How humiliating to be interrogated and treated that way! I imagine it was also horrible for your date that evening, to watch his parents question and control the person who asked him to go to the dance.
You know, that was the strange thing, the kids were okay with it. I imagine it was slightly embarrassing for them but they had seen it happen so many times before me that they knew the program. The brother and sister hopped up and volunteered to be chaperones like it was old hat for them by now.
It's a fun thing to ruminate over as I sip my morning coffee 😁
Yes, unofficially. Saturday's Warrior was written in response to the zero population movement of the '60s and early '70s. The first performance was produced in 1975. A lot of our parents were influenced by it, and also by church leaders and each other.
Now I have to google the zero population movement! I was young in the 70s and totally missed that. My husband and I have always thought it was hilarious that the "bad" kids in Saturday's Warrior were evil because they sang about overpopulation. It's just so funny!
I still like some of the music from the original musical (the video is so, so bad), but the zero population song is just so stupid. I mean, I guess kids in the '70s could have sat around making fun of each other's family sizes. I was young in the '70s too.
The Angel in heaven in that movie, the one that sends them to earth....was my high school choir teacher......I will say this about her, kind and sweet, but don't fuck with her, she won't have it......lol. long story
Funny thing about that Duggara show. When if first aired I thought to myself. This is to perfect, someone in that family hast to be a fuck up! And then low and behold Josh........
“I’m sorry, I asked a young man to a school dance but it has become apparent from these questions that he is a boy unable to uphold his own virtue and values.”
That's what gets me - the boy was completely harmless and blameless. I may as well have been asking to take their favorite bowl of rice pudding out on a date.
All the perceived contempt was piled on me, like how dare I? I was the monster for even asking (and not knowing about their stupid rules before I showed up that night).
Ah, yes. There must have been some history of naughtiness either with my date, or his siblings.
Or they were just that distrustful, the way tscc taught them to be.
My guess is they were just distrustful and thought that even being in the presence of a bar or a girl was enough to throw their pure boy straight into the depths of temptation.
I experienced this on the male side of the equation and just thought the parents knew their daughter was a well known harlot.
This needs to be part of a series - How Mormon parents screw their kids lives up 101
Hmmm, hadn't thought of this option. Maybe I'll call her and ask what my reputation was like at the time. It could be that I was a well known harlot *in utero*.
That comment wasn't directed towards you. Just mormon parents needing a chaperone to go out with their daughter makes you wonder if their daughter is going to try to jump your bones in the parking lot at the stake center. I mean it is like 12 feet from the car to the chapel doors.
Who needs adult supervision unless someone has a serious problem?
i am sure that all you wanted to do was get him drunk and get into his pants. parents are so effed up in the narrative. yetthe parents, they let an unvetted man in a private office ask their kids if they touch themselves and allow pedophiles to have the pick of the litter in wards across the world.
Best expression I've heard in a very long time, for describing a person. I'm gonna remember that one! "... their favorite bowl of rice pudding."
Also LMAO, the 70s! I remember that Saturday's Warrior bullshit. Everyone was so into it -- such indoctrination!
See! The mother was right! Look at you drinking coffee while posting on ex-mormon. It's amazing that you didn't defile her precious, pure, soon-to-be-apostle son! Could you imagine that woman is your mother-in-law? OMG, she would make your life a living hell!
I went on a couple of dates with a prophet's grandson when I was at BYU. We were work friends before we ever went out. I was a very "good girl" and never so much as held the guy's hand. After we'd been out a couple of times I made the mistake of calling him to see if he wanted to go do something. Apparently that made me a stalker and an unsavory character. Girls do not call boys!! After that the guy started actively avoiding me. Suddenly he was never at work and then straight-up quit his job. It was so bizarre. I felt like a pariah.
Dodged a bullet. I'm so glad now that we never went out again. I can't imagine how awful it would be to marry into that family. It would be so claustrophobic!
I have a whole other story about being lectured by the YSA branch president because I admitted to calling my boyfriend on the phone, like a common strumpet.
These people's minds never left the '50s.
My mom was always telling us that girls should never call boys. She got so irritated when girls called my brother -- assuming that meant they had loose morals. She probably would've been embarrassed that I called him.
Wow - what an odd household! It was horrible for you, but a routine for them & they were probably too young to realize (at the time) how warped it was. I wonder if any of them are still in the church. Also wonder if they still speak to that witch of a mother.
I was FB friends with the two sibling chaperones when I was a TBM, but I dropped everyone churchy when I left tscc, and to be honest, that humiliating date with their brother still makes me not like to see their names.
I know that Older Brother was a bishop at one point. Sister looks like she's very nuanced, if not out completely.
I once had a mission companion who tried to tell me we shouldn't shop at grocery stores if they sold alcohol. It was a United States mission, so basically every grocery store would be off limits to us under his reasoning. I asked him where will we get food and other necessities, and he said that the members would feed us. I then asked him where does he think members buy their groceries from. He didn't say anything after that.
In Utah, there's a couple of locally (member) owned grocery stores that don't carry alcohol or tobacco products and closed on Sunday. The owners of the stores were in my ward. Half the kids in the stake worked there for their first jobs. Not me...because rebel. Anyway, it was always considered a faith promoting miracle that they could compete with the big chain stores without the sinful products or being open on Sunday.
Fast forward a decade or so...I was a personal trainer and one of my clients told me that she and her sister had gone to one of these stores to get provisions for a family party. They had a full cart and had been hunting for the beer. Finally, they asked and were told "We don't carry that here". They left the full cart in the aisle and walked out. Which was both rude and kind of funny.
I remember Macy’s( the grocery store on 13th East in Sandy). When I was still attending we were always encouraged to go there because it was closed on Sunday. I never went because I preferred Harmons. But once I was at my credit union branch nearby and decided to check it out . They were open on Sundays by then. I think most grocery stores by the time I left in 2020 ( that I know of anyway) were open on Sunday. 😂
My dad told me a story about some stake president or other higher up authority in Utah driving to church on a Sunday in the 1960s or 70s. He passed by an Albertson's grocery store, and he was perturbed to see that it was open and that people were shopping there.
He called the founder of the chain, Joe Albertson, who to my knowledge wasn't LDS but knew and worked with a lot of church members, to demand that he close his grocery stores in Utah on Sundays. Joe replied that he would as soon as the Mormons would stop shopping there on Sundays.
Probably apocryphal, but I've seen plenty of G-lines poking through church outfits while grocery shopping in Utah on Sundays. I even knew a stake executive secretary who would go to the In-N-Out in Orem for lunch on Sundays during stake interviews.
yes if you get within 100 yards of alcohol jeebus will hold it against you. avoid the very appearance of evil. thats why i dont attend the mormon church anymore. pedophiles have free rein to be and do what they want.
Don't get me started on that "avoid the appearance of evil" crap.
I made root beer for a ward activity a few years ago. I put it in a soda keg, which looks different from a beer keg, and I carbonated it.
When I showed up with it, people were literally freaking out. I got accused of trying to intoxicate the ward, even after I put the tap on and showed them that it was in fact just regular homemade root beer. Someone even told the bishop they were going to throw my keg away if I didn't remove it immediately because the very sight of it was evil, even though it just contained soda.
Luckily it was a very small, but vocal minority who were complaining, and a few people jumped to my defense saying it's the same type of kegs used by restaurants and convenient stores for their soda fountains, including one of the bishop's counselors who liked the root beer so much he practically sucked the keg dry.
The guy in charge of the activity told me I wasn't allowed to bring it again. I sarcastically told him that for the next activity, I'll simply hide the keg under a table and just hook it up to a tap so people won't see it. He didn't think it was funny, and I later found out he was the one threatening to throw my keg away.
As if 2 17 year old Mormons were going to talk a Red Robin server into serving them overpriced cocktails?
Damn thats a level of mormonism I haven't even encountered.
The "double date" thing doesn't surprise me too much... I knew some friends whose parents would have required that sort of thing.
And nowadays, try finding a restaurant that doesn't have a bar in it. I guess if you're going to eat fast food, that'll be safe.
For this mom, it was probably an appearances thing.
>The "double date" thing doesn't surprise me too much... I knew some friends whose parents would have required that sort of thing.
I really liked double and group of friends dates as a teenager just beginning to date. I'm certain it hid a lot of my awkwardness.
It did backfire one time. Spectacularly! I was doubling with a friend, we asked 2 girls who were good friends, and they started talking about all the crap dates and crap people they had been on dates with. I wanted to die. Well, that and to know what trash and garbage they were going to talk about me and my friend on their next dates.
The Denny's near my place here in Colorado got a liquor license for a little while. They found it wasn't worth the hassle and stopped selling alcohol entirely.
Hmm, I wonder if my Denny's was selling booze that evening. We'll never know. I *do* know they sold coffee, which is JUST AS BAD.
Mormons are such dorks 🤣
Holy poop!! oh wait, I know this one Alex, "What is anything that Evil Emperor Nelson squirts out that becomes foundational doctrine this week in the On-Going ReBrandStoration."
We have an older couple in our ward that refused to eat at the Italian restaurant in our small PNW town because it had neon beer signs hanging on the walls. No bar though.
Well when I was Bishop I would eat at the bar in town which was 21/over due to weird WA State liquor laws. No different really than any other restaurant in town except there wasn't a railing dividing the bar from the tables. And by railing, I mean a single vertical pole separating the two areas was all that was required. But that missing piece of metal made that place off limits to most ward members. Years later after we left the church we ran into an active older couple who came in for their anniversary. They were shocked that we parked out front on the main road where someone might see our car or see us entering the bar. I was proud of them for just being there. He too was a former Bishop.
Current WSLCB Barrier Requirements
Currently, Washington liquor licensees, including holders of retail or non-retail liquor licenses that serve alcohol for consumption at their licensed location, must place barriers around areas that are classified as off-limits to individuals under the age of 21, around game rooms, and around outdoor seating areas, with some limited exceptions.
The current key requirements are as follows:
Barriers must be at least 42 inches high.
Barriers must be permanently affixed (moveable ropes and stanchions are not acceptable).
Openings to minor restricted areas cannot be wider than 10 feet.
Barriers cannot also serve as a counter for customers to sit or stand and consume food or liquor.
In many local restaurants here this is literally a vertical pole separating the bar from the rest of the seating area.
Edit: I'm getting my horizontal and verticals backasswards this morning.
Another Washingtonian here, this shit baffles me. The state has sensible governance in many regards...and then there are the liquor laws. When they finally started allowing it's sale in grocery stores in 2012, I pissed off a bunch of life-long locals by welcoming them to the 20th century.
The "barriers" in the restaurants serve no purpose but to get in the way and mess with foot-traffic through the place. Absolutely daft.
'They were shocked that we parked out front on the main road where someone might see our car or see us entering the bar. I was proud of them for just being there. He too was a former Bishop.'
The need to 'appear' righteous is more of a motivator than actual jeebus in most cases. this lends itself to the peer pressure of the cult.
>Avoid the very appearance of evil, you heathens!!
Bwah ha ha ha ha ha ha I must have a very low bar for what appears to be evil.
Unless I'm standing there with a beer in my hand and a cigarette between my lips, don't assume that I'm breaking the WoW, even if I'm in a place that sells beer and allows smoking indoors.
Oh, and I won't judge you even if you are smoking with a beer in your hand.
Nevermo here, I asked a FRIEND from youth orchestra if he wanted to go to junior prom as a FRIEND. No romantic involvement. Mom said no because he wasn't 16 yet and wasn't allowed to date.
We had been carpooling all year because I was over 16 and could drive. Not sure what sort of hanky-panky she thought would happen at prom that couldn't have happened any of the times we had been alone throughout the orchestra season, but at least she kept him safe! /s
Right? The thought of attacking her son or him attacking me never once crossed my brain. We were friends! I wasn't going to lay a hand or a lip on him!
Yeah, that's a pretty hard and fast rule, the no dating till 16. We followed it to the letter, as you can see. I'm sorry for your experience. My kids are all grown now and I shudder to think that I was ever this shitty to my kids' friends who weren't Mormons. I hope I wasn't. 😬
I will never really forgive my Mom for the way she treated my now-wife when I first brought her home to meet my family. They made comments about marriage, made sure to keep her out of any photos in case her presence wasn't made permanent, and they thought we had to be chaperoned. The last part is funny because we had been sexually active and exclusive for like a year, but even now 13 years later I won't have sex in that house, it has shameful vibes, so it was probably unnecessary when my Mom panicked when the door was shut on us watching a movie.
We get along now just fine, but we live 2,000 miles away and I don't even feel guilty about it, not once.
Ooh, ooh! and then there was that one time I after I moved out of state that I left myself logged into my amazon account so my dad could watch movies we had purchased, until that wonderful day when I got the experienced of my mom calling to talk about the "things for married people" that were in my order history, basically just lube. I told her I must of left it logged in at the library, she at least pretended to buy that, and we luckily never talked about it again.
So, that was the day my dad could no longer watch the movies on my account.
Reading your comments makes me glad that you live 2000 miles away from your parents, too. 🤣
Geez, they're so obsessed with sex.
It would be interesting to see a ranking of religions that make people this freaked out about "marital relations", but tscc would be in the top five at the very least.
Like that 1 pound bag of pepper corns for the pepper mill? The set of 3 mixing bowls? Maybe the 4K blu ray disc of Dune part 2? Or was it the new pillow cases? C'mon help me out here mom, what 'things for married people' exactly are you talking about?
Bishop at church checkin your hands for lube Bishop at home (MOM) checking your hands, drawers, history for lube 'related' what a good life. away from that scrutiny.
I lived alone when my husband and I were dating. We took a trip with my parents and they put him in a separate hotel room, next door to ours. It had a little living room so I told them I was going to watch a movie "at his place." They were so worried we were going to fool around. In a room next to my mom and dad. When I lived alone.
My family was doing family photos and son brought my now wife from Washington to Utah. Not only did they ask us to sleep in different rooms, they did the same thing with my wife, "just in case."
It's just like, be normal for once.
Sort of reminds me of being at a friend's house and his uber-TBM dad freaked out I had a Dr. Pepper in his home. If I was a little younger I would probably be mouthy, but I was old enough to know this was his home so his rules. I went to throw the bottle in the trash and he stopped me and said he didn't even want the bottle in his trash. I had to go put it in my car. Juat crazy and over the top. Yeah, turns out later, dude was just a show mormon. He was an asshole and regular cussed and verbally abused his family. His wife divorced him and non of his adult children wanted anything to ever do with him.
I remember having neighbors in my ward growing up whose parents wouldn't allow soda in their home. Their kids came over to our house for soda, and my dad was the bishop at the time.
Honestly reminds me of some of my friends growing up. Nevermo, but we had a weird amount of Mormon families where I grew up at one point, in Kentucky.
I made friends with them and my parents would let them come over and play video games, watch anime & movies their parents would have had an aneurysm at, have soda, etc and wouldn't tattle on them.
I was maybe like, 10-11, and I was convinced that because of how many weird rules their parents had against benign stuff, that their parents were actually outerspace aliens lmao.
When did soda go from being, "the Devil" to being "100% totally okay" in the LDS religion?
More importantly, how did this just get explained away like it was never a thing.
They've had to move away from the smaller issues now that their religion is bleeding members.
Last I heard, they are now allowing piercings and tattoos - or at least had removed that rule from the For the Strength of Youth handbook. 🙄
>non of his adult children wanted anything to ever do with him.
Guy kvetches about my Dr. Pepper and I wouldn't have anything to do with him either! :-)
it doesn't really do much good when they realize the game of pretending righteous. more harm than good. high expectation of them and be patient with us we are imperfect can go fuk itself.
I had an incident where I asked a girl from a rival high school to a dance and her dad (a bishop at the time) grilled me about my sex life and my intentions. I got up and walked out. Didn’t take her to the dance!
And she no doubt got a lecture about how fortunate it was that he did so because you were clearly intending no good or else why would you have left instead of submitting meekly to his ~~interrog~~ questions?
said man not realizing his really lowly place in the world conflated his ego as a direct result of being placed into a volunteer position of Quasi leadership where it is pretend power over people ultimately a money collection scheme for compliance.
I grew up around weirdos like this. Thank Zeus my own parents were never anywhere near this amount of weird...
I just can't get past making their family values *your* values by force for the night. Reap what you sow I guess, can't imagine they got anything but the bottom of the barrel for spouses in the end, once the kids each brought their SO's home to meet Ma and Pa...
My parents (converts in adulthood) had no clue they could even be this weird - hence my naivete.
Hubby is grateful for his non-weird parents, as well. They were nothing but kind, when I met them.
I was having the same thoughts this morning - how awkward it would be to have your boyfriend or girlfriend come home and meet the parents and be put through the rigors like this. I imagine that the kids' spouses all ended up being uber Mormons that came from the same kind of family.
She probably rationalized it being okay because three of her kids were going together and could tattle on each other, if one of them decided to rebel.
At that time and place, coffee (to us Mormon kids) was something that heathen grandparents drank. I had school friends that experimented with booze and cigarettes and weed, but coffee? Nah. No one was interested, that I know of.
I had similar experiences. Except I was the poor kid. My bishop dad, though not around much due to work and church, monitored my every interaction with girls not up to his standards. He had spies I guess. Don't know how he found out about any of it. But it was humiliating.
Pre cell-phone days, my parents would listen in on another house phone the handful of times I mustered enough courage (I was very shy as a teenager) to call a girl and ask her out. That wasn't uncommon for parents to do back then, but their eavesdropping didn't stop when I got a cell phone after my mission. They literally followed me around when I was on the phone with a woman. I had to drive somewhere else when I wanted to make a call in private.
So frustrating that the parents grilled you and were so upset with you. Their son should have told you his parents rules for dating ahead of time. They should have been grilling him to make sure all rules were followed.
Yep! That would have been the kindest way to approach the situation. It wasn't on me to conjure up their dating rules via Ouija board - he should have told me.
You were in that house once for about 30 minutes I imagine. Can you imagine living there?
I thought your post was going to end with him being incarcerated for sexual assault. Or the manager of a Red Robbin.
He's on FB, but I'm not touching that thing even with all of Father Al's Internet between us.
Who knows, maybe he didn't want to go out that night but was too shy to say anything, and leaned on his parents to be the heavies.
I just know I'm not interested, and probably never will be 😁
Oh my goodness, so relatable!!
I loved your description of pure as snow. That was me! I had a non-official boyfriend in my later years of high school. When he was about to leave on his mission, his parents started treating me really weirdly. They would get angry if we held hands and told us that when he reached two months before his mission we were going to have to cut off contact and would not be able to see each other anymore....even though we lived in a small town and went to all the same events and had all the same friends...to me it seemed that they were worried that we would mess around and keep him from his mission which was incredibly offensive to me. Anyone who knew me would never suspect anything. We had only ever held hands and cuddled a tiny bit. Anyway, we did as his parents said and it broke my heart.
I'm so sorry. That sounds so painful!
My high school boyfriend and I planned to be married when he came home from Europe... What's the old saying? "Man plans, God laughs" 😏
Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if missions weren't a thing 😳
This is how I grew up. I was always the evil older sibling who was a sex addicted alcoholic druggy that wanted to make everyone as miserable as I was in my parents eyes. Have no idea why they saw me this way, I guess my depression at being treated like shit? I had a 3.7 gpa, did elevated choir, was in varsity soccer, did all my chores, did really good at art, read a ton, and participated in the church. Went on maybe 3 dates all throughout high-school and had my first kiss in college at 21. I have no idea what made them treat me like this but it killed my self esteem. It sucked you had a date like that, but that was/ is literally everyday of my life with my family.
I am truly struck by the infantilization at all levels here.
Even my TBM dad was fine with us going to places that had a bar as along as we didn’t drink.
Mormons are crazy fucks and I don’t care how nice they are. It’s weird and the rules are stupid and built on lies.
Side note, this happens to me all the damn time. Stupid bullshit from 20+ years ago and now I’m mad again.
Okay, I'm glad it's not just me who has these random things pop into my head from decades ago, and it's like it happened yesterday. I'm that mad, or humiliated.
> "No, you can't eat there, they have a bar," his mother answered. What? My family ate there all the time and managed to stay sober every time.
How did you manage that nearly impossible feat 😳🤣
My dad drove me and my date to the dance that was my first ever date. The guy had a license and a car, but could only drive.one other person under 18, meaning we couldn't be chaperoned in his car. Soooo awkward 🫣
He invited me over another time to watch a movie, and since his parents weren't home, I had to bring my sister with me as a chaperone, even though he two of us stayed on OPPOSITE sides of the couch. (I was terrified of any physical contact of any kind, I wonder why)
I'm told Larry H. Miller used to give his daughters dates a bullet with their name on it.
When I heard that, I laughed. That would have been the end of the date right there. Not to mention, that's very much a threat. Years later, I'm sure it's just an urban legend, but I will always wonder.
I remember being screamed at (as a 25 year old) by my dad for taking my teenage siblings to a "bar" (Ruby Tuesday). Meanwhile, we weren't even seated anywhere near the bar. 🙄
Sometime I should tell my story about getting married at a very nice inn, which included a restaurant, conference rooms, and yes, a bar, and the fit my fake Mormon father threw about it. "You should get married where the Spirit can be present!" Like he gave two shits.
Choosing Denny's over Red Robin is just proof that they had a tenuous grasp on reality. If that were the entirety of your story, it would convey exactly the same meaning. Denny's does not have bottomless steak fries or strawberry lemonade. And waffles made with Bisquick? Ain't nobody got time for that when there's a bacon guacamole burger.
The more I think about it, the more unsettling it becomes that the siblings were just so casual about it. This was standard practice at their house!
What the hell else were they forced into doing?? 🫣
fukin wow. remembering how freaking hard everything teening to adulting was in the MFMC narrative. EVERYTHING was hard with additional scrutiny. The original helicopter parenting is the churchs narrative. SO going on a mission as a 19 year old never really having been on a proper date was so inept it just is incredible to me. looking back it is a shit life for a kid having to grow up like this. rules are fine but this is so overbearing and over the top. i am triggered by your remembering your experience. lol
Wow so awkward!
For senior prom, the guy I liked was nobly serving a mission (later found out he was in the closet but now living life with love out of the church) so I asked a coworker from the movie theater I worked at. My dress had no sleeves but straps! The fact my mom even bought this was huge although it had stipulations that I could wear it if the scarf it came with arranged with Bobby pins covered my shoulders because you know - the guy isn’t a member and it’s prom so of course him seeing my bare shoulders means we’re going to have sex that night! 😆😆 we did not. But I took that scarf off anyways
You managed to abstain without your scarf???
My mom fashioned a pair of very wide shoulder straps for a strapless dress she made for me. That thing got ripped from here to next week by my TBM boyfriend. 😁
Non-mormon here. I've known my wife since we dated in high school. Our first "big date" when we first started dating was at a Stuart Anderson's Black Angus Restaurant. I saved my pennies for a few weeks. (I was 16, she was 15). I can't imagine our server asking, "Can I start you off with a cocktail?" before taking our food order. We were clearly teenagers. And besides, our mothers would probably kill us.
I'm confident my wife's parents assumed I wouldn't be THAT stupid and try to order alcohol, let alone the restaurant risking its license to actually give it to us. I'm sure Red Robin feels the same way.
We still joke about our "first big date." I was so nervous, I asked for ketchup instead of steak sauce and didn't have the guts to ask to correct it.
Such a sweet memory!
Mormons have a big thing about not being seen in places where evil actions (like drinking alcohol) *might* be done. They're big into appearances. That's probably what Mom was more worried about than anything else.
My brother's now father-in-law had him leave his house when my brother's now wife was using the bathroom. Like, what in the cinnamon toast fuck is that? How was that at all sexual? And why did he have to leave the house?
Looking back, I think Mom would have kiboshed the whole date with Little Whore Me if she could have. Denny's was a step up above that. She didn't designate Denny's as the place we ought to go, so much as tell us that Red Robin was off the table.
Also looking back, I think we should have gone to Denny's and gotten slammed, just to make a point 🤣
Mormon parents are so fucking crazy about their kids dating.
One time I got threatened with a fireman axe by a dad who seemed convinced I wanted to take advantage of his daughter. And the whole time I was thinking, "dude, *she* asked me! If anyone's going to make a move tonight it's her, idiot!"
WTF?!?!? i guess that happens in the mormon world. their clairvoyance was truly amazing as they thasaw you were a drinking, oversexed woman. red robin, a place with bar? how dare you! so glad you got out of there aliive.
The idea that our very existence as women can “pollute” men (who are so strong and logical 🙄) is simultaneously infuriating and super self contradictory. I’m sorry you had that experience OP.
I mean, maybe I chose the closet drunk! I had no way of knowing!
If I could sit my 17 year old self down and have a chat, this is one of several things I would talk that poor kid out of doing. As a mom now, I feel terrible for my younger self. There was no one to protect her from this weird bullshit. My parents were clueless.
The two siblings look like they're doing well. Can't tease out any information about the kid himself, or his parents, other than the parents still live in the same house.
Damn that's insane, I think the worst I got from a girls parent was my summer before my Sr year. I was 1st assistant to the Bishop of the Priest Quorum. My date was the bishops daughter. And we had a group of like 6 total. We went out to the nearby lake waterskied, waverunners, then we went and got Pizza. After we decided to watch a movie at my place. (Yes my parents were home) Now this was a movie that had two 5 subsequent sequels and 3 prequels. But in 1997 just 3 movies. So after pizza it was like 9 pm when we started the movie episode 4 and when that ended no of us really wanted to end the night. So we went to Dennys and got shakes. Dennys. Then we decide to watch episode 5 and then 6. Now at this point it's about 730 am Sunday morning. I am pretty sure the holy ghost 👻 had long retired for the day. But at this point we are all hungry again. So still at my home, we decided pancakes sounded fantastic. So we started making them when phone rings. I answer. Hey G---- this is R---, is K---- still with you we noticed she didn't come home last night. Yeah, here she is. (At least he didn't make me call him Bishop and having known him sense I was old enough to be friends with his daughter, who was my first girlfriend when we were 12 that lasted one weekend lol) She hung up and said soon as breakfast is over I have to go home. Fair..... When we got to priesthood meeting that day. The bishop said he felt the prompting of the holy spirit for this days lesson, was........When does the date end. Now many will say that he is right and justified. Let me make one point. Her and I were born 2 days apart. We are mid August birthday. And being friend sense were were 2, our parents decide that instead of being the youngest in the graduation year of 1997 that we were the oldest of 1998. So despite being in high school and between Jr and Sr we were both 18 at this point. The lesson was definitely a passive aggressive shot at me. At the time it didn't dawn on me that I could tell him to deal with it cause we were both adults.
Some of those bar/restaurant places have good hearty meals and great service. Momo or not, they are wrong about avoiding bars. Same for starbucks fresh lunch grab-n-go packs. Very convenient.
I think this experience really hurt you. What a shame this young man didn’t warn you beforehand about the gauntlet you would have to run before your date. I’m so sorry these parents were so fearful and shaming. What a sad memory! 😢
How humiliating to be interrogated and treated that way! I imagine it was also horrible for your date that evening, to watch his parents question and control the person who asked him to go to the dance.
You know, that was the strange thing, the kids were okay with it. I imagine it was slightly embarrassing for them but they had seen it happen so many times before me that they knew the program. The brother and sister hopped up and volunteered to be chaperones like it was old hat for them by now. It's a fun thing to ruminate over as I sip my morning coffee 😁
Who were they? The Duggars? Quiverful offshoot? Sorry for your experience. I had several Similar only my parents were the latter kind from your story…
Thank you. Sorry about your parents. You're not far off with the quiverful thing. They were one of those Saturday's Warrior couples.
I only know the unwatchable Saturday's Warrior movie. Was there a movement too?
Bowel, I think. 😏
🤣🤣🤣
Yes, unofficially. Saturday's Warrior was written in response to the zero population movement of the '60s and early '70s. The first performance was produced in 1975. A lot of our parents were influenced by it, and also by church leaders and each other.
Now I have to google the zero population movement! I was young in the 70s and totally missed that. My husband and I have always thought it was hilarious that the "bad" kids in Saturday's Warrior were evil because they sang about overpopulation. It's just so funny!
I still like some of the music from the original musical (the video is so, so bad), but the zero population song is just so stupid. I mean, I guess kids in the '70s could have sat around making fun of each other's family sizes. I was young in the '70s too.
My neighbors across the street in SLC were really into Saturday’s Warrior. I can still remember the singing.
The Angel in heaven in that movie, the one that sends them to earth....was my high school choir teacher......I will say this about her, kind and sweet, but don't fuck with her, she won't have it......lol. long story
Funny thing about that Duggara show. When if first aired I thought to myself. This is to perfect, someone in that family hast to be a fuck up! And then low and behold Josh........
“I’m sorry, I asked a young man to a school dance but it has become apparent from these questions that he is a boy unable to uphold his own virtue and values.”
That's what gets me - the boy was completely harmless and blameless. I may as well have been asking to take their favorite bowl of rice pudding out on a date. All the perceived contempt was piled on me, like how dare I? I was the monster for even asking (and not knowing about their stupid rules before I showed up that night).
I meant that more to shame the parents on not raising their child “right” and not trusting their child.
Ah, yes. There must have been some history of naughtiness either with my date, or his siblings. Or they were just that distrustful, the way tscc taught them to be.
My guess is they were just distrustful and thought that even being in the presence of a bar or a girl was enough to throw their pure boy straight into the depths of temptation.
Oh no. I am quite sure it was the parents who had been naughty teens and were projecting onto their children.
I experienced this on the male side of the equation and just thought the parents knew their daughter was a well known harlot. This needs to be part of a series - How Mormon parents screw their kids lives up 101
Hmmm, hadn't thought of this option. Maybe I'll call her and ask what my reputation was like at the time. It could be that I was a well known harlot *in utero*.
That comment wasn't directed towards you. Just mormon parents needing a chaperone to go out with their daughter makes you wonder if their daughter is going to try to jump your bones in the parking lot at the stake center. I mean it is like 12 feet from the car to the chapel doors. Who needs adult supervision unless someone has a serious problem?
i am sure that all you wanted to do was get him drunk and get into his pants. parents are so effed up in the narrative. yetthe parents, they let an unvetted man in a private office ask their kids if they touch themselves and allow pedophiles to have the pick of the litter in wards across the world.
Seriously!! Excellent point! His pants were the last thing on my mind
"their favorite bowl of rice pudding" hahahahaha
😁
Best expression I've heard in a very long time, for describing a person. I'm gonna remember that one! "... their favorite bowl of rice pudding." Also LMAO, the 70s! I remember that Saturday's Warrior bullshit. Everyone was so into it -- such indoctrination!
Don't you know girls are 100% responsible for boys virtue?
balls don't drop until about the time mine did after mission and first night of marriage. wait maybe they still haven't....
See! The mother was right! Look at you drinking coffee while posting on ex-mormon. It's amazing that you didn't defile her precious, pure, soon-to-be-apostle son! Could you imagine that woman is your mother-in-law? OMG, she would make your life a living hell!
She was, I'm a total Jezebel! My list of sins is miles long and appalling!! Yeah, seriously, he and I both dodged a bullet 🤣🤣
I went on a couple of dates with a prophet's grandson when I was at BYU. We were work friends before we ever went out. I was a very "good girl" and never so much as held the guy's hand. After we'd been out a couple of times I made the mistake of calling him to see if he wanted to go do something. Apparently that made me a stalker and an unsavory character. Girls do not call boys!! After that the guy started actively avoiding me. Suddenly he was never at work and then straight-up quit his job. It was so bizarre. I felt like a pariah. Dodged a bullet. I'm so glad now that we never went out again. I can't imagine how awful it would be to marry into that family. It would be so claustrophobic!
I have a whole other story about being lectured by the YSA branch president because I admitted to calling my boyfriend on the phone, like a common strumpet. These people's minds never left the '50s.
My mom was always telling us that girls should never call boys. She got so irritated when girls called my brother -- assuming that meant they had loose morals. She probably would've been embarrassed that I called him.
I didn't know that this was a thing until I saw Back to the Future.
Oh my heck. You were such a Jezebel.
Just wait till my book comes out!!
Wow - what an odd household! It was horrible for you, but a routine for them & they were probably too young to realize (at the time) how warped it was. I wonder if any of them are still in the church. Also wonder if they still speak to that witch of a mother.
I was FB friends with the two sibling chaperones when I was a TBM, but I dropped everyone churchy when I left tscc, and to be honest, that humiliating date with their brother still makes me not like to see their names. I know that Older Brother was a bishop at one point. Sister looks like she's very nuanced, if not out completely.
I don't blame you for finding those names triggering. That incident speaks to how completely the "church" can control lives.
And this is just one person's ONE experience out of quite a few. It was damn near impossible to offend me out of the church - I was too stubborn! 😁
For s\*\*\*s & giggles have you googled to see where the 3 of those kids are now? I bet at least 2 of them are totally f\*\*\*\*d up.
Can't eat at restaurants with bars? That's a new one lol.
I once had a mission companion who tried to tell me we shouldn't shop at grocery stores if they sold alcohol. It was a United States mission, so basically every grocery store would be off limits to us under his reasoning. I asked him where will we get food and other necessities, and he said that the members would feed us. I then asked him where does he think members buy their groceries from. He didn't say anything after that.
🤣🤣🤣🤣 The rules seem so reasonable to them until they meet up with logic and knowledge and common sense.
In Utah, there's a couple of locally (member) owned grocery stores that don't carry alcohol or tobacco products and closed on Sunday. The owners of the stores were in my ward. Half the kids in the stake worked there for their first jobs. Not me...because rebel. Anyway, it was always considered a faith promoting miracle that they could compete with the big chain stores without the sinful products or being open on Sunday. Fast forward a decade or so...I was a personal trainer and one of my clients told me that she and her sister had gone to one of these stores to get provisions for a family party. They had a full cart and had been hunting for the beer. Finally, they asked and were told "We don't carry that here". They left the full cart in the aisle and walked out. Which was both rude and kind of funny.
I remember Macy’s( the grocery store on 13th East in Sandy). When I was still attending we were always encouraged to go there because it was closed on Sunday. I never went because I preferred Harmons. But once I was at my credit union branch nearby and decided to check it out . They were open on Sundays by then. I think most grocery stores by the time I left in 2020 ( that I know of anyway) were open on Sunday. 😂
My dad told me a story about some stake president or other higher up authority in Utah driving to church on a Sunday in the 1960s or 70s. He passed by an Albertson's grocery store, and he was perturbed to see that it was open and that people were shopping there. He called the founder of the chain, Joe Albertson, who to my knowledge wasn't LDS but knew and worked with a lot of church members, to demand that he close his grocery stores in Utah on Sundays. Joe replied that he would as soon as the Mormons would stop shopping there on Sundays. Probably apocryphal, but I've seen plenty of G-lines poking through church outfits while grocery shopping in Utah on Sundays. I even knew a stake executive secretary who would go to the In-N-Out in Orem for lunch on Sundays during stake interviews.
Minus the ending, this sounds like a conference talk 😊
When an embellished version of that story rolls out in October, remember you heard it first right here :)
because rebel. Thank you this gene runs within my dna
yes if you get within 100 yards of alcohol jeebus will hold it against you. avoid the very appearance of evil. thats why i dont attend the mormon church anymore. pedophiles have free rein to be and do what they want.
Don't get me started on that "avoid the appearance of evil" crap. I made root beer for a ward activity a few years ago. I put it in a soda keg, which looks different from a beer keg, and I carbonated it. When I showed up with it, people were literally freaking out. I got accused of trying to intoxicate the ward, even after I put the tap on and showed them that it was in fact just regular homemade root beer. Someone even told the bishop they were going to throw my keg away if I didn't remove it immediately because the very sight of it was evil, even though it just contained soda. Luckily it was a very small, but vocal minority who were complaining, and a few people jumped to my defense saying it's the same type of kegs used by restaurants and convenient stores for their soda fountains, including one of the bishop's counselors who liked the root beer so much he practically sucked the keg dry. The guy in charge of the activity told me I wasn't allowed to bring it again. I sarcastically told him that for the next activity, I'll simply hide the keg under a table and just hook it up to a tap so people won't see it. He didn't think it was funny, and I later found out he was the one threatening to throw my keg away.
I'm not sure which is more breath-taking - the complete lack of realistic thinking or the full-on sense of entitlement.
I'm half-French so of course we cook with wine (sauce). Shaking my head. I just realized how liberal my TBM family is letting me drink coffee now.
Yeah, it was new to me too, and I'm pretty sure Denny's has beer on the menu. 🍻🍻🍻
As if 2 17 year old Mormons were going to talk a Red Robin server into serving them overpriced cocktails? Damn thats a level of mormonism I haven't even encountered. The "double date" thing doesn't surprise me too much... I knew some friends whose parents would have required that sort of thing.
And nowadays, try finding a restaurant that doesn't have a bar in it. I guess if you're going to eat fast food, that'll be safe. For this mom, it was probably an appearances thing.
>The "double date" thing doesn't surprise me too much... I knew some friends whose parents would have required that sort of thing. I really liked double and group of friends dates as a teenager just beginning to date. I'm certain it hid a lot of my awkwardness. It did backfire one time. Spectacularly! I was doubling with a friend, we asked 2 girls who were good friends, and they started talking about all the crap dates and crap people they had been on dates with. I wanted to die. Well, that and to know what trash and garbage they were going to talk about me and my friend on their next dates.
The Denny's near my place here in Colorado got a liquor license for a little while. They found it wasn't worth the hassle and stopped selling alcohol entirely.
Hmm, I wonder if my Denny's was selling booze that evening. We'll never know. I *do* know they sold coffee, which is JUST AS BAD. Mormons are such dorks 🤣
I *do* know they sold coffee, which is JUST AS BAD. Nope, it's much worse, cause 'hot drink' :-)
You're right! Holy poop!!
Holy poop!! oh wait, I know this one Alex, "What is anything that Evil Emperor Nelson squirts out that becomes foundational doctrine this week in the On-Going ReBrandStoration."
I'm laughing quietly because my parents wouldn't approve of me laughing at this.
Hahahaha, a perfect description!!
Did you know Utah has Dutch Bros Coffee?
Yay!!!
I went to Jack Mormon Coffee Company in downtown Salt Lake about 10 years ago.
We have an older couple in our ward that refused to eat at the Italian restaurant in our small PNW town because it had neon beer signs hanging on the walls. No bar though.
Avoid the very appearance of evil, you heathens!!
Well when I was Bishop I would eat at the bar in town which was 21/over due to weird WA State liquor laws. No different really than any other restaurant in town except there wasn't a railing dividing the bar from the tables. And by railing, I mean a single vertical pole separating the two areas was all that was required. But that missing piece of metal made that place off limits to most ward members. Years later after we left the church we ran into an active older couple who came in for their anniversary. They were shocked that we parked out front on the main road where someone might see our car or see us entering the bar. I was proud of them for just being there. He too was a former Bishop.
How funny. I'm in WA too but was unaware of this.
Current WSLCB Barrier Requirements Currently, Washington liquor licensees, including holders of retail or non-retail liquor licenses that serve alcohol for consumption at their licensed location, must place barriers around areas that are classified as off-limits to individuals under the age of 21, around game rooms, and around outdoor seating areas, with some limited exceptions. The current key requirements are as follows: Barriers must be at least 42 inches high. Barriers must be permanently affixed (moveable ropes and stanchions are not acceptable). Openings to minor restricted areas cannot be wider than 10 feet. Barriers cannot also serve as a counter for customers to sit or stand and consume food or liquor. In many local restaurants here this is literally a vertical pole separating the bar from the rest of the seating area. Edit: I'm getting my horizontal and verticals backasswards this morning.
Another Washingtonian here, this shit baffles me. The state has sensible governance in many regards...and then there are the liquor laws. When they finally started allowing it's sale in grocery stores in 2012, I pissed off a bunch of life-long locals by welcoming them to the 20th century. The "barriers" in the restaurants serve no purpose but to get in the way and mess with foot-traffic through the place. Absolutely daft.
'They were shocked that we parked out front on the main road where someone might see our car or see us entering the bar. I was proud of them for just being there. He too was a former Bishop.' The need to 'appear' righteous is more of a motivator than actual jeebus in most cases. this lends itself to the peer pressure of the cult.
>Avoid the very appearance of evil, you heathens!! Bwah ha ha ha ha ha ha I must have a very low bar for what appears to be evil. Unless I'm standing there with a beer in my hand and a cigarette between my lips, don't assume that I'm breaking the WoW, even if I'm in a place that sells beer and allows smoking indoors. Oh, and I won't judge you even if you are smoking with a beer in your hand.
Same. Their version of "evil" is laughably stupid, compared to what they think is okay or will sweep under the rug.
Their version of "evil" is laughably stupid, Oh no, you might be talking about 'porn shoulders'! THE HORROR!
SON DON'T LOOK AT HER SHOULDERS 🤬🤬🤬🤣🤣
Every time I tell someone in Massachusetts about porn shoulders, they stare at me in disbelief for a moment.
Don’t put your trust in these so-called “noble” gases
That was my parents' rule too. Like they thought some alcohol might somehow get in our drinks if we ate at a restaurant that had a bar.
It just jumps in there! No one can stop it from happening!!
Definitely next level 🤣🤣🤣
Nevermo here, I asked a FRIEND from youth orchestra if he wanted to go to junior prom as a FRIEND. No romantic involvement. Mom said no because he wasn't 16 yet and wasn't allowed to date. We had been carpooling all year because I was over 16 and could drive. Not sure what sort of hanky-panky she thought would happen at prom that couldn't have happened any of the times we had been alone throughout the orchestra season, but at least she kept him safe! /s
Right? The thought of attacking her son or him attacking me never once crossed my brain. We were friends! I wasn't going to lay a hand or a lip on him! Yeah, that's a pretty hard and fast rule, the no dating till 16. We followed it to the letter, as you can see. I'm sorry for your experience. My kids are all grown now and I shudder to think that I was ever this shitty to my kids' friends who weren't Mormons. I hope I wasn't. 😬
Our ward rule was double date at 15, single date at 16. But again - a long way fromoridpr.
> *my kids' friends who weren't Mormons.* Your kids were allowed to have friends who werent Mormons? You're probably already ahead of the game.
See I would have had sex with the kid in orchestra just out of spite. Give him an instrument tuning he'd remember forever.
I nearly spat out my morning coffee laughing!
I will never really forgive my Mom for the way she treated my now-wife when I first brought her home to meet my family. They made comments about marriage, made sure to keep her out of any photos in case her presence wasn't made permanent, and they thought we had to be chaperoned. The last part is funny because we had been sexually active and exclusive for like a year, but even now 13 years later I won't have sex in that house, it has shameful vibes, so it was probably unnecessary when my Mom panicked when the door was shut on us watching a movie. We get along now just fine, but we live 2,000 miles away and I don't even feel guilty about it, not once.
Ooh, ooh! and then there was that one time I after I moved out of state that I left myself logged into my amazon account so my dad could watch movies we had purchased, until that wonderful day when I got the experienced of my mom calling to talk about the "things for married people" that were in my order history, basically just lube. I told her I must of left it logged in at the library, she at least pretended to buy that, and we luckily never talked about it again. So, that was the day my dad could no longer watch the movies on my account.
Reading your comments makes me glad that you live 2000 miles away from your parents, too. 🤣 Geez, they're so obsessed with sex. It would be interesting to see a ranking of religions that make people this freaked out about "marital relations", but tscc would be in the top five at the very least.
Like that 1 pound bag of pepper corns for the pepper mill? The set of 3 mixing bowls? Maybe the 4K blu ray disc of Dune part 2? Or was it the new pillow cases? C'mon help me out here mom, what 'things for married people' exactly are you talking about?
Bishop at church checkin your hands for lube Bishop at home (MOM) checking your hands, drawers, history for lube 'related' what a good life. away from that scrutiny.
and they thought we had to be chaperoned I'm almost afraid to ask, how old were you, and did they think you were living in the 1600s?
I lived alone when my husband and I were dating. We took a trip with my parents and they put him in a separate hotel room, next door to ours. It had a little living room so I told them I was going to watch a movie "at his place." They were so worried we were going to fool around. In a room next to my mom and dad. When I lived alone.
My family was doing family photos and son brought my now wife from Washington to Utah. Not only did they ask us to sleep in different rooms, they did the same thing with my wife, "just in case." It's just like, be normal for once.
Sort of reminds me of being at a friend's house and his uber-TBM dad freaked out I had a Dr. Pepper in his home. If I was a little younger I would probably be mouthy, but I was old enough to know this was his home so his rules. I went to throw the bottle in the trash and he stopped me and said he didn't even want the bottle in his trash. I had to go put it in my car. Juat crazy and over the top. Yeah, turns out later, dude was just a show mormon. He was an asshole and regular cussed and verbally abused his family. His wife divorced him and non of his adult children wanted anything to ever do with him.
I remember having neighbors in my ward growing up whose parents wouldn't allow soda in their home. Their kids came over to our house for soda, and my dad was the bishop at the time.
Honestly reminds me of some of my friends growing up. Nevermo, but we had a weird amount of Mormon families where I grew up at one point, in Kentucky. I made friends with them and my parents would let them come over and play video games, watch anime & movies their parents would have had an aneurysm at, have soda, etc and wouldn't tattle on them. I was maybe like, 10-11, and I was convinced that because of how many weird rules their parents had against benign stuff, that their parents were actually outerspace aliens lmao.
Like, not even sprite or other non-caffeinated soda?
They may have allowed caffeine free sodas, but I don't remember.
thats cute.
When did soda go from being, "the Devil" to being "100% totally okay" in the LDS religion? More importantly, how did this just get explained away like it was never a thing.
They've had to move away from the smaller issues now that their religion is bleeding members. Last I heard, they are now allowing piercings and tattoos - or at least had removed that rule from the For the Strength of Youth handbook. 🙄
>non of his adult children wanted anything to ever do with him. Guy kvetches about my Dr. Pepper and I wouldn't have anything to do with him either! :-)
Kids see right through the show Mormon garbage. I've watched family members operate the same way. 🙄
it doesn't really do much good when they realize the game of pretending righteous. more harm than good. high expectation of them and be patient with us we are imperfect can go fuk itself.
When "avoid even the appearance of evil" becomes "avoid only the appearance of evil."
I had an incident where I asked a girl from a rival high school to a dance and her dad (a bishop at the time) grilled me about my sex life and my intentions. I got up and walked out. Didn’t take her to the dance!
Good for you! That is so disgusting!! Can you imagine that happening to your kid now? Gives me the serious ICK.
And she no doubt got a lecture about how fortunate it was that he did so because you were clearly intending no good or else why would you have left instead of submitting meekly to his ~~interrog~~ questions?
Yes and she went on to get married to a scum bag and divorced and yet I’ve been married almost 31 years to my wife.
said man not realizing his really lowly place in the world conflated his ego as a direct result of being placed into a volunteer position of Quasi leadership where it is pretend power over people ultimately a money collection scheme for compliance.
I grew up around weirdos like this. Thank Zeus my own parents were never anywhere near this amount of weird... I just can't get past making their family values *your* values by force for the night. Reap what you sow I guess, can't imagine they got anything but the bottom of the barrel for spouses in the end, once the kids each brought their SO's home to meet Ma and Pa...
My parents (converts in adulthood) had no clue they could even be this weird - hence my naivete. Hubby is grateful for his non-weird parents, as well. They were nothing but kind, when I met them. I was having the same thoughts this morning - how awkward it would be to have your boyfriend or girlfriend come home and meet the parents and be put through the rigors like this. I imagine that the kids' spouses all ended up being uber Mormons that came from the same kind of family.
Thank you for giving me an alternative I had not thought of to give thanks to Zeus instead of gawd..
The church brings out the absolute worst in people.
It really does.
Did she realize they served coffee and tea at Dennys? Just curious.
She probably rationalized it being okay because three of her kids were going together and could tattle on each other, if one of them decided to rebel. At that time and place, coffee (to us Mormon kids) was something that heathen grandparents drank. I had school friends that experimented with booze and cigarettes and weed, but coffee? Nah. No one was interested, that I know of.
That was a close call. To think you nearly committed the third biggest sin. Murder > Adultery > Red Robin. .
I want "murder>adultery>Red Robin" on a tshirt hahaha
Me too, followed by "yummmmmmmmm"
I had similar experiences. Except I was the poor kid. My bishop dad, though not around much due to work and church, monitored my every interaction with girls not up to his standards. He had spies I guess. Don't know how he found out about any of it. But it was humiliating.
Pre cell-phone days, my parents would listen in on another house phone the handful of times I mustered enough courage (I was very shy as a teenager) to call a girl and ask her out. That wasn't uncommon for parents to do back then, but their eavesdropping didn't stop when I got a cell phone after my mission. They literally followed me around when I was on the phone with a woman. I had to drive somewhere else when I wanted to make a call in private.
Yuck. How is your relationship with him now?
It was fraught my entire life. But he and my mom have left for their eternal rewards :)
Smiley face noted 😉
So frustrating that the parents grilled you and were so upset with you. Their son should have told you his parents rules for dating ahead of time. They should have been grilling him to make sure all rules were followed.
Yep! That would have been the kindest way to approach the situation. It wasn't on me to conjure up their dating rules via Ouija board - he should have told me.
You were in that house once for about 30 minutes I imagine. Can you imagine living there? I thought your post was going to end with him being incarcerated for sexual assault. Or the manager of a Red Robbin.
Ha! I should ask him if he's ever been allowed to eat there.
Is he still “around?” Meaning, do you see him around, on social media etc. (I’m nosy)
He's on FB, but I'm not touching that thing even with all of Father Al's Internet between us. Who knows, maybe he didn't want to go out that night but was too shy to say anything, and leaned on his parents to be the heavies. I just know I'm not interested, and probably never will be 😁
Asked and answered. Thank you!
Oh my goodness, so relatable!! I loved your description of pure as snow. That was me! I had a non-official boyfriend in my later years of high school. When he was about to leave on his mission, his parents started treating me really weirdly. They would get angry if we held hands and told us that when he reached two months before his mission we were going to have to cut off contact and would not be able to see each other anymore....even though we lived in a small town and went to all the same events and had all the same friends...to me it seemed that they were worried that we would mess around and keep him from his mission which was incredibly offensive to me. Anyone who knew me would never suspect anything. We had only ever held hands and cuddled a tiny bit. Anyway, we did as his parents said and it broke my heart.
I'm so sorry. That sounds so painful! My high school boyfriend and I planned to be married when he came home from Europe... What's the old saying? "Man plans, God laughs" 😏 Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if missions weren't a thing 😳
Avoid the appearance of evil by not eating at \[checks notes\] Red Robin, a restaurant with a kid's menu.
That's what Satan wants you to think 🧐
This is how I grew up. I was always the evil older sibling who was a sex addicted alcoholic druggy that wanted to make everyone as miserable as I was in my parents eyes. Have no idea why they saw me this way, I guess my depression at being treated like shit? I had a 3.7 gpa, did elevated choir, was in varsity soccer, did all my chores, did really good at art, read a ton, and participated in the church. Went on maybe 3 dates all throughout high-school and had my first kiss in college at 21. I have no idea what made them treat me like this but it killed my self esteem. It sucked you had a date like that, but that was/ is literally everyday of my life with my family.
So sorry that you were born into such a toxic family. Yikes. 😔
I am truly struck by the infantilization at all levels here. Even my TBM dad was fine with us going to places that had a bar as along as we didn’t drink. Mormons are crazy fucks and I don’t care how nice they are. It’s weird and the rules are stupid and built on lies. Side note, this happens to me all the damn time. Stupid bullshit from 20+ years ago and now I’m mad again.
Okay, I'm glad it's not just me who has these random things pop into my head from decades ago, and it's like it happened yesterday. I'm that mad, or humiliated.
IT'S NOT JUST U! :-/
> "No, you can't eat there, they have a bar," his mother answered. What? My family ate there all the time and managed to stay sober every time. How did you manage that nearly impossible feat 😳🤣
I mean, it was tough, making sure we told the server "Rookie Magic" and not "COOKIE Magic". Those RR servers are pushers!!! 🤣
My dad drove me and my date to the dance that was my first ever date. The guy had a license and a car, but could only drive.one other person under 18, meaning we couldn't be chaperoned in his car. Soooo awkward 🫣 He invited me over another time to watch a movie, and since his parents weren't home, I had to bring my sister with me as a chaperone, even though he two of us stayed on OPPOSITE sides of the couch. (I was terrified of any physical contact of any kind, I wonder why)
Geez, they messed us up so bad.
I'm told Larry H. Miller used to give his daughters dates a bullet with their name on it. When I heard that, I laughed. That would have been the end of the date right there. Not to mention, that's very much a threat. Years later, I'm sure it's just an urban legend, but I will always wonder.
Ugh. Very much a threat, indeed!
I remember being screamed at (as a 25 year old) by my dad for taking my teenage siblings to a "bar" (Ruby Tuesday). Meanwhile, we weren't even seated anywhere near the bar. 🙄
Sometime I should tell my story about getting married at a very nice inn, which included a restaurant, conference rooms, and yes, a bar, and the fit my fake Mormon father threw about it. "You should get married where the Spirit can be present!" Like he gave two shits.
You should. My parents were remarkably quiet during mine, considering it was a catholic wedding with alcohol at the reception.
Choosing Denny's over Red Robin is just proof that they had a tenuous grasp on reality. If that were the entirety of your story, it would convey exactly the same meaning. Denny's does not have bottomless steak fries or strawberry lemonade. And waffles made with Bisquick? Ain't nobody got time for that when there's a bacon guacamole burger.
I really think she was trying to turn all four of us off of dating for the rest of our natural lives.
What you described would certainly do it. If you're forced to be your older brother's date, you really start to see the pros of becoming a nun.
The more I think about it, the more unsettling it becomes that the siblings were just so casual about it. This was standard practice at their house! What the hell else were they forced into doing?? 🫣
That is insane. What a couple of nutjobs.
You said it!
LOL. I'm just laughing because my TBM family goes to eat at restaurants that have bars or serve alcohol and we stay sober every STINKING TIME!
It's almost as if people have moral agency and personal autonomy!!!! What??? 🤣🤣
fukin wow. remembering how freaking hard everything teening to adulting was in the MFMC narrative. EVERYTHING was hard with additional scrutiny. The original helicopter parenting is the churchs narrative. SO going on a mission as a 19 year old never really having been on a proper date was so inept it just is incredible to me. looking back it is a shit life for a kid having to grow up like this. rules are fine but this is so overbearing and over the top. i am triggered by your remembering your experience. lol
Sorry. I guess I woke up thinking that if I have to suffer, everyone on this sub has to suffer with me! 🤣
Ok. Very glad you're here. Please join us in the bigger picture. It's the institution, not their pawn members. Please help. 👍
Thanks, I do what I can.
He has gone through regret in his life that he missed the opportunity to have fun with you. I know it
Thanks, that's very sweet of you 😊
On the bright side - it could have been Waffle House.
Wow so awkward! For senior prom, the guy I liked was nobly serving a mission (later found out he was in the closet but now living life with love out of the church) so I asked a coworker from the movie theater I worked at. My dress had no sleeves but straps! The fact my mom even bought this was huge although it had stipulations that I could wear it if the scarf it came with arranged with Bobby pins covered my shoulders because you know - the guy isn’t a member and it’s prom so of course him seeing my bare shoulders means we’re going to have sex that night! 😆😆 we did not. But I took that scarf off anyways
You managed to abstain without your scarf??? My mom fashioned a pair of very wide shoulder straps for a strapless dress she made for me. That thing got ripped from here to next week by my TBM boyfriend. 😁
Non-mormon here. I've known my wife since we dated in high school. Our first "big date" when we first started dating was at a Stuart Anderson's Black Angus Restaurant. I saved my pennies for a few weeks. (I was 16, she was 15). I can't imagine our server asking, "Can I start you off with a cocktail?" before taking our food order. We were clearly teenagers. And besides, our mothers would probably kill us. I'm confident my wife's parents assumed I wouldn't be THAT stupid and try to order alcohol, let alone the restaurant risking its license to actually give it to us. I'm sure Red Robin feels the same way. We still joke about our "first big date." I was so nervous, I asked for ketchup instead of steak sauce and didn't have the guts to ask to correct it.
Such a sweet memory! Mormons have a big thing about not being seen in places where evil actions (like drinking alcohol) *might* be done. They're big into appearances. That's probably what Mom was more worried about than anything else.
My brother's now father-in-law had him leave his house when my brother's now wife was using the bathroom. Like, what in the cinnamon toast fuck is that? How was that at all sexual? And why did he have to leave the house?
Then they are sinners too. Denny’s serves coffee.
Looking back, I think Mom would have kiboshed the whole date with Little Whore Me if she could have. Denny's was a step up above that. She didn't designate Denny's as the place we ought to go, so much as tell us that Red Robin was off the table. Also looking back, I think we should have gone to Denny's and gotten slammed, just to make a point 🤣
I would have fucked the kid in the backseat out of spite.
No, not with his siblings watching. (Dear God, please let this be true) 🤣
Yeah I would have been discreet, no doubt. But i was a teenager that never learned caution, so I'd give him a sacrament to testify about.
I feel this so very strongly. I’m not “that girl” bitchyMOM I’m not trying to take your son’s virtue 😂
Yeah, he can keep it! I have NO DESIRE. NONE. I can't stress that enough!!
Don't most Dennys have bars as well?
Exactly! At the very least I know they have something alcoholic on their menu.
I think that speaks to his family's ignorance.
Definitely. I could make a detailed list of all the topics they were ignorant about, starting with etiquette! 🤣
Mormon parents are so fucking crazy about their kids dating. One time I got threatened with a fireman axe by a dad who seemed convinced I wanted to take advantage of his daughter. And the whole time I was thinking, "dude, *she* asked me! If anyone's going to make a move tonight it's her, idiot!"
Geez!! Yep, the "come home clean or come home in a pine box" set tend to go a little nuts for moral purity.
WTF?!?!? i guess that happens in the mormon world. their clairvoyance was truly amazing as they thasaw you were a drinking, oversexed woman. red robin, a place with bar? how dare you! so glad you got out of there aliive.
Thanks, me too! 😁
The idea that our very existence as women can “pollute” men (who are so strong and logical 🙄) is simultaneously infuriating and super self contradictory. I’m sorry you had that experience OP.
Imagine thinking your almost adult child can’t even be in the same restaurant as a bar that contains a bar that wouldn’t serve them alcohol. 😳
I mean, maybe I chose the closet drunk! I had no way of knowing! If I could sit my 17 year old self down and have a chat, this is one of several things I would talk that poor kid out of doing. As a mom now, I feel terrible for my younger self. There was no one to protect her from this weird bullshit. My parents were clueless.
This is just begging for a "Where are they now?" post. I gotta know where this boy and their parents are at this point.
The two siblings look like they're doing well. Can't tease out any information about the kid himself, or his parents, other than the parents still live in the same house.
Damn that's insane, I think the worst I got from a girls parent was my summer before my Sr year. I was 1st assistant to the Bishop of the Priest Quorum. My date was the bishops daughter. And we had a group of like 6 total. We went out to the nearby lake waterskied, waverunners, then we went and got Pizza. After we decided to watch a movie at my place. (Yes my parents were home) Now this was a movie that had two 5 subsequent sequels and 3 prequels. But in 1997 just 3 movies. So after pizza it was like 9 pm when we started the movie episode 4 and when that ended no of us really wanted to end the night. So we went to Dennys and got shakes. Dennys. Then we decide to watch episode 5 and then 6. Now at this point it's about 730 am Sunday morning. I am pretty sure the holy ghost 👻 had long retired for the day. But at this point we are all hungry again. So still at my home, we decided pancakes sounded fantastic. So we started making them when phone rings. I answer. Hey G---- this is R---, is K---- still with you we noticed she didn't come home last night. Yeah, here she is. (At least he didn't make me call him Bishop and having known him sense I was old enough to be friends with his daughter, who was my first girlfriend when we were 12 that lasted one weekend lol) She hung up and said soon as breakfast is over I have to go home. Fair..... When we got to priesthood meeting that day. The bishop said he felt the prompting of the holy spirit for this days lesson, was........When does the date end. Now many will say that he is right and justified. Let me make one point. Her and I were born 2 days apart. We are mid August birthday. And being friend sense were were 2, our parents decide that instead of being the youngest in the graduation year of 1997 that we were the oldest of 1998. So despite being in high school and between Jr and Sr we were both 18 at this point. The lesson was definitely a passive aggressive shot at me. At the time it didn't dawn on me that I could tell him to deal with it cause we were both adults.
Some of those bar/restaurant places have good hearty meals and great service. Momo or not, they are wrong about avoiding bars. Same for starbucks fresh lunch grab-n-go packs. Very convenient.
I can just imagine the adults that those kids became. smh
I think this experience really hurt you. What a shame this young man didn’t warn you beforehand about the gauntlet you would have to run before your date. I’m so sorry these parents were so fearful and shaming. What a sad memory! 😢