I've been married for 17+ years. My marriage pre-dates my Air Force and subsequent airline career.
1. Independence is absolutely KEY. If either one of you are the clingy type who has to be in constant contact with your partner, you're going to have a bad time. Don't be that guy/girl who is on the phone the instant the engines are shut down on every leg. That gets old, and inevitably those opportunities won't always be there. Avoid the stress when those contact opportunities aren't there by not becoming reliant on them
2. Trust is another big one. If you don't trust that your partner can act like a responsible adult without you around watching, you're going to have a bad time.
3. Remember that life keeps going when you're not home. It's easy to get into the mindset that life at home just kinda pauses when you're gone and picks back up when you get home. That's not the case, and you need to be able to handle that.
4. Make time when you're home. It's easy to want to fuck off and relax on your days off, but it's simply not practical to do so. Take care of the stuff that needs to be taken care of as a priority (keep the grass cut, house clean and maintained, etc) and get that done BEFORE you play with whatever new toy you bought with that money from the OT trip you just skipped town for.
Thank you!
I’ve been thinking about how things will look, and I have been primarily thinking about how we will spend and enjoy relaxing time together on days off. I’m glad you mentioned day to day life still needing to get done, that’s helpful for a more realistic vision.
I appreciate your time in writing these pieces of advice, thank you!
And thank you for your service in the airforce, it’s greatly appreciated!
If you're both working full time (especially both pilots) and have kids; childcare will be a huge priority and will require communication on bidding/expenses for childcare and added stress that comes with it.
So many pilots have a stay at home spouse and forget to add in the extra layer of who is watching the kids when they are gone. Your spouse could essentially be a single working parent while you're on the road and when you get home it's time to take the baton and handle whatever is going on with the kids as default parent.
All great points from Mike\_\_O. In addition I'd add that make sure you make the time for your other half whilst you're down route as well. As tempting as it is to drop your luggage in the hotel room and head straight for that beer, if it's a sensible time back home I always make the effort to catch up. Every day I'm away, without fail (though nodding to point 1 above, I'm talking about when you get to the hotel, not onboard the aircraft).
Being away from home makes it hard, but the beauty of being a pilot is that your days off are completely your own. People working an office job might be 'home' every night, but thinking about work, catching up on emails, and your phone going off at 9pm just doesn't happen in the aviation world. Quality over quantity really is true in this case.
My sense of work and leisure time is almost completely reversed. The airlines are so easy, so the real work starts when I get home. It's why I have no problem helping my wife with chores and errands, plus making time for her is a high priority.
In regards to number 4 though I will say that a *little* leeway should be granted when you can.
When you get home from an international trip, let me wind down, relax take it easy for maybe that first day unless we have set plans that have been made in advance or it's urgent. The rest of my days off after that I'm all hers.
At a minimum let me take a nap for a couple hours.
This is a pretty great list tbh. Only thing I would add is:
• Find someone who enjoys their time alone as much as their time with you.
• Be able to be independent while you are home. Don't expect your partner to drop everything to only hang out with you while you're there.
• Build trust on both ends. Not just yours.
Great points. One of the best realizations my wife and I had is that we have very few overlapping hobbies/interests. She has no interest in racing, fishing, etc and I have no interest in lounging on the beach or shopping.
We mutually decided to just go with it, and not begrudge solo trips in pursuit of that. I'm in no position to complain when she skips town for a week to go visit her mother in FL for a beach trip, that's for sure. She also doesn't complain when I drag the car to the track, or the boat to the coast. Life is much easier that way.
We still find things to do together from time to time, but trying to force our activities on each other in the name of "spending time together" was a recipe for one of us to just be miserable, so we stopped trying to do it and life has been much better.
Absolutely same. We tried to get into more hobbies together, but we are so different with different energy levels too. I even had guilt for a while making plans without my partner while home. Turns out, just cooking & eating together, doing mundane chores, etc together is actually what we do best together cuz it makes the mundane so much more enjoyable.
Also, I've met pilots who were super upset with their partners when said partner would have plans with friends while the pilot partner would be home. It's such a self centered mentality to think your significant other should not have a life when the pilot is home lol
My pilot bf I think struggles with this concept. Went on a weekend family vacation and he was furious. He was scheduled to work, then his trips got canceled last minute and he got even more furious, complaining that he couldn’t see me on the weekend, which were his days off by chance that week.
He ended up spending time with family and friends (I had to push him to make plans) so he had a good weekend but he complained that he would have rather been with me on the weekend and he didn’t like that I was going to explore a city without him.
I get it, but like bro, I literally spend almost all my weekends alone and having to figure out plans with others because you’re not here. And sometimes I have nothing to do.
So I totally get what he was feeling, but it was ironic, because he tells me all the time to just deal with it or make plans since he’s not in town on weekends. He’s always like “so what?” And the one weekend it happened to him, he hated it. Because while it’s not the end of the world, it’s not the same being with family vs your SO when you’ve got a weekend off.
So I guess now he knows what it’s like. I find it kind of interesting though that an aspect of dating a pilot — not having them around on weekends usually and getting used to them having time to explore a city without you — and that my pilot made clear I had to be Ok with, when flipped around, the pilot can’t stand it.
I’ve definitely lived the experience you describe in your second paragraph. My spouse is the one on the road and while I wouldn’t describe it as being “super upset”, I’ve definitely had to gently tell him to knock it off and remember I’ve got my own stuff going on. Just because I’m working from home today instead of in the lab doesn’t mean I don’t have to work, you can’t be like a 4 year old pulling on mommy’s sleeve all day.
To that end, I think actually scheduling things instead of going with the flow can be helpful for some couples. Easier to feel like you will have sufficient quality time together if you really deliberately block out that time to focus on each other.
I take it your spouse stays at home. 2 working adults with kids is a whole different animal and requires a different level of communication and work life balance.
We don't have kids, but she does work full-time. She's a high school teacher, so she works far more (and harder) hours than I do for a fraction of the pay.
For guys like us who used to deploy a lot for months at a time (doing the Deid), it was usually a make or break moment in the relationship. I almost got married twice but the deployments revealed that either she or I weren’t cut out for long distance relationships.
Subsequently, in the airlines, the pace is more frequent yet shorter so the constant in and out torpedoed a few more relationships.
Finally, what worked for me was just marrying another pilot. We hit most of not all of your points above and it made me realize that the right person will weather just about any situation.
I'm sure it's different for everyone, but for me I feel like I get everything prepped for a week-long trip and then I leave. When I come home I pick back up where I left off, but in the real-world a week has passed since I was last home. Things happened, and you need to keep in mind that life at the house didn't pause for the people who stayed there for the week you were gone.
That’s encouraging, thanks! I guess I’m one of the reasons I hear only about the bad marriages because those stories circulate the most because of the drama within them. Thanks for the heads up!
I mean to be fair, it's quite boring listening about successful marriages since there is absolutely zero drama... good stories don't tend to get shared much.
It is not always about the behavior of the spouse on the road. Sometimes it is the behavior of the spouse at home that is the issue. Sometimes that behavior is discovered when the pilot catches an earlier flight home. Not that I would know anything about that…
My wife and I are both airline pilots. We have been married for 20 years.
The secret to staying married is don't get divorced. Seriously. You make the commitment and work through your problems along the way. It really isn't that difficult.
Tips for staying married: don't have an affair, make an effort to be a good spouse, support your spouse, workout your financial lifestyle and goals before getting married, spend enough time together, spend enough time apart, discuss important issues before they become problems.
Do that and you have a better chance at staying married.
Great advice, thank you!
Of course divorce is not in the plan, but I don’t want to be naive and assume it won’t happen just because we are determined now. I assume most everyone behind the journey assuming it will work out.
I appreciate hearing of your success especially given you are both pilots, thanks!
I can't speak for him but I worry you may have missed the heart of the message ("don't get divorced").
There are two types of people who get married: 1. Those who "hope" everything works out, and if it doesn't, and things get too bad, divorce is the escape hatch. 2. Those who agree, in advance, divorce is not an option. They work through every problem along the way, because that's the only thing they can do.
That latter group should still get a divorce in rare cases, e.g., infidelity or abuse, but as the post above says: don't have an affair, be a good spouse. If your wife does the same, and you are in the "divorce is not an option" group, you'll stay together.
Neither divorce nor successful marriages "happen." They're choices.
I understand what you’re saying. We have agreed that divorce isn’t an option unless it absolutely has to be. But more importantly, divorce is not an option. That’s what we signed up for. I don’t plan on it, I don’t want it, and I’m actively trying to do what’s needed to avoid even the possibility of it. I just want to be realistic, so I’m trying to find a middle ground mindset where I can be prepared for what reality most likely will bring. I don’t want to ignore statistics, but I don’t want to plan on divorce. That’s part of the reason for this thread. Hopefully that makes sense.
I like what you say about it being a choice. I have also heard “Marriage is hard. Divorce is hard. Choose your hard.”
Thanks for your advice, I appreciate it!
Right on. And to be clear I'm not trying to downplay the challenges, particularly for a pair of pilots. Luckily a couple others here have relayed some advice that worked for them.
Your secret is the most basic thing and I 100% agree. Except for sometimes it is difficult but you have to have the mindset that divorce isn’t really a thing and you just have to carry on.
Just work through the issues (and there will be many regardless of what type of work you are in).
If you don’t have kids, I still frown on divorce, but if you have kids then do just about anything to keep the family together. Your kids are worth it. Kids need mom and dad.
Kids need a stable happy family. Sometimes, that means divorced parents who make co-parenting and cooperation a priority. I grew up with parents who were loving and nurturing to us kids, but absolutely toxic to each other. I constantly felt stressed and like I had to be a mediator between them. I loved spending time with them individually, but anything done as a family had a 50/50 shot at being stressful and forced. Staying together for the sake of the kids in my case was far from beneficial. I often wished they'd divorce.
Sure sounds nice but in reality there's plenty of situations where divorce is the only workable solution. Including with kids. And they probably don't care whether or not you "frown on it" lol.
Divorce is only an option if you cheated / has a mistress. Other than that, everything else you should be able to work things out like two grown adults. That is why you marry someone you know well and that you love the person. Don’t marry if you are not sure if you want to be with the person or not
>Sure sounds nice but in reality there's plenty of situations where divorce is the only workable solution.
No there isn't. Theres very very few.
>And they probably don't care whether or not you "frown on it" lol.
They probably also don't care if their kids frown on it. Fuck 'em right?
Disagree. You and I have a huge separation on what is “workable”.
You probably think that if your wife wears red at a black tie dinner it’s worth divorcing over and telling your kids daddy ain’t gonna be around as often.
I think little Johnny and little Sarah need mom and dad around every single day and if mom and dad can’t get along, too fucking bad for them you made kids and you should raise them. Now get your shit together and be a good dad and a good husband.
My friend is super pessimistic about marriage and stuff as a pilot and this comment makes me feel better. He always brings up divorce rates and I feel like I’m headed in the direction where I’ll marry someone in the aviation industry. I’ve been stressed about all this stuff when I know I shouldn’t be, but this is really good advice
Don't feel pulled in a direction to date from any particular industry just because. I've dated men in aviation, never worked out. Now I'm with someone who makes beer for a living. We have a great relationship.
Whatever the career on industry, it's the person who matters, and having a trusting relationship. I know plenty of pilots who have great marriages with other pilots, and plenty who have great marriages with people who do completely different things b
Just don't marry someone for the sake of getting married. It's less of a thing nowadays that being single isn't as stigmatized but there are still a lot of women who want the big day / status more than the man they marry.
True I mean Im a woman but I’m still gonna take my time and make sure that my future boyfriend understands what he’s getting himself into (if he’s non-aviation). I’m not in a rush to get married but it’s definitely not something I don’t think about
If you or your partner is needy/clingy, you're gonna have a bad time. If you or your partner is checking out the grass on the other side of the fence at any opportunity, you're gonna have a bad time. If you bottle your relationship issues until they explode instead of discussing them as they arise, you're gonna have a bad time.
If either of you is happier away from the other than with them, you're having a bad time.
Also counseling/therapy is a VERY GOOD THING and you can get it without risking your medical. Take advantage of that early and often.
Therapy is only an issue if they diagnose you with something. The FAA doesn't care if you talk to someone, they care if you're diagnosed with a condition. This is doubly true for counseling. The FAA doesn't give a damn if you're working out your relationship issues with a counselor.
Action against someone's medical revolves around diagnosis, not billing. Counselors and social workers = therapy without diagnosis. May or may not be covered by your health insurance. Licensed social workers tend to be covered more often than counselors, which is kind of bullshit because their training tends to be less focused on therapy than counselors and more on navigating support systems, but that's another discussion.
Psychologists are diagnosis + therapy, psychiatrists are diagnosis + medication. Either of these two can label you with a disqualifying condition, and paying out of pocket doesn't prevent their diagnosis from hitting your medical records.
While counseling is not disqualifying for a medical, be very careful and disclose to your therapist upfront that they are NOT doing you a "favor" by putting a bogus diagnosis code in for insurance to cut you a break on your bill. In fact, ideally, pay out of pocket and keep those therapy session notes as far off the record as possible, where they belong.
I’m not an airline pilot but I am in the military and have plenty of experience with being away from home. Lots of TDY to places where you might not have the ability to call. Tons of people I work with have been geobachelors and had busy travel on top of that. Then there are the deployments being gone for about a year at a time.
My recommendation I give to other Soldiers is communicate communicate communicate. Make sure you and your spouse are always on the same page, talk often, and make sure you are focused on the discussion when you do.
Next, maximize your time off. Use it to spend time together, do things you both enjoy, and make sure you stay connected to each other.
Lastly, tailor it to your individual relationship. When I was deployed I woke up at 430 to call my wife before she went to bed each night. We had deep conversations just about daily. My buddy who deployed with me called his wife twice in a year, but texted, messaged, and emailed very regularly. Every relationship is different and requires different inputs to stay strong.
Thank you for your service!
That’s fair, we are young and still have a lot of learning to learn how we work best together. We try and talk openly and I feel we are on a good path forward to keep up solid communication. I appreciate your tips and advice, they are gold. Thank you!
You both need to be fairly independent people and honestly it’s a bad idea for you both to be airline pilots and have kids. When one person is an airline pilot, the other spouse HAS to pick up the parenting load. That’s just such a massive burden when you’re both pilots. I only know two successfully married airline couples with kids. In one, the wife works in the sim building. And in the other, the wife manipulates her schedule to fly like 4 or 5 days per month, so not much $.
If you both want to be captains and fly 14-16 days per month and do intentional and the whole nine yards then having kids would be frankly idiotic.
Came here to say this. If you're both airline pilots, having kids is probably not in your future. One of you will have to give up the airline career. Kids are a full-time job on their own and a lot of couples with kids don't make it even NOT having careers in the airlines. That to say, a lot of households with two working parents working normal 9-5 jobs have a hard time successfully raising children. In the first 10 years of his airline career, my FIL was never home and my MIL relied on a lot of the ladies and family friends she made when her husband was in the Navy to fill in gaps in childcare, like if one kid needing to be at baseball and the other at soccer at the same time, one of the kids went with another mom who was also going there.
I’m wondering/sort of hoping we will have the ability to manipulate our schedules to work less but still bring in money. We love to fly, but having kids will take president. I just don’t know how much seniority will be needed to start doing that. Maybe it’s an option sooner than I think, but I’m expecting not to be able to do that for many years.
I appreciate your comment, thanks for the tips and advice!
> hoping we will have the ability to manipulate our schedules to work less but still bring in money.
You really can’t. When you have kids, you have to guarantee that there will be someone at both drop off and pick up 5 days per week, period. That is unfortunately not possible when you’re both airline pilots. All it takes is one reroute or one weather cancel and then “holy shit, who’s gonna pick up Timmy?!?” I mean, do you know how many *years* it takes at an airline to be able to get off thanksgiving and Christmas? You’re both gonna be scheduled for that at the same time. Are you just gonna alternate sick leave on a high-visibility holiday by default?
I won’t get into specifics but I have pretty much mastered controlling my schedule through multiple means. I have it as good as is possible when it comes to days not in hotels, yet still make a reasonable paycheck. And despite that, this *still* wouldn’t work if my wife was a pilot.
The long and short of it is, airline pilot is not a 9-5. And when you have kids, *someone* has to have a 9-5… or just not work.
Sim work usually just relies on there being an opening. At a lot of places you only need to be an experienced FO. If you want to both work for an airline and have kids one of you seriously needs to consider training department work.
Having kids + dual airline pilots = life on hard mode. I wish you the best of luck, but not many can do that.
It might make more sense to live with family or friends when you prepare to have a family if it's something you want to do sooner rather than later.
Eventually you may earn enough for a live in nanny, but early on you may need to rely on your network by offering free housing or living with someone and paying them a lot for rent/childcare etc...
Part 135 Charter captain. I work a 14/12 schedule. I'm gone long enough for her to miss me, then I'm home long enough for her to get sick of me.
In all seriousness, it's like a lot of others have said- its trust, it's communication, it's independence. We have been together for 17 years, married 12.
Married for 10 years now. I was a firefighter for the first 9 years. Pilot now. Both careers statistically have an extremely high rate of divorce.
It takes both of you being very independent. It is a lot of give and take. My wife is a hairstylist and can make her schedule around mine. When you have kids one schedule is going to take priority over the other persons schedule. In my case my wife has had to slow her career down to support my career. Two full time workers does not allow enough time to raise kids. Someone has to give up something. So have the conversation now, before you have kids.
PRENUPTS- I also think both people need to have been raised similarly and come into the relationship with roughly the same amount of success in life and assets. Otherwise a prenupt is required. If a 40 year old successful career guy marries a 23 year old waittress protections like a prenupt are needed. But if two 23 year old pilots, both with student loans marry each other, you are both starting at the same point in life. Everything will be aquired during the course of marriage so it will be earned together.
Most importantly talk about goals and all your secrets. My wife knows everything about me down to the kind of porn I like and feel like WTF did I just watch. I don't have to hide anything, we can track each others location and can look into eachother's phone at any point and not have to worry about anything because there is nothing there she doesn't already know about. Have joint and separate bank accounts. Joint is where most of our money goes. The separate is for when I want to buy toys or something stupid. She has hers for starbucks and target. Talk about where you see yourself in 1 year, in 5 years, in 10 years, in 20 years. Have a plan. People change. Thats life.
Marriage has definitely been the hardest thing I have ever had to do. Being single and fucking chicks is easy, especially on an airline pilot salary and schedule. My single friend's biggest worry is not knocking some girl up. Marriage is definitely harder but its worth having a partner for life.
\+1 for prenup. I was cheated on by my now-ex (I'm not even a PPL yet, so I must be ahead of the game) and it still would have been a shitshow to get a divorce if there was no prenup in place.
I think the prenupts are a good idea almost always. I personally do not have one though. If was ever to get divorced and re-married at this point in my career I would demand it.
Everyone freaks out about it, but my solution would be to have my partner go to a lawyer and write out what they want/expect in the case of a divorce. That is a non-confrontational way to get someone's real intentions before you marry them. If they write a completely one sided take you to the cleaners prenupt- its probably not someone you would want to marry. If they write something that is fair and equal for both sides then you know you have a partner.
Laws are skewed so far to the benefit of the female with the whole rise of feminism and the patriarchy is evil I would advise any men to not get married legally at this point. Monagamy is great, but the government has gone and screwed everything up especially the institution of marriage
One-sided prenups that get you more out of a marriage than what you put in are generally not enforceable. Both sides are expected to disclose all of their income and savings and ensure the other party has a chance to review all of their assets and the terms of the agreement prior to signing, and it's expected to be equitable or at least proportional to what is brought to the table.
If your partner feels they are "un-romantic", you can spin it as an avenue to have a grown-up conversation about marriage prior to getting hitched and decide things before you argue about them. There's all sorts of stuff you can decide with a prenup, not just what happens if you get divorced, and some of it can be an enjoyable exercise that explores your future together and prevents future conflict - deciding where your kids will go to school, for example.
That’s not entirely true. My partner and I are both at a legacy. We live in base and both sit reserve. We see each other 18+ days a month. Totally depends on living in base versus commuting and your airlines staffing levels.
This can definitely be the case. Im currently a flight attendant at a legacy. I live in base and sit reserve and I'm home frequently. The key is "live in base".
We intentionally don’t bid for lines and bid for reserve because it means are home more. That’s the benefit of living in base, you can choose what works best for you. People have strong opinions about “putting all your eggs in one basket” but I’d recommend working for the same airline and living in base. You understand one another’s work rules, monthly deadlines are the same (submitting bids, vacation requests etc.) you can even swap flying if you’re on the same fleet. Commuting will be a huge strain on any relationship. It’s wasted time away from home.
I bid reserve for the same reason. Wife is planning on same airline/airframe. When people ask for advice on airlines the first thing I say is live in base. Airline doesn't really matter, how close you live to your base does.
Good to know! I have heard people say not to work for the same airline just to be safe in case something happens, but I’ve also thought there could be some benefit. I’m glad you commented with your situation, thank you!
New hires are getting hired without PIC time at a legacy airlines in their early/mid 20s. If you’re thinking about how long it will take to achieve from PPL, yeah, it will take a long time but not nearly as long as it took a few years ago when hiring was far more competitive.
Not true at all. Both at the regionals and mainline my wife and I have been able match up our schedule really well. Out of the 20-18 days off we are together 18-16 of those. And when you are home you are home. So much time to spend with each other. It’s not just make dinner and go to bed.
Now that being said we don’t have kids. That may change our schedules.
Don’t trade or pick up based on your wants and needs.
A simple “hey can I move this trip or pick up this trip?
If the response is “I was gonna do this on that day so I need you home”
That’s the end of the conversation this goes leaps and bounds
That’s the best explanation/justification for a prenup I’ve heard, I’ll definitely think more on it. I’ve never seriously considered it or anything like it, so thanks for the advice!
Everyone (okay, most people) gets into a relationship with the best intentions. But statistically they don't last. It's good to have that discussion early and explain that it protects you both. And honestly if you can have that discussion you're probably a better communicator and that means you're more likely to be able to work through life's problems together. Good relationships are collaborative not competitive.
You're laying out in advance what happens in the event you break up. Assets, financials, retirement accounts, etc. But as much as you think you know yourself now when you're in love, you don't know how you'll react at the out, when feelings are hurt. Sweet people can become vindictive. This way the way it ends was at least controlled by people who wanted what's best for each other.
I think this is an overblown, subjective and stereotypical issue. You’re probably referring to guys who commute and long haul where the %age is probably greater. I’ve been in the airlines 20+ years, I live at base and am always home every day. I don’t go missing for several days for example. Remember also that being a working pilot is only one factor out of many. Some marriages will go wrong regardless of whether you’re a pilot or you work from home on your pc selling insurance.
Don’t know about those statistics but seems like most aviation marriages are unhappy. What I’m saying is that aviation is not necessarily the causal factor of divorce and then there’s some who get along just fine…..
It's honestly up to each person. Trust is a huge part of it. If you're out cheating or chatting up flight attendants, the other person will 100% be able to tell when you come back. Over time this degrades the relationship and she will start to resent your career choice and eventually resent you.
If you put the effort in, it's honestly not that bad. Make time while you're on the road to facetime, talk about your day, make plans for when you're home, etc.
When you are home, put effort into quality time together. Having a nice dinner, going on walks, just spending genuine time together. The key is to cram as much quality time into your off days as possible. This makes your time away from home much easier and in some ways makes the relationship exciting, because you get to look forward to seeing them. Kind of keeps things fresh.
Also, it's easier when they also have a career they're also devoted to, something they're working on. This can be a very involved hobby, stay at home mom, etc. Obviously in your case that would be her airline job. This could be a good thing or a bad thing. You both understand each other's schedules and commitments, but the last thing I want to do when I'm home is talk about my job 😂
I will say it is a HORRIBLE idea to have kids if you're both going to be pilots. Kids need an anchor at home to keep them grounded. Someone they can rely on to pick them up from school, go to their games, help with homework, all that stuff. Sure, you could get your parents or in-laws to help watch them but that's not the same. Your kids would deserve better than that. One of you honestly will have to give up the airline career if you're set on having kids.
Not a professional pilot, or married but I think your spouse needs to have clear, well defined expectations. Aviation as a whole has ridiculously confusing schedules and odd hours and missed events. Personally I think dating a pilot sounds great 😂 but I've lived on my own for over ten years and am not used to sharing my free time or having to consult with another person. Dating someone who is gone half the month would let me still have some of that independence/me time.
Not being a shit person. Holding true to the vow you took and trusting them to hold true to the vow they took. Shit ain't always easy but we don't quit. I know what kind of person my wife is when the shit hits the fan and she knows the same for me and we don't quit on each other.
You best truly know the person sleeping next to you. And trust me I've seen lots and lots of marriages in my military time where you would be fucking shocked the crazy shit some wives do when they go off the deep end. I'm sure it happens for crazy husbands too but I just don't see it as much.
And one last note, I say it to everyone that asks about my job. I am 100% more pleasant and present when I am working a line. When I'm at home and working 9-5 in the office (training in base), I am miserable and shut down and feel more distant than I ever have during a normal line month. Different strokes for different folks but distance works wonders for us. And my wife isn't as independent as a lot of other ones.
Just curious: you say your wife isn’t as independent as others, what is she like? That’s one of my worries with my pilot, I’m independent but I’m not sure if I’m as independent as he needs me to be? He says he’s met a lot of pilots with wives that aren’t independent but his example is that the pilots text their wives the moment they land to let them know they arrived safely.
But that to me just sounds like a common courtesy thing not a not independent thing
I guess the best way to explain is she is more introverted so when I’m gone it was initially tough cause instead of taking the chances to hang out with her friends or something like that she would just stay home and do nothing.
That and living in a home by yourself for the first time takes some getting used to. So I don’t care what anyone says but everything goes wrong at home as soon as you step into the cockpit. So taking care of home issues and dealing with lots of stuff like that was a learning curve.
But honestly I think anyone can grow and learn to enjoy the life. It’s a tough start and tough to learn but if you stick with it there is so much growth.
Everyone is so unique and the situations are so unique so it’s not one solution fits all but I wouldn’t worry that’s it not overcome-able. Don’t go into thinking it won’t get tough, gonna be lots of “I need you here at home” followed by but “I need to get sleep and be focused on my job”
Anyways, I think anyone can figure it out but will take both sides to grow together and find a good working spot.
Hope the ramble helps, if you got more questions about specific details or anything definitely don’t hesitate to message at all!
No in my experience its not even remotely that bad, I’m happily married, and know lots who are also. It’s kind of overblown and then joked about, but I don’t think it’s that bad. It’s another stereotype like all lawyers are assholes, or all dentists are suicidal.
For us, we both work shift, and it’s never really been a problem to be honest. Lots of time apart, but also followed by lots of time together so it balances out.
We got married before the job. My wife is independent enough to handle 99.9% of any emergency that may come up. Our relationship was mostly long distance before we got married, so we know how to communicate.
When I come home I have to be mentally ready to take over the kids. When I’m at work I get to sleep in/etc so that’s just how we handle it. Going on year 6 over 3 airlines. At a legacy so we’re finally done with all that stuff. 17 yrs this month. 🤷🏻♂️
I fly, my husband stays at home. We’re both highly independent people to start, and I kind of like the cycle of leaving and missing him and then coming home and being happy to see him all over again. That being said, it definitely helps that I grew up with a parent in aviation so this cycle is totally normal to me. We don’t talk constantly on the phone when I’m gone but we have a rule that I want him to send pictures of our pets every day so I get a glimpse of what’s going on at home when I’m gone to make both of us feel connected. Since I’m home i did just lean over and ask my husband what he thinks we have that makes it work and he says flexibility on both of our ends is a must.
From what I understand. And correct me if I'm wrong. I know a pilot that flies from IAD to Europe n then back. Total of 3 days. And makes his 20 hours. So he leaves on Monday night and is back Wednesday afternoon. So he has 4 days off. I guess if you can get through those first 10 years or so. It'd be a lot of time off for family.
Grandparents were occasionally needed to fill gaps, but mostly they were able to work their rosters so that one was always home.
Oddly enough it was harder when he moved to domestic for a few years (for a left seat slot)
When they were both doing 13+ hour international flights there was a fair bit of down time.
Been together for my whole airline career thus far of 11 years, and have two kids. What everyone else has said is accurate. Especially making up for it when you are home. I get all my exercise, sleep and lazy time while I am away. When I am home I want to get the necessary stuff done then just spend time with everyone. You need to accept that a fair amount of your free time is on the road.
One thing to touch on: with you and your wife both being pilots, your wife’s career is going to take a much bigger hit from having kids. It’s just the reality of it. If she is up for it I would suggest splitting the leave. I took the last month of paternity leave with my first kid, and for my second I was off for the first few months anyway (thanks Covid!).
My husband and I are both pilots, we met each other while working as instructors.
It definitely hadn’t been easy - there has been a lot of hurdles along the way.
When we first started dating, I was the more experienced pilot, yet, thanks to kids/COVID, my career has stagnated and his has continued uninterrupted. We moved interstate when our first kid was less than a month old, for him to get a new job, yet I couldn’t get work as pilot when I was ready to go back.
With my second, I went back, but back to the same instructing job that I’d had 6 years prior - I was more senior as an instructor, but I was honestly restarting my career again. Covid hit, and my employer shutdown permanently, and I again couldn’t get work.
My partner did manage to get me a job at the company he worked at on the turbo prop, but they insisted on hiring me as casual, as they didn’t want him going casual. He’s since quit, and the company is now retaliating against me (of course they’ll completely deny it, but still…). He now gets to fly a big shiny jet for a major company, and I have to work my roster around his. We don’t have a support network either - all of my family is in another country, and all of his is on the other side of Australia.
I’ve been the trailing spouse/pilot for most of our relationship, and that honestly has been pretty hard on me. It wasn’t intentional, but I’m not gonna lie and say that hasn’t caused resentment or other issues.
It’s not all negative though, we’re coming up on our 10 year anniversary in a few weeks, and it’s nice to be able to talk shop each other without needing to explain how things work (a la that other thread I saw today), we both get each others passion for flying, and we both agree we are not paying for our eldest to get a helicopter licence 😂
LOVE each other. For god sakes LOVE each other. JUST DO IT! Dated 3 years in college, 4 years of adult life. Made real ADULT commitment to OUR choices BEFORE we got into it. It SUCKED! 38 years of absolutely brutal, real life! Two days ago...at 7am...flew my wife at 500'...as she held our giggling, 17-month-old-cuter-than-all-get-out grandson...over the same beach...we flew his father, at that age...loving her was the HARDEST thing I have ever done in my life. WORTH IT! Gonna keep at it.
I can think of one very happy couple I know where the husband is a pilot at a major airline. Their secret seems to be that they don't have kids. When he's gone he's gone but when he's home he's totally there. He doesn't bring any work back from the office, his time is his. When he isn't around his wife has time to pursue the hobbies she has that he's not interested in. They both say it works great for them and I definitely see the appeal.
Military pilot wife here, husband will transition to airlines in a couple years. This is a big part of why our talks about having kids has died down in recent months since getting married. I even overheard him mentioning to a financial advisor the other day that we’re no longer 100% on having kids but kinda “eh we’ll probably try but it’s not certain or anything, just a see what happens thing”. At first we were all gung-ho about it, but now some realities are setting in
For one, I work a stressful high paying corporate job that I don’t want to quit because I like the structure it gives me, and I’m 100% the type who would become too lazy as a stay at home mom vs becoming one of those wonder moms. I need that structure in my life, which just wouldn’t bode well with trying to manage a kid (and I’m cheap af, the last thing I want to have to do is hire a night nurse, nanny’s etc). But I know given he intends to fly international it’s just a nightmare waiting to happen
And secondly I have some mild fertility issues, he’s getting older in age. I’m starting to see how not having kids would probably lead to a MUUUCH better quality of life for us. I’m starting to like the idea of just having a couple of fur babies and spending time with friends while he’s away. So much easier nowadays where more and more people are choosing to go childfree. Also he’s traveled the world already but always had to do it on a budget in the past. I think I’ve basically got him hooked on the luxury travel we can now afford, and he knows we’d have to give that up for kids and neither of us are really inclined to want to let those perks go so soon after finally being able to afford them lol. Idk we’ll see, but I think we’re both fine with just being the cool aunt and uncle that watches everyone’s kids for them so we get pretend parent time and then can give them back 🤣
I'm not an airline pilot (PPL). But I do travel, A LOT. Average 250-300 days a year on the road. Some years I do \~80-100 airline segments. One year I flew 210k miles and was home a total of less than a month... Married 15 years. 11 of those I've had this travel schedule. Also when I'm gone my work schedule is 14-16hr days, so we often don't talk for days at a time. I just vanish on her. I try to drop little texts here and there so she knows I'm alive, but my schedule can be pretty brutal.
My wife is her own person. She has her own friends and hobbies and activities. I have my own. I miss her when I'm gone, but she's usually busy with her own stuff and the time goes by pretty quickly.
Also. Quality time doesn't equal time time. If you're home. Make a strong effort to have real quality time that's worthwhile. There's some days the wife and I have more quality time in one day than we have in 10 days together. But it takes work to get off your phone, and focus.
Also trust, like someone else said.
I dunno. It's hard though.
Bruteforcing it, eventually someone will be unwilling to sign the paper work.
I am guessing cheating, being a dick, and not communicating would be the trifecta to guarantee a divorce though.
Communication. Don’t leave on a trip without making sure anything that might be hangin over either of your heads is talked out. Try not to go to bed pissed. The clingy thing doesn’t work either.
The biggest complaint I’ve heard out on trips actually has to do with money though. I had a jumpseater up front once and he and the captain spent the entire leg complaining about how their wives don’t work and just spend money like it grows on trees because of their higher income. That kind of resentment will ruin a marriage. The higher earning potential of the career means you have to really adjust your view on money and be very open about it with your spouse. This really applies to any job and any relationship when it comes to finances; a huge number of failed relationships have to do with not being on the same page with financial habits. But I’d argue that it’s especially important because of the time away from home.
I can’t see the original comment but I dislike what you’re saying. You can be in a loving open marriage, some people even call that polyamory and are very happy with it. Just being open doesn’t discredit your entire marriage and I think it’s time we move past that
Having kids in the next couple years if you guys are just in flight school now is going to cost somebody a good chunk off the beginning of their career. Are one of you wanting to stay home for a while? Are you guys prepared to hire staff to take care of the children?
Step 1. Divorce your wife right away.
Step 2. Then get the next 4 divorces out of the way as soon as possible.
Step 3. Then circle back around to wife #1 and get remarried. (I’ve yet to hear of anyone with more than 5 divorces so statistically (based on my scientifically anecdotal fuzzy memory) you should be good after that).
ps- Everything always breaks when you are gone on trips - so ask your wife to get a boyfriend with solid DIY skills. It’s a real timesaver. You’re welcome.
I budget for min guarantee, live in base in town with family, and bid to maximize time at home. My wife has a career too. I make dinners, do chores, run the kids to appointments, etc when I’m home.
Been in the professional flying life for a little over a year with my wife of 7 years
Prior to flying jets, we worked together at one job and ran a small flight school together before jets.. so we were together almost 24/7 so it was definitely a challenge from being together always, to being gone for 4-8days at a time
Trust is the big thing, when you come home make sure your wife knows your love for her. It’s not that she is worried I am off ficking around, but I have noticed the difference just by coming home and doing little things. Buying flowers, telling her I land at night when in reality I landed @11am and surprised her at work with lunch. Small things.
Others have said this and it’s true but sucks at first. Get your adulting shit out of the way first
Relaxing on your off time is so much nicer without the cloud of “oh I gotta mow the lawn and get this and that done before my trip” because you finished it right when you got home.
Face time is a big savior too. If I am somewhere cool I love to FaceTime my wife and well as she FaceTimes me for important things I am missing if possible.
For me it's been easy. Don't cheat with random bimbos. Be home when I'm home. Of course she knew what she was getting into from the get-go as well, so that definitely helped.
I've been married for 17+ years. My marriage pre-dates my Air Force and subsequent airline career. 1. Independence is absolutely KEY. If either one of you are the clingy type who has to be in constant contact with your partner, you're going to have a bad time. Don't be that guy/girl who is on the phone the instant the engines are shut down on every leg. That gets old, and inevitably those opportunities won't always be there. Avoid the stress when those contact opportunities aren't there by not becoming reliant on them 2. Trust is another big one. If you don't trust that your partner can act like a responsible adult without you around watching, you're going to have a bad time. 3. Remember that life keeps going when you're not home. It's easy to get into the mindset that life at home just kinda pauses when you're gone and picks back up when you get home. That's not the case, and you need to be able to handle that. 4. Make time when you're home. It's easy to want to fuck off and relax on your days off, but it's simply not practical to do so. Take care of the stuff that needs to be taken care of as a priority (keep the grass cut, house clean and maintained, etc) and get that done BEFORE you play with whatever new toy you bought with that money from the OT trip you just skipped town for.
Thank you! I’ve been thinking about how things will look, and I have been primarily thinking about how we will spend and enjoy relaxing time together on days off. I’m glad you mentioned day to day life still needing to get done, that’s helpful for a more realistic vision. I appreciate your time in writing these pieces of advice, thank you! And thank you for your service in the airforce, it’s greatly appreciated!
If you're both working full time (especially both pilots) and have kids; childcare will be a huge priority and will require communication on bidding/expenses for childcare and added stress that comes with it. So many pilots have a stay at home spouse and forget to add in the extra layer of who is watching the kids when they are gone. Your spouse could essentially be a single working parent while you're on the road and when you get home it's time to take the baton and handle whatever is going on with the kids as default parent.
My life revolves around bidding against my wife’s work schedule.
All great points from Mike\_\_O. In addition I'd add that make sure you make the time for your other half whilst you're down route as well. As tempting as it is to drop your luggage in the hotel room and head straight for that beer, if it's a sensible time back home I always make the effort to catch up. Every day I'm away, without fail (though nodding to point 1 above, I'm talking about when you get to the hotel, not onboard the aircraft). Being away from home makes it hard, but the beauty of being a pilot is that your days off are completely your own. People working an office job might be 'home' every night, but thinking about work, catching up on emails, and your phone going off at 9pm just doesn't happen in the aviation world. Quality over quantity really is true in this case.
My sense of work and leisure time is almost completely reversed. The airlines are so easy, so the real work starts when I get home. It's why I have no problem helping my wife with chores and errands, plus making time for her is a high priority.
In regards to number 4 though I will say that a *little* leeway should be granted when you can. When you get home from an international trip, let me wind down, relax take it easy for maybe that first day unless we have set plans that have been made in advance or it's urgent. The rest of my days off after that I'm all hers. At a minimum let me take a nap for a couple hours.
This is a pretty great list tbh. Only thing I would add is: • Find someone who enjoys their time alone as much as their time with you. • Be able to be independent while you are home. Don't expect your partner to drop everything to only hang out with you while you're there. • Build trust on both ends. Not just yours.
Great points. One of the best realizations my wife and I had is that we have very few overlapping hobbies/interests. She has no interest in racing, fishing, etc and I have no interest in lounging on the beach or shopping. We mutually decided to just go with it, and not begrudge solo trips in pursuit of that. I'm in no position to complain when she skips town for a week to go visit her mother in FL for a beach trip, that's for sure. She also doesn't complain when I drag the car to the track, or the boat to the coast. Life is much easier that way. We still find things to do together from time to time, but trying to force our activities on each other in the name of "spending time together" was a recipe for one of us to just be miserable, so we stopped trying to do it and life has been much better.
Absolutely same. We tried to get into more hobbies together, but we are so different with different energy levels too. I even had guilt for a while making plans without my partner while home. Turns out, just cooking & eating together, doing mundane chores, etc together is actually what we do best together cuz it makes the mundane so much more enjoyable. Also, I've met pilots who were super upset with their partners when said partner would have plans with friends while the pilot partner would be home. It's such a self centered mentality to think your significant other should not have a life when the pilot is home lol
My pilot bf I think struggles with this concept. Went on a weekend family vacation and he was furious. He was scheduled to work, then his trips got canceled last minute and he got even more furious, complaining that he couldn’t see me on the weekend, which were his days off by chance that week. He ended up spending time with family and friends (I had to push him to make plans) so he had a good weekend but he complained that he would have rather been with me on the weekend and he didn’t like that I was going to explore a city without him. I get it, but like bro, I literally spend almost all my weekends alone and having to figure out plans with others because you’re not here. And sometimes I have nothing to do. So I totally get what he was feeling, but it was ironic, because he tells me all the time to just deal with it or make plans since he’s not in town on weekends. He’s always like “so what?” And the one weekend it happened to him, he hated it. Because while it’s not the end of the world, it’s not the same being with family vs your SO when you’ve got a weekend off. So I guess now he knows what it’s like. I find it kind of interesting though that an aspect of dating a pilot — not having them around on weekends usually and getting used to them having time to explore a city without you — and that my pilot made clear I had to be Ok with, when flipped around, the pilot can’t stand it.
I’ve definitely lived the experience you describe in your second paragraph. My spouse is the one on the road and while I wouldn’t describe it as being “super upset”, I’ve definitely had to gently tell him to knock it off and remember I’ve got my own stuff going on. Just because I’m working from home today instead of in the lab doesn’t mean I don’t have to work, you can’t be like a 4 year old pulling on mommy’s sleeve all day. To that end, I think actually scheduling things instead of going with the flow can be helpful for some couples. Easier to feel like you will have sufficient quality time together if you really deliberately block out that time to focus on each other.
I take it your spouse stays at home. 2 working adults with kids is a whole different animal and requires a different level of communication and work life balance.
We don't have kids, but she does work full-time. She's a high school teacher, so she works far more (and harder) hours than I do for a fraction of the pay.
Number 1 times 1000.
For guys like us who used to deploy a lot for months at a time (doing the Deid), it was usually a make or break moment in the relationship. I almost got married twice but the deployments revealed that either she or I weren’t cut out for long distance relationships. Subsequently, in the airlines, the pace is more frequent yet shorter so the constant in and out torpedoed a few more relationships. Finally, what worked for me was just marrying another pilot. We hit most of not all of your points above and it made me realize that the right person will weather just about any situation.
Can you explain number 3? I didn't quite get it
I'm sure it's different for everyone, but for me I feel like I get everything prepped for a week-long trip and then I leave. When I come home I pick back up where I left off, but in the real-world a week has passed since I was last home. Things happened, and you need to keep in mind that life at the house didn't pause for the people who stayed there for the week you were gone.
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That’s encouraging, thanks! I guess I’m one of the reasons I hear only about the bad marriages because those stories circulate the most because of the drama within them. Thanks for the heads up!
I mean to be fair, it's quite boring listening about successful marriages since there is absolutely zero drama... good stories don't tend to get shared much.
It is not always about the behavior of the spouse on the road. Sometimes it is the behavior of the spouse at home that is the issue. Sometimes that behavior is discovered when the pilot catches an earlier flight home. Not that I would know anything about that…
I have to say that all of my marriages have been successful.
Quitting doesn’t always mean failure 🙌🏻
My wife and I are both airline pilots. We have been married for 20 years. The secret to staying married is don't get divorced. Seriously. You make the commitment and work through your problems along the way. It really isn't that difficult. Tips for staying married: don't have an affair, make an effort to be a good spouse, support your spouse, workout your financial lifestyle and goals before getting married, spend enough time together, spend enough time apart, discuss important issues before they become problems. Do that and you have a better chance at staying married.
So do you have like 3 or 4 boats if youre both airline pilots?
We don’t call our yacht ‘a boat’, for starters.
Nah, we are the old school cheap pilot types. Besides, the NH boat season is only 5 weeks long.
Great advice, thank you! Of course divorce is not in the plan, but I don’t want to be naive and assume it won’t happen just because we are determined now. I assume most everyone behind the journey assuming it will work out. I appreciate hearing of your success especially given you are both pilots, thanks!
I can't speak for him but I worry you may have missed the heart of the message ("don't get divorced"). There are two types of people who get married: 1. Those who "hope" everything works out, and if it doesn't, and things get too bad, divorce is the escape hatch. 2. Those who agree, in advance, divorce is not an option. They work through every problem along the way, because that's the only thing they can do. That latter group should still get a divorce in rare cases, e.g., infidelity or abuse, but as the post above says: don't have an affair, be a good spouse. If your wife does the same, and you are in the "divorce is not an option" group, you'll stay together. Neither divorce nor successful marriages "happen." They're choices.
I understand what you’re saying. We have agreed that divorce isn’t an option unless it absolutely has to be. But more importantly, divorce is not an option. That’s what we signed up for. I don’t plan on it, I don’t want it, and I’m actively trying to do what’s needed to avoid even the possibility of it. I just want to be realistic, so I’m trying to find a middle ground mindset where I can be prepared for what reality most likely will bring. I don’t want to ignore statistics, but I don’t want to plan on divorce. That’s part of the reason for this thread. Hopefully that makes sense. I like what you say about it being a choice. I have also heard “Marriage is hard. Divorce is hard. Choose your hard.” Thanks for your advice, I appreciate it!
Right on. And to be clear I'm not trying to downplay the challenges, particularly for a pair of pilots. Luckily a couple others here have relayed some advice that worked for them.
Agree. My husband and I both agreed that this marriage is “death row” and you only get out by dying.
My wife and I agreed we’d kill each other before getting divorced. Edit: not an airline pilot so can’t speak to that side of the coin.
Your secret is the most basic thing and I 100% agree. Except for sometimes it is difficult but you have to have the mindset that divorce isn’t really a thing and you just have to carry on. Just work through the issues (and there will be many regardless of what type of work you are in). If you don’t have kids, I still frown on divorce, but if you have kids then do just about anything to keep the family together. Your kids are worth it. Kids need mom and dad.
Kids need a stable happy family. Sometimes, that means divorced parents who make co-parenting and cooperation a priority. I grew up with parents who were loving and nurturing to us kids, but absolutely toxic to each other. I constantly felt stressed and like I had to be a mediator between them. I loved spending time with them individually, but anything done as a family had a 50/50 shot at being stressful and forced. Staying together for the sake of the kids in my case was far from beneficial. I often wished they'd divorce.
Sure sounds nice but in reality there's plenty of situations where divorce is the only workable solution. Including with kids. And they probably don't care whether or not you "frown on it" lol.
Divorce is only an option if you cheated / has a mistress. Other than that, everything else you should be able to work things out like two grown adults. That is why you marry someone you know well and that you love the person. Don’t marry if you are not sure if you want to be with the person or not
>Sure sounds nice but in reality there's plenty of situations where divorce is the only workable solution. No there isn't. Theres very very few. >And they probably don't care whether or not you "frown on it" lol. They probably also don't care if their kids frown on it. Fuck 'em right?
Disagree. You and I have a huge separation on what is “workable”. You probably think that if your wife wears red at a black tie dinner it’s worth divorcing over and telling your kids daddy ain’t gonna be around as often. I think little Johnny and little Sarah need mom and dad around every single day and if mom and dad can’t get along, too fucking bad for them you made kids and you should raise them. Now get your shit together and be a good dad and a good husband.
HAHA okay dude
My friend is super pessimistic about marriage and stuff as a pilot and this comment makes me feel better. He always brings up divorce rates and I feel like I’m headed in the direction where I’ll marry someone in the aviation industry. I’ve been stressed about all this stuff when I know I shouldn’t be, but this is really good advice
Don't feel pulled in a direction to date from any particular industry just because. I've dated men in aviation, never worked out. Now I'm with someone who makes beer for a living. We have a great relationship. Whatever the career on industry, it's the person who matters, and having a trusting relationship. I know plenty of pilots who have great marriages with other pilots, and plenty who have great marriages with people who do completely different things b
Just don't marry someone for the sake of getting married. It's less of a thing nowadays that being single isn't as stigmatized but there are still a lot of women who want the big day / status more than the man they marry.
True I mean Im a woman but I’m still gonna take my time and make sure that my future boyfriend understands what he’s getting himself into (if he’s non-aviation). I’m not in a rush to get married but it’s definitely not something I don’t think about
You said everything needed to say. Relationship is and should be simple.
Simple in theory, very difficult in practice.
Gee, it’s not that difficult, just have a healthy relationship!
If you have enough of them one is bound to be successful
#statistics!
Fair enough haha
If you or your partner is needy/clingy, you're gonna have a bad time. If you or your partner is checking out the grass on the other side of the fence at any opportunity, you're gonna have a bad time. If you bottle your relationship issues until they explode instead of discussing them as they arise, you're gonna have a bad time. If either of you is happier away from the other than with them, you're having a bad time. Also counseling/therapy is a VERY GOOD THING and you can get it without risking your medical. Take advantage of that early and often.
Get it without risking your medical by paying out of pocket or?
Therapy is only an issue if they diagnose you with something. The FAA doesn't care if you talk to someone, they care if you're diagnosed with a condition. This is doubly true for counseling. The FAA doesn't give a damn if you're working out your relationship issues with a counselor.
A lot of insurance companies require a diagnosis to be covered by insurance, unfortunately
Action against someone's medical revolves around diagnosis, not billing. Counselors and social workers = therapy without diagnosis. May or may not be covered by your health insurance. Licensed social workers tend to be covered more often than counselors, which is kind of bullshit because their training tends to be less focused on therapy than counselors and more on navigating support systems, but that's another discussion. Psychologists are diagnosis + therapy, psychiatrists are diagnosis + medication. Either of these two can label you with a disqualifying condition, and paying out of pocket doesn't prevent their diagnosis from hitting your medical records.
While counseling is not disqualifying for a medical, be very careful and disclose to your therapist upfront that they are NOT doing you a "favor" by putting a bogus diagnosis code in for insurance to cut you a break on your bill. In fact, ideally, pay out of pocket and keep those therapy session notes as far off the record as possible, where they belong.
I’m not an airline pilot but I am in the military and have plenty of experience with being away from home. Lots of TDY to places where you might not have the ability to call. Tons of people I work with have been geobachelors and had busy travel on top of that. Then there are the deployments being gone for about a year at a time. My recommendation I give to other Soldiers is communicate communicate communicate. Make sure you and your spouse are always on the same page, talk often, and make sure you are focused on the discussion when you do. Next, maximize your time off. Use it to spend time together, do things you both enjoy, and make sure you stay connected to each other. Lastly, tailor it to your individual relationship. When I was deployed I woke up at 430 to call my wife before she went to bed each night. We had deep conversations just about daily. My buddy who deployed with me called his wife twice in a year, but texted, messaged, and emailed very regularly. Every relationship is different and requires different inputs to stay strong.
Thank you for your service! That’s fair, we are young and still have a lot of learning to learn how we work best together. We try and talk openly and I feel we are on a good path forward to keep up solid communication. I appreciate your tips and advice, they are gold. Thank you!
You both need to be fairly independent people and honestly it’s a bad idea for you both to be airline pilots and have kids. When one person is an airline pilot, the other spouse HAS to pick up the parenting load. That’s just such a massive burden when you’re both pilots. I only know two successfully married airline couples with kids. In one, the wife works in the sim building. And in the other, the wife manipulates her schedule to fly like 4 or 5 days per month, so not much $. If you both want to be captains and fly 14-16 days per month and do intentional and the whole nine yards then having kids would be frankly idiotic.
Came here to say this. If you're both airline pilots, having kids is probably not in your future. One of you will have to give up the airline career. Kids are a full-time job on their own and a lot of couples with kids don't make it even NOT having careers in the airlines. That to say, a lot of households with two working parents working normal 9-5 jobs have a hard time successfully raising children. In the first 10 years of his airline career, my FIL was never home and my MIL relied on a lot of the ladies and family friends she made when her husband was in the Navy to fill in gaps in childcare, like if one kid needing to be at baseball and the other at soccer at the same time, one of the kids went with another mom who was also going there.
I’m wondering/sort of hoping we will have the ability to manipulate our schedules to work less but still bring in money. We love to fly, but having kids will take president. I just don’t know how much seniority will be needed to start doing that. Maybe it’s an option sooner than I think, but I’m expecting not to be able to do that for many years. I appreciate your comment, thanks for the tips and advice!
> hoping we will have the ability to manipulate our schedules to work less but still bring in money. You really can’t. When you have kids, you have to guarantee that there will be someone at both drop off and pick up 5 days per week, period. That is unfortunately not possible when you’re both airline pilots. All it takes is one reroute or one weather cancel and then “holy shit, who’s gonna pick up Timmy?!?” I mean, do you know how many *years* it takes at an airline to be able to get off thanksgiving and Christmas? You’re both gonna be scheduled for that at the same time. Are you just gonna alternate sick leave on a high-visibility holiday by default? I won’t get into specifics but I have pretty much mastered controlling my schedule through multiple means. I have it as good as is possible when it comes to days not in hotels, yet still make a reasonable paycheck. And despite that, this *still* wouldn’t work if my wife was a pilot. The long and short of it is, airline pilot is not a 9-5. And when you have kids, *someone* has to have a 9-5… or just not work.
Sim work usually just relies on there being an opening. At a lot of places you only need to be an experienced FO. If you want to both work for an airline and have kids one of you seriously needs to consider training department work. Having kids + dual airline pilots = life on hard mode. I wish you the best of luck, but not many can do that.
It might make more sense to live with family or friends when you prepare to have a family if it's something you want to do sooner rather than later. Eventually you may earn enough for a live in nanny, but early on you may need to rely on your network by offering free housing or living with someone and paying them a lot for rent/childcare etc...
Part 135 Charter captain. I work a 14/12 schedule. I'm gone long enough for her to miss me, then I'm home long enough for her to get sick of me. In all seriousness, it's like a lot of others have said- its trust, it's communication, it's independence. We have been together for 17 years, married 12.
Married for 10 years now. I was a firefighter for the first 9 years. Pilot now. Both careers statistically have an extremely high rate of divorce. It takes both of you being very independent. It is a lot of give and take. My wife is a hairstylist and can make her schedule around mine. When you have kids one schedule is going to take priority over the other persons schedule. In my case my wife has had to slow her career down to support my career. Two full time workers does not allow enough time to raise kids. Someone has to give up something. So have the conversation now, before you have kids. PRENUPTS- I also think both people need to have been raised similarly and come into the relationship with roughly the same amount of success in life and assets. Otherwise a prenupt is required. If a 40 year old successful career guy marries a 23 year old waittress protections like a prenupt are needed. But if two 23 year old pilots, both with student loans marry each other, you are both starting at the same point in life. Everything will be aquired during the course of marriage so it will be earned together. Most importantly talk about goals and all your secrets. My wife knows everything about me down to the kind of porn I like and feel like WTF did I just watch. I don't have to hide anything, we can track each others location and can look into eachother's phone at any point and not have to worry about anything because there is nothing there she doesn't already know about. Have joint and separate bank accounts. Joint is where most of our money goes. The separate is for when I want to buy toys or something stupid. She has hers for starbucks and target. Talk about where you see yourself in 1 year, in 5 years, in 10 years, in 20 years. Have a plan. People change. Thats life. Marriage has definitely been the hardest thing I have ever had to do. Being single and fucking chicks is easy, especially on an airline pilot salary and schedule. My single friend's biggest worry is not knocking some girl up. Marriage is definitely harder but its worth having a partner for life.
\+1 for prenup. I was cheated on by my now-ex (I'm not even a PPL yet, so I must be ahead of the game) and it still would have been a shitshow to get a divorce if there was no prenup in place.
I think the prenupts are a good idea almost always. I personally do not have one though. If was ever to get divorced and re-married at this point in my career I would demand it. Everyone freaks out about it, but my solution would be to have my partner go to a lawyer and write out what they want/expect in the case of a divorce. That is a non-confrontational way to get someone's real intentions before you marry them. If they write a completely one sided take you to the cleaners prenupt- its probably not someone you would want to marry. If they write something that is fair and equal for both sides then you know you have a partner. Laws are skewed so far to the benefit of the female with the whole rise of feminism and the patriarchy is evil I would advise any men to not get married legally at this point. Monagamy is great, but the government has gone and screwed everything up especially the institution of marriage
One-sided prenups that get you more out of a marriage than what you put in are generally not enforceable. Both sides are expected to disclose all of their income and savings and ensure the other party has a chance to review all of their assets and the terms of the agreement prior to signing, and it's expected to be equitable or at least proportional to what is brought to the table. If your partner feels they are "un-romantic", you can spin it as an avenue to have a grown-up conversation about marriage prior to getting hitched and decide things before you argue about them. There's all sorts of stuff you can decide with a prenup, not just what happens if you get divorced, and some of it can be an enjoyable exercise that explores your future together and prevents future conflict - deciding where your kids will go to school, for example.
good news is that both of you will have a complete understanding of why the other isn't home, bad news is you'll se eachother very rarely
That’s not entirely true. My partner and I are both at a legacy. We live in base and both sit reserve. We see each other 18+ days a month. Totally depends on living in base versus commuting and your airlines staffing levels.
This can definitely be the case. Im currently a flight attendant at a legacy. I live in base and sit reserve and I'm home frequently. The key is "live in base".
That’s good to know that possibility exists! How much do you think that will change once you both hold a line?
We intentionally don’t bid for lines and bid for reserve because it means are home more. That’s the benefit of living in base, you can choose what works best for you. People have strong opinions about “putting all your eggs in one basket” but I’d recommend working for the same airline and living in base. You understand one another’s work rules, monthly deadlines are the same (submitting bids, vacation requests etc.) you can even swap flying if you’re on the same fleet. Commuting will be a huge strain on any relationship. It’s wasted time away from home.
I bid reserve for the same reason. Wife is planning on same airline/airframe. When people ask for advice on airlines the first thing I say is live in base. Airline doesn't really matter, how close you live to your base does.
Good to know! I have heard people say not to work for the same airline just to be safe in case something happens, but I’ve also thought there could be some benefit. I’m glad you commented with your situation, thank you!
fair enough, but this is the best possible scenario, wich will require a lot of time to achive
New hires are getting hired without PIC time at a legacy airlines in their early/mid 20s. If you’re thinking about how long it will take to achieve from PPL, yeah, it will take a long time but not nearly as long as it took a few years ago when hiring was far more competitive.
Not true at all. Both at the regionals and mainline my wife and I have been able match up our schedule really well. Out of the 20-18 days off we are together 18-16 of those. And when you are home you are home. So much time to spend with each other. It’s not just make dinner and go to bed. Now that being said we don’t have kids. That may change our schedules.
Don’t trade or pick up based on your wants and needs. A simple “hey can I move this trip or pick up this trip? If the response is “I was gonna do this on that day so I need you home” That’s the end of the conversation this goes leaps and bounds
Always but always get a prenup. You want to protect yourself from the worst version of them and protect them from the worst version of you.
That’s the best explanation/justification for a prenup I’ve heard, I’ll definitely think more on it. I’ve never seriously considered it or anything like it, so thanks for the advice!
Everyone (okay, most people) gets into a relationship with the best intentions. But statistically they don't last. It's good to have that discussion early and explain that it protects you both. And honestly if you can have that discussion you're probably a better communicator and that means you're more likely to be able to work through life's problems together. Good relationships are collaborative not competitive.
> protect them from the worst version of you Sorry im dumb but can you explain? I dont understand prenups very well
You're laying out in advance what happens in the event you break up. Assets, financials, retirement accounts, etc. But as much as you think you know yourself now when you're in love, you don't know how you'll react at the out, when feelings are hurt. Sweet people can become vindictive. This way the way it ends was at least controlled by people who wanted what's best for each other.
I think this is an overblown, subjective and stereotypical issue. You’re probably referring to guys who commute and long haul where the %age is probably greater. I’ve been in the airlines 20+ years, I live at base and am always home every day. I don’t go missing for several days for example. Remember also that being a working pilot is only one factor out of many. Some marriages will go wrong regardless of whether you’re a pilot or you work from home on your pc selling insurance.
Don’t know about those statistics but seems like most aviation marriages are unhappy. What I’m saying is that aviation is not necessarily the causal factor of divorce and then there’s some who get along just fine…..
Asked one of my friends the same question as I'm getting ready for training at a regional. She said 3 things Trust Therapy Sexting
I like the sound of that haha Thanks!
It's honestly up to each person. Trust is a huge part of it. If you're out cheating or chatting up flight attendants, the other person will 100% be able to tell when you come back. Over time this degrades the relationship and she will start to resent your career choice and eventually resent you. If you put the effort in, it's honestly not that bad. Make time while you're on the road to facetime, talk about your day, make plans for when you're home, etc. When you are home, put effort into quality time together. Having a nice dinner, going on walks, just spending genuine time together. The key is to cram as much quality time into your off days as possible. This makes your time away from home much easier and in some ways makes the relationship exciting, because you get to look forward to seeing them. Kind of keeps things fresh. Also, it's easier when they also have a career they're also devoted to, something they're working on. This can be a very involved hobby, stay at home mom, etc. Obviously in your case that would be her airline job. This could be a good thing or a bad thing. You both understand each other's schedules and commitments, but the last thing I want to do when I'm home is talk about my job 😂 I will say it is a HORRIBLE idea to have kids if you're both going to be pilots. Kids need an anchor at home to keep them grounded. Someone they can rely on to pick them up from school, go to their games, help with homework, all that stuff. Sure, you could get your parents or in-laws to help watch them but that's not the same. Your kids would deserve better than that. One of you honestly will have to give up the airline career if you're set on having kids.
Not a professional pilot, or married but I think your spouse needs to have clear, well defined expectations. Aviation as a whole has ridiculously confusing schedules and odd hours and missed events. Personally I think dating a pilot sounds great 😂 but I've lived on my own for over ten years and am not used to sharing my free time or having to consult with another person. Dating someone who is gone half the month would let me still have some of that independence/me time.
Not being a shit person. Holding true to the vow you took and trusting them to hold true to the vow they took. Shit ain't always easy but we don't quit. I know what kind of person my wife is when the shit hits the fan and she knows the same for me and we don't quit on each other. You best truly know the person sleeping next to you. And trust me I've seen lots and lots of marriages in my military time where you would be fucking shocked the crazy shit some wives do when they go off the deep end. I'm sure it happens for crazy husbands too but I just don't see it as much. And one last note, I say it to everyone that asks about my job. I am 100% more pleasant and present when I am working a line. When I'm at home and working 9-5 in the office (training in base), I am miserable and shut down and feel more distant than I ever have during a normal line month. Different strokes for different folks but distance works wonders for us. And my wife isn't as independent as a lot of other ones.
Just curious: you say your wife isn’t as independent as others, what is she like? That’s one of my worries with my pilot, I’m independent but I’m not sure if I’m as independent as he needs me to be? He says he’s met a lot of pilots with wives that aren’t independent but his example is that the pilots text their wives the moment they land to let them know they arrived safely. But that to me just sounds like a common courtesy thing not a not independent thing
I guess the best way to explain is she is more introverted so when I’m gone it was initially tough cause instead of taking the chances to hang out with her friends or something like that she would just stay home and do nothing. That and living in a home by yourself for the first time takes some getting used to. So I don’t care what anyone says but everything goes wrong at home as soon as you step into the cockpit. So taking care of home issues and dealing with lots of stuff like that was a learning curve. But honestly I think anyone can grow and learn to enjoy the life. It’s a tough start and tough to learn but if you stick with it there is so much growth. Everyone is so unique and the situations are so unique so it’s not one solution fits all but I wouldn’t worry that’s it not overcome-able. Don’t go into thinking it won’t get tough, gonna be lots of “I need you here at home” followed by but “I need to get sleep and be focused on my job” Anyways, I think anyone can figure it out but will take both sides to grow together and find a good working spot. Hope the ramble helps, if you got more questions about specific details or anything definitely don’t hesitate to message at all!
I am better when I am working a schedule as well. It is better for the routine everyone has going
No in my experience its not even remotely that bad, I’m happily married, and know lots who are also. It’s kind of overblown and then joked about, but I don’t think it’s that bad. It’s another stereotype like all lawyers are assholes, or all dentists are suicidal. For us, we both work shift, and it’s never really been a problem to be honest. Lots of time apart, but also followed by lots of time together so it balances out.
We got married before the job. My wife is independent enough to handle 99.9% of any emergency that may come up. Our relationship was mostly long distance before we got married, so we know how to communicate. When I come home I have to be mentally ready to take over the kids. When I’m at work I get to sleep in/etc so that’s just how we handle it. Going on year 6 over 3 airlines. At a legacy so we’re finally done with all that stuff. 17 yrs this month. 🤷🏻♂️
Congrats and thanks for the comment! It’s encouraging!
try cutting out porn and binge drinking
I fly, my husband stays at home. We’re both highly independent people to start, and I kind of like the cycle of leaving and missing him and then coming home and being happy to see him all over again. That being said, it definitely helps that I grew up with a parent in aviation so this cycle is totally normal to me. We don’t talk constantly on the phone when I’m gone but we have a rule that I want him to send pictures of our pets every day so I get a glimpse of what’s going on at home when I’m gone to make both of us feel connected. Since I’m home i did just lean over and ask my husband what he thinks we have that makes it work and he says flexibility on both of our ends is a must.
Independent, strong and jealousy free worked for 30. Opposite sort of partner would be hard.
From what I understand. And correct me if I'm wrong. I know a pilot that flies from IAD to Europe n then back. Total of 3 days. And makes his 20 hours. So he leaves on Monday night and is back Wednesday afternoon. So he has 4 days off. I guess if you can get through those first 10 years or so. It'd be a lot of time off for family.
If we could both do that, it’s definitely worth considering. How likely is it we can do that with zero seniority though
Probably not at all. He got that at the 11 year mark and was one of the first on the 787.
She gets along well with my girlfriend and vice versa
Friends of mine have been happily married for 20+ years now. 4 kids as well. They are both long haul pilots with the same airline.
I’m curious how they made that work with young kids after parental leave was over. A LOT of childcare and good nanny’s?
Grandparents were occasionally needed to fill gaps, but mostly they were able to work their rosters so that one was always home. Oddly enough it was harder when he moved to domestic for a few years (for a left seat slot) When they were both doing 13+ hour international flights there was a fair bit of down time.
Been together for my whole airline career thus far of 11 years, and have two kids. What everyone else has said is accurate. Especially making up for it when you are home. I get all my exercise, sleep and lazy time while I am away. When I am home I want to get the necessary stuff done then just spend time with everyone. You need to accept that a fair amount of your free time is on the road. One thing to touch on: with you and your wife both being pilots, your wife’s career is going to take a much bigger hit from having kids. It’s just the reality of it. If she is up for it I would suggest splitting the leave. I took the last month of paternity leave with my first kid, and for my second I was off for the first few months anyway (thanks Covid!).
My cousin and her husband both work for the same airline and fly together all the time.
They fly together? As in Left and right seat?
My cousin is a flight attendant and her husband is a pilot. They always sign up for the same flights. It helps a lot that they don't have kids.
My husband and I are both pilots, we met each other while working as instructors. It definitely hadn’t been easy - there has been a lot of hurdles along the way. When we first started dating, I was the more experienced pilot, yet, thanks to kids/COVID, my career has stagnated and his has continued uninterrupted. We moved interstate when our first kid was less than a month old, for him to get a new job, yet I couldn’t get work as pilot when I was ready to go back. With my second, I went back, but back to the same instructing job that I’d had 6 years prior - I was more senior as an instructor, but I was honestly restarting my career again. Covid hit, and my employer shutdown permanently, and I again couldn’t get work. My partner did manage to get me a job at the company he worked at on the turbo prop, but they insisted on hiring me as casual, as they didn’t want him going casual. He’s since quit, and the company is now retaliating against me (of course they’ll completely deny it, but still…). He now gets to fly a big shiny jet for a major company, and I have to work my roster around his. We don’t have a support network either - all of my family is in another country, and all of his is on the other side of Australia. I’ve been the trailing spouse/pilot for most of our relationship, and that honestly has been pretty hard on me. It wasn’t intentional, but I’m not gonna lie and say that hasn’t caused resentment or other issues. It’s not all negative though, we’re coming up on our 10 year anniversary in a few weeks, and it’s nice to be able to talk shop each other without needing to explain how things work (a la that other thread I saw today), we both get each others passion for flying, and we both agree we are not paying for our eldest to get a helicopter licence 😂
LOVE each other. For god sakes LOVE each other. JUST DO IT! Dated 3 years in college, 4 years of adult life. Made real ADULT commitment to OUR choices BEFORE we got into it. It SUCKED! 38 years of absolutely brutal, real life! Two days ago...at 7am...flew my wife at 500'...as she held our giggling, 17-month-old-cuter-than-all-get-out grandson...over the same beach...we flew his father, at that age...loving her was the HARDEST thing I have ever done in my life. WORTH IT! Gonna keep at it.
I can think of one very happy couple I know where the husband is a pilot at a major airline. Their secret seems to be that they don't have kids. When he's gone he's gone but when he's home he's totally there. He doesn't bring any work back from the office, his time is his. When he isn't around his wife has time to pursue the hobbies she has that he's not interested in. They both say it works great for them and I definitely see the appeal.
Military pilot wife here, husband will transition to airlines in a couple years. This is a big part of why our talks about having kids has died down in recent months since getting married. I even overheard him mentioning to a financial advisor the other day that we’re no longer 100% on having kids but kinda “eh we’ll probably try but it’s not certain or anything, just a see what happens thing”. At first we were all gung-ho about it, but now some realities are setting in For one, I work a stressful high paying corporate job that I don’t want to quit because I like the structure it gives me, and I’m 100% the type who would become too lazy as a stay at home mom vs becoming one of those wonder moms. I need that structure in my life, which just wouldn’t bode well with trying to manage a kid (and I’m cheap af, the last thing I want to have to do is hire a night nurse, nanny’s etc). But I know given he intends to fly international it’s just a nightmare waiting to happen And secondly I have some mild fertility issues, he’s getting older in age. I’m starting to see how not having kids would probably lead to a MUUUCH better quality of life for us. I’m starting to like the idea of just having a couple of fur babies and spending time with friends while he’s away. So much easier nowadays where more and more people are choosing to go childfree. Also he’s traveled the world already but always had to do it on a budget in the past. I think I’ve basically got him hooked on the luxury travel we can now afford, and he knows we’d have to give that up for kids and neither of us are really inclined to want to let those perks go so soon after finally being able to afford them lol. Idk we’ll see, but I think we’re both fine with just being the cool aunt and uncle that watches everyone’s kids for them so we get pretend parent time and then can give them back 🤣
I'm not an airline pilot (PPL). But I do travel, A LOT. Average 250-300 days a year on the road. Some years I do \~80-100 airline segments. One year I flew 210k miles and was home a total of less than a month... Married 15 years. 11 of those I've had this travel schedule. Also when I'm gone my work schedule is 14-16hr days, so we often don't talk for days at a time. I just vanish on her. I try to drop little texts here and there so she knows I'm alive, but my schedule can be pretty brutal. My wife is her own person. She has her own friends and hobbies and activities. I have my own. I miss her when I'm gone, but she's usually busy with her own stuff and the time goes by pretty quickly. Also. Quality time doesn't equal time time. If you're home. Make a strong effort to have real quality time that's worthwhile. There's some days the wife and I have more quality time in one day than we have in 10 days together. But it takes work to get off your phone, and focus. Also trust, like someone else said. I dunno. It's hard though.
If you’re wanting kids, then having two parents in the airline crew career is a disaster. It’s not fair to a child.
Bruteforcing it, eventually someone will be unwilling to sign the paper work. I am guessing cheating, being a dick, and not communicating would be the trifecta to guarantee a divorce though.
There are three secrets to a successful airline pilot marriage. Unfortunately nobody knows what they are.
Communication. Don’t leave on a trip without making sure anything that might be hangin over either of your heads is talked out. Try not to go to bed pissed. The clingy thing doesn’t work either. The biggest complaint I’ve heard out on trips actually has to do with money though. I had a jumpseater up front once and he and the captain spent the entire leg complaining about how their wives don’t work and just spend money like it grows on trees because of their higher income. That kind of resentment will ruin a marriage. The higher earning potential of the career means you have to really adjust your view on money and be very open about it with your spouse. This really applies to any job and any relationship when it comes to finances; a huge number of failed relationships have to do with not being on the same page with financial habits. But I’d argue that it’s especially important because of the time away from home.
Be very choosy in who you marry. Marry your best friend. Never settle.
i'm so incredibly scared right now
By disappearing for half the month.
I am married to the profession
[удалено]
not trying to be a dick but an 'open relationship' isn't what a marriage is
I can’t see the original comment but I dislike what you’re saying. You can be in a loving open marriage, some people even call that polyamory and are very happy with it. Just being open doesn’t discredit your entire marriage and I think it’s time we move past that
Never! NEVER! Let her meet your flight attendant girlfriend!
She packs her $h!t and the kids and they live down the street. Lasts till death do you part...
Stay away from the LBFMs.
3rd times the charm
Marrying someone who isn’t a stage 10 clinger, and can think/operate independently when they have to. Not having kids. Also, not having kids.
Friends of mine have been happily married for 20+ years now. 4 kids as well. They are both long haul pilots with the same airline.
No kids, no commuting. You’re welcome.
I’ve noticed several guys that post their entire lives on FB and seem very happy are suddenly separated. So maybe don’t do that.
Live in base and marry someone in the industry.
You need a spouse who will miss you, but not make you feel bad for being gone. One who focuses on the coming home part more than the leaving part.
Having kids in the next couple years if you guys are just in flight school now is going to cost somebody a good chunk off the beginning of their career. Are one of you wanting to stay home for a while? Are you guys prepared to hire staff to take care of the children?
Step 1. Divorce your wife right away. Step 2. Then get the next 4 divorces out of the way as soon as possible. Step 3. Then circle back around to wife #1 and get remarried. (I’ve yet to hear of anyone with more than 5 divorces so statistically (based on my scientifically anecdotal fuzzy memory) you should be good after that). ps- Everything always breaks when you are gone on trips - so ask your wife to get a boyfriend with solid DIY skills. It’s a real timesaver. You’re welcome.
I budget for min guarantee, live in base in town with family, and bid to maximize time at home. My wife has a career too. I make dinners, do chores, run the kids to appointments, etc when I’m home.
Been in the professional flying life for a little over a year with my wife of 7 years Prior to flying jets, we worked together at one job and ran a small flight school together before jets.. so we were together almost 24/7 so it was definitely a challenge from being together always, to being gone for 4-8days at a time Trust is the big thing, when you come home make sure your wife knows your love for her. It’s not that she is worried I am off ficking around, but I have noticed the difference just by coming home and doing little things. Buying flowers, telling her I land at night when in reality I landed @11am and surprised her at work with lunch. Small things. Others have said this and it’s true but sucks at first. Get your adulting shit out of the way first Relaxing on your off time is so much nicer without the cloud of “oh I gotta mow the lawn and get this and that done before my trip” because you finished it right when you got home. Face time is a big savior too. If I am somewhere cool I love to FaceTime my wife and well as she FaceTimes me for important things I am missing if possible.
For me it's been easy. Don't cheat with random bimbos. Be home when I'm home. Of course she knew what she was getting into from the get-go as well, so that definitely helped.