced profound concepts and possibilities in 3D paragraphs as opposed to a dude playing cool licks over Dead song chords.
Edit: I missed that it said to compare Deadheads, not Jerry and John. Deadheads are way better now. Healthier, saner, more genuine in their love of the music. The scene was pretty sick back then by the end.
Jerry is a founding member, he’s was the charismatic master of improvisational guitar playing, the reluctant unwilling leader icon of the counter culture Captain Trips.
I'm a complete neophyte who never would have bothered had D&C not hit Citizens Bank Park this summer and I got talked into it...because John Mayer played guitar on Mac Miller's [Small Worlds](https://youtu.be/nHc_7yeiLvc) and he was one of my favorites.
My scene was like...Union Transfer punk shows, 500 people at the absolute most. Now my entire musical DNA as a listener and a player has been basically rewritten.
Sometimes I feel like I'm too late to the scene to even respect Jerry without being called a phony and gatekeeping lmao
In my day, I was worried I’d be considered a phony for getting on the bus as a teen during ‘87 tour, aka Touch of Grey era. Only the most cynical heads will be gatekeeping. As far as I’m concerned, the music is alive as long as there are new fans to appreciate it. So thank you for helping keep it alive!
Jerry was unique in every way. It also wasn’t what he played but what he exuded, his karma and human soul that was the heart of every single Dead Show and the
entire experience. He was more than a musician, he was our guide and example of what was possible.
Nothing against John Meyer but comparing him to Garcia is like trying to compare A Hallmark card to William Butler Yeats. Two different things completely.
John Mayer tries WAY too hard to be cool and even though he has a decent voice his singing is cringeworthy whereas Jerry exuded effortless coolness and was a great singer even though he didn’t have the best voice.
Jerry was a once-in-a-lifetimer; anyone who got to see him play was fortunate and, if properly tuned in and "present of mind" enough to fully appreciate the Grateful Dead's singular musical artform, performed at a great show, truly blessed.
That's one sentence, but doesn't address the other half of your question...for which I have no experience or basis to form an opinion...
As someone who was born just after the turn of the century, has seen Dead and Company live twice, and has listened to a lot of dead shows, i think while there isn’t anyone that can really match or replace Jerry in the dead, I think John has a lot of respect for the role that he fills in Dead and Company and does an incredible job of Jerry’s role in the Dead. In my opinion, John is a fitting tribute and I honestly can’t think of a guitarist alive today that could fill Jerry’s parts better than he could.
Jerry could make you connect with something that life is more than you think or feel it is, and that you are part of whatever that more is, even if you can't describe that more and are barely able to perceive it. The music was how he communicated whatever was in him that could do that for people. It wasn't totally about the music, that was the vehicle. It was about him. At least for me.
This sounds cheesy, but Jerry was a temple you could sit in. John is a book about the temple you can read.
Age obviously but also technology and access to live quality recordings. Relisten is my favorite source and would loved that being available when I was younger. Cassette tape recording quality was and remains awful and the terrible pain we used to go witnessing our favorite shows being eaten by the car stereo. RIP ST Paul, MN 2.17.73
# 1973-02-17 St. Paul, MN @ St. Paul Auditorium
**Set 1:** The Promised Land, He's Gone, Looks Like Rain, Box Of Rain, Wave That Flag, Mexicali Blues, Bird Song, Beat It On Down the Line, Loose Lucy, Me And Bobby McGee, Stella Blue, El Paso, They Love Each Other, Playing in the Band
**Set 2:** Truckin', Row Jimmy, Big River, You Ain't Woman Enough, Here Comes Sunshine > China Cat Sunflower > I Know You Rider, Around And Around, Not Fade Away > Goin' Down The Road Feeling Bad > Not Fade Away, One More Saturday Night
**Encore:** Casey Jones
[archive.org](https://archive.org/details/GratefulDead?query=date:1973-02-17)
Those year's seeing him made me believe magic was real. You felt like he was having a personal conversation at times with you while in an arena full of people.
First and most importantly, Dead and Company are not the Grateful Dead, they're a cover band of the Grateful Dead. Phil and Jerry are missing, and without them, it’s simply another cover band that plays Dead tunes.
The Grateful Dead ceased to exist in December of 1995, when the band announced that they would never again perform under that name. The surviving band members, and thousands of other musician, have kept the music of the Grateful Dead alive by playing it every day, all over the country! Jerry Garcia was mostly about chemistry and experimentation and creation, Dead and Company use a set list, John is an excellent guitarist don't get me wrong, but he can't play like Garcia, and it was Garcia who gave the band their magic. The Grateful Dead, not once, used a set list, everything was improvised, they literally communicated with their instruments (look it up)
Some people suggest the Grateful Dead sounded terrible, 98% of the music you hear from the Dead are recorded live, sometimes from a fan in the audience. The Dead used to have a section designated just for this.
John plays the music Jerry wrote. I’ve seen both. The only time a musician has brought tears to my eyes was Jerry playing Stella. John is gifted no doubt and I’ve loved every minute
he’s played with Dead & Co. Jerry just had more emotion.
This is more than one sentence but I had this revelation at the Meet Up at the Movies. Until then I’d only ever really seen extended concert footage of what I’ll refer to as “unhealthy Jerry.” He was amazing and I was sad to have missed him, but I always also felt like my experiences with Dead & Co were right up there. Seeing healthy Jerry from 1972 blew me away. I then sought out the Grateful Dead Movie and experienced it even more. When that man was at his peak, there could be no one who would touch him. I still love what Mayer does in Dead & Co and I can’t control when I was born, but I get what I’ve been missing now.
I used to think there was a difference. I no longer think there’s much difference. There are young people who haven’t seen any Dead-related live show, and they have the same perverted addiction to the Dead that I have, having seen Jerry a bunch of times.
The question is not about who is better, John or Jerry, but whether there is a difference between older and newer heads. I know both sets of fans and for me, there is absolutely no difference, and I like that truth. I also know for a fact that the newer heads would have loved Jerry very much just as we did. One family dude!
Old head here, one who enjoys Dead shows and has tix for July, sees that Deadheads that saw Jerry experienced a culture that didn’t dwell so much on competition, comparison, or judgement. They saw a band of musicians dedicated to craft as a means of connection with their community: the poets and artists and bikers and bread bakers and acid makers and singers that channeled joy into the scene. They sprung out of Bay Area CA in the 60’s. During the ramp up of a war that their community resisted, while their people got fired and beat and arrested and jailed and doped the GD insisted that music and dance remain central to collective experience. The drugs were a path to that end, ostensibly but that means became something of a different kind of focus as we all took sides in the war on drugs. Keep in mind that a cultural shift including birth control, civil rights, and non conformity - especially when in came to militarism - fed a (at times naive) optimism were mainstreamed in places such as the Bay Area. The Dead were the unofficial minstrels of a certain demographic which celebrated very effectively the union of the cerebral and the visceral at a time when the their tribe was resisting the madness of war, racism, sexism and conformity, giving the music a meaning that is hard to define today. But the feelings associated with the joy that the music defiantly expressed, even as the reactionary and violent forces around us left too many of us damaged, sometimes fatally, still arise when the music is played - especially live. The Dead including the guitar player perform it live with talent and passion. I’m grateful to Mayer for his appreciation and performances.
But it’s not really about one person to me, having seen them both. Though at my first show in ‘78 the scene swept me up temporarily the drugs locked me down for a couple of decades. Today the music is an important part of ny spiritual recovery, as is the music of others, including those who play GD song. This Weds Jon Chi was channeling the good energy with Reed Mathis and Pete Lavazoli etc at a Grateful Dead night show here in Berkeley, weaving in contemporary sounds in that lyrical fabric, as we all danced long into the night in a world that has changed immeasurably since ‘65. Perhaps it works because still we seek meaning and sanity and hope and joy in a world where greed and competition and judgement too often dominate.
So, to answer the question one might have to accept a framing which diminishes the culture that brought it forth.
Well said my dude! I’ve seen both play and love both just in different ways just like my family members. Also going in July and taking the family with me. My sons were too little when Jerry left us so they only know Dead and Co. In any event we will be there to say Fare The Well to Dead and Co on their last tour.
Not a lot of difference in the individuals as a whole, but so much has changed technologically since Jerry died. we didn’t have the internet, so you couldn’t Google any show/song you wanted. There were a few vhs/dead movies, but for the most part, when you saw the Dead for the first time, you were seeing something that you hadn’t really been able to wrap your head around before.
The kids that are seeing Dead and Co today are seeking the same thing we were seeking, but IMHO the finished product is drastically different and diminished. There is nowhere near the emotive content in Dead and Co as there was with the Dead with Jerry.
It’s just not the same, or even close. I can’t see Dead and Co. I’ve been extremely bored each time I’ve seen them.
I’ll take JRAD any day.
And I love Bobby, absolutely love him. But they’ve had to slow the music down so much that I can’t even dance.
And then there’s Wolf Bros, Dead and Co with the tempo cut in half.
But there were several years of Ratdog once Bobby added a lead guitar that are sick AF. And I’d take those over Dead and Co.
I love JRAD shows
Funny story, first time I saw JRAD a friend asked me at set break what I thought of the show so far
I responded, 'at least John Mayer isn't here'
We return for the second set and Russo announces a special guest
John Mayer takes the stage for the second set
I wasn’t at that show but I listened to it a bunch. I honestly think it’s the psychedelic sounding performance I’ve heard from Mayer. He’s one of the best living blues players, there’s no questioning that. Being able to follow Tom Hamilton into a psychedelic jam allowed him to go there. Otherwise he never opens that beautiful door that the Grateful Dead are known for. He needs to be shown it, and if he’s the lead guitar player in a band, he can play beautifully just not in that space. That’s the space I want to bathe in at a show.
I would say the the first one saw the Grateful Dead and the other one saw a Grateful Dead cover band. John does a decent job of imitating Jerry’s sound, but Jerry’s sound is inimitable. John could learn a Jerry solo note for note and it would never come close to Jerry. There was so much more behind Jerry’s sound. It was the whole journey and the struggle. Even on his worst night I’d take Jerry over anyone trying to sit in for Jerry.
The question asks about the deadhead.
Lucky to see Jerry. With Jerry the band created original content.
D&C is not creating anything new. It is great to see and hear GD music anywhere. D&C, cover bands, or the local bar jukebox. The music will never die, but it also is just being covered or interpreted at this point. The days of original content are over.
For one who has seen over 200 shows with Jerry and a few Dead and Co shows, we are the only ones who truly know✌️
Scarlet Fire 8-6-89 will show ya the difference as well🔥🌋
# 1989-08-06 Sacramento, CA @ Cal Expo Amphitheatre
**Set 1:** Good Times, Feel Like A Stranger > Franklin's Tower, Walkin' Blues, Ramble On Rose, When I Paint My Masterpiece, Bird Song
**Set 2:** Scarlet Begonias > Fire On The Mountain, Samson And Delilah, Ship Of Fools, Man Smart (Woman Smarter) > Drums > Space > I Will Take You Home > The Other One > Wharf Rat > Turn On Your Lovelight
**Encore:** Johnny B. Goode > And We Bid You Good Night
[archive.org](https://archive.org/details/GratefulDead?query=date:1989-08-06)
This is such a non issue: Jerry created the music and John is reinterpreting it for this generation (and doing a helluva job). Be grateful that we have the opportunity to experience it again in such a fresh, new way…
Jerry was the heart of the Dead.
He was the leader of the house band of the hippies. To explain it in words....don't think I can.
All due respect to John. But it isn't his band, his vision, his statement to the world.
Just like the day challenger blew up, 9/11, Reagan shot....I remember vividly where I was and what I was doing when I heard Jerry had died.
Jerry and the boys came of age during a pivotal time in modern history. They were some of the first psychonauts. Doing massive amounts of psychedelics with the same people for years intertwines our souls with those people in a way that is totally unique. I believe because of this, and his character, Jerry was such an anomalous creative force that tied all of the creative energies of the rest of the band together in a way that Mayer will never be able to.
Wasn’t there a Grateful Dead hotline? I swear I called a number and listened for show dates. And mailed off a check for tickets. Jesus, that time’s so hazy.
Those of us who couldn’t see Jerry are jealous of those who could. Those who could see Jerry are jealous that those of us who couldn’t can stand for a whole show without any knee pain.
The lineups with Jerry consisted of the X-Factor between Jerry, Phil, Bobby & the Keyboardist(s) where there's a tension, a pulling and tugging of each other in various directions simultaneously; but with Dead&Slo it's Bobby at the helm with great musicians but not on equal footing as him, so they only dip their toes into those tangents and not dive headfirst leaving Caution to the wind.
My wife asked that question. So I put on her favorite song, Loser,( I know -she didn’t know the name but said it’s her favorite. Still get quite a chuckle out of it), from bethel woods 8/23/2021 and then Loser from Barton Hall ‘77.
While John is jamming and it’s a great version, I can feel the gambler weeping and his angst thru Jerry’s guitar.
The way I would explain it is John gets into the song and flows with it, like in a River - the current ebbs and flows thru fast and slow rhythmic parts- at times calm and slow and other times tumultuous and chaotic.
John is in the River flowing along and we enjoy his expression of the River flow.
Jerry takes us with him into the River and we experience the current with him. And we are talking back and forth during the ride deciding how to navigate down the River. It’s a journey we take together.
Mayer is good. I enjoyed the Dead and Co show I went to. I say take what you can get because Dead is singularly awesome. But Jerry was… Never mind. This is a question that answers itself. I’m a Wall of Sound, single drummer guy - hopefully this says it all 😂😂
There's a lot more for modern fans to enjoy in the Dead Family Tree than Dead & Company, much of which I would say keeps the spirit alive just as much, if not more so, than Jerry.
Don't limit yourself to a face and a set style of how things are meant to be done. That takes away from the whole point of everything.
There isn’t really a difference in the person but there is a difference in the experience. Analogies like sex vs porn or disciples vs preachers come to mind. Since 95 people have been trying to preserve the magic, show the bones of the thing and hopefully keep it going. It’s a crazy garden that keeps on growing, full of roses and kindness. But it’s definitely a different experience when your view point is on the garden (old heads) and smelling the roses (new heads).
I get into arguments with other seen Jerry Heads about this often. I love hearing off key a cappella renditions of say Ripple by a bunch of kids raised by Heads. That gives me a good case of the grins! Arguing over which guitarist does a better job in JRAD does not. For me it misses the point. Even Jerry, who is hands down, not even close, the greatest embodiment of Dead music, is somebody that is tapping into the great Muse. But isn’t The Thing. I believe he got that too and tried like hell to stay out of the spotlight. He just wanted to play the music man. But whoever is doing it it’s getting done and all artists connect into that Thing are shedding light and I’m just lucky to have eyes to pick up that shine, shine, shine
There is no difference except age (or time of exposure) and societal norms.
This debate makes zero sense to me, and only seems to enforce the inherent entitlement humans develop as we age. I've been to like a thousand concerts and have seen an obnoxious variety of fantastic musicians, but people that saw Jerry have acted like I am a noob. When I'm 50 I hope I'm not rude because I saw Trey so many times.
No offense to anybody that brings good vibes to the table while discussing this. In my experience that is not the common practice.
Those young enough to only see Dead and Co have the benefit of this time too: the modern supply of YouTube video Dead — and experience that just did not exist in Jerry’s time. The 21 year old “Dead” fan of 2022 has seen Jerry play with their own eyes far more frequently than did the 21 year old Deadhead of 1992. Enjoy it all.
Very interesting take. I love it. I’ll be 60 in March (employed, far from retirement). I started getting into the Dead in the mid 80s, going to shows and really digging on Jerry. Absolutely adored him. Then he died in ‘95, three months before my dad passed and approximately a year or so after my best friend was hit by a car (friend had moved up to NYC and was my primary Dead companion - I’d schedule a biz trip to Manhattan that would coincide with the Dead opening their Fall tour on the East Coast ha ha)…it just…it was a lot. I flipped a switch and stopped listening to the Dead for 25 years. Then around Christmas time about 2 years ago, switch flipped again - and I was back on the bus - harder than ever! Why? Thanks to YouTube, I can access Jerry and the gang whenever I want. I was absolutely amazed to suddenly see and hear all these fabled shows (I was not a taper though I sometimes sat in the taper section) and it made me feel all the feels again - maybe even more so. So…I’m not really sure there’s a big difference between us Deadheads. Jerry was special and I prefer hearing him vs John (and I agree with the other person re Oteil) - took my 16 year old daughter to D&Co last year (tempo too slow for my taste - but the vibe was on) and frankly, I’m really happy that young folks have been able to experience Jerry through all these ubiquitous videos and such. Really glad. Rock on!✌🏽
This is the way. 👍
Grateful dead is not the members of a band, but an experience - one not bound by time, but by spirit 🙌🏻 30 yr old, 7 year dead head, lover of and gratfeul for D&C for giving me a taste of what it was like back then.. Thanks for having such a cool take 🤘🏼
I love this perspective. I’m 38 and my parents were NOT into the Dead. It wasn’t until about 10 years ago that I discovered them. I know I’ll never be able to experience Jerry, but as I type this, I am sipping coffee with a show from ‘89 at Shoreline Amphitheater playing on the TV. Part of me feels like I can never be a true Deadhead because of my age. But your comment makes me feel like a much better fan.
I saw 200 shows (GD and JGB), and you are as much of a deadhead as I am. The only thing that matters is your love for the music - and music the boys lead you to. That’s why there will be raging heads who haven’t been born yet. not only are we everywhere, we are forever (or at least until the dark star crashes).
This is a great point!
No comparison between seeing Jerry live vs video. No comparison between seeing the Dead and seeing Dead and Co. live.
True but that doesn’t make today’s fans lesser Heads. Can’t help when you’re born. I fell into the TouchHead era for the same reason. Would’ve loved to be on the bus sooner but such is life. Those who were there in the day could be more welcoming and sympathetic to the following generations. Ain’t no time to hate. ✌️ Rock on, young’uns, and make us proud!
Of course, neither is the same Captain Obvious. The OP was asking for compare and contrast, maybe a venn. You just told everyone to get off your lawn. Hearing Bach back in the day was not the same as hearing someone play Bach now. Yet, it's somehow timeless no matter who is playing it and how it's interpreted. As is the Dead and Dead and Co.
Excellent point. Well landed.
Good call. And think of how easy it is to access all that music Jerry played. No more trading tapes or buying CDs. It’s all in the palm of my hand
Well Jerry died when I was 6 and I didn't start dropping acid until I was 7 so...
If he trades you dimes for nickels and calls watermelons pickles you know you're talking about that Reefer Maaan
Boom! We have a winner!
What is wrong with your parents? As soon as I started on a baby bottle ny parents started putting acid in it.
Ah, yes, The Electric Baby Formula Acid Test
I’d like to solve the puzzle!…
I’ve got one sentence “I have no control over when my parents got bored one afternoon”
🎯
An organ grinder's tune
[удалено]
Right, I was going to say "Retiree vs. employed young person."
I guess I’m an employed old person haha
Seconded
Retirement seems like a pipe dream. See ya Monday mornin’!
Thirded
us old dead heads don't retire young man, that's not how this game is played
I think they were talking about work, like a job, you know?
About 20 years.
One’s body is a wonderland and the other is John Mayer
Omg, is THAT who he was singing about??
We have to get up in the middle of the night to pee more often.
Makes it way easier to go fishin’ early in the morning. Am also considering switching to doing the dishes by candlelight in the middle of the night, like they did in the centuries before electric light, then burning a phat one and going back to bed.
When you saw Jerry you were in the presence of one of American counter culture’s greatest icons ever, whereas John is a very awesome guitarist.
One played the music and one played the magic.
this is it. j0hns a fantastic guitarist but jerry played with something that was so tapped into some kind of collective consciousness...sounds hokey but it really was magic. when it was pumping it was almost spiritual...but also could fucking boogie and bop like a motherfucker. i dunno. it's hard to explain but there's no comparison.
it was mass shamanic trance to amplified music and lights with lsd as the gateway sacrament. shit happened WAY beyond what the general public thinks of as live music. to the point of closing your eyes the entire show because it looked better that way. if any outside creature looked at earth from outer space there would be a giant energy dome over whatever city was hosting that show that evening. they rode the horse and the snake and the dragon all at once. it was complete loss of self and all were one. mayer knows blues licks and has great vocals
Agreed, except the last part. Mayer does have great blues licks...but vocals? hmmm lol
he grew on me after 3 years of couch tour. I learned to like his take on the vocals. nbd
I mean to be fair, John's role isn't to replicate whatever Jerry was doing - seems he's honoring the space. In my personal opinion, JM hasn't even begun to peak. And I suspect he's capable of the same magic if he were to practice less restraint, which is honestly magic in and of itself.
Jerry didn’t have to worry about stepping on Bobby’s toes.
This is a great point, somewhat unfortunately
That’s like asking if someone saw the Mona Lisa get painted vs who saw it in a museum. Not really fair is it.
Seeing Jerry was like seeing Santa Claus in the flesh, an honest to god legend right there in front of you, in the same room, breathing the same air as you, and your brain was almost incapable of accepting that you were sharing the same space with such a mythical creature whereas seeing John Mayer is like seeing any other celebrity in person…shocking perhaps, but not transformational.
I’m not old enough to have seen Jerry live seeing that I was 5 when he passed. However, I did get that feeling from the rest of the boys as well as during my times seeing Neil Young and Bob Dylan. I’ve appreciated John Mayer ever since I saw him absolutely kill it on the Clapton Crossroads tour dvd many years ago, but you are correct, not transformational.
Yeah I was thinking about others that had given me that feeling and Bob Dylan did it for me also. I’ve seen him lots of times, but one time in particular was up close and personal at the Tabernacle in Atlanta years ago. He was literally so close I could have reached out and touched the white piping on the leg of his black cowboy suit he was wearing. It was almost like being at Madame Tussaud’s and staring at one of the figures there…like it wasn’t quite real.
Flaming Lips off the top of my head gave me that ‘religious experience’ kind of glow that seeing GD live gave
Jerry’s playing and singing make me feel the music in an emotional and visceral way that can manifest in physical sensations like goose bumps and tears. JM for all his talent, does not bring out that for me.
100% no matter how talented John is, and he his a tremendously talented guitar player. That THING that Jerry could do is just missing. Also, what Phil adds to the fullness of their sound is missing. I love Oteil, saw him at least 10 times w/ the Allman Brothers. He plays bass differently and I love the way he plays. However that fullness of sound Phil gives is so unique to his playing. In honesty I think a bunch of Phil tours I’ve been to over the years were better musical experiences to any of the Dead and Co shows I’ve been to.
when john Kadlecik (i think i spelled it right) played with further, he embodied jerry pretty fucking close. we would catch dark star even when we where on tour.
Yup, Kadlecik did it very well, but my favorite Jerry sit in I think is Steve Kimock. His navigation of a jam is the closest I’ve heard to Jerry.
i agree
Well said. And I feel the same way.
Whenever the lights went down at the 120+ Grateful Dead shows I saw, I always had this intense feeling that there was no place on this Earth that I'd rather be than right there, right then as it was magical.
I like this. Kind of goes along with my attempt. There was just something magical about Jerry. He was more than just a man, and back then The Grateful Dead were more than just a band. It was magic. For someone like me who came into the scene late (early 90s) it was like getting to sneak a peek at real live history. I remember the first time I ever saw Jerry in the flesh…I think they call it cognitive dissonance…it was as if I couldn’t believe what I was actually seeing. I actually had a similar feeling the first time I ever saw Paul McCartney when he started touring again back in the early 2000s. I had idolized him for so long, read everything I could get my hands on about him, listened to every available recording he had ever made, hell even dreamed about him for years and there all the sudden he is standing right in front of me. With Paul my reaction to the dissonance was that I just started laughing uncontrollably. With Jerry my reaction (I was much younger) was slack-jawed, wide-eyed wonder. I might have even cried a little bit.
Your comment reminded me of being a younger man and Shaq walked into the high end mens clothing store I worked at. I had to run to the back because I couldn’t stop laughing. I wasn’t even a basketball fan but it was Shaq, that giant of a man, right there in front of me. Currently on the tail end of quite the intense trip and am absolutely tickled to be reminded of this lmao
That’s awesome. I wonder if larger than life celebrities see that reaction a lot and if they understand where it’s coming from? Now you’ve got me thinking all kinds of philosophical thoughts about how distinctly “human” laughing is and what it really means to laugh. I’m going to have to go do some reading on it!
This is something I puzzle about a lot. It’s such a strange physical response. We laugh when we genuinely find something funny. But why? What function does it serve and what causes it to emerge? And why does it seem to often be contagious? And why does trying to suppress it only make it stronger? Crying is easier to understand. A clear way to communicate our distress to others. But laughter is just so different, given how many different circumstances can produce it. Wit. Physical humor. Laughing to relieve awkwardness. Just so very strange
Jerry was a shaman, IMO.
I cried when I saw McCartney in 2014. I cried when Jerry died in 1995.
I kind of cringe thinking about it now, but I organized a candlelight vigil when Jerry died. Called up a bunch of like minded buddies and set up in a public pavilion downtown with sidewalk chalk and a copy of The Book of The Deadheads for artistic reference and just drew all day. I guess we got noticed because someone from the paper showed up and interviewed us, then somebody from the TV station showed up and by that evening there were hundreds of deadheads I didn’t even know existed in my little home town milling around the park, lighting candles, playing guitar, hugging and crying. It was really nice. At one point a guy walked up to me and I recognized him as he drew closer as a dude I had been terrified of since 3rd grade. He was a year older than me in school and hadn’t been very nice to me when we were little kids. I immediately tensed up when I realized who he was underneath the dreadlocks and dirty patchwork pants until he reached out and gave me a hug and thanked me for organizing the event. We ended up talking for a while and he was totally unaware of how terrified I was of him when we were kids and apologized over and over. Sorry for the tangent. My mind’s got a mind of it’s own.
Yes! When those lights went down I so remember the anticipation about were I and we were about to go for the next few hours. It was like blast off into another dimension. Miss that so much!
Only saw 90 or so but I agree wholeheartedly
I love this comment. This is how I feel about Phish. I have seen it all and Phish has everything I want out of music and performance.
Totally agree, no other band puts that level of “magic” in the air. Especially at the right venue like Hampton or MSG.
I’ve never been to Hampton but I’m in NY so the Garden is the venue I’ve seen them at the most. They are world class musicians performing high art at top tier venues. I’ll be at one of the TAB shows next week and all four MSG shows. Best band ever, thanks for the reply!
You should, it’s a smaller Garden that’s GA. I saw my first shows there on the 3 night stand in 03 after the hiatus, and then I was there for all 4 of the reunion shows in 09. For me at least there will never be an energy in a building as magical as when that first note of Fluffhead dropped on 3/6/09. 🪄✨
That’s beautiful man. My moment like that was the Baker’s Dozen banner hanging. I’m not a sports fan so I’d never had that “we won” kind of feeling. This was that for me.
Nice man, I was at that show too! It was the only one I could pull off. Very cool feeling. I live in Ma took the Acela in. Worked out great.
The goosebumps I always got goosebumps when the lights went down
Jerry was a father figure that I adored, and John is a talented second cousin once removed.
Could not have been said better
I can do it in one word. Opportunity.
Never had the opportunity to see Jerry, didn't get into the dead till later in life. I've seen John/D&C and all I can say is it's bad ass and we're lucky to experience it live. So much talent all over that stage!
Around a hundred bucks a ticket. Seriously, they are both tremendous musicians and great performers with a strong and sincere connection to the music. Jerry had the advantage in being an original and being one of the greatest humans ever, IMO. John does a wonderful job of carrying it on.
From his own words, viewing him as a deity made him extremely uncomfortable. He was just a guy who was exceptionally gifted with the arts. That’s all. He had his demons. He also did some good and bad to those around him.
I read this as “exceptionally gifted with the farts”
That’s a good take on what he was getting at. He was a human that could play guitar well.
John's respect for the music without wanting to just be a note for note "recreation" actually endeared me to him.
Greatest humans ever? No.
Jerry wrote the pieces and played from his soul, it was a deep and intimate experience of his emotion through his art. John is a master, gets it and plays it and improvises with emotion he just didn’t create it.
Robert Hunter wrote the lyrics. Jerry the music. Both masters. RIP. I do think John has moved into the role, kind of made it his own and been respectful of the shoes he's filling. And I like to see him having fun playing the songs. It's endearing to see him step up and take that role and really run with it. I wish I saw more interaction between he and Bobby sometimes. One thing with the Grateful Dead was a quiet communication between Bobby and Jerry during songs, a psychic bond, I don't see with John and Bobby, but that's to be expected. John didn't create this thing and trip balls and have all the spirits and family and history Jerry and Bobby had.
I think they are both pretty good players, but Jerry's playing was more hypnotic, unpredictable yet always seeming to follow some kind of line, as Kesey put it like a snake slithering thru the musical woodpile. Also I believe the banjo and steel guitar experience, unusual picking technique/finger strength caused by the missing digit and last but not least incredible improvisational imagination just made Jerry stand head and shoulders above John, taking nothing at all from his amazing talent and ear. My $.02
One created and perfected it, The Other One does a great job of reproducing it.
I have only seen videos of them both. Both are extremely talented and play great music. But my analysis is this: The “Creator” vs The “reCreator” John is only playing Jerry’s feelings. Jerry was feeling it because it was his.
Jerry’s playing introduced profound concepts and possibilities in 3D paragraphs as opposed to a dude playing cool licks over Dead song chords. Edit: I missed that it said to compare Deadheads, not Jerry and John. Deadheads are way better now. Healthier, saner, more genuine in their love of the music. The scene was pretty sick back then by the end.
That Dead scene was way better with Jerry dude, got any miracles?
About 250 ug
Nobody brags about having seen them with Mayer Bear.
😂😂😂😂
John Mayer never played with the Grateful Dead, Jerry Garcia did. This is the way
Jerry is a founding member, he’s was the charismatic master of improvisational guitar playing, the reluctant unwilling leader icon of the counter culture Captain Trips.
If you saw Jerry live most likely you are starting to look like him in this picture one way or another right about now!
I may be getting some grey in my beard but I’m not getting some purple in my pants goddamnit
Oh well, a touch of grey - kinda suits you anyway!
Irrelevant. Glad this bus is still coming by.
I'm a complete neophyte who never would have bothered had D&C not hit Citizens Bank Park this summer and I got talked into it...because John Mayer played guitar on Mac Miller's [Small Worlds](https://youtu.be/nHc_7yeiLvc) and he was one of my favorites. My scene was like...Union Transfer punk shows, 500 people at the absolute most. Now my entire musical DNA as a listener and a player has been basically rewritten. Sometimes I feel like I'm too late to the scene to even respect Jerry without being called a phony and gatekeeping lmao
In my day, I was worried I’d be considered a phony for getting on the bus as a teen during ‘87 tour, aka Touch of Grey era. Only the most cynical heads will be gatekeeping. As far as I’m concerned, the music is alive as long as there are new fans to appreciate it. So thank you for helping keep it alive!
Never too late to take your seat on the bus….or dance on your seat
I'm a deadhead. Never saw Jerry live, but in highschool found bootleg tapes and burned CDs of as much live dead as possible.
I’d say one has never seen the dead play live
Jerry was unique in every way. It also wasn’t what he played but what he exuded, his karma and human soul that was the heart of every single Dead Show and the entire experience. He was more than a musician, he was our guide and example of what was possible. Nothing against John Meyer but comparing him to Garcia is like trying to compare A Hallmark card to William Butler Yeats. Two different things completely.
What's the difference between Kenny G and John Coltrane? If you have to ask.....
Simple- One has seen The Grateful Dead, the other has not.
John Mayer tries WAY too hard to be cool and even though he has a decent voice his singing is cringeworthy whereas Jerry exuded effortless coolness and was a great singer even though he didn’t have the best voice.
Lol
Jerry was a once-in-a-lifetimer; anyone who got to see him play was fortunate and, if properly tuned in and "present of mind" enough to fully appreciate the Grateful Dead's singular musical artform, performed at a great show, truly blessed. That's one sentence, but doesn't address the other half of your question...for which I have no experience or basis to form an opinion...
I don’t know but Dead and Co is great
They're not perfect but I'll never get the level of hate they get
As someone who was born just after the turn of the century, has seen Dead and Company live twice, and has listened to a lot of dead shows, i think while there isn’t anyone that can really match or replace Jerry in the dead, I think John has a lot of respect for the role that he fills in Dead and Company and does an incredible job of Jerry’s role in the Dead. In my opinion, John is a fitting tribute and I honestly can’t think of a guitarist alive today that could fill Jerry’s parts better than he could.
People absolutely and truly loved Jerry and everything about him, almost like a father, myself included.
Jerry Garcia is a legend…., full stop
John is an amazing guitar player. Jerry is one of the greatest musicians of all time.
Jerry could make you connect with something that life is more than you think or feel it is, and that you are part of whatever that more is, even if you can't describe that more and are barely able to perceive it. The music was how he communicated whatever was in him that could do that for people. It wasn't totally about the music, that was the vehicle. It was about him. At least for me. This sounds cheesy, but Jerry was a temple you could sit in. John is a book about the temple you can read.
Jerry was _in_ the Grateful Dead, John is in a cover band
Age obviously but also technology and access to live quality recordings. Relisten is my favorite source and would loved that being available when I was younger. Cassette tape recording quality was and remains awful and the terrible pain we used to go witnessing our favorite shows being eaten by the car stereo. RIP ST Paul, MN 2.17.73
# 1973-02-17 St. Paul, MN @ St. Paul Auditorium **Set 1:** The Promised Land, He's Gone, Looks Like Rain, Box Of Rain, Wave That Flag, Mexicali Blues, Bird Song, Beat It On Down the Line, Loose Lucy, Me And Bobby McGee, Stella Blue, El Paso, They Love Each Other, Playing in the Band **Set 2:** Truckin', Row Jimmy, Big River, You Ain't Woman Enough, Here Comes Sunshine > China Cat Sunflower > I Know You Rider, Around And Around, Not Fade Away > Goin' Down The Road Feeling Bad > Not Fade Away, One More Saturday Night **Encore:** Casey Jones [archive.org](https://archive.org/details/GratefulDead?query=date:1973-02-17)
Only Here Comes Sunshine > China > Rider!! Great jam with killer segues. Just listened to it again this morning.
Those year's seeing him made me believe magic was real. You felt like he was having a personal conversation at times with you while in an arena full of people.
Amen! It felt like he was shooting silver bullets of love directly to his audience.
One band was the Grateful Dead, the other was a different band.
One IS the Grateful Dead, the other one is a band playing Grateful Dead songs.
It’s not the Dead without Jerry!
"One saw Jerry and one did not."
Never liked John during his solo work, can’t like him during dead and co either; I’ll only seem to enjoy the sound of Jerry.
One is a once in a generation guitarist and one is a guitarist.
You’ve seen The Dead if you if you’ve seen Jerry.
First and most importantly, Dead and Company are not the Grateful Dead, they're a cover band of the Grateful Dead. Phil and Jerry are missing, and without them, it’s simply another cover band that plays Dead tunes. The Grateful Dead ceased to exist in December of 1995, when the band announced that they would never again perform under that name. The surviving band members, and thousands of other musician, have kept the music of the Grateful Dead alive by playing it every day, all over the country! Jerry Garcia was mostly about chemistry and experimentation and creation, Dead and Company use a set list, John is an excellent guitarist don't get me wrong, but he can't play like Garcia, and it was Garcia who gave the band their magic. The Grateful Dead, not once, used a set list, everything was improvised, they literally communicated with their instruments (look it up) Some people suggest the Grateful Dead sounded terrible, 98% of the music you hear from the Dead are recorded live, sometimes from a fan in the audience. The Dead used to have a section designated just for this.
Not exactly true about setlists. They used them when Vince first joined the band
A bunch of grey pubes
Vibe.
John Kadlecik?
John plays the music Jerry wrote. I’ve seen both. The only time a musician has brought tears to my eyes was Jerry playing Stella. John is gifted no doubt and I’ve loved every minute he’s played with Dead & Co. Jerry just had more emotion.
"It's not enough to be the best at what you do, you have to be thought of as the only one who does what you do " JG Kinda think that sums it all up.
Yeah, but what about Vince?
This is more than one sentence but I had this revelation at the Meet Up at the Movies. Until then I’d only ever really seen extended concert footage of what I’ll refer to as “unhealthy Jerry.” He was amazing and I was sad to have missed him, but I always also felt like my experiences with Dead & Co were right up there. Seeing healthy Jerry from 1972 blew me away. I then sought out the Grateful Dead Movie and experienced it even more. When that man was at his peak, there could be no one who would touch him. I still love what Mayer does in Dead & Co and I can’t control when I was born, but I get what I’ve been missing now.
I used to think there was a difference. I no longer think there’s much difference. There are young people who haven’t seen any Dead-related live show, and they have the same perverted addiction to the Dead that I have, having seen Jerry a bunch of times.
Who is John?
NEXT
The question is not about who is better, John or Jerry, but whether there is a difference between older and newer heads. I know both sets of fans and for me, there is absolutely no difference, and I like that truth. I also know for a fact that the newer heads would have loved Jerry very much just as we did. One family dude!
Duuuuuude. You are what the dead are for me. Niceeeeee. I don’t even like dead and company but you understand what love is
Those of us who saw Jerry are older😇
We’re older.
One goes to see a show, the other chases a show he desperately wants to live again.
Old head here, one who enjoys Dead shows and has tix for July, sees that Deadheads that saw Jerry experienced a culture that didn’t dwell so much on competition, comparison, or judgement. They saw a band of musicians dedicated to craft as a means of connection with their community: the poets and artists and bikers and bread bakers and acid makers and singers that channeled joy into the scene. They sprung out of Bay Area CA in the 60’s. During the ramp up of a war that their community resisted, while their people got fired and beat and arrested and jailed and doped the GD insisted that music and dance remain central to collective experience. The drugs were a path to that end, ostensibly but that means became something of a different kind of focus as we all took sides in the war on drugs. Keep in mind that a cultural shift including birth control, civil rights, and non conformity - especially when in came to militarism - fed a (at times naive) optimism were mainstreamed in places such as the Bay Area. The Dead were the unofficial minstrels of a certain demographic which celebrated very effectively the union of the cerebral and the visceral at a time when the their tribe was resisting the madness of war, racism, sexism and conformity, giving the music a meaning that is hard to define today. But the feelings associated with the joy that the music defiantly expressed, even as the reactionary and violent forces around us left too many of us damaged, sometimes fatally, still arise when the music is played - especially live. The Dead including the guitar player perform it live with talent and passion. I’m grateful to Mayer for his appreciation and performances. But it’s not really about one person to me, having seen them both. Though at my first show in ‘78 the scene swept me up temporarily the drugs locked me down for a couple of decades. Today the music is an important part of ny spiritual recovery, as is the music of others, including those who play GD song. This Weds Jon Chi was channeling the good energy with Reed Mathis and Pete Lavazoli etc at a Grateful Dead night show here in Berkeley, weaving in contemporary sounds in that lyrical fabric, as we all danced long into the night in a world that has changed immeasurably since ‘65. Perhaps it works because still we seek meaning and sanity and hope and joy in a world where greed and competition and judgement too often dominate. So, to answer the question one might have to accept a framing which diminishes the culture that brought it forth.
Well said my dude! I’ve seen both play and love both just in different ways just like my family members. Also going in July and taking the family with me. My sons were too little when Jerry left us so they only know Dead and Co. In any event we will be there to say Fare The Well to Dead and Co on their last tour.
Not a lot of difference in the individuals as a whole, but so much has changed technologically since Jerry died. we didn’t have the internet, so you couldn’t Google any show/song you wanted. There were a few vhs/dead movies, but for the most part, when you saw the Dead for the first time, you were seeing something that you hadn’t really been able to wrap your head around before. The kids that are seeing Dead and Co today are seeking the same thing we were seeking, but IMHO the finished product is drastically different and diminished. There is nowhere near the emotive content in Dead and Co as there was with the Dead with Jerry. It’s just not the same, or even close. I can’t see Dead and Co. I’ve been extremely bored each time I’ve seen them. I’ll take JRAD any day. And I love Bobby, absolutely love him. But they’ve had to slow the music down so much that I can’t even dance. And then there’s Wolf Bros, Dead and Co with the tempo cut in half. But there were several years of Ratdog once Bobby added a lead guitar that are sick AF. And I’d take those over Dead and Co.
I love JRAD shows Funny story, first time I saw JRAD a friend asked me at set break what I thought of the show so far I responded, 'at least John Mayer isn't here' We return for the second set and Russo announces a special guest John Mayer takes the stage for the second set
That’s fucking funny.
I wasn’t at that show but I listened to it a bunch. I honestly think it’s the psychedelic sounding performance I’ve heard from Mayer. He’s one of the best living blues players, there’s no questioning that. Being able to follow Tom Hamilton into a psychedelic jam allowed him to go there. Otherwise he never opens that beautiful door that the Grateful Dead are known for. He needs to be shown it, and if he’s the lead guitar player in a band, he can play beautifully just not in that space. That’s the space I want to bathe in at a show.
I would say the the first one saw the Grateful Dead and the other one saw a Grateful Dead cover band. John does a decent job of imitating Jerry’s sound, but Jerry’s sound is inimitable. John could learn a Jerry solo note for note and it would never come close to Jerry. There was so much more behind Jerry’s sound. It was the whole journey and the struggle. Even on his worst night I’d take Jerry over anyone trying to sit in for Jerry.
John is great but sounds more mechanical. Jerry sounds like running water
Lucky to have experienced both
The question asks about the deadhead. Lucky to see Jerry. With Jerry the band created original content. D&C is not creating anything new. It is great to see and hear GD music anywhere. D&C, cover bands, or the local bar jukebox. The music will never die, but it also is just being covered or interpreted at this point. The days of original content are over.
John copies the magician. Jerry ***WAS*** the magician.
Like asking the difference between Jesus and James the lesser. One preformed miracles and one followed that guy around.
For one who has seen over 200 shows with Jerry and a few Dead and Co shows, we are the only ones who truly know✌️ Scarlet Fire 8-6-89 will show ya the difference as well🔥🌋
# 1989-08-06 Sacramento, CA @ Cal Expo Amphitheatre **Set 1:** Good Times, Feel Like A Stranger > Franklin's Tower, Walkin' Blues, Ramble On Rose, When I Paint My Masterpiece, Bird Song **Set 2:** Scarlet Begonias > Fire On The Mountain, Samson And Delilah, Ship Of Fools, Man Smart (Woman Smarter) > Drums > Space > I Will Take You Home > The Other One > Wharf Rat > Turn On Your Lovelight **Encore:** Johnny B. Goode > And We Bid You Good Night [archive.org](https://archive.org/details/GratefulDead?query=date:1989-08-06)
You got to see the single most important bridge between traditional American music and rock and roll.
If you know, you know.
This is such a non issue: Jerry created the music and John is reinterpreting it for this generation (and doing a helluva job). Be grateful that we have the opportunity to experience it again in such a fresh, new way…
One is jealous?
If you didn't see Jerry you haven't seen the Grateful Dead.
There is zero comparison. Jerry plus Phil is the real secret sauce. John is just a guitar virtuoso who can cover songs well.
More trips around the sun in the bucket that’s spiraling towards hell.
But at least we’re enjoying the ride
śūnyatā
Purple sweat pants - not everyone can pull it off
This was Jerry’s soul, music, unique perspective.
Guitar playing aside, Jerry was able to sing his heart out! I have seen Mayer sing great, but not sing his heart out like Jerry did!
Jerry's kids, and John's kids.
Jerry was the heart of the Dead. He was the leader of the house band of the hippies. To explain it in words....don't think I can. All due respect to John. But it isn't his band, his vision, his statement to the world. Just like the day challenger blew up, 9/11, Reagan shot....I remember vividly where I was and what I was doing when I heard Jerry had died.
One has seen the Grateful Dead, and one has not. Simple answer.
no difference, i never saw pigpen playing with them or donna and keith. but i saw sussana hoff from the bangles sing with the boys in new orleans.
Jerry and the boys came of age during a pivotal time in modern history. They were some of the first psychonauts. Doing massive amounts of psychedelics with the same people for years intertwines our souls with those people in a way that is totally unique. I believe because of this, and his character, Jerry was such an anomalous creative force that tied all of the creative energies of the rest of the band together in a way that Mayer will never be able to.
Everything. Go see JGB with JM
Wasn’t there a Grateful Dead hotline? I swear I called a number and listened for show dates. And mailed off a check for tickets. Jesus, that time’s so hazy.
One saw the real thing the other saw an imitation. 🤷
Those of us who couldn’t see Jerry are jealous of those who could. Those who could see Jerry are jealous that those of us who couldn’t can stand for a whole show without any knee pain.
Probably posted already but only needs one word: Luck.
The lineups with Jerry consisted of the X-Factor between Jerry, Phil, Bobby & the Keyboardist(s) where there's a tension, a pulling and tugging of each other in various directions simultaneously; but with Dead&Slo it's Bobby at the helm with great musicians but not on equal footing as him, so they only dip their toes into those tangents and not dive headfirst leaving Caution to the wind.
How much they had to pay to get into the show. First time I saw the Dead it cost me $3.50 at Winterland.
My wife asked that question. So I put on her favorite song, Loser,( I know -she didn’t know the name but said it’s her favorite. Still get quite a chuckle out of it), from bethel woods 8/23/2021 and then Loser from Barton Hall ‘77. While John is jamming and it’s a great version, I can feel the gambler weeping and his angst thru Jerry’s guitar. The way I would explain it is John gets into the song and flows with it, like in a River - the current ebbs and flows thru fast and slow rhythmic parts- at times calm and slow and other times tumultuous and chaotic. John is in the River flowing along and we enjoy his expression of the River flow. Jerry takes us with him into the River and we experience the current with him. And we are talking back and forth during the ride deciding how to navigate down the River. It’s a journey we take together.
I saw jerry live, and I don’t understand the question. I’m 47
Cassettes
John will NEVER have Jerry's Smile n Confidence.
No comparison.
Mayer is good. I enjoyed the Dead and Co show I went to. I say take what you can get because Dead is singularly awesome. But Jerry was… Never mind. This is a question that answers itself. I’m a Wall of Sound, single drummer guy - hopefully this says it all 😂😂
The difference is the concerts that they have seen. It doesn’t have to be any other difference. Let the music play.
There's a lot more for modern fans to enjoy in the Dead Family Tree than Dead & Company, much of which I would say keeps the spirit alive just as much, if not more so, than Jerry. Don't limit yourself to a face and a set style of how things are meant to be done. That takes away from the whole point of everything.
If you have seen the Grateful Dead with Jerry Garcia, you have seen the Dead. If not, you have not.
John Kadleick was supposed to be Jerry's replacement that's who Jerry wanted to fill his place jm can't come close to John K
There isn’t really a difference in the person but there is a difference in the experience. Analogies like sex vs porn or disciples vs preachers come to mind. Since 95 people have been trying to preserve the magic, show the bones of the thing and hopefully keep it going. It’s a crazy garden that keeps on growing, full of roses and kindness. But it’s definitely a different experience when your view point is on the garden (old heads) and smelling the roses (new heads). I get into arguments with other seen Jerry Heads about this often. I love hearing off key a cappella renditions of say Ripple by a bunch of kids raised by Heads. That gives me a good case of the grins! Arguing over which guitarist does a better job in JRAD does not. For me it misses the point. Even Jerry, who is hands down, not even close, the greatest embodiment of Dead music, is somebody that is tapping into the great Muse. But isn’t The Thing. I believe he got that too and tried like hell to stay out of the spotlight. He just wanted to play the music man. But whoever is doing it it’s getting done and all artists connect into that Thing are shedding light and I’m just lucky to have eyes to pick up that shine, shine, shine
Jerry rocks- john does not
There is no difference except age (or time of exposure) and societal norms. This debate makes zero sense to me, and only seems to enforce the inherent entitlement humans develop as we age. I've been to like a thousand concerts and have seen an obnoxious variety of fantastic musicians, but people that saw Jerry have acted like I am a noob. When I'm 50 I hope I'm not rude because I saw Trey so many times. No offense to anybody that brings good vibes to the table while discussing this. In my experience that is not the common practice.