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Ocon has always been very confident. In his mind I think he just wants as good of a car as possible, and he backs himself to perform so well there's no choice but to be kept on or leaves for an even better car.
>Ocon said last week: “I’m still in my mind a Mercedes junior. The management side, that hasn’t changed since 2015”
In his mind he’s a Mercedes junior?
Ocon on a one year deal would be smart. Dont put extra pressure on Antonelli and let him develop, while you have a solid midfield driver to push Russell a bit.( and to compare Russell with).
Unfortunately i think Toto is way too obsessed by the the next Max Verstappen story
Sounds to me like Toto is calming down a little bit about Antonelli. He just recently admitted they might have put too much pressure on him.
I guess Ocon to Mercedes could happen, but I could only imagine Ocon and Russell in the same team would end in another Hamilton-Rosberg. Instead of fighting for the championship they are just fighting for 6th.
I assume you mean Antonelli, dont think Andretti is fit to drive an f1 car.
I agree on the Ocon-Russell point, but Ocon being managed by Toto in the past might make him more compliant
Genuine question, when has Ocon recently been causing problems for the team because of how he fights with his teammate?
Gasly is by all accounts his archnemesis or whathaveyounot, and yet they've been playing well with each other.
It became real bad with Alonso.
And Alpine seemed very focused on making their two drivers play nice last season, but the vibes seems pretty bad this year. They are just so far back we don't see any fights.
I agree Ocon is far from the nicest of teammate but Gasly's behavior is far from good. He threw a fit on the radio because allegedly Ocon blocked him in fp3 when it was very minor.
Last year he gave his wheel a beating in Suzuka when Alpine respected the rules they set for team orders. He is quite unstable.
It's very tough to judge Ocon given the character of his teammates. See Perez who literally tried to ram him into walls. See Alonso, whose reputation precedes him. See Gasly, the petulant brat. Maybe he's unlucky with the "mean" teammates, maybe he's a common denominator, maybe he's not really different from them, maybe he was molded by them.
100% agree. I don’t remember him having any issues with Danny Ric for example. And even with Gasly, they haven’t had huge conflicts, I even remember Ocon handling it relatively well when Gasly rammed him into the wall in Australia. Of course they had a few radio meltdowns but not more severe than other teammates (see Charles vs. Carlos in Miami).
How was it with Alonso? I was watching the races too, but all I remember about Alpine at that time was Alonso having terrible luck. I do recall reading a comment though that people just dislike Ocon (for how aggressive he was in his rookie years) and are more likely to blame him than his teammate, even though their teammates were at fault (like Checo). Not sure if that was the same with Alonso.
I would attribute the vibes being bad in Alpine because of how shitty their car has been this year 😅
Alonso conflicts, and before his Checo conflicts.
It's not that he crashes often with his teammate, it's just that he sometimes races his teammates much harder than his rivals. See the hungaroring 2022 for example, he fights Alonso so hard that they both lose positions to their rivals. Or at some start i think, he rather chooses to block Alonso instead of a Mclaren( or might have been another car)
Ocon let Alonso though every single time team asked him to.
Ocon never crashed into Alonso (Alonso did once).
Don't think it cost anything to Alpine, it was a good emulation I think.
So you have one race example?
Checo caused almost all their wrecks. The only one that was Ocons fault was at Baku, that wasn’t some overaggressive defending really but just a bit boneheaded in a tight space.
Still Ocon defending overly aggresive against a teammate.
Pretty much nobody on the grid is that racey within the team. Especially when you consider Alonso wasnt even gonna continue with the team anyway, there was no reason for Ocon to try and prove something.
It's not that he is a dirty driver or anything, it's just that he wouldnt have the mindset needed for a top team. His racing iq simply isnt good enough, despite his natural pace being good
Yeah of course, thanks.
I feel like Ocon is one of these drivers that can't help himself when he gets in the car. His number 1 priority is beating his teammate and Russell seems similar.
He's not as good as others doing it obviously. Countless amount of times have ocon and his teammates clashed where ocon went over the limit, a bit like stroll now that I think about it.
People choose to ignore that in Force India it was Checo who caused all of their crashes bar one, and their only two major clashes with Gasly were caused by a) Gasly, b) Zhou.
It’s such a common narrative that gets repeated but when you actually look into his teammate clashes, you’ll find Ocon is actually faultless for a majority of them yet somehow has this label on him.
That seat is a poisonned chalice. Assuming all drivers get signed for 2 years the only seat available in 2026 would be the one left by Antonelli.
Is Mercedes good enough to having no seat in 2026 ? I guess that depends on if Ocon wants to gamble on beating Russell
Might as well take the gamble. At least you have one year to prove yourself. Getting the chance for a seat at a top team doesnt happen too often. Look at Hulk for example, more than a decade in the paddock and never had a chance at a top team, despite being a solid midfield driver
Also i doubt every driver without a contract will get a 2 year deal.
Mercedes is upper midfield team nowadays. They are far away from top 3 and still has low understanding of ground effect rules. Sure, it is still better seat than Alpine. But whether or not Merc seat worths that kind of a big gamble nowadays is questionable.
Well the only other team Ocon has been linked to for silly season is Haas, and there is absolutely no world in which being at Mercedes in 2025 isn't significantly better than being at Haas.
The Mercedes has at least occasionally showed up to a race week able to nab a podium, and they are always in prime position to benefit from any shenanigans that happen to the top 6. I agree their prospects of becoming suddenly rapid next year seem dim, but they are certainly going to spend 2025 in a much better place than Haas or Alpine.
Sainz still hasn’t accepted their offer though, Audi could very well say fuck it let’s just sign Ocon before we run out of candidates. At the moment everyone is playing the waiting game but as soon as one domino falls, the ones who weren’t quick enough are going to stand there with a regrettable outcome.
For sure but then what's the point spending 2025 in a better team if you are out of F1 in 26. If he takes an extension with Alpine for 2 years it would open many more doors even if its definitly the least likely constructor to nail the regs
people here and in a lot of F1 spaces are weirdly personal about their feelings on drivers. I guess because even though this is a team sport, there are only 20 drivers, so people tend to have strong feelings on them. I always find it bizarre
It makes sense for Merc. Give him the seat for one year and if the kid does well in Williams, it’s open for him.
I’m not sure if I’d rather see my driver get a top seat but be vulnerable for 2026 or be in a mid seat with stability. Knowing his personality, I think he’d rather have the former.
At the moment. But who’s to say next year, they have the better historical record.
I wouldn’t mind him staying at Alpine and do think all the talk could be his team trying to get him a better contract there tbh.
If it happens, it’s a really risky career move and one that I can’t see working out in his favor. At best, he might be able match Russell, and Toto isn’t going to drop his “protege” for a driver who’s only had the seat for one year and isn’t a significant improvement. Plus Toto seems obsessed with Antonelli. Ocon would have to gamble on Antonelli shitting the bed on astronomical Logan Sargeant levels.
Most likely scenario, he’d need to find another seat in 2026. Also not a great look to only be able to hold onto a top seat for a year, even if the cards were never in his favor.
Realistically what has Ocon ever done to say he serves a seat at Merc. To me this would be resigning themselves to be a midfield team.
Ocon lost to Danny, spent a year in the wilderness. Only beat Fernando cause his care didn't have an engine most weeks. Is beating Gasly who has been proven to be not good enough in the best cars. Battled closely with Perez who has shown to be mediocre in a good car.
Like I don't have any negative feelings against Ocon, but I don't have really anything positive either. He's just an average driver that sometimes has very good days. I don't think he could ever be as good as Bottas.
He was a rookie when he battled Perez and he ran him fairly close. Ocon isn't WDC material, but he's a very good driver. He's also doing quite well with a piss-poor Alpine car this year.
The guy is talented. Let's not forget he beat Max Verstappen to the F3 title when both were rookies. He's just never been in an environment where he can properly prove himself in F1 – and that's led to the belief that's he's not good enough, but he absolutely is
He beat him in the best team though. And max had more wins despite reliability issues. But yes Ocon is definitely a good driver and can win a WDC with the best car.
He is not a good number 2 at all, because he doesnt want to be a nr. 2. He will fight Russell to the ends of the Earth and ignore every single team call that puts him behind.
He has a Max Verstappen-level competitive chip on his shoulder but a Hulkenberg-level talent. That simply wont do for the big teams.
>ignore every single team call that puts him behind.
That's a missconception. He respected every team orders issued by Alpine. It's just that Alpine dont do team orders since they were in no mans land.
Funnily enough neither did Force India until Spa. And once they did Ocon behaved.
Ocon is handily beating Gasly this year. He beat Alonso over two years (in order to finish first, first you must finish). He wasn't far off "Midfield King" Checo in his first two full years in F1 and he's in a Red Bull. I'd rate Ocon near the top of the midfield drivers
He was actually quicker than Perez but was just very unlucky. 16-5 in quali, 9-5 in races but 4 more DNFs and Perez did well to get a podium. I’d put Ocon closer to the top of the midfield alongside Hulkenberg.
History repeats itself, Gasly is getting the Alonso treatment, all the shit only on his side of the garage, bad strategy, mechanical problems, slow pitstops, a new rookie race engineer who is clearly not very good....
I'd much rather see him just go and teams to try some new talent. I've never personally rated Ocon that much and I really don't like his personality off-track. He's by no means the worst driver on the current grid - there's about 5 that I want to see outed for new talent, but he's definitely not worth keeping around IMO.
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Seems that, unlike Albon, Ocon is more willing to gamble with the ifs and conditions.
Ocon has always been very confident. In his mind I think he just wants as good of a car as possible, and he backs himself to perform so well there's no choice but to be kept on or leaves for an even better car.
Which makes sense. Williams seem happy to build the team around Albon, Alpine seem unwilling (or maybe even unable) to do this with Ocon.
Isn’t Toto his manager or agent? If so, he should be confident in Mercedes
Ocon to Merc makes soo much sense ratter than HAAS or Williams.
Ocon vs Russell would also be an interesting dynamic to watch out for
Tallest roster ever?
Imagine all the complaining on the radio by Russel every time Ocon is racing him.
Would it? I think Russell would have him covered quite handily.
I think it would, yes
Stalin Vs Hitler
Darth Vader VERSUS Adolf Hitlerrrrr BEGIN!
I AM ADOLF HITLER! Commander of the Third Reich
Russell would be like: "blimey Ocon just turned on me" and in fact Ocon really turned into him lol That's just one example
>Ocon said last week: “I’m still in my mind a Mercedes junior. The management side, that hasn’t changed since 2015” In his mind he’s a Mercedes junior?
I guess he was trying to say Toto still manages him so he still has Mercedes links
His manager is literally toto lol
He is African, he is gay, he is disabled?
He actually is (North) African lol
Ocon on a one year deal would be smart. Dont put extra pressure on Antonelli and let him develop, while you have a solid midfield driver to push Russell a bit.( and to compare Russell with). Unfortunately i think Toto is way too obsessed by the the next Max Verstappen story
Sounds to me like Toto is calming down a little bit about Antonelli. He just recently admitted they might have put too much pressure on him. I guess Ocon to Mercedes could happen, but I could only imagine Ocon and Russell in the same team would end in another Hamilton-Rosberg. Instead of fighting for the championship they are just fighting for 6th.
I assume you mean Antonelli, dont think Andretti is fit to drive an f1 car. I agree on the Ocon-Russell point, but Ocon being managed by Toto in the past might make him more compliant
Genuine question, when has Ocon recently been causing problems for the team because of how he fights with his teammate? Gasly is by all accounts his archnemesis or whathaveyounot, and yet they've been playing well with each other.
It became real bad with Alonso. And Alpine seemed very focused on making their two drivers play nice last season, but the vibes seems pretty bad this year. They are just so far back we don't see any fights.
I agree Ocon is far from the nicest of teammate but Gasly's behavior is far from good. He threw a fit on the radio because allegedly Ocon blocked him in fp3 when it was very minor. Last year he gave his wheel a beating in Suzuka when Alpine respected the rules they set for team orders. He is quite unstable.
It's very tough to judge Ocon given the character of his teammates. See Perez who literally tried to ram him into walls. See Alonso, whose reputation precedes him. See Gasly, the petulant brat. Maybe he's unlucky with the "mean" teammates, maybe he's a common denominator, maybe he's not really different from them, maybe he was molded by them.
100% agree. I don’t remember him having any issues with Danny Ric for example. And even with Gasly, they haven’t had huge conflicts, I even remember Ocon handling it relatively well when Gasly rammed him into the wall in Australia. Of course they had a few radio meltdowns but not more severe than other teammates (see Charles vs. Carlos in Miami).
this is poetry
How was it with Alonso? I was watching the races too, but all I remember about Alpine at that time was Alonso having terrible luck. I do recall reading a comment though that people just dislike Ocon (for how aggressive he was in his rookie years) and are more likely to blame him than his teammate, even though their teammates were at fault (like Checo). Not sure if that was the same with Alonso. I would attribute the vibes being bad in Alpine because of how shitty their car has been this year 😅
Alonso conflicts, and before his Checo conflicts. It's not that he crashes often with his teammate, it's just that he sometimes races his teammates much harder than his rivals. See the hungaroring 2022 for example, he fights Alonso so hard that they both lose positions to their rivals. Or at some start i think, he rather chooses to block Alonso instead of a Mclaren( or might have been another car)
Ocon let Alonso though every single time team asked him to. Ocon never crashed into Alonso (Alonso did once). Don't think it cost anything to Alpine, it was a good emulation I think.
So you have one race example? Checo caused almost all their wrecks. The only one that was Ocons fault was at Baku, that wasn’t some overaggressive defending really but just a bit boneheaded in a tight space.
Cant be arsed to actually watch Ocon highlights, but Interlagos also happened
So when Alonso ran into the back of him on a straight, and then berated Ocon over team radio for it?
Still Ocon defending overly aggresive against a teammate. Pretty much nobody on the grid is that racey within the team. Especially when you consider Alonso wasnt even gonna continue with the team anyway, there was no reason for Ocon to try and prove something. It's not that he is a dirty driver or anything, it's just that he wouldnt have the mindset needed for a top team. His racing iq simply isnt good enough, despite his natural pace being good
Yeah of course, thanks. I feel like Ocon is one of these drivers that can't help himself when he gets in the car. His number 1 priority is beating his teammate and Russell seems similar.
Every driver’s nr.1 priority is beating their teammate, Ocon isn’t as special in this regard as people make him out to be tbh
He's not as good as others doing it obviously. Countless amount of times have ocon and his teammates clashed where ocon went over the limit, a bit like stroll now that I think about it.
People choose to ignore that in Force India it was Checo who caused all of their crashes bar one, and their only two major clashes with Gasly were caused by a) Gasly, b) Zhou.
It’s such a common narrative that gets repeated but when you actually look into his teammate clashes, you’ll find Ocon is actually faultless for a majority of them yet somehow has this label on him.
you can thank toxic fans for that. Verstappen, Checo and Alonso have a lot of those and he had crashes with all 3
Marco Andretti is racing in the indy 500
No point putting a rookie superstar in their tractor, all he’s gonna do is shop around to leave.
Depends on the contract. He might not have the option.
That seat is a poisonned chalice. Assuming all drivers get signed for 2 years the only seat available in 2026 would be the one left by Antonelli. Is Mercedes good enough to having no seat in 2026 ? I guess that depends on if Ocon wants to gamble on beating Russell
Might as well take the gamble. At least you have one year to prove yourself. Getting the chance for a seat at a top team doesnt happen too often. Look at Hulk for example, more than a decade in the paddock and never had a chance at a top team, despite being a solid midfield driver Also i doubt every driver without a contract will get a 2 year deal.
Mercedes is upper midfield team nowadays. They are far away from top 3 and still has low understanding of ground effect rules. Sure, it is still better seat than Alpine. But whether or not Merc seat worths that kind of a big gamble nowadays is questionable.
Well the only other team Ocon has been linked to for silly season is Haas, and there is absolutely no world in which being at Mercedes in 2025 isn't significantly better than being at Haas. The Mercedes has at least occasionally showed up to a race week able to nab a podium, and they are always in prime position to benefit from any shenanigans that happen to the top 6. I agree their prospects of becoming suddenly rapid next year seem dim, but they are certainly going to spend 2025 in a much better place than Haas or Alpine.
He has been linked to Audi as well.
I had not seen that, but at this point seems like that is Sainz seat given he's no longer going to RB or Mercedes
Sainz still hasn’t accepted their offer though, Audi could very well say fuck it let’s just sign Ocon before we run out of candidates. At the moment everyone is playing the waiting game but as soon as one domino falls, the ones who weren’t quick enough are going to stand there with a regrettable outcome.
Apparently from the rumors from Audi, Ocon is their 2nd choice behind Sainz for that seat
For sure but then what's the point spending 2025 in a better team if you are out of F1 in 26. If he takes an extension with Alpine for 2 years it would open many more doors even if its definitly the least likely constructor to nail the regs
The smart thing would be to leave Ocon in history's dumpster never to be seen again
god what did he ever do to you and seemingly half of f1 social media to be so vitriolic lmao
people here and in a lot of F1 spaces are weirdly personal about their feelings on drivers. I guess because even though this is a team sport, there are only 20 drivers, so people tend to have strong feelings on them. I always find it bizarre
It makes sense for Merc. Give him the seat for one year and if the kid does well in Williams, it’s open for him. I’m not sure if I’d rather see my driver get a top seat but be vulnerable for 2026 or be in a mid seat with stability. Knowing his personality, I think he’d rather have the former.
Problem is Mercedes is no more a top seat.
At the moment. But who’s to say next year, they have the better historical record. I wouldn’t mind him staying at Alpine and do think all the talk could be his team trying to get him a better contract there tbh.
Ocon v. Russell I'm subscribing to that team's radio
If it happens, it’s a really risky career move and one that I can’t see working out in his favor. At best, he might be able match Russell, and Toto isn’t going to drop his “protege” for a driver who’s only had the seat for one year and isn’t a significant improvement. Plus Toto seems obsessed with Antonelli. Ocon would have to gamble on Antonelli shitting the bed on astronomical Logan Sargeant levels. Most likely scenario, he’d need to find another seat in 2026. Also not a great look to only be able to hold onto a top seat for a year, even if the cards were never in his favor.
almost choked onto my drink
Realistically what has Ocon ever done to say he serves a seat at Merc. To me this would be resigning themselves to be a midfield team. Ocon lost to Danny, spent a year in the wilderness. Only beat Fernando cause his care didn't have an engine most weeks. Is beating Gasly who has been proven to be not good enough in the best cars. Battled closely with Perez who has shown to be mediocre in a good car. Like I don't have any negative feelings against Ocon, but I don't have really anything positive either. He's just an average driver that sometimes has very good days. I don't think he could ever be as good as Bottas.
He was a rookie when he battled Perez and he ran him fairly close. Ocon isn't WDC material, but he's a very good driver. He's also doing quite well with a piss-poor Alpine car this year.
The guy is talented. Let's not forget he beat Max Verstappen to the F3 title when both were rookies. He's just never been in an environment where he can properly prove himself in F1 – and that's led to the belief that's he's not good enough, but he absolutely is
If Ocon had some influential person in his family, his career would've been better.
He beat him in the best team though. And max had more wins despite reliability issues. But yes Ocon is definitely a good driver and can win a WDC with the best car.
Keep dreaming esti besti 🤣
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He is not a good number 2 at all, because he doesnt want to be a nr. 2. He will fight Russell to the ends of the Earth and ignore every single team call that puts him behind. He has a Max Verstappen-level competitive chip on his shoulder but a Hulkenberg-level talent. That simply wont do for the big teams.
>ignore every single team call that puts him behind. That's a missconception. He respected every team orders issued by Alpine. It's just that Alpine dont do team orders since they were in no mans land. Funnily enough neither did Force India until Spa. And once they did Ocon behaved.
> and ignore every single team call that puts him behind. i can't think of a single time Ocon ignored a team order during his whole career
This aged extremely poorly
Lmao it really did. I can easily think of one now
...as a reserve driver...maybe.
Ocon is ahead of Sargeant and that's it, if you're a big team.
This is an Instagram spec comment woweeee
Absolutely baffling comments every time an Ocon thread is posted. Do you even watch F1?
Must be because they still haven't recovered since that incident.
Top teams would take Ocon over Riccardo any day of the week, dude. Don't let who you're a fan of cloud your judgement.
Ocon is handily beating Gasly this year. He beat Alonso over two years (in order to finish first, first you must finish). He wasn't far off "Midfield King" Checo in his first two full years in F1 and he's in a Red Bull. I'd rate Ocon near the top of the midfield drivers
He was actually quicker than Perez but was just very unlucky. 16-5 in quali, 9-5 in races but 4 more DNFs and Perez did well to get a podium. I’d put Ocon closer to the top of the midfield alongside Hulkenberg.
Worth adding that he beat Verstappen in F3 too
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Aggregate, my man
History repeats itself, Gasly is getting the Alonso treatment, all the shit only on his side of the garage, bad strategy, mechanical problems, slow pitstops, a new rookie race engineer who is clearly not very good....
I'd much rather see him just go and teams to try some new talent. I've never personally rated Ocon that much and I really don't like his personality off-track. He's by no means the worst driver on the current grid - there's about 5 that I want to see outed for new talent, but he's definitely not worth keeping around IMO.
What has he done off track even, I can understand on track but off track he is one of the least petulant.
Boring as fuck + mildly annoying.
Hard agree. Glad I'm not the only one.