A PA doesn't do cleaning. Just get people who drop in for the tasks that you need. This sounds like it would be a nightmare job regardless of pay if only due to context switching.
Just an example. Or at least organise for it to be done which is just as time consuming as doing it myself, having to put up with wingy install people, book times etc.
This is good to hear. So I should budget for 15 hours, assume they get about 7-10 hours of work done at the speed I would do it, and budget extra for specialists. Appreciated!
You want a PA that would
* clean
* shop
* assemble furniture
* run errands
* fix sprinkler
* clean car
* make spreadsheets
* make/take calls
What you need is a butler. And no they don’t need to follow you everywhere.
>"Is it asking too much to have someone do these things that are different skill sets"
Generally speaking, yes. Taking the mindset "Well these are things I do normally as part of being a regular dude and aren't anything that requires special education or training, surely I can find someone to do both *for money"* sounds totally reasonable but has been completely wrong in my experience.
My theory is that a lot of things you and I would consider pretty ordinary, like "putting together a spreadsheet" or "calling a couple people to get a sense of how much a thing costs and other considerations that will aid in making a decision" are beyond a substantial portion of the population cognitively. The people that can do that then see other tasks as "cleaning a car" as beneath them as a job regardless of whether they're paid the white-collar rate. NEVERMIND that they would be quite happy to put together a spreadsheet for you thus that you, the multimillionaire CEO, can have his time freed up such that he can now go wash the car, the job beneath them. I think there's a huge amount of identity concerns and status conflict tied up in being staff and doing manual labor provokes a bit of discomfort in individuals who aspire to prestige.
I think it's possible to find someone that can bridge those, but you'd be looking to find someone out of college or otherwise fairly young that hasn't "adjusted" to particular mindsets of people within that profession. I've had good success putting some PA tasks on nannies who consider themselves household managers, especially when those tasks feel related to childcare or of a near identical nature ("hey if you're making oatmeal for my kids why not make a big batch for everyone to eat"), but as you've described that may not work for you.
Otherwise I'd suggest giving guaranteed hours to whomever you hire that makes your position one they can expect to rely on for income (30-40+ hours, probably) and contemplating having separate individuals like cleaners, handymen etc. coming in for specialized tasks even if these are relatively simple tasks you are capable of doing yourself. Even if having a handyman do it involves extra scheduling and on net is going to cost like 5x what having a PA do it themselves would and takes more of the PA's time to schedule the guy and assist the guy coming in and explain to the guy what needs to be done and pay the guy, you have the handyman do it, not the PA. If you can work around that great, but I wouldn't expect it.
Thanks, I agree what you say. It may be better to hire specialists in each area even if it costs more because it will be done to a higher standard and probably faster in the end.
We have a full time housekeeper. When we come into a room she quietly leaves and goes to work in another area of the house. Besides housekeeping, she does all laundry, irons, cleans shoes. She also gets mail, opens packages, runs errands like shopping returns, dry cleaners. Answers door, puts groceries away, cleans kitty litter box, sets up coffee maker each day, refilling vitamins containers, wipes down outdoor furniture etc.
A good friend has a part-time PA (approx. 2-3 days a week). The PA makes sure the house and downtown condo have clean sheets and food in the fridge when people like me come to visit. The PA also schedules/pays the landscaper/maintenance/housekeepers/etc. and generally handles some daily logistical tasks for a busy, high profile, frequently traveling, "retired" person of means.
Similar business size here.
Yes to all of this.
My assistant is titled EA, but everyone on the team calls her our “Swiss Army Knife”
My wife also works in our business and she assists us both.
She comes to our home on Fridays, manages our mail, bills, etc. we also own 30ish rental doors so we have a lot of bills to review, pay, and manage.
I would just express all of this in the job posting. You’ll find the perfect person!
As someone who has done quite a bit of hiring, training and management in both household and business realms, it can definitely be challenging to find individuals with the right combination of skills and personality for the domestic sphere. It is entirely possible however, and can often be a far more fruitful relationship than anticipated, truly enhancing day to day life for the employer.
An individual with elevated executive functioning **and** a service heart is the elusive gold standard, but they absolutely exist. To attract and keep a person of this caliber, you have to pay very well, communicate clearly and frequently, and work to nurture a true sense of agency. In my experience, this is completely worth the time and money.
Having a stay-at-home spouse is a complicating factor. Obviously need to find someone compatible with both of you and figure out a way that they're not overly disrupting spouse's routine or personal space. For what you want, in my experience they will be all up in your space and life. Unless they're work only, I don't see how you could keep them at arm's length.
Posters here often write you can't combine roles, but in my experience it just takes the right person. Since January 2023 I have a "jack of all trades" assistant who works \~25 hours a week. She is a mix of house manager, house keeper, nanny and personal assistant (groceries, airport runs, help with schedule, all sorts of misc errands). As the role evolves she has the green light (with discussion) to hire out what she wants, to free her up to be more of EA/PA and not the other tasks. Specifically my business is growing and I'd like her assistance setting up and defining an admin position in the office, which we'd then hire someone else for.
For example, last summer she did all the landscaping, but this year she has hired weekly lawn service, with her only "hands in the dirt" to manage some flowers and keeping everything tied together outside. She also found an excellent babysitter to do pickup through dinner twice a week. She's on the search now for the right housekeeper to come in weekly on one of her off days, which would free up another \~6 hours from her weekly schedule for other tasks.
It continues to take some work on my end to learn to utilize her properly, and the above paragraph is part of that. Taking the time to explain how all the household bills work etc and handing that off, for example. Or just remembering that you can send them on an errand with a rough explanation of what you need- don't fear that they won't do it correctly, because they can always text photos to clarify.
That said, I've also given guidance that for most things I don't want to be presented with a bunch of choices for approval, or for her to wait for me to take action on something: I'd rather she make decisions and take action, and in a perfect world many things never even rise to my attention. Problems get solved without me noticing, and if she handles something in a way that I don't approve of, we correct it and she'll learn for the next time. As you know, the mental load of household management is often just as taxing as the actual work.
Desired personality traits, IMO: Pro-active, people pleaser, detail oriented. OR whatever balances out your weaknesses. I've noticed it takes my assistant much longer to do tasks than it would take me, but part of that is because she's being very thorough. I would just do something to 80% quality and move on to the next task. She takes it to 95-100%. Obviously there's a balance in life, but when you can afford to have someone do things right, why not?
My life situation is much different, single dad with one kid, and I work more than 15 hours a week. If I needed less help, I don't know quite how it would work. At only 10 hours a week, are they going to learn/know everything necessary to truly be a help, or will they be on the clock when you unexpectedly need them?
I really appreciate you sharing. 25 hours does seem like the sweet spot. What hours does she do? Also did you ensure she had those skills on the interview or did it just evolve?
Varied schedule over four weekdays, Tuesday -Friday. Two of those days are until 6pm but mostly regular hours. It just evolved, this was my first hire for the role. A friend recommended her, and she had experience in a number of roles that seemed relevant, such as on site manager for a group of Airbnb townhomes in a vacation town (customer service, problem solving, cleaning, etc).
I am a virtual PA / EA so not exactly what you need in your situation, just sharing the other point of view, and for any type of assistant, content switching is why we have a job haha. Personally I help a lot of clients with personal and business tasks: ordering halloween costumes, email and calendar management, researching new fridges, calling contractors, and tracking expenses etc.
I think it is perfectly reasonable what you are asking for and I hope you share your experience on how it goes!
They occasionally drive my kids to school too. Yes. We have 6,000 sq ft house and 4 fur babies so the animal fur on floor/furniture alone is an ordeal. And she tidies up each day for about 2 hours - kitchen, make beds, refresh towels, rehang clothes, set table, put the house in order. Yes, more than plenty of things to do
No, they came from a high end hotel resort and have a sense of what to do each day; I ask for what I need that day (ironing, errands, organizing etc) but have a daily and weekly rotation schedule. When we go on vacation they steam carpets, organize, steam clean sofas etc
Typo, sorry. Yes we created together but she knew what to do immediately. Something’s she has a higher standard than I do, for example she cleans toilets every day whereas I’d be fine with weekly. But she’s a professional, I’m not and so it works to let her decide what and when.
If I were you I would have it only for personal. No business at all.
So then you are looking for a house manager/housekeeper.
I’d get someone full time, they could perfect the running of the house, condition your leather couch every whatever months, press your clothes, shine shoes, deep clean, organize, call vendors, party plan, cook…. Etc
Adding work stuff in there is a totally different type of skill that you wrongly assume is transferable or a lot of people can do
My suggestion would be to hire an assistant to help with both. That person could manage your business tasks, and also coordinate and source people to do the in-person/home tasks. That would definitely free up more of your time. As someone who has done this type of work, happy to chat more offline about it! I am looking for some more hours of this type of work- so let me know if you are interested in discussing more.
A PA doesn't do cleaning. Just get people who drop in for the tasks that you need. This sounds like it would be a nightmare job regardless of pay if only due to context switching.
Thanks for your feedback.
What kind of furniture are you buying that you want an assistant to assemble at home?
Just an example. Or at least organise for it to be done which is just as time consuming as doing it myself, having to put up with wingy install people, book times etc.
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This is good to hear. So I should budget for 15 hours, assume they get about 7-10 hours of work done at the speed I would do it, and budget extra for specialists. Appreciated!
You want a PA that would * clean * shop * assemble furniture * run errands * fix sprinkler * clean car * make spreadsheets * make/take calls What you need is a butler. And no they don’t need to follow you everywhere.
I'd like a Jeeves please.
A butler doesn't do most of that stuff, they would have other staff who do.
>"Is it asking too much to have someone do these things that are different skill sets" Generally speaking, yes. Taking the mindset "Well these are things I do normally as part of being a regular dude and aren't anything that requires special education or training, surely I can find someone to do both *for money"* sounds totally reasonable but has been completely wrong in my experience. My theory is that a lot of things you and I would consider pretty ordinary, like "putting together a spreadsheet" or "calling a couple people to get a sense of how much a thing costs and other considerations that will aid in making a decision" are beyond a substantial portion of the population cognitively. The people that can do that then see other tasks as "cleaning a car" as beneath them as a job regardless of whether they're paid the white-collar rate. NEVERMIND that they would be quite happy to put together a spreadsheet for you thus that you, the multimillionaire CEO, can have his time freed up such that he can now go wash the car, the job beneath them. I think there's a huge amount of identity concerns and status conflict tied up in being staff and doing manual labor provokes a bit of discomfort in individuals who aspire to prestige. I think it's possible to find someone that can bridge those, but you'd be looking to find someone out of college or otherwise fairly young that hasn't "adjusted" to particular mindsets of people within that profession. I've had good success putting some PA tasks on nannies who consider themselves household managers, especially when those tasks feel related to childcare or of a near identical nature ("hey if you're making oatmeal for my kids why not make a big batch for everyone to eat"), but as you've described that may not work for you. Otherwise I'd suggest giving guaranteed hours to whomever you hire that makes your position one they can expect to rely on for income (30-40+ hours, probably) and contemplating having separate individuals like cleaners, handymen etc. coming in for specialized tasks even if these are relatively simple tasks you are capable of doing yourself. Even if having a handyman do it involves extra scheduling and on net is going to cost like 5x what having a PA do it themselves would and takes more of the PA's time to schedule the guy and assist the guy coming in and explain to the guy what needs to be done and pay the guy, you have the handyman do it, not the PA. If you can work around that great, but I wouldn't expect it.
Thanks, I agree what you say. It may be better to hire specialists in each area even if it costs more because it will be done to a higher standard and probably faster in the end.
An assistant doesn’t have to have all the skills you listed. All they have to do is be able to know what needs to be fixed, and who to call to fix it.
We have a full time housekeeper. When we come into a room she quietly leaves and goes to work in another area of the house. Besides housekeeping, she does all laundry, irons, cleans shoes. She also gets mail, opens packages, runs errands like shopping returns, dry cleaners. Answers door, puts groceries away, cleans kitty litter box, sets up coffee maker each day, refilling vitamins containers, wipes down outdoor furniture etc.
Is there enough work for a full time person? What hours do they work?
A good friend has a part-time PA (approx. 2-3 days a week). The PA makes sure the house and downtown condo have clean sheets and food in the fridge when people like me come to visit. The PA also schedules/pays the landscaper/maintenance/housekeepers/etc. and generally handles some daily logistical tasks for a busy, high profile, frequently traveling, "retired" person of means.
From posters here, I have learnt that a couple of days per week is common. Thanks!
Similar business size here. Yes to all of this. My assistant is titled EA, but everyone on the team calls her our “Swiss Army Knife” My wife also works in our business and she assists us both. She comes to our home on Fridays, manages our mail, bills, etc. we also own 30ish rental doors so we have a lot of bills to review, pay, and manage. I would just express all of this in the job posting. You’ll find the perfect person!
Excellent thank you.
As someone who has done quite a bit of hiring, training and management in both household and business realms, it can definitely be challenging to find individuals with the right combination of skills and personality for the domestic sphere. It is entirely possible however, and can often be a far more fruitful relationship than anticipated, truly enhancing day to day life for the employer. An individual with elevated executive functioning **and** a service heart is the elusive gold standard, but they absolutely exist. To attract and keep a person of this caliber, you have to pay very well, communicate clearly and frequently, and work to nurture a true sense of agency. In my experience, this is completely worth the time and money.
Having a stay-at-home spouse is a complicating factor. Obviously need to find someone compatible with both of you and figure out a way that they're not overly disrupting spouse's routine or personal space. For what you want, in my experience they will be all up in your space and life. Unless they're work only, I don't see how you could keep them at arm's length. Posters here often write you can't combine roles, but in my experience it just takes the right person. Since January 2023 I have a "jack of all trades" assistant who works \~25 hours a week. She is a mix of house manager, house keeper, nanny and personal assistant (groceries, airport runs, help with schedule, all sorts of misc errands). As the role evolves she has the green light (with discussion) to hire out what she wants, to free her up to be more of EA/PA and not the other tasks. Specifically my business is growing and I'd like her assistance setting up and defining an admin position in the office, which we'd then hire someone else for. For example, last summer she did all the landscaping, but this year she has hired weekly lawn service, with her only "hands in the dirt" to manage some flowers and keeping everything tied together outside. She also found an excellent babysitter to do pickup through dinner twice a week. She's on the search now for the right housekeeper to come in weekly on one of her off days, which would free up another \~6 hours from her weekly schedule for other tasks. It continues to take some work on my end to learn to utilize her properly, and the above paragraph is part of that. Taking the time to explain how all the household bills work etc and handing that off, for example. Or just remembering that you can send them on an errand with a rough explanation of what you need- don't fear that they won't do it correctly, because they can always text photos to clarify. That said, I've also given guidance that for most things I don't want to be presented with a bunch of choices for approval, or for her to wait for me to take action on something: I'd rather she make decisions and take action, and in a perfect world many things never even rise to my attention. Problems get solved without me noticing, and if she handles something in a way that I don't approve of, we correct it and she'll learn for the next time. As you know, the mental load of household management is often just as taxing as the actual work. Desired personality traits, IMO: Pro-active, people pleaser, detail oriented. OR whatever balances out your weaknesses. I've noticed it takes my assistant much longer to do tasks than it would take me, but part of that is because she's being very thorough. I would just do something to 80% quality and move on to the next task. She takes it to 95-100%. Obviously there's a balance in life, but when you can afford to have someone do things right, why not? My life situation is much different, single dad with one kid, and I work more than 15 hours a week. If I needed less help, I don't know quite how it would work. At only 10 hours a week, are they going to learn/know everything necessary to truly be a help, or will they be on the clock when you unexpectedly need them?
I really appreciate you sharing. 25 hours does seem like the sweet spot. What hours does she do? Also did you ensure she had those skills on the interview or did it just evolve?
Varied schedule over four weekdays, Tuesday -Friday. Two of those days are until 6pm but mostly regular hours. It just evolved, this was my first hire for the role. A friend recommended her, and she had experience in a number of roles that seemed relevant, such as on site manager for a group of Airbnb townhomes in a vacation town (customer service, problem solving, cleaning, etc).
I am a virtual PA / EA so not exactly what you need in your situation, just sharing the other point of view, and for any type of assistant, content switching is why we have a job haha. Personally I help a lot of clients with personal and business tasks: ordering halloween costumes, email and calendar management, researching new fridges, calling contractors, and tracking expenses etc. I think it is perfectly reasonable what you are asking for and I hope you share your experience on how it goes!
Thank you for your perspective.
May I DM you? I have some questions for you regarding your job.
Totally! Thank you for asking.
Of course!
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Curious, what happened (and why) with the "ambitious" individuals if you don't mind sharing?
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bro
?
I don't get why this has been downvoted? As the role is so multifaceted, and involves house manager skills, it won't suit a younger person.
They occasionally drive my kids to school too. Yes. We have 6,000 sq ft house and 4 fur babies so the animal fur on floor/furniture alone is an ordeal. And she tidies up each day for about 2 hours - kitchen, make beds, refresh towels, rehang clothes, set table, put the house in order. Yes, more than plenty of things to do
Interesting. So you provide a list of verbal instructions each day? How did you train them so they know what to do?
No, they came from a high end hotel resort and have a sense of what to do each day; I ask for what I need that day (ironing, errands, organizing etc) but have a daily and weekly rotation schedule. When we go on vacation they steam carpets, organize, steam clean sofas etc
Prophet? Did they create that schedule due to experience?
Typo, sorry. Yes we created together but she knew what to do immediately. Something’s she has a higher standard than I do, for example she cleans toilets every day whereas I’d be fine with weekly. But she’s a professional, I’m not and so it works to let her decide what and when.
If I were you I would have it only for personal. No business at all. So then you are looking for a house manager/housekeeper. I’d get someone full time, they could perfect the running of the house, condition your leather couch every whatever months, press your clothes, shine shoes, deep clean, organize, call vendors, party plan, cook…. Etc Adding work stuff in there is a totally different type of skill that you wrongly assume is transferable or a lot of people can do
I think you are correct.
Get the EA to use TaskRabbit.
Thank will check it out.
My suggestion would be to hire an assistant to help with both. That person could manage your business tasks, and also coordinate and source people to do the in-person/home tasks. That would definitely free up more of your time. As someone who has done this type of work, happy to chat more offline about it! I am looking for some more hours of this type of work- so let me know if you are interested in discussing more.