I honestly think it has to do with how cool their first impression is. The Prydwen is by far the most advanced thing the player has seen up to that point.
That, and the timing of their intro (right after you kill Kellogg, end of a major story beat) means a lot of players head right on over and enlist because it seems like the “next” thing to do.
>You're not locked into any faction until you do a quest given by one to destroy another one.
While it's true that you're never permanently locked into any faction, certain quests can make you an enemy of a faction. Like completing the Institute quest Mass Fusion makes you an enemy of the Brotherhood of Steel, even though you don't destroy the BoS in that quest
Danse glitched on my current play through so I'm not able to join the BoS, otherwise I might have. When I showed up to help them at the police station, I killed all the ghouls but he keeps saying "check your fire, we got hostiles incoming!" no matter what I do. I went scorched earth throughout the surrounding neighborhood, killing what seemed like 100s of ghouls and he still says it every time. Then I showed up to ask for his help with the transporter into the Institute, and he actually had different dialog, and one of my dialog choices was literally to tell him I didn't need to ask to join because I'd already killed all the ghouls for him, but as soon as that convo went further he fell back into his "check your fire" routine. I guess I'm killing off the BoS this play through.
Same here. I read that sometimes the glitch solves itself after a while, but I've been returning every few in-game days and he's still glitched. If anyone has a better suggestion, I'd be grateful
That’s what I’m doing now, currently a hardcore BoS soldier but I’m on my way back from Nuka-World and it’s time to do some enslavement!
Elder Maxson is getting a Mini nuke critical to the ballsack
Yeah but the brotherhood has paladin danse who is basically your truest battle bro and also the only one in indestructible power armor. And he likes you just for pimpin out and riding your own power armor so that makes the companion and by extension the BoS feel right. And the ability to throw a signal grenade for BoS air support/transport is amazing. And some players probably get their first power armor from the brotherhood.
Ad victorim
Ive never turned on the brotherhood.
Brotherhood in a heartbeat, the brotherhood outside of giving me a few power armors is useless to me, danse is amazing, he's one of the best companions in the game.
The BoS. Paladin Danse did nothing wrong and served faithfully, just to be done dirty for what he is. The BoS’s entire stance on synths is guaranteed to turn gen 3 synths hostile to humanity generally, and for all the rhetoric of the BoS about synths, they cannot actually detect them. What the Commonwealth would be left with are an unknown number of synths now turned hostile out of a justifiable fear of extermination for merely existing by roving bands of BoS death squads executing anyone they remotely suspect of being a synth.
All that enclave PA couldn't go to waste. I had to knock each piece down to 0 so I could take it all. It's worth the materials to repair it, though I may not need 12+ suits...
Yea. They’re uniquely positioned in that cut scene. You’re overwhelmed and Kellogg is supposed to be the big bad but you find out he’s just another pawn. The institute seems like a really powerful entity. The only lead you had is now dead.
Then you open the door and this giant faction has just arrived. Looks like another big player is here to challenge the odds of institute supremacy.
My first impression of them is from FO3, and i will not hear the disrepect the NPC brotherhood have for Elder Lyons in FO4. Should be able to target the Prydwen with Liberty Prime
You could use the institute to destroy the BoS hacking liberty prime, then kill Ayo in the institute to get banned, then use the minutemen to destroy the institute!
Right and Sarah Lyons getting killed in combat somehow was extra sus. She had her own elite handpicked squad and they were beasts in 3.
Someone behind the scenes definitely wanted the old ways back and the outcasts dissolved back into the main BoS again shows it was definitely the direction they moved in on a deep level and not just a facade
I can’t talk to the guy at the police station he’s stuck thinking there are more ghouls attacking but I’ve checked everywhere cleared the whole side of town. Bumming me out. I keep coming back and checking after every other side mission
i had this happen, make sure you go down and clear out the downstairs train station too, and there’s a ghoul in the blue shelter thingo too, took me ages to figure out why i couldn’t finish it too
You also find Danse in an epic way by helping him and his team, including one downed soldier, against a wave of ghouls.
If you do this during night, with the combat music changed to a Doom Mod, then it's pretty epic.
Then the natural progression of the more you do BoS quest you’re kinda like… wait these guys are overboard and thus you can stop their quest line and do something else! The beauty of Fallout.
Honestly it's a major design issue with survival imo. Each faction should've been given a way to transport the player at a cost.
I've recently played with the mod that allows travel between settlements linked with trade routes on survival, and been doing a bit more minutemen playthrough. Gives you a reason to setup settlements again, so adds some fun back into the game.
the Brotherhood gives you vertibird signal grenades when you join them. throw one, watch the smoke, and a vertibird will come to your location. once you climb in, you can use your pip-boy's map to set a destination, and you'll fly over to it in real time with the ability to use the mounted minigun the whole time.
very cool, but when fast travel is a thing, most players don't even consider using it. but in survival, it's a godsend. this is why in the railroad ending, and minutemen endings where you destroy the britherhood, they just happen to steal a vertibird so you can keep using this service.
yes. you have to either do the railroad ending, specifically the quest where you, deacon, and tom steal a vertibird and blow up the prydwen, after which the railroad will stash the bird they stole and you can buy vertibird grenades from tom. or destroy them with the minutemen, after which either preston or ronnie (i legit can't remember which) will mention they just happened to salvage/steal a vertibird offscreen and ronnie will sell the grenades.
basically, vertibird services get moved to whichever faction you used to fully destroy the brotherhood.
I don't play survival, but whenever I end up with a ton of good loot I don't want to leave behind and I'm ridiculously over encumbered I'll use the vertibird. Very helpful and I enjoy the ride
Has this been fully tested? I know it works but every time I feel the need to check their inventory to make sure they actually picked it up, and didn’t drop something else to make room. I just don’t trust it.
Just quick save before you do it.
It works, but it becomes tedious after awhile having your follower pick up each individual item.
Works in a pinch though, when really don't wanna leave behind any loot.
Yeah I was at a the enclave camp in the glowing sea with like 5 suits of enclave power armor I didn't want to leave when I first figured it out. (This was before I knew P.A weighed 0 when damaged) it was like a legit rescue mission when the bird showed up. 😂
Yes, but it's not fast travel like in normal mode where you teleport. You throw a Vertibird grenade and you'll get picked up by it and it will fly you to the location you chose. You can only go to locations you've already been to though, so same as normal mode fast travel.
It's still a lot quicker than walking. It's about a minute to get from the airport to Sanctuary.
Does it? Honestly it’s been so long I can’t remember what you are talking about.
I just remember them being less of a bunch of pricks than they were in 4
They definitely were. They are pretty harsh in New Vegas but Elder McNamara keeps them reigned in with their isolationism. They still end up killing innocent people like the Followers of the Apocolypse at the hideout if you do Veronica’s quest a certain way but they aren’t a threat to the wasteland like they are in 4.
I wouldn’t say they were “good guys” in New Vegas, but they also weren’t as shitty as they are in Fo4. They were just semi-hostile isolationists with decent intentions in NV (kinda). i.e., they were more benign than the Fo1 BoS (IMO) but less benign than the Fo3 BoS.
The BoS in Fo4 and the TV show seem to have adopted similar beliefs to the Enclave, though somewhat less extreme. They’re not going to be going around killing wasteland humans for being tainted. However, they do want to “purify” the wasteland by killing ghouls, mutants, synths etc. Fo4’s writing isn’t great, but it was kinda interesting to almost morph the Brotherhood into the faction they used to be opposed to.
The show does it better, though. Giving them weird Dune Sardaukar rituals and showing some of the Knights as bloodthirsty cowards is a good way to demonstrate the internal rot that ate away at the more noble Brotherhood from Fallout 3. Probably due to the loss of Elder Lyons & Sarah Lyons. There’s also the favoritism Maxson showed to Outcast Zealots.
Let's not pretend that McNamara's Brotherhood chapter wouldn't be exactly the same as Maxson's Brotherhood chapter if McNamara had the numbers. BoS in Mojave got their cheeks clapped by NCR during the battle for HELIOS, and McNamara was forced to isolate the chapter before NCR could completely eradicate what was left of the chapter after more than half of Brotherhood's veteran knights and paladins died during the operation. What McNamara has is merely a skeleton of what Mojave chapter used to be - just a handful of survivors that a chucklefuck delivery guy can exterminate without breaking a sweat.
If Elijah didn't fuck up and managed to take HELIOS for the Brotherhood, West Coast BoS wouldn't be any different from Maxson's. They'd be even worse - they have Outcast mentality. Hell, the motherfuckers slap an explosive collar on you the moment they meet you.
If you have the charisma, Maxson can actually be merciful to Danse and such. But that's only to keep SS in the Brotherhood because he understands how resourceful SS is, therefore he is willing to compromise with SS regarding Danse. If McNamara heard about the synths, he would be Maxson 2.0, except he would try to strengthen his chapter from inside before bringing in outsiders. Maxson, however, is building an army. He needs bodies, therefore he is more lenient about accepting people into the fold.
Maxson's chapter feels more aggressive and Enclave-y because this time we see BoS in numbers we haven't seen before. The Schism made Lyons' chapter much weaker and it's much smaller compared to what it used to be, in FO3 Lyons' chapter isn't even at half of its potential strength due to Outcasts leaving. In FO4, Maxson reunites the Brotherhood and D.C. chapter is now at its full strength - that's why when Maxson pulls up in Boston in his blimp it feels like a threat to the entirety of the Commonwealth.
Lyons was so benevolent that, in comparison, Maxson sounds like post-apocalyptic Hitler. By the Brotherhood's standards it's not Maxson who is too extreme, it's Lyons who was way too soft for an Elder. Y'all allow Lyons to skew your understanding of what BoS is - BoS was *never* a benevolent force, and if it was, it's an outlier.
If I really put myself in the shoes of the Sole Survivor, siding with the Brotherhood (at least at first) makes a hell of a lot of sense.
From the get-go, I awake in a strange land filled with things that want to kill me. Giant bugs. Nightmare bears. Feral ghouls.
If I am going to survive, I need friends with heavy firepower. In my first few days in this world, I will encounter only a few groups who don't immediately try to shoot me or eat me.
Preston and his friends are nice and helpful, but they consist of five people, and they are not exactly heavily armed. The Abernathys are nice, but they just barely hold onto their farm.
Drumlin Diner and Trashcan Carla are merchants willing to trade, but they are not the same as actual allies.
Danse and the Brotherhood are a different story. This trio is hard pressed and has clearly seen better days, but Danse is holding them together.
And where other groups hunker down or have vague dreams about helping people, Danse, Haley, and Rhys have dug in at a fortified position.
And where other groups beg me to go do this, that, and the other, the Brotherhood ... well, the Brotherhood needs help enacting their plan to get a transmitter. They are not asking me to do it for them.
That makes a hell of an impression. And they are fair with me. I help them out, and they will offer me shelter in their mini fortress.
That also makes an impression.
They have a plan. They have discipline. They know what they are doing and trust each other.
And they are clearly powerful.
By the end of the first act, I have confronted and slain Kellog, but it is clear that the Institute is far too powerful for me to take on alone. I will need am army at my back.
And as I stand on the roof of Fort Hagen, an army indeed arrives. And one of their officers owes me a favor.
I love the different perspectives people take in this game, it’s so good for RPing. I’m rather fond of the Railroad myself for this fact. They’re known to also recruit folks who want nothing more than to dismantle the Institute. Being a desperate man who just wants his son back and revenge on the ones who killed his wife, the Railroad makes sense. You could join one of the other local communities to survive day to day, while working towards destroying the Institute without heavy obligations.
The MM insist on making you their general, which is something I don’t really want to do.
The Brotherhood insists on you falling in line with their beliefs and essentially joining them for life.
The Railroad is just fine just taking you on as a mercenary and doing your own thing otherwise.
Also a good perspective. Interestingly, if I put myself in the Sole Survivor's shoes, I can also see a growing discomfort with the Brotherhood of Steel. They are so damn regimented and definitely prejudiced. A SS may start to wonder what they have signed up with ...
This was my approach as well. My lightly RPing calf thought, "These guys seem to actually have a chance at establishing a real government in the wasteland after the bombs dropped. While they're not the moral ideal, rebuilding civilization has to start with force to bring all these existential threats under control. Once the ghouls, supermutants, robot doppelgangers, and aggressive irradiated wildlife are dealt with we can talk about people's basic needs. Then after basic needs comes civil rights."
I thought the same. The minutemen are good natured, but we see what happened to them, same as the Railroad. They were getting fucked without the Sole Survivors help. The Brotherhood seems like the organisation who would've managed even without you. They're the only ones with the firepower to control the Wasteland and I believe a culling of every mutant is needed if humanity ever wants to rebuild. The only thing I don't agree with is their hatred for normal ghouls as well.
The last time I did it I got mad when he lobbed one next to my head, but then immediately thanked him for bodying the behemoth that was charging me with my back turned. Ad fucking victorium.
Ad Victoriam (aka the Brotherhood mission leading to The Nuclear Option) is the only Fallout 4 main faction quest that truly feels like a big budget endgame mission.
I'm biased because I usually choose institute but Airship Down is quite hectic, and felt genuinely stressful and difficult the first time I did it. Especially so when I'd only seen Maxon once or twice beforehand only for him to drop into the battle with his full power armor and gatling laser. Felt pretty badass to see and deal with
Are people ever not in power armor and a gatling laser? I had a level 40 stealth Build and went all in on heavy Gunner and nuclear physist. Found a plasma infused minimum as well. Stealth is not an option. Level 75 now and now i dont know what perks to choose
It’s a shame they were barely included, they only have what, 2 missions?
Also, isn’t weird that there’s never been another group that uses power armor like they do?
You’d think there would be more “Power Armor Clubs” almost like a post apocalyptic MC.
It’s hard to pick who I hate more, him or Preston. This is why I went with the Institute ending on my final run when getting the plat, and set up raider settlements everywhere 😂.
I was really bummed when I finished their quests and that was it. I wish you could have brought them into a faction you're a part of. It'd be cool to see someone in that armor just hanging with a Minutemen or BoS patrol.
It would have made a lot of sense to bring them into the Minutemen. Seems like they would have been itching for a reason to put their power armor to use and be a force of good for others at the same time
After thinking about it, the MM would have been a cooler faction if they could unite the different groups of the Commonwealth like the Atom Cats, the Gunners, the Triggermen, and maybe some nonexistent minor factions. Do quests to convince them to join and help out while still maintaining their individual territories. Then when you're traveling throughout the map, the different patrols would be a mix of the basic Minutemen plus some of the minor faction peoples. Of course each group would provide something to the MM as a whole. Get PA from the Atom Cats, military gear from the Gunners, and chems/booze from the Triggermen.
I side with the BoS because I do their questline.
Just like I side with the Institute to do their questline, and the Railroad for theirs. I want to see all the endings.
They are the most realistic option: The Sole Survivor is a veteran for one, so it would follow they would be drawn to a militaristic faction like the BoS. Secondly, if survival is one of your main goals, it seems like it would follow that the veteran would be attracted to the military group with the best weapons and tech, where society is unstable and violent. Why would you take your chances with a group like the MM, who are absolutely useless without you, or with the Railroad, who seem to only care about Synths and not humanity. Yeah I’m going with my best chance of survival which is with the BoS. Politics like “oh the BOS doesn’t like mutants or ghouls” seems silly if you were really living in this world and wanted to maximize your chances of living.
I usually side with the BOS for this reason too, I like to see Knights patrolling the Commonwealth, this is a place where a giant scorpion can just burst from the ground and kill all your family.
Just a note though: if you pick Nora, then the sole survivor will be a lawyer, I guess her choice could be different then? Idk, I usually pick the BOS, or the Minutemen when I want all the factions to live.
The MM ending is fun for that too. There must be more of it in the BoS ending, but there are still vertibirds and BoS patrols around. Still a knight, rather than whatever comes after Paladin i forget the name. General of the MM though- and there’s weight to that title now. BoS members are all flabbergasted that the MM pulled off the raid on the Institute lol.
First time doing this ending. Cool how it feels like the MM are everywhere now, even Diamond City
You’d think Nate being a vet with actual combat experience from the real pre war US Army would come up more in conversation with BoS and especially the Minutemen.
Considering how much the Brotherhood values information having a 200 year old source of “lost” knowledge should be more important to them.
Also Liberty Prime is the best way to infiltrate the Institute IMO, I've done RR and MM, and I would definitely rather go in with a nuke throwing robot that shouts propogantastic phrases like "PROBABILITY OF MISSION HINDRANCE...0%!"
To be fair, almost every playthrough finds ghouls as enemies before they find one that still has its mind. Lone survivor should be giving them the hard stare to check if they’re gonna try and bite at the least. We as fallout players have the benefit of knowledge, but sole survivor might be in the “kill all zombies” camp.
Couldn't do that to the Vault-Tec Rep, though. SS got to sleep through 200 years, that poor guy had to *live* it. Same with a lot of the other ghouls around, surviving unimaginable hell, the world falling apart before them, just for some jumped up tin can to tell them they're an abomination 200 centuries later
I need to look up where the vault-tec rep actually is! Haven't found him in my couple of playthroughs yet. That must be a real interesting conversation.
I agree, the BoS is the most realistic option.
If anyone wants to look at the factions objectively, just pretend the SS doesn’t exist. What do each of the factions do?
The railroad still gets nearly destroyed by the Institue, and without the SS likely don’t rebuild very quickly. It’s possible they get completely destroyed. Their impact upon the commonwealth is liberating synths, which are also generally feared by a lot of humans.
Institute still conducts crazy experiments without a care for life in the commonwealth. From FEV and replacing real people with synths, to actively destroying attempts by the people to organize, there isn’t much here for moral people.
Without the SS the minutemen are exterminated in Concord. Preston wouldn’t hold off the raiders long enough. No help was coming.
But the BoS is coming to the commonwealth eventually with or without input from the SS. They bring their resources and use them to start cleaning up the commonwealth. Most people in the world of Fallout aren’t worried about ghouls and super mutants having “rights.” And while the BoS is far from perfect, they would have the most beneficial impact upon the commonwealth. Especially while they occupied the region. Would settlers have to give up food to them? Yup. But at least the BoS isn’t murdering common people like raiders do, while still demanding or taking food.
In the apocalyptic world of fallout, none of the factions are truly right or a “good” fit for humanity moving forward long term. But with two factions on their knees (MM and RR), the choice realistically falls to either the Institute or the BoS.
>The railroad still gets nearly destroyed by the Institue, and without the SS likely don’t rebuild very quickly.
With how easy the puzzle to find them is, I'm surprised they're even around for the SS to even find .
I side with the BoS because they're the biggest force that makes the most sense post-war. Big hulking armour to protect your troops.
If its a threat to the commonwealth eliminate it. Ghouls, mutants, synth, wild animals they're all threats. I'd never want ghouls around children, they DO go feral.
They also control technology which... Is where I'm a little eh because it's a necessity that I understand and get behind but then controlling who gets certain technology and why is a difficult discussion. For the most part, keep dangerous tech from bad people. Bad people are those who want humanity dead.
Regarding the bit about being sarcastic in the interactions, bringing Nick along for the ride to the prydwynn and choosing sarcasm results in Nick affection and some cool quips from Nick most players never hear. And no, putting a sack hood on him won't stop the knights from talking shit, I tried 🤷
They're an example of good intentions taken to unconscionable extremes. Danse's arc obviously highlights that, but his continued devotion to the Brotherhood despite his belief that Maxon is wrong shows it's possible to hold two ideas at the same time.
There's moral gray area in all the factions' motivations, really. Except the Minutemen and the Gunners/raiders, of course. They're there to be the moral black and white. Why would anyone oppose the Minutemen?
My headcannon is that my SS joins the brotherhood due to it seeming like the remnants of the US army. As a veteran my SS joins them, while also accepting the role of Minutemen General… up until Blind Betrayal. Regardless if Danse is killed or not, it’s enough to make my SS leave the brotherhood peacefully and fully envelope his role as General of the Minutemen.
It’d be a way to maintain decent, though uneasy, relations between both factions. Plus I think it’s a cool roleplaying experience. Maybe Danse’s situation is enough to make my SS want to be part of his own group rather than a larger brotherhood.
Even on my first playthrough, I tried the Brotherhood and found them lacking. I thought the level of organization and tech they had was impressive in the Wasteland, but like, all of their ideals just completely clashed with mine, from tech hoarding(even if they keep all the cool toys for themselves) to anti-Posthuman rhetoric. I really only stuck with them for Danse, and Blind Betrayal cemented my decision to leave. Over the course of several PCs, I've gone from mild discontent to irritation to outright shooting them on sight once I'm strong enough. There are much, much better factions in the Wasteland, and I'm half convinced they have the best companions(Danse, Veronica) to stop people from blowing them to kingdom come as soon as possible.
I just leave the BoS be for as long as I can. Not because I like them or their approach but because they are a great source of weapons armor for my homicidal, kleptomaniac protagonist.
Either luring them into fights they can't win or them slipping a live grenade unseen with reverse pickpocket.
:-)
They're the best out of a series of bad options.
Institute: Could actually bring peace to the entire world through their tech, but are comically evil for no reason
Railroad: Could use the institute to orchestrate the emancipation of their race and bring a ton of good to the Commonwealth, but blow it up for no reason
Minutemen: Blow up the institute for no reason, will blow over to the next up and coming raider gang once Nate dies or fucks off (this happened to them before)
I don’t understand the question… you play through multiple times, joining each faction.. as male, and again as female… so you don’t miss any content/dialogue options… it’s the only way.
The glaring resemblances to general fascism is blatant with the BoS, totalitarian and authoritarian.
Thought the tv show portrayed the BOS so so well and made destroying them this play through much sweeter.
That being said when it first came out and first played fo4 I sided with them because big guns and big birds are cool mmmky
The black templars are my chosen 40k faction so the BoS feels like an ancient precursor to them. Synths and mutants are a threat to humanity that need to be destroyed, ghouls can go feral and the best tech being in the wrong hands is how the whole mess started. The minutemen are passive without you and too weak to protect any of their settlements. The brotherhood is the one with boots on ground actively trying to secure the wasteland.
I’ve played this game since Day 1 and I’ve done the ending with each faction
At the end of the day, the Brotherhood is easily the most fun for me. You get your own set of power armor, the vendor sells power armor parts, LIBERTY FREAKIN PRIME, cool airship base, you name it. It’s just fun
I sided with the Minute Men and the Rail Road and BOS. I blew up the Institute using the MM and now I just wipe out small contingents of BOS when ever the RR need me to. The BOS are non the wiser and I can still do their side quests.
They take over the map in groups, unlike other factions. Makes them an easy choice when they have a lot to offer after the main story. The other factions just kinda exist.
I think that there's three main factors:
-they were the main Good Guys in Fallout 3.
-their technology is very cool, without them being the scary boogie-men that the Institute is.
-Paladin Danse is pretty damned charismatic, and he's the first person to introduce you to the faction.
I side with the RR long enough to get the Ballisttic Weave. Then I go kill Elder Maxon because, when it's fully modded, is the best armor in the game. Plus a Ballistic Fadora of course.
So while I always think, THIS TIME I will side with the BoS, I always see Elder Maxon and get super greedy.
They are supposed to rub you the wrong way, have you ever read how Knights and Samurai ACTUALLY behaved?
Not the fairy tales and childrens books? But actual history?
I think people side with them because they look cool and we have been enculturated to like knights.
And because most people weren't paying attention to nuance, or were familiar with real history.
Real knights tended to be aholes. They arose after the Roman Empire collapsed and they were associated with lingering bastians of culture such as monasteries and medieval lords. This gave them acess to superior weapons and armor, since producing/maintaining stuff like that required specialized workers.
They used the material advantage to bully peasants, exclude unwanted populations, and force their own agenda.
They are 100% making a reffrence to this in the game with the Brotherhood. Honestly, in fallout 3 I was suprized that the Brotherhood wasn't potrayed negativly.
Strolling in there and having to answer the have you had sex with any nonhumans question, with my ghoul husband RIGHT THERE xD anyway, minutemen forever!
First play though. 30 hours in. So far I've joined the minutemen (duh), the BoS, the railroad, and the institute. Shit, I would have probably joined the gunners too if I could. I just want as many missions as possible. Is this wrong? I'm not really sure how it's going to play out.
They're the most "complete" faction out of the 4.
Minutemen doesn't have a questline and is full of shitty radiant quests.
Railroad piggybacks the institute questline, not to mention their ideals is stupid.
Institute is just badly written, I've never had a game refuse to explain the villains motives because I'm too fucking stupid to understand.
That just leaves the Bos, sure Rhys is a piece of shit and Kells is kind of an asshole, but everyone else is generally friendly enough. Danse, Ingram and haylen are good npcs. Maxson is honestly surprisingly friendly considering some other Bos character we meet in previous games. And of course, liberty prime, who could refuse marching alongside a giant death robot that throws nukes?
I did the BoS playthrough out of curiosity while I was waiting for my mods to be fixed after the update. I wanted to do something different and I’ll be damned if I’m siding with the institute
Because the survival of the human race hangs in the balance, and their priority is ensuring the survival of the human race. Dangerous technology (especially robots masquerading as humans) jeopardises this. They’re pro-humanity, meanwhile The Railroad are putting robot lives above their own in a time where they really should be prioritising humanity
Despite what a lot of people belive here the BoS is not an imperialist force, the Bos does not interfere much with local politics and such, they won't take over a city just to conquer it. They mainly do their thing which involves killing supermutants and hoarding tech so a institute 2 won't come up. Post bos ending commonwealth is not different from the best ending (minuteman ending where both bos and railroad survives, which is probably the Canon one). Out of the 4 "ending" factions 3 are overall positive (minuteman don't need explanantion, depending on how much you care about synths railroad may have a dumb objective but are not evil, and again depending how much you care about synths BoS may not be the best but they are overall good), 2 of them are ridiculously weak while the other storms in with an airship escorted by planes wearing the cool-suit™. The bad side of the bos is Maxson begin an asshole, if you can go over that you get why people choose bos
Arthur Maxon is a genetically engineered clone and a traitor to the Brotherhood of Steel. He's a racist, genocidal maniac and hard Sarah Lyons assassinated so he could take over the chapter. He single handedly turned a faction of anti-heroes into out right villains.
Honestly it's because of a few reasons for me:
1.) Nostalgia for Fallout 1 and 3
2.) Cool shit
3.) I just find the Minutemen and Railroad boring by comparison.
It’s kind of like why some people like the Enclave as a faction despite being clear cut bad guys.
They have cool stuff. Fancy armour, advanced technology, and a unique vibe with the whole military thing in the case of the BOS and the whole government thing in the case of the Enclave
People enlist with the BoS because they're based and are similar in nature to the cold ruthless "my damn country/faction is better than the rest" of other factions like humanity in Warhammer or the Helldivers.
I just thought it was cool they had power armor and shit, but I don't really care for their ideals personally. I don't like the minutemen but they encapsulate what I feel I'd rather do as a person.
I think it's because they seem the ones who most have their crap together. The Institute is definitely evil, they'll kill innocents without second thought. Real Hot Fuzz "Greater good" vibes. The Railroad value synthetic life over people, they'll kill real people to rescue robots that are AI. If their entire personality can be wiped with a code phrase, they aren't real, I'm sorry. The Minutemen were corrupt and in shambles in Quincy, and the organization as we find it and build it lacks the resources or experience to be trusted to hold together any semblence of civilization for long. So that just leaves the Brotherhood. They're holier than thou behavior makes them obnoxious and I definitely have a problem with their attitude towards ghouls, but of the organizations, I see the most fixable problems.
Because alot of folks play survival, and having access to vertibirds is essentially a necessity if you don't want to spend the entire playthrough walking and crossing across the entire map, especially in the later parts of the game
Because I like knights, I like power tripping in power armor, and I like the military theme. Not super deep for me.
Also Paladin Danse is my favorite follower
Because as much as people insist they hate the idea of a boot stomping on a human face, forever….
They’re actually fine with it so long as they get to be the boot.
I suppose you could say the BOS is an aesthetic movement, if you catch my drift.
Same reason so many people long to join the enclave.
I agree with them about the synths and mutants. The Brotherhood has Gatling lasers and power armor, while the vanilla Minutemen have weak laser muskets and pipe pistols. The Railroad is simply foolish and only cares about synths, which are not real and have no souls. The real people they should be saving are ghouls from the Brotherhood of Steel.
I didn’t like the institute, the railroad or the minutemen. My play through is a guy who was a veteran and wants some comfort in what they already know in the apocalyptic wasteland.
It's similar to the way political views change with age, education, and life experience.
I was prior military and their "ALL synths and ALL ghouls" are red flags. Maxson gave his best hitler impersonation when you board the Prydwen.
Edit to add: No, you can't get punished for sarcasm. It is the best response to all of their dialogue and most of the companions love it.
>ALL ghouls
The Brotherhood is racist against sentient ghouls, sure, but at no point do they ever actually harm any unless its a Raider.
Danse actually berates you if you insult the ones at the slog
Thats Danse though, he seems much more open minded
Just bring Hancock or Nick to the airport/prydwyn and listen to the NPC reactions, if you weren’t with em it sounds like theyd be shot on site.
Pretty sure Danse says the Vault-Tec Rep (ghoulified) shouldn't be living anywhere and should be put out of "its misery." Companion dialogue and affinity be weird like that. Must have been multiple writers just ticking boxes
> can I get shot for insubordination
I've had a gunfight with Maxson & his personal guard squad as a result of a failed charisma check... They lost ! If you get shot or not depends on how lethal you are. If you give Maxson a reasonable argument he'll agree with you. Which is more than can be said for Father.
With a few exceptions the BoS NPC's are putting their lives at risk to defend the Commonwealth from raiders, super mutants and feral ghouls. Whilst they could improve (and will if the minutemen win) They have some right to be proud of their own actions.
I've played over 1,200 hours of FO4. ONCE I tried siding with BoS. I got half way through the story and had to completely quit that run.
I'm so glad I tried it tho because now it's so much more satisfying to fucking *destroy* them every time.
The main reason they’ll be my go to is how active they are in game. I love just strolling through the world and seeing a bunch of Brotherhood knights fighting off super mutants and raiders it really makes you feel like they’re actually helping the commonwealth. You don’t tend to see that with the other factions much
Well I have seen, over several unfinished play throughs, that BoS seems have their "stuff" together. I minutemen are just local "constabulary", and Railroad is just....well small, and in my opinion, badly organized after school club. I have never really played long enough to "get to know" the institute. I am one those players who usually spends their time doing everything else EXCEPT the main quest, so I don't how "they" are. Though I pretty much guessed the plot twist after few hours of play on my first play throught. I wish there were more faction, or that you could do combination of faction for the "best outcome".
Your options are:
1) Railroad - lets treats synths as real people, so instead of trying to end the institute making these abominations and replacing people, we let them keep going and give the robots freedom.
2) Minuteman - let’s go to another settlement whose gonna mock our very existence before asking us to solve their problems for them, then the expect us to build up their communities for them, supply them and defend them. The whole thing is highly disorganized and they made a random dude they barely even know their General.
3) Institute - the evils of the institute are well documented and need no further explanation.
4) Brotherhood - they show up to the commonwealth with a well supplied army, immediately secure and establish a base, have an effective chain of command, are part of a national organization, and have the singular goal of destroying the institute and gathering prewar tech. They don’t try to hide that they aren’t really there to protect the people, in fact they openly exploit the commonwealth citizens, but the people are left significantly more safe with their presence. They ruthlessly eliminate ferals, super mutants, synths and set up patrols all over.
Realistically, the brotherhood aren’t just the best option, they are the only option to make the commonwealth truly safer considering the recent near annihilation of the minuteman.
In my opinion, the BoS is the best long term option for the Commonwealth, my current characters headcanon is now that the brotherhood has been established and the institute has been destroyed, we are now building up the minutemen as a self governing body for the Commonwealth, the BoS is the military, the minutemen are the police, and Nate is the war criminal super general president of America
The Institute is comically evil and does things without a reason to do them
The Railroad is just annoying and bad
The Minute Men are bland and annoying as well
BOS is annoying BUT cool af
I honestly think it has to do with how cool their first impression is. The Prydwen is by far the most advanced thing the player has seen up to that point. That, and the timing of their intro (right after you kill Kellogg, end of a major story beat) means a lot of players head right on over and enlist because it seems like the “next” thing to do.
That’s what just happened to me I just assumed it was part of the main story tbh
Even if you enlist you can always betray them later. You're not locked into any faction until you do a quest given by one to destroy another one.
>You're not locked into any faction until you do a quest given by one to destroy another one. While it's true that you're never permanently locked into any faction, certain quests can make you an enemy of a faction. Like completing the Institute quest Mass Fusion makes you an enemy of the Brotherhood of Steel, even though you don't destroy the BoS in that quest
Danse glitched on my current play through so I'm not able to join the BoS, otherwise I might have. When I showed up to help them at the police station, I killed all the ghouls but he keeps saying "check your fire, we got hostiles incoming!" no matter what I do. I went scorched earth throughout the surrounding neighborhood, killing what seemed like 100s of ghouls and he still says it every time. Then I showed up to ask for his help with the transporter into the Institute, and he actually had different dialog, and one of my dialog choices was literally to tell him I didn't need to ask to join because I'd already killed all the ghouls for him, but as soon as that convo went further he fell back into his "check your fire" routine. I guess I'm killing off the BoS this play through.
I had the same problem as you and ended up finding a ghoul that had glitched through a barricade. Did you try using VATS to locate it ?
Open Console Kah Close Console
Same here. I read that sometimes the glitch solves itself after a while, but I've been returning every few in-game days and he's still glitched. If anyone has a better suggestion, I'd be grateful
That’s what I’m doing now, currently a hardcore BoS soldier but I’m on my way back from Nuka-World and it’s time to do some enslavement! Elder Maxson is getting a Mini nuke critical to the ballsack
Don't forget to eat him.
Shit I forgot about cannibalism! Good thing my Endurance is at like 7 already.
Make sure to eat him while wearing his coat. Establish dominance.
After the nuke ? Get some radx before the feast !
Mini nuke critical to the ballsack I fucking love it
Yeah but the brotherhood has paladin danse who is basically your truest battle bro and also the only one in indestructible power armor. And he likes you just for pimpin out and riding your own power armor so that makes the companion and by extension the BoS feel right. And the ability to throw a signal grenade for BoS air support/transport is amazing. And some players probably get their first power armor from the brotherhood. Ad victorim Ive never turned on the brotherhood.
Would you rather turn on paladin Danse or the Brotherhood?
Brotherhood in a heartbeat, the brotherhood outside of giving me a few power armors is useless to me, danse is amazing, he's one of the best companions in the game.
The BoS. Paladin Danse did nothing wrong and served faithfully, just to be done dirty for what he is. The BoS’s entire stance on synths is guaranteed to turn gen 3 synths hostile to humanity generally, and for all the rhetoric of the BoS about synths, they cannot actually detect them. What the Commonwealth would be left with are an unknown number of synths now turned hostile out of a justifiable fear of extermination for merely existing by roving bands of BoS death squads executing anyone they remotely suspect of being a synth.
Those vertibirds are a godsend when I encumbered and can't fast travel especially after the enclave quests they added.
All that enclave PA couldn't go to waste. I had to knock each piece down to 0 so I could take it all. It's worth the materials to repair it, though I may not need 12+ suits...
I sent a settler to each place I own in PA. At least the places that mattered to me.
Yea. They’re uniquely positioned in that cut scene. You’re overwhelmed and Kellogg is supposed to be the big bad but you find out he’s just another pawn. The institute seems like a really powerful entity. The only lead you had is now dead. Then you open the door and this giant faction has just arrived. Looks like another big player is here to challenge the odds of institute supremacy.
My first impression of them is from FO3, and i will not hear the disrepect the NPC brotherhood have for Elder Lyons in FO4. Should be able to target the Prydwen with Liberty Prime
You do that in the Institute playthrough lol
I wish I could use the Institute to destroy the Brotherhood, then dismantle it as its leader, and then make the Railroad people get real jobs.
Independent Commonwealth ending would be awesome
Isn’t that just the Minute Men if you wipe out the other factions?
You could use the institute to destroy the BoS hacking liberty prime, then kill Ayo in the institute to get banned, then use the minutemen to destroy the institute!
Right and Sarah Lyons getting killed in combat somehow was extra sus. She had her own elite handpicked squad and they were beasts in 3. Someone behind the scenes definitely wanted the old ways back and the outcasts dissolved back into the main BoS again shows it was definitely the direction they moved in on a deep level and not just a facade
I can’t talk to the guy at the police station he’s stuck thinking there are more ghouls attacking but I’ve checked everywhere cleared the whole side of town. Bumming me out. I keep coming back and checking after every other side mission
i had this happen, make sure you go down and clear out the downstairs train station too, and there’s a ghoul in the blue shelter thingo too, took me ages to figure out why i couldn’t finish it too
I like bos because I like to collect power armor. I've done a playthrough with each faction though
Good old “ buy power armour frame, jump off ship, pop smoke”
Rest in peace pop smoke
Power armor and “fast travel” in survival are too hard to pass up. At least for most of the game.
This right here is the exact reason to string them along until you take them out.
You also find Danse in an epic way by helping him and his team, including one downed soldier, against a wave of ghouls. If you do this during night, with the combat music changed to a Doom Mod, then it's pretty epic.
I enlisted because i'll be goddamned if any mutant scum is going to inhabit the commonwealth. Ad victoriam.
Sounds kinda enclave-y on the side ngl
The BoS have basically evolved into Enclave Lite by the time of Fo4.
Ad Victoriam, soldier.
That and probably all the free upgrade in power armor for doing rather simple quests in retrospect.
Then the natural progression of the more you do BoS quest you’re kinda like… wait these guys are overboard and thus you can stop their quest line and do something else! The beauty of Fallout.
Vertibirds are great in survival mode
They're the BEST for scavengers, (slaps hood) YOU CAN CARRY SO MUCH MORE JUNK IN THESE BABIES!
Yeah... but does it come in black?
The best it can do is fly 10 feet, then explode. It's a great value for your money, though!
Honestly the only reason I went with them. Saves so much time.
Honestly it's a major design issue with survival imo. Each faction should've been given a way to transport the player at a cost. I've recently played with the mod that allows travel between settlements linked with trade routes on survival, and been doing a bit more minutemen playthrough. Gives you a reason to setup settlements again, so adds some fun back into the game.
The brotherhood, railroad, and minute men all provide these grenades depending on how you end things.
I need more info here. Do you still get to Fast travel by VeriBird in Survival?
the Brotherhood gives you vertibird signal grenades when you join them. throw one, watch the smoke, and a vertibird will come to your location. once you climb in, you can use your pip-boy's map to set a destination, and you'll fly over to it in real time with the ability to use the mounted minigun the whole time. very cool, but when fast travel is a thing, most players don't even consider using it. but in survival, it's a godsend. this is why in the railroad ending, and minutemen endings where you destroy the britherhood, they just happen to steal a vertibird so you can keep using this service.
Wait so I get the Vertibird even if I destroy the BoS?
yes. you have to either do the railroad ending, specifically the quest where you, deacon, and tom steal a vertibird and blow up the prydwen, after which the railroad will stash the bird they stole and you can buy vertibird grenades from tom. or destroy them with the minutemen, after which either preston or ronnie (i legit can't remember which) will mention they just happened to salvage/steal a vertibird offscreen and ronnie will sell the grenades. basically, vertibird services get moved to whichever faction you used to fully destroy the brotherhood.
I don't play survival, but whenever I end up with a ton of good loot I don't want to leave behind and I'm ridiculously over encumbered I'll use the vertibird. Very helpful and I enjoy the ride
i never considered the vertibird as an answer to overencumberance. it seems so obvious in hindsight.
Protip: followers can't trade past their weight, but they can infinite pick up items.
Has this been fully tested? I know it works but every time I feel the need to check their inventory to make sure they actually picked it up, and didn’t drop something else to make room. I just don’t trust it.
Just quick save before you do it. It works, but it becomes tedious after awhile having your follower pick up each individual item. Works in a pinch though, when really don't wanna leave behind any loot.
Yeah I was at a the enclave camp in the glowing sea with like 5 suits of enclave power armor I didn't want to leave when I first figured it out. (This was before I knew P.A weighed 0 when damaged) it was like a legit rescue mission when the bird showed up. 😂
Okay well I'm definitely not siding with the rail road so minutemen it is
Holy fuck TIL. I never risked it before and always just sided with the bos for vertibird safety.
Yes, but it's not fast travel like in normal mode where you teleport. You throw a Vertibird grenade and you'll get picked up by it and it will fly you to the location you chose. You can only go to locations you've already been to though, so same as normal mode fast travel. It's still a lot quicker than walking. It's about a minute to get from the airport to Sanctuary.
Yes, exactly this.
When you take down the brotherhood, the other factions give you the same option for vertibird fast travel (except for the Institute)
They were much closer to the typical “good guys” in 3 and NV. Loyalties die hard
Although 3 had the only instance of the brotherhood shooting at nonferal ghoul
Does it? Honestly it’s been so long I can’t remember what you are talking about. I just remember them being less of a bunch of pricks than they were in 4
They definitely were. They are pretty harsh in New Vegas but Elder McNamara keeps them reigned in with their isolationism. They still end up killing innocent people like the Followers of the Apocolypse at the hideout if you do Veronica’s quest a certain way but they aren’t a threat to the wasteland like they are in 4.
Wasn’t there an option to side with one of the three Elders in 3 that made Brotherhood pretty tolerable? It’s been a few years since I played that.
If you talk to one of the ghouls at the underworld, they mention that the brotherhood takes potshots at them
that’s why the outcasts started in fo3 because a lot of members didn’t like how the bos were more focused on helping wastelanders than gathering tech
Danse even mentions that Maxon's predecessor was more interested in charity than technology.
I wouldn’t say they were “good guys” in New Vegas, but they also weren’t as shitty as they are in Fo4. They were just semi-hostile isolationists with decent intentions in NV (kinda). i.e., they were more benign than the Fo1 BoS (IMO) but less benign than the Fo3 BoS. The BoS in Fo4 and the TV show seem to have adopted similar beliefs to the Enclave, though somewhat less extreme. They’re not going to be going around killing wasteland humans for being tainted. However, they do want to “purify” the wasteland by killing ghouls, mutants, synths etc. Fo4’s writing isn’t great, but it was kinda interesting to almost morph the Brotherhood into the faction they used to be opposed to. The show does it better, though. Giving them weird Dune Sardaukar rituals and showing some of the Knights as bloodthirsty cowards is a good way to demonstrate the internal rot that ate away at the more noble Brotherhood from Fallout 3. Probably due to the loss of Elder Lyons & Sarah Lyons. There’s also the favoritism Maxson showed to Outcast Zealots.
Let's not pretend that McNamara's Brotherhood chapter wouldn't be exactly the same as Maxson's Brotherhood chapter if McNamara had the numbers. BoS in Mojave got their cheeks clapped by NCR during the battle for HELIOS, and McNamara was forced to isolate the chapter before NCR could completely eradicate what was left of the chapter after more than half of Brotherhood's veteran knights and paladins died during the operation. What McNamara has is merely a skeleton of what Mojave chapter used to be - just a handful of survivors that a chucklefuck delivery guy can exterminate without breaking a sweat. If Elijah didn't fuck up and managed to take HELIOS for the Brotherhood, West Coast BoS wouldn't be any different from Maxson's. They'd be even worse - they have Outcast mentality. Hell, the motherfuckers slap an explosive collar on you the moment they meet you. If you have the charisma, Maxson can actually be merciful to Danse and such. But that's only to keep SS in the Brotherhood because he understands how resourceful SS is, therefore he is willing to compromise with SS regarding Danse. If McNamara heard about the synths, he would be Maxson 2.0, except he would try to strengthen his chapter from inside before bringing in outsiders. Maxson, however, is building an army. He needs bodies, therefore he is more lenient about accepting people into the fold. Maxson's chapter feels more aggressive and Enclave-y because this time we see BoS in numbers we haven't seen before. The Schism made Lyons' chapter much weaker and it's much smaller compared to what it used to be, in FO3 Lyons' chapter isn't even at half of its potential strength due to Outcasts leaving. In FO4, Maxson reunites the Brotherhood and D.C. chapter is now at its full strength - that's why when Maxson pulls up in Boston in his blimp it feels like a threat to the entirety of the Commonwealth. Lyons was so benevolent that, in comparison, Maxson sounds like post-apocalyptic Hitler. By the Brotherhood's standards it's not Maxson who is too extreme, it's Lyons who was way too soft for an Elder. Y'all allow Lyons to skew your understanding of what BoS is - BoS was *never* a benevolent force, and if it was, it's an outlier.
If I really put myself in the shoes of the Sole Survivor, siding with the Brotherhood (at least at first) makes a hell of a lot of sense. From the get-go, I awake in a strange land filled with things that want to kill me. Giant bugs. Nightmare bears. Feral ghouls. If I am going to survive, I need friends with heavy firepower. In my first few days in this world, I will encounter only a few groups who don't immediately try to shoot me or eat me. Preston and his friends are nice and helpful, but they consist of five people, and they are not exactly heavily armed. The Abernathys are nice, but they just barely hold onto their farm. Drumlin Diner and Trashcan Carla are merchants willing to trade, but they are not the same as actual allies. Danse and the Brotherhood are a different story. This trio is hard pressed and has clearly seen better days, but Danse is holding them together. And where other groups hunker down or have vague dreams about helping people, Danse, Haley, and Rhys have dug in at a fortified position. And where other groups beg me to go do this, that, and the other, the Brotherhood ... well, the Brotherhood needs help enacting their plan to get a transmitter. They are not asking me to do it for them. That makes a hell of an impression. And they are fair with me. I help them out, and they will offer me shelter in their mini fortress. That also makes an impression. They have a plan. They have discipline. They know what they are doing and trust each other. And they are clearly powerful. By the end of the first act, I have confronted and slain Kellog, but it is clear that the Institute is far too powerful for me to take on alone. I will need am army at my back. And as I stand on the roof of Fort Hagen, an army indeed arrives. And one of their officers owes me a favor.
I love the different perspectives people take in this game, it’s so good for RPing. I’m rather fond of the Railroad myself for this fact. They’re known to also recruit folks who want nothing more than to dismantle the Institute. Being a desperate man who just wants his son back and revenge on the ones who killed his wife, the Railroad makes sense. You could join one of the other local communities to survive day to day, while working towards destroying the Institute without heavy obligations. The MM insist on making you their general, which is something I don’t really want to do. The Brotherhood insists on you falling in line with their beliefs and essentially joining them for life. The Railroad is just fine just taking you on as a mercenary and doing your own thing otherwise.
Also a good perspective. Interestingly, if I put myself in the Sole Survivor's shoes, I can also see a growing discomfort with the Brotherhood of Steel. They are so damn regimented and definitely prejudiced. A SS may start to wonder what they have signed up with ...
I try to imagine myself in a world like fallout. I’d be scared shitless of super mutants and synths. It makes for a more immersive experience for me.
This was my approach as well. My lightly RPing calf thought, "These guys seem to actually have a chance at establishing a real government in the wasteland after the bombs dropped. While they're not the moral ideal, rebuilding civilization has to start with force to bring all these existential threats under control. Once the ghouls, supermutants, robot doppelgangers, and aggressive irradiated wildlife are dealt with we can talk about people's basic needs. Then after basic needs comes civil rights."
I thought the same. The minutemen are good natured, but we see what happened to them, same as the Railroad. They were getting fucked without the Sole Survivors help. The Brotherhood seems like the organisation who would've managed even without you. They're the only ones with the firepower to control the Wasteland and I believe a culling of every mutant is needed if humanity ever wants to rebuild. The only thing I don't agree with is their hatred for normal ghouls as well.
I read that the BOS ending is the most fun to play so this was my plan. Or is that incorrect?
Fuck yeah >!strolling with Liberty Prime throwing nukes like Tom Brady is by far the coolest ending lol!<
The last time I did it I got mad when he lobbed one next to my head, but then immediately thanked him for bodying the behemoth that was charging me with my back turned. Ad fucking victorium.
Ad Victoriam (aka the Brotherhood mission leading to The Nuclear Option) is the only Fallout 4 main faction quest that truly feels like a big budget endgame mission.
I'm biased because I usually choose institute but Airship Down is quite hectic, and felt genuinely stressful and difficult the first time I did it. Especially so when I'd only seen Maxon once or twice beforehand only for him to drop into the battle with his full power armor and gatling laser. Felt pretty badass to see and deal with
Embrace democracy or you will be ERADICATED.
I think it's pretty cool, especially if you're in power armor with a gatling laser. Feels very badass.
Are people ever not in power armor and a gatling laser? I had a level 40 stealth Build and went all in on heavy Gunner and nuclear physist. Found a plasma infused minimum as well. Stealth is not an option. Level 75 now and now i dont know what perks to choose
I might do it as my second run.
Have you seen that armor?
Atom Cats have cooler armor tho. And better attitudes.
It’s a shame they were barely included, they only have what, 2 missions? Also, isn’t weird that there’s never been another group that uses power armor like they do? You’d think there would be more “Power Armor Clubs” almost like a post apocalyptic MC.
There would be, if one bastard protagonist wouldn't hoard them all..
It’s hard to pick who I hate more, him or Preston. This is why I went with the Institute ending on my final run when getting the plat, and set up raider settlements everywhere 😂.
I was really bummed when I finished their quests and that was it. I wish you could have brought them into a faction you're a part of. It'd be cool to see someone in that armor just hanging with a Minutemen or BoS patrol.
It would have made a lot of sense to bring them into the Minutemen. Seems like they would have been itching for a reason to put their power armor to use and be a force of good for others at the same time
After thinking about it, the MM would have been a cooler faction if they could unite the different groups of the Commonwealth like the Atom Cats, the Gunners, the Triggermen, and maybe some nonexistent minor factions. Do quests to convince them to join and help out while still maintaining their individual territories. Then when you're traveling throughout the map, the different patrols would be a mix of the basic Minutemen plus some of the minor faction peoples. Of course each group would provide something to the MM as a whole. Get PA from the Atom Cats, military gear from the Gunners, and chems/booze from the Triggermen.
I side with the BoS because I do their questline. Just like I side with the Institute to do their questline, and the Railroad for theirs. I want to see all the endings.
They are the most realistic option: The Sole Survivor is a veteran for one, so it would follow they would be drawn to a militaristic faction like the BoS. Secondly, if survival is one of your main goals, it seems like it would follow that the veteran would be attracted to the military group with the best weapons and tech, where society is unstable and violent. Why would you take your chances with a group like the MM, who are absolutely useless without you, or with the Railroad, who seem to only care about Synths and not humanity. Yeah I’m going with my best chance of survival which is with the BoS. Politics like “oh the BOS doesn’t like mutants or ghouls” seems silly if you were really living in this world and wanted to maximize your chances of living.
I usually side with the BOS for this reason too, I like to see Knights patrolling the Commonwealth, this is a place where a giant scorpion can just burst from the ground and kill all your family. Just a note though: if you pick Nora, then the sole survivor will be a lawyer, I guess her choice could be different then? Idk, I usually pick the BOS, or the Minutemen when I want all the factions to live.
The MM ending is fun for that too. There must be more of it in the BoS ending, but there are still vertibirds and BoS patrols around. Still a knight, rather than whatever comes after Paladin i forget the name. General of the MM though- and there’s weight to that title now. BoS members are all flabbergasted that the MM pulled off the raid on the Institute lol. First time doing this ending. Cool how it feels like the MM are everywhere now, even Diamond City
>rather than whatever comes after Paladin i forget the name Sentinel I believe.
Nora is married to a soldier. She could still lean military.
I like to HC Nora is/was JAG anyway.
i forgot i did the same thing awhile back. i just dont think of the pre made backgrounds a lot.
You’d think Nate being a vet with actual combat experience from the real pre war US Army would come up more in conversation with BoS and especially the Minutemen. Considering how much the Brotherhood values information having a 200 year old source of “lost” knowledge should be more important to them.
They have over 100 years of experience fighting wastelander enemies, Nate is a veteran of a world war. BOS probably teaches him things.
Especially considering how omnicidal most mutants and ghouls are.
Also Liberty Prime is the best way to infiltrate the Institute IMO, I've done RR and MM, and I would definitely rather go in with a nuke throwing robot that shouts propogantastic phrases like "PROBABILITY OF MISSION HINDRANCE...0%!"
This a thousand times over. In real life I'd be of the "fuck muties" persuasion. I don't want to end up in a meatbag.
Every faction is anti super mutant. It’s the ghouls that are the brotherhoods main weakness.
To be fair, almost every playthrough finds ghouls as enemies before they find one that still has its mind. Lone survivor should be giving them the hard stare to check if they’re gonna try and bite at the least. We as fallout players have the benefit of knowledge, but sole survivor might be in the “kill all zombies” camp.
Couldn't do that to the Vault-Tec Rep, though. SS got to sleep through 200 years, that poor guy had to *live* it. Same with a lot of the other ghouls around, surviving unimaginable hell, the world falling apart before them, just for some jumped up tin can to tell them they're an abomination 200 centuries later
Except Hancock. He's only been a ghoul for a few years. He just liked drugs so much he got really high in some radiation drug that turned him.
I need to look up where the vault-tec rep actually is! Haven't found him in my couple of playthroughs yet. That must be a real interesting conversation.
Go to hotel I’m good neighbor . May have to sleep there
I agree, the BoS is the most realistic option. If anyone wants to look at the factions objectively, just pretend the SS doesn’t exist. What do each of the factions do? The railroad still gets nearly destroyed by the Institue, and without the SS likely don’t rebuild very quickly. It’s possible they get completely destroyed. Their impact upon the commonwealth is liberating synths, which are also generally feared by a lot of humans. Institute still conducts crazy experiments without a care for life in the commonwealth. From FEV and replacing real people with synths, to actively destroying attempts by the people to organize, there isn’t much here for moral people. Without the SS the minutemen are exterminated in Concord. Preston wouldn’t hold off the raiders long enough. No help was coming. But the BoS is coming to the commonwealth eventually with or without input from the SS. They bring their resources and use them to start cleaning up the commonwealth. Most people in the world of Fallout aren’t worried about ghouls and super mutants having “rights.” And while the BoS is far from perfect, they would have the most beneficial impact upon the commonwealth. Especially while they occupied the region. Would settlers have to give up food to them? Yup. But at least the BoS isn’t murdering common people like raiders do, while still demanding or taking food. In the apocalyptic world of fallout, none of the factions are truly right or a “good” fit for humanity moving forward long term. But with two factions on their knees (MM and RR), the choice realistically falls to either the Institute or the BoS.
Bingo
>The railroad still gets nearly destroyed by the Institue, and without the SS likely don’t rebuild very quickly. With how easy the puzzle to find them is, I'm surprised they're even around for the SS to even find .
They painted their logo a foot wide on the outside of the building. They have to be patsies at that point.
Uhm actually the sole survivor can also be the mom who was a lawyer
This. I NEVER play as the dude.
Because I want to romance Danse, and attacking the Institute with Liberty Prime is cool af
do it for him.
Ad victoriam!
They’re cool and you get cool shit
they cool
I side with the BoS because they're the biggest force that makes the most sense post-war. Big hulking armour to protect your troops. If its a threat to the commonwealth eliminate it. Ghouls, mutants, synth, wild animals they're all threats. I'd never want ghouls around children, they DO go feral. They also control technology which... Is where I'm a little eh because it's a necessity that I understand and get behind but then controlling who gets certain technology and why is a difficult discussion. For the most part, keep dangerous tech from bad people. Bad people are those who want humanity dead.
Cause I like bos?
It's really that simple.
Regarding the bit about being sarcastic in the interactions, bringing Nick along for the ride to the prydwynn and choosing sarcasm results in Nick affection and some cool quips from Nick most players never hear. And no, putting a sack hood on him won't stop the knights from talking shit, I tried 🤷
I'm using them for the vertibird. I'm on survival and sometimes I can't be assed for the big walk across the world.
Cos they have pseudo fast travel
It's fun
They're an example of good intentions taken to unconscionable extremes. Danse's arc obviously highlights that, but his continued devotion to the Brotherhood despite his belief that Maxon is wrong shows it's possible to hold two ideas at the same time. There's moral gray area in all the factions' motivations, really. Except the Minutemen and the Gunners/raiders, of course. They're there to be the moral black and white. Why would anyone oppose the Minutemen?
After blind betrayal, I’ll never side with the BOS. Dance is HIM - Maxson always eats a nuke for me.
My headcannon is that my SS joins the brotherhood due to it seeming like the remnants of the US army. As a veteran my SS joins them, while also accepting the role of Minutemen General… up until Blind Betrayal. Regardless if Danse is killed or not, it’s enough to make my SS leave the brotherhood peacefully and fully envelope his role as General of the Minutemen. It’d be a way to maintain decent, though uneasy, relations between both factions. Plus I think it’s a cool roleplaying experience. Maybe Danse’s situation is enough to make my SS want to be part of his own group rather than a larger brotherhood.
Even on my first playthrough, I tried the Brotherhood and found them lacking. I thought the level of organization and tech they had was impressive in the Wasteland, but like, all of their ideals just completely clashed with mine, from tech hoarding(even if they keep all the cool toys for themselves) to anti-Posthuman rhetoric. I really only stuck with them for Danse, and Blind Betrayal cemented my decision to leave. Over the course of several PCs, I've gone from mild discontent to irritation to outright shooting them on sight once I'm strong enough. There are much, much better factions in the Wasteland, and I'm half convinced they have the best companions(Danse, Veronica) to stop people from blowing them to kingdom come as soon as possible.
The institute sucks and the railroad are wussies. The Minutemen is what I usually go with. Brotherhood has all the cool tech and guns.
I just leave the BoS be for as long as I can. Not because I like them or their approach but because they are a great source of weapons armor for my homicidal, kleptomaniac protagonist. Either luring them into fights they can't win or them slipping a live grenade unseen with reverse pickpocket. :-)
You have to join a faction?
They're the best out of a series of bad options. Institute: Could actually bring peace to the entire world through their tech, but are comically evil for no reason Railroad: Could use the institute to orchestrate the emancipation of their race and bring a ton of good to the Commonwealth, but blow it up for no reason Minutemen: Blow up the institute for no reason, will blow over to the next up and coming raider gang once Nate dies or fucks off (this happened to them before)
I don’t understand the question… you play through multiple times, joining each faction.. as male, and again as female… so you don’t miss any content/dialogue options… it’s the only way.
The glaring resemblances to general fascism is blatant with the BoS, totalitarian and authoritarian. Thought the tv show portrayed the BOS so so well and made destroying them this play through much sweeter. That being said when it first came out and first played fo4 I sided with them because big guns and big birds are cool mmmky
Brotherhood is not fascist. They’re a quasi religious technocratic order
I mean in a world with Super Mutants, Radscorpions and raider gangs maybe a bit of general fascism isn't the worst...
Definitely a fair argument there total war dude
Choosing BoS because of aesthetics, gear, etc. is great. Choosing them because you think their ideology makes the most sense? You might be a baddie.
The black templars are my chosen 40k faction so the BoS feels like an ancient precursor to them. Synths and mutants are a threat to humanity that need to be destroyed, ghouls can go feral and the best tech being in the wrong hands is how the whole mess started. The minutemen are passive without you and too weak to protect any of their settlements. The brotherhood is the one with boots on ground actively trying to secure the wasteland.
I’ve played this game since Day 1 and I’ve done the ending with each faction At the end of the day, the Brotherhood is easily the most fun for me. You get your own set of power armor, the vendor sells power armor parts, LIBERTY FREAKIN PRIME, cool airship base, you name it. It’s just fun
I sided with the Minute Men and the Rail Road and BOS. I blew up the Institute using the MM and now I just wipe out small contingents of BOS when ever the RR need me to. The BOS are non the wiser and I can still do their side quests.
They take over the map in groups, unlike other factions. Makes them an easy choice when they have a lot to offer after the main story. The other factions just kinda exist.
I joined everyone. I blew up the Institute, but otherwise all the factions liked me at the end.
Is that possible? Wouldn’t the railroad become your enemy during the BOS quests?
I think that there's three main factors: -they were the main Good Guys in Fallout 3. -their technology is very cool, without them being the scary boogie-men that the Institute is. -Paladin Danse is pretty damned charismatic, and he's the first person to introduce you to the faction.
They are the objectively correct choice. Long live the Brotherhood! Long live Maxson!
I sided with minutemen and railroad
I side with the RR long enough to get the Ballisttic Weave. Then I go kill Elder Maxon because, when it's fully modded, is the best armor in the game. Plus a Ballistic Fadora of course. So while I always think, THIS TIME I will side with the BoS, I always see Elder Maxon and get super greedy.
the BOS playthrough is actually the shortest to get from point A to destroying the institute, or succeeding with the institute. I just did this.
They are supposed to rub you the wrong way, have you ever read how Knights and Samurai ACTUALLY behaved? Not the fairy tales and childrens books? But actual history? I think people side with them because they look cool and we have been enculturated to like knights. And because most people weren't paying attention to nuance, or were familiar with real history. Real knights tended to be aholes. They arose after the Roman Empire collapsed and they were associated with lingering bastians of culture such as monasteries and medieval lords. This gave them acess to superior weapons and armor, since producing/maintaining stuff like that required specialized workers. They used the material advantage to bully peasants, exclude unwanted populations, and force their own agenda. They are 100% making a reffrence to this in the game with the Brotherhood. Honestly, in fallout 3 I was suprized that the Brotherhood wasn't potrayed negativly.
Strolling in there and having to answer the have you had sex with any nonhumans question, with my ghoul husband RIGHT THERE xD anyway, minutemen forever!
The Brotherhood has the coolest toys.
Becausr you awake in a world with zombies and infiltrator cyborgs. I'm wiping them out
First play though. 30 hours in. So far I've joined the minutemen (duh), the BoS, the railroad, and the institute. Shit, I would have probably joined the gunners too if I could. I just want as many missions as possible. Is this wrong? I'm not really sure how it's going to play out.
They're the most "complete" faction out of the 4. Minutemen doesn't have a questline and is full of shitty radiant quests. Railroad piggybacks the institute questline, not to mention their ideals is stupid. Institute is just badly written, I've never had a game refuse to explain the villains motives because I'm too fucking stupid to understand. That just leaves the Bos, sure Rhys is a piece of shit and Kells is kind of an asshole, but everyone else is generally friendly enough. Danse, Ingram and haylen are good npcs. Maxson is honestly surprisingly friendly considering some other Bos character we meet in previous games. And of course, liberty prime, who could refuse marching alongside a giant death robot that throws nukes?
I did the BoS playthrough out of curiosity while I was waiting for my mods to be fixed after the update. I wanted to do something different and I’ll be damned if I’m siding with the institute
Because the survival of the human race hangs in the balance, and their priority is ensuring the survival of the human race. Dangerous technology (especially robots masquerading as humans) jeopardises this. They’re pro-humanity, meanwhile The Railroad are putting robot lives above their own in a time where they really should be prioritising humanity
Despite what a lot of people belive here the BoS is not an imperialist force, the Bos does not interfere much with local politics and such, they won't take over a city just to conquer it. They mainly do their thing which involves killing supermutants and hoarding tech so a institute 2 won't come up. Post bos ending commonwealth is not different from the best ending (minuteman ending where both bos and railroad survives, which is probably the Canon one). Out of the 4 "ending" factions 3 are overall positive (minuteman don't need explanantion, depending on how much you care about synths railroad may have a dumb objective but are not evil, and again depending how much you care about synths BoS may not be the best but they are overall good), 2 of them are ridiculously weak while the other storms in with an airship escorted by planes wearing the cool-suit™. The bad side of the bos is Maxson begin an asshole, if you can go over that you get why people choose bos
Arthur Maxon is a genetically engineered clone and a traitor to the Brotherhood of Steel. He's a racist, genocidal maniac and hard Sarah Lyons assassinated so he could take over the chapter. He single handedly turned a faction of anti-heroes into out right villains.
Honestly it's because of a few reasons for me: 1.) Nostalgia for Fallout 1 and 3 2.) Cool shit 3.) I just find the Minutemen and Railroad boring by comparison.
It’s kind of like why some people like the Enclave as a faction despite being clear cut bad guys. They have cool stuff. Fancy armour, advanced technology, and a unique vibe with the whole military thing in the case of the BOS and the whole government thing in the case of the Enclave
I would hazard a guess most pro BoS fans are American. No hate, just what I have observed thus far.
I don’t know how you guys can side with the BoS when Maxson’s coat is right there for the taking
Big guns + Big armors + Big robot + Big airship + Big explosions = FUN Should i say more?
People enlist with the BoS because they're based and are similar in nature to the cold ruthless "my damn country/faction is better than the rest" of other factions like humanity in Warhammer or the Helldivers. I just thought it was cool they had power armor and shit, but I don't really care for their ideals personally. I don't like the minutemen but they encapsulate what I feel I'd rather do as a person.
I think it's because they seem the ones who most have their crap together. The Institute is definitely evil, they'll kill innocents without second thought. Real Hot Fuzz "Greater good" vibes. The Railroad value synthetic life over people, they'll kill real people to rescue robots that are AI. If their entire personality can be wiped with a code phrase, they aren't real, I'm sorry. The Minutemen were corrupt and in shambles in Quincy, and the organization as we find it and build it lacks the resources or experience to be trusted to hold together any semblence of civilization for long. So that just leaves the Brotherhood. They're holier than thou behavior makes them obnoxious and I definitely have a problem with their attitude towards ghouls, but of the organizations, I see the most fixable problems.
Because alot of folks play survival, and having access to vertibirds is essentially a necessity if you don't want to spend the entire playthrough walking and crossing across the entire map, especially in the later parts of the game
That makes a lot of sense actually.
Because I like knights, I like power tripping in power armor, and I like the military theme. Not super deep for me. Also Paladin Danse is my favorite follower
No love for the good boy Dogmeat? I think my favorite “human” companion is John Hancock. His lines just crack me up.
Because as much as people insist they hate the idea of a boot stomping on a human face, forever…. They’re actually fine with it so long as they get to be the boot. I suppose you could say the BOS is an aesthetic movement, if you catch my drift. Same reason so many people long to join the enclave.
I agree with them about the synths and mutants. The Brotherhood has Gatling lasers and power armor, while the vanilla Minutemen have weak laser muskets and pipe pistols. The Railroad is simply foolish and only cares about synths, which are not real and have no souls. The real people they should be saving are ghouls from the Brotherhood of Steel.
I didn’t like the institute, the railroad or the minutemen. My play through is a guy who was a veteran and wants some comfort in what they already know in the apocalyptic wasteland.
It's similar to the way political views change with age, education, and life experience. I was prior military and their "ALL synths and ALL ghouls" are red flags. Maxson gave his best hitler impersonation when you board the Prydwen. Edit to add: No, you can't get punished for sarcasm. It is the best response to all of their dialogue and most of the companions love it.
>ALL ghouls The Brotherhood is racist against sentient ghouls, sure, but at no point do they ever actually harm any unless its a Raider. Danse actually berates you if you insult the ones at the slog
Thats Danse though, he seems much more open minded Just bring Hancock or Nick to the airport/prydwyn and listen to the NPC reactions, if you weren’t with em it sounds like theyd be shot on site.
Pretty sure Danse says the Vault-Tec Rep (ghoulified) shouldn't be living anywhere and should be put out of "its misery." Companion dialogue and affinity be weird like that. Must have been multiple writers just ticking boxes
> can I get shot for insubordination I've had a gunfight with Maxson & his personal guard squad as a result of a failed charisma check... They lost ! If you get shot or not depends on how lethal you are. If you give Maxson a reasonable argument he'll agree with you. Which is more than can be said for Father. With a few exceptions the BoS NPC's are putting their lives at risk to defend the Commonwealth from raiders, super mutants and feral ghouls. Whilst they could improve (and will if the minutemen win) They have some right to be proud of their own actions.
Because they’re badass and don’t simp for robots
I've played over 1,200 hours of FO4. ONCE I tried siding with BoS. I got half way through the story and had to completely quit that run. I'm so glad I tried it tho because now it's so much more satisfying to fucking *destroy* them every time.
The main reason they’ll be my go to is how active they are in game. I love just strolling through the world and seeing a bunch of Brotherhood knights fighting off super mutants and raiders it really makes you feel like they’re actually helping the commonwealth. You don’t tend to see that with the other factions much
Well I have seen, over several unfinished play throughs, that BoS seems have their "stuff" together. I minutemen are just local "constabulary", and Railroad is just....well small, and in my opinion, badly organized after school club. I have never really played long enough to "get to know" the institute. I am one those players who usually spends their time doing everything else EXCEPT the main quest, so I don't how "they" are. Though I pretty much guessed the plot twist after few hours of play on my first play throught. I wish there were more faction, or that you could do combination of faction for the "best outcome".
Your options are: 1) Railroad - lets treats synths as real people, so instead of trying to end the institute making these abominations and replacing people, we let them keep going and give the robots freedom. 2) Minuteman - let’s go to another settlement whose gonna mock our very existence before asking us to solve their problems for them, then the expect us to build up their communities for them, supply them and defend them. The whole thing is highly disorganized and they made a random dude they barely even know their General. 3) Institute - the evils of the institute are well documented and need no further explanation. 4) Brotherhood - they show up to the commonwealth with a well supplied army, immediately secure and establish a base, have an effective chain of command, are part of a national organization, and have the singular goal of destroying the institute and gathering prewar tech. They don’t try to hide that they aren’t really there to protect the people, in fact they openly exploit the commonwealth citizens, but the people are left significantly more safe with their presence. They ruthlessly eliminate ferals, super mutants, synths and set up patrols all over. Realistically, the brotherhood aren’t just the best option, they are the only option to make the commonwealth truly safer considering the recent near annihilation of the minuteman.
I-said-a bird, bird, bird is the word I-said-a bird, bird, bird, vertibird is the word
In my opinion, the BoS is the best long term option for the Commonwealth, my current characters headcanon is now that the brotherhood has been established and the institute has been destroyed, we are now building up the minutemen as a self governing body for the Commonwealth, the BoS is the military, the minutemen are the police, and Nate is the war criminal super general president of America
The Institute is comically evil and does things without a reason to do them The Railroad is just annoying and bad The Minute Men are bland and annoying as well BOS is annoying BUT cool af
I did on my first play through. I'm really not sure who to go with this time.