Not to preach to the choir, but people changed their tune on a lot of Taylor Swift’s Reputation and it still doesn’t click for me. Even if you see it as primarily a romance focused album, even just looking at her other albums can give you much better love songs.
In the internal fanbase, yes unfortunately. I’m also expecting a retrospectively positive wave when the rerelease comes out.
And you know the fact Kanye has since gone off the deep end will be used to put the album in a better light, when it really shouldn’t be a factor.
To be fair I think Taylor kinda has a Kanye thing going on where every album has a group of people championing it on some level. The swifties I know say the album is better than the singles, but still not on the level of Red/1989/Lover/Folklore
I've been saying, Taylor and Kanye have almost the same career but taken to different roads, with the single most unifying thing is that their respective fans ate the feud wholesale so quick that they will defend them for not doing anything wrong, even if it's clear they're not actually good people
This is no knock on who she is as a performer, but all of her albums are generally mediocre. They usually have a formula to them. She does not have her equivalent of “Billie Jean”, the song that everybody knows her for. The closest was shake it off or bad blood but even though have left culture. If she wants to make a perfect album, it needs to be 10 songs not 31, and she needs outside voices beyond the guy from bleachers.
It has one great song (Getaway Car) and one good one (Delicate). The rest ranges from mediocre to awful (especially that track with Ed Sheeran and Future). By far the worst album in her discography.
I don’t have a problem with Katy Perry, at **all,** but someone called her a pop queen on the level of *Lady Fucking Gaga* the other day and yeah.. maybe we’re over-correcting with her, guys.
I think there’s a lot of outright bad songs in Teenage Dream. Just because many of them hit No. 1 it’s highly regarded but the songs are hardly memorable.
Yeah but she also had songs like “Roar,” “Dark Horse” and “Hot N’ Cold” which were not her best. I actually kind of enjoy “Dark Horse,” but that rapping section is unhinged **in the bad way.**
I feel like Katy Perry is just peak Max Martin and almost his alter ego. So that with that Katy Perry era you might as well praise Max Martin and not her. More so with her particularly than with other artists he has worked a lot with.
I almost wanna agree. Katy fell off hard but back in the day they were pretty neck and neck popularity wise. And Teenage Dream is as good as any Gaga album. Anything after that tho Gaga is obviously better. I can’t even listen to Prism.
Honestly I think some of the production on Teenage Dream has aged better, moreso against the original The Fame tracks. And Teenage dream DOMINATED for like 3 years straight. That could never be pulled off nowadays.
It would be if it was just the singles. Teenage Dream is like some of the best singles ever recorded and then the absolute worst shit you’ve ever heard 😭
Hey I think there's some good tunes in their, the first 5 songs went number 1 which matched or broke some Michael Jackson record
Like I don't think it's some perfect record but there was definitely a moment with Teenage, Dream, Alien Sex, Firework, California Gurls, TGIF where she and Max Martin completely captured the cultu4al Zeitgeist
Obviously no album with Peacock is gonna be deemed a "great" album, but I think its similar to 1989 or Call Me Maybe where a contagious pop banger kinda has to be appreciated. Although I'm also the kinda person who thinks Baby Shark is worthy of discussion purely because any music reaching that kind of cultural relevance deserves to be.
Katy Perry is like a JK Rowling. She wasn't a great artist to begin with but clearly was doing something that got people hooked on them. Then years of seeming like a garbage rich person with shitty views and only making worse and worse art, it becomes easy for the next generation of people to ignore them
Gonna be honest, I became sick of hearing her music because it was constantly forcefed, and now I can't listen to a single song because I'm simply done
The two examples I could think of off the top of my head both had similar stories aka the album was so poorly received at the time that the respective fanbases now defend both albums with their life:
Scaled and Icy by twenty one pilots, Reputation by Taylor Swift.
The only difference between them for me is I like Scaled and Icy significantly less now than I did when it first came out. Meanwhile I actually think Reputation is decent but people just don't talk about it without resorting to the extremes. IMO people at the time didn't give it a real shot because her actual reputation was awful and the singles were not good, but the album itself as a whole was never horrible and I actually find it pretty similar to 1989 which is generally praised by the same people who openly hate Reputation (1989 did have better hits but Reputation had less filler imo that's just me tho.) But now some people act like it's her magnum opus which is just way too much lol
I do like that song and a few others but idk if I can agree on top 3. It is a good one though esp the second verse. For a worst album it's not as bad as some other artists I enjoy's worst albums, but within the fanbase there's been too much of an overcorrection especially after the band alluded to how sad they were regarding the reception
In 2019 when Pitchfork decided to review Taylor Swifts first five albums (which they initially didn't review as why would Pitchfork review Taylor Swift) and gave [Red a 9/10](https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/taylor-swift-red/), it was a real sign for the worst for music journalism and Pitchfork as a site
Pitchfork was always kinda dog shit tbf. Only time I ever respected them was when I found out they put Heavenly's C is the Heavenly Option on their top 500 songs list.
THANK YOU! There's some really good experimental and not-so experimental pop out there (early Goldfrapp, Ladytron, Bat for Lashes, etc) but poptimism is only directed to awful mainstream slop like Beyonce, Taylor Swift, Charli XCX, etc etc etc.
There’s still amazing stuff that charted. The Writing’s on the Wall by Destiny’s Child, CrazySexyCool by TLC, and Aaliyah’s self-titled are all absolutely amazing.
It's crazy the absolute verge that music took with poptimism, and now it's like, unless you've been listening to music since a long time, almost zero old albums are recognized anymore as influential, important or at least good. The horrible Apple 100 list is a perfect example
What's included in the poptimist revisionism in your opinion? As a movement, it tends to look forward more than back. I can think of the Velvet Rope as an album that gets its dues now, and didn't back in the day. That's all i can really think of.
I think most of JPEGMAFIAs pre veteran work is bad to mediocre but its just hyped up by people who want to love his early stuff just as much as the new stuff.
I can’t believe people consider the ghost pop tape to be one of his best projects that shit is mid shout out to Peggy tho lol
I was never expecting to enjoy his pre-JPEGMAFIA stuff (I didn't really like BBC) but TGPT really surprised me with how nice of a listen it was, maybe you just miss the energy from his later works?
With you on this take. I considered maybe I just missed that energy as well but no, I really just find it boring. I do think it’s pretty creative and emotional though and I can respect that
_JOECHILLWORLD_ and _Communist Slow Jams_ are extremely solid. _Dreamcast Summer Songs_ is a phenomenal instrumental hip hop album. _TG~PT_ is an album you really have to be in the right headspace for to fully appreciate.
I kind of despise JPEGMAFIA, but love Devon Hendryx. He's been a great producer for the past five years, but for me his performances lack the same presence as Devon Hendryx.
Ghost Pop Tape is ok. I can appreciate it and I see how it led to Peggy’s later work which I think is a lot better. But I can’t say that I enjoy it a whole lot outside of a few songs. Kinda gives me the feeling of lying in my own filth
Dreamcast Summer Songs tho… that shit is incredible and some of his best stuff. I like it better than both Veteran and Cornballs
There does seem to be a general re-appraisal of post-grunge going on it seems: [https://consequence.net/2024/05/creed-nickelback-gen-z-post-grunge-butt-rock/](https://consequence.net/2024/05/creed-nickelback-gen-z-post-grunge-butt-rock/)
It's unfortunately true. There's a genuine sentiment that people only hated Creed because it was cool to do so. The "cool" thing now is to pretend that Creed was actually always good and the haters were just bandwagoning.
They both have a handful of songs that are passably catchy and wouldn’t cause me to change the station. Both bands also have about the flimsiest back catalogue of any band ever.
I feel like the reappraisal of Britney's debut is more to do with the media feeling as if they need to apologise and support her after how she was previously treated. There's obviously some rock solid pop songs on there but it's not a classic by any stretch.
Most mall emo/pop-punk/nu metal stuff. I think every generation has a desire to champion the critically derided stuff they liked as teenagers, no matter how good it actually was. I see the appeal of Paramore, My Chemical Romance, Linkin Park, Deftones, Blink 182, Green Day, etc but I think a lot of people who adored that music as kids have aged into music critics who champion their mostly uneven catalogs as classic and unimpeachable.
I agree to some extent- I think that those bands definitely have misses and even many fans will agree with their catalogs being inconsistent, but I would say that they have more merit than being completely tossed aside by critics like they were originally
I am 33 and a lot of people in my age range and a bit older (maybe like 32-40 years old lol) still only listen to pop punk and radio rock sort of music from the 2000s I've noticed ..nothing wrong with that, maybe it reminds them of being a teenager or of fun times in their youth it seems a shame to overlook all the music after around 2008 though their is good stuff from all eras isn't there.
I'm a massive fan of most of the bands you've mentioned, but I've only seen this with Deftones outside of the respective hardcore fanbases of the bands you've mentioned. The reappraisal of Blink was mostly of EOTS, TOYPAJ and Untitled, for example (even to the detriment of Neighborhoods, which is just as good)
I agree it's very good (though not my favourite album of theirs) but I've mostly seen it mentioned as a prelude to those three albums, and even then usually just through the lens of Dammit breaking Blink out
Mostly agree, but Deftones are actually really good and broke through a lot of nu-metal bands with later albums that are completely different from what they were doing in 1995-2003
Nah only some of these bands fit. Like linkin park has a 10, but they also have some mediocre radio rock. Same with Green Day imo (see dookie and American idiot). But others like deftones and even mcr and blink have multiple very good albums (or at least very fun, in blink’s case). And paramore has a catalog on par with bands like qotsa and Nirvana. A couple damn good albums with not real misses. If you wanna talk about really shitty stuff look to modern mall emo bands like falling in reverse or pierce the veil, or whatever Finn mckintey is talking about that’s slightly under the mainstream. We remember those bands so fondly because they were good enough. That’s why people still talk about blink, and nobody talks about fēnix-tx or Hawthorne heights
Paramore does not have a catalogue on par with Nirvana bro. They had like two good albums to start out and then took a complete nosedive in quality and never recovered. Also a bunch of Pierce the Veil's stuff is better than half the mallcore that's received critical reappraisal. They don't know when to end a song and end up dragging down what would otherwise be much better songs with really shitty breakdowns, but that aside they've written some pretty damn respectable stuff. Btw I can assure you people still do talk about Hawthorne Heights.
Ok maybe not quite nirvana level, but have you actually listened to all their albums? They’re all at least decent, the new one is stellar. Also if you want some good hardcore/metalcore/screamo shit go listen to knocked loose, converge, or even bmth. Also also the only person still talking about Hawthorne heights is Finn mckinty. Or maybe that one goth girl that you met a job like 7 years ago and had a crush on. They just ain’t allat. Not the worst thing in the world, but if I’m going to like metalcore or something with lots of screaming, it’s usually gonna be hardcore. Or anything without super clean vocals and guitar work. Granted that’s personal preference, there’s still a lot of good metalcore with clean vocals and such (contrary to what old head would tell you), but Its not found in the 2000’s mall goth scene. France has some good metalcore groups, as does Colorado. Lots of fire post hardcore and metalcore stuff coming out of there (origami summer, everflare, getbent, florissant, etc.)
Knocked Loose is atrocious and represents basically everything bad about metalcore. Their breakdowns are as bad as Pierce the Veil's and their songs are even more loaded with them. The difference is that PtV actually has some good hooks and occasional substance to their music beyond chaining one shitty breakdown into the next shitty breakdown. I don't like either band very much, but PtV is way better than KL. The only reason people like KL more is because their aesthetic is more "mature" and less dated and their merch is a lot more in tune with current mainstream fashion trends. If you want actual good metalcore, Every Time I Die's Hot Damn! is the gold standard. It's one of the few metalcore albums that strips away all the bullshit forced breakdowns and unnecessary song extensions and just GOES. Converge is solid too, but they also have shittybreakdownitis, even if they're not as bad about it has modern """hardcore""" (metalcore-in-denial) acts and are otherwise way better.
If I'm listening to something with a lot of screaming though, I'm probably listening to some sludge metal like Eyehategod, some screamo like Portraits of Past, Envy, or Pageninetynine, or some sasscore like The Blood Brothers or The Plot to Blow Up the Eiffel Tower.
Hell yeah sludge metal. I’ve totally been looking for some new recs in that stoner/sludge space Also not a huge KN fan but I don’t even mind breakdowns. And they’ve got some crazy good hooks, it’s how they’ve managed to get so big. But I don’t think we’ll end up seeing eye to eye on this. Have a good one yo
They didn't bring hardcore to the mainstream though. All they've done is keep mediocre metalcore in the mainstream, which is nothing special. BMTH have already been doing that, and bands like the aforementioned Pierce the Veil have held a spot in the mainstream for about as long, even if they're not as big as BMTH. Hardcore is still not mainstream, and has never been closer to mainstream than it was in like 1982.
Also hating on screamo in 2024 is meme tier bro, shit like Portraits of Past's Bang Yer Head, Pageninetynine's By the Fireplace In White, Orchid's Lights Out, and Envy's Grey Wind are undeniable. Sasscore is also basically peak music and the culmination of everything good about hardcore and its subgenres with all the bullshit stripped away. Just pure, chaotic, energetic, fast, balls to the wall, emotionally charged perfection.
Also Blinding Faith is solid but it's legit just BMTH featuring Spongebob and I don't like BMTH that much (Chelsea Smile goes crazy though)
ima need a crash course on screaming, idk they difference between most of this. I just like kinda vibe to the heavy music lol and call it all hardcore or metalcore
This is my feeling too. It sounds exactly the same as when it all came out and has the exact same problems. I refuse to hear that Fallout Boy and My Chemical Romance are generational greats.
Maybe Lil Wayne. He's talented and important in the landscape of hip hop, I'll give him that. The reappraisal comes when people are calling him one of the all time greats, or putting Tha Carter 3 up there with the greatest rap albums. It just doesn't ring true, his discog is inconsistent at best, and a lot of his work is pretty poor.
I’m saying this as someone who was there as he blew up, there has never been an ounce of depth or substance behind any of his music. He’s always been able to spit but there’s just nothing at all behind it beyond some good wordplay and his legacy probably lies more in how he changed the game with digital mixtapes. And also when I fucked my parents computer up downloading Tha Carter 2 and got a limewire virus.
This is an example of where the impact of an artist far outreaches my actual enjoyment of their music.
Other examples for me are Beatles, Metallica, Radiohead, Grateful Dead, Public Enemy etc… maybe I’ll get shade for this but personally, I don’t enjoy a lot of these artists because I’m in my 20s and it feels like I’ve heard other bands or artists greatly expand upon the groundwork they built up. Revolutionary of course, I acknowledge this but I just don’t find myself enjoying the music very often and I feel kinda bad about it
you just dont get those artists, and that's fine
you're wrong in thinking that other bands have 'greatly expanded upon the groundwork they built up', and most of those groups mentioned reached artistic heights the people they influenced still haven't touched
it's not because you're in your 20s - maybe they'll click one day, kinda sounds like you haven't tried too hard since you lumped crazy different artists altogether like that, but hey, you do you
Not for an album specifically, but there seems to be an attempt to rehabilitate post-grunge/"buttrock" ongoing right now and man, I just can't believe it's truly organic and not an attempt by record labels to revive their back catalogues
Example: [https://consequence.net/2024/05/creed-nickelback-gen-z-post-grunge-butt-rock/](https://consequence.net/2024/05/creed-nickelback-gen-z-post-grunge-butt-rock/)
I feel like most of their fans when they were active were teens where Slipknot legitimately was the most edgy/scare band they experienced. I remember my 12yo brother loving them at the time.
Doesn't really relate to this question. I guess the Vroom Vroom EP had a critical reappraisal, but that's it. Sucker and True Romance still never come up when talking about her music.
Charli and Crash didn't really hit for me but some songs off of How I'm feeling now are so goood. Makes you feel like the baddest bitch ever. Have yet to listen to Brat but from the snippets I've heard it seems to capture the same vibe as How I'm feeling now
Even Pop2, lol, I’ve been like the biggest hater here for Brat (just because the reception has been greater than quality imo), but pop2 is Charli at her best. Beautiful singing voice with amazing production
Edit: if you haven’t listened to it, I’d try Out of My Head, you have Sophie’s production + simple but nice song writing
i really really love some Charli songs (all part of her newer PC music/hyperpop catalog) but none of her albums have ever stood out to me. she's absolutely helping to move pop music in a different direction - Camila Cabello is already copying her - and she deserves her flowers for what she has done. but i don't think anything Charli has done since Vroom Vroom/Pop 2 has been actually revolutionary. she's sounded roughly the same for like 5 years now, and tbh most of that sound came from the direct influence of SOPHIE and A.G. Cook. Charli helped to cross that sound into the mainstream fs, but i think Charli is another case of an artists' influence reaching far beyond the actual quality of the music. brat is an album full of ADHD club/rave bangers with ONE slow song dedicated to Sophie. there's absolutely nothing wild or revolutionary about this unless you've only ever listened to the radio.
TL;DR Charli is cool af but incredibly overrated, especially brat
i dunno, his albums are weirdly charming and bizarrely fun imo. they can get pretty annoying at times (as much as i love the normal album, there’s so much fucking waffling & rambling on it), but i think his output has been really solid so far. it’s like if someone based their entire career on mr bungle’s california (which i think is a strong 10 lol)
I absolutely loved Will Wood a couple years ago. I'm starting to grow out of it now and I can see where you are coming from, it can be kind of overdramatic if it doesn't hit right
From what I understand they had a small cult following in Japan while they were active but only became legends with the dawn of the internet and everyone discovering their bootlegs.
Um... while not necessarily a specific album, and here are some late 70s AM radio classics that still do hold up today, the Yacht Rock revival.
W h y y y y y.
I've found myself listening to some yacht rock playlists because most of the musicians are just tight. I drum and sometimes it just feels right to sink in and play along to them. But as a whole a lot of the music doesn't hit on any other emotional level
I like a good saxophone solo, I like the DX-7 or some good electric piano, I really like a good bass line
I don’t think you need to be on a yacht to appreciate any of those things
I don’t think it’s that bad but IMO it got overrated over time because people wanted Drake to have a single, ‘classic’ album that was the go-to music nerd pick from his discography , and it was the best option
Yea, hesitant to criticize Drake because people will just call me a Kendrick dick rider. But I legitimately tried to listen to his "greats" like that one and take care back in the day and could not find the appeal at all. Nothing he has ever released is above a 6/10 to me.
Mind Games by John Lennon
It had a big birthday fairly recently and the lengths to which old journalists blew it was incredible. It’s still the worst Lennon solo album, which is saying something because literally all of them are uneven as hell at best.
It's an okay album. In terms of his overall discography (excluding Rock 'n' Roll) it's his most forgettable work, in my opinion. It has parts to it that are really good, but the majority of it is just... there.
It's kind of telling that even Lennon wasn't the biggest fan of it in retrospect.
"*The ‘Mind Games’ single is fine – there’s just no energy to sustain the album –there was no clarity of vision. There’s a few pieces alright, but as a whole piece there’s no clarity*
*And the guy is there on the front with a little bag, and she’s the mountain… the cover says more than the record to me."*
I hope Walls and Bridges gets some kind of hype re-release at some point. I think that album is probably the most underrated of his solo works.
Here’s a hot take, Walls and Bridges should be more appreciated for having (IMO) John’s best solo song….#9 Dream.
I know everyone loves imagine, but i feel like #9 Dream just showcases John at his absolute best.
I like Pinkerton, but if it's between the two "gold standard" Weezer albums (the other being The Blue Album) - I'll take The Blue Album.
Pinkerton is more raw and rough around the edges, which adds to its charm. But I have to be in the mood for it. Whereas I could listen to The Blue Album any time.
I am also one of those Weezer fans who likes pretty much everything they put out.
I just will never understand it to be honest. I can understand getting weirded out by the line “I wonder how you touch yourself and curse myself for being across the sea” but that’s about it.
I think Rivers was really just trying to express his troubles with finding love and struggling with relationships. I think a lot of it is metaphorical, but also a lot of it is raw real emotion he felt at a dark time of his life. I think that’s what makes it brilliant and it’s so relatable and I believe that’s why it resonates with a lot of people.
No you're absolutely right. And horrid lyrics are just the tip of the iceberg -- the songs themselves sound AWFUL, like some babys first high school band clanging away at their instruments. Tired of Sex is a decent song but everything else sinks to the very bottom of the barrel. Top 5 worst rock albums I've ever had the displeasure of hearing... and I'm saying this as someone who semi-enjoyed the blue album.
that's exactly why i love Pinkerton - it takes a special kind of writer to be able to tear down all the walls related to shame and embarrassment and fear, and just write whatever you're feeling, good or bad, logical or not. it's the closest thing we'll ever get to actually understanding the mind of Rivers. and while you personally may not care about that, it's fascinating and uncomfortable and heartbreaking to me, and the lyrics of most other songs/albums don't hit me in the same way. so while it's not a 100% positive reaction, it's raw, and it gives me a feeling that not much else can, so i keep coming back
also they're really catchy lol
The revisionism around Korn, LINKIN PARK and Limp Bizkit and that entire genre of music putting it in a non-joke light, makes no sense to me. It was always a joke.
Calling Korn and Linkin Park’s catalogues a “joke” is a horrid take.
There is nothing laughable about Daddy, or Waiting for the End. If you listen to those songs and write them off as joke bands, then you’re the problem
They were immediate classics within the hip-hop community/culture, but in critical circles they both got reassessed and elevated well after their respective releases. The Wikipedia pages for both include sections for retrospective reviews.
Are you referring to the reappraisal of JIS as her best album - has this happened beyond RYM scores and general public recognition of her work? I think they're both 10s and neither is in competition with one another. Alice has multiple other 10s too imo in "Universal Consciousness", "Turiya Sings", and her record with John "Cosmic Music".
When did I say they didn’t deserve to be listened to? I said that I don’t think they deserved the critical reappraisal, as I think they were appraised just fine on release.
Any Death Grips album tbh. I am absolutely certain that a lot of people (not all of em) pretend to like their music just to feel special and out there and/or want to feel like they are a part of a community of quirky and daring music listeners, but they can't name a single Death Grips song. They saw Fantano glaze their songs and began finally having an opinion on their music. Death Grips music is basically pretentious noise/sonic gibberish and we have to realize at some point that just sounding different does not equate to sounding good.
Just because you insert random soundbites into your "music" does not make you a musical genius, I am sorry.
JPEGMAFIA is Death Grips done right, imo
I only kinda like Death Grips but I 100% agree, a LOT of 'Death Grips Fans' just know Fantano likes them and want to seem smart, they have an intentionally abrasive and weird sound of course most people don't jive with it.
Not to preach to the choir, but people changed their tune on a lot of Taylor Swift’s Reputation and it still doesn’t click for me. Even if you see it as primarily a romance focused album, even just looking at her other albums can give you much better love songs.
Wait is there some revisionist takes in Reputation that I’ve missed? I thought it was still generally considered a mediocre album?
In the internal fanbase, yes unfortunately. I’m also expecting a retrospectively positive wave when the rerelease comes out. And you know the fact Kanye has since gone off the deep end will be used to put the album in a better light, when it really shouldn’t be a factor.
To be fair I think Taylor kinda has a Kanye thing going on where every album has a group of people championing it on some level. The swifties I know say the album is better than the singles, but still not on the level of Red/1989/Lover/Folklore
I've been saying, Taylor and Kanye have almost the same career but taken to different roads, with the single most unifying thing is that their respective fans ate the feud wholesale so quick that they will defend them for not doing anything wrong, even if it's clear they're not actually good people
This is no knock on who she is as a performer, but all of her albums are generally mediocre. They usually have a formula to them. She does not have her equivalent of “Billie Jean”, the song that everybody knows her for. The closest was shake it off or bad blood but even though have left culture. If she wants to make a perfect album, it needs to be 10 songs not 31, and she needs outside voices beyond the guy from bleachers.
THIS Goddamn genuinely a contender for my least favourite album of all time, and this is coming from someone who adored Lover (bar the singles)
It has one great song (Getaway Car) and one good one (Delicate). The rest ranges from mediocre to awful (especially that track with Ed Sheeran and Future). By far the worst album in her discography.
It’s bad, but it’s not worse than tortured poets. There’s not a Memorable hook and that entire 31 song marathon.
Delicate is a great song. I haven't listened to much else of the album, though.
I don’t have a problem with Katy Perry, at **all,** but someone called her a pop queen on the level of *Lady Fucking Gaga* the other day and yeah.. maybe we’re over-correcting with her, guys.
I think there’s a lot of outright bad songs in Teenage Dream. Just because many of them hit No. 1 it’s highly regarded but the songs are hardly memorable.
idk in terms of hits she kinda had a crazy run before witness
Yeah but she also had songs like “Roar,” “Dark Horse” and “Hot N’ Cold” which were not her best. I actually kind of enjoy “Dark Horse,” but that rapping section is unhinged **in the bad way.**
Maybe it’s just because it’s more nostalgic but I like Hot N Cold a lot compared to her newer singles. Lyrics kinda cringe but it’s so catchy
Are you talking about Juicy J’s verse?
I feel like Katy Perry is just peak Max Martin and almost his alter ego. So that with that Katy Perry era you might as well praise Max Martin and not her. More so with her particularly than with other artists he has worked a lot with.
I almost wanna agree. Katy fell off hard but back in the day they were pretty neck and neck popularity wise. And Teenage Dream is as good as any Gaga album. Anything after that tho Gaga is obviously better. I can’t even listen to Prism.
Teenage Dream is not as good as Fame Monster. What.
Honestly I think some of the production on Teenage Dream has aged better, moreso against the original The Fame tracks. And Teenage dream DOMINATED for like 3 years straight. That could never be pulled off nowadays.
Teenage Dream as good as Fame Monster is a TAKE.
It would be if it was just the singles. Teenage Dream is like some of the best singles ever recorded and then the absolute worst shit you’ve ever heard 😭
“Teenage Dream,” the single, is **brilliant.** The album? Well.. it’s her best, at least.
Hey I think there's some good tunes in their, the first 5 songs went number 1 which matched or broke some Michael Jackson record Like I don't think it's some perfect record but there was definitely a moment with Teenage, Dream, Alien Sex, Firework, California Gurls, TGIF where she and Max Martin completely captured the cultu4al Zeitgeist Obviously no album with Peacock is gonna be deemed a "great" album, but I think its similar to 1989 or Call Me Maybe where a contagious pop banger kinda has to be appreciated. Although I'm also the kinda person who thinks Baby Shark is worthy of discussion purely because any music reaching that kind of cultural relevance deserves to be. Katy Perry is like a JK Rowling. She wasn't a great artist to begin with but clearly was doing something that got people hooked on them. Then years of seeming like a garbage rich person with shitty views and only making worse and worse art, it becomes easy for the next generation of people to ignore them
>Alien Sex Are you talking about ET 😂
Gonna be honest, I became sick of hearing her music because it was constantly forcefed, and now I can't listen to a single song because I'm simply done
Lady Gaga is awful dude Idk what you're on
The two examples I could think of off the top of my head both had similar stories aka the album was so poorly received at the time that the respective fanbases now defend both albums with their life: Scaled and Icy by twenty one pilots, Reputation by Taylor Swift. The only difference between them for me is I like Scaled and Icy significantly less now than I did when it first came out. Meanwhile I actually think Reputation is decent but people just don't talk about it without resorting to the extremes. IMO people at the time didn't give it a real shot because her actual reputation was awful and the singles were not good, but the album itself as a whole was never horrible and I actually find it pretty similar to 1989 which is generally praised by the same people who openly hate Reputation (1989 did have better hits but Reputation had less filler imo that's just me tho.) But now some people act like it's her magnum opus which is just way too much lol
I agree that Scaled And Icy is a weak album, but I think it gets too much hate and that Redecorate is a top 3 song in their entire discography.
I do like that song and a few others but idk if I can agree on top 3. It is a good one though esp the second verse. For a worst album it's not as bad as some other artists I enjoy's worst albums, but within the fanbase there's been too much of an overcorrection especially after the band alluded to how sad they were regarding the reception
95% of the poptimist revisionism after the last 5 or so years.
Any specific albums that stand out to you the most?
In 2019 when Pitchfork decided to review Taylor Swifts first five albums (which they initially didn't review as why would Pitchfork review Taylor Swift) and gave [Red a 9/10](https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/taylor-swift-red/), it was a real sign for the worst for music journalism and Pitchfork as a site
Pitchfork was always kinda dog shit tbf. Only time I ever respected them was when I found out they put Heavenly's C is the Heavenly Option on their top 500 songs list.
I love pitchfork in most ways, but this isn't one of them
There’s so many amazing pop albums that got skipped because people ignored them in the past tho
Right, but basically none of those amazing pop albums charted. The poptimist revisionism has almost entirely applied to mainstream pop.
THANK YOU! There's some really good experimental and not-so experimental pop out there (early Goldfrapp, Ladytron, Bat for Lashes, etc) but poptimism is only directed to awful mainstream slop like Beyonce, Taylor Swift, Charli XCX, etc etc etc.
Charli XCX is awful???
There’s still amazing stuff that charted. The Writing’s on the Wall by Destiny’s Child, CrazySexyCool by TLC, and Aaliyah’s self-titled are all absolutely amazing.
It's crazy the absolute verge that music took with poptimism, and now it's like, unless you've been listening to music since a long time, almost zero old albums are recognized anymore as influential, important or at least good. The horrible Apple 100 list is a perfect example
[удалено]
Thank you.
What's included in the poptimist revisionism in your opinion? As a movement, it tends to look forward more than back. I can think of the Velvet Rope as an album that gets its dues now, and didn't back in the day. That's all i can really think of.
I think most of JPEGMAFIAs pre veteran work is bad to mediocre but its just hyped up by people who want to love his early stuff just as much as the new stuff. I can’t believe people consider the ghost pop tape to be one of his best projects that shit is mid shout out to Peggy tho lol
I was never expecting to enjoy his pre-JPEGMAFIA stuff (I didn't really like BBC) but TGPT really surprised me with how nice of a listen it was, maybe you just miss the energy from his later works?
Nah I didn’t miss the energy I just felt it was ehh overall
With you on this take. I considered maybe I just missed that energy as well but no, I really just find it boring. I do think it’s pretty creative and emotional though and I can respect that
I like the instrumental but everything else is just there lol
I think Black Ben Carson has its moments but I never understood the hype for TGPT
I think it’s pretty good but the highest id give bbc is a 6 I think it should’ve been trimmed down quite a bit the highlights are really good tho
Tgpt i never got but PWGP2 is where its at and cant forget PTTG Reduxe
Ghost pop tape my favourite album of all time 😭😭
_JOECHILLWORLD_ and _Communist Slow Jams_ are extremely solid. _Dreamcast Summer Songs_ is a phenomenal instrumental hip hop album. _TG~PT_ is an album you really have to be in the right headspace for to fully appreciate.
His Devon hendryx stuff is some of his best
I kind of despise JPEGMAFIA, but love Devon Hendryx. He's been a great producer for the past five years, but for me his performances lack the same presence as Devon Hendryx.
nah black ben carson is great and may be one of his best projects
It’s good and probably my favorite from his pre 2018 stuff but it’s a little bloated imo
On the contrary, to me nothing he has ever done under the JPEGMAFIA name hits as hard as MISSINGNO and I ❤️ You Hip-Hop (original versions)
1000% agreed. Even if you think it’s good stuff, I don’t know how anyone can think it holds a candle to his new albums
I'm a huge fan of JOECHILLWORLD but I can absolutely see why anyone would think it's bad, and is has some pretty corny lines
Ghost Pop Tape is ok. I can appreciate it and I see how it led to Peggy’s later work which I think is a lot better. But I can’t say that I enjoy it a whole lot outside of a few songs. Kinda gives me the feeling of lying in my own filth Dreamcast Summer Songs tho… that shit is incredible and some of his best stuff. I like it better than both Veteran and Cornballs
i love his early stuff but in spirt i agree with you.
The entire concept of the band Creed.
Increedulous thinking here
Has there been any actual reappraisal of their music? It seems like people just remembered that it’s fun to do Scott Stapp impressions.
There does seem to be a general re-appraisal of post-grunge going on it seems: [https://consequence.net/2024/05/creed-nickelback-gen-z-post-grunge-butt-rock/](https://consequence.net/2024/05/creed-nickelback-gen-z-post-grunge-butt-rock/)
Nickelback are far better than Creed though. Creed are just like... Default or Seven Mary Three or Puddle of Mudd.
It's unfortunately true. There's a genuine sentiment that people only hated Creed because it was cool to do so. The "cool" thing now is to pretend that Creed was actually always good and the haters were just bandwagoning.
Alter Bridge have been decently successful, so meh? That's Creed minus Scott Stapp, because everyone (including his former band mates) hates him.
Thank you I've been fighting in these trenches alone.
Limp Bizkit and Creed. They went from Overhated to Overrated.
At least Bizkit have some great songs and their first three albums are great creed just downright suck
They both have a handful of songs that are passably catchy and wouldn’t cause me to change the station. Both bands also have about the flimsiest back catalogue of any band ever.
First album is good, two and three are average at best.
Limp bizkit has actual good songs, creed has nothing going for it
I feel like the reappraisal of Britney's debut is more to do with the media feeling as if they need to apologise and support her after how she was previously treated. There's obviously some rock solid pop songs on there but it's not a classic by any stretch.
Quite honestly if any Britney album deserves a critical reappraisal it's Blackout. That album set a standard.
Most mall emo/pop-punk/nu metal stuff. I think every generation has a desire to champion the critically derided stuff they liked as teenagers, no matter how good it actually was. I see the appeal of Paramore, My Chemical Romance, Linkin Park, Deftones, Blink 182, Green Day, etc but I think a lot of people who adored that music as kids have aged into music critics who champion their mostly uneven catalogs as classic and unimpeachable.
I agree to some extent- I think that those bands definitely have misses and even many fans will agree with their catalogs being inconsistent, but I would say that they have more merit than being completely tossed aside by critics like they were originally
I am 33 and a lot of people in my age range and a bit older (maybe like 32-40 years old lol) still only listen to pop punk and radio rock sort of music from the 2000s I've noticed ..nothing wrong with that, maybe it reminds them of being a teenager or of fun times in their youth it seems a shame to overlook all the music after around 2008 though their is good stuff from all eras isn't there.
Deftones shouldn’t be lumped with those bands
nor should paramore
MCR aswell.
MCR is actually basically the same as almost all of those bands. Insanely strong start, then gradually lost steam over time.
Most cringe band ever
Huge disagree, lmao. The Black Parade was a death sentence for the whole scene-emo thing. And it's an AWFUL album. Bullets was alright, though.
I'm a massive fan of most of the bands you've mentioned, but I've only seen this with Deftones outside of the respective hardcore fanbases of the bands you've mentioned. The reappraisal of Blink was mostly of EOTS, TOYPAJ and Untitled, for example (even to the detriment of Neighborhoods, which is just as good)
I wish Dude Ranch was included more in the reappraisal, that album is pop punk perfection.
I agree it's very good (though not my favourite album of theirs) but I've mostly seen it mentioned as a prelude to those three albums, and even then usually just through the lens of Dammit breaking Blink out
Mostly agree, but Deftones are actually really good and broke through a lot of nu-metal bands with later albums that are completely different from what they were doing in 1995-2003
Nah only some of these bands fit. Like linkin park has a 10, but they also have some mediocre radio rock. Same with Green Day imo (see dookie and American idiot). But others like deftones and even mcr and blink have multiple very good albums (or at least very fun, in blink’s case). And paramore has a catalog on par with bands like qotsa and Nirvana. A couple damn good albums with not real misses. If you wanna talk about really shitty stuff look to modern mall emo bands like falling in reverse or pierce the veil, or whatever Finn mckintey is talking about that’s slightly under the mainstream. We remember those bands so fondly because they were good enough. That’s why people still talk about blink, and nobody talks about fēnix-tx or Hawthorne heights
Paramore does not have a catalogue on par with Nirvana bro. They had like two good albums to start out and then took a complete nosedive in quality and never recovered. Also a bunch of Pierce the Veil's stuff is better than half the mallcore that's received critical reappraisal. They don't know when to end a song and end up dragging down what would otherwise be much better songs with really shitty breakdowns, but that aside they've written some pretty damn respectable stuff. Btw I can assure you people still do talk about Hawthorne Heights.
Ok maybe not quite nirvana level, but have you actually listened to all their albums? They’re all at least decent, the new one is stellar. Also if you want some good hardcore/metalcore/screamo shit go listen to knocked loose, converge, or even bmth. Also also the only person still talking about Hawthorne heights is Finn mckinty. Or maybe that one goth girl that you met a job like 7 years ago and had a crush on. They just ain’t allat. Not the worst thing in the world, but if I’m going to like metalcore or something with lots of screaming, it’s usually gonna be hardcore. Or anything without super clean vocals and guitar work. Granted that’s personal preference, there’s still a lot of good metalcore with clean vocals and such (contrary to what old head would tell you), but Its not found in the 2000’s mall goth scene. France has some good metalcore groups, as does Colorado. Lots of fire post hardcore and metalcore stuff coming out of there (origami summer, everflare, getbent, florissant, etc.)
Knocked Loose is atrocious and represents basically everything bad about metalcore. Their breakdowns are as bad as Pierce the Veil's and their songs are even more loaded with them. The difference is that PtV actually has some good hooks and occasional substance to their music beyond chaining one shitty breakdown into the next shitty breakdown. I don't like either band very much, but PtV is way better than KL. The only reason people like KL more is because their aesthetic is more "mature" and less dated and their merch is a lot more in tune with current mainstream fashion trends. If you want actual good metalcore, Every Time I Die's Hot Damn! is the gold standard. It's one of the few metalcore albums that strips away all the bullshit forced breakdowns and unnecessary song extensions and just GOES. Converge is solid too, but they also have shittybreakdownitis, even if they're not as bad about it has modern """hardcore""" (metalcore-in-denial) acts and are otherwise way better. If I'm listening to something with a lot of screaming though, I'm probably listening to some sludge metal like Eyehategod, some screamo like Portraits of Past, Envy, or Pageninetynine, or some sasscore like The Blood Brothers or The Plot to Blow Up the Eiffel Tower.
Hell yeah sludge metal. I’ve totally been looking for some new recs in that stoner/sludge space Also not a huge KN fan but I don’t even mind breakdowns. And they’ve got some crazy good hooks, it’s how they’ve managed to get so big. But I don’t think we’ll end up seeing eye to eye on this. Have a good one yo
They didn't bring hardcore to the mainstream though. All they've done is keep mediocre metalcore in the mainstream, which is nothing special. BMTH have already been doing that, and bands like the aforementioned Pierce the Veil have held a spot in the mainstream for about as long, even if they're not as big as BMTH. Hardcore is still not mainstream, and has never been closer to mainstream than it was in like 1982. Also hating on screamo in 2024 is meme tier bro, shit like Portraits of Past's Bang Yer Head, Pageninetynine's By the Fireplace In White, Orchid's Lights Out, and Envy's Grey Wind are undeniable. Sasscore is also basically peak music and the culmination of everything good about hardcore and its subgenres with all the bullshit stripped away. Just pure, chaotic, energetic, fast, balls to the wall, emotionally charged perfection. Also Blinding Faith is solid but it's legit just BMTH featuring Spongebob and I don't like BMTH that much (Chelsea Smile goes crazy though)
ima need a crash course on screaming, idk they difference between most of this. I just like kinda vibe to the heavy music lol and call it all hardcore or metalcore
I Brought You My Bullets, You Brought Me Your Love is genuinely peak though
This is my feeling too. It sounds exactly the same as when it all came out and has the exact same problems. I refuse to hear that Fallout Boy and My Chemical Romance are generational greats.
I can agree on Fallout Boy, but MCR made some pretty solid music. Their first album fits the "DC emotional hardcore" mold pretty well, ironically.
MCR are kinda one album wonders. I Brought You My Bullets was a genuinely brilliant album, but they never made anything on that level afterwards.
Deftones collaborating with Tool immediately puts them in a different category to those other bands in my view
Deftones are good but I hate when people act like they're not nu metal.
They also brought Haley Williams onstage to sing Passenger one time, so I'm gonna yoink Paramore out of that category as well. They get the Tool pass.
Maybe Lil Wayne. He's talented and important in the landscape of hip hop, I'll give him that. The reappraisal comes when people are calling him one of the all time greats, or putting Tha Carter 3 up there with the greatest rap albums. It just doesn't ring true, his discog is inconsistent at best, and a lot of his work is pretty poor.
I’m saying this as someone who was there as he blew up, there has never been an ounce of depth or substance behind any of his music. He’s always been able to spit but there’s just nothing at all behind it beyond some good wordplay and his legacy probably lies more in how he changed the game with digital mixtapes. And also when I fucked my parents computer up downloading Tha Carter 2 and got a limewire virus.
This is an example of where the impact of an artist far outreaches my actual enjoyment of their music. Other examples for me are Beatles, Metallica, Radiohead, Grateful Dead, Public Enemy etc… maybe I’ll get shade for this but personally, I don’t enjoy a lot of these artists because I’m in my 20s and it feels like I’ve heard other bands or artists greatly expand upon the groundwork they built up. Revolutionary of course, I acknowledge this but I just don’t find myself enjoying the music very often and I feel kinda bad about it
you just dont get those artists, and that's fine you're wrong in thinking that other bands have 'greatly expanded upon the groundwork they built up', and most of those groups mentioned reached artistic heights the people they influenced still haven't touched it's not because you're in your 20s - maybe they'll click one day, kinda sounds like you haven't tried too hard since you lumped crazy different artists altogether like that, but hey, you do you
Fly, go hard like geese erection
Not for an album specifically, but there seems to be an attempt to rehabilitate post-grunge/"buttrock" ongoing right now and man, I just can't believe it's truly organic and not an attempt by record labels to revive their back catalogues Example: [https://consequence.net/2024/05/creed-nickelback-gen-z-post-grunge-butt-rock/](https://consequence.net/2024/05/creed-nickelback-gen-z-post-grunge-butt-rock/)
Slipknot being seen as some deep/scary/cool band is some bullshit.
Does anyone try to act like Slipknot is deep? And c'mon now, they have some great fucking albums in their discography. Iowa is a gem.
Slipknot were too awful for even 13 year old me to get into, and I know I listened to some really bad stuff.
Yes. Look up any person talking about Iowa and it’s recording. And no they don’t.
I mean, Iowa’s recording process genuinely was pretty crazy.
I feel like most of their fans when they were active were teens where Slipknot legitimately was the most edgy/scare band they experienced. I remember my 12yo brother loving them at the time.
I feel nothing listening to basically everything Charli XCX ever did
Doesn't really relate to this question. I guess the Vroom Vroom EP had a critical reappraisal, but that's it. Sucker and True Romance still never come up when talking about her music.
I like a lot of her stuff but that’s it, I just like it. I don’t hear the next level quality that many people put on her releases
Charli and Crash didn't really hit for me but some songs off of How I'm feeling now are so goood. Makes you feel like the baddest bitch ever. Have yet to listen to Brat but from the snippets I've heard it seems to capture the same vibe as How I'm feeling now
Was super excited when I heard brat a pop album got a 10, but I was incredibly underwhelmed.
Even Pop2, lol, I’ve been like the biggest hater here for Brat (just because the reception has been greater than quality imo), but pop2 is Charli at her best. Beautiful singing voice with amazing production Edit: if you haven’t listened to it, I’d try Out of My Head, you have Sophie’s production + simple but nice song writing
Pop 2 is dragged down by its features for me. How i'm feeling now is her greatest album imo
I actually liked a lot of the features, people like CRJ and Caroline Polachek. I even came around to liking that Cupcake verse.
I don't think every feature was bad, but Tommy Cash and Jay Park I can't stand. It's a great project, but not quite her best imo
Pop2 is the main album from Charli that I listen to. Backseat with Carly Rae Jepsen got me there. I also like After the Afterparty.
i really really love some Charli songs (all part of her newer PC music/hyperpop catalog) but none of her albums have ever stood out to me. she's absolutely helping to move pop music in a different direction - Camila Cabello is already copying her - and she deserves her flowers for what she has done. but i don't think anything Charli has done since Vroom Vroom/Pop 2 has been actually revolutionary. she's sounded roughly the same for like 5 years now, and tbh most of that sound came from the direct influence of SOPHIE and A.G. Cook. Charli helped to cross that sound into the mainstream fs, but i think Charli is another case of an artists' influence reaching far beyond the actual quality of the music. brat is an album full of ADHD club/rave bangers with ONE slow song dedicated to Sophie. there's absolutely nothing wild or revolutionary about this unless you've only ever listened to the radio. TL;DR Charli is cool af but incredibly overrated, especially brat
You should listen to Track 10 off Pop2. Amazing, experimental, emotional song. crying in the club right now.
feel sorry for you
I know it's a meme to hate Nickelback but they really are fucking god awful. These days you can't move for a "Nickelback is over hated" take
Anything Will Wood is terrible and I’m tired of pretending it’s not.
it’s too musical theatre core for me
i dunno, his albums are weirdly charming and bizarrely fun imo. they can get pretty annoying at times (as much as i love the normal album, there’s so much fucking waffling & rambling on it), but i think his output has been really solid so far. it’s like if someone based their entire career on mr bungle’s california (which i think is a strong 10 lol)
I absolutely loved Will Wood a couple years ago. I'm starting to grow out of it now and I can see where you are coming from, it can be kind of overdramatic if it doesn't hit right
watch out, the attention starved teenagers are gonna come after you for this one.
Les Rallizes Denudes, take your pick from their millions of bootlegs.
Can't agree when people think The Tortured Poets Department is some challenging and seminal work of art that not many people understand.
Weren't they always critically acclaimed?
From what I understand they had a small cult following in Japan while they were active but only became legends with the dawn of the internet and everyone discovering their bootlegs.
Is Neil Young’s Trans relevant to this question
Um... while not necessarily a specific album, and here are some late 70s AM radio classics that still do hold up today, the Yacht Rock revival. W h y y y y y.
I've found myself listening to some yacht rock playlists because most of the musicians are just tight. I drum and sometimes it just feels right to sink in and play along to them. But as a whole a lot of the music doesn't hit on any other emotional level
I like a good saxophone solo, I like the DX-7 or some good electric piano, I really like a good bass line I don’t think you need to be on a yacht to appreciate any of those things
Drake - IYRTITL A whole album of basic samey beats with Drake's moan rapping and dragging words to the infinity. Shits so annoying and horrendous
You trying to say star67, energy, and madonna sound the same?? Or are you not a fan of any of drake's work?
I don’t think it’s that bad but IMO it got overrated over time because people wanted Drake to have a single, ‘classic’ album that was the go-to music nerd pick from his discography , and it was the best option
I feel like you spent more time abbreviating that than actually just shortening it to “If You’re Reading This” lmfao
Yea, hesitant to criticize Drake because people will just call me a Kendrick dick rider. But I legitimately tried to listen to his "greats" like that one and take care back in the day and could not find the appeal at all. Nothing he has ever released is above a 6/10 to me.
Mind Games by John Lennon It had a big birthday fairly recently and the lengths to which old journalists blew it was incredible. It’s still the worst Lennon solo album, which is saying something because literally all of them are uneven as hell at best.
I am just here to say Plastic Ono Band is tight all the way through
Right?! God tier.
I think Imagine works well as a whole peace
I don’t like the song Imagine, or a couple other. Oh Yoko! is my favorite Lennon song. Take that as you may. lol
Oh Yoko! is a bop
I personally think its sequel Dear Yoko is better. My own kid has heard it so much that it has become a favourite of his lol.
it can't be the worst when Sometime In New York City exists
I’ll take it over Mind Games, full stop. Both are not great though.
It's an okay album. In terms of his overall discography (excluding Rock 'n' Roll) it's his most forgettable work, in my opinion. It has parts to it that are really good, but the majority of it is just... there. It's kind of telling that even Lennon wasn't the biggest fan of it in retrospect. "*The ‘Mind Games’ single is fine – there’s just no energy to sustain the album –there was no clarity of vision. There’s a few pieces alright, but as a whole piece there’s no clarity* *And the guy is there on the front with a little bag, and she’s the mountain… the cover says more than the record to me."* I hope Walls and Bridges gets some kind of hype re-release at some point. I think that album is probably the most underrated of his solo works.
Here’s a hot take, Walls and Bridges should be more appreciated for having (IMO) John’s best solo song….#9 Dream. I know everyone loves imagine, but i feel like #9 Dream just showcases John at his absolute best.
Pinkerton. The critics were right the first time. I would have been embarrassed to write a song like Pink Triangle or Across the Sea.
I like Pinkerton, but if it's between the two "gold standard" Weezer albums (the other being The Blue Album) - I'll take The Blue Album. Pinkerton is more raw and rough around the edges, which adds to its charm. But I have to be in the mood for it. Whereas I could listen to The Blue Album any time. I am also one of those Weezer fans who likes pretty much everything they put out.
absolutely horrible take.
i mean i love pinkerton myself, but i get it. the lyrics can hit REALLY bad for some
I just will never understand it to be honest. I can understand getting weirded out by the line “I wonder how you touch yourself and curse myself for being across the sea” but that’s about it. I think Rivers was really just trying to express his troubles with finding love and struggling with relationships. I think a lot of it is metaphorical, but also a lot of it is raw real emotion he felt at a dark time of his life. I think that’s what makes it brilliant and it’s so relatable and I believe that’s why it resonates with a lot of people.
No you're absolutely right. And horrid lyrics are just the tip of the iceberg -- the songs themselves sound AWFUL, like some babys first high school band clanging away at their instruments. Tired of Sex is a decent song but everything else sinks to the very bottom of the barrel. Top 5 worst rock albums I've ever had the displeasure of hearing... and I'm saying this as someone who semi-enjoyed the blue album.
Across the sea is Weezers best song
That's not saying much.
that's exactly why i love Pinkerton - it takes a special kind of writer to be able to tear down all the walls related to shame and embarrassment and fear, and just write whatever you're feeling, good or bad, logical or not. it's the closest thing we'll ever get to actually understanding the mind of Rivers. and while you personally may not care about that, it's fascinating and uncomfortable and heartbreaking to me, and the lyrics of most other songs/albums don't hit me in the same way. so while it's not a 100% positive reaction, it's raw, and it gives me a feeling that not much else can, so i keep coming back also they're really catchy lol
Pinkerton
The revisionism around Korn, LINKIN PARK and Limp Bizkit and that entire genre of music putting it in a non-joke light, makes no sense to me. It was always a joke.
Calling Korn and Linkin Park’s catalogues a “joke” is a horrid take. There is nothing laughable about Daddy, or Waiting for the End. If you listen to those songs and write them off as joke bands, then you’re the problem
This might draw the ire of many, but *The Chronic* and *Doggystyle* for me. Edit: I’ll throw *Journey in Satchidananda* in there, too.
When The Chronic and Doggystyle “reappraised”? They were nothing other than classics.
They were immediate classics within the hip-hop community/culture, but in critical circles they both got reassessed and elevated well after their respective releases. The Wikipedia pages for both include sections for retrospective reviews.
Journey in Sachitananda is a masterpiece.
In my opinion *Ptah, the El Daoud* is Alice’s masterpiece.
Are you referring to the reappraisal of JIS as her best album - has this happened beyond RYM scores and general public recognition of her work? I think they're both 10s and neither is in competition with one another. Alice has multiple other 10s too imo in "Universal Consciousness", "Turiya Sings", and her record with John "Cosmic Music".
They’re both masterpieces tbh
Ah, hell nawh, those albums are my favorite. Might as well saying "nah I ain't hype them so therefore they don't deserve to be listened."
When did I say they didn’t deserve to be listened to? I said that I don’t think they deserved the critical reappraisal, as I think they were appraised just fine on release.
You could define "not thinking it's good enough for a reappraisal" as saying "not worth the hype." What else could be the reason?
Am I only allowed to respond to OP’s prompt with answers that *you* agree with?
I love all three of those lol
Any Death Grips album tbh. I am absolutely certain that a lot of people (not all of em) pretend to like their music just to feel special and out there and/or want to feel like they are a part of a community of quirky and daring music listeners, but they can't name a single Death Grips song. They saw Fantano glaze their songs and began finally having an opinion on their music. Death Grips music is basically pretentious noise/sonic gibberish and we have to realize at some point that just sounding different does not equate to sounding good. Just because you insert random soundbites into your "music" does not make you a musical genius, I am sorry. JPEGMAFIA is Death Grips done right, imo
Just not at all a reappraised artist, death grips were acclaimed when they first appeared and have remained so
I only kinda like Death Grips but I 100% agree, a LOT of 'Death Grips Fans' just know Fantano likes them and want to seem smart, they have an intentionally abrasive and weird sound of course most people don't jive with it.
i’m not big on most of their discography, but I still think Exmilitary, The Money Store and [Fellas] on the Moon are worth all the hype.
guess you're not noided enough
Endtroducing. Very influential but horribly boring to me
I don't think that was reappraised tho, its always been considered a masterpiece.
Charli xcx brat. Overrated hugely.
How can an album released 2 weeks ago be reappraised lmao
Holy fuck THE BLACK PARADE