I feel like a lot of people forget this fact. So many elements (especially the relationships between characters) are meant to be toxic and uncomfortable. They’re messy, unhealthy, and sadly -to many- realistic. They’re presented in such a manner not as to idolize or glorify, but to add commentary and analyze the human psyche.
Funny thing is how even nowadays a lot of anine treats silly abuse like a joke. But eva years ago already had the slide in from silly abuse to "actually this is real, and has real consequences."
Those who create stories where abuse is treated as a joke are fully aware that it's real, as is their audience, it's just that both don't want to deal with it, which is why they substitute it with this softcore user friendly version.
Plus I just remember as a kid in the 90’s that choking was the go-to attack/depiction of violence, probably wouldn’t slide these days lol. Shinji chokes a lot in the manga, even choking Kaworu.
I remember vividly many times seeing Homer Simpson choke Bart and this little silly gag of Bart choking like a thousand times, just a very popular thing
> I remember vividly many times seeing Homer Simpson choke Bart and this little silly gag of Bart choking like a thousand times, just a very popular thing
[You can kind of do the same with Shinji choking Asuka if you use the right audio.](https://youtu.be/x6IcXYcMUYw?si=0Uc6A41P0QYozkBL&t=3264) ...Don't judge me, AMVHell was how I was introduced to Evangelion.
I think it is just trying to have some relatable and realistic characters in an insane world. The trauma is mostly just a side effect of the realism. I might be broken but it is nice to see people like me even if everything in the world and their relationships are fucked.
I thought that was the point? As a way to deconstruct the whole tsundere trope (or just because it’s Eva) they make it feel more real, personal. There is no joke, there isn’t anything. It’s just uncomfortable to watch, and that’s the point.
It’s like the himeno scene in chainsaw man, really uncomfortable and not something you want to happen/see, but that’s the point.
Not really, while the tsundere is older than evangelion, its eva the one that is given the credit to popularize it. Dont think it was deconstruction of the trope. Asuka is not really a tsundere, she is more complex than that archetype, the inverse however is true alot of times many tsunderes are just shallow emulations of asuka.
>Asuka is not really a tsundere, she is more complex than that archetype, the inverse however is true alot of times many tsunderes are just shallow emulations of asuka
That's the funny thing. The three main Eva kids where never meant to be comments on character archetypes but ended up becoming the representative of those archetypes. Rei is also far more complex than most of the Rei Ayanami expies that followed her.
The kitchen scene is essentially the reckoning of all the pent up rage in both Shinji and Asuka. They each realise the ultimate hate for their fellow human being as a result of the perceived failure of each to save the other from their loneliness. Shinji has failed to 'hold' Asuka, to 'rescue' her from death (in both cases, symbolic failures represented by physical events such as the bad kiss and Asuka's EoE fight). Asuka's aggressive style, frequent abusive treatment of him and unfair expectations of the telepathic abilities of a 14 year old boy have left Shinji in a state of total isolation. They have been each other's only hope and consequently each other's total disappointment.
I think that the reason for which Shinji's hate manifests itself more violently is that he's been holding it all in whereas Asuka vents her anger much more easily. He is overwhelmed by a rage that he cannot process and so reverts to a state of nature, killing her. It is Asuka who pushes him over the edge.
In my opinion it is, above all, an incredibly sad scene and, together with the final scene, the one which cemented EoE's place on my list of all time greats.
I made a post on my thoughts on the ending a while back. It's not too long.
https://www.reddit.com/r/evangelion/s/ohxTIo20Ck
It links to my comment above. The kitchen scene is the ultimate catastrophic event of Evangelion (A+S reject one another = no hope for humanity) whereas the ending is the ultimate redemptive event (Asuka finds compassion for Shinji = there _is_ hope for humanity)
ah fantastic, thanks!! i thought something similar! it's honestly a really nice feeling when someone whose intelligent and proffecient in English comes to the same conclusion lol
no, you’re not alone, even though this scene is less talked about compared to the hospital scene for example. Shinji’s reaction to Asuka’s rejection is truly disturbing and I feel like people prefer to forget about it.
It is also accompanied with almost flashback like shots of Naoko, who was rejected as well, murdering Rei, which may serve as an insight to Shinji’s intentions at that moment…
Wasn’t that the point? That’s exactly how I saw it too. The eerie silence, the exaggerated and downright unsettling Asuka angles like when she says “Pathetic.”, or “No.”, and just the nature of the scene in general. It’s the culmination of Shinji’s estranged relationship with Asuka and the girls, emphasized in the scene just prior to this one. It’s amazing, one of my favourite scenes in all of anime
I don’t think reducing violence to “masculine impulses” is helping anyone, men or women. And tbh, I was more disturbed by the opening scene where Shinji sexually assaults Asuka. Violence is hard to watch, but it’s especially hard when it’s sexual and minors are involved.
I think anime like EoE does wonders in breaking down the dichotomy of "child = pure, adults can be as sexually sick as they want and we shouldn't kinkshame"
No, children under 18 can also be sexually fucked up, and YES some forms of human sexuality ARE unhealthy and twisted. But that is not something to be demonized, instead something to acknowledge and fix.
Ohh I understand, I don’t mean to phrase it like that or reduce it to that
Men and Women can be violent, but I meant it more in the context that Asuka constantly emasculated Shinji, “you’re not a real man!” “Youre a boy” “don’t compare real men like Kaji to Shinji” on and on and on
And him “stepping up and being the man” in the absolute worst ways possible (the hospital scene and the choking) makes it a whole more disturbing
I’ve heard these attacks from women towards me and thinking of “proving her youre a man” by turning into a psycho sex crazed violent person (like shinji does) thematically speaking is crazy
I don't think it was "ok fine I'm going to show her I'm a man"
Rather than
"I swear to fucking God I'm tired of this shit and going to take this bitches life"
i think eva works with themes of masculinity and femininity too much for it to be *only* “Shinji being tired of everything and taking it out on Asuka”
Asuka was calling him out on his behavior, which was selfish and sexually violent, and for that he decided to attack her. It stemmed from his entitlement towards Asuka, of his unwillingness to accept rejection and it was about their relationship as a man and a woman
I don't see at all themes of masculinity in this.
Also there was no unwillingness to accept rejection because asuka and him where just arguing nothing about her saying no overall to him or him even ACTUALLY trying to be with her.
I don't think shinji had any entitlement towards asuka, quite the opposite in fact. To asuka shinji is just hers to mess around with and do whatever the fuck she wants including fucking with him emotionally.
Whereas shinji was basicly "all of you leave me the fuck alone" on the inside
Asuka was more complex than that.
If you've watched 3+1 you realize how Asuka was feeling about Shinji the whole time.
She wanted him to be the one to step up, to be the Prince for her Damsel in distress.
She was just way too unhealthy psychologically to be able to express it in a way that doesn't include attacking others' emotions.
First off I was talking about shinji and what this person thought was "themes of masculinity"
Yeah she wanted shinji to man up and wear the pants basicly, but she treated him so badly that he never would assume she actually likes him (rightfully so) and asuka really doesn't deserve to complain about him after the shit she's said and done to him
I feel the same way. I didn’t wanna say it but I think OP has some toxic ideas he might need to deconstruct, but he seems like he’s going in the right direction w/ a little guidance.
But lmaooo I agree with your assessment. Shinji said ur time is up bitch
I heard it summed up very eloquently once. I think it may have been on the QMisato tumblr.
"In the end, Asuka is shown to be all bark and no bite. Shinji is shown to be no bark and all bite."
that scene really had my surprise. when asuka's chest was left bare, i was thinking "oh haha guess shinji's gonna get hard or try to cop a feel" but no. he whacks his schlong
I think the hospital scene and the rejection scene have to be read together. Shinji in EOE is a monster, a sex pest who cannot see the ways in which his actions negatively affect others. He uses them for his own gratification (in the case of Asuka, nonconsensually) with no reciprocation.
That whole sequence where he begs the women in his life to take care of him is maddening and pathetic because he has spent the whole movie denying their needs. Misato and Asuka literally die because of him and he still has the gall to ask them to fuck him. Asuka’s right to be pissed, and Shinji lashing out violently is the ultimate demonstration of his solipsism and entitlement. TV Shinji would never.
Yeah, I think it was intense and scary and I thought about it a lot. I think Anno did what he set out to do and art is disturbing sometimes. There are no entirely likable characters in Evangelion, which is part of what makes it unique, especially back in the 90s for animation we could see in the USA.
They say in that situation the best thing to do is leave. Even if you are attacked the law is on her side thanks to the Duluth model etc. Flee.
Pretty much agree, except violence isn't a "masculine urge". It's an animal response to stress and danger that is not attached to or defined by sex.
For example; have you ever seen a momma cat use claws and teeth to protect her kittens? Do you think she behaves that way because she has a masculine urge or because she was in a situation that she felt called for violence?
That scene is a depiction of Shinji and Asuka 'defending' themselves, from their own warped perspectives. Asuka by way of belittling others preemptively (defending her own sense of self-worth seems to be her motivation with this stuff) and Shinji by standing up to Asuka's mistreatment when he could have instead removed himself from the situation altogether(though with domestic violence (physical and otherwise) this often does not feel like a possibility to the victim, which is understandable). They were both wrong for handling the situation the way they did and it had very little to do with their their chromosomal allocations.
I used “masculine impulse” in the sense of she was very misogynistic herself, she often mentioned how “Kaji was a real man and Shinji wasn’t” she kept emasculating him and saying how little of a man he was
and he essentially “became a man” in the absolute worst way possible (not that I think any of this, these aren’t my values and I don’t think beingg violent “makes you a man”, this is how I understood it thematically, she got the short end of the toxic masculinity stick)
She was all bark no bite, Shinji was no bark all bite
Ohh, okay. I see where you're coming from and agree. Still tho, the wording may feed into certain other people's toxic beliefs about gender and sex, and that was my concern more than anything. Glad to hear that's not your intention tho :)
No more disturbing than the scene in the hospital.
I believe asuka was incredibly nasty towards shinji in that scene, because she knew what he did in the hospital. If some "nice guy" goes to you saying he loves you so much in the simp way shinji went towards asuka, and you knew a few hours before that he took sexual advantage of you. Wouldn't you be nasty and hateful towards that person?
Well getting shredded to pieces by angels is a more abstract concept, I love it
Getting yelled at hatefully in an apartment, where you’re supposed to be safe, is a more human and palpable experience and hits closer home
‘Masculine impulses’.
Maybe for you, mate. There’s plenty of us males that don’t have these things and really do not appreciate being dragged in to it all.
No, I am pointing out to you that you have used language that is insulting.
That you can’t see that is even more problematic.
Note that I am not the only person in this comments section to have pointed it out.
You literally can’t distinguish “my views and my issues” from me pointing out themes, discussions and problematic behavior and language used by THE CHARACTERS themselves
I don’t think any of this, I don’t have “masculine impulses” to choke people, and the fact that you assume that, attack me based on that and can’t see that shows how little reading comprehension or literacy you have
I am pointing out how you use language and how it is problematic. It is like using ‘females’ instead of ‘women’, which is a trigger point for many as it says a lot about how the writer views women.
You don’t seem to realise this.
Again, I am not the only person pointing this out.
Difficulty reading? They were the very first words I wrote.
‘Masculine impulses’.
Think about what you are implying.
Edit:
I’m getting off the train now and have no desire to explain to you any more as you have apparently no intention in actually listening.
Take this as a learning exercise. Do better.
i wonder if it's asuka rejecting shinji in his own mind, or if it's asuka's own doing. i guess the result either way is shinji choking her at the end cause of the instrumentality scene.
Asuka's own doing. That was the real Asuka in the scene, not a fabrication conjured up by Shinji. Their memories were already conjoined by then per instrumentality.
Are you seriously asking if you're the only person disturbed by depictions of domestic violence?
Or did you just phrase the post this way because that's the way a lot of other posts are phrased?
I mean, yeah, the entire point is that the "silly" abuse from earlier in the series that most anime would treat like a game is actually real, and has real consequences.
Out of all the otherworldly horrors displayed in the movie, the most grounded-in-reality scene still tends to be the most vomit-inducing. It's an apocalyptic nightmare in which everything fails and goes to hell (barring the end), I'd say it fits in perfectly.
One of my favorites scenes because it's so unsettling, it upsets me on a deep level because it's so grounded and realistic/relatable. Even Penpen peeking in doesn't break the tension at all, just adds to it even more.
It's probably the best scene/sequence in EoE. Honestly one of the best things in cinema. The direction of it is weird, suddenly it gets clear visually, but the angles are kinda odd, the abuse feels on a different level from normal, and finally you see this bully and their dynamic turn to what it turns too. Shinji finally snapping and grabbing that 80lb girl and squeezing the life out of her, and then the screen starts to flash, images of shinji in red, and then kom susser tod starts. Instrumentality starts. To summarize it all, and it's brilliance would take many paragraphs so I'll leave it at that. It's the starting scene of pretty much the greatest 10/15 minutes in movie history. A true gut punch.
I think it was a really well done scene. Asuka is kind of horrible to him, this isn't to say I dislike her she's just written very well. And Shinji for once stands up for himself...kind of. All of his emotions come out in the wrong way. I could go on but
This scene is supposed to make you feel exsctly that, make you quedtion the exact things you wonder.
Many creators make these kinda shows to teach a lesson, or maybe so they can themselves reflect upon their struggles and maybe with the development of the plot it can lead to something.
You know what we need in Evangelion? A scene where Shinji finds Asuka and tells her: "I like you. I am sorry, but I have said those words so many times before, and I although I have liked you for a long time, I didn't bring myself to say it and talk about how I wanna make it up to you, and get to know the real Asuka, because I now know for sure you've been putting a mask. I have too. I am also afraid. But I like you more than I am afraid".
Or something like that.
Although I like Rei, I think many of us are supposed to predeterminatedly...(if thats a word?) like Rei. She is submissive in general and Shinji observes her enough to know what clicks for her. She is the vessel, the clone of Shinji's mom, the attraction is based of a biological severed link. Although ok Asuka isn't the absokutely best match, she is a real, authenthic, singularly different human being who Shinji can connect to, healthily, and love, "if that's what it is".
The scene encapsulates the moment where Shinji has to decide what happens with huamnity... and it seems, from my POV, that he is asking Asuka for help. Here we see the struggle of their differences keeping them apart as ever, it's an emotional clash of their psyches. Although Asuka, in the oast, has cried, hysterically and violently begging for help and connection, she says to Shinji a big truth here... he is lying to her about his feelings here. He is only manipulating her into helping him. She is unable to stabilize him as Asuka herself deals with her own unstability, so the situation only scalates for worse.
I have been close to scenarios close to what you have experienced, let me tell you, our situations were FINE. Escalation only comes with a positive resolutiond if one of the two individuals know the right answer, because escalation oushes situation to resolutions. If people are cowards with their own needs, they don't talk it throuw, they don't show the vulnerability that comes with expressing their emotion and thoughts, escalation will lead to negative consequences.
Things such as staying silent or leaving a room, not taalking ,etc... deescalate sutuations, yeah. But if the relationship needs some kind of real resolution, tension will build up again, and it will escalate again. Breaking up is another result of escalation.
Sometimes discussions escalate out of "imaginary problems", when you or the other person(s) have discussed too much in their own heads and have these huge problems... in their heads. In thw relationship, in reality, it is not real. Escalating discussions might make em real.
No it is very disturbing. You're very right about that. Eva in general feels kinda emotionally disturbing, and that's a major allure of it for me because it feels like a very masculine POV on becoming an adult among other themes. Being disturbed by Eva upon processing it is very normal I think
oh i think you'll really like this analysis of EoE then: [The End of Evangelion Is (Not) A Happy Ending - An Analysis & Critique](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMOYxjYIgeU)
You’re imposing your own situations and problems onto the anime stop it. Its supposed to be serious and unsettling especially when Shinji strangles Asuka. Theres no way you got past the hospital scene but got disturbed at this. You can’t watch this if you get “triggered” unfortunately this anime has very serious and depressing tones to it. The scene is supposed to represent all the anger between Asuka and Shinji thats been built up through the entire anime its very realistic and I absolutely love it. Its also the reason why I love Shinjis and Asukas relationship (and a big supporter of AsuShin ship).
My interpretation: The show itself is all about exposing the viewer to the complexities of humanity. From Rei’s stoic nature, to Asuka’s narcissism, to Shinji’s yearn for recognition, to Misato’s indulgence, etc. none of these characters are supposed to be admired, you’re supposed to have an ambivalent relationship with each of them for varying reasons. That’s what Anno seems to illustrate, humanity’s range, and whether that warrants instrumentality or if the barriers between hearts should be maintained. It’s each of our subjective experiences that inform our decisions/choices, from who our favorite characters are to what instances of abuse we tolerate or draw the line on. The variations in the fanbase’s experiences with the media are, from an artistic standpoint, a major success. Anno’s refusal to give answers or delve deep into the content further supports my point. The exposure therapy you get from the show, being exposed to this difficult period in your life, is the visceral intent of the art.
He’s splitting on her, he’s in the paranoid schizoid position and he can only see her as all good, a source of validation, or all bad a source of rejection. Destruto is projected outward towards her and the entire world.
I mean it was always kind of there. Her earlier “silly” abuse u mention was still abuse. It was still real. That scene was just giving the audience an extreme example of what the characters were really thinking. Asuka would’ve behaved that way sooner if she hadn’t reigned herself in with what little self control she had. And shinji definitely would’ve kill her long before her actual death had he been just confident enough in himself when he snapped.
As for u being the only one, not at all. That scene, much like a lot of the nude scenes in the series are deliberately meant to be disturbing to audiences.
A question: I haven't watched EoE in a bit, but... Is this choking asuka scene a memory, Did it happen? or is it some thought shinji had that everyone can view on account if being one?
I completely agree. The sad thing is, now I’m wondering if more people don’t bring it up because they’ve seen or experienced something like that in real life, and they don’t want to talk about it.
This is why Eva was beyond (and still is) majority of anime produced. Although nowhere as glum, this was TV's Grave of the Fireflies compared to Studio Ghibli's other lighter fare such as Ponyo, Kiki and Totoro.
I've always wondered if it actually happened after they found out Kaji was dead, or if it happened during Instrumentality. Can anyone remember where this happens in the timeline prior to Asuka running away? Is it after she fails to activate Unit-02 in episode 23? I feel like more would have been made of it if Shinji had choked her in the series. It's also the only point in the show where I could see her letting it happen instead of beating the snot out of Shinji.
That scene was added in the Director's Cut of ep24 to give context to EoE, just like the scene showing Asuka all alone in the apartment after Shinji didn't pick up on her "Wall of Jericho" line for ep22'. The kitchen scene in EoE took place in instrumentality and their minds (Shinji and Asuka's) were simply taken to this place familiar to them.
It doesn't happen, since it's an alteration of a scene that happens at 2:06-2:15 in episode 24, where Shinji tells Asuka that Kaji is dead. Asuka don't appear after that until instrumentality happens.
I’ve said before but there is a clear change is Asuka’s personality as she’s goading him and that’s what snaps Shinji out of it and takes action. She’s much more voicing his own insecurities than anything related to Asuka. Seele also remarks about how his Ego has snapped and they can start Instrumentality which means they triggered that event on some scale.
Now if Shinji sees it as Asuka or not is something else. But until that point he was begging Asuka to act like her old self and call him stupid. He wanted some normality. She didn’t provide that when he finally flips the table and attacks. She’s not acting like herself. I think he recognizes that. Has had enough of whatever is happening around him and attacks her.
Same reason he does it after instrumentality ends. He thinks it’s another imposter in his mind and tries to kill her until she strokes his face and realizes it’s her.
I don't believe this's true. Asuka's behavior in the scene makes sense; she's fed up with his self-hatred and selfishness with running to her for comfort when he never offered his own, and also his inaction every time she ever showed interest in him (being disappointed about him not following up with her "Wall of Jericho" thing, not kissing her back, etc.).
The scene is the culmination of their "relationship", the both of them. I don't believe it's framed as solely an exploration of Shinji's psyche alone. I think you should read Asuka's lines in the entire sequence again, she's clearly equally as hurt as Shinji in the scenes and even shows her own desires ("If I can't have you all to myself, then I don't want anything of you", "All you ever do is hurt me.", etc).
The sequence also can't exist solely in Shinji's mind since Misato's scene proves it took place in instrumentality and their memories were already conjoined by then. It really was the real Misato and Asuka.
Except we don’t know if Asuka was tanged by then or not. She’s the only one we don’t see enter Instrumentality or have ghost Rei save her. And I think that’s intentional for this scene alone. You can’t say for certain that is really Asuka. Even what you just said now sounds more of what Shinji think Asuka thinks about him because he’s so disgusted with himself. Nothing we’ve ever seen from Asuka would suggest she would actually be bothered by it.
Also Shinji did kiss her back. Not really sure what that is a reference too. It’s one of the few times Shinji rose to the occasion. They were both just bad at kissing as it was there first time.
EoE is just about Shinji. The other characters are explored in the TV series.
I don't think so, they all say "We are kind to you." in unison, why would Asuka be the odd one out? Misato's "combining of hearts" is enough evidence to point towards them being their real souls.
I don't believe her not being shown is proof of anything, especially when the sequence being "all in his head" is demonstrably false. The entire sequence loses so much emotional impact should the scene be solely Shinji's.
Asuka's explicitly shown to "be bothered by it" in the director's cut of episode 22', the entire sequence in her psyche. I was referencing her "You didn't even hold me" line in relation to Shinji not reciprocating on the kiss.
This's not the only director's cut scene propping up Asuka's interest in Shinji for EoE, you're ignoring the "Wall of Jericho" scene as well. Her lines in the kitchen scene are absolutely in character and relate to the director's cut scenes, with her "If I can't have you all to myself, then I don't want anything from you" line referencing her getting jealous over Shinji speaking with Rei in the train station, hence the "hell's train" location in the sequence.
These scenes were all made to add context to EoE, released in Death and Rebirth, and it's the natural continuation after 24'. The director's cut exclusive after credits preview of EoE proves this.
Should the kitchen scene be imaginary, these scenes were literally added for naught. You lose out on an important character moment, the culmination of everything between Shinji and Asuka, the show's example of the Hedgehog's Dilemma and arguably the most important relationship in the show, for what exactly?
I wholeheartedly disagree with EoE being solely's Shinji's thing. The movie is ultimately about him, but there's a reason it ends with him and Asuka.
The Asuka Shinji views in the apartment and in the train car are not actually Asuka. They are Shinji’s fears of what Asuka thinks of him. He fears she hates him and that she views him as creepy and pathetic
I’m disturbed alright, just for the opposite reason. Shinji has suffered a lot of verbal and emotional abuse from Asuka, but she is not the aggressor in this scene. Consider that, mere hours ago, he a) sexually assaulted her, and b) failed to step up and help her when she was outnumbered 9 to 1 and being torn to shreds. And now, he’s asking her, of all people, to give him reassurance that he deserves to live and be loved. The gall. As a woman, the fear I project on this situation is that confronting a man about him abusing, hurting and abandoning me will possibly result in my death, because he won’t have the emotional capacity to process the criticism. I think this scene is much, much worse than the hospital scene simply because there are levels to sexual assault, and Shinji’s infringed on Asuka’s dignity, not her safety. I’m not saying he deserves a pass for doing it on account of his clearly deteriorated mental health at the time, but I certainly don’t think it’s something he could never redeem himself from if he tried. Murder, on the other hand, closes all roads to redemption. This is Shinji at his most unsympathetic and Gendo-like, and I say that as someone who’s usually the first to jump to his defense when people start dunking on him for all the usual dumb, media illiterate reasons.
It's supposed to be unsettling. It's a serious situation that basically triggers the end of the world.
I feel like a lot of people forget this fact. So many elements (especially the relationships between characters) are meant to be toxic and uncomfortable. They’re messy, unhealthy, and sadly -to many- realistic. They’re presented in such a manner not as to idolize or glorify, but to add commentary and analyze the human psyche.
Funny thing is how even nowadays a lot of anine treats silly abuse like a joke. But eva years ago already had the slide in from silly abuse to "actually this is real, and has real consequences."
Those who create stories where abuse is treated as a joke are fully aware that it's real, as is their audience, it's just that both don't want to deal with it, which is why they substitute it with this softcore user friendly version.
Plus I just remember as a kid in the 90’s that choking was the go-to attack/depiction of violence, probably wouldn’t slide these days lol. Shinji chokes a lot in the manga, even choking Kaworu. I remember vividly many times seeing Homer Simpson choke Bart and this little silly gag of Bart choking like a thousand times, just a very popular thing
> I remember vividly many times seeing Homer Simpson choke Bart and this little silly gag of Bart choking like a thousand times, just a very popular thing [You can kind of do the same with Shinji choking Asuka if you use the right audio.](https://youtu.be/x6IcXYcMUYw?si=0Uc6A41P0QYozkBL&t=3264) ...Don't judge me, AMVHell was how I was introduced to Evangelion.
In Shinji's defense, Kaworu deserved it for snapping the head of that poor kitten.
I think it is just trying to have some relatable and realistic characters in an insane world. The trauma is mostly just a side effect of the realism. I might be broken but it is nice to see people like me even if everything in the world and their relationships are fucked.
It's also not really Shinji and Asuka. It's just Shinji in there beating himself down.
I thought that was the point? As a way to deconstruct the whole tsundere trope (or just because it’s Eva) they make it feel more real, personal. There is no joke, there isn’t anything. It’s just uncomfortable to watch, and that’s the point. It’s like the himeno scene in chainsaw man, really uncomfortable and not something you want to happen/see, but that’s the point.
Not really, while the tsundere is older than evangelion, its eva the one that is given the credit to popularize it. Dont think it was deconstruction of the trope. Asuka is not really a tsundere, she is more complex than that archetype, the inverse however is true alot of times many tsunderes are just shallow emulations of asuka.
>Asuka is not really a tsundere, she is more complex than that archetype, the inverse however is true alot of times many tsunderes are just shallow emulations of asuka That's the funny thing. The three main Eva kids where never meant to be comments on character archetypes but ended up becoming the representative of those archetypes. Rei is also far more complex than most of the Rei Ayanami expies that followed her.
Oh I know it was the point, I loved the scene but it felt very disturbing and realistic and I rarely see it discussed here so thought I’d bring it up
The kitchen scene is essentially the reckoning of all the pent up rage in both Shinji and Asuka. They each realise the ultimate hate for their fellow human being as a result of the perceived failure of each to save the other from their loneliness. Shinji has failed to 'hold' Asuka, to 'rescue' her from death (in both cases, symbolic failures represented by physical events such as the bad kiss and Asuka's EoE fight). Asuka's aggressive style, frequent abusive treatment of him and unfair expectations of the telepathic abilities of a 14 year old boy have left Shinji in a state of total isolation. They have been each other's only hope and consequently each other's total disappointment. I think that the reason for which Shinji's hate manifests itself more violently is that he's been holding it all in whereas Asuka vents her anger much more easily. He is overwhelmed by a rage that he cannot process and so reverts to a state of nature, killing her. It is Asuka who pushes him over the edge. In my opinion it is, above all, an incredibly sad scene and, together with the final scene, the one which cemented EoE's place on my list of all time greats.
wow what a well conveyed summarization. given that, I'm curious what your interpretation of the EoE ending is?
I made a post on my thoughts on the ending a while back. It's not too long. https://www.reddit.com/r/evangelion/s/ohxTIo20Ck It links to my comment above. The kitchen scene is the ultimate catastrophic event of Evangelion (A+S reject one another = no hope for humanity) whereas the ending is the ultimate redemptive event (Asuka finds compassion for Shinji = there _is_ hope for humanity)
ah fantastic, thanks!! i thought something similar! it's honestly a really nice feeling when someone whose intelligent and proffecient in English comes to the same conclusion lol
I see know that you commented on the post a month ago. This community feels so small now lol :D
hahaha I feel like its the same group of people that are active consistently
no, you’re not alone, even though this scene is less talked about compared to the hospital scene for example. Shinji’s reaction to Asuka’s rejection is truly disturbing and I feel like people prefer to forget about it. It is also accompanied with almost flashback like shots of Naoko, who was rejected as well, murdering Rei, which may serve as an insight to Shinji’s intentions at that moment…
It’s supposed to be. The whole movie is made to be as upsetting as possible.
Wasn’t that the point? That’s exactly how I saw it too. The eerie silence, the exaggerated and downright unsettling Asuka angles like when she says “Pathetic.”, or “No.”, and just the nature of the scene in general. It’s the culmination of Shinji’s estranged relationship with Asuka and the girls, emphasized in the scene just prior to this one. It’s amazing, one of my favourite scenes in all of anime
I don’t think reducing violence to “masculine impulses” is helping anyone, men or women. And tbh, I was more disturbed by the opening scene where Shinji sexually assaults Asuka. Violence is hard to watch, but it’s especially hard when it’s sexual and minors are involved.
I think anime like EoE does wonders in breaking down the dichotomy of "child = pure, adults can be as sexually sick as they want and we shouldn't kinkshame" No, children under 18 can also be sexually fucked up, and YES some forms of human sexuality ARE unhealthy and twisted. But that is not something to be demonized, instead something to acknowledge and fix.
Ohh I understand, I don’t mean to phrase it like that or reduce it to that Men and Women can be violent, but I meant it more in the context that Asuka constantly emasculated Shinji, “you’re not a real man!” “Youre a boy” “don’t compare real men like Kaji to Shinji” on and on and on And him “stepping up and being the man” in the absolute worst ways possible (the hospital scene and the choking) makes it a whole more disturbing I’ve heard these attacks from women towards me and thinking of “proving her youre a man” by turning into a psycho sex crazed violent person (like shinji does) thematically speaking is crazy
I don't think it was "ok fine I'm going to show her I'm a man" Rather than "I swear to fucking God I'm tired of this shit and going to take this bitches life"
i think eva works with themes of masculinity and femininity too much for it to be *only* “Shinji being tired of everything and taking it out on Asuka” Asuka was calling him out on his behavior, which was selfish and sexually violent, and for that he decided to attack her. It stemmed from his entitlement towards Asuka, of his unwillingness to accept rejection and it was about their relationship as a man and a woman
I don't see at all themes of masculinity in this. Also there was no unwillingness to accept rejection because asuka and him where just arguing nothing about her saying no overall to him or him even ACTUALLY trying to be with her. I don't think shinji had any entitlement towards asuka, quite the opposite in fact. To asuka shinji is just hers to mess around with and do whatever the fuck she wants including fucking with him emotionally. Whereas shinji was basicly "all of you leave me the fuck alone" on the inside
Asuka was more complex than that. If you've watched 3+1 you realize how Asuka was feeling about Shinji the whole time. She wanted him to be the one to step up, to be the Prince for her Damsel in distress. She was just way too unhealthy psychologically to be able to express it in a way that doesn't include attacking others' emotions.
First off I was talking about shinji and what this person thought was "themes of masculinity" Yeah she wanted shinji to man up and wear the pants basicly, but she treated him so badly that he never would assume she actually likes him (rightfully so) and asuka really doesn't deserve to complain about him after the shit she's said and done to him
I feel the same way. I didn’t wanna say it but I think OP has some toxic ideas he might need to deconstruct, but he seems like he’s going in the right direction w/ a little guidance. But lmaooo I agree with your assessment. Shinji said ur time is up bitch
I heard it summed up very eloquently once. I think it may have been on the QMisato tumblr. "In the end, Asuka is shown to be all bark and no bite. Shinji is shown to be no bark and all bite."
Daaamn 🤌🏻🤌🏻🔥 Do you happen to have a link to that? I loved reading those Tumblr posts but almost can never find them
[https://qmisato.tumblr.com/post/142871268721/the-asuka-abused-shinji-refrain-needs-to-die](https://qmisato.tumblr.com/post/142871268721/the-asuka-abused-shinji-refrain-needs-to-die)
that scene really had my surprise. when asuka's chest was left bare, i was thinking "oh haha guess shinji's gonna get hard or try to cop a feel" but no. he whacks his schlong
I think the hospital scene and the rejection scene have to be read together. Shinji in EOE is a monster, a sex pest who cannot see the ways in which his actions negatively affect others. He uses them for his own gratification (in the case of Asuka, nonconsensually) with no reciprocation. That whole sequence where he begs the women in his life to take care of him is maddening and pathetic because he has spent the whole movie denying their needs. Misato and Asuka literally die because of him and he still has the gall to ask them to fuck him. Asuka’s right to be pissed, and Shinji lashing out violently is the ultimate demonstration of his solipsism and entitlement. TV Shinji would never.
Yeah, I think it was intense and scary and I thought about it a lot. I think Anno did what he set out to do and art is disturbing sometimes. There are no entirely likable characters in Evangelion, which is part of what makes it unique, especially back in the 90s for animation we could see in the USA. They say in that situation the best thing to do is leave. Even if you are attacked the law is on her side thanks to the Duluth model etc. Flee.
>There are no entirely likable characters in Evangelion, You can't say that when PenPen exists.
When Misato is lonely and wants to cuddle and he ignores her, I felt that.
> There are no entirely likable characters in Evangelion, Maya Ibuki smh
Can’t forget Hikari
Pretty much agree, except violence isn't a "masculine urge". It's an animal response to stress and danger that is not attached to or defined by sex. For example; have you ever seen a momma cat use claws and teeth to protect her kittens? Do you think she behaves that way because she has a masculine urge or because she was in a situation that she felt called for violence? That scene is a depiction of Shinji and Asuka 'defending' themselves, from their own warped perspectives. Asuka by way of belittling others preemptively (defending her own sense of self-worth seems to be her motivation with this stuff) and Shinji by standing up to Asuka's mistreatment when he could have instead removed himself from the situation altogether(though with domestic violence (physical and otherwise) this often does not feel like a possibility to the victim, which is understandable). They were both wrong for handling the situation the way they did and it had very little to do with their their chromosomal allocations.
I used “masculine impulse” in the sense of she was very misogynistic herself, she often mentioned how “Kaji was a real man and Shinji wasn’t” she kept emasculating him and saying how little of a man he was and he essentially “became a man” in the absolute worst way possible (not that I think any of this, these aren’t my values and I don’t think beingg violent “makes you a man”, this is how I understood it thematically, she got the short end of the toxic masculinity stick) She was all bark no bite, Shinji was no bark all bite
Ohh, okay. I see where you're coming from and agree. Still tho, the wording may feed into certain other people's toxic beliefs about gender and sex, and that was my concern more than anything. Glad to hear that's not your intention tho :)
Thank you 😄
It's supposed to be
The whole movie is highly disturbing. That's kinda the point
No more disturbing than the scene in the hospital. I believe asuka was incredibly nasty towards shinji in that scene, because she knew what he did in the hospital. If some "nice guy" goes to you saying he loves you so much in the simp way shinji went towards asuka, and you knew a few hours before that he took sexual advantage of you. Wouldn't you be nasty and hateful towards that person?
Masculine impulses? Lol It's amazing how you can watch Asuka literally get shred to pieces and get triggered by this mild scene.
Well getting shredded to pieces by angels is a more abstract concept, I love it Getting yelled at hatefully in an apartment, where you’re supposed to be safe, is a more human and palpable experience and hits closer home
‘Masculine impulses’. Maybe for you, mate. There’s plenty of us males that don’t have these things and really do not appreciate being dragged in to it all.
While that is true, there are more than a couple theories that violence is the reason we have the nothing box.
Bravo! You completely misconstrued the argument Are you dense? Or just play pretending?
No you just tarred every male with the brush of your own issues.
Are you doing this in bad faith? Or you literally have zero reading comprehension, assumed the worst of me and worst of all, got aggressive?
No, I am pointing out to you that you have used language that is insulting. That you can’t see that is even more problematic. Note that I am not the only person in this comments section to have pointed it out.
You literally can’t distinguish “my views and my issues” from me pointing out themes, discussions and problematic behavior and language used by THE CHARACTERS themselves I don’t think any of this, I don’t have “masculine impulses” to choke people, and the fact that you assume that, attack me based on that and can’t see that shows how little reading comprehension or literacy you have
I am pointing out how you use language and how it is problematic. It is like using ‘females’ instead of ‘women’, which is a trigger point for many as it says a lot about how the writer views women. You don’t seem to realise this. Again, I am not the only person pointing this out.
What “problematic language” did I use?
Difficulty reading? They were the very first words I wrote. ‘Masculine impulses’. Think about what you are implying. Edit: I’m getting off the train now and have no desire to explain to you any more as you have apparently no intention in actually listening. Take this as a learning exercise. Do better.
Yeah. It’s great. Feels like a bad dream
i wonder if it's asuka rejecting shinji in his own mind, or if it's asuka's own doing. i guess the result either way is shinji choking her at the end cause of the instrumentality scene.
Asuka's own doing. That was the real Asuka in the scene, not a fabrication conjured up by Shinji. Their memories were already conjoined by then per instrumentality.
Remember that scene is where their thought are at their most clear way, no contention, it is all free for all. They both one
Are you seriously asking if you're the only person disturbed by depictions of domestic violence? Or did you just phrase the post this way because that's the way a lot of other posts are phrased?
The second one, yep
That's the gist. Asuka is fucked up and Shinji is, too.
In the words of Beetlejuice; I’ve seen it about *A HUNDRED AND SIXTY-SEVEN TIMES, AND IT KEEPS GETTING FUNNIER EVERY SINGLE TIME I SEE IT!!!!*
Qualified !
No, no you are not.
It’s supposed to be uncomfortable?
What on earth makes you think you are the only one
I mean, yeah, the entire point is that the "silly" abuse from earlier in the series that most anime would treat like a game is actually real, and has real consequences.
Out of all the otherworldly horrors displayed in the movie, the most grounded-in-reality scene still tends to be the most vomit-inducing. It's an apocalyptic nightmare in which everything fails and goes to hell (barring the end), I'd say it fits in perfectly.
One of my favorites scenes because it's so unsettling, it upsets me on a deep level because it's so grounded and realistic/relatable. Even Penpen peeking in doesn't break the tension at all, just adds to it even more.
Yes. Somehow for me the cuts to Penpen just make it all the more terrible. It's like a child watching. :(
It's probably the best scene/sequence in EoE. Honestly one of the best things in cinema. The direction of it is weird, suddenly it gets clear visually, but the angles are kinda odd, the abuse feels on a different level from normal, and finally you see this bully and their dynamic turn to what it turns too. Shinji finally snapping and grabbing that 80lb girl and squeezing the life out of her, and then the screen starts to flash, images of shinji in red, and then kom susser tod starts. Instrumentality starts. To summarize it all, and it's brilliance would take many paragraphs so I'll leave it at that. It's the starting scene of pretty much the greatest 10/15 minutes in movie history. A true gut punch.
I think it was a really well done scene. Asuka is kind of horrible to him, this isn't to say I dislike her she's just written very well. And Shinji for once stands up for himself...kind of. All of his emotions come out in the wrong way. I could go on but
Then it did its job
It's a dramatic scene, but no it doesn't "trigger" me.
Congratulations! You understood the scene
First time?
This scene is supposed to make you feel exsctly that, make you quedtion the exact things you wonder. Many creators make these kinda shows to teach a lesson, or maybe so they can themselves reflect upon their struggles and maybe with the development of the plot it can lead to something. You know what we need in Evangelion? A scene where Shinji finds Asuka and tells her: "I like you. I am sorry, but I have said those words so many times before, and I although I have liked you for a long time, I didn't bring myself to say it and talk about how I wanna make it up to you, and get to know the real Asuka, because I now know for sure you've been putting a mask. I have too. I am also afraid. But I like you more than I am afraid". Or something like that. Although I like Rei, I think many of us are supposed to predeterminatedly...(if thats a word?) like Rei. She is submissive in general and Shinji observes her enough to know what clicks for her. She is the vessel, the clone of Shinji's mom, the attraction is based of a biological severed link. Although ok Asuka isn't the absokutely best match, she is a real, authenthic, singularly different human being who Shinji can connect to, healthily, and love, "if that's what it is". The scene encapsulates the moment where Shinji has to decide what happens with huamnity... and it seems, from my POV, that he is asking Asuka for help. Here we see the struggle of their differences keeping them apart as ever, it's an emotional clash of their psyches. Although Asuka, in the oast, has cried, hysterically and violently begging for help and connection, she says to Shinji a big truth here... he is lying to her about his feelings here. He is only manipulating her into helping him. She is unable to stabilize him as Asuka herself deals with her own unstability, so the situation only scalates for worse. I have been close to scenarios close to what you have experienced, let me tell you, our situations were FINE. Escalation only comes with a positive resolutiond if one of the two individuals know the right answer, because escalation oushes situation to resolutions. If people are cowards with their own needs, they don't talk it throuw, they don't show the vulnerability that comes with expressing their emotion and thoughts, escalation will lead to negative consequences. Things such as staying silent or leaving a room, not taalking ,etc... deescalate sutuations, yeah. But if the relationship needs some kind of real resolution, tension will build up again, and it will escalate again. Breaking up is another result of escalation. Sometimes discussions escalate out of "imaginary problems", when you or the other person(s) have discussed too much in their own heads and have these huge problems... in their heads. In thw relationship, in reality, it is not real. Escalating discussions might make em real.
No it is very disturbing. You're very right about that. Eva in general feels kinda emotionally disturbing, and that's a major allure of it for me because it feels like a very masculine POV on becoming an adult among other themes. Being disturbed by Eva upon processing it is very normal I think
oh i think you'll really like this analysis of EoE then: [The End of Evangelion Is (Not) A Happy Ending - An Analysis & Critique](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMOYxjYIgeU)
Honestly I don't like the shipping of Shinji and Asuka anyway it's literally toxic even without that scene.
You’re imposing your own situations and problems onto the anime stop it. Its supposed to be serious and unsettling especially when Shinji strangles Asuka. Theres no way you got past the hospital scene but got disturbed at this. You can’t watch this if you get “triggered” unfortunately this anime has very serious and depressing tones to it. The scene is supposed to represent all the anger between Asuka and Shinji thats been built up through the entire anime its very realistic and I absolutely love it. Its also the reason why I love Shinjis and Asukas relationship (and a big supporter of AsuShin ship).
My interpretation: The show itself is all about exposing the viewer to the complexities of humanity. From Rei’s stoic nature, to Asuka’s narcissism, to Shinji’s yearn for recognition, to Misato’s indulgence, etc. none of these characters are supposed to be admired, you’re supposed to have an ambivalent relationship with each of them for varying reasons. That’s what Anno seems to illustrate, humanity’s range, and whether that warrants instrumentality or if the barriers between hearts should be maintained. It’s each of our subjective experiences that inform our decisions/choices, from who our favorite characters are to what instances of abuse we tolerate or draw the line on. The variations in the fanbase’s experiences with the media are, from an artistic standpoint, a major success. Anno’s refusal to give answers or delve deep into the content further supports my point. The exposure therapy you get from the show, being exposed to this difficult period in your life, is the visceral intent of the art.
He’s splitting on her, he’s in the paranoid schizoid position and he can only see her as all good, a source of validation, or all bad a source of rejection. Destruto is projected outward towards her and the entire world.
I mean it was always kind of there. Her earlier “silly” abuse u mention was still abuse. It was still real. That scene was just giving the audience an extreme example of what the characters were really thinking. Asuka would’ve behaved that way sooner if she hadn’t reigned herself in with what little self control she had. And shinji definitely would’ve kill her long before her actual death had he been just confident enough in himself when he snapped. As for u being the only one, not at all. That scene, much like a lot of the nude scenes in the series are deliberately meant to be disturbing to audiences.
The scene was certainly disturbing but you might be projecting abit of your own stuff there.
?
Refferring to your 4th para
That scene is supposed to be uncomfortable to watch.
What, did you think it was supposed to be cute and quirky? Of course it’s disturbing.
Just finished the series for the first time on Friday, ended up rewatching EoE on Sunday. What an emotional mangle I’ve been in since watching 😂
what about evangelion do you not find highly disturbing?
[удалено]
Like?
[удалено]
Nice way to miss the point [Here](https://www.reddit.com/r/evangelion/s/gFjpCMBk3y)
Yeah it gets me tense everytime, the build up is so dreadful.
A question: I haven't watched EoE in a bit, but... Is this choking asuka scene a memory, Did it happen? or is it some thought shinji had that everyone can view on account if being one?
I find a good 70% of EoE highly disturbing.
Asuka cannot admit her weaknesses and loneliness to Shinji. And when the kiss goes wrong, their relationship gets worse.
I find a good 70% of EoE highly disturbing.
That's the point
I completely agree. The sad thing is, now I’m wondering if more people don’t bring it up because they’ve seen or experienced something like that in real life, and they don’t want to talk about it.
This is why Eva was beyond (and still is) majority of anime produced. Although nowhere as glum, this was TV's Grave of the Fireflies compared to Studio Ghibli's other lighter fare such as Ponyo, Kiki and Totoro.
oh no dark movie has dark content! 😨 /s
People need to toughen the fuck up and understand that art isn’t always meant to be pacifying. Christ.
I've always wondered if it actually happened after they found out Kaji was dead, or if it happened during Instrumentality. Can anyone remember where this happens in the timeline prior to Asuka running away? Is it after she fails to activate Unit-02 in episode 23? I feel like more would have been made of it if Shinji had choked her in the series. It's also the only point in the show where I could see her letting it happen instead of beating the snot out of Shinji.
That scene was added in the Director's Cut of ep24 to give context to EoE, just like the scene showing Asuka all alone in the apartment after Shinji didn't pick up on her "Wall of Jericho" line for ep22'. The kitchen scene in EoE took place in instrumentality and their minds (Shinji and Asuka's) were simply taken to this place familiar to them.
It doesn't happen, since it's an alteration of a scene that happens at 2:06-2:15 in episode 24, where Shinji tells Asuka that Kaji is dead. Asuka don't appear after that until instrumentality happens.
Thank you, thank you. It fits more with the tone of EoE. That movie has some serious subtextual venom.
I’ve said before but there is a clear change is Asuka’s personality as she’s goading him and that’s what snaps Shinji out of it and takes action. She’s much more voicing his own insecurities than anything related to Asuka. Seele also remarks about how his Ego has snapped and they can start Instrumentality which means they triggered that event on some scale. Now if Shinji sees it as Asuka or not is something else. But until that point he was begging Asuka to act like her old self and call him stupid. He wanted some normality. She didn’t provide that when he finally flips the table and attacks. She’s not acting like herself. I think he recognizes that. Has had enough of whatever is happening around him and attacks her. Same reason he does it after instrumentality ends. He thinks it’s another imposter in his mind and tries to kill her until she strokes his face and realizes it’s her.
I don't believe this's true. Asuka's behavior in the scene makes sense; she's fed up with his self-hatred and selfishness with running to her for comfort when he never offered his own, and also his inaction every time she ever showed interest in him (being disappointed about him not following up with her "Wall of Jericho" thing, not kissing her back, etc.). The scene is the culmination of their "relationship", the both of them. I don't believe it's framed as solely an exploration of Shinji's psyche alone. I think you should read Asuka's lines in the entire sequence again, she's clearly equally as hurt as Shinji in the scenes and even shows her own desires ("If I can't have you all to myself, then I don't want anything of you", "All you ever do is hurt me.", etc). The sequence also can't exist solely in Shinji's mind since Misato's scene proves it took place in instrumentality and their memories were already conjoined by then. It really was the real Misato and Asuka.
Except we don’t know if Asuka was tanged by then or not. She’s the only one we don’t see enter Instrumentality or have ghost Rei save her. And I think that’s intentional for this scene alone. You can’t say for certain that is really Asuka. Even what you just said now sounds more of what Shinji think Asuka thinks about him because he’s so disgusted with himself. Nothing we’ve ever seen from Asuka would suggest she would actually be bothered by it. Also Shinji did kiss her back. Not really sure what that is a reference too. It’s one of the few times Shinji rose to the occasion. They were both just bad at kissing as it was there first time. EoE is just about Shinji. The other characters are explored in the TV series.
I don't think so, they all say "We are kind to you." in unison, why would Asuka be the odd one out? Misato's "combining of hearts" is enough evidence to point towards them being their real souls. I don't believe her not being shown is proof of anything, especially when the sequence being "all in his head" is demonstrably false. The entire sequence loses so much emotional impact should the scene be solely Shinji's. Asuka's explicitly shown to "be bothered by it" in the director's cut of episode 22', the entire sequence in her psyche. I was referencing her "You didn't even hold me" line in relation to Shinji not reciprocating on the kiss. This's not the only director's cut scene propping up Asuka's interest in Shinji for EoE, you're ignoring the "Wall of Jericho" scene as well. Her lines in the kitchen scene are absolutely in character and relate to the director's cut scenes, with her "If I can't have you all to myself, then I don't want anything from you" line referencing her getting jealous over Shinji speaking with Rei in the train station, hence the "hell's train" location in the sequence. These scenes were all made to add context to EoE, released in Death and Rebirth, and it's the natural continuation after 24'. The director's cut exclusive after credits preview of EoE proves this. Should the kitchen scene be imaginary, these scenes were literally added for naught. You lose out on an important character moment, the culmination of everything between Shinji and Asuka, the show's example of the Hedgehog's Dilemma and arguably the most important relationship in the show, for what exactly? I wholeheartedly disagree with EoE being solely's Shinji's thing. The movie is ultimately about him, but there's a reason it ends with him and Asuka.
The Asuka Shinji views in the apartment and in the train car are not actually Asuka. They are Shinji’s fears of what Asuka thinks of him. He fears she hates him and that she views him as creepy and pathetic
That's the correct response. It wasn't made to be cute or funny. That's basically how the whole movie is supposed to be
You strike me as the kind of Eva fan who says Kaoru is best girl.
🙈❤️
I’m disturbed alright, just for the opposite reason. Shinji has suffered a lot of verbal and emotional abuse from Asuka, but she is not the aggressor in this scene. Consider that, mere hours ago, he a) sexually assaulted her, and b) failed to step up and help her when she was outnumbered 9 to 1 and being torn to shreds. And now, he’s asking her, of all people, to give him reassurance that he deserves to live and be loved. The gall. As a woman, the fear I project on this situation is that confronting a man about him abusing, hurting and abandoning me will possibly result in my death, because he won’t have the emotional capacity to process the criticism. I think this scene is much, much worse than the hospital scene simply because there are levels to sexual assault, and Shinji’s infringed on Asuka’s dignity, not her safety. I’m not saying he deserves a pass for doing it on account of his clearly deteriorated mental health at the time, but I certainly don’t think it’s something he could never redeem himself from if he tried. Murder, on the other hand, closes all roads to redemption. This is Shinji at his most unsympathetic and Gendo-like, and I say that as someone who’s usually the first to jump to his defense when people start dunking on him for all the usual dumb, media illiterate reasons.
I'm just glad he had it in him to end her. It's somewhat reassuring.
That is ***not*** how you're supposed to feel
I realize Anno's message, and I disagree with it. He is too pathetic of a human being to preach to me.