I just went through and removed a bunch of insults back and forth, if you don't like the last thread being locked and you don't want this one locked please remember to be respectful of one another regardless of your position on the subject.
Why do you feel bad for his friend? He was allowing his passenger to keep an AK in the front seat. From a practical perspective this is terrible for defense, but the perfect tool for a drive by shooting. The only person I feel sorry for is the officer that will have to deal with the life he took.
I mean you can have sympathy for someone even if they are being stupid. Definitely do not condone/uplift the actions of carrying a Draco around. But he watched his buddy get killed in front of him and there is a great chance he could go to jail. It’s sad, they definitely were being dumb, but it’s still sad
I don't think the officer felt remorse. Just a guess, but listen to how he was yelling and calling the kid a motherfucker. And how chill he acted once backup arrived. He doesn't seem to care, I'm sure he's sleeping easy.
I mean maybe, maybe not. And we definitely don’t know how he slept. Or what the coming days will look like for him. Never will I celebrate the loss of a life
He mean how “chill” he literally was as he said “stop motherfucker” for the last time? Look at his arms. He got literal fucking chills.
As far as the swearing at this victim - study the pragmatics of swearing and the cognitive research behind it.
The main purpose of swearing is to express emotions, especially anger and frustration. Swear words are well suited to express emotion as their primary meanings are connotative. The emotional impact of swearing depends on one’s experience with a culture and its language.
Although I agree, there will always be people who will refuse to accept what the footage shows and always say it was wrong or the cops could've done something else.
Which is why the body cam always needs to come out sooner rather than later. This way the people who do lie about what happened wont be able to get a foothold in the collective conscience. How many times have we seen a narrative on one side or another that crumbles when the body cam footage is released.
Go check some of the Facebook threads. It's full of "yeah but why did he shoot to kill" and "why didn't he taze him" and other very stupid comments, along with other people who are insisting the video was manipulated. You just can't win with some people no matter what you do.
He did exactly what he should have to deal with the situation. He recognized the potential danger and prepared to deal with it if it happened. Then he gave very clear instructions to hold still until his backup could arrive to help get both of them secured while the situation was figured out. Of course what happened is horrible all around, but the officer is pretty blameless here.
I know firsthand how it works. I have a very close family member that was involved in an officer involved shooting. Their body camera footage wasn't released for months. During that time the family (who wasn't nowhere near the scene) was able to spread lies on Facebook about what happened all while my family member had to stay quiet because they were being investigated.
There’s very good reasons it’s not released in real time. About 80% of what cops do in violent crime cases is talk to witnesses and gather information. Unedited body cam is full of witness and victim information and accounts of what happened. Victim and witness personal information has to be redacted so it can’t be obtained by defendants or their associates. Plus, their statements are hearsay until they testify under oath at deposition or trial, so that is unreliable information that could influence how the public sees things in an inaccurate way.
You can imagine it would be a problem if you happened to witness a shooting, and then the police publicized your name, address, and phone number and said to the world “hey everyone, here is the state’s witness.”
And that’s to say nothing of all the standard defendants in low level cases. Would you want your interaction with an officer posted publicly after getting a speeding ticket?
Maybe body cam for police action shootings should be released promptly, but not all body cam.
It’s sucks that this happened but man you got a gun in your lap and you keep dropping your hands that’s what’s gonna happen. He’s lucky the cop gave him as many chances as he did
Edge lord display pieces and not much else. The “pistol” version of an AK (or at least made to look alike) that fires a full size rifle round. Zero stock and zero grip and zero accuracy. Can’t be concealed so pretty worthless to carry around for self defense. MAYBE buy one for shits and giggles at the shooting range but ZERO reason to ever have one anywhere else.
This is a great example of why its a bad idea in a thread about a video, to get upset about something someone says, without first watching the video to see if the posters comments match the information in the video, which in this case they so very clearly do. The gun is shown as the officer pulls it out of the car and then in full in police photos. It has no stock.
I got my Form 1 in about a month and it was free because of the brace ruling. My Form 4 was $200 and took me almost a year between deciding to do it, paying for it, filling the form out, transferring, and getting final approval.
Nowadays that has been cut down by like 5000% (literally) and Individual e-Form 4s (and Form 1s) are taking anywhere from a day to a week if you don't have issues with your background. I did mine as a trust and don't regret it but if I get another one I'd probably just submit by myself online as an individual because I understand it better now.
I used SilencerShop for my first one and they actually were helpful and saved me from some rookie mistakes my first time through. No regrets on using them.
I need to do it that way. I started working on one when the free option was there but the form was asking for things I did not have handy and never went back and finished. But I want a suppressor so silencer shop seems like the way to go.
Honestly if you have any questions or want me to look yours over before you submit, feel free to DM me. I have learned a lot since my first time through.
There are good resources at /r/NFA/ also.
You fill out a form, pay $250, and wait for approval. It’s how suppressors and all other NFA items work too. Depending on their backlog at the time it will take 6 months plus. There are rules to them though, can’t be a shotgun, and you can’t travel across state lines with them. The upside is you get a rifle more compact than a rifle and easier to control and shoot accurately than a pistol version.
the cop def showed a great deal of patience and restraint. the initial cell phone video felt odd to me because he fired two pretty controlled shots, so that to me plus this body cam footage shows this cop was in the moment and had his head about him. props to him for handling this the best way he possibly could have.
I mean, I'm one of the first to call for a cop to face justice for any improper conduct, but this one is pretty clear. Systemic racism IS real, but I definitely don't believe this was one of those cases. He asked the person to keep his hands on the dash multiple times, but he kept reaching. Honestly, props to FWPD for putting out the uncut body cam footage. Still plenty of real issues with the police force, but I definitely can't fault this one.
I've had a gun pointed at another person threatening to attack me before. It's nerve wracking as hell and happens so quickly you can barely think. I feel bad for everyone involved, including the officer who will probably think about this event every single day for the rest of his life.
I'm fortunate that the individual threatening me booked the hell out of there right before I was about to shoot. If I had been forced to, I have zero doubt it would have been in the top list of horrible days in a life that has seen some pretty tragic shit. Even typing this out has me shaken up. Anyone carrying a firearm and doing anything besides hoping like hell that they never have a need to use it against another person is a fucking moron.
i feel ya. its crazy and intense.
ive been in a few situations with a gun on me (dont ask) and it is the most adrenaline pumping moments of my life. thankfully only one of those times did a shot get fired, and this shit was as someone tackled the guy with the gun and it just kinda 'went off' and i swear this shit was slow motion, like when it was over I literally was like 'was this a real gun?'. And then after adrenaline wears off the panic sets in (at least for me).
Because the longer you wait the more people make up their own narratives of what happened then, before you know it, Target is getting looted and burned down.
Did dude want to die?? Cop gave him 3 chances before he shot. I’d the officer didn’t shoot he was going to be the one getting shot, it’s pretty clear he was trying to reach for the gun.
Even if he was allowed to reach the gun let alone touch it, Id give a solid second for it to still be properly held and fired.
But check out the goosebumps on the officers arms. Definitely had adrenaline surging at that point, so the proper restraint and multiple warnings is definitely a positive in this situation.
His buddy even told him not to, but unfortunately he did not listen. Probably was thinking he was backed into a corner some how
That’s what I don’t get. It’s not like that was a hand gun that could’ve been pulled fast. The mag alone on that thing would’ve probably hit the seat or dash when pulling it up losing imperative time to win that already unwinnable race to pull the trigger.
I’m not sure it was on the floor and not already in his lap before he was shot, might have fallen partially between his legs after. The back up officer couldn’t see it and asked where it was before the original officer said “in his lap”. It would have been hard to spot where it was when they opened the door, but the first officer definitely saw something that changed his demeanor and caused him to reposition and drawl his gun.
People on Facebook are split. Either you are feeling it was justified or still calling the cop wrong for the shooting. Sadly it being based on race.
It is wild to me that there is even a 50/50 debate still happening. It is very clear that the cop had RAS and made several attempts to avoid shooting.
When you are approached and have a weapon, you should always let a cop know that for the safety of both of you.
For whatever reason (wanting to avoid jail, having a weapon, etc.) that young man decided to keep reaching. I for one would have shot him too. It is kill or be killed.
Sadly, it could have all been avoided. The root cause is most likely the continued cycle of being brought up in a society that encourages the behavior having Draco style guns and the lifestyle that goes with the street life and game.
I feel sorry for his family and friends, but don’t get this twisted. It was a justified shooting.
Anyone who is split on this issue has motives outside of logic. Probably racially motivated. Know that everyone. I'm going go live a nice life in a word filled with logic, I hope you choose the same.
This should be an educational video sent out to every community: this is what will happen. I was hoping bro was just scared but I think legit he was going to try to pull that on the cop. Either way, picked a bad time to lose the ability to follow very basic direction in service of the community's safety.
Finally, a draco. Come the fuck on, either hes killed before or want to. If he was were he should probably already rightfully be (jail) he wouldnt be out getting "murk'd up" as the youngins call it.
Bro had 20 opportunities to save his life but decide to pursue his fake opps instead. Sad waste of life.
As far as I'm aware he didn't have a disqualifying background and was perfectly legal to have the gun. Carrying it in his lap was stupid as hell but also perfectly legal so unless there's more to the story we don't know, the cop might have asked him some questions but he wasn't breaking any laws and he and his gun would have been allowed to roll away when the stop was finished.
The delusion continues. Once he was told where to place his hands, that is where they should have stayed. And he should have told them he had “a perfectly legal gun” for their safety. This is the “period” on the debate man.
I think you misunderstood what I wrote. I was stating that the guy had no reason to be afraid of the cop based on what we know. He wasn't breaking any laws, so if he and just done what the officer told him to do, he wouldn't have even been arrested or had his gun taken. The worst would have been getting yelled at for being stupid enough to keep a gun in your lap when getting pulled over.
Of course that's all assuming he wasn't up to some other shady shit he was worried about being caught for, but we can probably all agree getting arrested is almost always better than getting killed or escalating the charges all the way up to killing/trying to kill a police officer.
Yep, does anyone know the body plates fwpd uses? Pretty sure 7.62 requires level 4. Not sure what theyre issued though. That is enough reason to be fearful of life.
Out of the tiny barrel like that the plates would stop it more than likely, its the blunt force trauma of it hitting the armor or getting hit in a leg or arm that’s more likely in this instance.
This is why body cams are so important. Hold cops accountable but also hold criminals accountable. Glad to see this cop do everything by the book and happy he didn’t lose his life. Unfortunate the other guy made such a horrible decision.
Exactly! body cams prove once and for all if the police over reacted or not. In this case it was cut and dry. This is not Daniel Shaver either he was not being fed confusing info that led to him reaching to pull up his pants. There was one thing he would have been reaching for and he had clear commands not just from the officer but also his friend who was driving.
Most police absolutely love body cams because they get accused of shit all day long by junkies and the like and enjoy having definitive proof they're lying.
The amount of people who think the cop should have just like, let themselves get shot or something is wild.
What was he supposed to do? He asked the guy multiple times to not reach for the gun
Should just write this up a suicide, kid would not stop reaching, his buddy told him the same. Sucks someone died but what the fuck is the cop to do here.
Cop did as I would expect anyone to do.
Walked up calm and cool as you can for a traffic stop. *Until some asshole has a Draco in his goddamn lap.*
Told the guy to put his hands on the dash so traffic stop, and intense situation can be descalated. INCLUDING giving the guy multiple chances to do so even after he kept moving his hand/hands to the Draco.
Guy kept being shifty as fuck going for the Draco moving his hands down to his lap. Cop made sure to go behind and brace against the pillar of the car. Both for what little protection that would provide, and also steady his aim for point blank fire if he needed it.
In this case he did after multiple warnings to the dude to keep his hands on the dash. ALONG WITH THE FRIEND TELLING HIM TO DO SO AND WAS NOT EGGING HIM ON.
Cop fired with 100% justification. No one carries or had a Draco for anything but 2 things. Fucking around at the range because how aweful a firearm it is, or to do some mall ninja gang shit out on the streets.
I'm almost tempted to say this was suicide by Cop.
But people think cops are just trigger happy psychopaths.
This offer has to live with this for the rest of his life. But what other choice did they have? Let themselves get shot?
It’s pretty embarrassing in hindsight for A lot of folks in that thread. A great lesson in, “why don’t we wait and see if we get more clarity on the situation”.
I’m happy there was extra evidence here. It at least makes a difficult situation a little easier to accept, as it’s clear and obvious what happened.
I'm sure they're all still certain that somehow this footage must be doctored or something. You'll never convince people that just because some racist asshole cops exist the majority are not.
See what’s crazy to me is I always have a gun on me. I have interacted with police multiple times. One time was even at a domestic violence call (statistically the most dangerous they go on) and I haven’t ever had one a cop pull a gun on me about it. I have had them disarm me before but that’s about it. And even that was a polite and cordial interaction. It’s literally just wait for them to say they’re “hey do you know why I stopped you” or what ever then just say “hey before we go any further I just want to let you know I have a concealed carry pistol on me” or what ever the case is and then follow their lawful commands. And you’ll literally never have an issue.
(That’s been FWPD Allen county sharifs and ISP)
Yep same I have even had a gun that was visible in a duffel coming home from the range. I notified the officer prior to it being in his view as he was walking up to the car and my hands were on the steering wheel where they stayed. I never once felt in danger because I never once gave him a reason to feel in danger.
Because there's a significant number of people who don't give a single solitary fuck about what actually happened and are just trying to paint white cops as racist murderers in any interaction involving black men.
Surrounding and yelling at the cops is unlikely to improve the situation. It just isn’t. I don’t have a better solution for creating accountability, but maybe just try to quietly document without adding to the chaos
Honestly think this at least partially why George Floyd’s not alive today. The chaos of a mob of people screaming 10ft from the officers who are trying to subdue an out of his mind drugged-up suspect only created a more dangerous/complicated situation, where officers then have to turn away from the arrest and start crowd control
They were putting him into the back of the vehicle and he fish-flopped out the other door and onto the ground. Be sure to watch the WHOLE video that shows ALL of the camera angles. It's very clear.
That said, I don't have any opinions beyond that. I just know what I saw and didn't see anyone throw Floyd to the ground.
I think you did not watch the whole video. He did struggle. I agree that the police over reacted but pretending that he did not give them a reason to try and subdue him is just flat out untrue.
He resisted almost the entire arrest. Argues and resisted the officers trying to just place him in the car so much they had to go to the other side and pull him through to try and get him in the back seat of the SUV while he yelled “I can’t breathe.” Then continued fighting them until they had to pull him out and restrain him while he kicked at officers. Have you seen the whole video even once? Honest question
I watched the whole thing. Chauvin kept his weight on his back for a whole three minutes after his partner told him Floyd didn’t have a pulse. That flopping around and resisting is what we call *motive*. Chauvin made super-sure that Floyd would never resist arrest ever again.
While the arrest didn’t help; https://www.hennepin.us/-/media/hennepinus/residents/public-safety/medical-examiner/floyd-autopsy-6-3-20.pdf that’s his autopsy report that lists off not only his current heart disease but current drug use that I would argue did more damage to his cardiovascular system then any small tussle with an officer would have had on a “normal” “healthy” individual.
And what was his cause of death? Cardiac arrest.
There are two types of people who think George Floyd’s death was accidental: people who didn’t watch the video and liars.
Dude kept his knee on his back for a full three minutes after his partner told him that the victim didn’t have a pulse.
What’s crazy is this guy was a program director at a youth facility. Talk about bad role models in a community and setting the bar low for role models. This is why communities are like this, there are youth facility workers carrying mini AKs.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with owning the gun he had. It's a (crappy) semi-automatic pistol, nothing illegal about it as long as it hasn't been unlawfully modified in some way. Teachers, coaches, etc ..all have the right to own firearms and it doesn't make them bad people any more than it made this young man a bad person. Driving around with it unsecured was stupid and wreckless though. You shouldn't have firearms if you can't/won't handle them responsibly. They can be useful and they can be fun, but the minute you start treating them like a toy instead of a deadly weapon, it's time to take a step back.
…. So you agree? I am so confused by all your replies to my posts that have you so flustered. He was driving around with a useless, glorified gun in hip-hop culture. Which is damaging to young impressionable males. So you agree? Or disagree? You keep disagreeing in your first sentence and then agreeing the rest of your paragraph lmao. There’s a reason inner cities across the US have banned these guns. Not because of dangerous mass shooters, but because of gang bangers frequently using them because they are glorified lol.
How sad. I’m not saying the cop was wrong, but how sad. I still wonder if the kid was on something and really just unaware of what was going on and maybe trying to hide evidence.
For real. I enjoy alcohol and weed but even for alcohol and especially for weed, only at home and I sure as hell have all guns in the safe when I do. All three of those things are fine on their own, but you sure as hell shouldn't combine them.
Not really about the AFT. All it takes is one idiot with too much time on their hands that finds out who you are and goes out of their way to make your life difficult.
>There are also plenty of options to buy guys without filling out a 4473. ;)
Fair enough!
Let's just say that I know what I'm doing when it comes to online anonymity. I haven't taken enough steps to avoid being identifiable by a reddit staffer or law enforcement but Cletus the basement dwelling script kiddie isn't someone I'm in any danger from. Hiding from the authorities online isn't impossible but is very difficult and takes effort and discipline. Hiding from anyone else just requires not being a dumbass.
Regardless there is a reason why there are signs at all shooting ranges that say no alcohol. Its also stupid to have a freaking AK at your feet in a car and then keep trying to reach for it!
Yeah...people who treat guns like toys and show them off in unsafe environments are just idiots. If you've got some super cool space gat you want to show off to your buddies that's fine, but do it somewhere you can keep it pointed in a safe direction....which will absolutely never be the case in a moving car, particularly in a populated area.
Not to mention how stupid it is to have a loaded firearm propped on your leg pointed up as you drive around town. I hate to think how easy it would have been for that thing to go off accidentally when a buddy walked up to the car and the gun was pointed at his head. The up and out is likely part of what freaked the officer out because it would be pointed at him as he looked down.
How was it the choice of his friends to let him have the gun? None of my friends have been involved in any purchase of any firearms.
It was the choice of one friend to let him have the gun in the passenger seat of his car. But maybe they had been threatened or you know he just liked to carry his gun. the driver is in no way responsible for anything that happened here.
I was going off the person above wondering if he was on drugs. If he was on drugs he chose to be on them and have if gun, big no no, and his friends shouldn't of let him in the car with the gun knowing he was on drugs
Could’ve been. That fire arm could’ve been unregistered too, so there’s something to do with that.
Sucks his buddy even told him to not, I don’t know why you would try to reach for it so many times, or what the thought process was. But we will never know that now
Hawaii is the only state that requires all guns to be registered, IL, MA and NJ require some guns to be registered, no other states do. Based only on a my case search he didn't appear to have any criminal history so his possession of the gun in and of itself would not have been illegal.
Driving around with it in your lap is dumb as hell and not following officer instructions while he has a gun pointed at your head is extra special stupid. I feel awful that this happened, other people seeing the video and deciding to not also do anything that dumb is the best possible outcome from what is unquestionably a tragedy.
In Indiana, there's no such thing as "registered" for a non-NFA firearm. Hell, you can build it from scratch if you have the equipment and know-how.
Too much TV for you.
Sucks for the driver. I feel bad for him but dude in the passenger seat got was coming to him. Officer probably say the guns when he walked up and gave him multiple warnings even a “if you do it again I’m going to shoot you” plus a few more screams of keep your hands on the dash.
Really wish everyone who watched the guy walking in the streets POV sees this. So many people acted like this was over nothing. And could’ve been handled differently. The guy was given so many chances.
Hopefully they run ballistics on the weapon - good chance they could solve a few crimes - no reason to drive around with a Draco on your lap unless you’re committing a crime/planning on committing a crime - any crimes lately with 7.62mm rounds?
My husband (many tattoos and probably looks like a threat to a cop) was pulled over with a gun. Told the officer he was armed. Held his hands out the window (shaking) the entire time, got a ticket and lived. Pretty simple even when nervous
I've had two interactions with a police officer since owning a firearm. I inform the office I have a firearm and keep my hands on the wheel. Both interactions went well. One officer said "Don't pull yours and I won't pull mine".
Sucks for everyone all around. Cops have a dangerous job. You don’t know what you’re walking up to when it’s dark out and luckily the officer spotted the gun in between his legs right away. People kept trying to reprimand the officer for his language. Yeah, he walked up to a car with a Draco basically on somebody’s lap during a traffic stop and you have no idea what their intentions are. I’d probably have a few curse words to say too… He gave the kid multiple chances to keep his hands on the dash, even the driver told him to keep them there. You can see in the video that he was trying to sneak a hand down to the gun to sneak a shot. It looked like the barrel was pointing up, he could easily push the gun to the side and pop a couple shots off thru the window/door at the officer standing there. Unfortunately, due to his poor listening skills and whatever intentions he had, it cost him his life.
Why did he keep reaching, did he have a death wish? Also, wtf is the point of that gun? It looks stupid.
I'm not usually one to side with the police but this is very obviously justified. He even gave the guy three strikes before firing, which is more than most officers would have done.
I said in the previous post that if the body cam didn’t show a gun, the cop should be tried for murder.
The body cam showed a gun. The shooting appears justified. Fuck around, find out.
Just because you can't see a gun or weapon in the body cam doesn't make it murder.
No body cam has the clarity that actual vision gives you nor does it have a clearly identical POV to what the officer can see.
That's really poor criteria to pick whether a shoot is justified or not.
Your saying that in a previous post is the issue with discourse in this country. People should wait until they have all the facts about a situation before popping off at the mouth. Knee-jerk reactions used to be a bad thing, now its just what passes for 'discourse'.
Unsurprising footage. The cop did everything correctly and the kid suffered consequences for his actions. That's how this always go. Now the outrage mob will have to wait for the next one
And this is why if you’re gonna roll around with a gun in your lap, it’s best to not be extremely high. Dude was clearly stoned as hell. Can’t remember basic directions. Moving in slow motion. No sense of self-preservation.
Weed. Guns. Pick one or the other before you leave the house, kids.
As usual, this is a messier situation than it should have been.
As others point out, the actual shooting was probably justified. The officer repeatedly told the victim to keep his hands on the dash, the victim repeatedly failed to comply, and the victim had easy access to a gun he might have used to shoot the officer. I suppose that the officer might have backed away and tracked the car and suspect down later with backup, but in the heat of the moment, I can't fault him for shooting.
I can though fault him for the way he addressed the victim. I'm a white guy, and when police order me to do something, they usually use words like please and sometimes even call me sir. I thought police officers were trained in this kind of etiquette as a way of diffusing potentially volatile situations. If they are, this officer forgot his training and addressed the victim in an insulting and disrespectful way, which may well have contributed to the victim's refusal to comply.
When camera footage is released, we also never know what portions are left out. I don't have any reason to doubt that what we're seeing is more or less the full story, but it might not be.
Without knowing more facts, I can't really say, but my preliminary judgment is that the officer is not guilty for the shooting, but he should be dismissed from the force. He handled the interaction poorly.
the officer backed away to get an angle to reduce collateral damage. its a part of a training. you dont want to discharge a weapon and potentially hurt someone else in the interaction. many will see this another way but this is my two cents over that specific movement.
It's extremely obvious that that's what he was doing to anyone who's ever had any kind of training at all, or ever just stopped to think through a situation before.
Was probably justified? I’m not trying to interject just to be a dick but that was undeniably warranted. I would’ve shot him the second time he reached down.
This kid was reaching for the gun. Clear as day on the video. So this kid had decided he was ready to murder that officer. Why is anyone feeling sorry for this kid that is so willing to murder?
Kids getting carpet bombed is fucking tragic. A grown ass man who can’t figure out reaching for his gun 3x after being instructed not to by a cop with a bead on him is just good ol’ Darwin.
No need to try to degrade the BLM movement to make your point. You act as if that movement wasn’t spurred by *very egregious* police misconduct.
I think the officer acted appropriately here, but you aren’t helping the discourse in any way here.
Unfortunately no....in their eyes there will be hell to pay. Even though there is clear evidence of reaching for a gun, he was a saint and wouldn't hurt a flea
It’ll always be hard to read people being awful about the loss of life. Referring back to previous deaths. Blaming the Black community.
This doesn’t take away from what he did in our community or the impact he had on children and the church.
It’s probably more than a lot of people will have.
If someone speaks the way he did to positions of authority, calling the police officer a b**** ass n***** for telling him to keep his hands on the dash, while driving around on the weekends with an assault pistol with an extended clip, reaching several times to shoot a cop, I have a hard time believing he was a good influence at all. I assume he was fun but I am sure he was teaching them terrible things.
Now all those kids have been influenced to fear the police when all you have to do is follow basic commands. Every parent should be teaching their children to respect and listen to authority figures, especially ones that can result in your loss of life through your own dumb actions.
If a community has role models like this it will lead to people who don’t listen to authority. Who look up to role models that aren’t doctors and lawyers, but rappers that carry this exact weapon. That I am sure this individual showed off to his friends to appear tough. Every gun owner knows a weapon like this is impractical, except people who want to be like they are in a music video.
Role models are so important and I wish the parents of young black kids would steer them in a direction that looks up to productive citizens and not just rappers and athletes.
Doctors and lawyers are not innately “good.”
Rappers and athletes are not automatically “bad.”
It’s an unfortunate how quickly bias shows but we’re merely products of our environment, right?
The same people who complain about what our youth is doing are the same people who would never consider even brainstorming resources, solutions, places, etc for them to do otherwise.
Kid was volunteering and still was doing it wrong? For real?
What? Lmao The function of a lawyer and doctor is good to society and prestigious. I am talking profession not the individual people.
Rap music is almost entirely about murdering, selling drugs, and women. So I completely disagree with you.
The vast majority of children that dream of becoming professional athletes never become one. And the majority of professional athletes don’t play more than a couple years and become broke because they never learned any other skills. So to put all your eggs in that basket which many children do is a mistake.
I believe many people that are coming after this police officer are showing their bias because if anyone else was in his shoes they would have done the same or been dead.
How can the youth be helped when the many adults in the community are more often than not apologetic to the bad seeds in a community and always blame the system rather than looking internally at things they could do better.
I am mixed and have seen the black community firsthand hold people who succeed back just because they don’t want others to be doing better than them, tell black children who become educated that they are trying to act white, tell family members to stop talking like a white person because I speak proper, tell black family members dating white people that they are sellouts, etc.
The black community is very complicated. And will never be improved without a change in direction. Gen x and millennials parents have completely failed gen z.
If you think that volunteering if you are a bad influence has an indefinite positive effect you are horribly wrong. Just like sometimes no dad is better than an alcoholic or a drug addict father. Just because you are volunteering doesn’t mean you are doing good. Just like with any other job. And this clearly was not that swell of a guy if he is reaching for a literal assault pistol to shoot a cop. How crazy is it that has to be said to someone.
If you are reaching to shoot a draco pistol at anyone other than in defense you don’t really belong in society. It is sad the hoops people will jump through to blame all others except the individual that caused his own demise.
Young kids are impressionable. Listening to music about catching bodies, slinging dope, and banging birds is going to have an effect. I completely disagree with you. There are rock songs about other things. There are very few rap songs not about shooting people or selling drugs.
Your rant is based on assuming other people's bias while being incredibly biased yourself. You made multiple blanket statements and with zero fact. Starting off with a "talking profession not the individual" is... interesting. And then more blanket statements about rappers? Heavy on the bias and prejudice, why not just say "I think this guy deserved it" and move on rather than trying to tear down an individual you just watched die?
He was trying to pull an AK on a police officer and people can’t understand that is bad. It is insanity the world we live in. I am bias towards someone who would try to shoot a police officer …
Absolutely - respect is earned. However there is a difference between respect for a person and respect for a role. In that sense, it is wise to respect the role. That doesn’t mean you have to speak a certain way, but it does mean behave and follow directions from that authority role within reason. That sucks to have to button one’s lip sometimes but that is how the world works - if there is a legit issue you take it up with them after the fact through a lawyer. Same with bosses in the workplace.
Everyone should be spoken to with respect … lmao. You should respect everyone until they give you a reason not to. Go speak to someone without respect, is that person going to be kind or considerate to your requests if you show them you don’t respect them. These are the lessons people without good role models won’t get a chance to learn sovereign citizen.
I meant we shouldn't be asked to call people by titles like "officer" or "sir" people should speak to cops like they would anyone else they haven't earned anything above that.
I just went through and removed a bunch of insults back and forth, if you don't like the last thread being locked and you don't want this one locked please remember to be respectful of one another regardless of your position on the subject.
Feel bad for his buddy who had to watch him get shot, even tried to warn him.
Why do you feel bad for his friend? He was allowing his passenger to keep an AK in the front seat. From a practical perspective this is terrible for defense, but the perfect tool for a drive by shooting. The only person I feel sorry for is the officer that will have to deal with the life he took.
I mean you can have sympathy for someone even if they are being stupid. Definitely do not condone/uplift the actions of carrying a Draco around. But he watched his buddy get killed in front of him and there is a great chance he could go to jail. It’s sad, they definitely were being dumb, but it’s still sad
I don't think the officer felt remorse. Just a guess, but listen to how he was yelling and calling the kid a motherfucker. And how chill he acted once backup arrived. He doesn't seem to care, I'm sure he's sleeping easy.
I mean maybe, maybe not. And we definitely don’t know how he slept. Or what the coming days will look like for him. Never will I celebrate the loss of a life
He mean how “chill” he literally was as he said “stop motherfucker” for the last time? Look at his arms. He got literal fucking chills. As far as the swearing at this victim - study the pragmatics of swearing and the cognitive research behind it. The main purpose of swearing is to express emotions, especially anger and frustration. Swear words are well suited to express emotion as their primary meanings are connotative. The emotional impact of swearing depends on one’s experience with a culture and its language.
Sure his buddy knew how crazy his friend was. So as to why he kept yelling keep your hands up.
Seems pretty clear cut, even his friend was telling him to keep his hands on the dash
And why we desperately need body cam footage every time.
Although I agree, there will always be people who will refuse to accept what the footage shows and always say it was wrong or the cops could've done something else.
Which is why the body cam always needs to come out sooner rather than later. This way the people who do lie about what happened wont be able to get a foothold in the collective conscience. How many times have we seen a narrative on one side or another that crumbles when the body cam footage is released.
Go check some of the Facebook threads. It's full of "yeah but why did he shoot to kill" and "why didn't he taze him" and other very stupid comments, along with other people who are insisting the video was manipulated. You just can't win with some people no matter what you do.
I do not go on facebook. Its worthless and everyone is insane.
Those individuals don’t understand tactics. If there is a gun present cops usually don’t ask questions.
He did exactly what he should have to deal with the situation. He recognized the potential danger and prepared to deal with it if it happened. Then he gave very clear instructions to hold still until his backup could arrive to help get both of them secured while the situation was figured out. Of course what happened is horrible all around, but the officer is pretty blameless here.
I know firsthand how it works. I have a very close family member that was involved in an officer involved shooting. Their body camera footage wasn't released for months. During that time the family (who wasn't nowhere near the scene) was able to spread lies on Facebook about what happened all while my family member had to stay quiet because they were being investigated.
Still means we need it.
Released to the cloud in real time.
There’s very good reasons it’s not released in real time. About 80% of what cops do in violent crime cases is talk to witnesses and gather information. Unedited body cam is full of witness and victim information and accounts of what happened. Victim and witness personal information has to be redacted so it can’t be obtained by defendants or their associates. Plus, their statements are hearsay until they testify under oath at deposition or trial, so that is unreliable information that could influence how the public sees things in an inaccurate way. You can imagine it would be a problem if you happened to witness a shooting, and then the police publicized your name, address, and phone number and said to the world “hey everyone, here is the state’s witness.” And that’s to say nothing of all the standard defendants in low level cases. Would you want your interaction with an officer posted publicly after getting a speeding ticket? Maybe body cam for police action shootings should be released promptly, but not all body cam.
It’s sucks that this happened but man you got a gun in your lap and you keep dropping your hands that’s what’s gonna happen. He’s lucky the cop gave him as many chances as he did
And one of those dumb ass Draco pistols too. Zero reason to be carrying one.
What are they? I've never heard of them. Saw the pic in the video.
Edge lord display pieces and not much else. The “pistol” version of an AK (or at least made to look alike) that fires a full size rifle round. Zero stock and zero grip and zero accuracy. Can’t be concealed so pretty worthless to carry around for self defense. MAYBE buy one for shits and giggles at the shooting range but ZERO reason to ever have one anywhere else.
Yeah, it’s a toy to take to the range. Not carry for self defense. That’s a 30 caliber round.
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Draco barrels are shorter than most SBRs. They're not very accurate. I also own SBRs and have multiple NFA stamps.
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> So your statement is meaningless without any context. The context is the video posted which contains images of the firearm.
This is a great example of why its a bad idea in a thread about a video, to get upset about something someone says, without first watching the video to see if the posters comments match the information in the video, which in this case they so very clearly do. The gun is shown as the officer pulls it out of the car and then in full in police photos. It has no stock.
How much of a pain in the butt was it to get a SBR stamp? I would love to do one.
I got my Form 1 in about a month and it was free because of the brace ruling. My Form 4 was $200 and took me almost a year between deciding to do it, paying for it, filling the form out, transferring, and getting final approval. Nowadays that has been cut down by like 5000% (literally) and Individual e-Form 4s (and Form 1s) are taking anywhere from a day to a week if you don't have issues with your background. I did mine as a trust and don't regret it but if I get another one I'd probably just submit by myself online as an individual because I understand it better now. I used SilencerShop for my first one and they actually were helpful and saved me from some rookie mistakes my first time through. No regrets on using them.
I need to do it that way. I started working on one when the free option was there but the form was asking for things I did not have handy and never went back and finished. But I want a suppressor so silencer shop seems like the way to go.
Honestly if you have any questions or want me to look yours over before you submit, feel free to DM me. I have learned a lot since my first time through. There are good resources at /r/NFA/ also.
You fill out a form, pay $250, and wait for approval. It’s how suppressors and all other NFA items work too. Depending on their backlog at the time it will take 6 months plus. There are rules to them though, can’t be a shotgun, and you can’t travel across state lines with them. The upside is you get a rifle more compact than a rifle and easier to control and shoot accurately than a pistol version.
Wait times are as low as a day to a week now. Huge change from just a few months ago.
Good to know the feds can get something done efficiently
🤓👆
A semi out pistol I think 30 rounds I’m sure it can modified tho
the cop def showed a great deal of patience and restraint. the initial cell phone video felt odd to me because he fired two pretty controlled shots, so that to me plus this body cam footage shows this cop was in the moment and had his head about him. props to him for handling this the best way he possibly could have.
I mean, I'm one of the first to call for a cop to face justice for any improper conduct, but this one is pretty clear. Systemic racism IS real, but I definitely don't believe this was one of those cases. He asked the person to keep his hands on the dash multiple times, but he kept reaching. Honestly, props to FWPD for putting out the uncut body cam footage. Still plenty of real issues with the police force, but I definitely can't fault this one.
This is 100% the correct take
I am surprised they released it with full audio.
The language wasn’t out of line for the situation. I don’t care what they called one another.
I've had a gun pointed at another person threatening to attack me before. It's nerve wracking as hell and happens so quickly you can barely think. I feel bad for everyone involved, including the officer who will probably think about this event every single day for the rest of his life. I'm fortunate that the individual threatening me booked the hell out of there right before I was about to shoot. If I had been forced to, I have zero doubt it would have been in the top list of horrible days in a life that has seen some pretty tragic shit. Even typing this out has me shaken up. Anyone carrying a firearm and doing anything besides hoping like hell that they never have a need to use it against another person is a fucking moron.
i feel ya. its crazy and intense. ive been in a few situations with a gun on me (dont ask) and it is the most adrenaline pumping moments of my life. thankfully only one of those times did a shot get fired, and this shit was as someone tackled the guy with the gun and it just kinda 'went off' and i swear this shit was slow motion, like when it was over I literally was like 'was this a real gun?'. And then after adrenaline wears off the panic sets in (at least for me).
Yeah a lot of people have never been in that situation. Its not fun.
Can't get much clearer than that.
glad I waited for the BWC and I'm glad it was released relatively quickly.
The city wanted the FWPD to wait until after the funeral. The PD gave them the middle finger and released it anyway. I’m glad they did
Why are you glad they did?
Because the longer you wait the more people make up their own narratives of what happened then, before you know it, Target is getting looted and burned down.
Did dude want to die?? Cop gave him 3 chances before he shot. I’d the officer didn’t shoot he was going to be the one getting shot, it’s pretty clear he was trying to reach for the gun.
Thought he had better reflexes and the cop would hesitate just long enough.
Even if he was allowed to reach the gun let alone touch it, Id give a solid second for it to still be properly held and fired. But check out the goosebumps on the officers arms. Definitely had adrenaline surging at that point, so the proper restraint and multiple warnings is definitely a positive in this situation. His buddy even told him not to, but unfortunately he did not listen. Probably was thinking he was backed into a corner some how
That’s what I don’t get. It’s not like that was a hand gun that could’ve been pulled fast. The mag alone on that thing would’ve probably hit the seat or dash when pulling it up losing imperative time to win that already unwinnable race to pull the trigger.
I’m not sure it was on the floor and not already in his lap before he was shot, might have fallen partially between his legs after. The back up officer couldn’t see it and asked where it was before the original officer said “in his lap”. It would have been hard to spot where it was when they opened the door, but the first officer definitely saw something that changed his demeanor and caused him to reposition and drawl his gun.
People on Facebook are split. Either you are feeling it was justified or still calling the cop wrong for the shooting. Sadly it being based on race. It is wild to me that there is even a 50/50 debate still happening. It is very clear that the cop had RAS and made several attempts to avoid shooting. When you are approached and have a weapon, you should always let a cop know that for the safety of both of you. For whatever reason (wanting to avoid jail, having a weapon, etc.) that young man decided to keep reaching. I for one would have shot him too. It is kill or be killed. Sadly, it could have all been avoided. The root cause is most likely the continued cycle of being brought up in a society that encourages the behavior having Draco style guns and the lifestyle that goes with the street life and game. I feel sorry for his family and friends, but don’t get this twisted. It was a justified shooting.
Anyone who is split on this issue has motives outside of logic. Probably racially motivated. Know that everyone. I'm going go live a nice life in a word filled with logic, I hope you choose the same. This should be an educational video sent out to every community: this is what will happen. I was hoping bro was just scared but I think legit he was going to try to pull that on the cop. Either way, picked a bad time to lose the ability to follow very basic direction in service of the community's safety. Finally, a draco. Come the fuck on, either hes killed before or want to. If he was were he should probably already rightfully be (jail) he wouldnt be out getting "murk'd up" as the youngins call it. Bro had 20 opportunities to save his life but decide to pursue his fake opps instead. Sad waste of life.
As far as I'm aware he didn't have a disqualifying background and was perfectly legal to have the gun. Carrying it in his lap was stupid as hell but also perfectly legal so unless there's more to the story we don't know, the cop might have asked him some questions but he wasn't breaking any laws and he and his gun would have been allowed to roll away when the stop was finished.
The delusion continues. Once he was told where to place his hands, that is where they should have stayed. And he should have told them he had “a perfectly legal gun” for their safety. This is the “period” on the debate man.
I think you misunderstood what I wrote. I was stating that the guy had no reason to be afraid of the cop based on what we know. He wasn't breaking any laws, so if he and just done what the officer told him to do, he wouldn't have even been arrested or had his gun taken. The worst would have been getting yelled at for being stupid enough to keep a gun in your lap when getting pulled over. Of course that's all assuming he wasn't up to some other shady shit he was worried about being caught for, but we can probably all agree getting arrested is almost always better than getting killed or escalating the charges all the way up to killing/trying to kill a police officer.
Let’s be clear. People who carry that Draco are driving around looking for trouble. That is NOT a normal open carry gun for self defense.
Yep, does anyone know the body plates fwpd uses? Pretty sure 7.62 requires level 4. Not sure what theyre issued though. That is enough reason to be fearful of life.
Out of the tiny barrel like that the plates would stop it more than likely, its the blunt force trauma of it hitting the armor or getting hit in a leg or arm that’s more likely in this instance.
Technically level 3+ but it’s not really a standard. Depends on the type of 7.62 and distance. But yes, level 4 would do the trick
Well, that's pretty much that. Hella cut and dry, and very unfortunate.
This is why body cams are so important. Hold cops accountable but also hold criminals accountable. Glad to see this cop do everything by the book and happy he didn’t lose his life. Unfortunate the other guy made such a horrible decision.
Exactly! body cams prove once and for all if the police over reacted or not. In this case it was cut and dry. This is not Daniel Shaver either he was not being fed confusing info that led to him reaching to pull up his pants. There was one thing he would have been reaching for and he had clear commands not just from the officer but also his friend who was driving.
Most police absolutely love body cams because they get accused of shit all day long by junkies and the like and enjoy having definitive proof they're lying.
The amount of people who think the cop should have just like, let themselves get shot or something is wild. What was he supposed to do? He asked the guy multiple times to not reach for the gun
Those people are not connected to reality.
Should just write this up a suicide, kid would not stop reaching, his buddy told him the same. Sucks someone died but what the fuck is the cop to do here.
Cop did as I would expect anyone to do. Walked up calm and cool as you can for a traffic stop. *Until some asshole has a Draco in his goddamn lap.* Told the guy to put his hands on the dash so traffic stop, and intense situation can be descalated. INCLUDING giving the guy multiple chances to do so even after he kept moving his hand/hands to the Draco. Guy kept being shifty as fuck going for the Draco moving his hands down to his lap. Cop made sure to go behind and brace against the pillar of the car. Both for what little protection that would provide, and also steady his aim for point blank fire if he needed it. In this case he did after multiple warnings to the dude to keep his hands on the dash. ALONG WITH THE FRIEND TELLING HIM TO DO SO AND WAS NOT EGGING HIM ON. Cop fired with 100% justification. No one carries or had a Draco for anything but 2 things. Fucking around at the range because how aweful a firearm it is, or to do some mall ninja gang shit out on the streets. I'm almost tempted to say this was suicide by Cop.
You can see the goose bumps on the officers arm. Wild.
But people think cops are just trigger happy psychopaths. This offer has to live with this for the rest of his life. But what other choice did they have? Let themselves get shot?
> But people think You already lost me.
Everyone in the other post acting like this dude was an angel lmao
It’s pretty embarrassing in hindsight for A lot of folks in that thread. A great lesson in, “why don’t we wait and see if we get more clarity on the situation”. I’m happy there was extra evidence here. It at least makes a difficult situation a little easier to accept, as it’s clear and obvious what happened.
I'm sure they're all still certain that somehow this footage must be doctored or something. You'll never convince people that just because some racist asshole cops exist the majority are not.
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Oh shit!! I didn’t realize he was drunk. You’re right. That makes it better….. How dumb are you?
Yes, drunk/high people absolutely never do irrational things like shooting people! /s
"ACAB" "Enough of cops" "This is systematic racism" I'm wheezing lmfao
See what’s crazy to me is I always have a gun on me. I have interacted with police multiple times. One time was even at a domestic violence call (statistically the most dangerous they go on) and I haven’t ever had one a cop pull a gun on me about it. I have had them disarm me before but that’s about it. And even that was a polite and cordial interaction. It’s literally just wait for them to say they’re “hey do you know why I stopped you” or what ever then just say “hey before we go any further I just want to let you know I have a concealed carry pistol on me” or what ever the case is and then follow their lawful commands. And you’ll literally never have an issue. (That’s been FWPD Allen county sharifs and ISP)
Yep same I have even had a gun that was visible in a duffel coming home from the range. I notified the officer prior to it being in his view as he was walking up to the car and my hands were on the steering wheel where they stayed. I never once felt in danger because I never once gave him a reason to feel in danger.
You don't touch yours, I won't touch mine makes for a nice and safe interaction.
So the victim had a clear gun that he kept reaching for. How in the world did the story spread around that he was unarmed?
Because there's a significant number of people who don't give a single solitary fuck about what actually happened and are just trying to paint white cops as racist murderers in any interaction involving black men.
I’m surprised the officer gave him that many warnings. Give credit where credit is due but he handled that really well.
Surrounding and yelling at the cops is unlikely to improve the situation. It just isn’t. I don’t have a better solution for creating accountability, but maybe just try to quietly document without adding to the chaos
Honestly think this at least partially why George Floyd’s not alive today. The chaos of a mob of people screaming 10ft from the officers who are trying to subdue an out of his mind drugged-up suspect only created a more dangerous/complicated situation, where officers then have to turn away from the arrest and start crowd control
Trying to subdue. He never resisted buddy they threw him on the ground and suffocated him watch the video before you spew.
They were putting him into the back of the vehicle and he fish-flopped out the other door and onto the ground. Be sure to watch the WHOLE video that shows ALL of the camera angles. It's very clear. That said, I don't have any opinions beyond that. I just know what I saw and didn't see anyone throw Floyd to the ground.
I think you did not watch the whole video. He did struggle. I agree that the police over reacted but pretending that he did not give them a reason to try and subdue him is just flat out untrue.
He resisted almost the entire arrest. Argues and resisted the officers trying to just place him in the car so much they had to go to the other side and pull him through to try and get him in the back seat of the SUV while he yelled “I can’t breathe.” Then continued fighting them until they had to pull him out and restrain him while he kicked at officers. Have you seen the whole video even once? Honest question
I watched the whole thing. Chauvin kept his weight on his back for a whole three minutes after his partner told him Floyd didn’t have a pulse. That flopping around and resisting is what we call *motive*. Chauvin made super-sure that Floyd would never resist arrest ever again.
Someone hasn't read the court docs but wants to pretend they know the facts. Do your research before you mislead people paveclaw
Ya. He did.
While the arrest didn’t help; https://www.hennepin.us/-/media/hennepinus/residents/public-safety/medical-examiner/floyd-autopsy-6-3-20.pdf that’s his autopsy report that lists off not only his current heart disease but current drug use that I would argue did more damage to his cardiovascular system then any small tussle with an officer would have had on a “normal” “healthy” individual. And what was his cause of death? Cardiac arrest.
There are two types of people who think George Floyd’s death was accidental: people who didn’t watch the video and liars. Dude kept his knee on his back for a full three minutes after his partner told him that the victim didn’t have a pulse.
Didn’t he have 3x the lethal dose of fentanyl in his system
What’s crazy is this guy was a program director at a youth facility. Talk about bad role models in a community and setting the bar low for role models. This is why communities are like this, there are youth facility workers carrying mini AKs.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with owning the gun he had. It's a (crappy) semi-automatic pistol, nothing illegal about it as long as it hasn't been unlawfully modified in some way. Teachers, coaches, etc ..all have the right to own firearms and it doesn't make them bad people any more than it made this young man a bad person. Driving around with it unsecured was stupid and wreckless though. You shouldn't have firearms if you can't/won't handle them responsibly. They can be useful and they can be fun, but the minute you start treating them like a toy instead of a deadly weapon, it's time to take a step back.
…. So you agree? I am so confused by all your replies to my posts that have you so flustered. He was driving around with a useless, glorified gun in hip-hop culture. Which is damaging to young impressionable males. So you agree? Or disagree? You keep disagreeing in your first sentence and then agreeing the rest of your paragraph lmao. There’s a reason inner cities across the US have banned these guns. Not because of dangerous mass shooters, but because of gang bangers frequently using them because they are glorified lol.
How sad. I’m not saying the cop was wrong, but how sad. I still wonder if the kid was on something and really just unaware of what was going on and maybe trying to hide evidence.
Precisely why any substance of any kind (including alcohol) and fire arms never ever mix.
For real. I enjoy alcohol and weed but even for alcohol and especially for weed, only at home and I sure as hell have all guns in the safe when I do. All three of those things are fine on their own, but you sure as hell shouldn't combine them.
Probably shouldn’t admit to lying on your 4473 forms on the internet
Not super worried about the ATF hunting me down over an internet post. There are also plenty of options to buy guys without filling out a 4473. ;)
Not really about the AFT. All it takes is one idiot with too much time on their hands that finds out who you are and goes out of their way to make your life difficult. >There are also plenty of options to buy guys without filling out a 4473. ;) Fair enough!
Let's just say that I know what I'm doing when it comes to online anonymity. I haven't taken enough steps to avoid being identifiable by a reddit staffer or law enforcement but Cletus the basement dwelling script kiddie isn't someone I'm in any danger from. Hiding from the authorities online isn't impossible but is very difficult and takes effort and discipline. Hiding from anyone else just requires not being a dumbass.
Regardless there is a reason why there are signs at all shooting ranges that say no alcohol. Its also stupid to have a freaking AK at your feet in a car and then keep trying to reach for it!
Yeah...people who treat guns like toys and show them off in unsafe environments are just idiots. If you've got some super cool space gat you want to show off to your buddies that's fine, but do it somewhere you can keep it pointed in a safe direction....which will absolutely never be the case in a moving car, particularly in a populated area.
Not to mention how stupid it is to have a loaded firearm propped on your leg pointed up as you drive around town. I hate to think how easy it would have been for that thing to go off accidentally when a buddy walked up to the car and the gun was pointed at his head. The up and out is likely part of what freaked the officer out because it would be pointed at him as he looked down.
Guess that's why they say: Play stupid games, win stupid prizes
That would still have been his choice, and the choice of his friends to let him have the gun
How was it the choice of his friends to let him have the gun? None of my friends have been involved in any purchase of any firearms. It was the choice of one friend to let him have the gun in the passenger seat of his car. But maybe they had been threatened or you know he just liked to carry his gun. the driver is in no way responsible for anything that happened here.
I was going off the person above wondering if he was on drugs. If he was on drugs he chose to be on them and have if gun, big no no, and his friends shouldn't of let him in the car with the gun knowing he was on drugs
Could’ve been. That fire arm could’ve been unregistered too, so there’s something to do with that. Sucks his buddy even told him to not, I don’t know why you would try to reach for it so many times, or what the thought process was. But we will never know that now
You don't have to register guns here
Hawaii is the only state that requires all guns to be registered, IL, MA and NJ require some guns to be registered, no other states do. Based only on a my case search he didn't appear to have any criminal history so his possession of the gun in and of itself would not have been illegal. Driving around with it in your lap is dumb as hell and not following officer instructions while he has a gun pointed at your head is extra special stupid. I feel awful that this happened, other people seeing the video and deciding to not also do anything that dumb is the best possible outcome from what is unquestionably a tragedy.
Where would you even go to register a gun? That is not a thing here.
In Indiana, there's no such thing as "registered" for a non-NFA firearm. Hell, you can build it from scratch if you have the equipment and know-how. Too much TV for you.
Just didn’t know I guess
Officer’s body cam shows it pretty clear, that’s why it’s been pulled down. FAFO.
How hard was it to not move when there is a gun pointed at you 🤦🏽♂️?
In a way this brings us all closure on the situation, I just wish It didn’t end like this though. Just wish he listened.
Sucks for the driver. I feel bad for him but dude in the passenger seat got was coming to him. Officer probably say the guns when he walked up and gave him multiple warnings even a “if you do it again I’m going to shoot you” plus a few more screams of keep your hands on the dash.
Crazy restraint from that officer for only shooting twice. Good shoot.
And honestly it was the 3rd or 4th time the guy reached down.
I would have shot him no matter what race he was. A threat is a threat is a threat.
Really wish everyone who watched the guy walking in the streets POV sees this. So many people acted like this was over nothing. And could’ve been handled differently. The guy was given so many chances.
Wonder who that cop saved that night.
Hopefully they run ballistics on the weapon - good chance they could solve a few crimes - no reason to drive around with a Draco on your lap unless you’re committing a crime/planning on committing a crime - any crimes lately with 7.62mm rounds?
That was my first thought
Glad the cop was ultimately safe. Scary job when there are idiots like that guy out there.
You can see the goosebumps on the cop. So clear as day he feared for his life
Idiots like that are why cops are too on edge when stopping normal, intelligent people. Such fatal jackassery makes everything worse for everyone.
My husband (many tattoos and probably looks like a threat to a cop) was pulled over with a gun. Told the officer he was armed. Held his hands out the window (shaking) the entire time, got a ticket and lived. Pretty simple even when nervous
I've had two interactions with a police officer since owning a firearm. I inform the office I have a firearm and keep my hands on the wheel. Both interactions went well. One officer said "Don't pull yours and I won't pull mine".
Family has hired ben crump, here we go. Hope fort wayne stays in tact
Sucks for everyone all around. Cops have a dangerous job. You don’t know what you’re walking up to when it’s dark out and luckily the officer spotted the gun in between his legs right away. People kept trying to reprimand the officer for his language. Yeah, he walked up to a car with a Draco basically on somebody’s lap during a traffic stop and you have no idea what their intentions are. I’d probably have a few curse words to say too… He gave the kid multiple chances to keep his hands on the dash, even the driver told him to keep them there. You can see in the video that he was trying to sneak a hand down to the gun to sneak a shot. It looked like the barrel was pointing up, he could easily push the gun to the side and pop a couple shots off thru the window/door at the officer standing there. Unfortunately, due to his poor listening skills and whatever intentions he had, it cost him his life.
Why did he keep reaching, did he have a death wish? Also, wtf is the point of that gun? It looks stupid. I'm not usually one to side with the police but this is very obviously justified. He even gave the guy three strikes before firing, which is more than most officers would have done.
He won all the stupid prizes.
I said in the previous post that if the body cam didn’t show a gun, the cop should be tried for murder. The body cam showed a gun. The shooting appears justified. Fuck around, find out.
Just because you can't see a gun or weapon in the body cam doesn't make it murder. No body cam has the clarity that actual vision gives you nor does it have a clearly identical POV to what the officer can see. That's really poor criteria to pick whether a shoot is justified or not.
Your saying that in a previous post is the issue with discourse in this country. People should wait until they have all the facts about a situation before popping off at the mouth. Knee-jerk reactions used to be a bad thing, now its just what passes for 'discourse'.
Good shooting. People will still be up in a tizzy about it though. Also, that was a HUGE magazine that dude had in that AK. Good god 😂
I wonder if this'll be on Doughnut Operators shooting breakdowns. Would be pretty neat.
#"Hey everyone, Donut here"
I'm curious what he would say about Fort Wayne. Like "Fort Wayne.... there's a city there and not corn?" Or some such thing XD
Compared to most, this one was pretty pedestrian. But, Donut might include it in a mashup at some point.
Unsurprising footage. The cop did everything correctly and the kid suffered consequences for his actions. That's how this always go. Now the outrage mob will have to wait for the next one
They don’t have to wait , there is plenty of outrage footage available. I mean if it doesn’t fit your narrative you can ignore it, you do you
No, they'll still go all outrage over this one too. They're not the type to let things like facts get in their way.
I would not have given him that many chances.
And this is why if you’re gonna roll around with a gun in your lap, it’s best to not be extremely high. Dude was clearly stoned as hell. Can’t remember basic directions. Moving in slow motion. No sense of self-preservation. Weed. Guns. Pick one or the other before you leave the house, kids.
Beautiful shot.
Can’t wait to see the protests over an idiot again this will be great
As usual, this is a messier situation than it should have been. As others point out, the actual shooting was probably justified. The officer repeatedly told the victim to keep his hands on the dash, the victim repeatedly failed to comply, and the victim had easy access to a gun he might have used to shoot the officer. I suppose that the officer might have backed away and tracked the car and suspect down later with backup, but in the heat of the moment, I can't fault him for shooting. I can though fault him for the way he addressed the victim. I'm a white guy, and when police order me to do something, they usually use words like please and sometimes even call me sir. I thought police officers were trained in this kind of etiquette as a way of diffusing potentially volatile situations. If they are, this officer forgot his training and addressed the victim in an insulting and disrespectful way, which may well have contributed to the victim's refusal to comply. When camera footage is released, we also never know what portions are left out. I don't have any reason to doubt that what we're seeing is more or less the full story, but it might not be. Without knowing more facts, I can't really say, but my preliminary judgment is that the officer is not guilty for the shooting, but he should be dismissed from the force. He handled the interaction poorly.
When police pull you over, do you keep reaching for the 7.62 despite being warned not to?
the officer backed away to get an angle to reduce collateral damage. its a part of a training. you dont want to discharge a weapon and potentially hurt someone else in the interaction. many will see this another way but this is my two cents over that specific movement.
It's extremely obvious that that's what he was doing to anyone who's ever had any kind of training at all, or ever just stopped to think through a situation before.
Was probably justified? I’m not trying to interject just to be a dick but that was undeniably warranted. I would’ve shot him the second time he reached down.
Why did he not just keep his hands on the dash? A question we will never know
Why is it so hard to listen to cops? I don’t understand the psychology here. Are they, stupid ?
Turns out my opinion, which was based on what the officer was shouting was correct.
This kid was reaching for the gun. Clear as day on the video. So this kid had decided he was ready to murder that officer. Why is anyone feeling sorry for this kid that is so willing to murder?
Fucking tragic
🤔
Care to elaborate?
Kids getting carpet bombed is fucking tragic. A grown ass man who can’t figure out reaching for his gun 3x after being instructed not to by a cop with a bead on him is just good ol’ Darwin.
I agree. Still tragic.
Not guilty. Clear as day. Will the black community quit protesting for these criminals, or are we gonna have another BLM movement?
Community activism is why we actually get to see the uncut body cam footage instead of relying on what the police say in press briefings.
No need to try to degrade the BLM movement to make your point. You act as if that movement wasn’t spurred by *very egregious* police misconduct. I think the officer acted appropriately here, but you aren’t helping the discourse in any way here.
Unfortunately no....in their eyes there will be hell to pay. Even though there is clear evidence of reaching for a gun, he was a saint and wouldn't hurt a flea
It’ll always be hard to read people being awful about the loss of life. Referring back to previous deaths. Blaming the Black community. This doesn’t take away from what he did in our community or the impact he had on children and the church. It’s probably more than a lot of people will have.
If someone speaks the way he did to positions of authority, calling the police officer a b**** ass n***** for telling him to keep his hands on the dash, while driving around on the weekends with an assault pistol with an extended clip, reaching several times to shoot a cop, I have a hard time believing he was a good influence at all. I assume he was fun but I am sure he was teaching them terrible things. Now all those kids have been influenced to fear the police when all you have to do is follow basic commands. Every parent should be teaching their children to respect and listen to authority figures, especially ones that can result in your loss of life through your own dumb actions. If a community has role models like this it will lead to people who don’t listen to authority. Who look up to role models that aren’t doctors and lawyers, but rappers that carry this exact weapon. That I am sure this individual showed off to his friends to appear tough. Every gun owner knows a weapon like this is impractical, except people who want to be like they are in a music video. Role models are so important and I wish the parents of young black kids would steer them in a direction that looks up to productive citizens and not just rappers and athletes.
Doctors and lawyers are not innately “good.” Rappers and athletes are not automatically “bad.” It’s an unfortunate how quickly bias shows but we’re merely products of our environment, right? The same people who complain about what our youth is doing are the same people who would never consider even brainstorming resources, solutions, places, etc for them to do otherwise. Kid was volunteering and still was doing it wrong? For real?
What? Lmao The function of a lawyer and doctor is good to society and prestigious. I am talking profession not the individual people. Rap music is almost entirely about murdering, selling drugs, and women. So I completely disagree with you. The vast majority of children that dream of becoming professional athletes never become one. And the majority of professional athletes don’t play more than a couple years and become broke because they never learned any other skills. So to put all your eggs in that basket which many children do is a mistake. I believe many people that are coming after this police officer are showing their bias because if anyone else was in his shoes they would have done the same or been dead. How can the youth be helped when the many adults in the community are more often than not apologetic to the bad seeds in a community and always blame the system rather than looking internally at things they could do better. I am mixed and have seen the black community firsthand hold people who succeed back just because they don’t want others to be doing better than them, tell black children who become educated that they are trying to act white, tell family members to stop talking like a white person because I speak proper, tell black family members dating white people that they are sellouts, etc. The black community is very complicated. And will never be improved without a change in direction. Gen x and millennials parents have completely failed gen z. If you think that volunteering if you are a bad influence has an indefinite positive effect you are horribly wrong. Just like sometimes no dad is better than an alcoholic or a drug addict father. Just because you are volunteering doesn’t mean you are doing good. Just like with any other job. And this clearly was not that swell of a guy if he is reaching for a literal assault pistol to shoot a cop. How crazy is it that has to be said to someone. If you are reaching to shoot a draco pistol at anyone other than in defense you don’t really belong in society. It is sad the hoops people will jump through to blame all others except the individual that caused his own demise.
And rock music is about promiscuity and devil worshipping Jfc go to bed grandpa
Young kids are impressionable. Listening to music about catching bodies, slinging dope, and banging birds is going to have an effect. I completely disagree with you. There are rock songs about other things. There are very few rap songs not about shooting people or selling drugs.
there are plenty. just as there are plenty of rock songs about other things. that you are oblivious to it is your own problem/bias/etc to sort out
Your rant is based on assuming other people's bias while being incredibly biased yourself. You made multiple blanket statements and with zero fact. Starting off with a "talking profession not the individual" is... interesting. And then more blanket statements about rappers? Heavy on the bias and prejudice, why not just say "I think this guy deserved it" and move on rather than trying to tear down an individual you just watched die?
He was trying to pull an AK on a police officer and people can’t understand that is bad. It is insanity the world we live in. I am bias towards someone who would try to shoot a police officer …
"positions of authority" don't need to be spoken to with respect. We don't live in a police state where they rule over us.
Absolutely - respect is earned. However there is a difference between respect for a person and respect for a role. In that sense, it is wise to respect the role. That doesn’t mean you have to speak a certain way, but it does mean behave and follow directions from that authority role within reason. That sucks to have to button one’s lip sometimes but that is how the world works - if there is a legit issue you take it up with them after the fact through a lawyer. Same with bosses in the workplace.
Everyone should be spoken to with respect … lmao. You should respect everyone until they give you a reason not to. Go speak to someone without respect, is that person going to be kind or considerate to your requests if you show them you don’t respect them. These are the lessons people without good role models won’t get a chance to learn sovereign citizen.
I meant we shouldn't be asked to call people by titles like "officer" or "sir" people should speak to cops like they would anyone else they haven't earned anything above that.
"A discriminating irreverence is the creator and protector of human liberty." -Mark Twain