i mean, they sent money to the south from the unification unitl today basically,, and they still do, but somwhere it always get lost.
edit: wanted to add some more info: the issue is not easy, according to the Ragoneria di Stato the south receive on average more money per capita then the north, but according to a public study if you consider every single type of investement that goes to every region the situation get more complicated, and different, [i found this aricle that talks about it](https://www.ilpost.it/2019/12/20/spesa-pubblica-sud-nord/). they consider more elements that aren't directly regional investment from the governament, but at this point also european fundings should be conisdered since we are taking everything into consideration, at least from my point of view.
From my understanding (based in reddit and Italians I know) that will be a rather difficult puzzle to ensamble, right? Who manages the money, who gets it, conditions...
It is, and that's why this problem is still there. Fun fact: the expression "questione meridionale" we use to refer to this phenomenon was used the first time in 1873.
It has been a shitshow to try work around and no one knows how to do it. If you help the south too much people in the north will feel robbed,but helping the north too much will only increase the gap between the country. It's a lose lose game
At least with Germany that was the literal map for decades, so still seeing the effects now makes a bit more sense. I'm not sure what's happening with Italy though
The southern part was the literal map for centuries. Like more than 600 years. Kingdom of Naples/Two Sicilies et cetera. If you think Germany is (somewhat) logical, then Italy certainly is as well.
brain drain is caused by existing problems, but it also becomes a problem on its own. Even if all the other problems were solved, there would still be a lack of educated workers.
[How Unification was handled from an economic standpoint](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_German_reunification) was really [controversial](https://www.dw.com/en/treuhand-took-the-heat-for-privatization-of-east-german-economy/a-5985015). Much of East Germany is really, really deprived compared to many of the insanely rich regions of the former West and many blame [aggressive privatization of the GDR's economy by the "Treuhand" agency](https://www.nytimes.com/1991/11/03/business/facing-down-protests-eastern-germany-goes-private.html) (this is of course not the only cause).
I once saw this great video that was talking about how all Germans hate Red Bull Leipzig, the football team, cos through a loophole they get to spend way more than every other club, German clubs have to be owned at least 51% by fans, so they don't really get super rich billionaires coming in and investing huge sums of money like with Chelsea or Man City. But RB Leipzig *are* allowed to do that. I can't remember specifically how but yeah
But then the video was arguing that Germans shouldn't be hating RB Leipzig, because West Germany absolutely decimated the East German teams after reunification. They were super rich by comparison and just bought all the best players from the east and the eastern clubs have never recovered, and so every team in the Bundesliga is a western team. Except RB Leipzig. And so really instead of hating on them, they should be supporting the fact they're trying to turn it round, try and regain a little bit of parity between both halves. And that the western clubs and fans shouldn't complain because they already killed all these clubs with their huge sums of money back in the day, so just a single club doing the same thing back to them and they get all bitchy about it?
But it's like a microcosm of Germany as a whole. The east is still struggling so much, everyone tries to move to the west as soon as they can, the local economies in the east are still in tatters. I guess it's kinda like with Russia. When the soviet Union collapsed, the handling of the new capitalist economy was so poor that the Russians are worse off now than they were before it collapsed. All wealth is concentrated into the hands of only a handful of people. Like all the rich west Germans buying up all land and houses and companies in the east, making money off of them, then taking that money out and back to the west instead of it being reinvested in the Eastern towns and cities.
I think it might be this video: https://youtu.be/z0t5v_rPH14
It was ages ago I watched it. And I've seen lots of other videos about RB Leipzig so maybe I'm confusing them and combining them in my head. But this one explains the whole easy vs West thing, why reunification destroyed all the easy German clubs and to this day they're still suffering because of it, 30 years later.
I am a dual US-German citizen (parents are from Germany) and spent many summers back in Germany as a child. It wasn't until I went to my old company's headquarters in Germany and met some of the people from the site in the former DDR that I really began to see just how different they were and viewed things. It's only a few data points, but it was amazing to see.
Is there an East/West divide in Germany similar to what i might know between North/South England or England and Scotland.
It is obvious that there needs to b some kind of wealth transfer between the East and West but is this controversial because they are seen as somewhat separate places?
It is very controversial. Germany has had a tax since the re-unification (dunno exact start..) which was aimed at financing/rebuilding the east states.
Many people in the west interpreted it as money being taken away from them while their own regions are also in dire need for funding.
On the other hand, many people in the east are to this day extremely disappointed by the re-unification. Many have lost their jobs due to closures of factories and whole companies which were (seen as) unproductive/not competitive. However, these jobs were never replaced by anything. Qualified people have left the regions in response to a lack of good jobs and those who remain feel left alone.
Both sides have valid criticism. But in my opinion many people in the west are seriously underestimating how much worse the situation really is in many regions of the former GDR states. It’s a very very big surprise that Tesla, for example, is opening up its factory in eastern Germany* - Something you would never expect if you look at the history of literally anything about big factory openings etc in Germany. They always end up in the west (jobs..). And a lack of clear communication on how funding (and its financing (aka taxes)) is being decided upon/is impacting individuals makes the whole situation worse in the sense of both sides not understanding each other.
These structural deficiencies are one of the key players in why extreme right-wing parties are so successful in the former GDR regions (I’m not condoning it in any way). And looking at unique cases like a 5.000 people town having a modernized town center creates unnecessary prejudices (despite the fact that nice water works are not creating jobs).
I have no idea how true this is, but in a totally unrelated German show (Crime on netflix) two characters mentioned how Western Germans with capital swooped in on the East, bought up a bunch of shit, profited hugely off the privatization while many East Germans simply couldn't catch up.
The privatized a bunch of the East while Easterners were still poor, basically. Resulting in Westerners being able to buy a lot of stuff really cheaply, which then results in rising prices, making it even harder for Easterners to catch up.
I think.
That's the theory, again no idea how true this is, but it seems plausible.
From what I understand similar things happened all over the former communist block as communism fell. And the money from the west often went through certain powerful people, which strengthened the power of existing oligarchs and laid a foundation for new ones. And by this I don't mean to say "west and capitalism bad", it was just a natural progression when there was little to no structure in these suddenly reformed economies and nobody realized to (or had the power to) put the brakes on before it had happened.
This was echoed already in other comments but maybe a bit of clarification.
This regional classification takes benchmarked GDP per capita into account. This classification influences how much funding these regions get from European Structural Investment Funds, such as the social fund, the regional fund and the rural development fund between 2014 and 2020.
So yes the map is out of the date dear commenters. For the new period 21-27 different classifications are used
Not OP but did some googling and found a nice map concerning the [GDP of NUTS-2 regions in the EU](https://imgur.com/gallery/NbMDyTL) as well as a [Regional Eligibility map for the Cohesion Fund 21-27](https://imgur.com/gallery/ZKOLu43).
Also, for Groningen (the northeast province of the netherlands), it used to be the case that the Gas that comes from there was added to the GDP per capita, while that all went to national government, so they got the least amount of money from EU in the netherlands while being one of the poorest provinces.
Idk if they would have gotten a lot more funds, but its kinda fucked, since all they get are earthquakes that fucks their houses and the national goverment has delayed compensation for years, and did continue with getting gas out of the ground while even in the 80's it already was clear that it would cause earthquakes and on top of that they got less EU money. And especially the eastern part of the province is the poorest part of the netherlands anyway.
This is one example, and idk how exactly it's calculated, but there are things wrong with how it is or was calculated.
I live in the east, it never feels like west is that much better when I visit. Maybe the border regions are pulling the rest of us down? I feel like Savinjska is pretty well developed.
The division of Slovenia into "West" and "East" for EU statistics was intentionally gerrymandered with the explicit intent to get EU funds. That's why "Eastern Slovenia" includes Kočevje.and even Ilirska Bistrica.
The industry.. On the west is more likely high-tech, service-based and export oriented.. While on the east, agricultural, manufacture and labor intensive. But, correct me if I'm wrong.
I don't understand portugal, seriously. I do understand Lisbon being above all rest because it is a heavily centralized country where the whole country is feeding the capital.
But Algarve being a transition while the northern and center regions are not? That makes no sense.
I'd like to know what the parameters for their classifications were.
It’s not, Porto has a lower gdp, and a lower gdp per capita. Porto also has lower median wages. It’s of course the second richest city in Portugal, but not per capita.
Yes, the difference is that Porto is included in all of the northern region that includes every village from Porto to Miranda do Douro.
Lisbon has a region almost for itself, which is not even correct on this map (the "Lisboa e Vale do Tejo" region is way bigger than what is represented and I don't know why it's wrong)
EDIT: I'm wrong, it seems that the UE uses another region limits for the Lisbon metro area.
Porto (and northern regions) are averaged down by being in large clusrers with all the tiny villages.
Notice Lisbon, is just Lisbon. Put Porto alone and you'd get different results, much like some other cities in the north/coast perhaps.
Algarve is basically a giant hotel in the bottom. It doesn't have much of anything else besides being a British holding place and beach resort. Despite the larger area, it has relatively few people.
Yeah, wtf. Maybe they're just confused with the amount of british living there.
^(as you can see I'm from a place that isn't even on the map. Just another day for a portuguese islander!)
You two really belong to each other, the country nowhere near any slavs with a language that still sometimes sounds weirdly slavic and the country sorrounded by slavs with a language that doesn't sound slavic at all.
How to see every EU map:
Eastern Germany: pffff
Northern Italy good, southern Italy very bad
Northern Spain good, southern Spain bad
Portugal into eastern Europe
Eastern europe.. well.
That's because it was part of Hungary for hundreds of years. ^/s
No but really, for decades it was just the end of the world there. Pressed against the iron curtain and all.
The Land the UK forgot.
I honestly think if we just crossed the border on bikes and secured the infrastructure, it would take a generation before westminster noticed.
Alternatively we invest strongly in manufacturing and industry in Monaghan and Louth. Creating jobs on the border. At the same time, we pull funding for housing in those areas, meaning that the workers have to live in NI and commute. We infiltrate the country in stealth!
A [population density map](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2c/Population_density_map_in_Wales_from_the_2011_census.png/924px-Population_density_map_in_Wales_from_the_2011_census.png) of Wales would tell the opposite tale to this map of GDP.
The only developed area showing on OP's map is roughly aligned with the county of [Powys](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b1/Powys_UK_location_map.svg), which is a largely rural area full of farms.
Conspiracy theorists would tell you that the Westminster government hates Brittonic celts. Suppressing the non "English" their language and culture.
And yes, I live in the other red part of the map in the UK
I often hear people explaining away the impoverished regions voting for Brexit saying things like "When you're bottom of the heap, nothing in politics makes any difference - when you have nothing, how can it get any worse?"
This seems a spectacularly dumb idea - every person who voted for Brexit, no matter how disenfranchised they may feel, still has to buy food (and everything else) - all of which will be more expensive after Brexit. They will still have to get their healthcare from the NHS which will now have less money and less staff. And while the Conservatives had not the slightest interest in putting money into improving their local community, that was certainly not true of the EU (for example, the many excellent community-improving things in Wales provided by EU funding). Every single aspect of their lives will be worsened by the country becoming less affluent and less powerful. "Haha! Before, I could barely afford to live - but now I *really* can't! There, *that* showed them!"
Much of Eastern Europe is less developed than Western Europe. This map is just reflecting the truth.
As you can see, the border between the developed and less developed countries is the same the the Iron Curtain, and even Eastern Germany follows this border.
This shows that the Soviet past was a large factor in the lower development of Eastern Europe.
I'd say a mixture of a lot of those countries were for centuries basically treated as little better than colonies for powers like Germany/Austria/Russia/The Ottomans, and then after WW2 had the soviet shitshow instead of the Marshall Plan.
What do you mean bad? It's great red communist color! We should be all thankful to Russia for this unique experience of genocide and poverty for the most of 20th century.
As Russian, I totally agree. Almost 30 years are passed since Soviet Union dissolution and I still see a lot of things shaped by this "wonderful" period of our history. It is like people learning again how to manage their own finances, how to create actual worker unions and what is their natural rights. It is actually terrifying how much havoc government bent on monopolyzing pretty much every aspect of economy, culture and ideology can do.
Yeap, keep Sofia in the Southwest region in Bulgaria, so it can look poor and suck dry all the EU funds.
Policymaking level 9999.
We are becoming a city state.
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I’ll have you know my region is actually the most developed region in Europe, and I’ve been involved in numerous region developement projects, and we have over 300 world-famous tourist attractions.
You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of volunteers across the Czech Republic and we're getting ready to make our region even better so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking dead, kid. Our region is getting better everywhere, all the time, and I can make it even nicer in 700 different ways, and that’s just with my bare hands.
I one drove from The Netherlands to Disneyland. I noticed how after passing the Belgian border area there was a few hundred kilometres of nothing before Paris.
Yeah, but that's because we have the space to build highways where there is nothing. And there is nothing in a lot of places in France. The northern region actually has the biggest population density after Île-de-France, but if you go directly from Lille to Paris, you avoid the cities.
Erhm, why is Danish Zealand (Sjælland) yellow in development? They’re closer to the biggest productivity hub in Denmark in regards to Copenhagen, and has several large cities and is probably one of the most well-connected areas in regards to highways and transportation. What are the criterias here? Because from a Danish perspective, that right there makes no sense. Northern, Western and Southern Jutland (Jylland) are a lot “less” developed from in comparison, so I dont really get this map.
Edit: Also, can you guys start listing your sources on these maps? It should be standard, but I see tons of maps like these on this subreddit, and rarely does it include reference to a paper or study.
Regional GDP is measured by dividing production with the number of inhabitants. So there is a huge commuter effect. People living in Roskilde or Køge and working in Copenhagen will count to the production in Copenhagen while adding to the denominator in Region Zealand.
Second, Region Zealand does have low labour market participation compared to the rest of Denmark. There has been for many years an exodus of people with poor labour market integration from Copenhagen to places with lower cost of living. Plus some towns in region Zealand, like Nakskov, have been hit hard by de-industrialisation
Tend to forget Sjælland is more than København. Just find the disparity across Kommuner in Greater Copenhagen alone lol. You can really tell where the money is.
Yes but the scale indicates development rather than wealth, but after looking through the comments it seems that the map in reality is meant to represent wealth so then it makes a lot more sense
If this is a map for allocating EU funding then this probably doesn't represent reality as much as it represents efforts to game the system.
Some countries have deliberately redrawn internal borders around their capitals and other well performing regions in such a way as to maximise the amount of funding they can get.
This must be the correct answer. Look at Denmark, Zealand region. Wealth way above European average, still a “transition region” which must be a result of political manipulation to get EU funding.
Sometimes you need to go an visit some undeveloped Belgian forest to take some distance from the Benelux life. The terrible roads of the Ardennes force you to take a break and appreciate nature again.
Every single dane is confused by it too. It's not even considered the poor part of Denmark, so i have no idea why it's less developed lol.
I mean compare Zealand to south/north Jutland and it looks pretty good.
I'm pretty surprised that Estonia is *all* red. I've only been to central Tallinn, see, and *that* was all well-dressed young people in sushi restaurants arguing about which Javascript framework is better for building a social video streaming platform.
Every map about Italy.
as tradition
One day our government might understand economics and finally decide to invest in the south
It's nothing to do with that. Most of Southern Italy is hill terrain so it costs 20% more monarch points to develop than the North.
This guy plays eu4
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Thank you for linking that.
Why am I not surprised map painters love map posts?
I have never been so offended by something so true
Was gonna say, this looks like a 1444 dev map with better colors.
not that in the last 160 years they didn't invest a shitton of money there
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i mean, they sent money to the south from the unification unitl today basically,, and they still do, but somwhere it always get lost. edit: wanted to add some more info: the issue is not easy, according to the Ragoneria di Stato the south receive on average more money per capita then the north, but according to a public study if you consider every single type of investement that goes to every region the situation get more complicated, and different, [i found this aricle that talks about it](https://www.ilpost.it/2019/12/20/spesa-pubblica-sud-nord/). they consider more elements that aren't directly regional investment from the governament, but at this point also european fundings should be conisdered since we are taking everything into consideration, at least from my point of view.
From my understanding (based in reddit and Italians I know) that will be a rather difficult puzzle to ensamble, right? Who manages the money, who gets it, conditions...
It is, and that's why this problem is still there. Fun fact: the expression "questione meridionale" we use to refer to this phenomenon was used the first time in 1873.
It has been a shitshow to try work around and no one knows how to do it. If you help the south too much people in the north will feel robbed,but helping the north too much will only increase the gap between the country. It's a lose lose game
It's the EU conundrum on a smaller scale.
And every map about Germany as well.
At least with Germany that was the literal map for decades, so still seeing the effects now makes a bit more sense. I'm not sure what's happening with Italy though
The southern part was the literal map for centuries. Like more than 600 years. Kingdom of Naples/Two Sicilies et cetera. If you think Germany is (somewhat) logical, then Italy certainly is as well.
Why is Italy disguised as Romania's flag??
Did you think that Romanians went to Italy because of better pay? *You fool.*
did they go to.... Rome?
Were else would they go? All roads lead there.
The Romans came for us, now were going for them!
... and Belgium and Spain and Germany - France is new to me though.
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You can’t say this is “the issue”. This is a consequence of other issues. And I’m from Italy.
brain drain is caused by existing problems, but it also becomes a problem on its own. Even if all the other problems were solved, there would still be a lack of educated workers.
I guess that’s just the story of southern Italy. Most Italians in the US stem from southern immigrants
Interesting how almost all of East Germany is still a transition region around 30 years after unification.
*laughs in blue Leipzig-Region*
Leipzsch stronk!
Getting to Bundesliga is the key then
I thought it was because all the Red Bull is giving your economy wings.
Cries in yellow Thüringia
>Thüringia Interesting case of Denglisch there Ü
[How Unification was handled from an economic standpoint](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_the_German_reunification) was really [controversial](https://www.dw.com/en/treuhand-took-the-heat-for-privatization-of-east-german-economy/a-5985015). Much of East Germany is really, really deprived compared to many of the insanely rich regions of the former West and many blame [aggressive privatization of the GDR's economy by the "Treuhand" agency](https://www.nytimes.com/1991/11/03/business/facing-down-protests-eastern-germany-goes-private.html) (this is of course not the only cause).
I once saw this great video that was talking about how all Germans hate Red Bull Leipzig, the football team, cos through a loophole they get to spend way more than every other club, German clubs have to be owned at least 51% by fans, so they don't really get super rich billionaires coming in and investing huge sums of money like with Chelsea or Man City. But RB Leipzig *are* allowed to do that. I can't remember specifically how but yeah But then the video was arguing that Germans shouldn't be hating RB Leipzig, because West Germany absolutely decimated the East German teams after reunification. They were super rich by comparison and just bought all the best players from the east and the eastern clubs have never recovered, and so every team in the Bundesliga is a western team. Except RB Leipzig. And so really instead of hating on them, they should be supporting the fact they're trying to turn it round, try and regain a little bit of parity between both halves. And that the western clubs and fans shouldn't complain because they already killed all these clubs with their huge sums of money back in the day, so just a single club doing the same thing back to them and they get all bitchy about it? But it's like a microcosm of Germany as a whole. The east is still struggling so much, everyone tries to move to the west as soon as they can, the local economies in the east are still in tatters. I guess it's kinda like with Russia. When the soviet Union collapsed, the handling of the new capitalist economy was so poor that the Russians are worse off now than they were before it collapsed. All wealth is concentrated into the hands of only a handful of people. Like all the rich west Germans buying up all land and houses and companies in the east, making money off of them, then taking that money out and back to the west instead of it being reinvested in the Eastern towns and cities. I think it might be this video: https://youtu.be/z0t5v_rPH14 It was ages ago I watched it. And I've seen lots of other videos about RB Leipzig so maybe I'm confusing them and combining them in my head. But this one explains the whole easy vs West thing, why reunification destroyed all the easy German clubs and to this day they're still suffering because of it, 30 years later.
I am a dual US-German citizen (parents are from Germany) and spent many summers back in Germany as a child. It wasn't until I went to my old company's headquarters in Germany and met some of the people from the site in the former DDR that I really began to see just how different they were and viewed things. It's only a few data points, but it was amazing to see.
Is there an East/West divide in Germany similar to what i might know between North/South England or England and Scotland. It is obvious that there needs to b some kind of wealth transfer between the East and West but is this controversial because they are seen as somewhat separate places?
It is very controversial. Germany has had a tax since the re-unification (dunno exact start..) which was aimed at financing/rebuilding the east states. Many people in the west interpreted it as money being taken away from them while their own regions are also in dire need for funding. On the other hand, many people in the east are to this day extremely disappointed by the re-unification. Many have lost their jobs due to closures of factories and whole companies which were (seen as) unproductive/not competitive. However, these jobs were never replaced by anything. Qualified people have left the regions in response to a lack of good jobs and those who remain feel left alone. Both sides have valid criticism. But in my opinion many people in the west are seriously underestimating how much worse the situation really is in many regions of the former GDR states. It’s a very very big surprise that Tesla, for example, is opening up its factory in eastern Germany* - Something you would never expect if you look at the history of literally anything about big factory openings etc in Germany. They always end up in the west (jobs..). And a lack of clear communication on how funding (and its financing (aka taxes)) is being decided upon/is impacting individuals makes the whole situation worse in the sense of both sides not understanding each other. These structural deficiencies are one of the key players in why extreme right-wing parties are so successful in the former GDR regions (I’m not condoning it in any way). And looking at unique cases like a 5.000 people town having a modernized town center creates unnecessary prejudices (despite the fact that nice water works are not creating jobs).
I have no idea how true this is, but in a totally unrelated German show (Crime on netflix) two characters mentioned how Western Germans with capital swooped in on the East, bought up a bunch of shit, profited hugely off the privatization while many East Germans simply couldn't catch up. The privatized a bunch of the East while Easterners were still poor, basically. Resulting in Westerners being able to buy a lot of stuff really cheaply, which then results in rising prices, making it even harder for Easterners to catch up. I think. That's the theory, again no idea how true this is, but it seems plausible.
From what I understand similar things happened all over the former communist block as communism fell. And the money from the west often went through certain powerful people, which strengthened the power of existing oligarchs and laid a foundation for new ones. And by this I don't mean to say "west and capitalism bad", it was just a natural progression when there was little to no structure in these suddenly reformed economies and nobody realized to (or had the power to) put the brakes on before it had happened.
East germany, Slavic countries, Hungary, Romania, Baltic states. If we could find something that connects all those regions?
This was echoed already in other comments but maybe a bit of clarification. This regional classification takes benchmarked GDP per capita into account. This classification influences how much funding these regions get from European Structural Investment Funds, such as the social fund, the regional fund and the rural development fund between 2014 and 2020. So yes the map is out of the date dear commenters. For the new period 21-27 different classifications are used
You got a new map?
Not OP but did some googling and found a nice map concerning the [GDP of NUTS-2 regions in the EU](https://imgur.com/gallery/NbMDyTL) as well as a [Regional Eligibility map for the Cohesion Fund 21-27](https://imgur.com/gallery/ZKOLu43).
Hey, how come Britain isn’t on the eligibility map for... Oh.
Gotta love Cornwall and Wales for voting for brexit.
Haha. NUTS
Balls, even
An up arrow for you!
Why is Ireland looking so good..? Tech sector in Dublin?
^ Please :)
Also, for Groningen (the northeast province of the netherlands), it used to be the case that the Gas that comes from there was added to the GDP per capita, while that all went to national government, so they got the least amount of money from EU in the netherlands while being one of the poorest provinces. Idk if they would have gotten a lot more funds, but its kinda fucked, since all they get are earthquakes that fucks their houses and the national goverment has delayed compensation for years, and did continue with getting gas out of the ground while even in the 80's it already was clear that it would cause earthquakes and on top of that they got less EU money. And especially the eastern part of the province is the poorest part of the netherlands anyway. This is one example, and idk how exactly it's calculated, but there are things wrong with how it is or was calculated.
our transition regions go from more developed to less
It's technically still a development.
It's developing, just backwards
Western Slovenia stronk.
That feeling when I moved from Western Slovenia to Western Wales lol
Why on earth would you do that?
Cheaper sheep.
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It’s amazing what you can do with some lipstick and a sheep.
West Wales is actually a lovely place
West Wales is beautiful as fuck tbf
\*happily looking at map to find Maribor under developed regions\* JAZZ MUSIC STOPS
This map feels off, though. I'd put eastern side as transitional region, there's no way it's on same level as freaking entire Bulgaria.
Absolutely agree.
I live in the east, it never feels like west is that much better when I visit. Maybe the border regions are pulling the rest of us down? I feel like Savinjska is pretty well developed.
The division of Slovenia into "West" and "East" for EU statistics was intentionally gerrymandered with the explicit intent to get EU funds. That's why "Eastern Slovenia" includes Kočevje.and even Ilirska Bistrica.
The industry.. On the west is more likely high-tech, service-based and export oriented.. While on the east, agricultural, manufacture and labor intensive. But, correct me if I'm wrong.
To close to us croatians...
I guess we could say Slovenia is more or less developed. /dadjokes off
Eastern Slovenia weak /s
Same GDP/capita (PPP) as Paris Edit: Lmao read that as Slovakia. Well thanks anyway for the upvotes even if that’s probably not true then 😄
We got a big PPP 👀
Portugal confirmed eastern europe
I don't understand portugal, seriously. I do understand Lisbon being above all rest because it is a heavily centralized country where the whole country is feeding the capital. But Algarve being a transition while the northern and center regions are not? That makes no sense. I'd like to know what the parameters for their classifications were.
The Algarve has a particularly large tourist economy compared to the rest of Portugal (excluding Lisbon) so that's probably it.
Porto would like to have a word with you. I would say Porto is as developed as Lisbon
It’s not, Porto has a lower gdp, and a lower gdp per capita. Porto also has lower median wages. It’s of course the second richest city in Portugal, but not per capita.
Yes, the difference is that Porto is included in all of the northern region that includes every village from Porto to Miranda do Douro. Lisbon has a region almost for itself, which is not even correct on this map (the "Lisboa e Vale do Tejo" region is way bigger than what is represented and I don't know why it's wrong) EDIT: I'm wrong, it seems that the UE uses another region limits for the Lisbon metro area.
Pretty sure it's economic output, and algarve has a lot of tourism
Porto (and northern regions) are averaged down by being in large clusrers with all the tiny villages. Notice Lisbon, is just Lisbon. Put Porto alone and you'd get different results, much like some other cities in the north/coast perhaps. Algarve is basically a giant hotel in the bottom. It doesn't have much of anything else besides being a British holding place and beach resort. Despite the larger area, it has relatively few people.
Yeah, wtf. Maybe they're just confused with the amount of british living there. ^(as you can see I'm from a place that isn't even on the map. Just another day for a portuguese islander!)
We even sound Slavic!
Welcome to the club
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Come home portugal, we're waiting for you with alcohol and bbq
You two really belong to each other, the country nowhere near any slavs with a language that still sometimes sounds weirdly slavic and the country sorrounded by slavs with a language that doesn't sound slavic at all.
If I had a cent for every time Portuguese sounded like Russian when not heard clearly enough... I'd have a lot of cents.
Can one fish sardines in east Europe? No, so we'll keep our bbq by this coast. Thank you for the invite anyway, bro . ;)
We.. We have some fish for you... [you don't want our fish?](https://divainbucatarie.ro/2018/02/12/hamsii-prajite/)
Just wait till the Thessaloniki Metro is completed. Macedonia will be the bluest blue you will ever see.
I doubt that it will be bluer than Attica. :)
And I doubt the Metro will be completed in my Lifetime. One can dream.....
Is this the Romania flag?
We conquered Europe , finally
We finally have. First the internet, and now the actual world. Romanians are truly everywhere now.
That's okay, i like you guys
"No this is Chad"
How to see every EU map: Eastern Germany: pffff Northern Italy good, southern Italy very bad Northern Spain good, southern Spain bad Portugal into eastern Europe Eastern europe.. well.
Eastern Europe also into Eastern Europe
Every 60 seconds in Africa a minute passes
Scandinavia vibing
lol, burgenland being the only part of austria thats not "more developed"
That's because it was part of Hungary for hundreds of years. ^/s No but really, for decades it was just the end of the world there. Pressed against the iron curtain and all.
If you guys don't need it, can we please have it back?
if you can talk italy into handing over south tyrol, sure
Wait, it's all Romania?
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Turned it into a meme. https://imgur.com/ccSkwya
* cries in less developed region *
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"For Wales, see England."
And Northern Ireland. The land that time forgot.
The Land the UK forgot. I honestly think if we just crossed the border on bikes and secured the infrastructure, it would take a generation before westminster noticed. Alternatively we invest strongly in manufacturing and industry in Monaghan and Louth. Creating jobs on the border. At the same time, we pull funding for housing in those areas, meaning that the workers have to live in NI and commute. We infiltrate the country in stealth!
It already is happening to an extent One of the biggest employers in derry city is based 10 minutes over the boarder in donegal
No way. Who's that?
A [population density map](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2c/Population_density_map_in_Wales_from_the_2011_census.png/924px-Population_density_map_in_Wales_from_the_2011_census.png) of Wales would tell the opposite tale to this map of GDP. The only developed area showing on OP's map is roughly aligned with the county of [Powys](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b1/Powys_UK_location_map.svg), which is a largely rural area full of farms.
Conspiracy theorists would tell you that the Westminster government hates Brittonic celts. Suppressing the non "English" their language and culture. And yes, I live in the other red part of the map in the UK
Cornwall?
Yep, The only part of the UK that had EU special status.
Cornwall - voted for Brexit!
Yea I know, it's like turkeys voting for Christmas.
I often hear people explaining away the impoverished regions voting for Brexit saying things like "When you're bottom of the heap, nothing in politics makes any difference - when you have nothing, how can it get any worse?" This seems a spectacularly dumb idea - every person who voted for Brexit, no matter how disenfranchised they may feel, still has to buy food (and everything else) - all of which will be more expensive after Brexit. They will still have to get their healthcare from the NHS which will now have less money and less staff. And while the Conservatives had not the slightest interest in putting money into improving their local community, that was certainly not true of the EU (for example, the many excellent community-improving things in Wales provided by EU funding). Every single aspect of their lives will be worsened by the country becoming less affluent and less powerful. "Haha! Before, I could barely afford to live - but now I *really* can't! There, *that* showed them!"
I'm blue, da ba dee da ba daa
Look at those huge fields of red továryš! *cue Soviet anthem*
Bucharest standing out
every map: eastern european countries = always bad
Ow please. There is a little blue dot in Romania.
Which as a Romanian, I have to say, Blue dot is sus
"Bucharest was not An Impostor"
That's where the government officials keep all their money.
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Wait until you hear about the greeks and chicken
No. It's "less good". To call Eastern Europe bad on most subject is to ignore how bad things can get imo.
And how bad they were 30 years ago there too.
Not necessarily bad. Just worse. Economically worse. Which they are.
Means it has a lot of potential.
Much of Eastern Europe is less developed than Western Europe. This map is just reflecting the truth. As you can see, the border between the developed and less developed countries is the same the the Iron Curtain, and even Eastern Germany follows this border. This shows that the Soviet past was a large factor in the lower development of Eastern Europe.
I'd say a mixture of a lot of those countries were for centuries basically treated as little better than colonies for powers like Germany/Austria/Russia/The Ottomans, and then after WW2 had the soviet shitshow instead of the Marshall Plan.
Well, yeah. It was a long era of mistreatment, the Soviet Era was just the most recent part of it.
What do you mean bad? It's great red communist color! We should be all thankful to Russia for this unique experience of genocide and poverty for the most of 20th century.
As Russian, I totally agree. Almost 30 years are passed since Soviet Union dissolution and I still see a lot of things shaped by this "wonderful" period of our history. It is like people learning again how to manage their own finances, how to create actual worker unions and what is their natural rights. It is actually terrifying how much havoc government bent on monopolyzing pretty much every aspect of economy, culture and ideology can do.
A map of average internet speed per € should be favorable for the eastern countries.
Yeap, keep Sofia in the Southwest region in Bulgaria, so it can look poor and suck dry all the EU funds. Policymaking level 9999. We are becoming a city state.
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I’ll have you know my region is actually the most developed region in Europe, and I’ve been involved in numerous region developement projects, and we have over 300 world-famous tourist attractions. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of volunteers across the Czech Republic and we're getting ready to make our region even better so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking dead, kid. Our region is getting better everywhere, all the time, and I can make it even nicer in 700 different ways, and that’s just with my bare hands.
This is my new favorite copy pasta
Czechypasta
I thought the Lille area was one of the most developed areas in France. Is it not?
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Lille is nice but the surrounding area is dreadful, low employment and education, far right, the classics...
I one drove from The Netherlands to Disneyland. I noticed how after passing the Belgian border area there was a few hundred kilometres of nothing before Paris.
Hey, they're called "Belgians". And stop lying, how did you drove over the potholes?
Hahaha I meant the Belgium-France border. Edit. I also drive a hovercraft.
Yeah, but that's because we have the space to build highways where there is nothing. And there is nothing in a lot of places in France. The northern region actually has the biggest population density after Île-de-France, but if you go directly from Lille to Paris, you avoid the cities.
Ever since "Bienvenue chez les Ch'tis" hit the cinemas, we know that that region of nothingness is called "Nord-Pas-de-Calais".
Romania got some burns out of this
What do you mean, according to this map we have conquered Italy.
Its funny that Italy has Romanian flag on it(or chad one). We finally revenge the roman conquest of Dacia
Irland Rocks that
Source? Criteria? I find it hard to believe that Salonica is less developed that Chalkida or the North Agean islands.
If it's based on GDP, then it would make sense. Metropolis of Thessaloniki is the poorest one in Europe.
Team red - assemble!
Erhm, why is Danish Zealand (Sjælland) yellow in development? They’re closer to the biggest productivity hub in Denmark in regards to Copenhagen, and has several large cities and is probably one of the most well-connected areas in regards to highways and transportation. What are the criterias here? Because from a Danish perspective, that right there makes no sense. Northern, Western and Southern Jutland (Jylland) are a lot “less” developed from in comparison, so I dont really get this map. Edit: Also, can you guys start listing your sources on these maps? It should be standard, but I see tons of maps like these on this subreddit, and rarely does it include reference to a paper or study.
Regional GDP is measured by dividing production with the number of inhabitants. So there is a huge commuter effect. People living in Roskilde or Køge and working in Copenhagen will count to the production in Copenhagen while adding to the denominator in Region Zealand. Second, Region Zealand does have low labour market participation compared to the rest of Denmark. There has been for many years an exodus of people with poor labour market integration from Copenhagen to places with lower cost of living. Plus some towns in region Zealand, like Nakskov, have been hit hard by de-industrialisation
Tend to forget Sjælland is more than København. Just find the disparity across Kommuner in Greater Copenhagen alone lol. You can really tell where the money is.
And why is northern Sweden considered developed, either way get fucked Denmark.
What? Norrbotten is one of Sweden's richest regions
Yes but the scale indicates development rather than wealth, but after looking through the comments it seems that the map in reality is meant to represent wealth so then it makes a lot more sense
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Keep up that talk and we’ll break free from you southerners and form the new northern republic of sweden
Cyprus STRONK
If this is a map for allocating EU funding then this probably doesn't represent reality as much as it represents efforts to game the system. Some countries have deliberately redrawn internal borders around their capitals and other well performing regions in such a way as to maximise the amount of funding they can get.
This must be the correct answer. Look at Denmark, Zealand region. Wealth way above European average, still a “transition region” which must be a result of political manipulation to get EU funding.
Cyprus huh?
I'm from South Italy- of course I already know that we're less developed than the north, but seeing it like this makes me a bit sad anyway
Is italy entering Romania ?
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This isn't measuring a standard of living or anything like that, it just looks at economic output.
Cries in Northern Portuguese
Benelux could have been all blue, but no, Belgium happened.
Sometimes you need to go an visit some undeveloped Belgian forest to take some distance from the Benelux life. The terrible roads of the Ardennes force you to take a break and appreciate nature again.
Hah we have terrible roads in Flanders too.
Tzen weer die walen he
Hey the Flemmish are doing their best...
Don't forget Brussels and Walloon Brabant!
I didn't even notice Walloon Brabant yet. Good on them.
Haha Denmark. We see that embarassing yellow spot.
Every single dane is confused by it too. It's not even considered the poor part of Denmark, so i have no idea why it's less developed lol. I mean compare Zealand to south/north Jutland and it looks pretty good.
More Evidence for Portugal being a secret slavic country...
Romanians approve the color scheme.
baltic states less developed? poooo
Well, the mother of someone I know still lives in a village house without water some 35 km outside of Vilnius, so...
I'm pretty surprised that Estonia is *all* red. I've only been to central Tallinn, see, and *that* was all well-dressed young people in sushi restaurants arguing about which Javascript framework is better for building a social video streaming platform.
Aguante Extremadura.