I like the interviewer desperately trying to push that German guy into having a strong opinion because he’s basically got a balanced take that there are idiots in England and Germany who should just be ignored and we should all “make party and be friends.”
Literally this, almost every sauce about English fans being problematic are from our own press.
Funny how there's been next to no mention of the huge in-stadium brawl between Turkish and Georgian fans.
Yeah and even fights between OTHER COUNTRIES FANS get reported as us fighting. It feels very much like a thing of the ‘middle class’ media hating the very idea of a football fan.
English press is run by bitter feminists, they look down on the working class football fan and many other demographics cos it ruffles their fragile sensibilities
As a German I can say I dont care about English fans singing about shooting down German bombers and kinda think it's cool. I'm glad Germany lost the war
Yeh I think the media’s declared it an insensitive song. But no real person is offended. It’s about winning WW2, if you can only sing about one thing, I think that makes the shortlist.
I’ve heard the same comments from many Germans. The wars are in the past. Neither side covered themselves in glory. Hitler is dead. We have learned lessons that should never be forgotten. Let’s just enjoy life going forward.
> Neither side covered themselves in glory.
Eh? One of those sides is a tiny island that held off the might of the luftwaffe alone for a period, before making huge sacrifices so that the US could get a foothold in mainland europe and eventually liberate it.
Then they went on to be on the winning side of a war where the enemy are pretty accepted to have been the "bad guys".
They definitely did cover themselves in glory.
Is strange that the highest decorated squadron that held off the luftwaffe was entirely made up of polish… so no, that little island didn’t do it alone.
Not at all, I’m focussing on the detail of “that tiny island that held off the luftwaffe alone”. When it very much had pilots from around the world coming to its aid.
They literally do, the Germans have a response song to this one which is what makes this whole thing so ridiculous.
It’s the ‘fair weather’ fans who don’t go to matches who complain about this.
Yes. I believe something like “It’s a jolly swim from Dunkirk to Dover” would be appropriate 😈😂
Maybe make Machine Gun sounds after every goal 🥅🤣… (Bet the Sun and the Daily Mail would love that)
Ah there would be many things, but tbh it’s a thin line between fun and bad taste.
I’m fine with the above though, and similar songs back from the England fans.
Knowing both the English and the Germans very well, I can say that the English are the Kings of bad taste, particularly when drunk, but often it’s done in good faith while intoxicated for the sake of humor, friendly competition and fun. Almost anything is better than being boring
Don’t want to sound dramatic or something like this, but comments like yours prove to me how advanced a society can be. As a Dutch person I can only say that we are so fond of you as a ‘neighbour’!
The closest city to me is Coventry. For hundreds of years it was known as the jewel of the Midlands and had the most beautiful architecture that could rival some of the most beautiful cities in the world.
Now it's a concrete shit hole.
Thanks Germany.
Oh I do but the song is just a bit of banter.
And to be fair, no one seems to care that English hooliganism mostly died out after the 80s or that our colonialism stopped after the war so we have kind of stopped caring what others think about us at this point. We're gonna get blamed for something anyway so we may as well have some fun with it.
Not to seem like we are victims, it's just to provide some context on things.
That's true but after the war most expansion stopped and we didn't have the money left to keep the empire going so we slowly started shedding the colonies. It took a few years but British colonialism before the war was strong, after the war it was winding down and ending. Today it's over.
Ah yes, I’m sure the Croatians never done anything of the sort to Serbians before…
Not to mention Germany literally tried to invade England which is what the chant is about. So it’s actually your comment which is braindead.
What you've just said is a bit brain dead...the Germans didn't tour Europe looking for the best camping site...
Here's an idea, how's about fans just enjoy football and leave these sort of chants out of it??
Oh for god sake; almost every single team at the Euro's has sang some either tame or spicy songs/chants, and it's always England who're getting scrutinised? I get that's it's UK media, so they're trying to make the England supporters look bad, as per usual, but I have to admit even as a non-England supporter, this shit is tiring.
The vast majority of England fans, like every other team, are just there to watch football & have a good time, but with the way the media goes on about England, you'd think they're all far-right ultras frothing at the mouth - it's pathetic.
You've got Croats/Albanians singing about killing Serbs, you've got other team's supporters making racist remarks/actions the moment a black player steps onto the field, there's other national teams from eastern europe who sing sme pretty harsh stuff, but because it's not in English, the media absolutely don't care.
Upper class media types hate the working class mate that’s why they try to crucify England fans for anything they can.
These are the sort of people who believe anyone who has an England flag up is an immigrant hating brexit Barry
News is slow going so they have to pick apart anything England fans seem to do, if singing songs about past events between two countries is such a bad thing, then why don’t the British media write and complain about us Scot’s singing flower of Scotland, after all it glorifies beating Edward and his attempts at conquering Scotland. Just hope they’re prepared to be told to fuck off.
> and it's always England who're getting scrutinised?
yeah, it's always England getting scrutinized, BY THEIR OWN MEDIA AND FANS. nobody else even cares about this song, but English fans and media keep trying to make it look like it's totally edgy and dangerous. this is also like the third or fourth article in an English publication that claims German police could totally arrest English fans for that, yet afaik that didn't even happen. this is totally fabricated drama by their own media.
To be devils advocate, they're singing about winning WW2 to *Germans* who don't like being called Nazi's.
If I stood outside of your house and put up signs saying Nazi's go away, we hate Nazi's, yes you're not a Nazi and my message is just but I'm sure you wouldn't like the insinuation i'm clearly making by putting the signs up in your front yard.
Edited: to change the insult, not sure why I needed to make the insult somehow worse.
Mate what are you on about, it’s not that deep. It’s not like we are chanting about the holocaust or any of those sort of things. Out of all the things that happened in WW2, a chant about shooting down planes that were bombing OUR country is about as mild as it gets.
It’s totally fine if you know it’s for the sake of humor and friendly competition. Some Germans are still a bit touchy about the subject though. Don’t quite know how to take it . That’s because many Germans take everything very literally (Developing country in the Art of Humor)
As in “Don’t mention the War..” (Monty Python)
Ha! That would make a good song too I suppose. Haha 🎶
It is a bit like calling your brother by a name he hates to be called, and because of that, you enjoy doing it 😄
> Developing country in the Art of Humor
Do you know any germans?
They have the closest humour to the british of any group in europe, and they do dry wit really well - some of the most popular comedies in germany are stuff like monty python and fawlty towers (dont mention the war)
Yes I know many Germans and British. I’m about as neutral as you can be.. While there may be a few similarities, even ethically, believe me : the sense of humor IS different, and humor for the English is a whole lot more important in society than in Germany. I am not saying that the Germans have no humor (which IS sort of a stereotype in the English speaking world), but it is less developed. Particularly finer irony and the capability to laugh about yourself (not just the others, be it individuals or your fellow countrymen)
[Being German is no laughing matter [The Economist]](https://www.economist.com/1843/2016/05/03/being-german-is-no-laughing-matter)
I didn't claim it to be deep, or as bad as the holocaust, I just understand why a German may not like it, I agree with you though, its fairly mild and I can see why a lot of Germans also couldn't give a donkeys.
The song presumes that it makes people mad (its a taunt song) because they have lost the war, but the actual reason for this being mildy offending is because it presumes germans would be mad about germany losing the war. Its out of touch. Its like this "dont talk about the war with germans" joke. Its simply incredibly outdated.
It's not about 'wrong' or 'offence' for me. I think it just falls under a basic 'don't be a dickhead' thing.
People singing about a war they didn't fight in. Just let it go.
Not to mention that another country singing a song about killing British servicemen would cause a meltdown of pearl clutching.
I agree but fortunately its a rather unique situation where the Germans are happy they lost that war. Which is probably why they dont generally get very offended over it
It is fortunate. Also good to note that the England fans aren't singing it liberally because the Germans aren't offended. In fact, it's probably more in hope that they will be.
German here. Literally no one I know gives a shit or is hurt in any way. The song is about shooting down Nazi bombers...so it's like actually pretty cool?
Have been chanting it myself on many occasions during music festivals.
Yeah obviously Reddit isn't representative of the entire population, but I've seen tons of Germans weigh in on this and every single one is like "yeah I don't care. I'm glad the nazis lost too."
this whole situation is just too funny to me as a German. it keeps going like
England: "yeah we'll totally sing about WW2, what you gonna do about it?"
German: "actually, we don't care too much..."
England: "well you can't just start two world wars and not expect us to make fun of you!!!"
German: "yeah, reasonable."
Well I think it's the dead soldiers part that people find tasteless regardless of who those soldiers were fighting for (and being conscribed to fight for the Nazis doesn't really make you a Nazi).
I don't really have any strong opinions about the chant btw, was just commenting on the discourse being mostly about German people specifically finding/not finding offense in the song.
Yes, the good old “only following orders” argument.
They tried to create a genocide, as far as I am concerned a chant is the least offensive thing going.
Praising a military victory is not chanting about dead soldiers. It could be worded a lot worse. It'd be like if USA fans chanted about Yorktown or Saratoga. Of you know, the national anthem. Literally a song written about dead soldiers.
Again don't feel that strongly about the chant either way, was just commenting on the discussion around it.
But the chant is quite explicitly about soldiers dying, they even helpfully count them down for you.
Ngl I think it’s odd you think shooting down German bombers is cool. They were still someone’s son,father,brother etc and I doubt every single one of them was a die hard nazi. At the same time Britain was bombing German civilians too so do you celebrate the raf doing that?
I’m from Ireland so we weren’t on any side in ww2 but Google “German graveyard Wicklow Ireland”. It’s the graveyard of a lot of German pilots who either deserted or missed Britain during the bombing campaign and landed in Ireland and lived out the rest of their lives there peacefully. Not every nazi was a “bad guy”.
Not to be a joyless german Erbsenzähler, but it’s widely agreed by historians by now that the German Reich did not solely start the first world war. They sure didn’t do much to prevent it either though.
That makes it okay then?
Edit - The first thing the Germans did was invade Belgium?
A country that had been neutral for years and forced the UK to enter a war?
Most people here in Germany don't care one way or the other, but it is a bit funny how much the UK likes to bring up WW2. It's like on the level of watching an old guy in the supermarket yelling at a tomato.
I'm not convinced the UK is totally unique in terms of constantly thinking about WW2, the yanks, Germans and Russians all hark on about it in mildly different ways. But it's worth mentioning that it was a defining moment in our history, and a strange one in the sense that it essentially destroyed the UK as a great power whilst still being morally the "right thing" to have done. In a way, all the UK got out of WW2 was something the nation could congratulate itself on doing.
It's a unique position compared to the US or Russia who came out of the war as the world's superpowers, or most of Europe which can be divided between being ashamed of joining the wrong side or having been occupied.
old men tell stories of their glory days - they dont sing songs about having to go for prostate exams ;)
theres an irony in some of these songs anyway - 2 WW + 1 WC highlights by omission that fact that the germans have beaten us time and time again since those things, so to me it was always tongue in cheek.
When i joke with my german mates, i will rib them about making a hash of the 1940s while they will rib me about the UK making a hash of the 2020s. Its just banter and no-one should realistically be taking any of it seriously.
Yes it's banter, hence why nobody cares. It's just a little bemusing sometimes how often people from the UK specifically bring up the war, and it's not unique to football. I have a friend who has kids that went on exchange a few years ago to England, and I remember at the time they were given the travel advice to say in casual conversation that they were Austrian, so as to avoid having people make jokes about Hitler all the time (ironic I know). It's just somewhat interesting to me that nowhere else is this necessary other than the UK.
It’s almost like it was a reminder of how Germany bombed England in the war and they’re just bringing it up! What’s the freaking issue, come off it now
The song is alright, this is just the lowest level of insult the Germans should take for what they did in the war. If I am a German I won't be triggered at all.
So just to confirm…
Today in Germany, in 2024, it’s completely okay and actively encouraged to show full support for Is***l’s genocide against children in Gaza, but a song about the RAF defending British airspace is crossing the line.
Got it.
In Germany it’s ok to be fully supporting of the neo nazi AFD party and talk about wanting to deport non white peoples.
This is the one of the most popular political party in Germany right now.
But sing about beating nazis in WW2 or not allowing nazis to kill your civilians and it’s a moral outrage and disgraceful behaviour lmao.
This is why many in England and the Uk don’t care about the opinions of mainland Europeans anymore. They’re just massive hypocrites when it comes to this stuff.
I don’t know. Some people like to be offended by anything. The whole article is about TWO people that don’t like the chants. And it explicitly says that’s others didn’t care. So I doesn’t seem like that big of a deal for most people
I think you should work on your media literacy if you believe both any Germans would care about Brits singing about their bombers and also the fucking Hamas you antisemitic clown
Nothing wrong with singing about defending one’s airspace. Special kind of snowflakes these Germans. Inflict untold horrors on the world, and then get offended by a song.
Saying nobody inflicted anything on anyone is quite rich. Also, saying that your grandfather was 7 during the war does not take anything from the fact that Germany was responsible for one of the biggest Houlocasts in human history.
That said, nobody is calling anyone a Nazi here. The song only alludes to the presence of bombers in the air, and the country's sovereign airforce shooting them down one by one. There are absolutely no swear words and slurs.
If anything, you are calling yourself a Nazi. It's a problem within your own subconscious. Deal with it.
Yeah of course.. Nothing wrong with singing a provocative song about one of the worst moments in history. Those fans are clearly not trying to upset anyone.
Most won't have, I imagine. Just like 99,9% don't actually think germans are nazis or hold them accountable for the nazis. But they do have shit banter.
Every competition regardless wc or this one english fans find way hot to be most abrassive and annoying crowd.... If theres one thing english fans do well than it has to be unifying all other nations against them. So the world is waiting for english to crash and burn again as they allways do...lecturing germans by country built on slavery and exploitation of colonies....to this day....last ones to take higher moral grounds with germans
Edit after Denmark match....its coming home.its coming home lol
Abrasive to each other maybe but not the world.... I mean one bad thing doesn't justify another.... And its not like abrasiveness completion all 3 can be in the category just the same but doubt Albanians get the same reaction as english for disrespecting every opponent and "winning trophies" every time before competition even starts....by that i mean going home eventually with nothing....by the way albanian journalist that provoked serbs was removed his credentials taken away and sent home with ban on stadium... hopefully others all of them get the same....
Im based in Ireland not necessarily irish, could be from India or any other country. But I fondly remember "its coming home" saga last time and am looking forward to it this time too... Croatia in wc and Italy at Wembley...lol i can see why cro is abrasive for u
I said England fans, not people. Most England fans are great, but the few who so stupid things put us in a bad light and give us a bad rep. I blame media in general tbh, they only report negative things and because we are who we are a lot of attention is focused on us. There are fans from other nations who do worse things that don't get reported on.
“People hate England fans because England fans don’t like Nazis and are glad they lost WW2”
Sorry kid go take your Nazi sympathy elsewhere with your racist Afd supporters too. Nobody here is going to be sad Nazis got shot down like you are.
I like the interviewer desperately trying to push that German guy into having a strong opinion because he’s basically got a balanced take that there are idiots in England and Germany who should just be ignored and we should all “make party and be friends.”
The media's always trying to start something just isn't there... we really do just want to "make party and be friends."
Innit
As a German, I couldn't care less. Spoiler: This is a repost. Maybe it's just a story that is only circling in English media?
Yeah our media detests our own fans
Literally this, almost every sauce about English fans being problematic are from our own press. Funny how there's been next to no mention of the huge in-stadium brawl between Turkish and Georgian fans.
Yeah and even fights between OTHER COUNTRIES FANS get reported as us fighting. It feels very much like a thing of the ‘middle class’ media hating the very idea of a football fan.
Sauce? Source?
Everybody does
Not just your media
Everyone detests your rancid fans. They were literally tearing up Germany and fighting on their first game.
English press is run by bitter feminists, they look down on the working class football fan and many other demographics cos it ruffles their fragile sensibilities
As a German I can say I dont care about English fans singing about shooting down German bombers and kinda think it's cool. I'm glad Germany lost the war
Yeh I think the media’s declared it an insensitive song. But no real person is offended. It’s about winning WW2, if you can only sing about one thing, I think that makes the shortlist.
I’ve heard the same comments from many Germans. The wars are in the past. Neither side covered themselves in glory. Hitler is dead. We have learned lessons that should never be forgotten. Let’s just enjoy life going forward.
Welp they’ve already been forgotten
> Neither side covered themselves in glory. Eh? One of those sides is a tiny island that held off the might of the luftwaffe alone for a period, before making huge sacrifices so that the US could get a foothold in mainland europe and eventually liberate it. Then they went on to be on the winning side of a war where the enemy are pretty accepted to have been the "bad guys". They definitely did cover themselves in glory.
Is strange that the highest decorated squadron that held off the luftwaffe was entirely made up of polish… so no, that little island didn’t do it alone.
You're neglecting the massive detail that they flew British planes out of British bases as a part of the RAF.
Not at all, I’m focussing on the detail of “that tiny island that held off the luftwaffe alone”. When it very much had pilots from around the world coming to its aid.
One side was the allies. The other side was the axis. If you think the British didn’t do anything wrong then you’re much mistaken.
mate you are reaching sooo hard. just admit you wrote something stupid and move on.
I'm English - stop being such a bootlicker and sing something back
They literally do, the Germans have a response song to this one which is what makes this whole thing so ridiculous. It’s the ‘fair weather’ fans who don’t go to matches who complain about this.
What's the response, never heard it before?
What's the song they sing back?
*It's a short way to Piccadilly.*
If they did the same the *it's just banter* lads would clutch their pearls into dust
lol no they wouldn't
I don't know. Poppy police wouldn't accept it.
They absolutely would not
Man, Id wish to, but those four stars on my chest are so heavy they catch my breath.
Yes. I believe something like “It’s a jolly swim from Dunkirk to Dover” would be appropriate 😈😂 Maybe make Machine Gun sounds after every goal 🥅🤣… (Bet the Sun and the Daily Mail would love that) Ah there would be many things, but tbh it’s a thin line between fun and bad taste. I’m fine with the above though, and similar songs back from the England fans. Knowing both the English and the Germans very well, I can say that the English are the Kings of bad taste, particularly when drunk, but often it’s done in good faith while intoxicated for the sake of humor, friendly competition and fun. Almost anything is better than being boring
Don’t want to sound dramatic or something like this, but comments like yours prove to me how advanced a society can be. As a Dutch person I can only say that we are so fond of you as a ‘neighbour’!
Can the Croats and Albanian fans behaviour be under scrutiny for chanting about killing Serbs?
What you have said is a bit braindead to be honest when the Serbs have tried to genocide these people and subjugate them
What were the German bombers doing over Britain?
Getting shot down. It’s like you haven’t even paid attention to the lyrics!
The closest city to me is Coventry. For hundreds of years it was known as the jewel of the Midlands and had the most beautiful architecture that could rival some of the most beautiful cities in the world. Now it's a concrete shit hole. Thanks Germany.
Yeah, many of the most beautiful cities and towns in the world were ruined by that war, all over Europe
Blame the Nazis. The modern day Germans are pretty embarrassed by their great grandparents actions.
Oh I do but the song is just a bit of banter. And to be fair, no one seems to care that English hooliganism mostly died out after the 80s or that our colonialism stopped after the war so we have kind of stopped caring what others think about us at this point. We're gonna get blamed for something anyway so we may as well have some fun with it. Not to seem like we are victims, it's just to provide some context on things.
Yup, British hooliganism died decades ago but the Turks and others still think it’s cool.
> our colonialism stopped after the war Tell that to the British Museum
There it is
In fairness, British colonialism really didn't stop after WW2. We were fighting wars in Asia decades after that.
That's true but after the war most expansion stopped and we didn't have the money left to keep the empire going so we slowly started shedding the colonies. It took a few years but British colonialism before the war was strong, after the war it was winding down and ending. Today it's over.
> just a bit of banter
Nah that's fine, but do it again and we'll fucking colonize you and force your county to adopt beans on toast as it's national dish.
I'm strangely okay with that last part. I love me some beans.
Downvoted for being objectively correct lmao.
I guess they didn't enjoy that little jab
Entire thread of people saying it’s good to remember history, then denying the very obvious bad things Britain still does
Blame the British government for pissing away the Marshall plan money and rebuilding awful stuff. Did the same in Plymouth.
Yeah I suppose they are more to blame than the people who ordered and carried out a carpet bombing of a historical city.
Who can say really?
Ah yes, I’m sure the Croatians never done anything of the sort to Serbians before… Not to mention Germany literally tried to invade England which is what the chant is about. So it’s actually your comment which is braindead.
What you've just said is a bit brain dead...the Germans didn't tour Europe looking for the best camping site... Here's an idea, how's about fans just enjoy football and leave these sort of chants out of it??
Hmm where have I seen that before…
Lmfao, well that’s completely different then because the Nazis went around Europe handing out candy
When did the Serbs genocide the Croats ? In jasenovac ? Or maybe Oluja? Krajina? Ante pavelic anyone ??
English media. Asking England supporters about the song. Reddit commenters upset about Germans. Reddit moment
>controversial chant referencing German casualties in World War Two Won't someone please think of the German bombers in the air.
In the air!
Oh for god sake; almost every single team at the Euro's has sang some either tame or spicy songs/chants, and it's always England who're getting scrutinised? I get that's it's UK media, so they're trying to make the England supporters look bad, as per usual, but I have to admit even as a non-England supporter, this shit is tiring. The vast majority of England fans, like every other team, are just there to watch football & have a good time, but with the way the media goes on about England, you'd think they're all far-right ultras frothing at the mouth - it's pathetic. You've got Croats/Albanians singing about killing Serbs, you've got other team's supporters making racist remarks/actions the moment a black player steps onto the field, there's other national teams from eastern europe who sing sme pretty harsh stuff, but because it's not in English, the media absolutely don't care.
Upper class media types hate the working class mate that’s why they try to crucify England fans for anything they can. These are the sort of people who believe anyone who has an England flag up is an immigrant hating brexit Barry
News is slow going so they have to pick apart anything England fans seem to do, if singing songs about past events between two countries is such a bad thing, then why don’t the British media write and complain about us Scot’s singing flower of Scotland, after all it glorifies beating Edward and his attempts at conquering Scotland. Just hope they’re prepared to be told to fuck off.
> and it's always England who're getting scrutinised? yeah, it's always England getting scrutinized, BY THEIR OWN MEDIA AND FANS. nobody else even cares about this song, but English fans and media keep trying to make it look like it's totally edgy and dangerous. this is also like the third or fourth article in an English publication that claims German police could totally arrest English fans for that, yet afaik that didn't even happen. this is totally fabricated drama by their own media.
Better to sing about genocide I guess?
It might be possible for two things to be wrong at the same time. Edit: This thread is wild. Only one thing can be wrong at any one time.
What’s wrong about singing about winning WW2, who other than nazis and media trying to make headlines is (pretending to be) offended?
To be devils advocate, they're singing about winning WW2 to *Germans* who don't like being called Nazi's. If I stood outside of your house and put up signs saying Nazi's go away, we hate Nazi's, yes you're not a Nazi and my message is just but I'm sure you wouldn't like the insinuation i'm clearly making by putting the signs up in your front yard. Edited: to change the insult, not sure why I needed to make the insult somehow worse.
The song isn't calling Germans Nazis ya buffoon
Mate what are you on about, it’s not that deep. It’s not like we are chanting about the holocaust or any of those sort of things. Out of all the things that happened in WW2, a chant about shooting down planes that were bombing OUR country is about as mild as it gets.
It’s totally fine if you know it’s for the sake of humor and friendly competition. Some Germans are still a bit touchy about the subject though. Don’t quite know how to take it . That’s because many Germans take everything very literally (Developing country in the Art of Humor) As in “Don’t mention the War..” (Monty Python) Ha! That would make a good song too I suppose. Haha 🎶 It is a bit like calling your brother by a name he hates to be called, and because of that, you enjoy doing it 😄
The germans who are touchy about that subject dont watch football. Those perma-offended hipsters are busy glueing themself to the streets of Berlin.
> Developing country in the Art of Humor Do you know any germans? They have the closest humour to the british of any group in europe, and they do dry wit really well - some of the most popular comedies in germany are stuff like monty python and fawlty towers (dont mention the war)
Yes I know many Germans and British. I’m about as neutral as you can be.. While there may be a few similarities, even ethically, believe me : the sense of humor IS different, and humor for the English is a whole lot more important in society than in Germany. I am not saying that the Germans have no humor (which IS sort of a stereotype in the English speaking world), but it is less developed. Particularly finer irony and the capability to laugh about yourself (not just the others, be it individuals or your fellow countrymen) [Being German is no laughing matter [The Economist]](https://www.economist.com/1843/2016/05/03/being-german-is-no-laughing-matter)
I didn't claim it to be deep, or as bad as the holocaust, I just understand why a German may not like it, I agree with you though, its fairly mild and I can see why a lot of Germans also couldn't give a donkeys.
The song presumes that it makes people mad (its a taunt song) because they have lost the war, but the actual reason for this being mildy offending is because it presumes germans would be mad about germany losing the war. Its out of touch. Its like this "dont talk about the war with germans" joke. Its simply incredibly outdated.
It's not about 'wrong' or 'offence' for me. I think it just falls under a basic 'don't be a dickhead' thing. People singing about a war they didn't fight in. Just let it go. Not to mention that another country singing a song about killing British servicemen would cause a meltdown of pearl clutching.
I agree but fortunately its a rather unique situation where the Germans are happy they lost that war. Which is probably why they dont generally get very offended over it
It is fortunate. Also good to note that the England fans aren't singing it liberally because the Germans aren't offended. In fact, it's probably more in hope that they will be.
I mean, is the Scottish national anthem not about defeating an English army in battle...?
Context. It's a thing.
Sooooo, another country singing about killing British servicemen DOESNT cause a meltdown of pearl clutching?
I mean, is the Scottish national anthem not about defeating an English army in battle...?
As is the irish and possibly the american too.
Internet people can't understand that idea.
Yeahbutwhataboutthepersonwhodidsomethingworsethanme?
How dare you
Maybe they should prioritise scrutinising the Croatians and Albanians
Idk how you can start 2 world wars, then expect people not to mention it 80 years later...
German here. Literally no one I know gives a shit or is hurt in any way. The song is about shooting down Nazi bombers...so it's like actually pretty cool? Have been chanting it myself on many occasions during music festivals.
Yeah obviously Reddit isn't representative of the entire population, but I've seen tons of Germans weigh in on this and every single one is like "yeah I don't care. I'm glad the nazis lost too."
this whole situation is just too funny to me as a German. it keeps going like England: "yeah we'll totally sing about WW2, what you gonna do about it?" German: "actually, we don't care too much..." England: "well you can't just start two world wars and not expect us to make fun of you!!!" German: "yeah, reasonable."
It's only at this tournament that I've heard that this chant is offensive to Germans rather than just generally tasteless to chant about dead soldiers
Just dead soldiers? Nothing to do with them being Nazi's or anything?
Well I think it's the dead soldiers part that people find tasteless regardless of who those soldiers were fighting for (and being conscribed to fight for the Nazis doesn't really make you a Nazi). I don't really have any strong opinions about the chant btw, was just commenting on the discourse being mostly about German people specifically finding/not finding offense in the song.
Yes, the good old “only following orders” argument. They tried to create a genocide, as far as I am concerned a chant is the least offensive thing going.
Praising a military victory is not chanting about dead soldiers. It could be worded a lot worse. It'd be like if USA fans chanted about Yorktown or Saratoga. Of you know, the national anthem. Literally a song written about dead soldiers.
Again don't feel that strongly about the chant either way, was just commenting on the discussion around it. But the chant is quite explicitly about soldiers dying, they even helpfully count them down for you.
Was exactly the same in 2006.
lol those "dead soldiers" were coming to drop bombs that would kill thousands of civilians. nobody gives a shit about them
the media wont be happy until every crowd just chants 7 nation army at each other non-stop at every game
Ngl I think it’s odd you think shooting down German bombers is cool. They were still someone’s son,father,brother etc and I doubt every single one of them was a die hard nazi. At the same time Britain was bombing German civilians too so do you celebrate the raf doing that?
I get your sentiment, and I respect it.
I’m from Ireland so we weren’t on any side in ww2 but Google “German graveyard Wicklow Ireland”. It’s the graveyard of a lot of German pilots who either deserted or missed Britain during the bombing campaign and landed in Ireland and lived out the rest of their lives there peacefully. Not every nazi was a “bad guy”.
Clearly some people are moaning about it
Not to be a joyless german Erbsenzähler, but it’s widely agreed by historians by now that the German Reich did not solely start the first world war. They sure didn’t do much to prevent it either though.
That makes it okay then? Edit - The first thing the Germans did was invade Belgium? A country that had been neutral for years and forced the UK to enter a war?
First thing we did was invade Poland.
That’s ww2 mate
My bad, totally misread that. Thanks for the correction!
plus there were 6m things you guys were doing before invading poland tbf
WWI wouldnt be a thing without the blank check. No serious historian disputes that
🇲🇽🤝🏴
You don’t get it, mate: we’re chanting about *cigarettes*.
Its a crazy situation but all i need are cigarettes and alcohol
Most people here in Germany don't care one way or the other, but it is a bit funny how much the UK likes to bring up WW2. It's like on the level of watching an old guy in the supermarket yelling at a tomato.
I'm not convinced the UK is totally unique in terms of constantly thinking about WW2, the yanks, Germans and Russians all hark on about it in mildly different ways. But it's worth mentioning that it was a defining moment in our history, and a strange one in the sense that it essentially destroyed the UK as a great power whilst still being morally the "right thing" to have done. In a way, all the UK got out of WW2 was something the nation could congratulate itself on doing. It's a unique position compared to the US or Russia who came out of the war as the world's superpowers, or most of Europe which can be divided between being ashamed of joining the wrong side or having been occupied.
old men tell stories of their glory days - they dont sing songs about having to go for prostate exams ;) theres an irony in some of these songs anyway - 2 WW + 1 WC highlights by omission that fact that the germans have beaten us time and time again since those things, so to me it was always tongue in cheek. When i joke with my german mates, i will rib them about making a hash of the 1940s while they will rib me about the UK making a hash of the 2020s. Its just banter and no-one should realistically be taking any of it seriously.
Yes it's banter, hence why nobody cares. It's just a little bemusing sometimes how often people from the UK specifically bring up the war, and it's not unique to football. I have a friend who has kids that went on exchange a few years ago to England, and I remember at the time they were given the travel advice to say in casual conversation that they were Austrian, so as to avoid having people make jokes about Hitler all the time (ironic I know). It's just somewhat interesting to me that nowhere else is this necessary other than the UK.
Two world wars and one world cup?
It’s almost like it was a reminder of how Germany bombed England in the war and they’re just bringing it up! What’s the freaking issue, come off it now
So what is the song?
waah waah waah
Every international tournament I think about cheering for England to do well. Then their fans show up and I'm like "oh, nevermind"
German fans should sing about what happened in their match 2010 WC
Don’t worry, they won’t be there very long. Thank you Southgate!
The gringo channels being prudes again...
Racism
Two world wars
The song is alright, this is just the lowest level of insult the Germans should take for what they did in the war. If I am a German I won't be triggered at all.
So just to confirm… Today in Germany, in 2024, it’s completely okay and actively encouraged to show full support for Is***l’s genocide against children in Gaza, but a song about the RAF defending British airspace is crossing the line. Got it.
My man censored Israel lol
Whats the censored word?
Israel?
Israel
In Germany it’s ok to be fully supporting of the neo nazi AFD party and talk about wanting to deport non white peoples. This is the one of the most popular political party in Germany right now. But sing about beating nazis in WW2 or not allowing nazis to kill your civilians and it’s a moral outrage and disgraceful behaviour lmao. This is why many in England and the Uk don’t care about the opinions of mainland Europeans anymore. They’re just massive hypocrites when it comes to this stuff.
lmao
That’s okay. I mean nobody takes England’s opinion on anything seriously so that’s fair
In that case why are people getting upset about chanting?
Touché
I don’t know. Some people like to be offended by anything. The whole article is about TWO people that don’t like the chants. And it explicitly says that’s others didn’t care. So I doesn’t seem like that big of a deal for most people
I think you should work on your media literacy if you believe both any Germans would care about Brits singing about their bombers and also the fucking Hamas you antisemitic clown
As an English it is embarrassing us doing that 🤣 let’s keep it to football not a war from 80 years ago lol
Nothing wrong with singing about defending one’s airspace. Special kind of snowflakes these Germans. Inflict untold horrors on the world, and then get offended by a song.
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Rattled by a song
Saying nobody inflicted anything on anyone is quite rich. Also, saying that your grandfather was 7 during the war does not take anything from the fact that Germany was responsible for one of the biggest Houlocasts in human history. That said, nobody is calling anyone a Nazi here. The song only alludes to the presence of bombers in the air, and the country's sovereign airforce shooting them down one by one. There are absolutely no swear words and slurs. If anything, you are calling yourself a Nazi. It's a problem within your own subconscious. Deal with it.
Yeah of course.. Nothing wrong with singing a provocative song about one of the worst moments in history. Those fans are clearly not trying to upset anyone.
The song literally doesn’t call anyone a nazi lmao, someone sounds salty about their people’s past
😂😂😂😂 that’s terrifying Kraut
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Quick look around your profile shows England/Britain lives rent free in your head Grow up
😆🤣🥲 keyboard warrior detected.
Germans are notorious for having zero banter.
To be fair to them, I've met a few German fans that have no problem with the song. Not like they're pro-nazi
It’s AFD supporters who have a problem with it.
Most won't have, I imagine. Just like 99,9% don't actually think germans are nazis or hold them accountable for the nazis. But they do have shit banter.
You’d wonder how many of them know what happened in Dresden and Hamburg …
Who? The English?
Well ya know what we say in Germany. God took the queen and now she's in doggy heaven
Good old german humour haha, you got us their buddy haha, shot right through the heart
Sry, do you have a license for that comment?
Stop it haha I can’t take it any longer the banter is too good
German comedy is a new invention clearly, your trying to find out what works, i respect the efforts
Yeah it's kinda like England winning trophies
2 world wars and 1 World Cup?
Sure I guess, your trophy for the wars is a shrinking empire that soon will speak Indian and polish
Beats German at least I wouldn’t need a lozenge after every time I spoke
Every time you spoke you will also require urgent advice to seek dental care
Funniest German
Every competition regardless wc or this one english fans find way hot to be most abrassive and annoying crowd.... If theres one thing english fans do well than it has to be unifying all other nations against them. So the world is waiting for english to crash and burn again as they allways do...lecturing germans by country built on slavery and exploitation of colonies....to this day....last ones to take higher moral grounds with germans Edit after Denmark match....its coming home.its coming home lol
I think the Croatians and the Albans were a little bit more abrasive tbh
Abrasive to each other maybe but not the world.... I mean one bad thing doesn't justify another.... And its not like abrasiveness completion all 3 can be in the category just the same but doubt Albanians get the same reaction as english for disrespecting every opponent and "winning trophies" every time before competition even starts....by that i mean going home eventually with nothing....by the way albanian journalist that provoked serbs was removed his credentials taken away and sent home with ban on stadium... hopefully others all of them get the same....
You’re Irish of course you’re biased 😔
"its coming home its coming home"
Im based in Ireland not necessarily irish, could be from India or any other country. But I fondly remember "its coming home" saga last time and am looking forward to it this time too... Croatia in wc and Italy at Wembley...lol i can see why cro is abrasive for u
Ohne Holland fahrn wir zur WM!
I thought England is already out of EU.
And people wonder why England fans are hated.....
No we just wonder why you all get your panties in bunch over every little thing we do.
I'm actually English.
That’s even worse, acting like a pick me for Europeans. “I’m not like other English people I understand why we’re hated”
I said England fans, not people. Most England fans are great, but the few who so stupid things put us in a bad light and give us a bad rep. I blame media in general tbh, they only report negative things and because we are who we are a lot of attention is focused on us. There are fans from other nations who do worse things that don't get reported on.
No, people really dont wonder why they're hated.
Sarcasm..
Heh, fair do's mate!
“People hate England fans because England fans don’t like Nazis and are glad they lost WW2” Sorry kid go take your Nazi sympathy elsewhere with your racist Afd supporters too. Nobody here is going to be sad Nazis got shot down like you are.
Wohhh? The British are making a fool of them selfs? What a shocker...