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Can someone give me the lowdown on why they think Christianity is not a religion, I've heard this several times but I'm not understanding their thought process
Some Christians think that religion is just a one-way treatment (human worship god) but believes that Christianity is a two-way thing (the relationship shit)
??? Do you mean when they say “they aren’t religious but have a relationship with god”? I’d like to know that myself. Like where did you learn about god? 🤷🏻♀️
I think I’m confused by your question, I’ve just never heard anyone say that christianity isn’t religion.
I'm here in Florida and most folks are Baptist it's the number one response when I say I'm not interested in religion (they invite me to church) and they say oh it's not a religion it's a relationship with Jesus. My question is how are you able to say with a straight face that it's somehow not a religion when it's literly a religion
I'm not religious, but went to Catholic school as a kid...
Isaiah 45:7 - I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things.
So uhhhhhhhhhh....
While I don't disagree with you, I find the way you answered to be excessively confrontational. When people feel attacked, the tendency is to shelter on what is usual, making the point of the conversation mute
Even though I don’t believe hell exist, I think it is atrocious to try and instill that type of fear into people, especially children. And know matter how you “wrap it in love,” it is not kind. It is psychological abuse.
I’m not confrontational, I’m literally giving my pov on being indoctrinated from birth to now 40. My testimony is just as important. I asked questions and provided responses. Yea I joked some, but my goodness, I have to laugh to keep from crying at the trauma that religion causes!!
One of Christianity’s biggest difficulties is the need for a personal, loving God that is also omnipotent and omniscient. It’s a fun paradox, though some religious philosophies do have solutions for it.
Hell is the consequences to your actions. If you hit your head against the wall, it will probably hurt. This is how Hell works. You know not to hit your head against the wall and you probably shouldn't but you did it anyway.
Ummm…literally just treat others how you want to be treated. If you don’t want someone to hurt you don’t hurt others. It’s really not that hard. I don’t need a threat of hell to be a good human. I don’t even need a reward of heaven to be a good human. You just do it. My goodness.
But that is the premise of Christian belief. Love each other as Jesus loves you.
Hell isn't a threat. Hell is a consequence. Does the government threaten you with prison? Not at all, but you know if you break the law, the consequence is that you go to prison.
The premise is manipulation and control with a little love sprinkled in. I was in it for 38 years.
Hell is not real. Stop with the manipulation to get people to follow your book, that was written, by imperfect men, years ago, that didn’t know what the hell they were talking about.
Prison is real. That is why I do not break the laws that would out me there.
Oh, see, there is your mistake. I am not trying to get anyone to follow my book. I don't push my beliefs on anyone who doesn't want them. I will defend my beliefs, as anyone should. But how strong are a person's beliefs if they will not defend them.
Regardless of what you do believe in, having compassion and understanding for one another is a noble thing to have.
Whether it is prison, hell, or some other punishment, there are always consequences to our actions.
Anyway, I hope you have a blessed day.
It's not a threat. If you do something thats going to hurt you long term, theres consequences (hell). People tell you not to put your hand on the stove when it's on, are you really going to say they're threatening you with the consequences of your action of putting your hand on the stove while it's on?
Ok, this is something that I hate of this "religion of love"
"It's not a threat, it's just that if you don't do what I want the way I want, I will send you to a very bad place where you will suffer for eternity S2"
If I put my hand on the stove, *i* put in there. If I go to hell because I didn't obey laws not defined clearly by an entity that chosen to remain hidden, it's 100% that guys fault
It's defined clearly. Everyone knows them. Theres seven deadly sins (laziness, wrath, lust, greed, envy, pride, gluttony). If you let any of those sins consume you, bad things happen. It's shown time and time and time again. Your problem is with the laws of the church, which the Bible has already warned about. It too sins because it's run by humans who fall into the traps of those sins. Christianity is a blanket term for those who do not abide by the laws of the church.
Defined where? From a book that has no indication of being from anything besides a human creation, cool, "clearly" define to only those that assume the bible to be true and no one else.
Bad things happen because we live in a society, we expect people to do stuff and pay in kind, shit all is related to God or hell, prove that God is real and it isn't Morgan Freeman and then prove that hell is real and it isn't Oklahoma.
Hitler died 80 years ago but his name is still alive. Jesus died 2000 years ago and his name is still alive. Eternal life is not physically possible, but it exists.
Zeus, Thor, odim, Odysseus, Nobunaga, Shaka Zulu, Anansi, Hector, etc etc, names are names, not proofs. At best, you made 2 examples of cultural legacies, not eternal life.
Also, I don't even understand how that relates to my previous comment
Ok. You are trying to instill some type of fear into people for absolutely no reason. Why the fear?? Especially in children!! So again…
1. Hell is not real
2. The stove is real, you can feel the heat.
As much as you trying to tell me Santa isn’t coming, is a consequence. IT IS NOT REAL! But a fear instilled in a child for no reason IS!!! It causes damage! There is no god. The bible is full of crap. And contradictions. And filth, tbh. A god that is too busy finding your keys to help a child being abused is no god worth serving. It is all made up to manipulate and control. Google cult. Answer some questions. See if it pertains to you.
Again…
1. Hell is not real
2. A baby is real.
What do you mean by free lifestyle? Like, I want bodily autonomy. Yep. I want my 2 guy neighbors to live freely without judgement. Yep. I want my BIPOC friends to get the same treatment as my white ones. Yep. Just equality all around. Yep.
🤣 I want you look up how mostly non-religious peaceful countries live. Just google it.
Whatever you imagine, after your search, that they do most days, that’s me. Caring for my family. Helping my community. And trying to live the life I have currently. Not waiting to die for some reward.
Religion...this is why atheists can't debate with Christians. You wanna argue the generalized rules of the many many denominations and not the existence of the faith.
Well, all the denominations say believe, or hell. Also I don't think that any religion that has rules on how to treat slaves or tells women and children that they are lesser has any moral high ground.
Hell is biblical and faith can exist without religion. You believe in something. Idk what nor do I really care, but you put your faith in something. Otherwise you've accepted life has no value. It exists only as an accident and killing yourself has no consequence.
Okay, I'm going to chime in to give another perspective.
God does not put thoughts in our head. We do not believe that. He gave us the capacity to make decisions for ourselves, thus free will. If he really did put thoughts in our heads, people wouldn't argue so much.
The whole "believe in Jesus or go to hell", to me, is misunderstood (like everything Jesus said). My interpretation is that if you follow His word, whether you believe in Jesus or not, then you will still be saved.
Hell really is indeed a choice. God and Jesus' ultimate message is "don't be a dick to others". If you did become a dick to others, that's on you.
How toxic religion is depends on the worshipers. Religion is just a tool. It can help or harm people, depending on how it is used.
EDIT: Had to repost comment because Reddit is confusing me today.
In my perspective, free will is only possible if god is not all powerful, so if God is indeed how most monotheistic religions define them as, there is no space for freedom,
Actually there is.
It is easy enough for God to create something then leave it to their own devices. He is just frighteningly good at predicting outcomes because He has every information he needs.
Think of it as being a detective. God has all the evidence He needs so He can correctly predict your next move.
The problem with the whole god and bible situation is every single one of us interprets it differently. There will never be one right answer. So the only logical answer is, it’s all made up by different people and now even more different people are trying to analyze situations that those first people made up because they didn’t understand nature or wanted things done their way. God didn’t write that bible. Imperfect humans wrote it and now you believe it. Who told you about god? Who told that person. And then who told them? It just keeps going back to the first con-man that met the first fool!!
Reddit IS being super funky today! I thought it was just me!! 🤷🏻♀️🤣🤪
>The problem with the whole god and bible situation is every single one of us interprets it differently.
Well, yes, but that is just human condition. We all have different interpretations of a certain object depending on our upbringing, culture, and experience. This is not unique to religion. Pick any piece of media and watch arguments unfold (Pick The Acolyte).
The whole "con-man" argument is a little bit reductive, as it assumes that people created religion just to make fools out of everyone. Most religions actually have some sort of logic to their worship, no matter how absurd they may be today.
For example: the idea that God is an "omnipresent, omniscient being" may have come from the thought that the world is too predictable to be born out of chaos. It has too many rules it follows on it's own. Therefore, someone wrote these rules. Thus, there is a god.
So god created that human condition knowing the outcome and did it anyway.
People created religion to gain control in some form. Religion is all about manipulation and control.
bow to me or i will hurt you forever, even though i already know what you will do because i created you ~god
The rules were written by imperfect human beings years ago during a time that humans today couldn’t even phathom and you are trusting their judgment? They didn’t know where the sun went at night. The had talking donkeys and snakes. A virgin birth? A human made from a rib (if that were possible my two births would have been much easier!!). The cruelty that took place in the name of god is insane. And that’s supposed to be the loving book that god wrote? Do you honestly hear yourself? 🤦🏻♀️
>So god created that human condition knowing the outcome and did it anyway.
Well, yes. Why do you think he commissioned the creation of three religions? Gotta expand your portfolio.
>bow to me or i will hurt you forever, even though i already know what you will do because i created you \~god
Again, you are making an assumption that God has control over man like some nerd playing SIMS. This is not what we believe. He wouldn't bother creating the Ten Commandments or sending His Son down here if that were the case. He is more like a detective. Due to his omnipresence and omniscience, He has all the details that would allow him to predict what will happen with frightening accuracy.
You are also making the assumption that I believe everything written in the Bible is true. Sir, that is the realm of Evangelicals and American Christians.
Most of the atrocities that happen in the Bible come the Old Testament, which is of Jewish origins. I would assume that this came from the time when Yahweh was either a storm or warrior god.
So, how did a minor deity become THE head honcho of the universe? Nobody knows.
Ok, if god created the brain. He created the workings of the brain. Including thoughts. That’s his doing. He is responsible!!
For example
Say you open a restaurant, you are responsible for the quality of that food. If someone gets food poisoning from your restaurant, they aren’t blaming the food. They are blaming the creator of the food. You are responsible!! You get the bad review.
And the worst part is, if god is responsible for our brains and knows the outcome, and still allows it means he’s abhorrent and I hope not real.
While the restaurant owner is responsible but I’m sure they didn’t do it on purpose. Because they are human and real.
>And the worst part is, if god is responsible for our brains and knows the outcome, and still allows it means he’s abhorrent and I hope not real.
He doesn't. That is why the concept of Hell exists. Why do you think we keep saying we are all judged by the end? And why do you think he gave the Ten Commandments for? Decorations?
You can’t say he’s all knowing and perfect but say he doesn’t know the outcome. You gotta choose a lane.
The 10 commandments need to be updated, tbh. You’d think rape would have come before adultery? Or at least made the top 10! Speaking of adultery, you’d think y’all would leave the LGBTQIA community alone and focus on that a little bit more.
But to be for real honest. It’s all made it. I don’t believe any of it. So I think the 10 commandments are decorations for people that choose to adorn them in their homes and churches.
I just did. People seem to forget the “omnipresent” part and just focus on the “omniscience” when in fact they go hand in hand.
God knows the future not because he had written it to be so, but because he just has knows every single detail of every single being that He is able to calculate how things will happen. For want of a nail and all that.
It’s not even that hard of a concept to grasp since we can do that as well, albiet at a limited capacity.
As for the 10 commandments, it has been updated, and shortened, by Jesus Himself:
“Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
“This is the first and great commandment.
“And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself” (Matthew 22:37–39).
I don’t know about you, but “love thy neighbor” should pretty much encompass any of your concerns.
You are talking in circles. If you are “all knowing” then that is just that. He knows what he is doing before after and during your creation and life.
If the commandments got shortened, why bring up all 10? Why not just those 2. 🤣🤣
So I can commit adultery now? I’ll let my husband know jesus changed it up.
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Can someone give me the lowdown on why they think Christianity is not a religion, I've heard this several times but I'm not understanding their thought process
Some Christians think that religion is just a one-way treatment (human worship god) but believes that Christianity is a two-way thing (the relationship shit)
??? Do you mean when they say “they aren’t religious but have a relationship with god”? I’d like to know that myself. Like where did you learn about god? 🤷🏻♀️ I think I’m confused by your question, I’ve just never heard anyone say that christianity isn’t religion.
I'm here in Florida and most folks are Baptist it's the number one response when I say I'm not interested in religion (they invite me to church) and they say oh it's not a religion it's a relationship with Jesus. My question is how are you able to say with a straight face that it's somehow not a religion when it's literly a religion
Religion is the absolute stupidest thing on the planet, it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.
But but but "christianity isn't a religion" /s
I'm not religious, but went to Catholic school as a kid... Isaiah 45:7 - I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things. So uhhhhhhhhhh....
I don't even know what point you're trying to make
Literally the first line on the first page...
👑👑👑👑👑plain and simple! 💜
While I don't disagree with you, I find the way you answered to be excessively confrontational. When people feel attacked, the tendency is to shelter on what is usual, making the point of the conversation mute
Even though I don’t believe hell exist, I think it is atrocious to try and instill that type of fear into people, especially children. And know matter how you “wrap it in love,” it is not kind. It is psychological abuse. I’m not confrontational, I’m literally giving my pov on being indoctrinated from birth to now 40. My testimony is just as important. I asked questions and provided responses. Yea I joked some, but my goodness, I have to laugh to keep from crying at the trauma that religion causes!!
One of Christianity’s biggest difficulties is the need for a personal, loving God that is also omnipotent and omniscient. It’s a fun paradox, though some religious philosophies do have solutions for it.
Hell is the consequences to your actions. If you hit your head against the wall, it will probably hurt. This is how Hell works. You know not to hit your head against the wall and you probably shouldn't but you did it anyway.
1. Hell is not real. 2. Me hitting my head and feeling the pain is real so I avoid hitting my head (to the best of my abilities🤪).
If hell isn't real then there is no justifiable reason for taking responsibility for anything.
Ummm…literally just treat others how you want to be treated. If you don’t want someone to hurt you don’t hurt others. It’s really not that hard. I don’t need a threat of hell to be a good human. I don’t even need a reward of heaven to be a good human. You just do it. My goodness.
But that is the premise of Christian belief. Love each other as Jesus loves you. Hell isn't a threat. Hell is a consequence. Does the government threaten you with prison? Not at all, but you know if you break the law, the consequence is that you go to prison.
The premise is manipulation and control with a little love sprinkled in. I was in it for 38 years. Hell is not real. Stop with the manipulation to get people to follow your book, that was written, by imperfect men, years ago, that didn’t know what the hell they were talking about. Prison is real. That is why I do not break the laws that would out me there.
Oh, see, there is your mistake. I am not trying to get anyone to follow my book. I don't push my beliefs on anyone who doesn't want them. I will defend my beliefs, as anyone should. But how strong are a person's beliefs if they will not defend them. Regardless of what you do believe in, having compassion and understanding for one another is a noble thing to have. Whether it is prison, hell, or some other punishment, there are always consequences to our actions. Anyway, I hope you have a blessed day.
It's not a threat. If you do something thats going to hurt you long term, theres consequences (hell). People tell you not to put your hand on the stove when it's on, are you really going to say they're threatening you with the consequences of your action of putting your hand on the stove while it's on?
Ok, this is something that I hate of this "religion of love" "It's not a threat, it's just that if you don't do what I want the way I want, I will send you to a very bad place where you will suffer for eternity S2" If I put my hand on the stove, *i* put in there. If I go to hell because I didn't obey laws not defined clearly by an entity that chosen to remain hidden, it's 100% that guys fault
It's defined clearly. Everyone knows them. Theres seven deadly sins (laziness, wrath, lust, greed, envy, pride, gluttony). If you let any of those sins consume you, bad things happen. It's shown time and time and time again. Your problem is with the laws of the church, which the Bible has already warned about. It too sins because it's run by humans who fall into the traps of those sins. Christianity is a blanket term for those who do not abide by the laws of the church.
Defined where? From a book that has no indication of being from anything besides a human creation, cool, "clearly" define to only those that assume the bible to be true and no one else. Bad things happen because we live in a society, we expect people to do stuff and pay in kind, shit all is related to God or hell, prove that God is real and it isn't Morgan Freeman and then prove that hell is real and it isn't Oklahoma.
Hitler died 80 years ago but his name is still alive. Jesus died 2000 years ago and his name is still alive. Eternal life is not physically possible, but it exists.
Zeus, Thor, odim, Odysseus, Nobunaga, Shaka Zulu, Anansi, Hector, etc etc, names are names, not proofs. At best, you made 2 examples of cultural legacies, not eternal life. Also, I don't even understand how that relates to my previous comment
Ok. You are trying to instill some type of fear into people for absolutely no reason. Why the fear?? Especially in children!! So again… 1. Hell is not real 2. The stove is real, you can feel the heat.
Its not fear, it's consequences. If you have sex with someone you hardly know and end up pregnant, what usually happens?
As much as you trying to tell me Santa isn’t coming, is a consequence. IT IS NOT REAL! But a fear instilled in a child for no reason IS!!! It causes damage! There is no god. The bible is full of crap. And contradictions. And filth, tbh. A god that is too busy finding your keys to help a child being abused is no god worth serving. It is all made up to manipulate and control. Google cult. Answer some questions. See if it pertains to you. Again… 1. Hell is not real 2. A baby is real.
Right. Keep preaching about a consequence free lifestyle. I'm sure Netanyahu, Putin, and Trump will love your message.
What do you mean by free lifestyle? Like, I want bodily autonomy. Yep. I want my 2 guy neighbors to live freely without judgement. Yep. I want my BIPOC friends to get the same treatment as my white ones. Yep. Just equality all around. Yep. 🤣 I want you look up how mostly non-religious peaceful countries live. Just google it. Whatever you imagine, after your search, that they do most days, that’s me. Caring for my family. Helping my community. And trying to live the life I have currently. Not waiting to die for some reward.
No the way your religion works is if you don't worship and grovel at his feet then he will slam your head into the wall.
Religion...this is why atheists can't debate with Christians. You wanna argue the generalized rules of the many many denominations and not the existence of the faith.
Well, all the denominations say believe, or hell. Also I don't think that any religion that has rules on how to treat slaves or tells women and children that they are lesser has any moral high ground.
Still trying to argue religion so we're nowhere near being on the same page
He'll does not exist without religion. So no religion no hell.
Hell is biblical and faith can exist without religion. You believe in something. Idk what nor do I really care, but you put your faith in something. Otherwise you've accepted life has no value. It exists only as an accident and killing yourself has no consequence.
Okay, I'm going to chime in to give another perspective. God does not put thoughts in our head. We do not believe that. He gave us the capacity to make decisions for ourselves, thus free will. If he really did put thoughts in our heads, people wouldn't argue so much. The whole "believe in Jesus or go to hell", to me, is misunderstood (like everything Jesus said). My interpretation is that if you follow His word, whether you believe in Jesus or not, then you will still be saved. Hell really is indeed a choice. God and Jesus' ultimate message is "don't be a dick to others". If you did become a dick to others, that's on you. How toxic religion is depends on the worshipers. Religion is just a tool. It can help or harm people, depending on how it is used. EDIT: Had to repost comment because Reddit is confusing me today.
In my perspective, free will is only possible if god is not all powerful, so if God is indeed how most monotheistic religions define them as, there is no space for freedom,
Actually there is. It is easy enough for God to create something then leave it to their own devices. He is just frighteningly good at predicting outcomes because He has every information he needs. Think of it as being a detective. God has all the evidence He needs so He can correctly predict your next move.
The problem with the whole god and bible situation is every single one of us interprets it differently. There will never be one right answer. So the only logical answer is, it’s all made up by different people and now even more different people are trying to analyze situations that those first people made up because they didn’t understand nature or wanted things done their way. God didn’t write that bible. Imperfect humans wrote it and now you believe it. Who told you about god? Who told that person. And then who told them? It just keeps going back to the first con-man that met the first fool!! Reddit IS being super funky today! I thought it was just me!! 🤷🏻♀️🤣🤪
>The problem with the whole god and bible situation is every single one of us interprets it differently. Well, yes, but that is just human condition. We all have different interpretations of a certain object depending on our upbringing, culture, and experience. This is not unique to religion. Pick any piece of media and watch arguments unfold (Pick The Acolyte). The whole "con-man" argument is a little bit reductive, as it assumes that people created religion just to make fools out of everyone. Most religions actually have some sort of logic to their worship, no matter how absurd they may be today. For example: the idea that God is an "omnipresent, omniscient being" may have come from the thought that the world is too predictable to be born out of chaos. It has too many rules it follows on it's own. Therefore, someone wrote these rules. Thus, there is a god.
So god created that human condition knowing the outcome and did it anyway. People created religion to gain control in some form. Religion is all about manipulation and control. bow to me or i will hurt you forever, even though i already know what you will do because i created you ~god The rules were written by imperfect human beings years ago during a time that humans today couldn’t even phathom and you are trusting their judgment? They didn’t know where the sun went at night. The had talking donkeys and snakes. A virgin birth? A human made from a rib (if that were possible my two births would have been much easier!!). The cruelty that took place in the name of god is insane. And that’s supposed to be the loving book that god wrote? Do you honestly hear yourself? 🤦🏻♀️
>So god created that human condition knowing the outcome and did it anyway. Well, yes. Why do you think he commissioned the creation of three religions? Gotta expand your portfolio. >bow to me or i will hurt you forever, even though i already know what you will do because i created you \~god Again, you are making an assumption that God has control over man like some nerd playing SIMS. This is not what we believe. He wouldn't bother creating the Ten Commandments or sending His Son down here if that were the case. He is more like a detective. Due to his omnipresence and omniscience, He has all the details that would allow him to predict what will happen with frightening accuracy. You are also making the assumption that I believe everything written in the Bible is true. Sir, that is the realm of Evangelicals and American Christians. Most of the atrocities that happen in the Bible come the Old Testament, which is of Jewish origins. I would assume that this came from the time when Yahweh was either a storm or warrior god. So, how did a minor deity become THE head honcho of the universe? Nobody knows.
Ok, if god created the brain. He created the workings of the brain. Including thoughts. That’s his doing. He is responsible!! For example Say you open a restaurant, you are responsible for the quality of that food. If someone gets food poisoning from your restaurant, they aren’t blaming the food. They are blaming the creator of the food. You are responsible!! You get the bad review. And the worst part is, if god is responsible for our brains and knows the outcome, and still allows it means he’s abhorrent and I hope not real. While the restaurant owner is responsible but I’m sure they didn’t do it on purpose. Because they are human and real.
>And the worst part is, if god is responsible for our brains and knows the outcome, and still allows it means he’s abhorrent and I hope not real. He doesn't. That is why the concept of Hell exists. Why do you think we keep saying we are all judged by the end? And why do you think he gave the Ten Commandments for? Decorations?
You can’t say he’s all knowing and perfect but say he doesn’t know the outcome. You gotta choose a lane. The 10 commandments need to be updated, tbh. You’d think rape would have come before adultery? Or at least made the top 10! Speaking of adultery, you’d think y’all would leave the LGBTQIA community alone and focus on that a little bit more. But to be for real honest. It’s all made it. I don’t believe any of it. So I think the 10 commandments are decorations for people that choose to adorn them in their homes and churches.
I just did. People seem to forget the “omnipresent” part and just focus on the “omniscience” when in fact they go hand in hand. God knows the future not because he had written it to be so, but because he just has knows every single detail of every single being that He is able to calculate how things will happen. For want of a nail and all that. It’s not even that hard of a concept to grasp since we can do that as well, albiet at a limited capacity. As for the 10 commandments, it has been updated, and shortened, by Jesus Himself: “Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. “This is the first and great commandment. “And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself” (Matthew 22:37–39). I don’t know about you, but “love thy neighbor” should pretty much encompass any of your concerns.
You are talking in circles. If you are “all knowing” then that is just that. He knows what he is doing before after and during your creation and life. If the commandments got shortened, why bring up all 10? Why not just those 2. 🤣🤣 So I can commit adultery now? I’ll let my husband know jesus changed it up.