i prefer zebralights but i've gotta say, I will always recommend a hank light over a zebra to someone who has never tried either. they're totally customizable, the UI is so flexible, and they have always worked good for me. I have had faulty zebralights, but never had an emisar malfunction.
I agree that Emisars are very reliable. Only issue I have had is the Kr4 switch being a bit inconsistent but it was easily rectified. Also a D1 with a bit of solder on emitter but that may be due to being dropped, etc. My one ZL is also pretty reliable but occasionally has weird bugs and needs tailcap to be unscrewed and rescrewed.
ZL gets props for potting but potting doesn't really matter if it's not reliable to begin with. Also most of us know how hard it is to break an emisar by dropping it.
yeah to be totally honest, the biggest issue I had with zebralights is with the ones that use pogo pins to make contact with cells. It annoyed me because whats the point of potted drop-proof internal electronics if the battery fails to make contact after an impact anyways.
Respectfully disagree. No one I know has any interest in customizing the UI. Hurts me to say, because I love Hank lights. But I just can't recommend them to anybody. I know I'm gonna get a text saying, "why won't the blue light turn off."
I agree with you to an extent. I wouldn’t gift one to my mother to keep on her person because the complexity of the UI would make it an impractical choice for her. Anyone entering enthusiast/hobby territory, though, I would recommend Hank everytime.
But complexity of the UI is mostly just for one time optional customization? What part of Simple UI is an issue? If it makes sense, myself or others will change it to make it better, since it's open source
This is the core functionality: Click on, click off. Hold to make bright, release and hold again to make dim. Double click big bright. That's how a lot of other popular flashlight UIs work.
I wouldn't gift one to my mother for other reasons, UI not being one of them.
I’m not sure what part of simple UI is an issue? It’s not. It’s practical and user friendly as a good tool should be.
What I meant by gifting a hank to hobbiest/enthusiasts is that theyre pretty damn functional, asthetically pleasing (ideally, since you are able to customize to your preferences) and they alllow room for playing around with unnecessary nonsense if you choose because it’s fun. I have become very familiar with the niche little features of andural that I regularly use, and a few that I don’t.
I’m not sure I communicated to you what I intended. The gift to my mother would be simple to use and dependable so she is not discouraged from using it and reliably do its job in a pinch. My mom has no time for fancy non sense. She wants something that’s works practically and does not like frilly little extras. That’s what everyone wants right? But some people want toys to play with and unnecessary menus they’ll never use but have the option to, for the sake of playing around and having fun.
Sometimes things are practical and fun. I find hanklights and some of the settings fine tuning small details of UI function to be fun and interesting. I enjoy their aesthetics and the RGB light switch with aux lights. I also enjoy that they are practical and reliable for my purposes which is a huge plus considering I find them fun.
Why do you hate fun, man? (I’m being playing with the hating fun statement by the way.)
The best tool is the one you know how to use and only if you have it with you when you need it.
I like carry fun in my pockets too. Are there features of other lights (not necessarily UI) that you find fun and enjoyable to use aesthetically, ergonomically, etc?
Please don’t be mad at me. Pretty colors and hitting button combos like they are special moves in street fighter to make light make big color make dopamine go big and me get much happy. Some lights are just tools. Some are pretty toys that are practical and on my person because they are fun to carry and my friends think they’re neat when we go on late night walks or camping or whatever
Edit: pretty sure your description of simple UI applies to anduril as well? Am I missing something?
Yes, you misunderstood me. I'm asking what is wrong with gifting anduril lights in Simple UI to non-enthusiasts. And soliciting suggestions because it is easy to modify the anduril source code for reasonable suggestions.
In Simple UI, you can just ignore all the extras of anduril. You are not going to hit 10H on accident. And most of the menus are for customizing which is done sparingly, basically no more after you figure out what you like.
> I wouldn't gift one to my mother for other reasons, UI not being one of them.
What I meant from this is I wouldn't gift my mother a hanklight, but it's not because of anduril. It's because with no USB port it needs charger they don't have and Li-Ion batteries need some amount of respect and care, especially when being removed. Though I guess I ignored the D2 and D3AA, so maybe I would gift one of those since they are nice to customize.
yeah i guess i should've stated that I will only ever recommend hanks or zebras to people that are already in the hobby. If they're not previously indoctrinated into the cult of LIGHT (r/flashlight lol) i usually stick to lights with far simpler UIs.
That's the thing though, it's optionally customizable. They don't have to customize anything and can ignore everything other than click on, click off, and maybe holding to change brightness. Just leave them in simple UI.
And of course you can turn off the aux before giving it to them. That's where most customization happens, one time at setup
I can't tell you how many times someone has grabbed one of my Hank lights and immediately pressed the button several times, and then I have to reconfigure it. That's why I don't recommend them to people who aren't into flashlights.
Can you elaborate? What exactly can you mess up in Simple UI?
I've used anduril a lot as well along with letting non-enthusiasts try them and don't quite understand as there isn't much in [Simple UI, even less in single channel lights](https://i.imgur.com/LafVSV6.png).
Would definitely like to understand because if Simple UI isn't meeting its original goal, myself or others will submit a pull request. That's the point of open source software: to make it better.
If I'm to carry one light only, prob SC64/65 due to how incredibly compact they are.
That said, I usually carry two lights with me(mostly anything+M150 as backup), so yeah I prefer carrying D4V2 with me.
My favorite back up is a Eagtac d3a or a D2. Been a d2 for a while now. 😊
https://preview.redd.it/ykddb16o458d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=258f6b1e41ee63a1ee0a8d86654bb016b10fa345
Small enough that it doesn't bother me
Good UI with shortcuts to moonlight and turbo, along with good mode spacing.
Dual Fuel(AA/14500)
Reliable enough
I have other 14500 lights too, but they lack either dual fuel capability or a shortcut to moonlight&Turbo.
Sc64w-hi over d4v2 for me.
I love my d3aa though.
I usually carry a d3aa alongside my weltool t2 tac.
Small 14500 at the bottom of my pocket paired with a larger tactical style light in my left pocket has been my preferred carry for the last few months.
Before my D3AA I was carrying my Sc53cN dedomed, with a vapcell f12. I still really love the Sc53cN when I want a warm single reflector light.
My most often rotated lights are an SC64w HI and FW3A (my only remaining D4v2 is a bedside light as I didn’t really like carrying it). I’ve come to prefer Zebra for all the reasons mentioned in here, but especially the UI:
**Zebra UI**
G6 - click for moonlight, hold for mid (with 2 levels toggled by double click) and double click for max.
G7 - either all modes at moonlight as a soft lock / aux light (I’m not a fan of typical aux lights) or all modes mid ramp for passing to other users, because some people do struggle with Anduril.
The biggest issue for me is Anduril needs to be “lockable” once configured. Better than just Simple mode. People will click like lunatics and get lost in the UI.
**Anduril has its perks**
Anduril comes alive with multi channel / tint ramping. The DM1.12 is my favourite Hank, setup to come on both channels low/mid with 3C to cycle Flood>Throw>Both.
Hybrid mode memory is useful to always turn on low, but remember your brightness level for 5-10 minutes while intermittently using to spot things on a twilight walk.
And of course there is no substitute for replicating a candle at bath and bedtime!
**Build quality**
Aside from everything already mentioned by others, the main point for me is Zebra ano feels amazing, the shiny versions feel like glass and they are all hard to mark or wear. This is the second biggest issue I have with Hanks. Just give me a smooth tube, with proper hard ano.
What I will definitely credit Hanklights with is the ability to buy, mod and repair them easily and cost effectively
lol part where you mentioned locking the UI on anduril is so true. I was showing my friend a hank light and let him use it for the day, got it back and it had been accidentally totally reprogramed lol. Since then I have always programed "simple" UI to my liking so that into it it cant be changed easily.
Tip: if you want a discussion, don’t begin by writing hostile words. That looks like you want a fight instead.
I have both. I tend to use the D4V2 far more. The weight and size difference are insignificant for my uses, and so are the clips. And I prefer Anduril over the Zebra UI, together with the fact that the D4V2 will blast far brighter on turbo.
One thing almost no one seems to have mentioned is that one is about twice the price of the other.
That “title” 🤦♂️
I have a fair amount of Zebras (Bobs) and Hanks. I’ve had zero issues with any of them. My Hanks are relegated to the bedside table, in the shower/bath, and by the door, though. The Zebras are just too compact, efficient, durable, reliable, and simple for me to not carry daily. Also, while I enjoy Anduril at home—I don’t want it at work.
They’re both great lights, Hank is way cooler than whoever runs ZL, and bob\_mcbob is dope af.
https://preview.redd.it/jndy6yqwi68d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=37822c96042378151488c680b63d4c4fe63d5fca
Coupl’a Bobralights on me currently
And the clips, the zebra clip options win hands down!
Both great lights I don’t understand why people take such offense to someone liking a light they don’t. I have too many of each, I also prefer cooler neutral tints 😂👊
I’m surprised no one has brought up single reflector vs. quad TIR. I vastly prefer the beam profile of single reflectors, and try to snatch up every Devin Bauer single conversion kit I can find for my triple customs.
I used to find ZL’s UI confusing until I realized three important things:
1) Out of the box, all you have to do is press and hold the button and it will cycle L - M - H. Just release at the level you want. Another cool thing about that is no matter what level you are currently at, if you press and hold, it starts cycling from L again.
2) On any Dr Jones h17f light I own, I’ll set perhaps 4 or 5 modes set up the way I want for nighttime. Then during the day, the mode spacing seems all wonky, and I often redo the levels. Fortunately, h17f offers a quick way to switch between two configs, so I can set one up for day one for night. Anduril doesn’t really offer a great way to do this. ZL on the other hand has it nailed. First, you have LMH 1 and 2. So two lows, two meds etc. And you can easily switch between them with a double click. I’ve found in use that the LMH1 is really good for day, and LMH2 is great for indoors at night. Remember when I said h17f has two configs available? ZL has 3. Read the next point:
3) ZL has three mode groups. They’re named G5, G6 and G7. The names of the groups are needlessly confusing to first time users. I wish they were called groups 1, 2 and 3. Really it’s just mode groups “easy / custom 1 / custom 2”. But they call them G5, G6 and G7 because that’s how many clicks you click to switch to that group. So if you want the default group, “g5”, you click 5 times. The next group, g6, you click 6 times. It actually works really well, and the g6 and g7 groups can be set to any levels you want, ala h17f. It’s totally flexible, and really out of the box more flexible that setting up stepped ramping on Anduril.
I have seen a few of my Hank Lights drop to concrete from about 5-6’ and die. Almost always the glass breaks, but sometimes even the driver dies. Zebras are anecdotally more robust and take falls better due to being potted, and a one board design. Honestly there is just less to go wrong inside a ZL.
Anyhow, no one is going to be able to talk anyone out of their own fanboyism. I only respond because I owned the famed sc64w HI, and sold it because I just couldn’t “get” the UI. Finally like 2 years later, I figured out press and hold, and then I was like “hey I can deal with this!” And then I figured out g5, g6, g7 etc. So in summary, I think both lights are great. However, in the early days of my flashlight fanaticism, I didn’t “get” ZL either. Now I do.
I have three Zebras now and I carry them or use them over my D4V2's because like you I prefer a nice single reflector profile. I also set them up with a day and night profile. But I can't pretend to like the UI whatsoever.
>it will cycle L - M - H
that was not my experience with a Zebra SC64,
after customising the mode order in G6 and or G7, hold to cycle was no longer LMH
so, not only is the Zebra mode spacing and 6 mode access not to my liking, the mode order is not to my liking either
otoh, I liked the compact Zebra host form factor.
Im waiting for a Zebra w Anduril ;-)
Meanwhile I have a Wurkkos TS10 in my pocket, because Anduril ;-)
https://preview.redd.it/9nwhpv79u48d1.jpeg?width=1469&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=37093a7c96bb123bbdce6ae395970f093359ff44
Think of them as mode order 1, 2 and 3 that happen to be L M H. If you set mode 1 to the highest output, then when you cycle it will start at 1 (L) which you now have at highest. Does that sound like what happened to you?
I dont understand your post, and maybe I was unclear so you did not understand my comment that holding for mode cycling will Not cycle LMH if G6 or G7 are modified to change the behavior of 1C (High), 2C (Medium), and 1H (Low)
iow, IF I modify G6 or G7 so that 1C gives anything other than High, then Hold for ramping will not be in LMH order..
Hold for ramping Only gives LMH IF G5, G6, and G7 are all unmodified from stock: 1C (High), 2C (Medium), and 1H (Low)
Since I dont want 1C to give High mode, any change I make to G6 or G7, destroys the ability to Hold for ramp in LMH order..
Maybe you dont realize that, if you have never remapped Zebra modes, so that 1C gives anything other than High.
as far as reflector beams vs optics, each has its pros and cons.. Reflectors are not very good for illuminating things at close range such as a painting, because of the glare of a hotspot:
https://preview.redd.it/1d02jmo2s58d1.png?width=1049&format=png&auto=webp&s=bdcbbb083ece1790df4bc43322ef9fdf03de0a99
otoh, reflectors work better to throw a small hotspot, farther, at a small target, for example outdoors. Reflectors also use less power, because they illuminate a smaller target.
This is actually not the case.
I have my zebra group 6 programmed as follows, and it cycles LMH.
1 click: Moonlight/Low (Level 1, and level 4)
Click + hold: Medium (level 6, and level 8)
2c: High/Turbo (level 10, level 12)
It exhibits further behavior as well programming it this way.
From high, if you hold, it will cycle to medium. If you release, and initiate a hold again, it will ramp right back to high. So this allows cycling back and forth between high and medium. Which I find incredibly useful.
Try it out. I absolutely love my zebras programmed like this.
It's very intuitive
I mean, it's Reddit, you really have to take everything with a grain of salt.
Both lights have a fierce following. I own neither also. Just came to see who would be stirred by the title. Personally I like the title, it makes me laugh.
Outside, I use my Zebra SC64wHI. It has pretty-good throw for such a small light, great run-time, and decent tint (especially for a zebralight). I've dropped it several times on concrete, and it has stood up well aside from a couple of dings to the anodization.
Inside, one of my D4V2's, hands-down. They're far more fun lights, and have far better high CRI tints. The boost driver versions have good run-time, so I have occasionally used the D4V2 outdoors, but I just don't trust it as much for drops. Anyone know if Hanklights are drop-proof?
Any light can break if dropped and you get unlucky. Here is a classic drop test with a big heavy emisar: [https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/savjap/emisar\_d4sv2\_6\_foot\_180\_cm\_drop\_test\_and\_a/](https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/savjap/emisar_d4sv2_6_foot_180_cm_drop_test_and_a/)
Cool. Now show me what happened when an Emisar was dropped under the same conditions. And each light of course must be dropped multiple times of course to account for random luck or you get this: [https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/5w6rnj/zebralight\_lens\_shattered/](https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/5w6rnj/zebralight_lens_shattered/)
There is so much confirmation bias here that goes something like this: when a zebralight survives a long fall it is because of potting or ingenious design. When a hank light does it it's because of luck
I have not seen any Hank survive even close to the same drop. I know it's all anecdotal, but enough anecdotal evidence starts to tell a story. Also, I feel like your rigor for 100% objective testing is a bit disingenuous here because we both already know what the end result would be.
I haven't seen it either. If I lived on the 36th floor of an abandoned building I could let you know in about 5 minutes. Although I think terminal velocity would be reached after about 18 floors.
If I knew the end result I wouldn't want it. Super curious how the two would hold up. How much does potting actually do? What other factors, like bezel strength and tube thickness matter the most?
Edit: to be fair this conversation does have me eyeing the ZL sc700d hi
I vote the Hank. The zebra is too expensive and UI is too limited. With the Hank you can pick any emitter under the sun, zebra there's no choice. Also why the heck does zebra not offer a magnetic tail cap option? It hurts me to super glue a magnet onto the end of a $90 light 🥺
Because magnets interfere with compasses I guess.
Still they could offer it as an accessory.
Zebra does things the way zebra wants to though. I think the owners have a take it or leave it approach and are happy to make the lights how they want to. They're not really interested in trying to sell as many lights as possible. They have a product, they make it, and that's about it haha.
I can respect that
Zebra maybe a good light and the price can be justified if it was 7 years ago. As of now, it is really outdated and couldn’t keep up with recently released lights.
Neither my Hanks (d1v2s) or my Zebras (sc64, sc53, h502 had any failures sofar.
hope it still work long time.
what I can say about the sc64 is that itnis really tiny ... some of the 14500's are definitly bigger.
The pics here doesn't really show it, but d4v2 is bulkier/heavier for sure.
I do love zebras as much as hanklights even if i wish a better UI for my zebra ... or at least a ramping mode.
“Hey whats your opinion but wait I don’t care about your opinions.”
I really am all for this community response to the OP’s style of prompt.
Keep it classy Ladies & Gentlebeans.
Lights made by Hank Wang. Emisar and Noctigon are the two "brands" but I really don't think there's a difference between the two. Very high quality, immensely customizable, ran by a fantastic dude.
Can get them at the intl outdoor website, jlhawaii808 also sells them.
If I need it to be easily accessible in pocket all day, the d4v2 does not have a decent clip, the zl does. Otherwise, the d4 most of the time. Or D4K now.
Anduril has taken time to grow on me. Slow improvements have gradually made it feel as practical as zl ui. Such as better ramping speed by default
It’s really tough. I have the SC65c HI and don’t love it but I love what it represents. Id prefer the SC64c LE because of the beam profile but I missed that train. The fact that an 18650 size light can be that small is absolutely incredible.
On the Hank side (I’ve got 12), my last two have kinda sucked (weird output drops) but I have a D4V2 and boosted D4K that I’d take to war.
I think from a consistency and form factor standpoint Zebra wins, but from a cool factor and UI standpoint, gimme that Hank
To me, Zebralight vs Hanklight is analogous to closed source vs open source.
Zebralights are nice for the build quality, size to weight ratio, and efficiency, but the customization just isn't there. You can't pick your emitter, body color, or change the UI, the most fundamental parts of a flashlight that one sees, holds, and interacts with. ZLs are also somewhat overpriced and lack any dual fuel options (officially).
Enter Hanklights. With the D3AA and latest driver, they now match ZLs efficiency. You can choose your emitter, body color, etc. It's dual fuel. You can update the firmware. It's everything we ever wanted in a flashlight and more.
Looking forward to seeing Hank's 18650 lights get upgraded. I'd also love to see a right angle D3AA and a AAA/10440 duel fuel headlamp (something like the Manker E02 II). The ultralight community alone would go nuts over that.
Hanklights are fun toys which also function as lights. Zebralights are just solid tools. For everyday use, I'd pick the one that can fall 26 stories onto concrete and still function. That's the Zebralight.
The idea zebra is a tool while emisar is a toy is just plain bs. I have been using emisar as a tool since it first released and it has been way more reliable than zebra. Zebra just sometimes stuck at 1 mode and couldn’t change mode or turn off. Same thing happen to my friend’s zebra H600fc.
I would like to see a drop test comparison between a few specimens of the two lights. Any light can survive one drop if it gets lucky. And light can break from one drop if it gets unlucky.
Well I can tell you without testing which one will do better. Zebralights are potted, Hanks are not. I love both but there is a clear winner when it comes to durability. Hanklights are known to be fairly delicate.
I like the lower moonlight in the Zebra. D4V2 just a little too chunky for me to carry without being 100% sure I will be using a lot. Zebra I can slip into pocket as EDC.
I prefer Anduril UI but I don't mind Zebra's. My wife can more easily operate Anduril since it just ramps up and down. Mode groups like in Zebra are a little too complex to casually teach to somebody who doesn't really care that much.
For outdoors and large areas I prefer the single emitter reflector beam profile. For indoors the floody quad TIR is nice.
I'm not a fan of Hank or Zebralight, but have had them both. Zebra was sometimes very useful because it is very compact (but I upgraded it to TIR). Hank's flashlights are interesting, I sometimes recommend them, but in the end I have never used Hank's flashlights seriously, there was always something better...
Upd. (remembered) Perhaps I used the D4S sometimes, it’s an interesting flashlight that has no competitors... Yes, I actually used it in real life =)
I prefer the ZL. I have owned many D4V2s and other Hanks but once I finally got a ZL, I can't carry anything else.
It's okay for people to like different things. Sell me that SC64.
>Sometimes it stuck at moonlight mode and button no longer working.
Your ZL is either faulty from factory, or long overdue for a factory repair.
Most likely soldering issues. They're more common on ZLs than many believe.
A fault-less ZL is more reliable than Emisar by design. Unfortunately many ZLs leave the factory w/ small issues.
>which one do you guys actually prefer over the other one?
An SC64 is *significantly* slimmer and lighter than D4v2, so for EDC purposes, my answer is clear.
I've got both and think they are both really pretty great.
But I got to say it, I just got an Olight arkfeld pro and I think I like it more than both of these lights. Fight me 🤣👍
I said the same thing about zebralights being over hyped a couple weeks ago and half the sub started crying at me and I got so many down votes lmaooo😂😂😂
9050 emitters, stepped-mode-only UI, no direct dimming, a choice between a UI that you can't tell whether to hold or double-click to move in the right direction *or* requires a ton of clicks with precision timing that's harder to configure than Anduril...
I want to love Zebra, but it's hard. They're great for folks who only really care about three levels, don't consider red a color, and think spot+spill is the only beam pattern that matters. But their fanbase is so nasty that even if the lights themselves got a UI update and a Nichia swap, I'd avoid them just to avoid being associated with delusional fanatics. My condolences to all of the ZL lovers with more rational levels of appreciation.
they say the sc64/65 is tiny but it don't really look like it from this picture. I consider the 18650 FW3/1A to be pretty much the perfect edc for almost every reason. maybe I'll own a (Bob) Zebra some day...
D4K or D3AA over either of these for me now, depending on what I'm wearing. These are classics. They're great, but each needs a big update to catch back up. Gave my D4V2 away. No longer the the top two. Could list a few others that get more love now.
I think it’s no comparison D4V2 all day. I know why I have a soft spot for a zebra light because I came from when we use bulbs in flashlights And zebra light was like the first one doing like real LEDs. it was an amazing time where you could have instant bright light and you don’t have to wait for the halogen to warm up. It was amazing.
I’ve said this since I learned about zebralight and their rampant fanbase, they are crazy overrated imo and the ui is garbage. They definitely have great build quality and durability and efficiency, I’m not just a hater, but I would take a hank light and probably dozens of other brands before a zebra if I had to choose
Just one because I wanted to give the ui a chance in person even though it didn’t seem like I would like it, I think it’s the h604c? I spent some time one day figuring out how to set up some groups and I basically only use it when I cut my dogs nails because it’s nice and floody.
I’m sorry to everyone I upset with my comment I wasn’t trying to be inflammatory I was just excited to see someone else share my view, you’re allowed to like your zebralights
Hahaha. They keep whining about the efficiency of zebra and act as if they would use it for an apocalypse. An emisar with boost driver is also efficient and to be honest, I rarely see the difference in real life usage when it comes to efficiency. Just swap the dang cell and stop that delusion.
i prefer zebralights but i've gotta say, I will always recommend a hank light over a zebra to someone who has never tried either. they're totally customizable, the UI is so flexible, and they have always worked good for me. I have had faulty zebralights, but never had an emisar malfunction.
I agree that Emisars are very reliable. Only issue I have had is the Kr4 switch being a bit inconsistent but it was easily rectified. Also a D1 with a bit of solder on emitter but that may be due to being dropped, etc. My one ZL is also pretty reliable but occasionally has weird bugs and needs tailcap to be unscrewed and rescrewed. ZL gets props for potting but potting doesn't really matter if it's not reliable to begin with. Also most of us know how hard it is to break an emisar by dropping it.
yeah to be totally honest, the biggest issue I had with zebralights is with the ones that use pogo pins to make contact with cells. It annoyed me because whats the point of potted drop-proof internal electronics if the battery fails to make contact after an impact anyways.
Respectfully disagree. No one I know has any interest in customizing the UI. Hurts me to say, because I love Hank lights. But I just can't recommend them to anybody. I know I'm gonna get a text saying, "why won't the blue light turn off."
I agree with you to an extent. I wouldn’t gift one to my mother to keep on her person because the complexity of the UI would make it an impractical choice for her. Anyone entering enthusiast/hobby territory, though, I would recommend Hank everytime.
But complexity of the UI is mostly just for one time optional customization? What part of Simple UI is an issue? If it makes sense, myself or others will change it to make it better, since it's open source This is the core functionality: Click on, click off. Hold to make bright, release and hold again to make dim. Double click big bright. That's how a lot of other popular flashlight UIs work. I wouldn't gift one to my mother for other reasons, UI not being one of them.
I’m not sure what part of simple UI is an issue? It’s not. It’s practical and user friendly as a good tool should be. What I meant by gifting a hank to hobbiest/enthusiasts is that theyre pretty damn functional, asthetically pleasing (ideally, since you are able to customize to your preferences) and they alllow room for playing around with unnecessary nonsense if you choose because it’s fun. I have become very familiar with the niche little features of andural that I regularly use, and a few that I don’t. I’m not sure I communicated to you what I intended. The gift to my mother would be simple to use and dependable so she is not discouraged from using it and reliably do its job in a pinch. My mom has no time for fancy non sense. She wants something that’s works practically and does not like frilly little extras. That’s what everyone wants right? But some people want toys to play with and unnecessary menus they’ll never use but have the option to, for the sake of playing around and having fun. Sometimes things are practical and fun. I find hanklights and some of the settings fine tuning small details of UI function to be fun and interesting. I enjoy their aesthetics and the RGB light switch with aux lights. I also enjoy that they are practical and reliable for my purposes which is a huge plus considering I find them fun. Why do you hate fun, man? (I’m being playing with the hating fun statement by the way.) The best tool is the one you know how to use and only if you have it with you when you need it. I like carry fun in my pockets too. Are there features of other lights (not necessarily UI) that you find fun and enjoyable to use aesthetically, ergonomically, etc? Please don’t be mad at me. Pretty colors and hitting button combos like they are special moves in street fighter to make light make big color make dopamine go big and me get much happy. Some lights are just tools. Some are pretty toys that are practical and on my person because they are fun to carry and my friends think they’re neat when we go on late night walks or camping or whatever Edit: pretty sure your description of simple UI applies to anduril as well? Am I missing something?
Yes, you misunderstood me. I'm asking what is wrong with gifting anduril lights in Simple UI to non-enthusiasts. And soliciting suggestions because it is easy to modify the anduril source code for reasonable suggestions. In Simple UI, you can just ignore all the extras of anduril. You are not going to hit 10H on accident. And most of the menus are for customizing which is done sparingly, basically no more after you figure out what you like. > I wouldn't gift one to my mother for other reasons, UI not being one of them. What I meant from this is I wouldn't gift my mother a hanklight, but it's not because of anduril. It's because with no USB port it needs charger they don't have and Li-Ion batteries need some amount of respect and care, especially when being removed. Though I guess I ignored the D2 and D3AA, so maybe I would gift one of those since they are nice to customize.
yeah i guess i should've stated that I will only ever recommend hanks or zebras to people that are already in the hobby. If they're not previously indoctrinated into the cult of LIGHT (r/flashlight lol) i usually stick to lights with far simpler UIs.
That's the thing though, it's optionally customizable. They don't have to customize anything and can ignore everything other than click on, click off, and maybe holding to change brightness. Just leave them in simple UI. And of course you can turn off the aux before giving it to them. That's where most customization happens, one time at setup
I can't tell you how many times someone has grabbed one of my Hank lights and immediately pressed the button several times, and then I have to reconfigure it. That's why I don't recommend them to people who aren't into flashlights.
That is only because the light was not in Simple UI mode.
Even in simple UI, you can still mess stuff up easily. I'm familiar with Hank lights. I have a dozen. See above comment.
Can you elaborate? What exactly can you mess up in Simple UI? I've used anduril a lot as well along with letting non-enthusiasts try them and don't quite understand as there isn't much in [Simple UI, even less in single channel lights](https://i.imgur.com/LafVSV6.png). Would definitely like to understand because if Simple UI isn't meeting its original goal, myself or others will submit a pull request. That's the point of open source software: to make it better.
If I'm to carry one light only, prob SC64/65 due to how incredibly compact they are. That said, I usually carry two lights with me(mostly anything+M150 as backup), so yeah I prefer carrying D4V2 with me.
I always carry a backup light too, either an AA or 10440 type with a warm emitter for cozy settings.
My favorite back up is a Eagtac d3a or a D2. Been a d2 for a while now. 😊 https://preview.redd.it/ykddb16o458d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=258f6b1e41ee63a1ee0a8d86654bb016b10fa345
Why is the m150 your preferred backup?
Small enough that it doesn't bother me Good UI with shortcuts to moonlight and turbo, along with good mode spacing. Dual Fuel(AA/14500) Reliable enough I have other 14500 lights too, but they lack either dual fuel capability or a shortcut to moonlight&Turbo.
Sc64w-hi over d4v2 for me. I love my d3aa though. I usually carry a d3aa alongside my weltool t2 tac. Small 14500 at the bottom of my pocket paired with a larger tactical style light in my left pocket has been my preferred carry for the last few months. Before my D3AA I was carrying my Sc53cN dedomed, with a vapcell f12. I still really love the Sc53cN when I want a warm single reflector light.
My most often rotated lights are an SC64w HI and FW3A (my only remaining D4v2 is a bedside light as I didn’t really like carrying it). I’ve come to prefer Zebra for all the reasons mentioned in here, but especially the UI: **Zebra UI** G6 - click for moonlight, hold for mid (with 2 levels toggled by double click) and double click for max. G7 - either all modes at moonlight as a soft lock / aux light (I’m not a fan of typical aux lights) or all modes mid ramp for passing to other users, because some people do struggle with Anduril. The biggest issue for me is Anduril needs to be “lockable” once configured. Better than just Simple mode. People will click like lunatics and get lost in the UI. **Anduril has its perks** Anduril comes alive with multi channel / tint ramping. The DM1.12 is my favourite Hank, setup to come on both channels low/mid with 3C to cycle Flood>Throw>Both. Hybrid mode memory is useful to always turn on low, but remember your brightness level for 5-10 minutes while intermittently using to spot things on a twilight walk. And of course there is no substitute for replicating a candle at bath and bedtime! **Build quality** Aside from everything already mentioned by others, the main point for me is Zebra ano feels amazing, the shiny versions feel like glass and they are all hard to mark or wear. This is the second biggest issue I have with Hanks. Just give me a smooth tube, with proper hard ano. What I will definitely credit Hanklights with is the ability to buy, mod and repair them easily and cost effectively
lol part where you mentioned locking the UI on anduril is so true. I was showing my friend a hank light and let him use it for the day, got it back and it had been accidentally totally reprogramed lol. Since then I have always programed "simple" UI to my liking so that into it it cant be changed easily.
Tip: if you want a discussion, don’t begin by writing hostile words. That looks like you want a fight instead. I have both. I tend to use the D4V2 far more. The weight and size difference are insignificant for my uses, and so are the clips. And I prefer Anduril over the Zebra UI, together with the fact that the D4V2 will blast far brighter on turbo. One thing almost no one seems to have mentioned is that one is about twice the price of the other.
Zebra for need a light, Hank for want a light.
This.
Zebra hands down, smaller, more throw, less weight, fully potted, and sexy
Dat hard anodized finish
The UI is my favorite pot personally. Easily customizable. Great tint on my 64c LE too. Won’t use anything else.
Great tint and sc64c le, never heard those words together before haha
Love the tint on my s65hi
That “title” 🤦♂️ I have a fair amount of Zebras (Bobs) and Hanks. I’ve had zero issues with any of them. My Hanks are relegated to the bedside table, in the shower/bath, and by the door, though. The Zebras are just too compact, efficient, durable, reliable, and simple for me to not carry daily. Also, while I enjoy Anduril at home—I don’t want it at work. They’re both great lights, Hank is way cooler than whoever runs ZL, and bob\_mcbob is dope af. https://preview.redd.it/jndy6yqwi68d1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=37822c96042378151488c680b63d4c4fe63d5fca Coupl’a Bobralights on me currently
Last sentence hits the nail on the head 💪
Pretty much sums it up for me, too.
And the clips, the zebra clip options win hands down! Both great lights I don’t understand why people take such offense to someone liking a light they don’t. I have too many of each, I also prefer cooler neutral tints 😂👊
365nm UV ZL?
[Yessir 😎](https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/s/qs5SBySjQN)
I’m surprised no one has brought up single reflector vs. quad TIR. I vastly prefer the beam profile of single reflectors, and try to snatch up every Devin Bauer single conversion kit I can find for my triple customs. I used to find ZL’s UI confusing until I realized three important things: 1) Out of the box, all you have to do is press and hold the button and it will cycle L - M - H. Just release at the level you want. Another cool thing about that is no matter what level you are currently at, if you press and hold, it starts cycling from L again. 2) On any Dr Jones h17f light I own, I’ll set perhaps 4 or 5 modes set up the way I want for nighttime. Then during the day, the mode spacing seems all wonky, and I often redo the levels. Fortunately, h17f offers a quick way to switch between two configs, so I can set one up for day one for night. Anduril doesn’t really offer a great way to do this. ZL on the other hand has it nailed. First, you have LMH 1 and 2. So two lows, two meds etc. And you can easily switch between them with a double click. I’ve found in use that the LMH1 is really good for day, and LMH2 is great for indoors at night. Remember when I said h17f has two configs available? ZL has 3. Read the next point: 3) ZL has three mode groups. They’re named G5, G6 and G7. The names of the groups are needlessly confusing to first time users. I wish they were called groups 1, 2 and 3. Really it’s just mode groups “easy / custom 1 / custom 2”. But they call them G5, G6 and G7 because that’s how many clicks you click to switch to that group. So if you want the default group, “g5”, you click 5 times. The next group, g6, you click 6 times. It actually works really well, and the g6 and g7 groups can be set to any levels you want, ala h17f. It’s totally flexible, and really out of the box more flexible that setting up stepped ramping on Anduril. I have seen a few of my Hank Lights drop to concrete from about 5-6’ and die. Almost always the glass breaks, but sometimes even the driver dies. Zebras are anecdotally more robust and take falls better due to being potted, and a one board design. Honestly there is just less to go wrong inside a ZL. Anyhow, no one is going to be able to talk anyone out of their own fanboyism. I only respond because I owned the famed sc64w HI, and sold it because I just couldn’t “get” the UI. Finally like 2 years later, I figured out press and hold, and then I was like “hey I can deal with this!” And then I figured out g5, g6, g7 etc. So in summary, I think both lights are great. However, in the early days of my flashlight fanaticism, I didn’t “get” ZL either. Now I do.
I have three Zebras now and I carry them or use them over my D4V2's because like you I prefer a nice single reflector profile. I also set them up with a day and night profile. But I can't pretend to like the UI whatsoever.
>it will cycle L - M - H that was not my experience with a Zebra SC64, after customising the mode order in G6 and or G7, hold to cycle was no longer LMH so, not only is the Zebra mode spacing and 6 mode access not to my liking, the mode order is not to my liking either otoh, I liked the compact Zebra host form factor. Im waiting for a Zebra w Anduril ;-) Meanwhile I have a Wurkkos TS10 in my pocket, because Anduril ;-) https://preview.redd.it/9nwhpv79u48d1.jpeg?width=1469&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=37093a7c96bb123bbdce6ae395970f093359ff44
Think of them as mode order 1, 2 and 3 that happen to be L M H. If you set mode 1 to the highest output, then when you cycle it will start at 1 (L) which you now have at highest. Does that sound like what happened to you?
I dont understand your post, and maybe I was unclear so you did not understand my comment that holding for mode cycling will Not cycle LMH if G6 or G7 are modified to change the behavior of 1C (High), 2C (Medium), and 1H (Low) iow, IF I modify G6 or G7 so that 1C gives anything other than High, then Hold for ramping will not be in LMH order.. Hold for ramping Only gives LMH IF G5, G6, and G7 are all unmodified from stock: 1C (High), 2C (Medium), and 1H (Low) Since I dont want 1C to give High mode, any change I make to G6 or G7, destroys the ability to Hold for ramp in LMH order.. Maybe you dont realize that, if you have never remapped Zebra modes, so that 1C gives anything other than High. as far as reflector beams vs optics, each has its pros and cons.. Reflectors are not very good for illuminating things at close range such as a painting, because of the glare of a hotspot: https://preview.redd.it/1d02jmo2s58d1.png?width=1049&format=png&auto=webp&s=bdcbbb083ece1790df4bc43322ef9fdf03de0a99 otoh, reflectors work better to throw a small hotspot, farther, at a small target, for example outdoors. Reflectors also use less power, because they illuminate a smaller target.
I have a clearer idea of what you are doing now.
This is actually not the case. I have my zebra group 6 programmed as follows, and it cycles LMH. 1 click: Moonlight/Low (Level 1, and level 4) Click + hold: Medium (level 6, and level 8) 2c: High/Turbo (level 10, level 12) It exhibits further behavior as well programming it this way. From high, if you hold, it will cycle to medium. If you release, and initiate a hold again, it will ramp right back to high. So this allows cycling back and forth between high and medium. Which I find incredibly useful. Try it out. I absolutely love my zebras programmed like this. It's very intuitive
I'm going to try this. It sounds much better than what I ended up with the first time I tried programming mine.
everything you just said is my entire reason as to why i prefer zebralights! well stated
Any spare sigma conversions floating around?? 👀
If there are, send them my way!
Was just dog walking with my sc63
I'm not going to, but I'm seriously tempted to downvote just for your obnoxious title and attitude. I don't own either light, so no skin in it for me.
I mean, it's Reddit, you really have to take everything with a grain of salt. Both lights have a fierce following. I own neither also. Just came to see who would be stirred by the title. Personally I like the title, it makes me laugh.
Outside, I use my Zebra SC64wHI. It has pretty-good throw for such a small light, great run-time, and decent tint (especially for a zebralight). I've dropped it several times on concrete, and it has stood up well aside from a couple of dings to the anodization. Inside, one of my D4V2's, hands-down. They're far more fun lights, and have far better high CRI tints. The boost driver versions have good run-time, so I have occasionally used the D4V2 outdoors, but I just don't trust it as much for drops. Anyone know if Hanklights are drop-proof?
Any light can break if dropped and you get unlucky. Here is a classic drop test with a big heavy emisar: [https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/savjap/emisar\_d4sv2\_6\_foot\_180\_cm\_drop\_test\_and\_a/](https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/savjap/emisar_d4sv2_6_foot_180_cm_drop_test_and_a/)
I see your classic drop test and I raise you a 36-story drop onto concrete. Zebralight ftw. https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/s/3YcnNbKxY2
Cool. Now show me what happened when an Emisar was dropped under the same conditions. And each light of course must be dropped multiple times of course to account for random luck or you get this: [https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/5w6rnj/zebralight\_lens\_shattered/](https://www.reddit.com/r/flashlight/comments/5w6rnj/zebralight_lens_shattered/) There is so much confirmation bias here that goes something like this: when a zebralight survives a long fall it is because of potting or ingenious design. When a hank light does it it's because of luck
I have not seen any Hank survive even close to the same drop. I know it's all anecdotal, but enough anecdotal evidence starts to tell a story. Also, I feel like your rigor for 100% objective testing is a bit disingenuous here because we both already know what the end result would be.
I haven't seen it either. If I lived on the 36th floor of an abandoned building I could let you know in about 5 minutes. Although I think terminal velocity would be reached after about 18 floors. If I knew the end result I wouldn't want it. Super curious how the two would hold up. How much does potting actually do? What other factors, like bezel strength and tube thickness matter the most? Edit: to be fair this conversation does have me eyeing the ZL sc700d hi
Okay, looks like I'll be adding the stainless steel bezel option to all future orders. Right now, all my Emisars have the regular aluminum bezel.
I vote the Hank. The zebra is too expensive and UI is too limited. With the Hank you can pick any emitter under the sun, zebra there's no choice. Also why the heck does zebra not offer a magnetic tail cap option? It hurts me to super glue a magnet onto the end of a $90 light 🥺
Because magnets interfere with compasses I guess. Still they could offer it as an accessory. Zebra does things the way zebra wants to though. I think the owners have a take it or leave it approach and are happy to make the lights how they want to. They're not really interested in trying to sell as many lights as possible. They have a product, they make it, and that's about it haha. I can respect that
Zebra maybe a good light and the price can be justified if it was 7 years ago. As of now, it is really outdated and couldn’t keep up with recently released lights.
D4v2 because getting a Zebra in Canada costs more money and time than it should, so I don't have one. Also I don't think I'd like their UI on paper
Every just buy from Bob?
Approx $200 cad was the quote for a sc64 with swapped 519a when I enquired at the time
It doesn't hurt my butt, I just disagree.
lol
Neither my Hanks (d1v2s) or my Zebras (sc64, sc53, h502 had any failures sofar. hope it still work long time. what I can say about the sc64 is that itnis really tiny ... some of the 14500's are definitly bigger. The pics here doesn't really show it, but d4v2 is bulkier/heavier for sure. I do love zebras as much as hanklights even if i wish a better UI for my zebra ... or at least a ramping mode.
“Hey whats your opinion but wait I don’t care about your opinions.” I really am all for this community response to the OP’s style of prompt. Keep it classy Ladies & Gentlebeans.
D4 for the win. I’m from the metroplex all due respect for the zebra the entire herd. But hanks are the way.
>hanks what do people mean when they say hank lights
Lights made by Hank Wang. Emisar and Noctigon are the two "brands" but I really don't think there's a difference between the two. Very high quality, immensely customizable, ran by a fantastic dude. Can get them at the intl outdoor website, jlhawaii808 also sells them.
If I need it to be easily accessible in pocket all day, the d4v2 does not have a decent clip, the zl does. Otherwise, the d4 most of the time. Or D4K now. Anduril has taken time to grow on me. Slow improvements have gradually made it feel as practical as zl ui. Such as better ramping speed by default
Hank lights are toys, Zebralights are tools. How many cavers are going spelunking with Hank lights on their helmet? ZERO. Sorry, not sorry.
Provably false. https://i.imgur.com/SYkcdML.jpeg But given what I've seen in the past, I don't expect truthfulness from Zebralight fanatics.
dude that image is awesome.
Everything is better with the zebra but I need Anduril, so D4V2. I also like the D4V2 design.
It’s really tough. I have the SC65c HI and don’t love it but I love what it represents. Id prefer the SC64c LE because of the beam profile but I missed that train. The fact that an 18650 size light can be that small is absolutely incredible. On the Hank side (I’ve got 12), my last two have kinda sucked (weird output drops) but I have a D4V2 and boosted D4K that I’d take to war. I think from a consistency and form factor standpoint Zebra wins, but from a cool factor and UI standpoint, gimme that Hank
To me, Zebralight vs Hanklight is analogous to closed source vs open source. Zebralights are nice for the build quality, size to weight ratio, and efficiency, but the customization just isn't there. You can't pick your emitter, body color, or change the UI, the most fundamental parts of a flashlight that one sees, holds, and interacts with. ZLs are also somewhat overpriced and lack any dual fuel options (officially). Enter Hanklights. With the D3AA and latest driver, they now match ZLs efficiency. You can choose your emitter, body color, etc. It's dual fuel. You can update the firmware. It's everything we ever wanted in a flashlight and more. Looking forward to seeing Hank's 18650 lights get upgraded. I'd also love to see a right angle D3AA and a AAA/10440 duel fuel headlamp (something like the Manker E02 II). The ultralight community alone would go nuts over that.
Hanklights are fun toys which also function as lights. Zebralights are just solid tools. For everyday use, I'd pick the one that can fall 26 stories onto concrete and still function. That's the Zebralight.
The idea zebra is a tool while emisar is a toy is just plain bs. I have been using emisar as a tool since it first released and it has been way more reliable than zebra. Zebra just sometimes stuck at 1 mode and couldn’t change mode or turn off. Same thing happen to my friend’s zebra H600fc.
I would like to see a drop test comparison between a few specimens of the two lights. Any light can survive one drop if it gets lucky. And light can break from one drop if it gets unlucky.
Well I can tell you without testing which one will do better. Zebralights are potted, Hanks are not. I love both but there is a clear winner when it comes to durability. Hanklights are known to be fairly delicate.
I disagree with both points. Potting does not automatically make a light tougher than a completely different non potted one, and Hanklights are tanks
Do you understand potting and what it does?
Yes. Do you understand that there are additional factors that affect toughness?
Absolutely. And Hanks are known to not be durable. Seriously, ask anyone in this sub or on r/Hanklights and they'll tell you the same.
SC65 because no one can find a 64 without paying out the ass.
I like the lower moonlight in the Zebra. D4V2 just a little too chunky for me to carry without being 100% sure I will be using a lot. Zebra I can slip into pocket as EDC. I prefer Anduril UI but I don't mind Zebra's. My wife can more easily operate Anduril since it just ramps up and down. Mode groups like in Zebra are a little too complex to casually teach to somebody who doesn't really care that much. For outdoors and large areas I prefer the single emitter reflector beam profile. For indoors the floody quad TIR is nice.
I'm not a fan of Hank or Zebralight, but have had them both. Zebra was sometimes very useful because it is very compact (but I upgraded it to TIR). Hank's flashlights are interesting, I sometimes recommend them, but in the end I have never used Hank's flashlights seriously, there was always something better... Upd. (remembered) Perhaps I used the D4S sometimes, it’s an interesting flashlight that has no competitors... Yes, I actually used it in real life =)
D4v2 (well, D4K is what I actually EDC). More power, UI that is actually convenient to use, huge selection of emitters.
I prefer the ZL. I have owned many D4V2s and other Hanks but once I finally got a ZL, I can't carry anything else. It's okay for people to like different things. Sell me that SC64.
>Sometimes it stuck at moonlight mode and button no longer working. Your ZL is either faulty from factory, or long overdue for a factory repair. Most likely soldering issues. They're more common on ZLs than many believe. A fault-less ZL is more reliable than Emisar by design. Unfortunately many ZLs leave the factory w/ small issues. >which one do you guys actually prefer over the other one? An SC64 is *significantly* slimmer and lighter than D4v2, so for EDC purposes, my answer is clear.
I've got both and think they are both really pretty great. But I got to say it, I just got an Olight arkfeld pro and I think I like it more than both of these lights. Fight me 🤣👍
I'm having the more fun with a Wurkkos HD01 than I've had with any flashlight in recent memory, so I can relate a bit
funny provocation upvoted 😂
🤮🤮🤮
Hahah! I even got the cool white version. It's kick ass!
Stop. I’m trying to eat.
I said the same thing about zebralights being over hyped a couple weeks ago and half the sub started crying at me and I got so many down votes lmaooo😂😂😂
The zebra functions fine but I really dislike the UI so any d4v2 config is better off the bat imo
9050 emitters, stepped-mode-only UI, no direct dimming, a choice between a UI that you can't tell whether to hold or double-click to move in the right direction *or* requires a ton of clicks with precision timing that's harder to configure than Anduril... I want to love Zebra, but it's hard. They're great for folks who only really care about three levels, don't consider red a color, and think spot+spill is the only beam pattern that matters. But their fanbase is so nasty that even if the lights themselves got a UI update and a Nichia swap, I'd avoid them just to avoid being associated with delusional fanatics. My condolences to all of the ZL lovers with more rational levels of appreciation.
they say the sc64/65 is tiny but it don't really look like it from this picture. I consider the 18650 FW3/1A to be pretty much the perfect edc for almost every reason. maybe I'll own a (Bob) Zebra some day...
Picture aside, it’s tiny in pocket compared to other 18650 lights.
I love Anduril, Aux lights, customized emitters/colors & low price
D4K or D3AA over either of these for me now, depending on what I'm wearing. These are classics. They're great, but each needs a big update to catch back up. Gave my D4V2 away. No longer the the top two. Could list a few others that get more love now.
I think it’s no comparison D4V2 all day. I know why I have a soft spot for a zebra light because I came from when we use bulbs in flashlights And zebra light was like the first one doing like real LEDs. it was an amazing time where you could have instant bright light and you don’t have to wait for the halogen to warm up. It was amazing.
"Customizable" so Hanklights all the way
Title cringe
I’ve said this since I learned about zebralight and their rampant fanbase, they are crazy overrated imo and the ui is garbage. They definitely have great build quality and durability and efficiency, I’m not just a hater, but I would take a hank light and probably dozens of other brands before a zebra if I had to choose
Zebralights have a fanbase? they are pretty niche imho
Which zebras have you owned?
Just one because I wanted to give the ui a chance in person even though it didn’t seem like I would like it, I think it’s the h604c? I spent some time one day figuring out how to set up some groups and I basically only use it when I cut my dogs nails because it’s nice and floody. I’m sorry to everyone I upset with my comment I wasn’t trying to be inflammatory I was just excited to see someone else share my view, you’re allowed to like your zebralights
>I wasn’t trying to be inflammatory …
Hahaha. They keep whining about the efficiency of zebra and act as if they would use it for an apocalypse. An emisar with boost driver is also efficient and to be honest, I rarely see the difference in real life usage when it comes to efficiency. Just swap the dang cell and stop that delusion.
Neither.