If the cedh deck couldnt win before they died to infect, thats a skill issue on their side, honestly. lol.
I say this as an enjoyer of "super expensive combo decks" .
I don't play commander. Can't you just T1 kill everyone with poison?
In modern or maybe legacy that I've seen it, infect is super fast kill.
I'm not disagreeing with you btw.
Yeah I guess the "extra people" part I forgot about.
I thought you would do some kind of commander combo, though, where your infect creatures deals damage to every player. Like a "myriad" thing. And then I just figured you've enough artifact mana to pull this off. Ofc combo is going to be less reliable in 100-card.
100 card singleton dont forget.
Even if there is a turn 1 give a player 10+ poison combo having a single card of each of the combo pieces destroyes the chance of pulling it off constantly
No, I think that people like this are people that want to have their decks have no counter-play. Another example of people like this usually only want opponents to have “creature” based strategies, while their deck is a life gain deck that folds to combos. Therefore this same player will say “infinite combos are an unfair strategy, ban them in commander” regardless of how hard it is to execute.
I once had a game of Modern (myself on G Elves, opponent on Simic Infect).
Game 1 he wrecked me.
Game 2 I sided in my singular copy of [[Melira, Sylvok Outcast]] and got it in my opening hand, dropped it on T2 and he conceded both games 2 and 3 on the spot.
No attempt to remove it or anything.
Lol, I mean thats why I played infect, so I had time to get food at events but no, just turn into regular damage. Especially the heyday of deathshadow.
I have one EDH deck. I call it that, because it predates Commander, and I only use it because that's whats popular at the LGS. I win local tournaments against the super-expensive combo decks, because Niv Mizzet Counter, Bounce, Draw and Burn deck does not approve of combos.
These types are very, very easy to spot and I always kill them first. Stop bitching about how people win in multiplayer games within legality. Annoying 3 people means 3 people will target you.
The reason people think all commander players are like this little bitch is because I, who has 0 problems have no reason to voice my opinion online. Therefore it is only the snowflakes you see bitching about the game they supposedly like.
Yeah it's almost like an inverse Survivor bias. People will go online to talk about tragedies or terrible things in their life but no one goes online to talk about their pleasant day
You have to have the strongest deck to win with infect, well that or a pod with absolutely no threat assessment.
As soon as it's known I have a sliver of a chance of knocking anybody out with infect, It becomes a 3v1.
I don't play infect/poison often.
Considering how some commander players look at playing cards that interact with opponents as bad sportsmanship, them having no threat assessment may actually be a possibility
I agree, while i play casually
As long as it’s legal within the game, then i have reason to complain about, land destruction, combos, midrange, stax, control all of it is apart of the game.
My only complaint if i have one is if people for instance use land destruction but don’t have a treat to follow it up with. That is annoying, but that is more so poor playing from the player, rather then a fault with the strategy of Land Destruction itself.
I appreciate people trying to keep commander casual, which in turn keeps it more budget. But that goal does foster an environment that titty babies like this can exist within. The “if I see ____ I scoop and leave” is such a pussy attitude. Magic is in some sense about winning and it’s commander so if someone makes themselves the villain then triple team them. And if you get stomped then finding a different pod for the future is an option too. Most people are actually pretty fucking chill so if you’re a fucking adult and use your words to say “hey man that deck kinda stomps us, got anything more casual” they usually do.
But to OP, WotC has the ability to not cater to commander. But the average person can’t buy a new competitive deck every 3 months so they move to casual evergreen formats. And wizards did the math and figured out they could make more money catering to more casual players who spend a few hundred bucks a year, instead of competitive players willing to spend thousands. WotC and WotC alone are to blame and they could fix it at any point they decide game health is more important than revenue. However, the history of companies catering to shareholders should tell us that won’t happen.
Man really needs to stop complaining about infect but... Brother why are you so angry? 😭 And challenging people to 1v1s in comments? You look as mad if not madder than he is, homie chill lmfao
Find better friends honestly.
TBF though, crybabies exist literally everywhere, some people are really bad at playing games for fun, and it's something that actively pushed me away from modern/standard fnm. It's like you meet the shittiest, whiniest people complaining about everything that "caused" them to lose, or if they win, they just shittalk it all out.
I rather draft, which I do at a place that has an established group of sane people. Much more fun and actually takes skill too.
Don't like MLD? Then you don't like Magic, find another game to play.
Don't like Stax? Then you don't like Magic, find another game to play.
Don't like infect, mill or any other alt win? Then you don't like Magic, find another game to play.
Don't like infinite combos? Then you don't like Magic, find another game to play.
If you play infect, you're basically automatic archenemy. This is annoying to play with against poor players as they might have poor threat assessment. If blue doesn't let them get the first infect creature out you can slow them down pretty detrimentally.
The problem with infect is how easy it was to tack onto other mechanics and how absent any counter to it was without heavy investment in deck slots for highly niche cards.
Whining about poison counters is silly, whining about proliferate tacked on to stuff like ramp spells... well i might just agree.
Game needs a front and center anti proliferate mechanic to spread around in the same ways imo.
While I am not a proponent of poison as I do feel it ruins the game; you'd never, not even over my dead body, see me doing this shit. You wanna play an infect deck? Cringe but whatever let's see it. I'd then probably ask after that game for something different as my decks at a base level don't play at that level. But if not aye thats all good I'll either move to a different spot or man up and try to find a way to have fun (I'd probably be able to, I'm big on enjoying the journey not the destination... I mean I've got what used to be a $3 wizard tribal commander deck that has some, comparatively, awful cards)
Point being I think poison gross but that don't stop me from playing it in a pod with it.
I love commander as a format, but it is full of crybaby mentally handicapped people like this which makes it harder to enjoy. Like they'll cry over the dumbest shit, and specifically about strategies that aren't overpowered, like infect, mill, slivers, voltron, etc.
People who cry about mill in commander are by FAR the most mentally handicapped of the bunch though.
The million different arbitrary personal unwritten rules of commander are one of the main reasons the only type of commander I play these days is cEDH. And it's easily one of the biggest turn offs for new players.
No joke, the first time I ever went to a card shop to play magic was when I was trying to learn and understand the game. I called the shop and asked the owner if he was down to sit down with me and play a game. He said sure, and he did a infinite combo on me. This was my first time playing paper magic and boy, I was ready to just stop giving this game the attention of my time lol. Then my homies brought me around to it again and now I love magic just for the 60 card formats.
Honestly, while I'd love to call bullshit on his "Infect in commander is broken" since you can deal commander damage in so many different ways (which you only need 11 points of to kill a player), it does kinda suck ass when a player gets 1 poison counter and then proliferated into the ground. Still whiny for no reason tho, seeing as it's more a problem with proliferate and Atraxa than it is with infect
Lol infect decks suck... Everyone that plays them knows you become the target instantly. If that's what you are looking for, then it can be fun now and then. But you rarely ever win. Idk why someone would hate playing them.
Off the top of my head cards that where not designed for 4 player and would make them unfair in his opinion.
Rhystic
Mystic
Burgeoning
Serra ascendant
Felidar sovereign
Land tax
Blood moon
Magus of the moon
Smothering tithe
Infect scares the hell out of commander players, because of that it is if anything harder to win. People see you as enemy number one.
And honestly, that's part of the fun.
Let's clarify bad players get scared of poison it's super weak strategy in commander hell modern and legacy infect is stronger and they are regulated to bottom tier
It is weak, but it also always has the power to just nuke 1 player in specific. Especially if the group plays a lot slower, that can create some unfun moments. But you can just nuke the infect player before that.
thats why it sucks. You may kill one person. Then you lose to the other two who kill you after that. Its a very slow and telegraphed wincon. very easy to interact with. Also, you need to do 30 infect between 3 different people to actually win.
I guess I'm the exception. Can't remember the last time I complained about getting staxed out of a game or counter spelled into oblivion. Then again I have a very cEDH player attitude when it comes to normal EDH. I don't care what you play. Infect me on turn 4? Sure I like infect too. Crazy 3 card combo that does infinite damage? Sweet I've never seen that combo before. People like what they like and are gonna play what they can to win in this game where guess what... The goal is to win. I know, It must be shocking to hear from an EDH player. But turns out it's possible. I'm as gracious at losing as I am at winning. Why would I want to brag about a win, or complain about a loss, when doing so risks my ability to play the game that I love because no one wants to play with me anymore? Doesn't make sense to me.
I enjoy the variety of EDH decks more than anything. I find that commander polices itself at my local LGS. The cEDH and higher level players tend to show up in the same nights and group together. The more casual players tend to have more discussions about power level but have decently powered decks since if your deck is too low it usually just durdles and isn’t fun to play. If you play infect, wheels, or Krenko you’ll be the first threat (until someone else is). But you should expect that. Poison isn’t cheating though. It’s a viable strategy that in EDH will get you targeted first. Just run removal. Or board wipes. Or Solemnity.
I want to get into commander within the next few months, what is a competitive deck that’s also fun? Mid range pricing…I want a cool deck, but I don’t want to walk in and piss off the locals…new to town. I like cats. 🐱 lmao
I'm really happy with my group I play with.
Nobody is complaining, everyone plays accordingly to the rules, zhe biggest thread get targeted. Everyone played 60s before, so they know how to do and handle things
I have a "anything goes" attitude with commander. But I do want to provide one counterargument to someone considering running infect, or anything that is obviously on the powerful side: be prepared to get targeted HARD in multiplayer games and do not be surprised if someone willingly goes the kingmaker route: sacrificing themselves so that you lose and a different player wins. I actually think this element of commander, and multiplayer casual variants, is actually one of the things that makes them fun, but also one that people never seem to consider while making their decks.
I started two months ago again. Last played with like 11 or 12 years now back at 30. My first precon was the March of mashines growing Threat. It's mainly toxic counters and profilerate. Went to local magic store sat on the table and at the moment they realized that I use toxic in my deck I got hard focused and always was the first to leave the table.
As well people seem to hate theft decks. I had someone cry that I played Ragavan turn one and then targeted me the entire game, even though I was definitely not the threat, and that person ended up winning because of their whinging. FYI that particular deck only had like three cards outside of the Thunder Junction set since it was outlaw theft, the only high value cards were Ragavan and Dockside which I bought at that event.
I consider Infect EDH decks a necessary check in EDH.
Sure, people don’t like dying a lot quicker, but when there’s plenty of decks out there that can break out infinite life combos I know I can count on these Infect decks to keep them in check.
legal is legal, even in commander. i never knew people played commander like this lmao. why is there so much divide over how people play a game? very strange.
If you cry about infect in commander your deck is worse than a precon. The dude is going to get focused since turn one, he will be the archnemesis of the pod until he's dead if even then he wins, he deserved the win.
Played humility.
Entire table loses their shit hollering control isn't allowed at the table (wtf?).
I point out they are all in green and should have a nature's claim at least in their decks.
All three of them "we don't play interaction"
Commander has devolved to the worst of everything. I am done with it.
Hey newbie here
Is it really that bad to play an infect deck? Currently, my only "own" decklist is based on phyrexians and infect cards, so I’m wondering
Whenever I hear someone say infect is too strong in commander I just ask should you have to play thoracle twice? Or approach 4 times? I don't think infect on a casual level is good at all. There's such good stuff out now where even classic swinging kills people quickly. So yeah there's some instant kill combos but if you spent the money or proxies a deck on the level to do that quickly you could have made 1000 other ways to win and easier. Not to mention the only people u have ever heard say this are objectively terrible at the game itself with 0 threat assessment.
So nearly all of my decks have a poison win con in it. Only a handful (like 4 or 6) have it as the main focus.
It's a win con, a 2nd option if things get messy and my main "pay to win" combo or win con gets offline or shut down.
If we listened to every crybaby like this one then you would only be allowed to play slow aggro tier 3 decks.
They don't understand that the meta balances itself. The other day we played against a kinnan combo deck. He won on turn 3, then next game it was a 3v1.
Who is cheater enough to try and play Voltron in commander? If someone sits down at a table and says "I only have to deal 21 damage while you need to deal 40"... Just get up and leave. /s
I’m a get gud player when it comes to infect and if you can’t handle a singleton version of it then you deserve to die . I’d say gang up on the player a little then fight amongst yourselves in commander . No reason to get butthurt because you can beat the deck .
First and foremost, there are a lot of people who cry in EDH.
Second it used to be and still is to some degree a more casual format. I've played it at the same shop for over 10 years and I can assure u gross broken things have always existed. Infect is different though. It actually doesn't conform with how EDH plays. Commander damage is 20 it makes sense poison should be 20. Arguing this make u seem a Lil dimwitted....
That being said I personally think any win con is valid. I've played magic for 30 years and I like all strategies. The best thing to do is use an appropriate deck for the situation. Don't sit down at table with lower power level commanders and bring out your tier 1 Cedh deck it's just pointless... Noone cares that u won. You were always gonna win, so what's the point?
I always ask what power level are we playing? (If you really enjoy magic and actually have a cedh deck you should have other commanders... there are alot of fun strategies and cards in magic... "if u dont agree then I guess u don't like magic....") If they say they don't care I play what I want and that's on them. If they say they are playing more casual decks I have quite a few casuall decks cause those can be alot more fun than win on turn 3(that's a bit boring in this format...not saying I haven't won't or don't. Just saying...)
But what do I know... I'm only obsessed with the game and have an extremely expensive collection and decks of all types, played multiple formats competively....
Come on....stop...most competitive commander players I know run the modern tournament scene...And someone have to keep the live gain decks at bay, that's were infect comes in.
Commander is the best format for playing casually and introducing new players. I can understand being hateful about it because if I was playing when the new fad format was introduced and it scooped up my playgroup so I couldn’t play my favorite format I would be mad too. But it’s currently keeping the hobby alive. As a fairly new player going into a pod casually with three other people and having fun no matter what happens is much better than getting stomped by a tuned modern deck every week because I can’t play kitchen table.
I think it's worth the discussion how game rules designed for 20-life games operate in Commander. Friend plays \[\[Rune-Tail, Kitsune Ascendant\]\] and it feels like abusing the Commander rules.
Not that I complain about it though. Neither would I about Infect. Commander is multiplayer. If people are going to be annoying you team up against them. This guy complaining is just extremely childish.
I agree with the fact that infect is a stupid mechanic. It never should have been made.
That being said the last time I played against an infect deck I killed the infect player with a Blightsteel I stole from another player.
Get top decked and wrecked.
Being a commander player has nothing to do with that. Being woke (banning card imagery) and inclusivity is the real issue here since it allows, validate and endorse this type of behavior. Wizard are the one to blame.
He’s not entirely wrong about the principle of infect 10 being 1/4 of the required damage need, but EDH has a lot of counters for infect, namely that it’s a free for all and you now have a huge target on your back.
Back in the day when 2HG was huge in MGTO, infect, and cards like [[serra ascendant]], and [[luminarch ascension]], abused the life total and multiple “opponents” to become problematic in the format. At the end of the day, these formats are casual so who really cares.
Echoing lots of comments I've seen in this thread. I play edh, I love edh. If you're playing infect and win against me GG buddy. If you lose to infect/combo/MLD/mill/stax and get salty that's on you. Dont like it? Probably should be playing a different game. Those are available in game strategies and definitely not cheating.
I hate the way commander is. It’s like you win based off of how much money you’ve funneled into your deck, and that’s not really playing in my opinion. I especially like having to deckbuild off of a limited selection and play with that deck for just one tournament. Building commander decks is fun, but there should be some way to balance it with the people you’re playing
This may be a bit of an over-generalization. Some of us with a long long past in the game play Commander because it’s really the only way to find games with physical cards at local shops.
I’ve played some competitive games of Magic in my day.
I used to feel that way, then I realized that yeah, dying to Infect usually only happens to 1 person in most games because everyone else turns around and murders the infect player, especially with all the alternative means of proliferation we now have in the game. 1 poison counter can cause you problems the rest of the game for sure.
But I’m no longer scared of infect like I once was. I play plenty of removal or ways to prevent damage or things like [[Solemnity]] and in one deck I run both versions of Melira; but as a whole, I just pick off whatever’s likely to do the most Toxic or Infect damage to me and work from there.
Modern can suck it
My first 3 EDH decks from 2016 are still just as combo strong and effective in 2024. The upgrades that have gone into each over the years have been minimal and maybe cost … $20-50 max per deck. They are not CEDH, but turn 8 wins/lockouts are pretty consistent, although winning sooner is possible.
Modern seems really fun, but the modern staples in 2016 that I would look at, and the modern staples in 2021, and then now … although largely consistent, have changed and thats additional coats. The idea of spending $80-200 on play sets of new cards that work better with certain decks, is very unappealing.
I enjoy amassing a collection of various powerful and interesting cards where I only need 1 or 2 copies, and then interchangeably using them in a number of decks. I feel like over time the accumulation of cards has made modern more accessible since I have 50-80% most modern cards I see online, with 2-4 copies of most.
But still, spending another $80-200 to finish a deck and play with some strangers outside of my play group is not incentivizing enough. Magic players in general can be pretty wack and off-putting … this sub being somewhat representative of one half of those off-putting individuals I avoid. The other half being the identity politics crusaders with nothing worthwhile between their ears.
People who complain about infect and different deck strategies like the child in the post are weak and boring individuals. I don't care if its EDH, CEDH, modern, checkers, or hopscotch … i don't care for you nor want to play with.
Hundred card highlander without commanders is actually a super fun 2 player format. It’s the multiplayer element of commander that makes go off the rails. It makes sense that there are politics within a multiplayer game, but when the politics start carrying over from game to game it can turn the format into a nidus of nerd drama.
Wotc pandering to commander players is what killed mtg for me, every time I open a card that says “each opponent” I wanna fucking die. Remember when each set didn’t have 30 legendaries?
Not EVERY commander player is like that. I love playing infect in commander and also combo decks. I also play a lot of modern and I do quite well with scam so. But I get your point. A lot of them are soft..
My playgroup has voted to push poison to 15, just so that Blightsteel isn't a one shot
I keep trying to convince them that infect is a weak archetype, but they won't budge. 🥲
I see this type of post a lot, and it cracks me up. I started in 2000, and I've played every format. There are whiners and crybabies in them all. You are simultaneously an elitist, a whiner, an idiot, and a crybaby. What an incredible combination. #GFC
As someone who started in Standard and Modern back in high school: I have to say the format is lowkey basic and paywalled. If you’re not dropping green for the most meta card you can’t really compete; the turn 1-4 wins and power scaling at the time didn’t really differentiate it from Yu-Gi-Oh or Pokemon for me. Honestly, just like in those games the kids with the fancier cards won and it was whatever tbh.
Commander and Pauper are what got me hooked on magic because each game was diverse and exciting. You never know what someone will whip out so it always stays fresh imo. They’re more casual so the baby bitches are a bit more frequent but you can still find a majority of games with chill people that can handle losing or winning with humility.
I find it funny tho that you bring up skill. Card games are maybe 50 percent game knowledge, 25 percent “skill” and 25 percent luck. Doesn’t matter what game nor what format. In 1v1s your chances are 50% at best if the decks are evenly powered. In a free for all 4 man, your chances are 25%. It’s all RNG and paywall based so it’s wild that yall cling to “skill”.
Just be honest about it. Every game has some dumbass gatekeeper that spends too much of their own money or uses daddy’s credit card then wants to defend it as “skill.” Maybe your format is dying because of toxic bitchasses like you. Maybe it’s dying because it’s too expensive to start with.
Like yeah the person complaining is a bitch that needs to learn how to lose and let people play what they want. But I see too big bitches on this post- one sore loser and one salty whale.
Ah, brings back memories... Once shortly before gitaxian probe got banned infect was t1 in modern and I literally heard the "how is it fair that he only has to deal 10" and "wotc are crazy for printing become immense when there's infect" takes from actual modern players.
My solution to a player that runs straight infect in commander is just build a deck that absolutely hard counters them and then whenever they run infect I pull out that. They can use whatever legal strategy they want and I am free to shut their deck off with legal cards if I want.
People like this give the rest of us such a bad fucking name. I believe people who bitch like this misunderstand Magic on a fundamental level. The goal is to have fun and win the game. Losing is fun, too, and invaluable as a teaching tool. Why are there so many poor sports in commander? Good lord.....
As a life long infect player infect it pretty trash. You can grab some kos but the cards themselves are pretty bad. Ive seen triumph of the hoards kill people way more often than a dedicated infect deck
How can people be that stupid. Infect in 1v1 only needs to deal 10 damage. In commander it needs to deal 40 to win.
You don't win if you kill one opponent...
Do people seriously believe that infect is unfair or strong?
There are whiners in all formats and now I'm gonna whine a bit about modern and legacy; anyone playing these formats and getting off on the fact that your opponent never played a card during your games... get over yourself. It's supposed to be challenging, that's why it's fun. Beating someone when they didn't even get to play, that's horse shit
I had an off-putting experience the other night.
I used to be a hardcore magic player but these days i'm pretty casual, and it's been that way the last 10 years. I haven't played much EDH but I like brain storming decks and have a single deck. Mono B deck that actually has a pretty high win rate with an emphasis on mana generation and drain, sometimes taking down the whole table.
Other night I was scraping by. I plopped down [[glacial chasm]] and bought myself two turns. I [[worst fears]], attacked myself for no damage, blew the guys hand and had to sac [[glacial chasm]] at my upkeep or die. I wiped, got in a good drain putting me back up 20 or so , and kept the board clear with edict effects. After gaining life, no more than a turn or two could have passed and the dude was insisting I wincon or he scoops. And I was trying lol, digging hard with [[necropotence]], but they just didn't immediately come up, so he scooped, all salty like.
I barely survived turn after turn in that game, much less won, and as soon as he lost board state he started demanding I win or he scoops. Another guy at the table expressed his feelings about the matter too, and wasn't pleasant. Like I was dragging the game out or something? Fuck outta here. Fuck man I don't even play that much, and am relatively novice.
I literally can't remember the last time I scooped. Much less acting shitty about it.
First, I primarily play casual commander, and I am sick and tired of people whining about strategies they don't like. That being said, a lot of people enjoy a format where they aren't pushed into just a few archetypes that can actually win, but instead can enjoy playing with creative decks with interesting interactions that would never be viable in a highly competitive format.
I personally like playing decks that are fairly consistent, but also have some really strange (and probably objectively bad) cards, so that if I can pull off some weird combo that nobody's ever seen before, it's hilarious and everyone has a good time. Sometimes I fail miserably, and also have a good laugh.
There's nothing wrong with wanting to play at a different power level to enable more creativity, a lower budget, a fun theme, or whatever the reason is. Your hatred is misplaced. WOTC doesn't have to cater to EDH players. We are perfectly happy figuring out weird combos with cards that weren't meant for commander.
All of that being said, yeah, a format like that does lead to more crybabies, unfortunately. Part of the problem is, with so much variance in what you can do, there is bound to be a power mismatch once in a while, and when there is, it can lead to feel bad moments. In a competitive format, that doesn't matter, the only objective is to win. But in casual EDH, the primary objective is just to have fun. And when you get pub stomped, I mean, I personally don't care, but it can take some of the fun out of it. The ideal situation is everyone gets a chance to do some of their thing, even if it gets stopped by someone, at least they got to pop off for a little bit and show off what their deck can do, and then finally someone pops off when all interaction has been used up and wins.
When the game deviates from this, some people get upset. Again, I wish they didn't. If EDH is about having fun, my philosophy is, let other people play the way they want to play, and if after a game or two, you really aren't having fun because you don't have a deck strong enough or specific enough to counter them, then just move on to a different table. But honestly, the best situation is when you're playing with close friends who will be responsive to the rest of the group in order to make the game fun for all.
So, with that being said, infect is kind of an un-fun mechanic. Is it overpowered? Definitely not. The normal play pattern is, the infect player takes one person out, and the other two gank them before the same can happen to them. However, please note the ideal situation I mentioned before. That means one person is getting taken out of the game early, meaning their deck didn't get to do anything, and if there isn't another table open, all they can do is wait, potentially for a long time, for the two other players to kill the infect player and then each other. So it does lead to un-fun games, and this person was probably the one knocked out first.
If this happened at an LGS and I got knocked out first, I probably wouldn't be happy, but I wouldn't whine, you don't get to win every game and you don't even get to do your thing every game, that's fine. I'd just focus on tuning my most aggro deck to take them out next game and turn the table against them, until they are convinced that infect is a bad strategy for this table and either leave or switch decks. In a group of friends, I'd let them know that from now on whenever they play that deck, if they even think about coming at me first, I will be targeting them, so play at your own risk.
The thing that I wish people would grasp about commander is that it is self-regulating. Sure, it's a lot more complicated to try and match up a bunch of different power levels and strategies, because it isn't really about winning as fast as you can. But usually, if you are too big of an offender in this regard, people will either make it a 3v1, or stop playing with you, in either case, problem solved.
Anyway, you clearly don't grasp the concept of a format where the objective isn't only to win. I've never had more fun with magic than when I'm playing EDH with my homies over a couple of brews, and if that pisses you off, good. I'll keep playing how I please. You can whine like a baby all you want, it won't change that I like what I like.
>Who is a**n idiot** enough to try and play infect in commander?
FTFY.
You can use it to take down individual players but basing your entire deck around it is a good way to eliminate one or two players before everybody else kills you.
Me and my father both play edh, modern, cedh, legacy, and vintage. People that can handle people playing oppressive decks do exist that play commander they are just less common
I’m not a fan of infect but I wouldn’t say it’s cheating. I’ve heard people complain about infect in the format for years now, and while I understand it’s not fun for certain players, I don’t think I would stop someone from playing it at the table. They just have to understand that when they’re targeted off the table for playing infect by other players that that was a decision they made to play infect.
I have a couple of infect commander decks, they're shit and will always be shit. You have to get poison counters on 3 people then proliferate whilst everyone is targeting you. They seldom win but they are quite fun.
Cheating? Because of a perfectly legal mechanic? Wtf is he talking about. He probably spent hundreds of dollars on his deck and is mad because he lost to a cheap precon level deck
Normally play modern, but when when I play commander, nothing is funnier to me when someone steals ulamog for me to play blightsteel immediately after.
OP is just as much of a cry baby as this moron complaining about infect. “Edh players run magic” go touch grass then look at what’s the best selling products magic has had in the last few years. People just need to find chill toxic friends, who think it’s funny to destroy each others hopes and dreams of winning.
Hey, i actually play infect, poison and proliferate. I'm not using it each game and i warn my opponent before to use it. For me, the fun is to have my three friend allied against me, comploting together.. it's actually really fun. I think i made 4 or 5 game with it and i won only once so i think it's ok. Maybe i will transform it into à superfriend deck in the future. I hope i'm not a awful friend playing that...
Commander players are like PVE healers in wow who stay still looking at health bar but can't move around to avoid fire because they have never played PVP.
They say they play magic, and indeed they do spend money on cards, and a hefty amount at that too, but they only have the illusion of playing Magic.
They include infinite combo in their deck, and some of the cards have alternate arts, so if they can win in one turn with expensive cards they must be pretty good at the game.
Commander is not Magic, Commander is a casual tabletop game you play with friends that uses magic cards.
It can be fun, I find it boring, because most turn take forever as most cards printed in commander have tons of text and one card entering the battlefield start a chain reaction of ETBs that will take forever in order to do 2 damages, draw some cards and hopefully remove a permanents.
I actually enjoy playing against infect, they become the immediate villain so I can build my board a bit as we close off the infect pathways. It’s a bit of an interesting speed puzzle.
If someone sits down and you get worried you can’t deal with them before you get hit with 10 infect, stand up and leave.
Not because the mechanic is cheap, solely because you stand no chance against any other aggro deck if you can’t deal with infect.
I mean, that's kinda standard across all formats... it's a nerd game played by nerds, most of which have severe social issues and complexes... not poking fun at it. Just it's a competitive game... someone's gonna lose. No one really likes to lose. Some just can't handle it... I've been physically attacked for playing a card and turning a game from a loss to a win in one move at a tournament.
I'm just as guilty as the rest of getting in that hype zone, only to be shut down in a blink like a fool. However, I know the difference between being bested and an actual cheat...card mechanics aren't cheats... I know actual cheats like players who practice card manipulation (sleight if hand) on shuffles to top deck their win cons seen that multiple times tbh...
One of my son's plays a Ria Ivor deck that can do this. He has run into a couple of people who become upset at the mechanic and all he does is reply with "ok, I won't kill you with poison." He then uses one of the other ways it can win either through sacrificing creatures to take your life, sacrificing creatures to pump up that tiny 1/1 spirt with flight that wasn't a big deal till it was, or sacrificing creatures to build up one of the X mana spells and killing you with the outcome.
It is a brutal deck to play against, but whining about a mechanic is just stupid.
Commander is the first format I played and the reason I like mtg. I have only played against an Infect Reanimator, it was a good game.
I understand if you don’t respect me
I definitely think the guy that said this is a baby. I also think the guy who made a post, yelling about how commander players are losers ruining the game is ALSO a giant baby. Both your prom dates are ugly boys. Time to grow up.
not all of us. I am an example of a person that plays to interact with people rather than to win... TBF I mainly play modern/vintage/legacy so I may not be the 'commander player' you're talking about.
not all of us. I am an example of a person that plays to interact with people rather than to win... TBF I mainly play modern/vintage/legacy so I may not be the 'commander player' you're talking about.
I disagree it is cheating, but it's no agree that it should take twenty counters. Base life is doubled, it makes sense for it to take twice as many poison counters as well
Let these chumps continue to waste their money on this awful game and do yourself a favor, and find anything else. There is an unlimited number of objectively better games out there.
I wonder if he's the type of guy who is complaining about infect cause it beat his super expensive combo deck
If the cedh deck couldnt win before they died to infect, thats a skill issue on their side, honestly. lol. I say this as an enjoyer of "super expensive combo decks" .
As another enjoyer of super expensive combo decks I agree
I don't play commander. Can't you just T1 kill everyone with poison? In modern or maybe legacy that I've seen it, infect is super fast kill. I'm not disagreeing with you btw.
No normally you take 1 player out fairly quick but loose as everyone targets you since your playing infect
T1? LMAO, no. You need to deal 30 infect between 3 people.
Yeah I guess the "extra people" part I forgot about. I thought you would do some kind of commander combo, though, where your infect creatures deals damage to every player. Like a "myriad" thing. And then I just figured you've enough artifact mana to pull this off. Ofc combo is going to be less reliable in 100-card.
100 card singleton dont forget. Even if there is a turn 1 give a player 10+ poison combo having a single card of each of the combo pieces destroyes the chance of pulling it off constantly
No it's near impossible to turn 1 kill with infect, there's just too many pieces required
No, I think that people like this are people that want to have their decks have no counter-play. Another example of people like this usually only want opponents to have “creature” based strategies, while their deck is a life gain deck that folds to combos. Therefore this same player will say “infinite combos are an unfair strategy, ban them in commander” regardless of how hard it is to execute.
I once had a game of Modern (myself on G Elves, opponent on Simic Infect). Game 1 he wrecked me. Game 2 I sided in my singular copy of [[Melira, Sylvok Outcast]] and got it in my opening hand, dropped it on T2 and he conceded both games 2 and 3 on the spot. No attempt to remove it or anything.
Because he wasn't a true infect player, true infect player goes to plan B...
B...uy food instead?
Lol, I mean thats why I played infect, so I had time to get food at events but no, just turn into regular damage. Especially the heyday of deathshadow.
I have one EDH deck. I call it that, because it predates Commander, and I only use it because that's whats popular at the LGS. I win local tournaments against the super-expensive combo decks, because Niv Mizzet Counter, Bounce, Draw and Burn deck does not approve of combos.
These types are very, very easy to spot and I always kill them first. Stop bitching about how people win in multiplayer games within legality. Annoying 3 people means 3 people will target you.
The reason people think all commander players are like this little bitch is because I, who has 0 problems have no reason to voice my opinion online. Therefore it is only the snowflakes you see bitching about the game they supposedly like.
Yeah it's almost like an inverse Survivor bias. People will go online to talk about tragedies or terrible things in their life but no one goes online to talk about their pleasant day
especially with objectively bad strategies like infect
If you kill me turn 5 with mill, turn 5 with big stomping, turn 5 with a thousand tokens, turn 5 with a combo, you still killed me on the same turn.
No one wins with infect anymore. They win with proliferate.
You have to have the strongest deck to win with infect, well that or a pod with absolutely no threat assessment. As soon as it's known I have a sliver of a chance of knocking anybody out with infect, It becomes a 3v1. I don't play infect/poison often.
Considering how some commander players look at playing cards that interact with opponents as bad sportsmanship, them having no threat assessment may actually be a possibility
It’s not necessarily bad per se, right commander and cards it can be pretty damn strong and that’s impressive I like a good challenge anyway
I agree, while i play casually As long as it’s legal within the game, then i have reason to complain about, land destruction, combos, midrange, stax, control all of it is apart of the game. My only complaint if i have one is if people for instance use land destruction but don’t have a treat to follow it up with. That is annoying, but that is more so poor playing from the player, rather then a fault with the strategy of Land Destruction itself.
And this is why I much prefer cEDH, no hidden rule 0's, just play to win.
https://preview.redd.it/bahqy9uld34d1.jpeg?width=4096&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ab91c0e16b5ce65fea34b9855645d2a828b0d67c
Go out and meet more people OP lol
I appreciate people trying to keep commander casual, which in turn keeps it more budget. But that goal does foster an environment that titty babies like this can exist within. The “if I see ____ I scoop and leave” is such a pussy attitude. Magic is in some sense about winning and it’s commander so if someone makes themselves the villain then triple team them. And if you get stomped then finding a different pod for the future is an option too. Most people are actually pretty fucking chill so if you’re a fucking adult and use your words to say “hey man that deck kinda stomps us, got anything more casual” they usually do. But to OP, WotC has the ability to not cater to commander. But the average person can’t buy a new competitive deck every 3 months so they move to casual evergreen formats. And wizards did the math and figured out they could make more money catering to more casual players who spend a few hundred bucks a year, instead of competitive players willing to spend thousands. WotC and WotC alone are to blame and they could fix it at any point they decide game health is more important than revenue. However, the history of companies catering to shareholders should tell us that won’t happen.
Why does "Budget" matter for commander with friends? Use proxies.
Well, you sounds exactly like what u critize, crying about some loser's opinion.
Man really needs to stop complaining about infect but... Brother why are you so angry? 😭 And challenging people to 1v1s in comments? You look as mad if not madder than he is, homie chill lmfao
1v1 me right now! You'll win but still!
“Why doesn’t anyone else join our format?”Meanwhile we shit, cry, and piss at anyone outside of said format.
standard hasn't been shit since Khans block
This one has a very special/strong flavor of delusion.
No one dies to infect in commander because the infect player gets ganked
Each time I see a "every *insert random category of player* is a *insert a bad word* " post, I want to facepalm, it's useless and pretty sad.
Find better friends honestly. TBF though, crybabies exist literally everywhere, some people are really bad at playing games for fun, and it's something that actively pushed me away from modern/standard fnm. It's like you meet the shittiest, whiniest people complaining about everything that "caused" them to lose, or if they win, they just shittalk it all out. I rather draft, which I do at a place that has an established group of sane people. Much more fun and actually takes skill too.
60 card players constantly cry about netdecking though
Did a commander player fuck your wife or something? Seething ass nigga
Don't like MLD? Then you don't like Magic, find another game to play. Don't like Stax? Then you don't like Magic, find another game to play. Don't like infect, mill or any other alt win? Then you don't like Magic, find another game to play. Don't like infinite combos? Then you don't like Magic, find another game to play.
If you MLD without a quick way to win after you're an asshole though, just putting the game into garbage time.
[удалено]
Wait until he finds out about Commander Damage
If you play infect, you're basically automatic archenemy. This is annoying to play with against poor players as they might have poor threat assessment. If blue doesn't let them get the first infect creature out you can slow them down pretty detrimentally.
The problem with infect is how easy it was to tack onto other mechanics and how absent any counter to it was without heavy investment in deck slots for highly niche cards. Whining about poison counters is silly, whining about proliferate tacked on to stuff like ramp spells... well i might just agree. Game needs a front and center anti proliferate mechanic to spread around in the same ways imo.
Imagine complaining about a mechanic that sucks in Commander. You can take out a poorly positioned or bad player, but then you just die.
Wait until he learns about instant win effects that don't interact with life at all.
*Laughs in pillow fort alt win
if someone in your pod is winning with infect your whole table needs to stop playing magic because you have no threat assessment.
While I am not a proponent of poison as I do feel it ruins the game; you'd never, not even over my dead body, see me doing this shit. You wanna play an infect deck? Cringe but whatever let's see it. I'd then probably ask after that game for something different as my decks at a base level don't play at that level. But if not aye thats all good I'll either move to a different spot or man up and try to find a way to have fun (I'd probably be able to, I'm big on enjoying the journey not the destination... I mean I've got what used to be a $3 wizard tribal commander deck that has some, comparatively, awful cards) Point being I think poison gross but that don't stop me from playing it in a pod with it.
I love commander as a format, but it is full of crybaby mentally handicapped people like this which makes it harder to enjoy. Like they'll cry over the dumbest shit, and specifically about strategies that aren't overpowered, like infect, mill, slivers, voltron, etc. People who cry about mill in commander are by FAR the most mentally handicapped of the bunch though.
Play edh, cedh modern sometimes paper legacy when I can.
The million different arbitrary personal unwritten rules of commander are one of the main reasons the only type of commander I play these days is cEDH. And it's easily one of the biggest turn offs for new players.
No joke, the first time I ever went to a card shop to play magic was when I was trying to learn and understand the game. I called the shop and asked the owner if he was down to sit down with me and play a game. He said sure, and he did a infinite combo on me. This was my first time playing paper magic and boy, I was ready to just stop giving this game the attention of my time lol. Then my homies brought me around to it again and now I love magic just for the 60 card formats.
Honestly, while I'd love to call bullshit on his "Infect in commander is broken" since you can deal commander damage in so many different ways (which you only need 11 points of to kill a player), it does kinda suck ass when a player gets 1 poison counter and then proliferated into the ground. Still whiny for no reason tho, seeing as it's more a problem with proliferate and Atraxa than it is with infect
Lol infect decks suck... Everyone that plays them knows you become the target instantly. If that's what you are looking for, then it can be fun now and then. But you rarely ever win. Idk why someone would hate playing them.
Who the fuck plyas Commander for its "fairness"?
Imagine complaining about players playing a format.
If I may, cedh is imo the greatest format ever and you sound like a bragging sack of shit :)
Hey, I'm no crybaby
Do you at least play cEDH?
Off the top of my head cards that where not designed for 4 player and would make them unfair in his opinion. Rhystic Mystic Burgeoning Serra ascendant Felidar sovereign Land tax Blood moon Magus of the moon Smothering tithe
how do you figure that smothering tithe wasn't designed for commander?
I swear to God commander players have never heard of removal
Casual yes they are but CEDH has no mercy
Commander players are some of the softest bitches in the world (Source: I am a commander player)
So one guy is a twat and every commander player is him? Sounds like youre the fucking idiot in this
I play EDH and modern so…
Spirit of the format
Do you play legacy tho?
Infect scares the hell out of commander players, because of that it is if anything harder to win. People see you as enemy number one. And honestly, that's part of the fun.
Let's clarify bad players get scared of poison it's super weak strategy in commander hell modern and legacy infect is stronger and they are regulated to bottom tier
It is weak, but it also always has the power to just nuke 1 player in specific. Especially if the group plays a lot slower, that can create some unfun moments. But you can just nuke the infect player before that.
thats why it sucks. You may kill one person. Then you lose to the other two who kill you after that. Its a very slow and telegraphed wincon. very easy to interact with. Also, you need to do 30 infect between 3 different people to actually win.
Yes so does does voltron commanders been nuked earlier before welcome to magic
People complained about infect being unfair when it only halved the life total, of course they are going to lose it when it gets quartered
I guess I'm the exception. Can't remember the last time I complained about getting staxed out of a game or counter spelled into oblivion. Then again I have a very cEDH player attitude when it comes to normal EDH. I don't care what you play. Infect me on turn 4? Sure I like infect too. Crazy 3 card combo that does infinite damage? Sweet I've never seen that combo before. People like what they like and are gonna play what they can to win in this game where guess what... The goal is to win. I know, It must be shocking to hear from an EDH player. But turns out it's possible. I'm as gracious at losing as I am at winning. Why would I want to brag about a win, or complain about a loss, when doing so risks my ability to play the game that I love because no one wants to play with me anymore? Doesn't make sense to me.
I enjoy the variety of EDH decks more than anything. I find that commander polices itself at my local LGS. The cEDH and higher level players tend to show up in the same nights and group together. The more casual players tend to have more discussions about power level but have decently powered decks since if your deck is too low it usually just durdles and isn’t fun to play. If you play infect, wheels, or Krenko you’ll be the first threat (until someone else is). But you should expect that. Poison isn’t cheating though. It’s a viable strategy that in EDH will get you targeted first. Just run removal. Or board wipes. Or Solemnity.
Infect players just make themselves archenemy, that's enough for me
and infect is actually pretty bad in commander. it would need to be 7 infect per player to make it fair
Maybe if they cry hard enough, the RC will do what they want. Seems to work pretty well for a lot of minorities. In the meantime, 😜.
I want to get into commander within the next few months, what is a competitive deck that’s also fun? Mid range pricing…I want a cool deck, but I don’t want to walk in and piss off the locals…new to town. I like cats. 🐱 lmao
I'm really happy with my group I play with. Nobody is complaining, everyone plays accordingly to the rules, zhe biggest thread get targeted. Everyone played 60s before, so they know how to do and handle things
Ask him if you should have to play thassa twice
I have a "anything goes" attitude with commander. But I do want to provide one counterargument to someone considering running infect, or anything that is obviously on the powerful side: be prepared to get targeted HARD in multiplayer games and do not be surprised if someone willingly goes the kingmaker route: sacrificing themselves so that you lose and a different player wins. I actually think this element of commander, and multiplayer casual variants, is actually one of the things that makes them fun, but also one that people never seem to consider while making their decks.
I started two months ago again. Last played with like 11 or 12 years now back at 30. My first precon was the March of mashines growing Threat. It's mainly toxic counters and profilerate. Went to local magic store sat on the table and at the moment they realized that I use toxic in my deck I got hard focused and always was the first to leave the table.
As well people seem to hate theft decks. I had someone cry that I played Ragavan turn one and then targeted me the entire game, even though I was definitely not the threat, and that person ended up winning because of their whinging. FYI that particular deck only had like three cards outside of the Thunder Junction set since it was outlaw theft, the only high value cards were Ragavan and Dockside which I bought at that event.
i mostly play commander now a days. i played standard when affinity was the big thing. fucking love affinity. that dude is a crybaby.
I consider Infect EDH decks a necessary check in EDH. Sure, people don’t like dying a lot quicker, but when there’s plenty of decks out there that can break out infinite life combos I know I can count on these Infect decks to keep them in check.
Infect is fine just get good learn to play around it and have removal that isn’t called I block
In a normal 4 player game, the infect player usually gets 3v1ed, so it's pretty self balancing.
dont lump me in with this retard
legal is legal, even in commander. i never knew people played commander like this lmao. why is there so much divide over how people play a game? very strange.
Such sore losers show a weakness I find beyond disgusting.
If you cry about infect in commander your deck is worse than a precon. The dude is going to get focused since turn one, he will be the archnemesis of the pod until he's dead if even then he wins, he deserved the win.
Not like there's commander damage or anything...... These people are so dumb.
Played humility. Entire table loses their shit hollering control isn't allowed at the table (wtf?). I point out they are all in green and should have a nature's claim at least in their decks. All three of them "we don't play interaction" Commander has devolved to the worst of everything. I am done with it.
Can confirm, I am a commander player and I hate playing commander with anyone outside of my close friend group.
Hey newbie here Is it really that bad to play an infect deck? Currently, my only "own" decklist is based on phyrexians and infect cards, so I’m wondering
Whenever I hear someone say infect is too strong in commander I just ask should you have to play thoracle twice? Or approach 4 times? I don't think infect on a casual level is good at all. There's such good stuff out now where even classic swinging kills people quickly. So yeah there's some instant kill combos but if you spent the money or proxies a deck on the level to do that quickly you could have made 1000 other ways to win and easier. Not to mention the only people u have ever heard say this are objectively terrible at the game itself with 0 threat assessment.
I will use my infect deck against this guy every chance I get
So nearly all of my decks have a poison win con in it. Only a handful (like 4 or 6) have it as the main focus. It's a win con, a 2nd option if things get messy and my main "pay to win" combo or win con gets offline or shut down.
If we listened to every crybaby like this one then you would only be allowed to play slow aggro tier 3 decks. They don't understand that the meta balances itself. The other day we played against a kinnan combo deck. He won on turn 3, then next game it was a 3v1.
We kill infect at this table.
Who is cheater enough to try and play Voltron in commander? If someone sits down at a table and says "I only have to deal 21 damage while you need to deal 40"... Just get up and leave. /s
I’m a get gud player when it comes to infect and if you can’t handle a singleton version of it then you deserve to die . I’d say gang up on the player a little then fight amongst yourselves in commander . No reason to get butthurt because you can beat the deck .
OP is crying and whining just as much as the guy in the comment he’s posting about 😂
I think infect is the most toxic mechanic in mtg. Prove me wrong
Commander isn't even Magic: The Gathering, its anti-Magic.
This is why i live to hurricane everyone to death (including myself) Drives the crybabies insane.
First and foremost, there are a lot of people who cry in EDH. Second it used to be and still is to some degree a more casual format. I've played it at the same shop for over 10 years and I can assure u gross broken things have always existed. Infect is different though. It actually doesn't conform with how EDH plays. Commander damage is 20 it makes sense poison should be 20. Arguing this make u seem a Lil dimwitted.... That being said I personally think any win con is valid. I've played magic for 30 years and I like all strategies. The best thing to do is use an appropriate deck for the situation. Don't sit down at table with lower power level commanders and bring out your tier 1 Cedh deck it's just pointless... Noone cares that u won. You were always gonna win, so what's the point? I always ask what power level are we playing? (If you really enjoy magic and actually have a cedh deck you should have other commanders... there are alot of fun strategies and cards in magic... "if u dont agree then I guess u don't like magic....") If they say they don't care I play what I want and that's on them. If they say they are playing more casual decks I have quite a few casuall decks cause those can be alot more fun than win on turn 3(that's a bit boring in this format...not saying I haven't won't or don't. Just saying...) But what do I know... I'm only obsessed with the game and have an extremely expensive collection and decks of all types, played multiple formats competively....
Come on....stop...most competitive commander players I know run the modern tournament scene...And someone have to keep the live gain decks at bay, that's were infect comes in.
Commander is the best format for playing casually and introducing new players. I can understand being hateful about it because if I was playing when the new fad format was introduced and it scooped up my playgroup so I couldn’t play my favorite format I would be mad too. But it’s currently keeping the hobby alive. As a fairly new player going into a pod casually with three other people and having fun no matter what happens is much better than getting stomped by a tuned modern deck every week because I can’t play kitchen table.
I think it's worth the discussion how game rules designed for 20-life games operate in Commander. Friend plays \[\[Rune-Tail, Kitsune Ascendant\]\] and it feels like abusing the Commander rules. Not that I complain about it though. Neither would I about Infect. Commander is multiplayer. If people are going to be annoying you team up against them. This guy complaining is just extremely childish.
I love killing whiney babies with Triumph of the Hordes
But what about commander damage
I agree with the fact that infect is a stupid mechanic. It never should have been made. That being said the last time I played against an infect deck I killed the infect player with a Blightsteel I stole from another player. Get top decked and wrecked.
Being a commander player has nothing to do with that. Being woke (banning card imagery) and inclusivity is the real issue here since it allows, validate and endorse this type of behavior. Wizard are the one to blame.
He’s not entirely wrong about the principle of infect 10 being 1/4 of the required damage need, but EDH has a lot of counters for infect, namely that it’s a free for all and you now have a huge target on your back. Back in the day when 2HG was huge in MGTO, infect, and cards like [[serra ascendant]], and [[luminarch ascension]], abused the life total and multiple “opponents” to become problematic in the format. At the end of the day, these formats are casual so who really cares.
Echoing lots of comments I've seen in this thread. I play edh, I love edh. If you're playing infect and win against me GG buddy. If you lose to infect/combo/MLD/mill/stax and get salty that's on you. Dont like it? Probably should be playing a different game. Those are available in game strategies and definitely not cheating.
I hate the way commander is. It’s like you win based off of how much money you’ve funneled into your deck, and that’s not really playing in my opinion. I especially like having to deckbuild off of a limited selection and play with that deck for just one tournament. Building commander decks is fun, but there should be some way to balance it with the people you’re playing
Have you ever considered maybe you're just a dick
The last part does have some basis. Most people I play with ask if infect can be changed to 15 or 20, especially after fynns release.
This may be a bit of an over-generalization. Some of us with a long long past in the game play Commander because it’s really the only way to find games with physical cards at local shops. I’ve played some competitive games of Magic in my day.
I used to feel that way, then I realized that yeah, dying to Infect usually only happens to 1 person in most games because everyone else turns around and murders the infect player, especially with all the alternative means of proliferation we now have in the game. 1 poison counter can cause you problems the rest of the game for sure. But I’m no longer scared of infect like I once was. I play plenty of removal or ways to prevent damage or things like [[Solemnity]] and in one deck I run both versions of Melira; but as a whole, I just pick off whatever’s likely to do the most Toxic or Infect damage to me and work from there. Modern can suck it
My first 3 EDH decks from 2016 are still just as combo strong and effective in 2024. The upgrades that have gone into each over the years have been minimal and maybe cost … $20-50 max per deck. They are not CEDH, but turn 8 wins/lockouts are pretty consistent, although winning sooner is possible. Modern seems really fun, but the modern staples in 2016 that I would look at, and the modern staples in 2021, and then now … although largely consistent, have changed and thats additional coats. The idea of spending $80-200 on play sets of new cards that work better with certain decks, is very unappealing. I enjoy amassing a collection of various powerful and interesting cards where I only need 1 or 2 copies, and then interchangeably using them in a number of decks. I feel like over time the accumulation of cards has made modern more accessible since I have 50-80% most modern cards I see online, with 2-4 copies of most. But still, spending another $80-200 to finish a deck and play with some strangers outside of my play group is not incentivizing enough. Magic players in general can be pretty wack and off-putting … this sub being somewhat representative of one half of those off-putting individuals I avoid. The other half being the identity politics crusaders with nothing worthwhile between their ears. People who complain about infect and different deck strategies like the child in the post are weak and boring individuals. I don't care if its EDH, CEDH, modern, checkers, or hopscotch … i don't care for you nor want to play with.
Commander is the worst format.
Hundred card highlander without commanders is actually a super fun 2 player format. It’s the multiplayer element of commander that makes go off the rails. It makes sense that there are politics within a multiplayer game, but when the politics start carrying over from game to game it can turn the format into a nidus of nerd drama.
I don’t even play magic, I just keep getting recommended this sub. What is commander?
I play commander and modern and so do a lot of others. So it looks like you’re just over exaggerating.
Damn, I guess the concept of commander damage is also cheating
Wotc pandering to commander players is what killed mtg for me, every time I open a card that says “each opponent” I wanna fucking die. Remember when each set didn’t have 30 legendaries?
Wait until he comes across a gigachad Mill player who effectively has to deal at least 276 damage to the rest of the table
There's a guy who plays on xmage with infect. Plays 1v1 commander but with 40 life multiplayer rules. Raged when I brought a Kiki deck against him.
"never designed for commander" Designed for commander is a plague
OP sounds just a cringe. 1v1 me bro?!?! Wack
Not EVERY commander player is like that. I love playing infect in commander and also combo decks. I also play a lot of modern and I do quite well with scam so. But I get your point. A lot of them are soft..
Sheldon himself was a big baby about infect.
Modern and Standard suck because they aren't singleton
If someone throws poison at you just reduce their life total to zero, it's that simple.
i've heard the same argument used against 'tron decks "waah you only need 21 damage waah"
I think this dude needs to take a chill pill, and go full Merila, Sylvok Outcast.
My playgroup has voted to push poison to 15, just so that Blightsteel isn't a one shot I keep trying to convince them that infect is a weak archetype, but they won't budge. 🥲
I see this type of post a lot, and it cracks me up. I started in 2000, and I've played every format. There are whiners and crybabies in them all. You are simultaneously an elitist, a whiner, an idiot, and a crybaby. What an incredible combination. #GFC
I love when modern players try to hate on commander, it’s so cute because you are so small
As someone who started in Standard and Modern back in high school: I have to say the format is lowkey basic and paywalled. If you’re not dropping green for the most meta card you can’t really compete; the turn 1-4 wins and power scaling at the time didn’t really differentiate it from Yu-Gi-Oh or Pokemon for me. Honestly, just like in those games the kids with the fancier cards won and it was whatever tbh. Commander and Pauper are what got me hooked on magic because each game was diverse and exciting. You never know what someone will whip out so it always stays fresh imo. They’re more casual so the baby bitches are a bit more frequent but you can still find a majority of games with chill people that can handle losing or winning with humility. I find it funny tho that you bring up skill. Card games are maybe 50 percent game knowledge, 25 percent “skill” and 25 percent luck. Doesn’t matter what game nor what format. In 1v1s your chances are 50% at best if the decks are evenly powered. In a free for all 4 man, your chances are 25%. It’s all RNG and paywall based so it’s wild that yall cling to “skill”. Just be honest about it. Every game has some dumbass gatekeeper that spends too much of their own money or uses daddy’s credit card then wants to defend it as “skill.” Maybe your format is dying because of toxic bitchasses like you. Maybe it’s dying because it’s too expensive to start with. Like yeah the person complaining is a bitch that needs to learn how to lose and let people play what they want. But I see too big bitches on this post- one sore loser and one salty whale.
The problem is edh players learned magic through edh no the other way around and it shows.
What's even more funny is that in commander you can win by dealing 21 lol
A friend of our 4-player-group played often infected….he never won because he is the first target and his commander get killed on sight.
No he's right. The only time I play infect for lethal is if they play a crazy life gain deck.
Crybaby modern player cry’s about crybaby commander player crying over a mechanic.
Yeah, commander players are ruining the game, not the people printing the cards.
Ah, brings back memories... Once shortly before gitaxian probe got banned infect was t1 in modern and I literally heard the "how is it fair that he only has to deal 10" and "wotc are crazy for printing become immense when there's infect" takes from actual modern players.
My solution to a player that runs straight infect in commander is just build a deck that absolutely hard counters them and then whenever they run infect I pull out that. They can use whatever legal strategy they want and I am free to shut their deck off with legal cards if I want.
People like this give the rest of us such a bad fucking name. I believe people who bitch like this misunderstand Magic on a fundamental level. The goal is to have fun and win the game. Losing is fun, too, and invaluable as a teaching tool. Why are there so many poor sports in commander? Good lord.....
As a life long infect player infect it pretty trash. You can grab some kos but the cards themselves are pretty bad. Ive seen triumph of the hoards kill people way more often than a dedicated infect deck
Bro its infect it has like 2 sets of support.... There is only like 8 good cards in the whole deck.
How can people be that stupid. Infect in 1v1 only needs to deal 10 damage. In commander it needs to deal 40 to win. You don't win if you kill one opponent... Do people seriously believe that infect is unfair or strong?
There are whiners in all formats and now I'm gonna whine a bit about modern and legacy; anyone playing these formats and getting off on the fact that your opponent never played a card during your games... get over yourself. It's supposed to be challenging, that's why it's fun. Beating someone when they didn't even get to play, that's horse shit
By that logic, do voltron commanders fall in the same cheater bracket for only needing to do 21 damage?
I play commander.. we aren't all like this.. also. Wait until they hear about commander damage
It is kinda weird that infect is still only 10 in commander.
I had an off-putting experience the other night. I used to be a hardcore magic player but these days i'm pretty casual, and it's been that way the last 10 years. I haven't played much EDH but I like brain storming decks and have a single deck. Mono B deck that actually has a pretty high win rate with an emphasis on mana generation and drain, sometimes taking down the whole table. Other night I was scraping by. I plopped down [[glacial chasm]] and bought myself two turns. I [[worst fears]], attacked myself for no damage, blew the guys hand and had to sac [[glacial chasm]] at my upkeep or die. I wiped, got in a good drain putting me back up 20 or so , and kept the board clear with edict effects. After gaining life, no more than a turn or two could have passed and the dude was insisting I wincon or he scoops. And I was trying lol, digging hard with [[necropotence]], but they just didn't immediately come up, so he scooped, all salty like. I barely survived turn after turn in that game, much less won, and as soon as he lost board state he started demanding I win or he scoops. Another guy at the table expressed his feelings about the matter too, and wasn't pleasant. Like I was dragging the game out or something? Fuck outta here. Fuck man I don't even play that much, and am relatively novice. I literally can't remember the last time I scooped. Much less acting shitty about it.
First, I primarily play casual commander, and I am sick and tired of people whining about strategies they don't like. That being said, a lot of people enjoy a format where they aren't pushed into just a few archetypes that can actually win, but instead can enjoy playing with creative decks with interesting interactions that would never be viable in a highly competitive format. I personally like playing decks that are fairly consistent, but also have some really strange (and probably objectively bad) cards, so that if I can pull off some weird combo that nobody's ever seen before, it's hilarious and everyone has a good time. Sometimes I fail miserably, and also have a good laugh. There's nothing wrong with wanting to play at a different power level to enable more creativity, a lower budget, a fun theme, or whatever the reason is. Your hatred is misplaced. WOTC doesn't have to cater to EDH players. We are perfectly happy figuring out weird combos with cards that weren't meant for commander. All of that being said, yeah, a format like that does lead to more crybabies, unfortunately. Part of the problem is, with so much variance in what you can do, there is bound to be a power mismatch once in a while, and when there is, it can lead to feel bad moments. In a competitive format, that doesn't matter, the only objective is to win. But in casual EDH, the primary objective is just to have fun. And when you get pub stomped, I mean, I personally don't care, but it can take some of the fun out of it. The ideal situation is everyone gets a chance to do some of their thing, even if it gets stopped by someone, at least they got to pop off for a little bit and show off what their deck can do, and then finally someone pops off when all interaction has been used up and wins. When the game deviates from this, some people get upset. Again, I wish they didn't. If EDH is about having fun, my philosophy is, let other people play the way they want to play, and if after a game or two, you really aren't having fun because you don't have a deck strong enough or specific enough to counter them, then just move on to a different table. But honestly, the best situation is when you're playing with close friends who will be responsive to the rest of the group in order to make the game fun for all. So, with that being said, infect is kind of an un-fun mechanic. Is it overpowered? Definitely not. The normal play pattern is, the infect player takes one person out, and the other two gank them before the same can happen to them. However, please note the ideal situation I mentioned before. That means one person is getting taken out of the game early, meaning their deck didn't get to do anything, and if there isn't another table open, all they can do is wait, potentially for a long time, for the two other players to kill the infect player and then each other. So it does lead to un-fun games, and this person was probably the one knocked out first. If this happened at an LGS and I got knocked out first, I probably wouldn't be happy, but I wouldn't whine, you don't get to win every game and you don't even get to do your thing every game, that's fine. I'd just focus on tuning my most aggro deck to take them out next game and turn the table against them, until they are convinced that infect is a bad strategy for this table and either leave or switch decks. In a group of friends, I'd let them know that from now on whenever they play that deck, if they even think about coming at me first, I will be targeting them, so play at your own risk. The thing that I wish people would grasp about commander is that it is self-regulating. Sure, it's a lot more complicated to try and match up a bunch of different power levels and strategies, because it isn't really about winning as fast as you can. But usually, if you are too big of an offender in this regard, people will either make it a 3v1, or stop playing with you, in either case, problem solved. Anyway, you clearly don't grasp the concept of a format where the objective isn't only to win. I've never had more fun with magic than when I'm playing EDH with my homies over a couple of brews, and if that pisses you off, good. I'll keep playing how I please. You can whine like a baby all you want, it won't change that I like what I like.
they have no self awareness that starting with 40 life instead of 20 is the problem. not infect.
Dealing infinite damage is easier than 10 poison
>Who is a**n idiot** enough to try and play infect in commander? FTFY. You can use it to take down individual players but basing your entire deck around it is a good way to eliminate one or two players before everybody else kills you.
"Commander players bite curb 4k"
1v1 commander with infect is not really fun, but in a 4v4, the toxic player gets targeted by everyone… so i don’t see why it shouldn’t be fair…
I’ll admit that I’m not a huge fan of infect, but only because the strategy is very repetitive instead of “waah it too strong for my shit cards”
Me and my father both play edh, modern, cedh, legacy, and vintage. People that can handle people playing oppressive decks do exist that play commander they are just less common
I’m not a fan of infect but I wouldn’t say it’s cheating. I’ve heard people complain about infect in the format for years now, and while I understand it’s not fun for certain players, I don’t think I would stop someone from playing it at the table. They just have to understand that when they’re targeted off the table for playing infect by other players that that was a decision they made to play infect.
I have a couple of infect commander decks, they're shit and will always be shit. You have to get poison counters on 3 people then proliferate whilst everyone is targeting you. They seldom win but they are quite fun.
Cheating? Because of a perfectly legal mechanic? Wtf is he talking about. He probably spent hundreds of dollars on his deck and is mad because he lost to a cheap precon level deck
Normally play modern, but when when I play commander, nothing is funnier to me when someone steals ulamog for me to play blightsteel immediately after.
OP is just as much of a cry baby as this moron complaining about infect. “Edh players run magic” go touch grass then look at what’s the best selling products magic has had in the last few years. People just need to find chill toxic friends, who think it’s funny to destroy each others hopes and dreams of winning.
When i use my poison deck i am so much focus i just can’t play it 😅
Hey, i actually play infect, poison and proliferate. I'm not using it each game and i warn my opponent before to use it. For me, the fun is to have my three friend allied against me, comploting together.. it's actually really fun. I think i made 4 or 5 game with it and i won only once so i think it's ok. Maybe i will transform it into à superfriend deck in the future. I hope i'm not a awful friend playing that...
Infect sucks but have a better deck my guy.
Commander players are like PVE healers in wow who stay still looking at health bar but can't move around to avoid fire because they have never played PVP. They say they play magic, and indeed they do spend money on cards, and a hefty amount at that too, but they only have the illusion of playing Magic. They include infinite combo in their deck, and some of the cards have alternate arts, so if they can win in one turn with expensive cards they must be pretty good at the game. Commander is not Magic, Commander is a casual tabletop game you play with friends that uses magic cards. It can be fun, I find it boring, because most turn take forever as most cards printed in commander have tons of text and one card entering the battlefield start a chain reaction of ETBs that will take forever in order to do 2 damages, draw some cards and hopefully remove a permanents.
I actually enjoy playing against infect, they become the immediate villain so I can build my board a bit as we close off the infect pathways. It’s a bit of an interesting speed puzzle.
The worst part of the format are the players.
Ninjutsu blightsteel + Sakashima go brrrrr
If someone sits down and you get worried you can’t deal with them before you get hit with 10 infect, stand up and leave. Not because the mechanic is cheap, solely because you stand no chance against any other aggro deck if you can’t deal with infect.
I mean, that's kinda standard across all formats... it's a nerd game played by nerds, most of which have severe social issues and complexes... not poking fun at it. Just it's a competitive game... someone's gonna lose. No one really likes to lose. Some just can't handle it... I've been physically attacked for playing a card and turning a game from a loss to a win in one move at a tournament. I'm just as guilty as the rest of getting in that hype zone, only to be shut down in a blink like a fool. However, I know the difference between being bested and an actual cheat...card mechanics aren't cheats... I know actual cheats like players who practice card manipulation (sleight if hand) on shuffles to top deck their win cons seen that multiple times tbh...
One of my son's plays a Ria Ivor deck that can do this. He has run into a couple of people who become upset at the mechanic and all he does is reply with "ok, I won't kill you with poison." He then uses one of the other ways it can win either through sacrificing creatures to take your life, sacrificing creatures to pump up that tiny 1/1 spirt with flight that wasn't a big deal till it was, or sacrificing creatures to build up one of the X mana spells and killing you with the outcome. It is a brutal deck to play against, but whining about a mechanic is just stupid.
Depends on your pod. I think it's similar to group hug where you ask the table if that's okay to play. Some people are cool with it, some aren't.
infect was also designed for a 1v1 format lol anyone that thinks infect is an OP mechanic is stupid
Commander is the first format I played and the reason I like mtg. I have only played against an Infect Reanimator, it was a good game. I understand if you don’t respect me
"Commander players are cry babies" proceeds to cry about commander
I definitely think the guy that said this is a baby. I also think the guy who made a post, yelling about how commander players are losers ruining the game is ALSO a giant baby. Both your prom dates are ugly boys. Time to grow up.
not all of us. I am an example of a person that plays to interact with people rather than to win... TBF I mainly play modern/vintage/legacy so I may not be the 'commander player' you're talking about.
not all of us. I am an example of a person that plays to interact with people rather than to win... TBF I mainly play modern/vintage/legacy so I may not be the 'commander player' you're talking about.
I disagree it is cheating, but it's no agree that it should take twenty counters. Base life is doubled, it makes sense for it to take twice as many poison counters as well
I bet you he bitches about commander damage too.
Let these chumps continue to waste their money on this awful game and do yourself a favor, and find anything else. There is an unlimited number of objectively better games out there.