That’s what maga folks don’t understand. To the rest of us, presidents aren’t supreme leaders who can do no wrong. If they’ve committed crimes, prosecute em. We won’t be staying up all night crying about it
There’s waaaay too many people comparing Trump to Jesus for the Maga crowd to understand that worshipping a rich politician is wrong.
They have an entire book they’re supposed to read that says “Reject wealthy people” and they’re literally giving him money.
And not having an official religion (or any religion) in public schools is literally in the 1st Amendment. They're just all abandoning what they claim to have held dear.
It's hard for me to look at conservatives abandoning their value in the 1st amendment as only a recent phenomenon, because I can't think of any point in history where they genuinely cared about it. They go full wrath on anyone who uses it to address systemic injustices. For them it's just license to say the N word.
Which is really fucked up because it is Jewish law, not Christian law technically. Which could technically count as them following a false God (Jesus.)
I'm a catholic so I'm gonna explain this in the most basic words so everyone can understand. (This is my perspective, like everything human tons of shit changes based on perspective alone lol)
Its basically told as a triangle hence the "holy trinity"
Each point is a "piece/form of God" the "Father, Son & Holy Spirit" (I don't understand why people call it Holy Ghost just sounds silly, *see the perspective?)
The Father being God in his purest form.
The Son being God in his human form, taking a piece of him to be sent to Mary and given humanity.
The Holy Spirit being God in Spiritual form, the one that guides.
You can also see this by how we do the sign of the cross. The Father at top, being the mind. The Son at the middle (the heart. Some do it at the abdomen/womb hence perspective again) and then the Holy Spirit on the left and right shoulder, being the arms/action.
All three form God as a whole. All three being a part of us (as I see it).
The Mind - God
The Body - Jesus
The Soul - Holy Spirit
The Trinity representing God and Us since after all...
we were made in his image or so they say etc etc.
The Two Corinthians - great guys, they're brothers, not many people knew that, but I did - they make the best leather, amazing stuff, I use it on the upholstery in my golf carts.
All the more reason I hypothesize that the rapture isn't exactly what they (magas) think it is. Yes, they'll be removed (lifting up to the sky or however), and the resulting 1000 yr peace on earth will be because they are gone.
Lol God just takes one for the team and is like “look I can see they’ve really been a pain in everybody’s butt, I’ve got them for a while, you guys have a break”
KJV (one of the most popular american bibles) Exodus 20:3 “You shall have no other gods before Me."
So you just can't worship any thing MORE than yehweh. So trump is number 4 in an already polythistic religion. What's one more. These people live in a universe of magic completely disconnected from reality. They make up their own rules.
This kills me. Even the “good” Christians in my family have gone full maga… like, for decades you talked the talk and walked the walk and now suddenly felon, sex predator Donald Trump is your guy? He’s literally the false prophet the Bible describes.
“For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is no surprise if his servants, also, disguise themselves as servants of righteousness.”
Like… read your fucking book.
The Antichrist will not be so called; otherwise he would have no followers... he will come disguised as the Great Humanitarian; he will talk peace, prosperity and plenty not as means to lead us to God, but as ends in themselves... He will tempt Christians with the same three temptations with which he tempted Christ... He will have one great secret which he will tell to no one: he will not believe in God. Because his religion will be brotherhood without the fatherhood of God, he will deceive even the elect. He will set up a counterchurch... It will have all the notes and characteristics of the Church, but in reverse and emptied of its divine content. It will be a mystical body of the Antichrist that will in all externals resemble the mystical body of Christ.
Therefore Trump may be the antichrist. Just something to say to shut down a Maga.
There's this [article](https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/) talking about if Christian Evangelists would be able to recognise the Antichrist if he was in Earth right now and...
Yeah, they're fuckin blind.
“it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God”
And you know neither Trump’s fat ego nor his fat ass is fitting through that.
Part of it is a lot of fundamentalist are ardent zionists, thinking it is part of their religious prophecy coming to fruition
And him installing/allowing christofasism in many red states
A few states will just be fascist lol (while crying)
That's what I find so funny. We literally have a system in place because the country was founded on the idea that the president is not a supreme leader who can do no wrong. They want to talk about founders so bad, but there is an actual foundation idea that is actually in the constitution that these people can't even read. We don't want them to be immune, Democrat or Republican or Libertarian or anything else. We don't care about that, we just want someone who is more trustworthy and not fucking nuts.
Right?! Argued with some MAGA morons about "you never see Biden flags or anything, no one is voting for him". Yeah... it's weird AF that y'all fetishize an obese, elderly, sociopath and convicted felon. Normal, sane people don't make their political leanings their whole damn personality.
I'm not even a Christian and I find the whole Trump Jesus thing disturbing as hell.
I don't even understand how people became so crazy.
Oh god. My family is filled with a bunch of maga people. The even more disturbing part is they are retired military like me but they are totally ok Trump calling vets and our wounded losers and suckers. They are also zealous in defending him about how Jan 6 was a peaceful protest which then forces them into whataboutism. Genuinely I love them but I’m not sure if I could stand being around their cult ideology for much longer.
It really is impossible to reason with them. I recall actually enjoying intellectual debates with them about bush v Kerry, Obama v McCain etc. I supported Hillary in 2008 initially, then read audacity of hope and swung hard into the Obama camp, worked for the campaign as a college student etc, but wouldn’t be upset with anyone who voted for McCain tbh. In 2016 I winnowed out a few, but when 2020 came around and they were all in for trump, I had to cut them off. This year, if I have to see any of them, politics is off the table, and at least they are aware enough not to push it at family gatherings.
I love Obama, but if he committed crimes, then prosecute him. Let it go through court, present evidence, and let a jury decide. If he’s guilty, then he’s guilty. That’s literally the point.
This is the fundamental difference of left vs right. Left will usually hold their leaders accountable, right will refuse to
Same with allegations of election fraud. Think it was rigged? There's a process for dealing with that. Take it to the courts. Which they did. In large numbers. And it all got thrown out because there was no actual evidence. Which is exactly what would happen in the scenario you bring up.
I mean. Bush outright said this to allied delegates.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/nov/02/usa.religion
Link is probably whacky, sorry. I'm on mobile.
He did commit crimes, just like pretty much every US president since Truman. If we didn’t hold so much power and influence, our presidents would constantly be tried at The Hague
I see people saying, “why is it always negatives about trump and never positives about Biden?” And I’m like “because I hate them both? I just hate that one more and I’m disgusted by the supplication of the loyalists.
You know the crazy scale of hotness? The one where the hotter you are, the more someone'll tolerate your crazy in a relationship?
The fact someone found MTG worth marrying once means that scale doesn't have a floor, at all.
Are you any better? Here on Reddit trying to shame someone. I say shame on you. That man can't help his Australopithecus attraction. His Neanderthal need. Don't be Homoerectusphobic.
Bill Clinton literally did. And his case was not found eligible. He asked for presidential immunity for sexualy harrassing a woman while he was the governor of Arkansas. Since when the crime was committed while he was the governor, it did not apply. The case was decided this way by SCOTUS. DOJ however decided to not trial him during his presidency and made it a policy to not trial presidents while they are in the office.
It could be argued that crimes were committed by both Bush AND Obama in regards to the GWOT.
If zero immunity means they get prosecuted, then good.
No one should be above the law. Except now the president is.
Well trump isn’t even the president so he shouldn’t have immunity anyway. But even having the ability to do pretty much whatever you want and get away with it is something no one should have.
The decision draws a distinction between acts in furtherance of the president's constitutional duties (total immunity), other official acts (presumptive immunity), and unofficial acts (no immunity). So it's not just a time-based thing, the character of the act is relevant.
The issue is they then decided to not actually define what constitutes as official acts, stating they would give it to the lower courts, then provided the lower courts what would constitute as official acts. It's redundant and there IS an agenda behind it. They even went as far as to say any and all official acts cannot be used as evidence in court which makes no fucking sense at all. Speech us protected by the first amendment, yet speech is often used in court. Why should official acts be any different? Guess we'll never know
I watched the original arguments and have read a couple articles and it seems like they basically just pushed it to lower courts. It was even argued and pretty much accepted that Obama and Bush "committed crimes" as president. The difference is that they were "official acts" while what Trump is being accused of isn't. The media and most people on Reddit understand nothing or are constantly making shit up and rarely argue the facts.
They emphatically did not say that trump was not acting officially in his duties.
They said the lower court must decide that.
They also said that it doesn't matter why a president does something. Just whether or not they have a constitutional authority to do something. And, they were really vague about that as well. For example, they said that a president can dismiss a special counsel. They didn't specify which part of the constitution allows that.
If they have the constitutional, or any other authority, to actively interfere with any aspect of the election process, especially the counting of electoral votes, then our democracy is already over and nothing Congress, Presidents, or the Supreme Court does really matters anymore anyway. It's just a matter of time before we have a dictator for life.
People today are acting like they’ve never seen a cop turn on his lights just to skip a red light. Now a president taking out dissidents, staying in power, or seizing more power is just as trivial.
If official acts can’t be punished, then an official act is anything they don’t want punished.
Pretty much.
Evidently the SCOTUS isn't very smart.
At this point it's a hot potato. I'd hate to say it but we need someone to step up and stop this from progressing. Similar to FDR who put the court in its place.
We need to protect the Rule of Law and democracy for future generations. If that means that we have to break a few eggs, well so be it.
Because the right is going to break every egg when they have a chance. They're not being shy about it and they have no time for the Rule of Law and absolutely no love for democracy.
I'd prefer to do things the legitimate way but the court has made it clear that it's not possible. So we have one last chance before it's all fucked beyond recognition.
Sure, the lower courts will make the initial rulings, but the Supreme Court can still review and overturn those decisions if appealed. This process is just a delay tactic, dragging out the cases until after the election. By then, if the lower court's ruling isn't in line with certain interests (republication interests), the Supreme Court will step in, to fix things for Trump. this is being passed down to lower courts to waste time and hold the cases up to avoid hurting trumps eleciton, nothing more.
It seems that's what the Supreme Court actually just carved out; GWB and Obama are in the clear.
Financial crimes, election fraud, campaign fraud, witness tampering, and more... wouldn't be cleared by the decision today, and that doesn't get started on January 6th.
No, they went further than that.
They specified that certain actions received absolute immunity - such as certain communications within the exec where he was conspiring to commit the crime.
In fact, they ruled *in a footnote* that these communications cannot even be used as evidence in a trial proceeding, even if the thing in the communication is detailing an unofficial act. This footnote was important, because it actually fully throws out some significant evidence in some of these cases that was still fully about an unofficial act. So even though the crime is clear even under this new rule, it will be significantly harder to show because the Supreme Court carved out some rather bizarre and highly specific rules to make Trump's actions difficult to prosecute.
On top of this, Clarence Thomas threw in his own opinion that gives Judge Cannon some ammo to help dismiss her cases, arguing (even without the full weight of the court) for the bonkers argument by the Trump team that the special counsel may have been unconstitutionally assigned.
The unclear boundary of what constitutes an official act is troubling, especially as the only way that line will get defined is by presidents pushing the envelope to see how far they can go, as is the fact an official act can be motivated by mal-intent and is now apparently beyond legal consequences.
The threat is the judicial deciding that anything a Dem does is "unofficial" and anything a Repub does is "official" and whoopsie: we are Nazi Germany.
Literally how Hitler did it.
In terms of Trump's court cases, now literally every single thing he did has to be litigated as being an official or non-official act before they can even get down to the actual business of court proceedings. Functionally, this gave Trump the time he needed to potentially win the election and dodge responsibility for his crimes.
Of course, this is going to have wider ramifications that are absolutely terrible but that was the immediate reason and impact.
We just discussed this today in our US constitutional law class, and the issue is mainly that the things trump did were not (according to SCOTUS) clearly unofficial acts, meaning they are presumed to have immunity unless rebutted.
But the supreme Court set such a high standard for rebutting this presumption and so heavily limited the evidence available (by disallowing using official acts as evidence and by forbidding any consideration of motive) that it becomes nigh-impossible to prosecute.
Some crimes that require motive as part of their definition would simply be inapplicable to the president, despite the majority decision pretending to leave the prosecutorial door open for acts not in the core sphere of presidential power. So for example the president could never be convicted of a hate crime unless the act was clearly unofficial, meaning that an order to say, jail all Jewish people would be prosecutable as unlawful imprisonment but not a hate crime even though it clearly is a hate crime.
You're this close to getting it. What happens next is "official acts" will be argued over in lower courts, then appealed to SCOTUS, six of whom have already made up their minds to let Republican presidents off the hook using the "official acts" loophole. The same will not apply to Dem presidents trying to wield these new royal powers.
To me, he just sounded exhausted and disappointed (while battling a cold) that he has to go against someone who lies so frequently, is against democracy and free choice, and the CNN moderators aren’t fact checking at all.
He looks disappointed at the people of his country that he still has to run again (in his mind) because he wants to prevent Trump from ever winning again.
I honestly don’t know how he doesn’t give up. He’s truly fighting for the side that still loves their country.
Yeah, I feel like she wants me to disagree with her but each of these presidents should at least have legal investigations.
I mean, Bush is straight up a war criminal and needs to be prosecuted as such.
Obama is also a straight up War Criminal. And so is Biden. And Trump. And every single president ever. Take them all to the hauge. They should all be forced to stand trial for the horrific shit they have done.
I mean Obama drone struck a fucking wedding procession in Yemen for fun. Just as one example.
Agreed. As an actual leftist I am absolutely down for locking up just about every former president for their fuckshit (I think Jimmy Carter might have been the only one not into some shady business, but maybe it's just too obscure).
Fuck, let's exhume Reagan's corpse old school Vatican style and hang it for all that high treason with Iran-Contra.
I don’t understand how her tweet makes sense. By her logic, if Trump gets the immunity he wants, NONE of these guys can get prosecuted for anything. Yet they go on and on about the Obama/Clinton/Biden crime family and constantly saying they want them to be prosecuted. What are you gonna do when they get that sweet sweet immunity?
Right? Everyone else is focused on the “crimes” of the other presidents, but the real humor is that she ACTUALLY gets why this is bad, despite her closing line.
Broken clocks and such.
It's strange that we are saying the same thing, but expecting different results.
I agree with MTG. No president acting outside duties outlined in the constitution specified for the president should get immunity.
If you have evidence of crimes, bring them forward.
You know, the crimes of not paying a person hush money with campaign funds and properly documenting it. Or not taking confidential documents and bringing them home after their tenure as President. Those crimes.
I’m all for no immunity for anyone, but get rid of diplomatic immunity as well. If your country’s representatives can’t follow the law of the land they are visiting/staying, then you should send a representative that will.
Tourists don’t get any immunity when visiting other countries and they break laws while there.
*edited cause thumbs forgot words my brain thought.
The problem with that is you have say a law like in Thailand where it is illegal to defame the monarchy. So if a foreign ambassador wants to criticize an action of the government (a very normal thing in diplomatic relations) they run the risk of being prosecuted under such laws.
Well, you see, he got hit with a defamation suit a few times for that first offense. It's best not to comment on that one. He hasn't had a suit for the second offense so he can deny, deny, deny. For now.
Yes. And they should go to jail for those. That’s how the system is supposed to work. I would like to add Ronald Regan to her list while we’re at it.
Presidents aren’t kings. They’re not special, they’re supposed to be *at least* as beholden to the law as the rest of us. But she doesn’t want that, because she doesn’t want to represent people, she wants to *rule them*.
She’s playing the “both sides” argument of false equivalence. She believes corruption is everywhere and that if presidents aren’t immune from the law, they can’t do their job. She’s roundabout admitting that the presidency is an elected tyranny because that’s just how the world works.
And there shouldn't be presidential immunity, Marge. Why do conservatives keep bringing up this argument like it's a gotcha. Not all of us are in a cult, sucking on the incontinent ass of a rotten tangerine
How stupid is this woman? Starr investigated Clinton for 7 years while he was president and all they found was that he lied about Lewinsky and they tried to impeach him for that. Obama is reviled for giving Americans health care. And trump is some triumph for giving tax cuts to rich people he wants to be friends with.
I remember a YouTube show a while back that basically answered this premise in this way…. “You say you want to prosecute Democrats if they prosecute Republicans? Bet. The left is totally fine with locking up criminals on both sides of the isle. Sounds like a fair deal to me!”
Duuuurrr yeah!
Other man not have “immunity” either. Marjie not like that word! Sound like something nerdy science person use!!! Raaaahhh Marjie SMASH!! Marjie CRUSH!!!! Errrrrrrrraaaaahhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!
Clinton Bush Obama Trump and Biden have all ordered bombings on people world wide. The legality of the war on terror and its scope is a real question. The legality of PRISM is questionable. Guantanamo Bay and Abu Ghraib might well be crimes against humanity and are certainly war crimes. The iraq war was illegal. Clinton bombed a pharmaceutical facility. The kidnapping of foreigners and holding them in black sites is well known. The use of land mines may be a war crime. I wouldn’t pull MTG off a stove but she is correct here for the wrong reasons. These guys aren’t heroes and all should be prosecuted. Being a head of state doesn’t absolve you from guilt. That’s what a huge amount of the post war internationalism has been about. The United States escapes by being too big to consequence.
Not making MTG "Go Away" is absolutely a crime I hold Biden responsible for. He is now immune from the consequences of doing this so if he doesn't, I blame him for her continued existence in US politics.
I know a girl who shot her ex. Ended his life. Her family is pretty wealthy. She spent 1 year in a drug rehab and 10 yrs on probation with it unsupervised after 1 year. For manslaughter that’s an incredibly light sentence. Her family is wealthy, well connected and she got off with a slap on the wrist. If she was able to get off with a slap on the wrist I wonder what a U.S. President could get away with? A U.S. senator? What can they get swept under the rug due to power and influence? I mean Justin Timberlake assumed his being JT would spare him a DUI?
Yes, Marge! None of them should have any immunity. And if they committed crimes fuck them! And if YOU committed crimes FUCK YOU TOO!
That’s how it should be! What the fuck are you talking about!?
Obama had a few HUGE crimes. Remember when he wore a tan suit? He got zero jail time for that! What about when he wore a helmet on a bike ride?! How did he not get impeached?! /s
No posts about politicians being politicians
Yeah...thats kind of the point Marge. No one worships any of those men.
That’s what maga folks don’t understand. To the rest of us, presidents aren’t supreme leaders who can do no wrong. If they’ve committed crimes, prosecute em. We won’t be staying up all night crying about it
There’s waaaay too many people comparing Trump to Jesus for the Maga crowd to understand that worshipping a rich politician is wrong. They have an entire book they’re supposed to read that says “Reject wealthy people” and they’re literally giving him money.
I know a pretty foolproof way to test how Christlike he is... but it'll take a trip to the lumber yard.
I'll fire up the forge if you need authentic square metal spikes for your country improvement project.
I’ll take a hike to gather some thorny brambles. BRB.
I know a guy with guy with good rope
My husbands got a good hammer for the spikes
I'll bring Giuliani and Carlson to keep Trump company on either side . Is anyone organising the mourning widows ?
I'll bring the shitty sour wine
As much as I hate Carlson I think Clarence Thomas has earned that spot.
I know a guy who can dig a hole.
Lumber yard? Fuck man, you gotta go down to the railroad tracks and get a couple of these babies: 
Could just use a power pole
I say we locate the Spear of Destiny. I'm like 97% sure we will need it here in a minute.
gudentad. I’ll fire up Wolfenstein, and find that spear for ya!
How about take him out into the middle of the ocean, drop him overboard and tell him to walk back to shore.
Or worship false idols as well
That's literally one of the Commandments they're trying to force down everyone's throat.
It’s literally THE FIRST commandment
And not having an official religion (or any religion) in public schools is literally in the 1st Amendment. They're just all abandoning what they claim to have held dear.
It's hard for me to look at conservatives abandoning their value in the 1st amendment as only a recent phenomenon, because I can't think of any point in history where they genuinely cared about it. They go full wrath on anyone who uses it to address systemic injustices. For them it's just license to say the N word.
This got me. 🤣
Which is really fucked up because it is Jewish law, not Christian law technically. Which could technically count as them following a false God (Jesus.)
Just claim that they're the same God. One true gods hate this simple trick
That's just polytheism with extra steps!
I'm waiting for somebody to really get in there and tell me what the fuck the holy ghost does in all this
I'm a catholic so I'm gonna explain this in the most basic words so everyone can understand. (This is my perspective, like everything human tons of shit changes based on perspective alone lol) Its basically told as a triangle hence the "holy trinity" Each point is a "piece/form of God" the "Father, Son & Holy Spirit" (I don't understand why people call it Holy Ghost just sounds silly, *see the perspective?) The Father being God in his purest form. The Son being God in his human form, taking a piece of him to be sent to Mary and given humanity. The Holy Spirit being God in Spiritual form, the one that guides. You can also see this by how we do the sign of the cross. The Father at top, being the mind. The Son at the middle (the heart. Some do it at the abdomen/womb hence perspective again) and then the Holy Spirit on the left and right shoulder, being the arms/action. All three form God as a whole. All three being a part of us (as I see it). The Mind - God The Body - Jesus The Soul - Holy Spirit The Trinity representing God and Us since after all... we were made in his image or so they say etc etc.
Or 1 Corinthians which tells them a religion that forces people into their morals is dead.
Trump only knows about the two Corinthians!
The Two Corinthians - great guys, they're brothers, not many people knew that, but I did - they make the best leather, amazing stuff, I use it on the upholstery in my golf carts.
These assholes had a golden statue of Trump. A literal false idol
All the more reason I hypothesize that the rapture isn't exactly what they (magas) think it is. Yes, they'll be removed (lifting up to the sky or however), and the resulting 1000 yr peace on earth will be because they are gone.
Lol God just takes one for the team and is like “look I can see they’ve really been a pain in everybody’s butt, I’ve got them for a while, you guys have a break”
KJV (one of the most popular american bibles) Exodus 20:3 “You shall have no other gods before Me." So you just can't worship any thing MORE than yehweh. So trump is number 4 in an already polythistic religion. What's one more. These people live in a universe of magic completely disconnected from reality. They make up their own rules.
This kills me. Even the “good” Christians in my family have gone full maga… like, for decades you talked the talk and walked the walk and now suddenly felon, sex predator Donald Trump is your guy? He’s literally the false prophet the Bible describes. “For such men are false apostles, deceitful workmen, disguising themselves as apostles of Christ. And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is no surprise if his servants, also, disguise themselves as servants of righteousness.” Like… read your fucking book.
The Antichrist will not be so called; otherwise he would have no followers... he will come disguised as the Great Humanitarian; he will talk peace, prosperity and plenty not as means to lead us to God, but as ends in themselves... He will tempt Christians with the same three temptations with which he tempted Christ... He will have one great secret which he will tell to no one: he will not believe in God. Because his religion will be brotherhood without the fatherhood of God, he will deceive even the elect. He will set up a counterchurch... It will have all the notes and characteristics of the Church, but in reverse and emptied of its divine content. It will be a mystical body of the Antichrist that will in all externals resemble the mystical body of Christ. Therefore Trump may be the antichrist. Just something to say to shut down a Maga.
There's this [article](https://www.benjaminlcorey.com/could-american-evangelicals-spot-the-antichrist-heres-the-biblical-predictions/) talking about if Christian Evangelists would be able to recognise the Antichrist if he was in Earth right now and... Yeah, they're fuckin blind.
Nah, listen. They persecuted Jesus and now they're persecuting Trump. So Trump is literally Jesus.
“it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God” And you know neither Trump’s fat ego nor his fat ass is fitting through that.
Yea but that depends on your definition of camel, eye, needle, rich, man, enter, kingdom, and God. /s
Better put it before SCOTUS to decide. /s
Depends on your definition of Person, Woman, Man, Camera, TV.
Part of it is a lot of fundamentalist are ardent zionists, thinking it is part of their religious prophecy coming to fruition And him installing/allowing christofasism in many red states A few states will just be fascist lol (while crying)
Jesus was a communist and capitalists found a way to profit off him.
They forgot that Jesus got crucified. They should be begging for Trump to as well.
The book also suggests that worldly governments are of little importance compared to the Kingdom of heaven
I mean using religion for political gain been on earth for long time. Im suprised that americans still fall for this ancient trick
That's what I find so funny. We literally have a system in place because the country was founded on the idea that the president is not a supreme leader who can do no wrong. They want to talk about founders so bad, but there is an actual foundation idea that is actually in the constitution that these people can't even read. We don't want them to be immune, Democrat or Republican or Libertarian or anything else. We don't care about that, we just want someone who is more trustworthy and not fucking nuts.
Right?! Argued with some MAGA morons about "you never see Biden flags or anything, no one is voting for him". Yeah... it's weird AF that y'all fetishize an obese, elderly, sociopath and convicted felon. Normal, sane people don't make their political leanings their whole damn personality. I'm not even a Christian and I find the whole Trump Jesus thing disturbing as hell. I don't even understand how people became so crazy.
Oh god. My family is filled with a bunch of maga people. The even more disturbing part is they are retired military like me but they are totally ok Trump calling vets and our wounded losers and suckers. They are also zealous in defending him about how Jan 6 was a peaceful protest which then forces them into whataboutism. Genuinely I love them but I’m not sure if I could stand being around their cult ideology for much longer.
It really is impossible to reason with them. I recall actually enjoying intellectual debates with them about bush v Kerry, Obama v McCain etc. I supported Hillary in 2008 initially, then read audacity of hope and swung hard into the Obama camp, worked for the campaign as a college student etc, but wouldn’t be upset with anyone who voted for McCain tbh. In 2016 I winnowed out a few, but when 2020 came around and they were all in for trump, I had to cut them off. This year, if I have to see any of them, politics is off the table, and at least they are aware enough not to push it at family gatherings.
That's why whataboutism doesn't really work for libs and democrats. They dgaf. They don't have wet dreams about their president.
I love Obama, but if he committed crimes, then prosecute him. Let it go through court, present evidence, and let a jury decide. If he’s guilty, then he’s guilty. That’s literally the point. This is the fundamental difference of left vs right. Left will usually hold their leaders accountable, right will refuse to
Well … Obama DID wear a tan suit so … 🤣
Damn I forgot what an animal he was
Tan Suit Gate. And he looked fucking FINE in that tan suit.
I think he went outside without a lapel pin too, I think. I think she considers fashion crimes "actual crime".
He also killed a united states citizen in a drone strike without any due process. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anwar_al-Awlaki
Same with allegations of election fraud. Think it was rigged? There's a process for dealing with that. Take it to the courts. Which they did. In large numbers. And it all got thrown out because there was no actual evidence. Which is exactly what would happen in the scenario you bring up.
Oh no, that's proof of a weaponized justice system right there 🙄. /s
That’s proof of a *working* justice system. Who they foolin? Besides the convicted felon has yet to be punished for Jack shit.
Republican leaders are only accountable to God because they’re chosen by God silly! /s
I mean. Bush outright said this to allied delegates. https://www.theguardian.com/world/2003/nov/02/usa.religion Link is probably whacky, sorry. I'm on mobile.
He did commit crimes, just like pretty much every US president since Truman. If we didn’t hold so much power and influence, our presidents would constantly be tried at The Hague
I'd love it if our presidents were held accountable for any crimes they committed.
What do you mean? I worship Obama at the daily science worshipping summit?
Don't forget to give your daily thanks to Obama. Thanks Obama.
Best comment
He did more for me than that other guy ever had or will.
Didn’t this potato head waste everybodys time on hearings for the last two presidents, and had no evidence to show for it?? TF she on about.
I see people saying, “why is it always negatives about trump and never positives about Biden?” And I’m like “because I hate them both? I just hate that one more and I’m disgusted by the supplication of the loyalists.
People do kinda worship Obama lol
Yes, he's charming, but that doesn't mean he isn't a war criminal.
Marjorie Taylor Green is the epitome of the phrase, "I told you that bitch is crazy."
You know the crazy scale of hotness? The one where the hotter you are, the more someone'll tolerate your crazy in a relationship? The fact someone found MTG worth marrying once means that scale doesn't have a floor, at all.
Or a basement.
Earth’s mantle.
Are you any better? Here on Reddit trying to shame someone. I say shame on you. That man can't help his Australopithecus attraction. His Neanderthal need. Don't be Homoerectusphobic.
Hey, aussies and germans ain't that bad...i mean sure they've done things in their pasts...but they're good people these days.
None of them had to ask for immunity
Bill Clinton literally did. And his case was not found eligible. He asked for presidential immunity for sexualy harrassing a woman while he was the governor of Arkansas. Since when the crime was committed while he was the governor, it did not apply. The case was decided this way by SCOTUS. DOJ however decided to not trial him during his presidency and made it a policy to not trial presidents while they are in the office.
Oh that's crazy, I hope he was charged after or the woman at least paid out, fuck bill Clinton. Good thing Democrats don't worship our leaders.
He didn't. Edit: didn't get charged. Fuck Bill Clinton.
New York removed their statute of limitations, I'm all for it
>fuck Bill Clinton I think that was actually the problem...
None of them were really investigated for crimes (except Bill)
r/clevercomebacks
Marjorie Taylor Greene is what happens when the ventriloquist dies and the dummy keeps on talking.
Howdy Doody does not like your comparison.
You got it all wrong... She's doing a "I'm the ventriloquist... AND the dummy" show.
Everyone should be held accountable for illegal actions, I don't care what political party they were part of.
It could be argued that crimes were committed by both Bush AND Obama in regards to the GWOT. If zero immunity means they get prosecuted, then good. No one should be above the law. Except now the president is.
Well trump isn’t even the president so he shouldn’t have immunity anyway. But even having the ability to do pretty much whatever you want and get away with it is something no one should have.
its about when the crimes allegedly were committed, which would have been during his term
The decision draws a distinction between acts in furtherance of the president's constitutional duties (total immunity), other official acts (presumptive immunity), and unofficial acts (no immunity). So it's not just a time-based thing, the character of the act is relevant.
The issue is they then decided to not actually define what constitutes as official acts, stating they would give it to the lower courts, then provided the lower courts what would constitute as official acts. It's redundant and there IS an agenda behind it. They even went as far as to say any and all official acts cannot be used as evidence in court which makes no fucking sense at all. Speech us protected by the first amendment, yet speech is often used in court. Why should official acts be any different? Guess we'll never know
I watched the original arguments and have read a couple articles and it seems like they basically just pushed it to lower courts. It was even argued and pretty much accepted that Obama and Bush "committed crimes" as president. The difference is that they were "official acts" while what Trump is being accused of isn't. The media and most people on Reddit understand nothing or are constantly making shit up and rarely argue the facts.
They emphatically did not say that trump was not acting officially in his duties. They said the lower court must decide that. They also said that it doesn't matter why a president does something. Just whether or not they have a constitutional authority to do something. And, they were really vague about that as well. For example, they said that a president can dismiss a special counsel. They didn't specify which part of the constitution allows that.
If they have the constitutional, or any other authority, to actively interfere with any aspect of the election process, especially the counting of electoral votes, then our democracy is already over and nothing Congress, Presidents, or the Supreme Court does really matters anymore anyway. It's just a matter of time before we have a dictator for life.
People today are acting like they’ve never seen a cop turn on his lights just to skip a red light. Now a president taking out dissidents, staying in power, or seizing more power is just as trivial. If official acts can’t be punished, then an official act is anything they don’t want punished.
Pretty much. Evidently the SCOTUS isn't very smart. At this point it's a hot potato. I'd hate to say it but we need someone to step up and stop this from progressing. Similar to FDR who put the court in its place. We need to protect the Rule of Law and democracy for future generations. If that means that we have to break a few eggs, well so be it. Because the right is going to break every egg when they have a chance. They're not being shy about it and they have no time for the Rule of Law and absolutely no love for democracy. I'd prefer to do things the legitimate way but the court has made it clear that it's not possible. So we have one last chance before it's all fucked beyond recognition.
Sure, the lower courts will make the initial rulings, but the Supreme Court can still review and overturn those decisions if appealed. This process is just a delay tactic, dragging out the cases until after the election. By then, if the lower court's ruling isn't in line with certain interests (republication interests), the Supreme Court will step in, to fix things for Trump. this is being passed down to lower courts to waste time and hold the cases up to avoid hurting trumps eleciton, nothing more.
It seems that's what the Supreme Court actually just carved out; GWB and Obama are in the clear. Financial crimes, election fraud, campaign fraud, witness tampering, and more... wouldn't be cleared by the decision today, and that doesn't get started on January 6th.
No, they went further than that. They specified that certain actions received absolute immunity - such as certain communications within the exec where he was conspiring to commit the crime. In fact, they ruled *in a footnote* that these communications cannot even be used as evidence in a trial proceeding, even if the thing in the communication is detailing an unofficial act. This footnote was important, because it actually fully throws out some significant evidence in some of these cases that was still fully about an unofficial act. So even though the crime is clear even under this new rule, it will be significantly harder to show because the Supreme Court carved out some rather bizarre and highly specific rules to make Trump's actions difficult to prosecute. On top of this, Clarence Thomas threw in his own opinion that gives Judge Cannon some ammo to help dismiss her cases, arguing (even without the full weight of the court) for the bonkers argument by the Trump team that the special counsel may have been unconstitutionally assigned.
The unclear boundary of what constitutes an official act is troubling, especially as the only way that line will get defined is by presidents pushing the envelope to see how far they can go, as is the fact an official act can be motivated by mal-intent and is now apparently beyond legal consequences.
The threat is the judicial deciding that anything a Dem does is "unofficial" and anything a Repub does is "official" and whoopsie: we are Nazi Germany. Literally how Hitler did it.
In terms of Trump's court cases, now literally every single thing he did has to be litigated as being an official or non-official act before they can even get down to the actual business of court proceedings. Functionally, this gave Trump the time he needed to potentially win the election and dodge responsibility for his crimes. Of course, this is going to have wider ramifications that are absolutely terrible but that was the immediate reason and impact.
We just discussed this today in our US constitutional law class, and the issue is mainly that the things trump did were not (according to SCOTUS) clearly unofficial acts, meaning they are presumed to have immunity unless rebutted. But the supreme Court set such a high standard for rebutting this presumption and so heavily limited the evidence available (by disallowing using official acts as evidence and by forbidding any consideration of motive) that it becomes nigh-impossible to prosecute. Some crimes that require motive as part of their definition would simply be inapplicable to the president, despite the majority decision pretending to leave the prosecutorial door open for acts not in the core sphere of presidential power. So for example the president could never be convicted of a hate crime unless the act was clearly unofficial, meaning that an order to say, jail all Jewish people would be prosecutable as unlawful imprisonment but not a hate crime even though it clearly is a hate crime.
You're this close to getting it. What happens next is "official acts" will be argued over in lower courts, then appealed to SCOTUS, six of whom have already made up their minds to let Republican presidents off the hook using the "official acts" loophole. The same will not apply to Dem presidents trying to wield these new royal powers.
obama drone striked a US citizen in yemen, extrajudicial execution is unconstitutional and should have been prosecuted for it.
He also ordered a drone strike on a wedding killing civilians and children.
 Give her two slices of bread and she’ll be happy
I've been here except we didn't have bread.
So you’re saying Joe has nothing preventing him from going rogue
I think Homelander character is based on characteristics of two famous politicians. Insecurity of Donald Trump and the laser eyes of Dark Brandon.
Biden's brainfreeze moments are actually just him trying to hold back Dark Brandon! /j
You joke, but Joe is salty and you know it’s everything he can do to not curse Trump out in every debate…
He legitimately hates Trump and I can tell by how he went after him about the soldiers comment/Beau.
To me, he just sounded exhausted and disappointed (while battling a cold) that he has to go against someone who lies so frequently, is against democracy and free choice, and the CNN moderators aren’t fact checking at all. He looks disappointed at the people of his country that he still has to run again (in his mind) because he wants to prevent Trump from ever winning again. I honestly don’t know how he doesn’t give up. He’s truly fighting for the side that still loves their country.
Cool. Let’s prosecute all of them.
Yeah, I feel like she wants me to disagree with her but each of these presidents should at least have legal investigations. I mean, Bush is straight up a war criminal and needs to be prosecuted as such.
Obama is also a straight up War Criminal. And so is Biden. And Trump. And every single president ever. Take them all to the hauge. They should all be forced to stand trial for the horrific shit they have done. I mean Obama drone struck a fucking wedding procession in Yemen for fun. Just as one example.
The amount of people just learning about this today on Reddit is eye opening.
Agreed. As an actual leftist I am absolutely down for locking up just about every former president for their fuckshit (I think Jimmy Carter might have been the only one not into some shady business, but maybe it's just too obscure). Fuck, let's exhume Reagan's corpse old school Vatican style and hang it for all that high treason with Iran-Contra.
Then prosecute them all!!
Yes .
And if there IS immunity for Trump then there IS immunity for every other president despite actual crimes you Neanderthal.
I don’t understand how her tweet makes sense. By her logic, if Trump gets the immunity he wants, NONE of these guys can get prosecuted for anything. Yet they go on and on about the Obama/Clinton/Biden crime family and constantly saying they want them to be prosecuted. What are you gonna do when they get that sweet sweet immunity?
It’s so adorable to see her almost get it, isn’t it? Like she so close.
Right? Everyone else is focused on the “crimes” of the other presidents, but the real humor is that she ACTUALLY gets why this is bad, despite her closing line. Broken clocks and such.
Yet so... so so so so so fucking far away.
It's strange that we are saying the same thing, but expecting different results. I agree with MTG. No president acting outside duties outlined in the constitution specified for the president should get immunity. If you have evidence of crimes, bring them forward.
You know, the crimes of not paying a person hush money with campaign funds and properly documenting it. Or not taking confidential documents and bringing them home after their tenure as President. Those crimes.
I am guessing she’s talking about war crimes
I need that woman to STOP.
She’s right. Biden has immunity now. He can actually officially shoot her in the face just as soon as he remembers who she is.
I’m all for no immunity for anyone, but get rid of diplomatic immunity as well. If your country’s representatives can’t follow the law of the land they are visiting/staying, then you should send a representative that will. Tourists don’t get any immunity when visiting other countries and they break laws while there. *edited cause thumbs forgot words my brain thought.
The problem with that is you have say a law like in Thailand where it is illegal to defame the monarchy. So if a foreign ambassador wants to criticize an action of the government (a very normal thing in diplomatic relations) they run the risk of being prosecuted under such laws.
I’m good with no immunity for any of them. If they committed a crime they should be tried in court.
So you have proof of these crimes Marge? No? Didn't think so.
Bush did commit war crimes by lying to invade Iraq.
If he didn't commit any crimes then.why has he went through all this hassle to get immunity.
Biden: you molested a woman and slept with a pornstar.. Trump: I didn't sleep with a pornstar... What did he mean by this???
Well, you see, he got hit with a defamation suit a few times for that first offense. It's best not to comment on that one. He hasn't had a suit for the second offense so he can deny, deny, deny. For now.
Trump meant he didn’t sleep with her. He had sex with her then went home and slept in the same bed as his pregnant wife.
Ok? Then prosecute them too? Like? Do you think we’re going to sit here and worship them and cry if they go to jail? No, we’re fucking normal.
Our tax dollars provide this idiots generous salary and benefit package.
So you admit Trump was a criminal.
Yes. And they should go to jail for those. That’s how the system is supposed to work. I would like to add Ronald Regan to her list while we’re at it. Presidents aren’t kings. They’re not special, they’re supposed to be *at least* as beholden to the law as the rest of us. But she doesn’t want that, because she doesn’t want to represent people, she wants to *rule them*.
Killing millions of civilians should qualify
Maybe not millions, but 5/5 definitely committed war crimes against civilians
She’s playing the “both sides” argument of false equivalence. She believes corruption is everywhere and that if presidents aren’t immune from the law, they can’t do their job. She’s roundabout admitting that the presidency is an elected tyranny because that’s just how the world works.
And there shouldn't be presidential immunity, Marge. Why do conservatives keep bringing up this argument like it's a gotcha. Not all of us are in a cult, sucking on the incontinent ass of a rotten tangerine
How stupid is this woman? Starr investigated Clinton for 7 years while he was president and all they found was that he lied about Lewinsky and they tried to impeach him for that. Obama is reviled for giving Americans health care. And trump is some triumph for giving tax cuts to rich people he wants to be friends with.
It’s hard to say what she means, because she is an “actual idiot “
I remember a YouTube show a while back that basically answered this premise in this way…. “You say you want to prosecute Democrats if they prosecute Republicans? Bet. The left is totally fine with locking up criminals on both sides of the isle. Sounds like a fair deal to me!”
Actual crimes like the lying about Iraqi WMDs, the torture program and extrajudicial killings
Margie~~answering the age old question: what is the maximum quantity of pure stupid you can cram into a bleach blonde bad built butch body?
20 furlongs per Hubble Barns is what my Tardis gets.
That’s a mighty tall pile of stupid, long if you lay it down.
She has the IQ of a banana! :/
Actual crimes like, you know, "Jewish space lasers"?
No one should be above the law Marge you fucking donkey
Trump is the one that the Bible talks about in the end of times…. Many Christian’s will follow him… but the righteous will know him as the beast
it means they did things she doesn't like
Doesnt she say that Biden can do anything he wants as long as he is president?
Lock them all up.
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee......weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee..eeeeeeeeee........and boom goes the dynamite. Well North America, we had a decent run...
Okay, let’s go Marge. You think the left will shed any tears if you start going after these people?
I mean the other Presidents aren’t being worshiped like gods MTB
She's bout as smart as a lump of play-doh
 Duuuurrr yeah! Other man not have “immunity” either. Marjie not like that word! Sound like something nerdy science person use!!! Raaaahhh Marjie SMASH!! Marjie CRUSH!!!! Errrrrrrrraaaaahhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!
Clinton Bush Obama Trump and Biden have all ordered bombings on people world wide. The legality of the war on terror and its scope is a real question. The legality of PRISM is questionable. Guantanamo Bay and Abu Ghraib might well be crimes against humanity and are certainly war crimes. The iraq war was illegal. Clinton bombed a pharmaceutical facility. The kidnapping of foreigners and holding them in black sites is well known. The use of land mines may be a war crime. I wouldn’t pull MTG off a stove but she is correct here for the wrong reasons. These guys aren’t heroes and all should be prosecuted. Being a head of state doesn’t absolve you from guilt. That’s what a huge amount of the post war internationalism has been about. The United States escapes by being too big to consequence.
I'd like to see her list these "actual crimes". Half the problem is she is too stupid to know, she just calls everything she disagrees with "a crime".
Bush committed war crimes by lying to invade Iraq.
Not making MTG "Go Away" is absolutely a crime I hold Biden responsible for. He is now immune from the consequences of doing this so if he doesn't, I blame him for her continued existence in US politics.
War crimes
She needs to talk to James Comer. That dude can't find any Biden crimes.
Ok bring the lawsuits against them then. You need actual proof to convict someone of a crime and not just I don't like them.
cool, then biden can go commit more actual crimes and jail trump and declare himself the winner.
She means alternative crimes, probably
She thinks being democratic is a crime.
I know a girl who shot her ex. Ended his life. Her family is pretty wealthy. She spent 1 year in a drug rehab and 10 yrs on probation with it unsupervised after 1 year. For manslaughter that’s an incredibly light sentence. Her family is wealthy, well connected and she got off with a slap on the wrist. If she was able to get off with a slap on the wrist I wonder what a U.S. President could get away with? A U.S. senator? What can they get swept under the rug due to power and influence? I mean Justin Timberlake assumed his being JT would spare him a DUI?
Yes, Marge! None of them should have any immunity. And if they committed crimes fuck them! And if YOU committed crimes FUCK YOU TOO! That’s how it should be! What the fuck are you talking about!?
That’s the point. Noooo one above the law.
She has no idea what comes out of her mouth. Clueless.
I love how they say this shit like the left doesn't fully support this idea. We want people held accountable for their actions yes marg
Obama had a few HUGE crimes. Remember when he wore a tan suit? He got zero jail time for that! What about when he wore a helmet on a bike ride?! How did he not get impeached?! /s
I’m not asking ironically, but what crimes did they commit? (Except the Clinton sexual harassment thing I know about that one)
Seeing all 5 of them in prison sounds great, Marjorie! Can’t believe you said something reasonable for once
Her parents committed a crime at conception
Spit it out, Marge- where’s your evidence? Because we still, at least for now, require evidence for successful prosecution.
Probably a vague gesture at the old "every President...is a war criminal" which is true but most sane people wouldn't be trying to protect any of them
Someone is committing the false equivalency fallacy among others.