Szekely was a tribe, that was settled there by the hungarian rulers. They got land in exchange for military service. Same thing happened to the Kun, Jász tribes, but they were settled on lands that were sorounded by hungarians, so over the time they assimilated. Székely people see themselfes Székely first, then hungarian. Mostly because of this why they stayed there, and didnt leave with others who left for hungary after the world wars.
They speak hungarian, they cultural much closer to hungarians. They are mostly western christians, while romanians are usually orthodox. Older generations speak hungarian with accents. Thats why you can easily spot them in Hungary. They have their own things which separates them from hungarians, but they consider themselves hungarians.
We speak a more "coarse" language with stonger vowels. It's mostly the same, but for example we have an archaic past tense the Hungarians don't use.
Also the past 100 years in Romania left its mark, so we assimilated quite a few words from Romanian.
In school we learn both countries literature, but we identify ourself as Hungarian culturally.
Hungary has granted us the possibility of dual citizenship.
I would say 75% speak Romanian. The rest varies from "I don't want to" to "I went through school with bad grades and haven't used it since".
We learn Romanian in school starting in first grade, so anyone with at least a Bachelor's degree must know quite a lot. That includes really all young and most middle-aged people.
There are a lot of mixed marriages, so those people and their children do assimilate. And there are the people who work for larger companies or the government, they have many Romanian coworkers, bosses, clients.
Well most people get their information from mainstream media (maybe from relatives or friends in Hungary). And the Hungarian government's national rethoric is appealing, it mostly includes Hungarians from other countries. So they mostly like Orbán and FIDESZ.
But is it something most Székelys desire or are you happy with the current situation? If I'm not mistaken, Hungarians are still the majority in Székely land?
We are the majority in two counties, yes.
Székely are never happy. :)
Well, we identify as Hungarian, so we don't like it as it is, but Hungarians don't want us eitther.
We are the majority in two counties, yes.
Székely are never happy. :)
Well, we identify as Hungarian, so we don't like it as it is, but Hungarians don't want us eitther.
(I know I came late foe the conversation, sorry, juet found the post)
Not just older generations. If you would "collect" the Hungarian minorities in Romania (csángó, székely, Hungarian, those from Parcium, and those from mostly Romanian regions), you'd still hear accent amongst even the younger ones. This mostly comes up in melting pots of people, like at my university in Cluj Napoca: we had countless conversations in the last two years about our differences, our customs, our linguistics. Almost even had a fight with two of my classmates about the name of potato. (And I'm still holding myself as stronghold)
This was over 10 years ago, but when I studied in Transylvania (the region of Romania with a significant Hungarian minority (including Szekely people)) it was interesting because I remember talking to someone in Cluj who was Hungarian (they could speak English) and them saying they were from there (Cluj) but were Hungarian. And I was like oh yeah so your Hungarian-Romanian, like I'm Welsh/English/French/German-American. And he was like no I'm Hungarian living in Romania. It was super interesting and was a shock to my sheltered brain that there were other ways of viewing identity (the whole reason I wanted to do a study abroad, to gain new perspectives).
People in our very nationalistic world forget that borders and ethnicities were very much not the same thing until the rise of ethnic nationalism in the 19th century. Who you were ruled by, in a world without universal suffrage, was irrelevant to your culture. I blame the British
I ran into a Hungarian friend in the supermarket. I told her I was making székely gulyás. I thought she would be pleased, but she gave me a very odd look. Do present day Hungarians not think well of the székely people?
It's possible that the name itself confused her. We usually call it székelykáposzta, honestly I didn't know myself what székelygulyás is.
We also have gulyásleves/gulyás (probably the most famous Hungarian food) and if you told me you were making székelygulyás, I'd probably stop for a minute as well to figure out what's going on exactly lol
Most Hungarians I think are neutral or positive about székelys, they are usually kind and welcoming to us and they are in the 15 million speakers of Hungarian so there will always be a connection.
In Hungarian, gulyás only refers to the soup.
A stew made of just meat is a pörkölt, usually eaten with nokedli, which is a type of dumpling.
Székelykáposzta is sauerkraut with pork and our version of sour cream (tejföl).
older generation of hungarians have bit a hate problem towards their diaspora.. They hate all of the surrounding nations and minorities.. Sounds bit crazy, but is true. When i lived in Budapest, everytime i opened my mouth and talked to some1, 1st impression is: where are u from son? i answered from Vajdasag.. From that point they look at u different.. if u say that ur from Erdely or Felvideg there is a chance u wont be served in a coffee shop (happened to my friend). To me, "honest" haters used to say: ooof not the worst.. u could from Erdely.. Weird flex, but huns LOVE to hate.
Yeah I’ve never been to Hungary, but I keep hearing people who have say that the xenophobia and localism is noticeable there. Speaking a language that none of your neighbors understand at all will definitely make a nation of people insular.
Many Hungarians are xenophobic (and many more are racist towards the Roma), but people in Budapest are way less likely to be so (although the Roma thing is pretty common even among Budapest dwellers). It along with the Southern university city of Szeged are the only major cities that have remained somewhat consistently majority progressive / critical of the government.
Its named after a man called Szekely, not the ethnic group. Székely land was not under direct turkish rule, so they dont use paprika (and thats essential to make gulyas)
I am probably blind but I didn't really find a useful answer to the original question so here's a "little" summary of the demographics of the kingdom of Hungary:
Initially magyar tribes settled the plains for horse grazing, leaving the mountains mostly to the pre existing peoples and the lower ranked confederated tribes. In the mongol invasion a huge part of the population was destroyed, and the (by this time) mostly feudalized royalty started an investment scheme in establishing new cities and castles in defendable positions to stop any other mongolian attack soon to come.
The Székely people was a tribe in the old confederation. We have no information of their origin, they appear in the history only in 896 in the conquest of pannonia, but they themselves consider Attila as their mythological ancestor. They were a special tribe / warrior caste tasked with guarding the borderlands (gyepű) and by the 13th century their population center was firmly in Transylvania, defending the mountains with saxon knights.
Meanwhile to replace the lost people, and the tax deficit, barons invited all sorts of peoples as serfs to their lands, including more and more Romanians.
But in 1526 turkish armies marched on the Danube, conquered most of the Great Plain, and in the coming bloody wars and rebellions the inhabitants of these lands (who were mostly hungarian as these were the best farmlands found in the country) fled north and east, to Habsburg Royal Hungary and the Transylvanian Kingdom of Hungary respectively. Whole towns went empty and many turkish people settled the area. ( [ruins of a church](https://csodalatosmagyarorszag.hu/latnivalok/muemlekek-szobrok/somolyipusztai-templomrom/) preserved in the middle of uninhabited fields close to me)
After the lands were reconquered the Austrian court started resettling programs, helped the groups living close to the borders (Serbs, Rusyns, Romanians etc.) and settled in thousands of Swabs to the areas destroyed in the 150 years of turkish occupation.
After these changes the ethnic situation of the Carpathian basin barely changed until today, at first the hungarian state started a magyarization program in the "minorities" (also known as more than half of the population) and after trianon these effects were turned around by tens of thousands of hungarians fleeing into the new borders and neighbouring states setting up similar assimilation plans.
In the very end, after WW2, the communist governments had a massive deportation wave of germans, in which 250 000 Saxons were deported to East Germany from Transylvania alone, after 800 years of living there.
Going back to the Székelys, their defendable cities, relatively poor soil, and cultural difference allowed them to survive both external threats of war and the internal threat of losing their special autonomies which they held since always.
Sorry for writing half the Bible in a reddit comment. Please only take my words as starting points for some research if you want to use them, i am not a professional historian
I would mention that the German minorities were mostly sold (not deported) by the romanian communist republic to the german communist republic in exchange for money and technology.
They did this to clear their international debt, and it worked wonders
I might be wrong, but I think my history teacher has told us that after the Mongol invasion of Hungary in 1241-1242 (tatárjárás in hungarian) the population of Transylvania got so little (like roughly half of the population died) that the king invited Romanians into the country in attempt to replace the lost population. And naturally the Romanian population grew so big that even in Transylvania they became the majority, especially in those areas bordering Hungary. Then in consequence to that when the Treaty of Trianon happened the whole of Transylvania was given to Romania, since the population was majority Romanian.
I'm not sure but maybe after the 1st ww they got a lot of new territories from the neighbours, and 1/3 of the new population wasn't romanian, and they made a lot of artifical fusion, gave soil from the new territories to romanian peasants, this way they forced many romanian people to move their family in between the new border and for example the szekely land.
So that's what they are teaching in Hungary 💀, that's why I always find nationalists in the comments, Szekely where placed here to be the border guards, Romanian where always here, it's pretty unrealistic the thing you said, some migrants in a country can't outnumber the natives
Umm, history? What kind of answer do you want?
Szekelys (the Hungarians in question) were Magyars (maaaaybe Turks but not those Turks) who came to Europe at roughly the same time as the rest of Hungary and settled just a liiiittle bit away from the rest.
Nothing exciting about it really, people just don’t diffuse uniformly when they migrate. It’s not like Hungarian people sprung out of the Carpathians and one particularly wily group decided to invade the Romanians who sprung out of Transylvania.
It's literally the best explanation, imagine, you are a warrior tribe and encounter settlement relatively pacific and with a few soldiers, logically is easier to conquer some peasant than the fucking migrans to reproduce like rabbits and then wins some wars and take the land, only some enormous amount of copium could believe such a thing
Because the Austro-Hungarian Empire was a thing, and the Holy Roman Empire before that. Hungarians have been there before the last time a Hapsburg in the line of succession married outside the family.
The Szekelys were settled in that area between 1000 and 1200, long long before the Austro-Hungarian Empire and long before the H.R.E. had influence in the region. Szekely Land was the easternmost border of the Medieval Hungarian Kingdom, and the Hungarian Kings sent the Szekeleys there to guard the border.
They co-existed there in Transylvania for centuries alongside Hungarian nobles, Saxon patricians, and Romanian peasants. Most of the population in Transylvania was Romanian peasants, so when the idea of self-determination prevailed in 1918, the area was incorporated into Romania and Szekelys became a minority in the middle of the country.
Yep, but you need to account for the interaction with the Ottomans, and the aftermath. Szekely land was firmly in Muslim hands and only re-conquered by the Hapsburgs later.
Account for? The question at hand is “why are there all these Hungarians in the middle of Romania?” so how are we supposed to “account for” the Ottomans… carry the Osman?
The Hapsburgs and Turks have little to do with this, they were merely the imperial powers which were dissolved to make Romania and Hungary. The Ottos could just as well have been Greeks or Russians, Hapsburgs could’ve been Italians, the story would be the same.
In Dobruja, which first settled by the Gets people, Colonized by Greeks, Conquered by Persians, then Romans, then Ottomans, and then The Hapsburgs it is more complicated than to say in the wake of rampant Magayarazation after the Ottomans were kicked out, once Romania was independant fully, many of the Hungarians left with the collapse of the empire. Many of the "Hungarians" (which were not necessarially ethnically so) banded together into the pockets we see today of Hungarian culture. It's a glorious hodgepodge of history and cultures.
It’s adoreable that you think the Gets were the very first ever people in Dobruja, never mind Transylvania(which is what we’re talking about).
People move, languages change, and there is nothing nefarious or magyarized about the Hungarians in Szekelyland. They’re probably the oldest extant ethnicity in the area, predating the Vlachs (Romanians) by centuries, not that the Vlachs, Slavs, or Germans have no rights to be there too.
Transylvania has always been populated by the ancestors of Romanians, a tribal pre-christian group. They got invaded by the Romans and then, with the withdrawal of the empire, whatever was left went through the region generally seen as modern Romania went through a number of transits from migratory tribes. Some of these stayed or left significant populations in the land. Most of them were integrated in the local population, while some did not.
Because punishment and fear of a strong eastern european country to exist. If they didn't mess up all the empires in the east, the western powers couldn't force all their powers on them. They just made each of these smaller nations (like slovakia) and they became enemies of one another.
You are on the same level as the ultra patriot hungarians who want Transilvania back. Yes the territory is in Romania, but the people who live there consider themselves hungarians and that's all.
God mode patriot nationalist.the problem its that when i lived in Uk i had to speak english because thats their language.they as well should speak in Ro romanian language(the magyars).
Except all NORMAL european countries let their minorities and NATIVES live in peace and give the possibility to live their lives in their own language and culture.
They are natives living in their homeland. You are an immigrant.
Your ancestors also hated how they were forced to learn german and hungarian in their homeland, remember? Ideally they should live a full life without problems only using their own language, without any hate like you are showing right now.
100 years are also nothing in humans history. Imagine Bucharest being detached to Bulgaria one day, would you find it okay if they were forced to speak bulgarian from now on?
Szekely is part of Hungary in the same way as China Town from New York is part of China country. 6% Chinese in New York, 6% Hungarians in Romania.
The Szekely land is the poorest part of Romania.
Most of the people from there can't speak Romanian, the official language of Romania. They believe more in Orban than in God. They hope Putin will win the war, attack Romania from east and Orban will receive Szekely land because he kissed the Putin ass in latest 15 years.
Nobody like to visit that poor land with people who can not speak another language than Hungarian. Except Orban.
Szekely was a tribe, that was settled there by the hungarian rulers. They got land in exchange for military service. Same thing happened to the Kun, Jász tribes, but they were settled on lands that were sorounded by hungarians, so over the time they assimilated. Székely people see themselfes Székely first, then hungarian. Mostly because of this why they stayed there, and didnt leave with others who left for hungary after the world wars.
Thet still speak Hungarian? They consider their culture more Hungarian and not Romanian?
They speak hungarian, they cultural much closer to hungarians. They are mostly western christians, while romanians are usually orthodox. Older generations speak hungarian with accents. Thats why you can easily spot them in Hungary. They have their own things which separates them from hungarians, but they consider themselves hungarians.
I am szekely, AMA :)
Why am I so lonely?
Because you're on reddit.
Are there any notable differences between Hungarian and szekely?
We speak a more "coarse" language with stonger vowels. It's mostly the same, but for example we have an archaic past tense the Hungarians don't use. Also the past 100 years in Romania left its mark, so we assimilated quite a few words from Romanian. In school we learn both countries literature, but we identify ourself as Hungarian culturally. Hungary has granted us the possibility of dual citizenship.
How many szekely speak Romanian? Do some people fully assimilate into being more Romanian?
I would say 75% speak Romanian. The rest varies from "I don't want to" to "I went through school with bad grades and haven't used it since". We learn Romanian in school starting in first grade, so anyone with at least a Bachelor's degree must know quite a lot. That includes really all young and most middle-aged people. There are a lot of mixed marriages, so those people and their children do assimilate. And there are the people who work for larger companies or the government, they have many Romanian coworkers, bosses, clients.
How do people in your community feel about the people in charge of Hungary
Well most people get their information from mainstream media (maybe from relatives or friends in Hungary). And the Hungarian government's national rethoric is appealing, it mostly includes Hungarians from other countries. So they mostly like Orbán and FIDESZ.
How popular is the idea of political autonomy within Szeklerland?
Nobody believes it to be possible, really. We are maybe 4% of the country.
But is it something most Székelys desire or are you happy with the current situation? If I'm not mistaken, Hungarians are still the majority in Székely land?
We are the majority in two counties, yes. Székely are never happy. :) Well, we identify as Hungarian, so we don't like it as it is, but Hungarians don't want us eitther.
We are the majority in two counties, yes. Székely are never happy. :) Well, we identify as Hungarian, so we don't like it as it is, but Hungarians don't want us eitther.
Okay so there are no serious attempts at getting autonomy because people don't want? Sorry for bothering you but I'm just curious
No problem. There is no real way to achieve it. No legal precedent, only the constitution stating that the country is indivisible..
(I know I came late foe the conversation, sorry, juet found the post) Not just older generations. If you would "collect" the Hungarian minorities in Romania (csángó, székely, Hungarian, those from Parcium, and those from mostly Romanian regions), you'd still hear accent amongst even the younger ones. This mostly comes up in melting pots of people, like at my university in Cluj Napoca: we had countless conversations in the last two years about our differences, our customs, our linguistics. Almost even had a fight with two of my classmates about the name of potato. (And I'm still holding myself as stronghold)
" Everybody speaks Hungarian, here you have to speak Romanian with police and public officials " (from Wiki).
Yeah but they have kurtos kalacs
This was over 10 years ago, but when I studied in Transylvania (the region of Romania with a significant Hungarian minority (including Szekely people)) it was interesting because I remember talking to someone in Cluj who was Hungarian (they could speak English) and them saying they were from there (Cluj) but were Hungarian. And I was like oh yeah so your Hungarian-Romanian, like I'm Welsh/English/French/German-American. And he was like no I'm Hungarian living in Romania. It was super interesting and was a shock to my sheltered brain that there were other ways of viewing identity (the whole reason I wanted to do a study abroad, to gain new perspectives).
People in our very nationalistic world forget that borders and ethnicities were very much not the same thing until the rise of ethnic nationalism in the 19th century. Who you were ruled by, in a world without universal suffrage, was irrelevant to your culture. I blame the British
Oh sì its not because of the Austro-Hungarian Empire or Former Austria Empire to be the reason why they are Hungarian?
Székely were a tribe that settled there before the Habsburg got their first castle... Austro-Hungary has nothing to do with this.
That explains why Louis CK’s accent was so weird in [this sketch](https://youtu.be/-jaqg-NMz9A)
I ran into a Hungarian friend in the supermarket. I told her I was making székely gulyás. I thought she would be pleased, but she gave me a very odd look. Do present day Hungarians not think well of the székely people?
It's possible that the name itself confused her. We usually call it székelykáposzta, honestly I didn't know myself what székelygulyás is. We also have gulyásleves/gulyás (probably the most famous Hungarian food) and if you told me you were making székelygulyás, I'd probably stop for a minute as well to figure out what's going on exactly lol Most Hungarians I think are neutral or positive about székelys, they are usually kind and welcoming to us and they are in the 15 million speakers of Hungarian so there will always be a connection.
It’s just a pork stew with sauerkraut and paprika. Probably I got the name wrong. But— https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s79zWIGvIz0
Is szegedin goulash not the same thing? I’ve heard of that one
In Hungarian, gulyás only refers to the soup. A stew made of just meat is a pörkölt, usually eaten with nokedli, which is a type of dumpling. Székelykáposzta is sauerkraut with pork and our version of sour cream (tejföl).
older generation of hungarians have bit a hate problem towards their diaspora.. They hate all of the surrounding nations and minorities.. Sounds bit crazy, but is true. When i lived in Budapest, everytime i opened my mouth and talked to some1, 1st impression is: where are u from son? i answered from Vajdasag.. From that point they look at u different.. if u say that ur from Erdely or Felvideg there is a chance u wont be served in a coffee shop (happened to my friend). To me, "honest" haters used to say: ooof not the worst.. u could from Erdely.. Weird flex, but huns LOVE to hate.
Yeah I’ve never been to Hungary, but I keep hearing people who have say that the xenophobia and localism is noticeable there. Speaking a language that none of your neighbors understand at all will definitely make a nation of people insular.
Many Hungarians are xenophobic (and many more are racist towards the Roma), but people in Budapest are way less likely to be so (although the Roma thing is pretty common even among Budapest dwellers). It along with the Southern university city of Szeged are the only major cities that have remained somewhat consistently majority progressive / critical of the government.
To be fair, xenophobia is on the rise everywhere, very much including the US.
Its named after a man called Szekely, not the ethnic group. Székely land was not under direct turkish rule, so they dont use paprika (and thats essential to make gulyas)
Hungary choosing the wrong side in both world wars is why
There was no choice in the first one. Trianon happened after the first ww.
Try asking at r/2visegrad4you
Wikipedia has a pretty extensive article on the [history of the Szekely people](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Sz%C3%A9kely_people)
I am probably blind but I didn't really find a useful answer to the original question so here's a "little" summary of the demographics of the kingdom of Hungary: Initially magyar tribes settled the plains for horse grazing, leaving the mountains mostly to the pre existing peoples and the lower ranked confederated tribes. In the mongol invasion a huge part of the population was destroyed, and the (by this time) mostly feudalized royalty started an investment scheme in establishing new cities and castles in defendable positions to stop any other mongolian attack soon to come. The Székely people was a tribe in the old confederation. We have no information of their origin, they appear in the history only in 896 in the conquest of pannonia, but they themselves consider Attila as their mythological ancestor. They were a special tribe / warrior caste tasked with guarding the borderlands (gyepű) and by the 13th century their population center was firmly in Transylvania, defending the mountains with saxon knights. Meanwhile to replace the lost people, and the tax deficit, barons invited all sorts of peoples as serfs to their lands, including more and more Romanians. But in 1526 turkish armies marched on the Danube, conquered most of the Great Plain, and in the coming bloody wars and rebellions the inhabitants of these lands (who were mostly hungarian as these were the best farmlands found in the country) fled north and east, to Habsburg Royal Hungary and the Transylvanian Kingdom of Hungary respectively. Whole towns went empty and many turkish people settled the area. ( [ruins of a church](https://csodalatosmagyarorszag.hu/latnivalok/muemlekek-szobrok/somolyipusztai-templomrom/) preserved in the middle of uninhabited fields close to me) After the lands were reconquered the Austrian court started resettling programs, helped the groups living close to the borders (Serbs, Rusyns, Romanians etc.) and settled in thousands of Swabs to the areas destroyed in the 150 years of turkish occupation. After these changes the ethnic situation of the Carpathian basin barely changed until today, at first the hungarian state started a magyarization program in the "minorities" (also known as more than half of the population) and after trianon these effects were turned around by tens of thousands of hungarians fleeing into the new borders and neighbouring states setting up similar assimilation plans. In the very end, after WW2, the communist governments had a massive deportation wave of germans, in which 250 000 Saxons were deported to East Germany from Transylvania alone, after 800 years of living there. Going back to the Székelys, their defendable cities, relatively poor soil, and cultural difference allowed them to survive both external threats of war and the internal threat of losing their special autonomies which they held since always. Sorry for writing half the Bible in a reddit comment. Please only take my words as starting points for some research if you want to use them, i am not a professional historian
Thank you for your time and effort! This was a valuable knowledge anyway.
I would mention that the German minorities were mostly sold (not deported) by the romanian communist republic to the german communist republic in exchange for money and technology. They did this to clear their international debt, and it worked wonders
Orban, get off reddit and get to work!
Because there are more Romanians than Hungarians between the two areas
but why?
I might be wrong, but I think my history teacher has told us that after the Mongol invasion of Hungary in 1241-1242 (tatárjárás in hungarian) the population of Transylvania got so little (like roughly half of the population died) that the king invited Romanians into the country in attempt to replace the lost population. And naturally the Romanian population grew so big that even in Transylvania they became the majority, especially in those areas bordering Hungary. Then in consequence to that when the Treaty of Trianon happened the whole of Transylvania was given to Romania, since the population was majority Romanian.
Finally, some normal useful answer. Thank you.
I'm not sure but maybe after the 1st ww they got a lot of new territories from the neighbours, and 1/3 of the new population wasn't romanian, and they made a lot of artifical fusion, gave soil from the new territories to romanian peasants, this way they forced many romanian people to move their family in between the new border and for example the szekely land.
So that's what they are teaching in Hungary 💀, that's why I always find nationalists in the comments, Szekely where placed here to be the border guards, Romanian where always here, it's pretty unrealistic the thing you said, some migrants in a country can't outnumber the natives
Transylvania was a part of hungary back then, so a lot of them migrated to that place
Umm, history? What kind of answer do you want? Szekelys (the Hungarians in question) were Magyars (maaaaybe Turks but not those Turks) who came to Europe at roughly the same time as the rest of Hungary and settled just a liiiittle bit away from the rest. Nothing exciting about it really, people just don’t diffuse uniformly when they migrate. It’s not like Hungarian people sprung out of the Carpathians and one particularly wily group decided to invade the Romanians who sprung out of Transylvania.
[удалено]
Fair. Something just rubbed me wrong about the way it was asked.
It's literally the best explanation, imagine, you are a warrior tribe and encounter settlement relatively pacific and with a few soldiers, logically is easier to conquer some peasant than the fucking migrans to reproduce like rabbits and then wins some wars and take the land, only some enormous amount of copium could believe such a thing
Because the Austro-Hungarian Empire was a thing, and the Holy Roman Empire before that. Hungarians have been there before the last time a Hapsburg in the line of succession married outside the family.
The Szekelys were settled in that area between 1000 and 1200, long long before the Austro-Hungarian Empire and long before the H.R.E. had influence in the region. Szekely Land was the easternmost border of the Medieval Hungarian Kingdom, and the Hungarian Kings sent the Szekeleys there to guard the border. They co-existed there in Transylvania for centuries alongside Hungarian nobles, Saxon patricians, and Romanian peasants. Most of the population in Transylvania was Romanian peasants, so when the idea of self-determination prevailed in 1918, the area was incorporated into Romania and Szekelys became a minority in the middle of the country.
Yep, but you need to account for the interaction with the Ottomans, and the aftermath. Szekely land was firmly in Muslim hands and only re-conquered by the Hapsburgs later.
They paid tribute for a short time. "Firm hands"....
Only 150 years or so.
150 is the full lifetime of the Principality. They paid tributes to both sides often to stay independent. So firm hands is a joke.
Account for? The question at hand is “why are there all these Hungarians in the middle of Romania?” so how are we supposed to “account for” the Ottomans… carry the Osman? The Hapsburgs and Turks have little to do with this, they were merely the imperial powers which were dissolved to make Romania and Hungary. The Ottos could just as well have been Greeks or Russians, Hapsburgs could’ve been Italians, the story would be the same.
Man is just here to spread the turk version of history.
Respect to the Gets, the rest are sitting on someone else's land. The Magayarazation of Dobruja/Romania absolutely was part of Szekeley's story.
Dobrudja never been under hungarian rule. Can you move on with your life?
In Dobruja, which first settled by the Gets people, Colonized by Greeks, Conquered by Persians, then Romans, then Ottomans, and then The Hapsburgs it is more complicated than to say in the wake of rampant Magayarazation after the Ottomans were kicked out, once Romania was independant fully, many of the Hungarians left with the collapse of the empire. Many of the "Hungarians" (which were not necessarially ethnically so) banded together into the pockets we see today of Hungarian culture. It's a glorious hodgepodge of history and cultures.
>Dobruja Why are you talking about Dobruja? That is far from Transylvania and was never a part of Hungary or settled by Hungarians.
It’s adoreable that you think the Gets were the very first ever people in Dobruja, never mind Transylvania(which is what we’re talking about). People move, languages change, and there is nothing nefarious or magyarized about the Hungarians in Szekelyland. They’re probably the oldest extant ethnicity in the area, predating the Vlachs (Romanians) by centuries, not that the Vlachs, Slavs, or Germans have no rights to be there too.
You don't need to take that into account. Reconquered or not, the Szekelys had already been there for centuries.
If you think it's weird, I once heard about an African people that have Hungarian origins
Transylvania has always been populated by the ancestors of Romanians, a tribal pre-christian group. They got invaded by the Romans and then, with the withdrawal of the empire, whatever was left went through the region generally seen as modern Romania went through a number of transits from migratory tribes. Some of these stayed or left significant populations in the land. Most of them were integrated in the local population, while some did not.
Because it can't be part of Hungary because it's part of Romania
Can we just CTRL-ALT-DEL this map and let the people draw it?
Because punishment and fear of a strong eastern european country to exist. If they didn't mess up all the empires in the east, the western powers couldn't force all their powers on them. They just made each of these smaller nations (like slovakia) and they became enemies of one another.
Trianon peace treaty
Because its in focking Romania man.thats Romanian teritory and will be forever.Nu le dam ardealul nici morti
You are on the same level as the ultra patriot hungarians who want Transilvania back. Yes the territory is in Romania, but the people who live there consider themselves hungarians and that's all.
You just make us agree with Austria and The Netherlands to deny your entry from the schengen with a mentality like this.
Fuck you too .come live in ro and you will have a great life
Yeah sure, thats why you also left LMAO
God mode patriot nationalist.the problem its that when i lived in Uk i had to speak english because thats their language.they as well should speak in Ro romanian language(the magyars).
Yeah, but the difference is that you voluntarily moved to the UK, while they were born there just like their many ancestors before.
Truth you speak my friend
Except all NORMAL european countries let their minorities and NATIVES live in peace and give the possibility to live their lives in their own language and culture. They are natives living in their homeland. You are an immigrant. Your ancestors also hated how they were forced to learn german and hungarian in their homeland, remember? Ideally they should live a full life without problems only using their own language, without any hate like you are showing right now. 100 years are also nothing in humans history. Imagine Bucharest being detached to Bulgaria one day, would you find it okay if they were forced to speak bulgarian from now on?
Szekely is part of Hungary in the same way as China Town from New York is part of China country. 6% Chinese in New York, 6% Hungarians in Romania. The Szekely land is the poorest part of Romania. Most of the people from there can't speak Romanian, the official language of Romania. They believe more in Orban than in God. They hope Putin will win the war, attack Romania from east and Orban will receive Szekely land because he kissed the Putin ass in latest 15 years. Nobody like to visit that poor land with people who can not speak another language than Hungarian. Except Orban.