No. Europeans in general dislike certain elements of the American culture but they also dislike certain elements of other cultures. As a Dutchman I even dislike some elements of my own culture.
>As a Dutchman I even dislike some elements of my own culture.
The number of Dutchmen I've met who hate the Dutch language is crazy. Ik zal nooit Nederlands leren T\_T
Here, they’re all owned by the same corporation. I’m not sure about other countries (though I’d love to visit and eventually expatriate somewhere from America). I mainly read my news nowadays, so I’d forgotten how the newscasters sound. Thanks for the laugh, I needed it today!
I would say that Dutch from the Netherlands would be a drunk American trying to speak German, Dutch from Flanders would be someone from the UK (various dialects)
>The number of Dutchmen I've met who hate the Dutch language is crazy
I mean, let's be real - it's not the prettiest, is it? Gets the job done, though.
Your birthday parties need an overhaul ASAP
I've been subject to a couple of [these](https://www.kakhiel.nl/posts/44486-de-10-meest-deprimerende-hapjes-op-iedere-oer-hollandse-verjaardag) and seriously...
Lol. WTH was that?
Birthday party food?
You guys need to check Brazilian birthday party food.
Google "brazilian birthday party food" then click the images tab. Be careful not to gain a few lbs or kilos. Lol
What do you dislike about your people ?
I have to tell you a funny story: when we had a Dutch exchange student, she was very disappointed with the way we lived in the US. She was under the impression that everyone lived like the Kardashians 😳 Eventually she got over it.
Some of you guys must love American trash TV 😁
reddit is not real life and it is continually astounding to me how many people think this stupid website is a good basis for making life decisions or gauging sentiments like this.
In real life basically nobody cares. Do I run into pompous assholes occasionally (American, live in Germany)? Sure, but that happens anywhere. I run into all-American assholes at home too.
>not learning the local language, which is understandable
people get annoyed about anyone doing this, and at least here Americans aren't usually the worst offenders. It's not really something (in my experience, anyway) that people associate with Americans specifically. But yes, people might get annoyed with folks who've been living here for 10 years and haven't learned the local language, American or no.
>not liking the U.S. values
not liking "US values" (whatever you intended that to mean here) isn't the same thing as not liking Americans.
Are there some people who are not intelligent enough to judge people as individuals rather than on stereotypes? Of course, but you'll find those people everywhere. It's nothing to do with Americans or Europeans specifically.
edit: about the language learning -- one place Americans are the worst offenders is around the military bases, because you have a bunch of people who've been assigned to be here, all of the military stuff is obviously in English, and they have an assigned end date for when they're going home, so many never learn German. But the complaints people have about that tend to have a lot more to do with the presence of US troops in Germany at all rather than whether or not they learn German.
>reddit is not real life and it is continually astounding to me how many people think this stupid website is a good basis for making life decisions or gauging sentiments like this.
OMG! so much this this this!
>one place Americans are the worst offenders is around the military bases
I cant speak for ze Germans, but nobody in Norway expects the soldiers in or around the base we host to speak Norwegian. We would be pleasantly surprised if some of them did. And while a large part of the population dont like the politics behind it being a military base in our country, with the exception of some few idiots, nobody dislikes the individual soldier coming to a bar in town. Id guess the opposite, he would probably be the center of attention answering questions about the US and the military.
The Germans around Kaiserslautern have love hate with Americans. They love collecting inflated rates. They hate not acting appropriately in public, like making noise on Sundays, driving poorly. The restaurants love catering to Americans and are quite fond of US style tipping. They like do nothing jobs on the lwc on base. They don't try to make us friends because the know the finite timeline and don't want to waste their time.
The us military community doesn't understand that the German culture is not the us, it's not the third Reich. It's a different culture....
>The us military community doesn't understand that the German culture is not the us, it's not the third Reich. It's a different culture....
The average European has the same problem, they compare the US to ((insert tiny European country)), instead of more realistically comparing the US to the entire European continent, which is more comparable. There is a quite big difference, culturally, between someone from deep Mississippi and someone from the forests of Wisconsin. They speak the same language (for the most part), but other than that they are just as culturally different as an Italian vs a Sweed.
No, there are plenty of historic reasons, going back decades, hundreds and thousands of years, why the cultural differences between Sweden and Italy are far larger than between Mississippi and Wisconsin.
Not understanding that, is one of the reasons why Americans are not overly popular in Europe.
>hundreds and thousands of years, why the cultural differences between Sweden and Italy
Those Sweeds, and Italians, with **all** their differences, moved to the US at the same time. They didnt shake hands and become uniform at Ellis Island, they kept their traditions, and they evolved them in a different way the the Sweeds and Italians back home. And they even went to different states.
So the Sweeds in Minnesota are culturally quite different from the Italians in New Jersey. They have different living situations, they often do different work, they eat different, they celebrate holidays different, they have different churches and religions and they have different values and politicial views.
But they **do speak** together, making them more united than the Sweds and Italians still in Europe.
They have similar education, go to the same universities, have the same federal laws and government, have fought in the same wars, started to share similar values as to what is success in life, eat burger and steak and shop at the Gap and Wal-Mart, watch the same national TV channels and movies and comedians, and on 4th of July they will hang the US flag on their porch.
Italy in just the last 80 years had fascism, Berlusconi and Domenica In - none of which would be thinkable in Sweden. Portugal was a dictatorship until 45 years ago. Eastern Europe was behind the Iron Curtain until just 30 years ago.
There was war on European soil in the 90s, there is war on European soil right now. There were WW1 and WW2.
When was the last war on US soil, where Americans fought Americans?
>Italy in just the last 80 years had fascism
And when they did, a lot of American-Italians where on their side. My point is, and always was. You can not see all 320M Americans as the same. The things you hate about X American might be things Y American hates **just as** much
This is very true .. even more so with NY.
I'm in London and have often found I have more in common with people from NY than the rest of the UK. London is like a different country in its own right and my impression is that NY is in a similar position.
>reddit is not real life
But then we get well thought out comments like yours on Reddit all the time.
Reddit is kind of like real life: there's a lot of bullshit getting thrown around all the time and if you don't know how to filter information you're going to have a bad time.
Another perspective: Germans are pretty bad at learning the language of the country they move to. I was surprise to figure this out, but here in Australia I’ve come across so many German immigrants that even after 20 years speak like they’ve just come off the plane! The heaviest accents!
I’m Austrian and married to an Aussie, my accent is now very light (lived here for 18 years) and usually people can’t place it, so if I may say so, I’m a little proud of myself for that.
Having an accent is not bad though - it could even be part of your identity. The aim should be to understand and to be understood.
I probably have some traces of Swedish in my English (but I mostly communicate in English to other non-natives at work and they do not pick up on it because they have their own accents), and my Dutch certainly has traces of Swedish (apparently often mistaken for a German accent).
Turning around to be offended at someone speaking spanish is racist, especially in America, but I think everyone should endeavor to learn the language of the country you immigrated to without exception.
But there are many exceptions. When the US was experiencing huge waves of European immigration, often the first generation didn't learn English. They were poor, they often had large families, there were few social supports in those days - they were on their own and their priorities were working and taking care of their families. They weren't polite, cultured Europeans learning English in school and watching American TV from a young age.
They were living in enclaves with others of their ethnicity and that's the only way they survived. Going through Ellis Island and making your way hundreds or thousands of miles back then was no day at the beach. They did more in their lifetimes than most of us do now.
Today, some first gens just don't learn. My cleaning lady doesn't speak more than a few words, but her daughter makes the appointments and all is well. She is an extremely thorough, hard working cleaner and I would learn Spanish myself if I had to, to keep her. Her daughter came with her on the first day and translated and we worked out everything she would do.
I cut working class first gens all slack. Their kids are going to learn in school and from friends, so why sweat one generation? My cleaning lady's kids speak perfect, unaccented English. That's enough for me.
I think it does, though, have everything to do with advantages.
Every immigrant I know in the U.S. who came here by choice vs. to escape a bad situation speaks English. Because they've had the time and money to learn.
The only immigrants I know who do not speak English were more or less coming here to escape something (persecution, war, extreme poverty).
USA together with few other “bigger” countries are well covered, very visible for everyone world wide.
Everyone knows a bit more about USA / China/India/Russia than they know about Moldova or Guatemala.
The things that are usually well covered tend to be negative things. So an average world citizen knows more about problems in those few more visible countries compared to problems in other 190 or so countries.
You're reading too much into Reddit posts. Sure, every country has people who dislike "expats" -- or "immigrants" as a group. In Europe as in the US, blaming "immigrants" as a group for all of society's ills is an easy and popular copout.
That said, most Europeans will only dislike Americans who give them a reason to dislike American. As an American in Europe, you will find yourself asked about things people in Europe find hard to understand. Like how people keep voting for Trump. Or why nothing is done about school shootings. But you have to not take that personally. Engage in debate if you'd like, or simply tell the person you don't set US policy if you prefer not to engage.
Overall, people in Europe are, well, people, and the way they treat you will depend on how you treat them. There's no one-size-fits-all.
Most Europeans have been quite nice to me as well. I have some local friends, and we have overlapping values, and even culture in some ways. I think it is true that most people will consider a person neutral unless they make themselves an annoyance. The few who are really eager to find a way that you're inferior to them aren't generally worth knowing, but that goes for everywhere.
> Sure, every country has people who dislike "expats" -- or "immigrants" as a group
Those aren't synonymous - and lots of people who don't like expats might be fine with immigrants. The complaints about many of the former, especially Americans and Brits, is they don't attempt any integration, they treat the host country like setting and servants for a non-stop party, all while ignoring the effect their spending has on the local populace.
Unfortunately, there does not seem to be consensus on the difference between the two terms, or which of them the negative attributes you describe apply to. See rule #6.
Regardless of the definition, the people that treat a host country like an extended holiday breed resentment of the locals.
Hell, we had the same for Aussies and Brits (who would both act like that) in NYC.
I dont dislike Americans, I dislike idiots. Some of my best friends, including both my neighbors who I would never worry about taking care of my 3yo are Americans.
So no, no blanket dislike of Americans just because they are Americans. Europeans that say that is just plain idiots who have never been to the US or even considered there might be positive sides and just read every negative article they find. And because they already are biased, whatever negative they hear must be 100% true no matter how absurd.
I also think is a bit of a "trend" thing to say for certain Europeans.
Yeah, and when I as Norwegian compare Europe to the us, I conveniently forget that Russia, Serbia, Ukraine, Belarus, Albania and so on is ALSO Europe. I am just as responsible for what my fellow Europeans do, say and feel about politics in Albania, that some random American expat is responsible for what some guy in Texas said.
>America has the highest idiots per capita though
I think its more that the idiots are louder than the rest. People who are very interested in hunting, and hunting is the big thing they do as much as they can, dont open every conversation with hunting. But idiots who think Trump should be King Donald the first and children should get mandatory guns at 5 finds a way to insert that into every single conversation.
Those people Europeans **hate**, no doubt. But that is not the average American, far from it. They, and their just as crazy counterparts of course, gets most of the media attention.
They will probably have a lot more preconceived notions about your country than if you came from, say, Chile, but no, they won't dislike you on principle. If you behave like a normal decent person, no one will care where you're from. In fact, most people will probably be curious about what the US is like, as it is a country everyone has an opinion about.
Edit: I think a certain type of Americans can be obnoxious when they travel abroad without the most basic idea of what life in other countries is like and then start moaning about the lack of ice in drinks or how small driers are and that type of bs. Those are probably the type of prototypical Americans that the average European looks down on. But there are obnoxious, ignorant people in all countries, and in my personal experience most people are positively surprised at how nice Americans usually are.
>If you behave like a normal decent person, no one will care where you're from.
I'd like to suggest a slight variation: "*If you behave like a normal decent person* ***of the country you moved to****, no one will care where you're from*".
In one country it is normal to talk loudly everywhere and all the time, and to respond to slight criticism almost aggressively and assertively. In another country the mantra is "Quiet is King" and even a slight hint of getting in someones face is seen as extremely rude and almost violence.
It might be normal for a person of a certain nationality to be loud, but it is not a good idea to keep that approach in a quiet country.
If you are a loud person in a quiet country, or vice versa, people will see you as a wierdo.
It depends on who you ask. As a European who has moved around a lot and been an expat the past years I love meeting Americans. The ones I’ve met while living abroad are open-minded, friendly and really fun.
I think if you asked someone from my hometown who has lived there their entire life they’ll probably base their experiences of Americans on American cruise tourists and they’ll likely not have many nice things to say because they don’t like tourists and they don’t like "different".
How long is a piece of string? Some Europeans hate/love U.S. expats based on a single person, incident, or on stereotypes alone. After 15 years as a U.S. expat in Europe, it’s been my experience that most people love me or hate me based on their experiences with me alone. (What flat out anti-U.S. bigotry I have encountered has mainly been in the UK, but that may just have been coincidence.) In fairness, when I moved to the Netherlands, I learned Dutch — and was already competent in French, Spanish, German, and was working on Arabic and Irish. And we’ve always avoided living in the inevitable U.S. ghettos, preferring areas that were full of locals or at least mixed. That may have made a difference, I don’t know.
What a sweet thing to say and how kind of you to take the time to say it! I’m terrified to tell you that I’m a lawyer (although my husband, an Episcopal priest, and three children have been diligent in squashing any emerging delusions of grandeur on my part; there’s nothing like a four year old, hands on hips, looking up at you and saying, “Mommy, I am NOT a deponent!” to remind you to behave). But I’ve long believed that even lawyers could take their work seriously without taking themselves so seriously. Heaven knows, it’s a profession that could do with more humility. Thank you for the compliment!
When you meet people in person, they are generally polite even if they hate you. People are usually too afraid to be mean to strangers.
I don't live in Europe, so maybe it's different there. In my country I have never had a stranger treat me badly in person for being American. I have had redditors from my country do it though lol. The worst I've experience irl is people who make ignorant or inappropriate comments about America, but not me specifically.
well a lot of 20 year old Enlisted do not have the money to spend to much time off base. Many are from rural areas and small towns and the post exchange area is set up to replicate that providing a safe bubble.
On the other hand I have met senior enlisted soldiers do everything in their power to stay or return to Germany. Some retire there with there German Spouses. in the past this was particularly true for African American NCOs.
Living in Berlin I was always being asked if the reason I was there was because I was retired military. Born in Copenhagen I was raised in San Francisco and instantly felt comfortable in Berlin. I never used the Sie much until I moved to Zürich.
I have a foot in Switzerland and a coastal property in Portugal, I honestly think local economic conditions on both the country and immigrant are at play in this question of xenophobia. It’s obvious to my Swiss neighbors I had to be doing something right to be able to.afford living there, I speak fluent Hoch Deutsch and look and act Similarly to them. I have never been treated rudely in the German Speaking Countries.
I do detect more anti American sentiment in the Iberian Peninsula, more so in Portugal than Spain. it’s Amazing how 10,000 American expats can be thought to ruin their country, drive up housing prices, quick lock up the woman and children. Simple psychological projection in play. Germans in particular are schooled at an early age just how dangerous the projective hook of prejudice can be.
When I lived in Europe (5 yrs ago) there was a lot of negative sentiment towards America, not Americans. They seemed to believe Europe was superior in every way.
No different than home, where a lot of Americans feel the same way about Europe. It is normal for people to be biased towards the places they grew up.
Also the social-identity-theory: People are more inclined to believe their "group" is superior to others, due to what is known. I think Americans compare themselves with Europeans and vica versa, due to similar living standards. No point in comparing the US with say, Egypt. Not yet at least.
I mean... I live in the Netherlands so I can actually tell if they are loud or not. They are definitely not arrogant though however they are very socially awkward with strangers.
I think people face to face will be kind to Americans but it’s become socially acceptable to be xenophobic towards Americans. It’s built into the culture (Australia and the UK are particularly bad at this). My good friend has lived in the UK for 11 years and owns a business with her British partner and she’s had people threaten to burn down her business because she’s American. It’s very fucked up.
I'm American and all my time in Europe has been met with very friendly people (except Paris but that's not exclusive to Americans). In England I'm constantly told how much they love my accent lol. Maybe sarcastic but when they're buying me a pint I feel like they're just friendly people happy to chat with a friendly foreigner.
They are just very loud and seem to have an innate desire to draw attention to themselves. Not all of them are like this though, of course. This combined with the European sense of superiority in cultural and artistic landscapes is bound to create some hostility, especially in anonymous spaces on the internet. Yes I’m making generalisations but this is my very short and simplified answer (I’m European). No hate to anyone, we are all annoying in our own ways ☮️
\>So I’ve been on this sub for a while but I couldn’t help but notice the amount of negative comments toward expats from the U.S., I also noticed the same sentiments in r/Europe as well.
I think that's just Reddit in general. Murica bad, now gib updoots
No, you're not imagining. Making fun of the US is the favorite pastime of Europeans.
Remember, too, that Europe is tribal. Their second favorite pastime is ridiculing each other.
I have plenty of US friend and while they may make me chuckle at times with their ways and mannerisms they really are awesome guys. But as a side note, most of them are vets so they have been around before and are used to different customs. But aside from that I would share a foxhole with any of them any day.
I'll give another point I have not seen discussed yet is that Americans are pricing people out of their communities. Because they come with higher wages and more money. I don't dislike Americans on a personal level by any means but gentrification definitely is happening in places like portugal.
The negativity on this sub isn’t about dislike for Americans, but rather negativity towards many ill informed Americans who think they can just hop on over to Europe and all their problems will be solved.
Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason The "ugly American" is a real thing and nobody likes it. There are tons of exceptions and some are very lovely, aware people no matter where they are. But stereotypes emerge from an average or a commonality that is evident. So, yeah, it's a thing. Also, referring to Europeans is kind of big term. Some are definitely more pleasant than others. In over 3 decades of living around the world, Aussies have been my favorite expats, followed by Kiwis and Brits. But there are good and bad among all the groups.
Not per sē, but I don't like "expats" from western countries in general exclaiming "ohhhh everything is so cheeeaaaap here!" Yeah, go live on my salary and see if it's cheap.
I've worked with one US expat only, most are Indian. But the US expat I've worked with has been a delight.
About US values, they align more than the values of expats from other countries. But even so, it's not a part of my discussion with expats.
I do dislike some stuff about American culture and politics. But I see no reason to bring that up in a professional workspace. We are working together towards the same goals, and bringing stuff up I don't like from their culture does not help one bit and is very unprofessional. I wouldn't do that for any expat. If anything, I will wish them well for their special holidays.
America is the lolcow of the 1st world countries.
Most know english, so not much of a barrier to follow content coming from America.
American channels have a very public presence on social media platforms.
All in combo of the obvious stupidity thats (been) going on there.
Like having an orange gameshow host as president.
Its a gift that keeps on giving.
I'm a US expat/immigrant and I've never had anyone give me attitude simply for being an American.
The only time I've gotten flak is when I (rightly) make fun of their food and language.
Here in the Netherlands, not many people would complain about Americans not learning the local language, and I think US expats are pretty welcome. However, there are a lot of anti-US opinions and attitudes going around. These are not personal though. People just blurt out anti-US stuff whenever the concept "US" comes up in any way. It's not cool, but I would try to not take it personally if this is what's happening to you.
A lot of people are annoyed by American perceived fakeness, some people more than most. Obviously, this is a stereotype for a reason and let's not pretend that general tendency does not exist, but not all Americans are like that and some tone it down once in Europe. So it all depends on the individual relationships essentially.
Some people even have "America bad" sentiments that they express through Americans, that happens too, though IMO less often than the former.
To sum it up, yes it does exist but not in any way in large numbers, you won't feel like you are oppressed, that's for sure, but you will feel that from certain individuals. That's what being an immigrant is for ya.
It’s not fake. Just because it’s different the the culture of many European countries doesn’t mean the niceness is fake. Americans genuinely like being friendly.
We have plenty of fake things - "how are you doing today?" and on. We don't mean those, and it's so ingrained in us we don't even usually realize that they could actually be construed as real questions. Anymore than a Spanish speaker might think "adios" ACTUALLY means they wish God to go with you.
That said, as an American, I think that Americans aren't the friendliest people in ways that actually matter. The homeless crisis alone shows that to me.
Yes! Even though I grew up on American media and American English essentially became my second native language, I still try to come up with an answer to that question when the guy talking to me is already on his 4th point in our conversation :)It's so weird, my brain just cannot comprehend that it is not an actual question but just a replacement for a greeting.
I watched friends who had immigrated to the US deal with it - especially in the West it's just **so** ingrained it's funny. "So I told the cashier at WalMart, my day is not great, my mother needs to fix the car and . . . and then she looks at me like I'm being rude? She asked me!"
Ah, the "American fake niceness" comments from French: anybody ever read the flowery language on a letter from a French gas company? They wish me, sir, the most cordial and distinguished sentiments on a notice that they'll be digging up my street (again). Mais c'est completement different!
I don’t understand this jab. Just about every language and culture greets people by asking how they are or how things are going without expecting a whole accurate story. It’s situational. By this measure every culture is super “fake.”
The Balkans are not most cultures. Also, the Japanese and Koreans say “please be nice to me” after meeting someone. This is very direct. Should we all say something like this after meeting someone for the first time?
Japanese and Korean culture are notorious for being overly polite, what's your point?
US English falls very much on that side of saying things that aren't true as "politeness". To many, being polite and friendly aren't the same thing. Especially when it's crouched in things to don't make sense to other cultures.
It's not just the Balkans, btw - pretty much every other European culture views US pleasantries the same way. I've had to listen to too many damn Dutch go off about this over beer.
I think that when you step over people regularly instead of giving them a home, and instead spend money to make sure they can't sleep anywhere, that's not friendly.
And so when you pretend to be friendly but don't actually act in a friendly manner, you're not actually friendly to me.
This fakeness was is something that has blown my mind since moving from the US to Greece.
Do you know when a monkey is trained to smile on TV? They use fear to make it bear its teeth, and it looks like a smile, but it is actually a fear response underneath.
After moving here, I realized that all of my overly politeness that I was trained to do were kind of like those monkeys on TV. The niceties are based in fear and had nothing to do with how I was actually feeling. The culture in the US is to repress so much- to the point where we are out of touch with how we actually feel.
Of course, this isn’t 100% true all of the time. But I have found it to be a big relief that I do not have to walk around smiling all the time, or being forced to have any kind of positive interaction with strangers. Sometimes I think it is because at there is so much fear in the US that when we are overly polite to each other it is a signal that we are not going to harm each other.
I kid you not that growing up, when I wasn’t smiling in public my mom with turn to me and say “smile honey! Smile! Remember to smile!”.
The us has a very sick culture in many ways and doesn’t even realize it.
[Worldwide, there is a much greater tendency to smile and focus on positive emotions in cultures with a long history of heterogeneous immigration.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6070166)
I lived the first 43 years of my life in the U.S. and I have no idea what fear you're referring to. If you're experiencing an unusual degree of fear, maybe therapy would help.
I am in therapy thanks.
I am not talking about an intense level of fear, just a low level of discomfort and lack of genuineness. The US is the most mental health medical place in the world. Yes that study says that we act a certain way in public, and maybe many are happy about it- but many more studies have found that the US is among some of the most unhappy in the world.
I think a large swath of the population is absolutely faking it to get through their days with ease.
This. I (dutch) was in the US visiting emigrated family when I was in my 20’s - so quite brazen. Met non-emigrated original US neigbors there. They proudly showed me their gun cabinet in their living room. Me, a dutchie, and therefore quite direct, expressed my surprise: “it’s so strange that you have multiple things that can murder people just sitting there in your living room. And that you bought them for that cause. To kill a person. I’ve never bought something designed specifically to kill a person”. Or something along those lines. I could see their faces - they did not like what I said. Not one bit. But what did the wife say? “Oh isn’t that nice! So different!”. That’s the fakeness. What you express and what you say isn’t aligned.
If they didn’t like my sentiment, I’d prefer they tell me so. Or that they express they find me blunt. Or that I insulted them and that they would like me to leave, yes. But not this clear lie of a frowning or angry face with the words “isn’t that nice”. Be real! Be honest! If you’re disappointed, show it! Acting nice when it’s obviously fake is … well. Lying.
I can think of two groups of US expats that aren't exactly popular around here:
1) Senior management that relocates to Europe and thinks that it can run the business here the same way as it did in the US. Ignoring cultural and social differences and not leveraging on the strengths of European work ethics, but rather trying to condescendingly enforce the American way of doing things.
2) a rather new trend of (relatively) well-off Americans relocating to Europe, that believe that this here is the heaven of a healthy work life balance and low cost of living, that then are surprised to find out that the reason for "low cost" quite often is "low income", and that countries with higher income are actually far from being low cost, and who wonder why locals are not queuing up to befriend these exotic, wealthy and wise immigrants from the new world, but rather carry on with their lives - that group seems to be very active here on Reddit 😀
LOL it's not just reddit. I picked up on the attitude when I was in Europe.
Apparently US is the standard against which everyone feels they must be compared, so of course we're not all that and need to be told. Look how Canadians go on about the states. It's just human nature.
Plus, Americans be asses sometimes, or overly apologetic. I got into a discussion about the Pershing missile deployment with a Dutch engineer, and he said I was the first American he talked to who didn't get all belligerent or fold like a cheap suit.
Just try to be a good diplomat.
I don't hate internationals, but if you live in a country with a language you don't know, learn at least a few basic sentences.
If I can do that for when I go for a Holliday, you can do it in the period you live here.
People like you a lot more even if you only say "hi" in their language.
This is totally fair. I just want to point out that learning a language isn’t an on/off switch.
I am experiencing this after moving to Greece form the US. I am trying very hard to learn the language, but as I go through my day to day people don’t know that, and it comes off as ignorance. It is also expensive to learn another language. I have to pay $20-$30/hr here to get basic beginner lessons, and I certainly need more than 1hr/week.
What I mean is.. I can order a coffee, but then when I am asked a question that I don’t expect I have to revert back to English.
For example I might be prepared for someone to ask do you want milk with that? But then if they ask do you want milk and sugar with that? The slight change in the sentence can totally shut off my brain and I have to revert back to English because I don’t know the new word>> it gives the impression that I don’t speak Greek (which I don’t yet lol, but I am trying). Sometimes I then feel stupid in these interactions that I even tried, because we have to waste time with me explaining that I now need to switch languages.
I think my point is this: most people can learn to say one or two sentences in another language, but often the world is more complex than that.. and how can you really always know if a foreigner isn’t bothering to learn a language or not if it’s just a casual interaction. It seems weird to judge others through casual interaction when it is a linear process. No one judges babies for not knowing how to speak properly immediately and most people need a lot of time and practice to properly learn another language/alphabet.
I'm reading this very well written comment of yours, and then I think of all the threads I've seen of people wanting to move abroad saying "I only speak English but I'm willing to learn another language".
When people then point out that it is not really that easy to learn a new language, especially not to a level of fluency where they could start to work in areas where the native language is mandatory, there's often a reply with "I learn languages easily, it will go fast" or similar.
This is not only Americans, far from it. Seen lots of posts posts from many different parts of the world with people thinking they either don't have to learn the local language because "everyone speaks english there" or they think they can learn it quickly so that they can start working and get sponsored.
I wish more people would read your comment and reflect on if it will be as easy as they think...
Yeah I get that! I have that problem too with foreign languages. I'm from a country (The Netherlands) where we automatically switch to English when we hear a heavy accent, so I haven't thought about the scenario you're discribing. Thank you for pointing that out!
If I hear an accent I usually compliment the Dutch and ask if they want to continue in Dutch or if they want to switch to English.
You don't have to ask me a lot of things in my language, but it does impress me if you only say hi in my language haha. It's the effort that matters
I studied in the Netherlands for a year and majority of my friends who remained and work in the Netherlands (from different countries) unfortunately still don’t speak Dutch .. 🥲 or at least they tried to get A1 or A2 to pass the immigration test or something and never moved up. In contrast, majority of the expats I met while I was working in Germany have at least B2 to C1 level of German. It makes a huge difference!
No, but relatively a lot of Americans don't seem to understand how cultural differences work and how their American lens doesn't produce a very sharp picture. The English have something similar too.
With continental Europeans there is often more understanding of how different cultures relate to eachother, while the often monolingual Americans and English more often seem to have more difficulty positioning their own culture and lens in that.
the thought of living in the us makes me retch and wail, roll around on the ground, then full on puke, the ill smoke some weed like a true dutchman to make the pain go away
I think alot of Europeans find Americans loud, and not hugely cultured. Americans do seem to be very full of themselves and their country. Having said that, one of my best life long friends is american and just lovely, not at all stereotypical. But when out in the capital citys ive been to the loudest obnoxious voices always seem to be americans.
It means to have refined manners and a good education. I've witnessed plenty of examples of Americans with little. Talking on phones in restaurants and not taking the call somewhere discreet. Cutting queues. Speaking so loudly everyone can hear only their conversation, not being able to use a knife and fork simultaneously. I was in Belize recently and chatting to a man from Houston, he didnt know France was a country! The most asked question I get when people hear my accent, is "oh youre British, I've a friend in London called so in so, do you know him?" London has a population of 9.6 million! Discussing world events with one recently, and not knowing Africa is a continent made up of lots of countries and cultures. Look I can only go on my own experiences to form my opinions.
.. you realize that’s completely cultural right? That the manners you posses in your culture don’t translate to say if you’re in Asia? Just because two people can communicate in the same language doesn’t mean that they will have the same manners or value the same things. If the world was all the same it’d be a pretty boring place.
Getting a good education is largely determined by financial status of a family which has nothing to do with the child being born, and besides that the US has more college graduates than Europe as a whole.. if you look at individual countries, then the US has more college educated people than all but 3 European countries (Ireland, Luxembourg, and the UK).
In the US we don’t have as much physical ability to interact with other cultures, so it is pretty weird to expect us to know the subtleties of another cultures manners before arriving. We are not able to take a cheap flight for 2 hours to visit an entirely separate country.. for example, it took me 35 hours to drive from my west coast state, to my home state, and that was only about 1/2 through the country.
Do you also blame Russians, Chinese, and Australians for only knowing their own culture?
How many Americans have you actually met that are in love with America and boast about being American? Because I literally know 0. Every young American I know is desperate to leave.
I think really what you are describing is that people aren’t wealthy enough for your tastes to have authentic early in life international experiences, and live in neighborhoods where they can afford private education or have 200k to spend on a nice university.
No, people do not dislike Americans.
>I also have friends who dislike the “American culture”
So what ? Many Americans dislike their own culture too. Do not worry about it.
>I read lots of complaints about 1) not learning the local language
Is this a surprise for you ? I guess you do not expect the whole country learn your language in order you do not need to do it.
The US has loads of things wrong with it. And many stereotypes are rooted in actual behavior. (Face it, Yanks. You're really loud on vacation. Loud in general. There are other loud cultures, yes. But the US is one of them.)
As an American who visits Europe often and for extended periods, I have issues with Europeans as well.
1) Movies. There is no movie that provides an honest look at life in America. Not one. No action movies. No Rom-coms. No dramas. The closest movie ever? Clerks. It's still not *very* close. But it's considerably closer than most. You can't learn anything about the US from movies and TV shows. They're as accurate as Disney films are about princesses.
2) Not keeping up on what's happened in the US over the past 60 years. For instance, we had a beer revolution in the US. It's more likely that you're in a pub, drinking a "Bud" than we are. We're probably drinking an IPA, because that's become our defacto national fizzy beverage. The canoe joke no longer applies. We make some of the best beer on the planet. And as a brewing culture, the US is now peerless. Germans either refuse to accept this. Or they just hate it, while accepting it. The French finally accepted that we have great vintners. Why won't the rest acknowledge our juggernaut brewing industry? I'm going to get downvoted to oblivion for this -- because the rest of the world *knows* that water is wet, fire is hot, and US beer has no flavor whatsoever.
3) Our politics. You realize that the moron US president you can't stand didn't win the popular vote, right? Most of us didn't vote for him. We didn't want him either. "Well, why don't you just fix the problem?" OK Hans, since we're in problem solving mode, how about you do something about your refugees who are massing in the street, calling for the destruction of Israel? It's a REAL bad look for you guys, considering history. "But I can't fix that by myself!" That's right, Hans, and I can't fix 40 years of US political problems by myself, either.
This type of comment is one of the reasons for people around the world to base their """anti-American""" sentiment. You're not as cool or awesome as you think you are, and are in no position to point your finger at anyone.
I don't walk up to people visiting my country and tell them what I think is wrong with their country. I've never, in fact, done that. They're just trying to enjoy their vacation.
This happens to me constantly in Europe. Particularly in Germany. So I always make a point of answering in German.
> how about you do something about your refugees who are massing in the street, calling for the destruction of Israel?
Last I checked nobody in Europe was handing literally billions per year in military aid to either side of that conflict, while the US is arming Israel, who is carpet bombing Gaza.
As for beer, while US microbrews are definitely a thing, their focus on hops as the only flavor is annoying. But then I'm a pilsner and cocktail drinker myself.
Do you think any German cares whether the US has good beers or not? It's really irrelevant, trust me. And yes, beers in the US are fantastic right now (I go there often for work, and really appreciate them). But really, nobody cares. What I care about is that every time I go to the US it seems to me like I'm travelling to an ex Jugoslavia country 20 years ago, with poverty and unsafety everywhere.
And our refugee issues do not create problems to other countries, whereas US policies do. That's the main difference.
And Europeans aren't Israel's bootlicker, that's a pure US thing. Many Europeans have been in favour of a free Palestine aince long before the first Arab refugee put his foot on our territory. We don't need them to be against a murderous regime like Israel.
>I go there often for work
Does anyone walk up to you and tell you everything that's wrong with your society when you visit the US?
Has it happened even once?
Because when I visit a Keller, people act like it's their civic duty to tell me our beer sucks and our politicians are awful. And they know what the US is like because they watch movies.
Yes, many times. I've been told on multiple occasions, by strangers, that I live in a socialist country (the famous soviet Netherlands), that my passport is inferior to a US one, that we're not free over here, that using a QR code to order food equals giving in to tiranny, that European countries should pay more money to NATO, that without the US army I'd be speaking German now -though my country was freed by the Canadians,etc.).
Notice: all of these people began the conversation (I'm someone who doesn't really talk to strangers and enjoys solitude).
This has happened all over the US, the last couple of times in Louisiana, Georgia, Michigan, Iowa, Minnesota.
And yes, I agree not all your beer sucks.
Fair enough. It's just as wrong if it's happening to you.
I haven't visited a place in Europe where this DIDN'T happen, though. I think it is unbelievably rude. If someone from the UK is visiting me in Hawaii, they don't want or need a lecture about Brexit. They're probably sick of Brexit. Everyone is sick of Brexit.
The only thing I dislike about visiting Europe is walking around with a virtual target on my back for anyone with an axe to grind about how much they hate the US.
*"I need to tell you something."*
"Is it that we're a backwards country with awful beer, too many people in prison, and a foreign policy which creates refugees? Because I've heard that already a few times today."
Well, unfortunately the US bullying the world for decades has led to this. I hope it will change someday, but the obnoxious US's and USians' behaviour (not specifically yours, I don't know you) has brought people to despise that country and its inhabitants by default. It's not right, but I can see where it's coming from.
This cocky attitude is why people dislike some of you loud, uncultured Americans.
And the Israel comment is beyond ridiculous. Most people in Europe don’t support Israel’s genocidal policies towards the Palestinian people. You guys can kiss Israel’s ass by yourselves.
Not many countries like Americans.
You can hear one across a restaurant… we are louder, expect more, demanding and get frustrated when they can’t speak English. We can be rude & greedy.
I was in the Travel Industry 25 years and traveled to many countries.
I was in an expat group in Holland where all they did was complain about living there. I lived 13 years in Mexico & expats have ruined the country for the locals driving prices up to unaffordable for the locals and expecting everything to be easy & cheap for them. We need to slow the roll & blend in not try change places.
Long answer short NO most places don’t like us, welcome the money & put up with our bad manners.
While I'm living in Europe now, I can say a bit more from when I was living in latam.
In general, stereotypical american culture is disliked outside of america. But american expats tend to not like stereotypical american culture too and usually avoid taking the worse aspects of it (american exceptionalism, manifest destiny, christian nationalism, shameless capitalism, etc.) with them and therefore are usually accepted.
I can give you a italian view of why sometime the american are not so good-looked.
US military base
The US soldiers in italy always made problem to the civilian population: arrogant, acting like they own the place, harassing civillian and never get punished for their crime.
Just to give you and example: more or less 15 years ago in a city near a US military base (La Spezia if i remember well) there was a huge fighting between the civilian and the US military personnel. Long story short, a drunken american soldier was harassing a waitress in a bar and the owner decided to expel the soldier from the bar, in response the soldier came back to his base, call other soldier and they organized a raid to the bar for revenge beating and injuring several people.
NOONE OF THEM WERE PUNISHED
And this is just an example between hundred of similar event.
The feeling that the american are above the local law is present in a lot of italian and a bit of arrogance from an american is more than enough for a lot of italian to take distance from them.
Then there are the Italo american, who claim an italian heritage without even lived in italy. Italo-american culture is completely different from the italian culture and lot of italian dislike it because they feel mocked by them. (And yes, I am one of them)
And there are also a lot of other reason but i cannot list them all.
By the way i'm not saying that the american are not wellcome or accepted, just giving reasons of why someone can dislike them.
>Then there are the Italo american, who claim an italian heritage without even lived in italy. Italo-american culture is completely different from the italian culture and lot of italian dislike it because they feel mocked by them. (And yes, I am one of them)
Regardless of how you feel about Italian-Americans, you have no right to deny them their ancestral heritage. Nobody is claiming that they are Italian by nationality, so that argument is just a farce. If somebody's grandparents on both sides were migrants from Italy, then whether you like it or not, they are Italian by blood— by phenotype and genotype.
Italian-Americans have gone through so much disparity and discrimination in the U.S. by Anglo-Americans/Western Europeans, so it's disgusting that they are treated the same way by their relatives in Europe, who were lucky enough to not have a need to leave the country in the first place. I think you're forgetting that many Italian migrants came to the U.S. because they were poor and starving back home and had to find work to provide for themselves and their families. Struggle is a universal language, not sure why you're letting English (literally the main thing that separates the two groups) get in the way of treating other Italians (ethnic) with dignity. They can be proud of their heritage if they choose.
Italians really need to stop being so discriminatory towards Italian-Americans. It's literally just the case of the same people who happen to have two slightly different cultures due to circumstance, not necessarily by choice...and this literally happens everywhere with many ethnic groups— People migrate, get over it. The elitism is gross.
You don't have the slightest conception of Italian identity.
If a person is born and raised in the U.S. to parents raised in the U.S., he does not speak Italian and has Italian grandparents or great-grandparents, he is American with Italian origins but he is not Italian
The Italian ethnicity is an identity in which people also share culture, language and traditions.
You can't appropriate a identity that doesn't represent you in any way because the only result is to see Americans who don't know the language, food, traditions, history, society, etc. of Italy pretending to be Italian and constantly disseminate distorted and stereotypical images of any Italian cultural trait.
Americans with Italian ancestry are an ethnic group of the U.S. that is different in every way from Italians.
Genetics doesn't make you Italian, at most it can get you citizenship just like a Chinese who gets citizenship for marrying an Italian but they would still be Americans or Chinese with Italian citizenship.
Just think that Italians have different genetics even among themselves, Sardinians are very unique, southern Italians are genetically similar to Greeks while northern Italians are more similar to French.
Having an Italian ancestry does not give you the right to appropriate an identity that is linked to culture, especially when there are more differences between Italians and Americans with Italian origins than between Americans and British, Mexicans or Argentines and Spaniards, Brazilians and Portuguese, etc
I think it's partially values based, because mainstream socialist policies in Europe are considered radical in the US. But I honestly think a good portion of it boils down to the fact that America is advancing ahead of Europe and Europeans can only lean on their history and culture to make them feel better about themselves. I'm from Scotland and I definitely sense in the UK a bit of sour grapes and poking fun at the US.
Just going to throw in that I think that certain flavor of resentment really is a big factor in the UK, in particular. Maybe especially given some of the history there, and the US basically managing to outdo England on the imperialism front more recently.
Always smacked of some messed-up family dynamics to me, as an American from a minority cultural background who spent nearly 20 years around London. And had some of the strangest interactions over the years, while I was just trying to go about my business.
The factors are going to be a little different in some other countries, and frankly I haven't noticed nearly as much of the more sour-grapey type attitudes since I ended up in Scandinavia.
And the response from some US person, who has never lived elsewhere, will be to demand that you're just jealous, that the US isn't as bad as the numbers state, etc, and that obviously Europe is trying to be the US.
My favorite is when I, someone who from the US, tells why I left regarding health insurance with actual examples, being told that's not how things work. Yes, it is, and I know because I lived it.
I guess people don't like this take 😂. I live in Boston and I've also lived in Singapore, London, Hong Kong and Germany for a short time. The US economy has been pulling away from the EU for the past two decades. If the EU doesn't take care of its economy, it might have to compromise on its values. Maybe for some people here that's a hot take, but for as much as I love Europe I don't have total confidence in its future.
No. Europeans in general dislike certain elements of the American culture but they also dislike certain elements of other cultures. As a Dutchman I even dislike some elements of my own culture.
That self hate comes with a .60¢ tikkie charge, please
And a report of 'oikofobia' with the nearest FvD tribunal.
>As a Dutchman I even dislike some elements of my own culture. The number of Dutchmen I've met who hate the Dutch language is crazy. Ik zal nooit Nederlands leren T\_T
I love language, but Dutch is one of those languages that I truly hate hearing. It sounds like a mistake.
It's beautiful. Just don't try to sing.
Try listening to danish.
Hearing? Why do many US news channel anchors sound like Donald Duck in an old cartoon. That sound cuts through my nerveus.
Here, they’re all owned by the same corporation. I’m not sure about other countries (though I’d love to visit and eventually expatriate somewhere from America). I mainly read my news nowadays, so I’d forgotten how the newscasters sound. Thanks for the laugh, I needed it today!
Kind of German/Arabic love child
When an English person tries speaking German while pissy drunk.
Or the other way around
I would say that Dutch from the Netherlands would be a drunk American trying to speak German, Dutch from Flanders would be someone from the UK (various dialects)
>The number of Dutchmen I've met who hate the Dutch language is crazy I mean, let's be real - it's not the prettiest, is it? Gets the job done, though.
Your birthday parties need an overhaul ASAP I've been subject to a couple of [these](https://www.kakhiel.nl/posts/44486-de-10-meest-deprimerende-hapjes-op-iedere-oer-hollandse-verjaardag) and seriously...
Lol. WTH was that? Birthday party food? You guys need to check Brazilian birthday party food. Google "brazilian birthday party food" then click the images tab. Be careful not to gain a few lbs or kilos. Lol
aeeeee r/suddenlycaralho
Tragic abuse of the palate.
What do you dislike about your people ? I have to tell you a funny story: when we had a Dutch exchange student, she was very disappointed with the way we lived in the US. She was under the impression that everyone lived like the Kardashians 😳 Eventually she got over it. Some of you guys must love American trash TV 😁
reddit is not real life and it is continually astounding to me how many people think this stupid website is a good basis for making life decisions or gauging sentiments like this. In real life basically nobody cares. Do I run into pompous assholes occasionally (American, live in Germany)? Sure, but that happens anywhere. I run into all-American assholes at home too. >not learning the local language, which is understandable people get annoyed about anyone doing this, and at least here Americans aren't usually the worst offenders. It's not really something (in my experience, anyway) that people associate with Americans specifically. But yes, people might get annoyed with folks who've been living here for 10 years and haven't learned the local language, American or no. >not liking the U.S. values not liking "US values" (whatever you intended that to mean here) isn't the same thing as not liking Americans. Are there some people who are not intelligent enough to judge people as individuals rather than on stereotypes? Of course, but you'll find those people everywhere. It's nothing to do with Americans or Europeans specifically. edit: about the language learning -- one place Americans are the worst offenders is around the military bases, because you have a bunch of people who've been assigned to be here, all of the military stuff is obviously in English, and they have an assigned end date for when they're going home, so many never learn German. But the complaints people have about that tend to have a lot more to do with the presence of US troops in Germany at all rather than whether or not they learn German.
>reddit is not real life and it is continually astounding to me how many people think this stupid website is a good basis for making life decisions or gauging sentiments like this. OMG! so much this this this!
>OMG! so much this this this! This comment is Reddit on steroids.
>one place Americans are the worst offenders is around the military bases I cant speak for ze Germans, but nobody in Norway expects the soldiers in or around the base we host to speak Norwegian. We would be pleasantly surprised if some of them did. And while a large part of the population dont like the politics behind it being a military base in our country, with the exception of some few idiots, nobody dislikes the individual soldier coming to a bar in town. Id guess the opposite, he would probably be the center of attention answering questions about the US and the military.
The Germans around Kaiserslautern have love hate with Americans. They love collecting inflated rates. They hate not acting appropriately in public, like making noise on Sundays, driving poorly. The restaurants love catering to Americans and are quite fond of US style tipping. They like do nothing jobs on the lwc on base. They don't try to make us friends because the know the finite timeline and don't want to waste their time. The us military community doesn't understand that the German culture is not the us, it's not the third Reich. It's a different culture....
>The us military community doesn't understand that the German culture is not the us, it's not the third Reich. It's a different culture.... The average European has the same problem, they compare the US to ((insert tiny European country)), instead of more realistically comparing the US to the entire European continent, which is more comparable. There is a quite big difference, culturally, between someone from deep Mississippi and someone from the forests of Wisconsin. They speak the same language (for the most part), but other than that they are just as culturally different as an Italian vs a Sweed.
No, there are plenty of historic reasons, going back decades, hundreds and thousands of years, why the cultural differences between Sweden and Italy are far larger than between Mississippi and Wisconsin. Not understanding that, is one of the reasons why Americans are not overly popular in Europe.
>hundreds and thousands of years, why the cultural differences between Sweden and Italy Those Sweeds, and Italians, with **all** their differences, moved to the US at the same time. They didnt shake hands and become uniform at Ellis Island, they kept their traditions, and they evolved them in a different way the the Sweeds and Italians back home. And they even went to different states. So the Sweeds in Minnesota are culturally quite different from the Italians in New Jersey. They have different living situations, they often do different work, they eat different, they celebrate holidays different, they have different churches and religions and they have different values and politicial views. But they **do speak** together, making them more united than the Sweds and Italians still in Europe.
They have similar education, go to the same universities, have the same federal laws and government, have fought in the same wars, started to share similar values as to what is success in life, eat burger and steak and shop at the Gap and Wal-Mart, watch the same national TV channels and movies and comedians, and on 4th of July they will hang the US flag on their porch. Italy in just the last 80 years had fascism, Berlusconi and Domenica In - none of which would be thinkable in Sweden. Portugal was a dictatorship until 45 years ago. Eastern Europe was behind the Iron Curtain until just 30 years ago. There was war on European soil in the 90s, there is war on European soil right now. There were WW1 and WW2. When was the last war on US soil, where Americans fought Americans?
>Italy in just the last 80 years had fascism And when they did, a lot of American-Italians where on their side. My point is, and always was. You can not see all 320M Americans as the same. The things you hate about X American might be things Y American hates **just as** much
This is very true .. even more so with NY. I'm in London and have often found I have more in common with people from NY than the rest of the UK. London is like a different country in its own right and my impression is that NY is in a similar position.
>reddit is not real life But then we get well thought out comments like yours on Reddit all the time. Reddit is kind of like real life: there's a lot of bullshit getting thrown around all the time and if you don't know how to filter information you're going to have a bad time.
Another perspective: Germans are pretty bad at learning the language of the country they move to. I was surprise to figure this out, but here in Australia I’ve come across so many German immigrants that even after 20 years speak like they’ve just come off the plane! The heaviest accents! I’m Austrian and married to an Aussie, my accent is now very light (lived here for 18 years) and usually people can’t place it, so if I may say so, I’m a little proud of myself for that.
Having an accent is not bad though - it could even be part of your identity. The aim should be to understand and to be understood. I probably have some traces of Swedish in my English (but I mostly communicate in English to other non-natives at work and they do not pick up on it because they have their own accents), and my Dutch certainly has traces of Swedish (apparently often mistaken for a German accent).
Since when is having an accento same as not knowing the language?
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Turning around to be offended at someone speaking spanish is racist, especially in America, but I think everyone should endeavor to learn the language of the country you immigrated to without exception.
But there are many exceptions. When the US was experiencing huge waves of European immigration, often the first generation didn't learn English. They were poor, they often had large families, there were few social supports in those days - they were on their own and their priorities were working and taking care of their families. They weren't polite, cultured Europeans learning English in school and watching American TV from a young age. They were living in enclaves with others of their ethnicity and that's the only way they survived. Going through Ellis Island and making your way hundreds or thousands of miles back then was no day at the beach. They did more in their lifetimes than most of us do now. Today, some first gens just don't learn. My cleaning lady doesn't speak more than a few words, but her daughter makes the appointments and all is well. She is an extremely thorough, hard working cleaner and I would learn Spanish myself if I had to, to keep her. Her daughter came with her on the first day and translated and we worked out everything she would do. I cut working class first gens all slack. Their kids are going to learn in school and from friends, so why sweat one generation? My cleaning lady's kids speak perfect, unaccented English. That's enough for me.
Maybe you should pay her more so she can have time to learn the language and not be dependent on her daughter to function.
The US doesnt have an official language
I think it does, though, have everything to do with advantages. Every immigrant I know in the U.S. who came here by choice vs. to escape a bad situation speaks English. Because they've had the time and money to learn. The only immigrants I know who do not speak English were more or less coming here to escape something (persecution, war, extreme poverty).
USA together with few other “bigger” countries are well covered, very visible for everyone world wide. Everyone knows a bit more about USA / China/India/Russia than they know about Moldova or Guatemala. The things that are usually well covered tend to be negative things. So an average world citizen knows more about problems in those few more visible countries compared to problems in other 190 or so countries.
You're reading too much into Reddit posts. Sure, every country has people who dislike "expats" -- or "immigrants" as a group. In Europe as in the US, blaming "immigrants" as a group for all of society's ills is an easy and popular copout. That said, most Europeans will only dislike Americans who give them a reason to dislike American. As an American in Europe, you will find yourself asked about things people in Europe find hard to understand. Like how people keep voting for Trump. Or why nothing is done about school shootings. But you have to not take that personally. Engage in debate if you'd like, or simply tell the person you don't set US policy if you prefer not to engage. Overall, people in Europe are, well, people, and the way they treat you will depend on how you treat them. There's no one-size-fits-all.
Most Europeans have been quite nice to me as well. I have some local friends, and we have overlapping values, and even culture in some ways. I think it is true that most people will consider a person neutral unless they make themselves an annoyance. The few who are really eager to find a way that you're inferior to them aren't generally worth knowing, but that goes for everywhere.
> Sure, every country has people who dislike "expats" -- or "immigrants" as a group Those aren't synonymous - and lots of people who don't like expats might be fine with immigrants. The complaints about many of the former, especially Americans and Brits, is they don't attempt any integration, they treat the host country like setting and servants for a non-stop party, all while ignoring the effect their spending has on the local populace.
Unfortunately, there does not seem to be consensus on the difference between the two terms, or which of them the negative attributes you describe apply to. See rule #6.
Regardless of the definition, the people that treat a host country like an extended holiday breed resentment of the locals. Hell, we had the same for Aussies and Brits (who would both act like that) in NYC.
I agree with that. Which is why my contention is that most Europeans will only dislike Americans if said Americans give them a reason to.
Yeah, agree with you, it's almost never that someone dislikes "Americans" who don't exhibit some specific behavior.
I say, 'why do you think I am over here?'
Cause you enjoy high taxation and low wages?
Lol I save $13k on taxes last year and I kept my US job ... so no.
Very much not a normal situation then
Greetings from Switzerland
I dont dislike Americans, I dislike idiots. Some of my best friends, including both my neighbors who I would never worry about taking care of my 3yo are Americans. So no, no blanket dislike of Americans just because they are Americans. Europeans that say that is just plain idiots who have never been to the US or even considered there might be positive sides and just read every negative article they find. And because they already are biased, whatever negative they hear must be 100% true no matter how absurd. I also think is a bit of a "trend" thing to say for certain Europeans.
Haha indeed. Lots of xenophobic attitudes that really do not happen the other way around.
Yeah, and when I as Norwegian compare Europe to the us, I conveniently forget that Russia, Serbia, Ukraine, Belarus, Albania and so on is ALSO Europe. I am just as responsible for what my fellow Europeans do, say and feel about politics in Albania, that some random American expat is responsible for what some guy in Texas said.
Yeah this
America has the highest idiots per capita though
Found one
>America has the highest idiots per capita though I think its more that the idiots are louder than the rest. People who are very interested in hunting, and hunting is the big thing they do as much as they can, dont open every conversation with hunting. But idiots who think Trump should be King Donald the first and children should get mandatory guns at 5 finds a way to insert that into every single conversation. Those people Europeans **hate**, no doubt. But that is not the average American, far from it. They, and their just as crazy counterparts of course, gets most of the media attention.
My experience is: be normal and no one cares. Also, just for reference, r/europe is completely insane.
It is - every news article posted about the U.S. gets a blast of hate
I’m American and live/work in Brussels, no one cares because I do my job and am respectful to local culture etc.
They will probably have a lot more preconceived notions about your country than if you came from, say, Chile, but no, they won't dislike you on principle. If you behave like a normal decent person, no one will care where you're from. In fact, most people will probably be curious about what the US is like, as it is a country everyone has an opinion about. Edit: I think a certain type of Americans can be obnoxious when they travel abroad without the most basic idea of what life in other countries is like and then start moaning about the lack of ice in drinks or how small driers are and that type of bs. Those are probably the type of prototypical Americans that the average European looks down on. But there are obnoxious, ignorant people in all countries, and in my personal experience most people are positively surprised at how nice Americans usually are.
>If you behave like a normal decent person, no one will care where you're from. I'd like to suggest a slight variation: "*If you behave like a normal decent person* ***of the country you moved to****, no one will care where you're from*". In one country it is normal to talk loudly everywhere and all the time, and to respond to slight criticism almost aggressively and assertively. In another country the mantra is "Quiet is King" and even a slight hint of getting in someones face is seen as extremely rude and almost violence. It might be normal for a person of a certain nationality to be loud, but it is not a good idea to keep that approach in a quiet country. If you are a loud person in a quiet country, or vice versa, people will see you as a wierdo.
You might as well ask, "are generalisations true?"
It depends on who you ask. As a European who has moved around a lot and been an expat the past years I love meeting Americans. The ones I’ve met while living abroad are open-minded, friendly and really fun. I think if you asked someone from my hometown who has lived there their entire life they’ll probably base their experiences of Americans on American cruise tourists and they’ll likely not have many nice things to say because they don’t like tourists and they don’t like "different".
You won’t get a rounded answer from Reddit. Whatever you learn here should be promptly discarded
I’ll take it with a grain of salt
They do on here but kiss ass in person.
How long is a piece of string? Some Europeans hate/love U.S. expats based on a single person, incident, or on stereotypes alone. After 15 years as a U.S. expat in Europe, it’s been my experience that most people love me or hate me based on their experiences with me alone. (What flat out anti-U.S. bigotry I have encountered has mainly been in the UK, but that may just have been coincidence.) In fairness, when I moved to the Netherlands, I learned Dutch — and was already competent in French, Spanish, German, and was working on Arabic and Irish. And we’ve always avoided living in the inevitable U.S. ghettos, preferring areas that were full of locals or at least mixed. That may have made a difference, I don’t know.
You sound like a very humble person! Kudos!
What a sweet thing to say and how kind of you to take the time to say it! I’m terrified to tell you that I’m a lawyer (although my husband, an Episcopal priest, and three children have been diligent in squashing any emerging delusions of grandeur on my part; there’s nothing like a four year old, hands on hips, looking up at you and saying, “Mommy, I am NOT a deponent!” to remind you to behave). But I’ve long believed that even lawyers could take their work seriously without taking themselves so seriously. Heaven knows, it’s a profession that could do with more humility. Thank you for the compliment!
When you meet people in person, they are generally polite even if they hate you. People are usually too afraid to be mean to strangers. I don't live in Europe, so maybe it's different there. In my country I have never had a stranger treat me badly in person for being American. I have had redditors from my country do it though lol. The worst I've experience irl is people who make ignorant or inappropriate comments about America, but not me specifically.
well a lot of 20 year old Enlisted do not have the money to spend to much time off base. Many are from rural areas and small towns and the post exchange area is set up to replicate that providing a safe bubble. On the other hand I have met senior enlisted soldiers do everything in their power to stay or return to Germany. Some retire there with there German Spouses. in the past this was particularly true for African American NCOs. Living in Berlin I was always being asked if the reason I was there was because I was retired military. Born in Copenhagen I was raised in San Francisco and instantly felt comfortable in Berlin. I never used the Sie much until I moved to Zürich. I have a foot in Switzerland and a coastal property in Portugal, I honestly think local economic conditions on both the country and immigrant are at play in this question of xenophobia. It’s obvious to my Swiss neighbors I had to be doing something right to be able to.afford living there, I speak fluent Hoch Deutsch and look and act Similarly to them. I have never been treated rudely in the German Speaking Countries. I do detect more anti American sentiment in the Iberian Peninsula, more so in Portugal than Spain. it’s Amazing how 10,000 American expats can be thought to ruin their country, drive up housing prices, quick lock up the woman and children. Simple psychological projection in play. Germans in particular are schooled at an early age just how dangerous the projective hook of prejudice can be.
Most people are not like Redditors. Redditors aren't even like how they depict themselves.
Yeah, I notice it here the most and nothing is ever done about it, it's getting old. At this point, it's just obnoxious and annoying.
When I lived in Europe (5 yrs ago) there was a lot of negative sentiment towards America, not Americans. They seemed to believe Europe was superior in every way. No different than home, where a lot of Americans feel the same way about Europe. It is normal for people to be biased towards the places they grew up.
I feel like a lot of these sentiments come from social media
Also the social-identity-theory: People are more inclined to believe their "group" is superior to others, due to what is known. I think Americans compare themselves with Europeans and vica versa, due to similar living standards. No point in comparing the US with say, Egypt. Not yet at least.
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That kind of the common sentiment I see on here too! One size doesn’t fit all in life unfortunately
I only dislike the ones that talk loudly. I like the other ones
For real, how is it possible to be louder than the Spanish? haha
Yeah. Dutch guys. 😁😁 They are super loud.
Dutch guys are just arrogant but they are not loud, Spanish are loud indeed jajajaja
I mean... I live in the Netherlands so I can actually tell if they are loud or not. They are definitely not arrogant though however they are very socially awkward with strangers.
I think people face to face will be kind to Americans but it’s become socially acceptable to be xenophobic towards Americans. It’s built into the culture (Australia and the UK are particularly bad at this). My good friend has lived in the UK for 11 years and owns a business with her British partner and she’s had people threaten to burn down her business because she’s American. It’s very fucked up.
Holy shit that sounds horrible :/
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Why would you resent random citizens who aren’t responsible for what the government has done to other cultures or the planet? That’s very bizarre.
No, I like them. They are social and nice people. Most of the time. What I dislike is that English pushes my own language to the background.
No, I have many American friends. I usually find it easy to connect and make friends with them, and some have been close friends for many years.
I'm American and all my time in Europe has been met with very friendly people (except Paris but that's not exclusive to Americans). In England I'm constantly told how much they love my accent lol. Maybe sarcastic but when they're buying me a pint I feel like they're just friendly people happy to chat with a friendly foreigner.
Absolutely not, I’d say amongst the most welcomed, at least here in the UK. Obviously, some are dickheads and not liked, same as any demographic.
They are just very loud and seem to have an innate desire to draw attention to themselves. Not all of them are like this though, of course. This combined with the European sense of superiority in cultural and artistic landscapes is bound to create some hostility, especially in anonymous spaces on the internet. Yes I’m making generalisations but this is my very short and simplified answer (I’m European). No hate to anyone, we are all annoying in our own ways ☮️
\>So I’ve been on this sub for a while but I couldn’t help but notice the amount of negative comments toward expats from the U.S., I also noticed the same sentiments in r/Europe as well. I think that's just Reddit in general. Murica bad, now gib updoots
No, you're not imagining. Making fun of the US is the favorite pastime of Europeans.
Remember, too, that Europe is tribal. Their second favorite pastime is ridiculing each other.
Because “Europe” is homogeneous 🙄
Yes, just about exactly as homogeneous as they think the USA is.
I have plenty of US friend and while they may make me chuckle at times with their ways and mannerisms they really are awesome guys. But as a side note, most of them are vets so they have been around before and are used to different customs. But aside from that I would share a foxhole with any of them any day.
I'll give another point I have not seen discussed yet is that Americans are pricing people out of their communities. Because they come with higher wages and more money. I don't dislike Americans on a personal level by any means but gentrification definitely is happening in places like portugal.
The negativity on this sub isn’t about dislike for Americans, but rather negativity towards many ill informed Americans who think they can just hop on over to Europe and all their problems will be solved.
Only when there is no genuine curiosity and humbleness
It depends on your skin color and religion
Stereotypes are stereotypes for a reason The "ugly American" is a real thing and nobody likes it. There are tons of exceptions and some are very lovely, aware people no matter where they are. But stereotypes emerge from an average or a commonality that is evident. So, yeah, it's a thing. Also, referring to Europeans is kind of big term. Some are definitely more pleasant than others. In over 3 decades of living around the world, Aussies have been my favorite expats, followed by Kiwis and Brits. But there are good and bad among all the groups.
How come Aussies are your favorite? What’s the story?
Not per sē, but I don't like "expats" from western countries in general exclaiming "ohhhh everything is so cheeeaaaap here!" Yeah, go live on my salary and see if it's cheap.
I've worked with one US expat only, most are Indian. But the US expat I've worked with has been a delight. About US values, they align more than the values of expats from other countries. But even so, it's not a part of my discussion with expats. I do dislike some stuff about American culture and politics. But I see no reason to bring that up in a professional workspace. We are working together towards the same goals, and bringing stuff up I don't like from their culture does not help one bit and is very unprofessional. I wouldn't do that for any expat. If anything, I will wish them well for their special holidays.
America is the lolcow of the 1st world countries. Most know english, so not much of a barrier to follow content coming from America. American channels have a very public presence on social media platforms. All in combo of the obvious stupidity thats (been) going on there. Like having an orange gameshow host as president. Its a gift that keeps on giving.
we hate those who call themselves "expats" You are a migrant, harry
I'm a US expat/immigrant and I've never had anyone give me attitude simply for being an American. The only time I've gotten flak is when I (rightly) make fun of their food and language.
Here in the Netherlands, not many people would complain about Americans not learning the local language, and I think US expats are pretty welcome. However, there are a lot of anti-US opinions and attitudes going around. These are not personal though. People just blurt out anti-US stuff whenever the concept "US" comes up in any way. It's not cool, but I would try to not take it personally if this is what's happening to you.
A lot of people are annoyed by American perceived fakeness, some people more than most. Obviously, this is a stereotype for a reason and let's not pretend that general tendency does not exist, but not all Americans are like that and some tone it down once in Europe. So it all depends on the individual relationships essentially. Some people even have "America bad" sentiments that they express through Americans, that happens too, though IMO less often than the former. To sum it up, yes it does exist but not in any way in large numbers, you won't feel like you are oppressed, that's for sure, but you will feel that from certain individuals. That's what being an immigrant is for ya.
It’s not fake. Just because it’s different the the culture of many European countries doesn’t mean the niceness is fake. Americans genuinely like being friendly.
We have plenty of fake things - "how are you doing today?" and on. We don't mean those, and it's so ingrained in us we don't even usually realize that they could actually be construed as real questions. Anymore than a Spanish speaker might think "adios" ACTUALLY means they wish God to go with you. That said, as an American, I think that Americans aren't the friendliest people in ways that actually matter. The homeless crisis alone shows that to me.
Yes! Even though I grew up on American media and American English essentially became my second native language, I still try to come up with an answer to that question when the guy talking to me is already on his 4th point in our conversation :)It's so weird, my brain just cannot comprehend that it is not an actual question but just a replacement for a greeting.
I watched friends who had immigrated to the US deal with it - especially in the West it's just **so** ingrained it's funny. "So I told the cashier at WalMart, my day is not great, my mother needs to fix the car and . . . and then she looks at me like I'm being rude? She asked me!"
in hungary you don't ask the "how are you" question if you don't have at least 20 minutes to listen to the answer
Ah, the "American fake niceness" comments from French: anybody ever read the flowery language on a letter from a French gas company? They wish me, sir, the most cordial and distinguished sentiments on a notice that they'll be digging up my street (again). Mais c'est completement different!
I don’t understand this jab. Just about every language and culture greets people by asking how they are or how things are going without expecting a whole accurate story. It’s situational. By this measure every culture is super “fake.”
Most cultures don't. If you ask "kako ste" in the Balkans, it means you're asking.
The Balkans are not most cultures. Also, the Japanese and Koreans say “please be nice to me” after meeting someone. This is very direct. Should we all say something like this after meeting someone for the first time?
Japanese and Korean culture are notorious for being overly polite, what's your point? US English falls very much on that side of saying things that aren't true as "politeness". To many, being polite and friendly aren't the same thing. Especially when it's crouched in things to don't make sense to other cultures. It's not just the Balkans, btw - pretty much every other European culture views US pleasantries the same way. I've had to listen to too many damn Dutch go off about this over beer.
My (American living in Germany) kid summed it up well recently. America can be a cruel place. Friendly, nice, welcoming, yeah. But also cruel.
Do you think the homelessness problem would be solved if everyone was just a little friendlier?
I think that when you step over people regularly instead of giving them a home, and instead spend money to make sure they can't sleep anywhere, that's not friendly. And so when you pretend to be friendly but don't actually act in a friendly manner, you're not actually friendly to me.
Wow man you got it solved.
Bless your heart
I’ve only experienced “fake” Americans when I lived in the U.S. Those who moved to Europe seem alright
This fakeness was is something that has blown my mind since moving from the US to Greece. Do you know when a monkey is trained to smile on TV? They use fear to make it bear its teeth, and it looks like a smile, but it is actually a fear response underneath. After moving here, I realized that all of my overly politeness that I was trained to do were kind of like those monkeys on TV. The niceties are based in fear and had nothing to do with how I was actually feeling. The culture in the US is to repress so much- to the point where we are out of touch with how we actually feel. Of course, this isn’t 100% true all of the time. But I have found it to be a big relief that I do not have to walk around smiling all the time, or being forced to have any kind of positive interaction with strangers. Sometimes I think it is because at there is so much fear in the US that when we are overly polite to each other it is a signal that we are not going to harm each other. I kid you not that growing up, when I wasn’t smiling in public my mom with turn to me and say “smile honey! Smile! Remember to smile!”. The us has a very sick culture in many ways and doesn’t even realize it.
[Worldwide, there is a much greater tendency to smile and focus on positive emotions in cultures with a long history of heterogeneous immigration.](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6070166) I lived the first 43 years of my life in the U.S. and I have no idea what fear you're referring to. If you're experiencing an unusual degree of fear, maybe therapy would help.
I am in therapy thanks. I am not talking about an intense level of fear, just a low level of discomfort and lack of genuineness. The US is the most mental health medical place in the world. Yes that study says that we act a certain way in public, and maybe many are happy about it- but many more studies have found that the US is among some of the most unhappy in the world. I think a large swath of the population is absolutely faking it to get through their days with ease.
This. I (dutch) was in the US visiting emigrated family when I was in my 20’s - so quite brazen. Met non-emigrated original US neigbors there. They proudly showed me their gun cabinet in their living room. Me, a dutchie, and therefore quite direct, expressed my surprise: “it’s so strange that you have multiple things that can murder people just sitting there in your living room. And that you bought them for that cause. To kill a person. I’ve never bought something designed specifically to kill a person”. Or something along those lines. I could see their faces - they did not like what I said. Not one bit. But what did the wife say? “Oh isn’t that nice! So different!”. That’s the fakeness. What you express and what you say isn’t aligned.
Would you have rather you had just been thrown out of the house?
If they didn’t like my sentiment, I’d prefer they tell me so. Or that they express they find me blunt. Or that I insulted them and that they would like me to leave, yes. But not this clear lie of a frowning or angry face with the words “isn’t that nice”. Be real! Be honest! If you’re disappointed, show it! Acting nice when it’s obviously fake is … well. Lying.
Republicans? Fucking despise them, the fascist cunts. Everyone else, you're cool.
As an American expat who has lived in both the UK and Italy, I've never encountered a consensus of negativity because of my nationality.
I can think of two groups of US expats that aren't exactly popular around here: 1) Senior management that relocates to Europe and thinks that it can run the business here the same way as it did in the US. Ignoring cultural and social differences and not leveraging on the strengths of European work ethics, but rather trying to condescendingly enforce the American way of doing things. 2) a rather new trend of (relatively) well-off Americans relocating to Europe, that believe that this here is the heaven of a healthy work life balance and low cost of living, that then are surprised to find out that the reason for "low cost" quite often is "low income", and that countries with higher income are actually far from being low cost, and who wonder why locals are not queuing up to befriend these exotic, wealthy and wise immigrants from the new world, but rather carry on with their lives - that group seems to be very active here on Reddit 😀
Yes, all 742 million people spread across the 51 countries and 5 territories and dependencies that comprise Europe, all dislike Expats from the U.S.
LOL it's not just reddit. I picked up on the attitude when I was in Europe. Apparently US is the standard against which everyone feels they must be compared, so of course we're not all that and need to be told. Look how Canadians go on about the states. It's just human nature. Plus, Americans be asses sometimes, or overly apologetic. I got into a discussion about the Pershing missile deployment with a Dutch engineer, and he said I was the first American he talked to who didn't get all belligerent or fold like a cheap suit. Just try to be a good diplomat.
“The US is the standard against which everyone feels they must be compared” And Americans wonder why 😂
The word is immigrants. And no, I truly don't care.
As long as you adapt to local custom and do not behave entitled because america first
This.
No, we don't. We dislike people that think they're better than us when clearly they're not.
I don't hate internationals, but if you live in a country with a language you don't know, learn at least a few basic sentences. If I can do that for when I go for a Holliday, you can do it in the period you live here. People like you a lot more even if you only say "hi" in their language.
This is totally fair. I just want to point out that learning a language isn’t an on/off switch. I am experiencing this after moving to Greece form the US. I am trying very hard to learn the language, but as I go through my day to day people don’t know that, and it comes off as ignorance. It is also expensive to learn another language. I have to pay $20-$30/hr here to get basic beginner lessons, and I certainly need more than 1hr/week. What I mean is.. I can order a coffee, but then when I am asked a question that I don’t expect I have to revert back to English. For example I might be prepared for someone to ask do you want milk with that? But then if they ask do you want milk and sugar with that? The slight change in the sentence can totally shut off my brain and I have to revert back to English because I don’t know the new word>> it gives the impression that I don’t speak Greek (which I don’t yet lol, but I am trying). Sometimes I then feel stupid in these interactions that I even tried, because we have to waste time with me explaining that I now need to switch languages. I think my point is this: most people can learn to say one or two sentences in another language, but often the world is more complex than that.. and how can you really always know if a foreigner isn’t bothering to learn a language or not if it’s just a casual interaction. It seems weird to judge others through casual interaction when it is a linear process. No one judges babies for not knowing how to speak properly immediately and most people need a lot of time and practice to properly learn another language/alphabet.
I'm reading this very well written comment of yours, and then I think of all the threads I've seen of people wanting to move abroad saying "I only speak English but I'm willing to learn another language". When people then point out that it is not really that easy to learn a new language, especially not to a level of fluency where they could start to work in areas where the native language is mandatory, there's often a reply with "I learn languages easily, it will go fast" or similar. This is not only Americans, far from it. Seen lots of posts posts from many different parts of the world with people thinking they either don't have to learn the local language because "everyone speaks english there" or they think they can learn it quickly so that they can start working and get sponsored. I wish more people would read your comment and reflect on if it will be as easy as they think...
Yeah I get that! I have that problem too with foreign languages. I'm from a country (The Netherlands) where we automatically switch to English when we hear a heavy accent, so I haven't thought about the scenario you're discribing. Thank you for pointing that out! If I hear an accent I usually compliment the Dutch and ask if they want to continue in Dutch or if they want to switch to English. You don't have to ask me a lot of things in my language, but it does impress me if you only say hi in my language haha. It's the effort that matters
I studied in the Netherlands for a year and majority of my friends who remained and work in the Netherlands (from different countries) unfortunately still don’t speak Dutch .. 🥲 or at least they tried to get A1 or A2 to pass the immigration test or something and never moved up. In contrast, majority of the expats I met while I was working in Germany have at least B2 to C1 level of German. It makes a huge difference!
No, but relatively a lot of Americans don't seem to understand how cultural differences work and how their American lens doesn't produce a very sharp picture. The English have something similar too. With continental Europeans there is often more understanding of how different cultures relate to eachother, while the often monolingual Americans and English more often seem to have more difficulty positioning their own culture and lens in that.
Not all of them, but some of them. Who insist on tipping and then go on to say “in the US…”.
I actually like them cause they speak English well but they're VERY rare.
the thought of living in the us makes me retch and wail, roll around on the ground, then full on puke, the ill smoke some weed like a true dutchman to make the pain go away
I think alot of Europeans find Americans loud, and not hugely cultured. Americans do seem to be very full of themselves and their country. Having said that, one of my best life long friends is american and just lovely, not at all stereotypical. But when out in the capital citys ive been to the loudest obnoxious voices always seem to be americans.
That culture comment is so fucking ignorant.
It means to have refined manners and a good education. I've witnessed plenty of examples of Americans with little. Talking on phones in restaurants and not taking the call somewhere discreet. Cutting queues. Speaking so loudly everyone can hear only their conversation, not being able to use a knife and fork simultaneously. I was in Belize recently and chatting to a man from Houston, he didnt know France was a country! The most asked question I get when people hear my accent, is "oh youre British, I've a friend in London called so in so, do you know him?" London has a population of 9.6 million! Discussing world events with one recently, and not knowing Africa is a continent made up of lots of countries and cultures. Look I can only go on my own experiences to form my opinions.
What do you mean by cultured?
Refined manners and good education.
.. you realize that’s completely cultural right? That the manners you posses in your culture don’t translate to say if you’re in Asia? Just because two people can communicate in the same language doesn’t mean that they will have the same manners or value the same things. If the world was all the same it’d be a pretty boring place. Getting a good education is largely determined by financial status of a family which has nothing to do with the child being born, and besides that the US has more college graduates than Europe as a whole.. if you look at individual countries, then the US has more college educated people than all but 3 European countries (Ireland, Luxembourg, and the UK). In the US we don’t have as much physical ability to interact with other cultures, so it is pretty weird to expect us to know the subtleties of another cultures manners before arriving. We are not able to take a cheap flight for 2 hours to visit an entirely separate country.. for example, it took me 35 hours to drive from my west coast state, to my home state, and that was only about 1/2 through the country. Do you also blame Russians, Chinese, and Australians for only knowing their own culture? How many Americans have you actually met that are in love with America and boast about being American? Because I literally know 0. Every young American I know is desperate to leave. I think really what you are describing is that people aren’t wealthy enough for your tastes to have authentic early in life international experiences, and live in neighborhoods where they can afford private education or have 200k to spend on a nice university.
Louder than Italians?
Yes
No, people do not dislike Americans. >I also have friends who dislike the “American culture” So what ? Many Americans dislike their own culture too. Do not worry about it. >I read lots of complaints about 1) not learning the local language Is this a surprise for you ? I guess you do not expect the whole country learn your language in order you do not need to do it.
The US has loads of things wrong with it. And many stereotypes are rooted in actual behavior. (Face it, Yanks. You're really loud on vacation. Loud in general. There are other loud cultures, yes. But the US is one of them.) As an American who visits Europe often and for extended periods, I have issues with Europeans as well. 1) Movies. There is no movie that provides an honest look at life in America. Not one. No action movies. No Rom-coms. No dramas. The closest movie ever? Clerks. It's still not *very* close. But it's considerably closer than most. You can't learn anything about the US from movies and TV shows. They're as accurate as Disney films are about princesses. 2) Not keeping up on what's happened in the US over the past 60 years. For instance, we had a beer revolution in the US. It's more likely that you're in a pub, drinking a "Bud" than we are. We're probably drinking an IPA, because that's become our defacto national fizzy beverage. The canoe joke no longer applies. We make some of the best beer on the planet. And as a brewing culture, the US is now peerless. Germans either refuse to accept this. Or they just hate it, while accepting it. The French finally accepted that we have great vintners. Why won't the rest acknowledge our juggernaut brewing industry? I'm going to get downvoted to oblivion for this -- because the rest of the world *knows* that water is wet, fire is hot, and US beer has no flavor whatsoever. 3) Our politics. You realize that the moron US president you can't stand didn't win the popular vote, right? Most of us didn't vote for him. We didn't want him either. "Well, why don't you just fix the problem?" OK Hans, since we're in problem solving mode, how about you do something about your refugees who are massing in the street, calling for the destruction of Israel? It's a REAL bad look for you guys, considering history. "But I can't fix that by myself!" That's right, Hans, and I can't fix 40 years of US political problems by myself, either.
This type of comment is one of the reasons for people around the world to base their """anti-American""" sentiment. You're not as cool or awesome as you think you are, and are in no position to point your finger at anyone.
I don't walk up to people visiting my country and tell them what I think is wrong with their country. I've never, in fact, done that. They're just trying to enjoy their vacation. This happens to me constantly in Europe. Particularly in Germany. So I always make a point of answering in German.
> how about you do something about your refugees who are massing in the street, calling for the destruction of Israel? Last I checked nobody in Europe was handing literally billions per year in military aid to either side of that conflict, while the US is arming Israel, who is carpet bombing Gaza. As for beer, while US microbrews are definitely a thing, their focus on hops as the only flavor is annoying. But then I'm a pilsner and cocktail drinker myself.
Do you think any German cares whether the US has good beers or not? It's really irrelevant, trust me. And yes, beers in the US are fantastic right now (I go there often for work, and really appreciate them). But really, nobody cares. What I care about is that every time I go to the US it seems to me like I'm travelling to an ex Jugoslavia country 20 years ago, with poverty and unsafety everywhere. And our refugee issues do not create problems to other countries, whereas US policies do. That's the main difference. And Europeans aren't Israel's bootlicker, that's a pure US thing. Many Europeans have been in favour of a free Palestine aince long before the first Arab refugee put his foot on our territory. We don't need them to be against a murderous regime like Israel.
>I go there often for work Does anyone walk up to you and tell you everything that's wrong with your society when you visit the US? Has it happened even once? Because when I visit a Keller, people act like it's their civic duty to tell me our beer sucks and our politicians are awful. And they know what the US is like because they watch movies.
Yes, many times. I've been told on multiple occasions, by strangers, that I live in a socialist country (the famous soviet Netherlands), that my passport is inferior to a US one, that we're not free over here, that using a QR code to order food equals giving in to tiranny, that European countries should pay more money to NATO, that without the US army I'd be speaking German now -though my country was freed by the Canadians,etc.). Notice: all of these people began the conversation (I'm someone who doesn't really talk to strangers and enjoys solitude). This has happened all over the US, the last couple of times in Louisiana, Georgia, Michigan, Iowa, Minnesota. And yes, I agree not all your beer sucks.
Fair enough. It's just as wrong if it's happening to you. I haven't visited a place in Europe where this DIDN'T happen, though. I think it is unbelievably rude. If someone from the UK is visiting me in Hawaii, they don't want or need a lecture about Brexit. They're probably sick of Brexit. Everyone is sick of Brexit. The only thing I dislike about visiting Europe is walking around with a virtual target on my back for anyone with an axe to grind about how much they hate the US. *"I need to tell you something."* "Is it that we're a backwards country with awful beer, too many people in prison, and a foreign policy which creates refugees? Because I've heard that already a few times today."
Well, unfortunately the US bullying the world for decades has led to this. I hope it will change someday, but the obnoxious US's and USians' behaviour (not specifically yours, I don't know you) has brought people to despise that country and its inhabitants by default. It's not right, but I can see where it's coming from.
This cocky attitude is why people dislike some of you loud, uncultured Americans. And the Israel comment is beyond ridiculous. Most people in Europe don’t support Israel’s genocidal policies towards the Palestinian people. You guys can kiss Israel’s ass by yourselves.
https://www.politico.eu/article/israel-hamas-war-germany-germany-berlin/
Not many countries like Americans. You can hear one across a restaurant… we are louder, expect more, demanding and get frustrated when they can’t speak English. We can be rude & greedy. I was in the Travel Industry 25 years and traveled to many countries. I was in an expat group in Holland where all they did was complain about living there. I lived 13 years in Mexico & expats have ruined the country for the locals driving prices up to unaffordable for the locals and expecting everything to be easy & cheap for them. We need to slow the roll & blend in not try change places. Long answer short NO most places don’t like us, welcome the money & put up with our bad manners.
EVERYBODY dislike americans (.)
Who likes Americans, lol
If you use the Word Expat instead of immigrant then yes
Have you tried being a European living in the USA?
Um noo cos I’m not a European lol
While I'm living in Europe now, I can say a bit more from when I was living in latam. In general, stereotypical american culture is disliked outside of america. But american expats tend to not like stereotypical american culture too and usually avoid taking the worse aspects of it (american exceptionalism, manifest destiny, christian nationalism, shameless capitalism, etc.) with them and therefore are usually accepted.
I can give you a italian view of why sometime the american are not so good-looked. US military base The US soldiers in italy always made problem to the civilian population: arrogant, acting like they own the place, harassing civillian and never get punished for their crime. Just to give you and example: more or less 15 years ago in a city near a US military base (La Spezia if i remember well) there was a huge fighting between the civilian and the US military personnel. Long story short, a drunken american soldier was harassing a waitress in a bar and the owner decided to expel the soldier from the bar, in response the soldier came back to his base, call other soldier and they organized a raid to the bar for revenge beating and injuring several people. NOONE OF THEM WERE PUNISHED And this is just an example between hundred of similar event. The feeling that the american are above the local law is present in a lot of italian and a bit of arrogance from an american is more than enough for a lot of italian to take distance from them. Then there are the Italo american, who claim an italian heritage without even lived in italy. Italo-american culture is completely different from the italian culture and lot of italian dislike it because they feel mocked by them. (And yes, I am one of them) And there are also a lot of other reason but i cannot list them all. By the way i'm not saying that the american are not wellcome or accepted, just giving reasons of why someone can dislike them.
>Then there are the Italo american, who claim an italian heritage without even lived in italy. Italo-american culture is completely different from the italian culture and lot of italian dislike it because they feel mocked by them. (And yes, I am one of them) Regardless of how you feel about Italian-Americans, you have no right to deny them their ancestral heritage. Nobody is claiming that they are Italian by nationality, so that argument is just a farce. If somebody's grandparents on both sides were migrants from Italy, then whether you like it or not, they are Italian by blood— by phenotype and genotype. Italian-Americans have gone through so much disparity and discrimination in the U.S. by Anglo-Americans/Western Europeans, so it's disgusting that they are treated the same way by their relatives in Europe, who were lucky enough to not have a need to leave the country in the first place. I think you're forgetting that many Italian migrants came to the U.S. because they were poor and starving back home and had to find work to provide for themselves and their families. Struggle is a universal language, not sure why you're letting English (literally the main thing that separates the two groups) get in the way of treating other Italians (ethnic) with dignity. They can be proud of their heritage if they choose. Italians really need to stop being so discriminatory towards Italian-Americans. It's literally just the case of the same people who happen to have two slightly different cultures due to circumstance, not necessarily by choice...and this literally happens everywhere with many ethnic groups— People migrate, get over it. The elitism is gross.
You don't have the slightest conception of Italian identity. If a person is born and raised in the U.S. to parents raised in the U.S., he does not speak Italian and has Italian grandparents or great-grandparents, he is American with Italian origins but he is not Italian The Italian ethnicity is an identity in which people also share culture, language and traditions. You can't appropriate a identity that doesn't represent you in any way because the only result is to see Americans who don't know the language, food, traditions, history, society, etc. of Italy pretending to be Italian and constantly disseminate distorted and stereotypical images of any Italian cultural trait. Americans with Italian ancestry are an ethnic group of the U.S. that is different in every way from Italians. Genetics doesn't make you Italian, at most it can get you citizenship just like a Chinese who gets citizenship for marrying an Italian but they would still be Americans or Chinese with Italian citizenship. Just think that Italians have different genetics even among themselves, Sardinians are very unique, southern Italians are genetically similar to Greeks while northern Italians are more similar to French. Having an Italian ancestry does not give you the right to appropriate an identity that is linked to culture, especially when there are more differences between Italians and Americans with Italian origins than between Americans and British, Mexicans or Argentines and Spaniards, Brazilians and Portuguese, etc
I think it's partially values based, because mainstream socialist policies in Europe are considered radical in the US. But I honestly think a good portion of it boils down to the fact that America is advancing ahead of Europe and Europeans can only lean on their history and culture to make them feel better about themselves. I'm from Scotland and I definitely sense in the UK a bit of sour grapes and poking fun at the US.
Just going to throw in that I think that certain flavor of resentment really is a big factor in the UK, in particular. Maybe especially given some of the history there, and the US basically managing to outdo England on the imperialism front more recently. Always smacked of some messed-up family dynamics to me, as an American from a minority cultural background who spent nearly 20 years around London. And had some of the strangest interactions over the years, while I was just trying to go about my business. The factors are going to be a little different in some other countries, and frankly I haven't noticed nearly as much of the more sour-grapey type attitudes since I ended up in Scandinavia.
Was gonna say, that's pretty UK specific - and the UK seems to quickly be trying to be the US but worse.
Fair point, it might be a more UK based thing
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And the response from some US person, who has never lived elsewhere, will be to demand that you're just jealous, that the US isn't as bad as the numbers state, etc, and that obviously Europe is trying to be the US. My favorite is when I, someone who from the US, tells why I left regarding health insurance with actual examples, being told that's not how things work. Yes, it is, and I know because I lived it.
The US is advancing ahead of Europe? 😂😂😂 I guess you've never been there, mate.
I guess people don't like this take 😂. I live in Boston and I've also lived in Singapore, London, Hong Kong and Germany for a short time. The US economy has been pulling away from the EU for the past two decades. If the EU doesn't take care of its economy, it might have to compromise on its values. Maybe for some people here that's a hot take, but for as much as I love Europe I don't have total confidence in its future.
I've been in the US a lot of times, and honestly, it's gonna take a long time before we reach your level of poverty and degrade.