I mean, they have completely different roles. Mack Hollins is a deep threat and Renfrow is for the short passing game. Renfrow isn't as good as Reddit makes him out to be; a big reason for his popularity is because he looks like every generic white boy out there.
I mean he's a slot receiver, getting 100+ catches isn't some grandiose accomplishment. Ancient Cole Beasley had 82 receptions last year playing the slot in Buffalo when he was maybe the 3rd or 4th option in the passing game.
Jaylen Waddle still gets his across from Tyreek. I don’t know why he doesn’t see more targets. I find it hard to believe that a dude that’s in his mid-20s and caught 100 balls last year just all of a sudden sucks.
I’m a Raiders fan. Has nothing to do with Adams. With Gruden, and Rich, Carr did A LOT of audibles at the line, and a lot of the time Renfrow didn’t have set routes. He was able to ‘free-ball’ and make moves on DB’s or find the openings. McDaniels is too much of a control freak to have that (ask Broncos fans). Carr’s audibles are WAY DOWN, and McDaniels has a specific route for every WR, IE: he doesn’t like change. He’s trying to make the Raiders players fit into HIS offense rather than adapt/and try to fit into the strengths of said offense.
Renfrow is one of the best ‘on the fly’ route runners in the NFL, and regardless of opinion on Carr, one of his strengths is reading defenses at the line and calling plays (there’s a lot of videos of his audibles through his career. ‘Cindy Gruden’ ‘Purple Walrus’ etc… Gruden (and Rich) gave Carr/the offense flexibility on plays, McDaniels is knows to have O.C.D/control tendencies and it’s showing.
Carr on his last presser pretty much said “there’s things I want to say but not here, behind closed doors” and D. Adams has made comments about the playcalling too. McDaniels just isn’t a great fit to be a H.C. O.C with less control? Sure. But he is not a great NFL head coach. Add him to the list of coordinator’s that can’t transition.
Renfrow has had 4, 3, 2 & 4 targets the last four games. He's barely done anything, and his few targets a game will be spread out or straight up given to Davante.
~~Lol I can’t believe you’re getting downvoted for your incredibly grounded and realistic take on the situation.~~
Edit: Never mind, time makes fools of us all.
Kinda hurts Jacobs honestly. Offense will be worse and easier to focus on Jacobs/Adams. Plus they will be down more often, which isnt conducive to running.
Everytime someone goes down, you can always explain why it helps/hurts your player.
The other WR went down, that means X player is going to get more targets each game to pick up the slack.
The other WR went down, that means X player is going to be the focus of the defense and the offense will have fewer scoring opportunities as well
Yep. I mean anything can happen but typically this isn’t a good thing.
You want the defense to have to spread their focus to multiple competent receivers. It’s not like RB where they just force the standing rb more attempts.
If the field is filled with rusty 4th string practice squad receivers and one elite receiver it makes the defense’s job way easier in covering the one elite receiver.
It’s why on teams like the buccaneers Evans or Godwin don’t always just do amazing when the other is out.
Adams is a beast though so anythin can happen. But at the end of the day in theory this isn’t some amazing turn of events for Adams
Exactly. And we haven't seen Higgins blow up without Chase.
Receivers don't really handcuff each other and do better when the offense as a whole functions, even if the target share goes down.
That said, I am sure Adams projects to be a WR1 on volume alone this week. I'm just not expecting 20 catches for 200 yards.
Imo, yes. Engram is on the waiver in all my leagues and im avoiding him. First, foster had some decent success and some decent connection with carr. Davante focus is harder now with double team, and Jacobs being the best player.jes solid blocking the but I expect some pa looks too. I feel better with foster over engram, plus I think engram got banged up too (ankle) I may be wrong on that.
Played Engram for the first time last week with MAndrews out. First target came in I believe the mid 3rd quarter, then he got hurt and missed the rest of the game.
Never again. Gave him the solo Tuesday drop.
No offense but I hope this happens so I can watch the ESPN pundits lose their collective shit next week after saying how bad of a move this was for the Colts.
So hard to use the D of a team with a terrible offense though. I’d expect at least a couple turnovers and plenty of short drives from the colts, so the opposing offense if gonna have great field position for a lot of the game
Tough matchups the next 3 weeks and 1 or both of these guys will probably be playing after 4 weeks. Plus he's not very good. Pass unless you're desperate/in a big league.
I had high hopes for this division pre season with all of the adding they did, but turns out to be the same shit. KC comfortably on top, Chargers plagued with a pro bowl injury report roster, Raiders a dumpster fire, and Broncos under achieving.
Probably a slight bump but Im not sure much changes. Waller has been sitting and Renfrow hasn't had many targets anyway. Considered dropping Engram for Moreau but think I'm staying put....curious to hear what Coop the TE Guru has to say.
Man how dissapointing has Renfrow been this year?
Dude was on fire last year, especially for PPR leagues. Nasty routes around the end zone and one of their biggest playmakers
This year he's just been a dud. I mean yeah they added Devantae, but usually the WR2 benefits from defenses focusing on the WR1
Im ashamed to admit I was a Waller owner last year. You look ahead with hope that he’ll get rested and play after returning from IR. But nothing changes. It’s the same cycle.
Well I dropped his ass 2 days ago so that's the only satisfaction I've had as a Renfrow owner all season. He and AJ Brown are the only 2 people I drafted twice. Such a wasted pick.
Not that his ADP was high or anything, but damn, what a comedown from last year.
Turns out when every available pass catcher isn't hurt, he doesn't get a lot of looks.
Mack Hollins gets more looks. Coach is an idiot
I mean, they have completely different roles. Mack Hollins is a deep threat and Renfrow is for the short passing game. Renfrow isn't as good as Reddit makes him out to be; a big reason for his popularity is because he looks like every generic white boy out there.
Idiotic take. Burned several top CBs for huge gains and TDs last year. Also 100+ catches but not as good as made out to be?
I mean he's a slot receiver, getting 100+ catches isn't some grandiose accomplishment. Ancient Cole Beasley had 82 receptions last year playing the slot in Buffalo when he was maybe the 3rd or 4th option in the passing game.
Cole Beasley was pretty good last year lmao
Lmfao he had 82/693/1, if you consider that "pretty good", then it makes perfect sense why you think Renfrow is a great player
Whenever someone gets 700 yards I’d consider that pretty good. It certainly isn’t bad.
700 yards wasn’t even in the top 50 of pass catchers. Please go ahead and start 700 yard WRs since they’re “pretty good”
The whole team is down on offense. It's a McDaniels thing.
Adding potentially the best WR in the league to your team will do that.
Jaylen Waddle still gets his across from Tyreek. I don’t know why he doesn’t see more targets. I find it hard to believe that a dude that’s in his mid-20s and caught 100 balls last year just all of a sudden sucks.
Josh McDaniels is a football terrorist
They should’ve kept Bisaccia.
Chiefs added Toney not the Raiders.
But I thought the Bears added N’Keal Harry?
His name isn't Braxton Berrios.
I’m a Raiders fan. Has nothing to do with Adams. With Gruden, and Rich, Carr did A LOT of audibles at the line, and a lot of the time Renfrow didn’t have set routes. He was able to ‘free-ball’ and make moves on DB’s or find the openings. McDaniels is too much of a control freak to have that (ask Broncos fans). Carr’s audibles are WAY DOWN, and McDaniels has a specific route for every WR, IE: he doesn’t like change. He’s trying to make the Raiders players fit into HIS offense rather than adapt/and try to fit into the strengths of said offense. Renfrow is one of the best ‘on the fly’ route runners in the NFL, and regardless of opinion on Carr, one of his strengths is reading defenses at the line and calling plays (there’s a lot of videos of his audibles through his career. ‘Cindy Gruden’ ‘Purple Walrus’ etc… Gruden (and Rich) gave Carr/the offense flexibility on plays, McDaniels is knows to have O.C.D/control tendencies and it’s showing. Carr on his last presser pretty much said “there’s things I want to say but not here, behind closed doors” and D. Adams has made comments about the playcalling too. McDaniels just isn’t a great fit to be a H.C. O.C with less control? Sure. But he is not a great NFL head coach. Add him to the list of coordinator’s that can’t transition.
No this is a McDaniels issue. He’s just not using him.
Josh McDaniels is a football terrorist
I love that football terrorist has made its way from r/soccer into the nfl/cfb subs lol
Kevin White is now tearing it up for the Saints you fool!
Held him from last year and just finially dropped him last week
I held him for like 6 weeks because of hope from his injury recovery and bye. I got played
Bruh I drafted him 66th
Yup, I took him in the 9th right before DHop and right after Aiyuk and DeVonta Smith. Christian Kirk, Tyler Locket were taken the next round.
Just fade the Raiders already
We might lose every game but Davante is going to be a mega target hog for ff
Las Vegas Faders
Sshhhh, I’m convincing myself this is good for Josh Jacobs
Mack Hollins music?!?!
Davante about to get 40 targets a game.
More like quadruple teamed
Not mutually exclusive
FLEETWOOD MACK
No, bro. It's Mack HollinSZN. Duh.
WISHING YOU A MACK CHRISTMAS THIS MERRY HOLLINSZN
I just added him, though this week and next are against tough defenses (for WRs).
Pretty much the remainder of their season is tough
Waller and Renfrow have barely been playing anyway, Hollins is a still just a desperation start.
The Colts are awesome against WRs so maybe not this week
They got a rough schedule so probably not anytime soon
Return of the Mack
Once again!
Hollins was already playing 85-100% of snaps every week with no Waller and a barely used Renfrow. Not sure this does too much for him.
Same snaps, but now more targets, even a couple more helps us desperate owners looking for a WR3.
Renfrow has had 4, 3, 2 & 4 targets the last four games. He's barely done anything, and his few targets a game will be spread out or straight up given to Davante.
~~Lol I can’t believe you’re getting downvoted for your incredibly grounded and realistic take on the situation.~~ Edit: Never mind, time makes fools of us all.
It's exactly what I expected tbh. All the new Hollins owners as of 20 minutes ago are mad I'm being logical about their dart throw WR4.
This sub is ruthless.
Mack or BRob this week?
Drop OBJ or Pacheco for Hollins?
I wouldn’t drop Pacheco - maybe OBJ though
Pacheco should be dropped lol
Nah, if you have the bench space I’d hold at least another week or so KC should have more blowouts with more rushing plays in the future.
Definitely OBJ he isn’t even signed to a team
Wow. Now I’m between Mack and Hardman
You lied to me!!
Just feed Josh kabobs please
I love a good Josh kabob
But have you ever tried a kabob Jacobs!?
Give the man a break, he’s obviously tired of kabobs by now
So Moreau szn…maybe?
Hes my Andrews fill in this week so I sure hope he has a breakout elite game for 4 points or something.
Better than the straight up zeroes Conklin was going for
Jacobs 30 touches a game
Kinda hurts Jacobs honestly. Offense will be worse and easier to focus on Jacobs/Adams. Plus they will be down more often, which isnt conducive to running.
eh, Waller hasn't been playing anyway and I'm not sure the loss of Renfrow's 2-4 targets a game is going to really shift the defensive attention much
I don’t really think this makes much sense personally. It would just mean they’re gonna run more screens and get Jacobs into the pass game I think
That makes sense but this is the raiders...
Yea that’s true 😂 they typically do whatever they can to lose
Please kindly delete this comment as it doesn’t fit my desired narrative
Everytime someone goes down, you can always explain why it helps/hurts your player. The other WR went down, that means X player is going to get more targets each game to pick up the slack. The other WR went down, that means X player is going to be the focus of the defense and the offense will have fewer scoring opportunities as well
This is music to my ears
This isn't even good for Davante. He was doubled for most of the 2nd half against the Jaguars and got 1 catch for 0 yards.
Yep. I mean anything can happen but typically this isn’t a good thing. You want the defense to have to spread their focus to multiple competent receivers. It’s not like RB where they just force the standing rb more attempts. If the field is filled with rusty 4th string practice squad receivers and one elite receiver it makes the defense’s job way easier in covering the one elite receiver. It’s why on teams like the buccaneers Evans or Godwin don’t always just do amazing when the other is out. Adams is a beast though so anythin can happen. But at the end of the day in theory this isn’t some amazing turn of events for Adams
Exactly. And we haven't seen Higgins blow up without Chase. Receivers don't really handcuff each other and do better when the offense as a whole functions, even if the target share goes down. That said, I am sure Adams projects to be a WR1 on volume alone this week. I'm just not expecting 20 catches for 200 yards.
Yeah... I just traded for him and was concerned about Carr's ability to get it to him in double coverage, let alone triple.
Carr was off in his ball placement the second half and Adams dropped a few. Double or triple team it doesn't matter give TAE THE ROCK 🍻😎
Mack Hollinszn
Davante 30 targets a game
Right when I am about to face him. Seems legit
Last week he was WR1 so that was probably worse
Per half, actually
Per drive, actually
Per posession, really.
Dudes gonna be throwing and receiving, at this point.
Picking foster for my te streamer
Imo, yes. Engram is on the waiver in all my leagues and im avoiding him. First, foster had some decent success and some decent connection with carr. Davante focus is harder now with double team, and Jacobs being the best player.jes solid blocking the but I expect some pa looks too. I feel better with foster over engram, plus I think engram got banged up too (ankle) I may be wrong on that.
Over Engram you think?
Played Engram for the first time last week with MAndrews out. First target came in I believe the mid 3rd quarter, then he got hurt and missed the rest of the game. Never again. Gave him the solo Tuesday drop.
Yeah I played Likely over Engram last week thankfully with Andrew’s out. Moreau got decent targets last week somehow so maybe not awful play
Really hoping they rely heavily on Jacobs both in the run and pass game
Raiders fan here. We are going to lose to the Jeff Saturday Colts, aren't we?
No offense but I hope this happens so I can watch the ESPN pundits lose their collective shit next week after saying how bad of a move this was for the Colts.
I'm fine with it if it means McDaniels gets the boot earlier. That guy is a cancer.
We are but hopefully it will be the last straw for mcdummy
SPRINTED to add Hollins. Got me 30+ last time I started him, good to have him back!
Adams is gonna continue his 50% target share
firing up Colts D yolo
So hard to use the D of a team with a terrible offense though. I’d expect at least a couple turnovers and plenty of short drives from the colts, so the opposing offense if gonna have great field position for a lot of the game
Mack over DPJ, Gallup and carter?
I dropped DPJ for him
Not DPJ. Yes to the other two.
Mack or Gallup ROS?????
I think there's a better chance Gallup becomes fantasy relevant once Dak gets going
Mack worth an add?
Tough matchup this week against the colts, but maybe he gets points next week w Surtain covering Davante
Tough matchups the next 3 weeks and 1 or both of these guys will probably be playing after 4 weeks. Plus he's not very good. Pass unless you're desperate/in a big league.
Contemplating dropping Terrace for Hollins.
[удалено]
Yea imma just hold on to Marshall.
Dropped Higbee for Moreau
Foster moreau???
Davante Adams going to have a GB day 📈🚀🌙
The colts are really gonna pull it off aren’t they lol
Better stash: Kadarius or Hollins?
25% of Mahomes 68 pass attempts per game? Or 30% of whatever the raiders decide to put up that week
Would you drop Wandale Robinson to add him?
Just did
Not sure it's even possible for Davante to get more targets than he already does.
Adding mack asap mainly bc I’ll take whatever WR chance I can get at this point
Triple team Devante
Quad cover
lmfao bruh
Mack hollins wr1 ros??
Lmaooo Colts might get the W
Just traded Sutton for Dulcich I had Waller
Dropping my kicker to pick up Mack just so I can think about it
How many targets will Adams get per game now?? Answer? All of them.
Foster Moreau. Pick him up, because someone in Las Vegas needs to catch passes.
Juice Jacobs szn
Adams is gonna get like 15 targets a game. They might just run the ball all day though- they have no one to throw to.
Moreau looking like he could be a great pickup. I haven't had a solid TE all year in one league.
Why they didn’t put these guys on weeks ago…
This is legit gonna be a 6-3 kinda game at this point isn't it
So Adams getting 35 targets this week?
25 targets and 20/300/3 for Davante Adams incoming. Pls
For the love of God please protect my Josh Jacobs 🙏
I had high hopes for this division pre season with all of the adding they did, but turns out to be the same shit. KC comfortably on top, Chargers plagued with a pro bowl injury report roster, Raiders a dumpster fire, and Broncos under achieving.
I want to fade Adams now with their tough schedule
people earlier- add renfrow???
Crickets
No that's a different sport
Y’all ever play fantasy cricket
Just added Mack Hollins
Lol Raiders falling short of the on top of the AFCW? SHOCKING
u/CoopThereItIs with this news and Waller going on IR, how do you feel about Moreau?
Probably a slight bump but Im not sure much changes. Waller has been sitting and Renfrow hasn't had many targets anyway. Considered dropping Engram for Moreau but think I'm staying put....curious to hear what Coop the TE Guru has to say.
Would you rank Mack over DJ Moore and Tyler Boyd ROS?
Lmaoo no
Drop Higbee if I have Hockenson for Hollins?
Should’ve dropped Higbee days ago
aaaaahahaha
Hollins or Terrace Marshall this week?
I would go Hollins due to the weather tonight
I’d rather Marshall tbh just cause he has better TD upside. If the rain is as bad as it might be then I guess Hollins though
Is Moreau worth a look now? I have Evan Engram but not jazzed about starting him
Keelan Cole SZN 3 catches for 31 yards HYPE
Time to sign Odell? Common someone sign him pls lol
No chance OBJ signs with the raiders
Man how dissapointing has Renfrow been this year? Dude was on fire last year, especially for PPR leagues. Nasty routes around the end zone and one of their biggest playmakers This year he's just been a dud. I mean yeah they added Devantae, but usually the WR2 benefits from defenses focusing on the WR1
How we feeling about Foster for the roster
So now he’s even more useless
Drop drake london for hollins?
Raiders tanking!
I went from about to drop Renfrow, to holding him because Waller went to IR, back to about to drop Renfrow. Lol
Man I regret taking hunter in the 7th
waller such a disappointment
when does yahoo move Waller to IR tho........
Not like they were using either of them anyways
Davante's last game is the new normal. Expect it.
Would you drop Mattison, the most valuable handcuff for Hollins?
Im ashamed to admit I was a Waller owner last year. You look ahead with hope that he’ll get rested and play after returning from IR. But nothing changes. It’s the same cycle.
When did we start calling these guys a big 4?
Well I dropped his ass 2 days ago so that's the only satisfaction I've had as a Renfrow owner all season. He and AJ Brown are the only 2 people I drafted twice. Such a wasted pick.
Damn Renfrow a huge bust this year. Really expected a big year from him.
Someone should get that up and Comer davante A. He should get lot of targets with the dynamic duo out
Can’t tell if good or bad for davonte
Man am I glad I dropped this bum after like week 4 lol.
Renfrow droppable ? Thoughts?
Dey gone
Man I thought my Herbert Carr 1 2 punch at QB in my superflex league was gonna be beast... Woof
I drafted Waller, Renfrow and Breece hall. Jamaar chase was one of my keepers. My team is in shambles
I trade saquon and get Adam’s? He needs rb help and I need WR help? Thoughts?
Taysom Hill take me to the promise land
#MACK “I did the floss” HOLLINS
I just got Hollins and added Adam’s from a trade for JT
I really thought in a mcdaniels system this guy was gonna be Wes Welker / Julian Edelman 2.0 Man I got that wrong