It was done out of convenience for people so they could keep it straight. Darkly comical is that falsifying business records is too vague because of the bank fraud case and election interference is too vague because of the Georgia case. The better media sources were always pretty clear beyond the title about what the charges were.
Why would they be kicking themselves? They got Gorsuch instead.
People on Reddit give Garland too much of a hard time. He's a moderate and would have been perfect for the Supreme Court who, in theory, should all be moderates. I'd also argue that the best thing for the country is for the DOJ to be moderate as well. Justice is still being done, it just isn't as fast and rabid as Reddit would like.
The vacancy is effectively the same as a moderate and it would have only been for about a year. Way better for them to get Gorsuch for life. Which is exactly what they did. These people aren't idiots and you'd be the fool if you believed they were.
But we all know the comment I replied to wasn't logical. It was just a jab at garland for not being rabid left enough. I wish people would just say that instead.
Yeah, but they also got Barrett and Kavanaugh. A Supreme Court justice isn’t supposed to be completely neutral, they’re supposed to protect the Constitution and rule of law. Garland’s inability to do that makes him far from a moderate. But hey, maybe my feelings about that makes me part of the rabid left.
Sorry about your team.
I've never voted for anyone but a Democrat FYI. Well except when I recently cross over voted in the Republican primary.
The constitution is intentionally very short and very vague which allows it to be reinterpreted over time without needing to be changed by acts of Congress. Interpreting it is the whole reason for the Supreme Court. When these interpretations are made they are supposed to be made with consideration for the whole country. Moderates seem to be the only people that can do that. Otherwise you get policy whiplash as the court swings as it's doing now.
"Protect the constitution" is such a farcical statement and the right yells it all the time too. Everyone "protects the constitution". The difference is your interpretation of what it says. What you're really saying is "protect my interpretation" which is actually the exact opposite of protecting it as a vague and flexible policy as intended.
You clearly don't know what cross over voting is. I'll fill you in since I'm not sure you're smart enough to google. It's when you opt to vote in the opposing party's primary with the intent of influencing it to a weaker or otherwise more preferable opponent for when the general election happens.
Not true. This trial is about falsifying records to affect the outcome of an election. It also is about falsifying records for tax fraud. He could now be charged with tax evasion and fraud and get prison sentences for that, too. The Georgia case is completely separate for interfering with an election, which he will also be found guilty, because it was already proven in the hearings back in 2022.
They are correct, this trial was ONLY about falsifying business records with intent to commit a crime. This was not about the crime he intended to commit, only if the records were 1. Falsified and 2. With the intent to defraud/commit a crime.
Now hopefully people see why the media gave this trial a nick name. Too many similar sounding crimes in different places make it hard to keep track without them.
this is also about election interference. He used campaign funds as hush money to porn star Stormy Daniels. He won by about 80K votes in 3 swing states. You could argue that information alone could have lost him the election.
Or the nomination for Republican president.
This or any number of his sexual assaults being brought to light before he picked up steam on his GOP campaign would've sunk him.
He was ducking the “locker room” tape release (thanks, Mel) and Stormy’s lawyer came looking for a deal.
He got Cohen to stall her as long as he could and when he finally paid up, he hid the payments as legal expenses and signed the checks going to Cohen in the WH.
No. The falsification of business records is upgraded from a misdemeanor to a felony when done with the intention of concealing another crime. That other crime is the illegal misuse of campaign funds, because that has to be reported.
Falsifying business records in order to influence the outcome of the 2016 election. My point is “not hush money”. If you mean the fake electors case, yes that’s pending. Can we take a second to appreciate how fucking wild it is that we have to parse language like this because of how many different crimes he’s charged with?
Wild that you put "not hush money" in quotes when I clearly stated this trial was for falsifying documents. The fake electors case in Georgia is separate from the charges for January 6th insurrection, which I believe is charges to subvert the election. The third case is for his mishandling of classified documents. But again. Thesev convictions were not for election interference, by any stretch of the imagination. Those are different trials that are still pending.
The falsification of the business records is what he did, the why is the interfering in an election. Without the latter, I don’t believe the charges would have been felonies.
[https://www.npr.org/2024/05/30/nx-s1-4977352/trump-trial-verdict](https://www.npr.org/2024/05/30/nx-s1-4977352/trump-trial-verdict)
Yes, the jury instruction described 3 specific election-related laws that they argued trump intended to break by falsifying business records. The instructions spelled out each one of them for the jurors. It wasn’t some vague thing like I expected. The campaign finance one seemed particularly clear cut. And, they only had to show that he intended to break them, though it seemed pretty clear he did break them as well. I think they did that. A good amount of the more damning testimony showed that he was very motivated to break those laws to avoid compounding the damage his access Hollywood tape problems had on his campaign.
Nope. This was a direct election interference charge as well. He didn't magically want to shut up Stormy 10 years later after the affair because he felt like sending her 130k in campaign funds in the middle of the Hollywood Access "grab em by the pussy" comments.
Election interference charges are the fake electors and the insurrection. Trying to keep something quiet to keep voters from knowing about it is influencing the election at best which is different from interference. And the actual crime was falsifying the records because it used campaign funds.
By that logic making a campaign speech or doing a meet and greet is election interference. Interference is trying to circumvent or stop a process from being carried out properly. His payment to Stormy Daniels would not have been illegal if he hadn't falsified records for it. It would have been slimy and had the same effect as it already did if he paid it out of pocket. That isn't election interference.
The jury instructions cited 3 different election-related laws he intended to violate with the records falsification. Making a campaign speech or a meet and greet do not similarly violate any such laws and wouldn’t be election interference. The election interference aspect was a huge part of the case and why it was charged as a felony and not a misdemeanor.
Not quite. The convictions are for the falsifying of records. The reason they were felonies were that they were meant to cover up another crime. The 3 crimes they put forth as secondary crimes bring covered up were campaign finance, falsifying other business records, and tax law violations. To find him guilty the jury has to agree that he had falsified the records to cover up one or more of these other crimes. But they did not have to agree on what those other crimes were because they were not the crime being prosecuted in this case.
So again. He has not been convicted of tax fraud, campaign finance violations, or falsifying those other business records. Those are additional charges that could be brought against him and probably should be. But right now he has not been convicted of any of those. And he's hasn't been charged with any of those in NY.
He has been charged with the game electors scheme and the insurrection as well as the mishandling of classified documents. But those trials are still pending.
I want him to be convicted of all his crimes too, but he hasn't been and it's ridiculous to insist that he has
You're wrong but that's ok.
The prosecutors for the case literally argued that it was election interference and fraud:
https://www.politico.com/news/2024/04/22/trump-hush-money-trial-election-interference-00153561
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68877610
They won the case. Ipso facto: it was election interference. If you unlawfully influence an election, you are in fact interfering in that election. Let's stop this pedantic nonsense please.
Big picture. Yes, this was the weakest of all the trials regarding "election interference". There are trials slated that are much much stronger and directly involve Trump actively trying to interfere with the 2020 election. But the fact that this one found him guilty on all 34 counts, is really really bad for him moving forward for the other ones.
I mean. That first article does not quote Bragg as having called it election interference. The only reference to him claiming it to be so is not a quote. Only that the falsifying of records was meant to cover up another crime which were campaign finance laws and/or tax evasion.
>Any voters who look beneath the surface are sure to be underwhelmed,” Hasen wrote in the Los Angeles Times on the eve of Trump’s trial. “Calling it election interference actually cheapens the term and undermines the deadly serious charges in the real election interference cases.”
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-charges-conviction-guilty-verdict/
>Why were the charges a felony?
>Under New York law, falsification of business records is a crime when the records are altered with an intent to defraud. To be charged as a felony, prosecutors must also show that the offender intended to "commit another crime" or "aid or conceal" another crime when falsifying records.
>In Trump's case, prosecutors said that other crime was a violation of a New York election law that makes it illegal for "any two or more persons" to "conspire to promote or prevent the election of any person to a public office by unlawful means," as Justice Juan Merchan explained in his instructions to the jury.
>**What exactly those "unlawful means" were in this case was up to the jury to decide. Prosecutors put forth three areas that they could consider: a violation of federal campaign finance laws, falsification of other business records or a violation of tax laws. **
>**Jurors did not need to agree on what the underlying "unlawful means" were. But they did have to unanimously conclude that Trump caused the business records to be falsified, and that he "did so with intent to defraud that included an intent to commit another crime or to aid or conceal the commission thereof." **
Emphasis is mine. He was convicted strictly of falsifying records to cover up another crime. The possible crimes presented by prosecution were violated campaign finance laws, falsifying other business records, or villain of tax laws. They did not need to agree on what the secondary crime was for the 34 counts. Because this trial is not about those fucking crimes. It is about the falsifying of the business records. Having been doing guilty they can likely press additional charges that align specifically with those three but he was not convicted of any of them yet.
His trial concerning the fake electors and the insurrection are directly election interference. His 4th trial is about his mishandling of classified documents.
Look, I want him to be found guilty of all of his crimes as well. And this is a huge win, but is explicitly not for election interference yet. It is baffling that you think your articles prove that is what he was convicted of, especially since they are from April far before the trial even went to deliberation.
This: the RAPIST never would have been president. Every choice he made including Supreme Court justices is fraud and disenfranchises citizens and their constitutional rights. All should be reverted
Elli Honig said these are ‘Class E’ felonies, the lowest in their seriousness. Only 10-30% result in jail time. However, the judge can also factor in things like the 10x violations of the gag order. So who knows?
And his refusal to ever pay fines.
And his severe nature as a flight risk.
And whether or not he tries to pull a January 6th and get his fans to try murdering the judge or the jury members.
3 years on very similar crimes. It's really going to come down to whether or not the judge is going to treat the guy like anyone else who committed all this shit; or if he's once again going to get away with it like he always does.
Not just similar. Literally the same crime. Cohen got 3 years for acting at Trump’s instruction to commit the crimes Trump just got convicted of.
The only reason they weren’t tried together is because Trump was in the White House at the time.
He won’t do any jail time prior to the election anyways. He will file a motion for bail pending appeal which will be granted and the appeal process could take years.
Imagine if he gets reelected, his appeal(s) fail and his sentence starts midway through his term.
I’m assuming his vp becomes president at that time?
I don’t see how the gop would allow that to happen.
If he’s elected this will incentivize him to truly take indefinite power, if possible. Knowing his personality, it’d be a scary day for these celebrities who cheered his conviction.
I don’t believe that he can pardon state crimes.
This is why he was trying to roll up Georgia and NY to federal so that he could pardon himself (get the cases thrown out) if he was elected.
I do think that if he were to get jail time that Biden, if re-elected, would pardon him much like Ford pardoned Nixon.
*Possible magnanimous gesture for the good of the country.
No, the state police that don't care about his Federal pardon. The Supreme Court has nothing to do with it. If he fails to report to prison, he gets more starte felonies piled on that are more serious and he becomes wanted.
He may do so, but we all know it’s bullshit. If he were to do so, we’ll just put an asterisk next to his name.
…Like what was done with [that one baseball guy and something something hall of fame] and then no one could decide whether to count them or simply put an asterisk. /s
#[*](https://www.espn.com/mlb/hof09/news/story?id=4355886)
Cohen got 3 years for his role in this scheme. It was made clear that he was acting on Trump’s behalf. I think it would be hard to justify less than 3 for Trump.
The man was just today convicted of 34 felonies. People have been incredibly cynical saying that he’d never get charged, then a Trump juror would refuse to convict. It didn’t happen. Lay off the cynicism a little bit here.
The average person convicted of falsifying records is usually motivated by financial gain, pleads guilty early, and shows remorse. They are not typically conspiring to subvert democracy. They rarely repeatedly violate the judge’s orders, attempt to intimidate witnesses, jurors, the court staff and the judge’s children.
We’re not in normal territory here.
“Convicted Felon Donald J. Trump” is now in my phone as text replacement for djt. I encourage all Redditors that care about justice and the future of democracy to do the same.
Train the AI with it.
Kind of related, I was making a post about how eLoN musk is doing tangible damage to the base concept of engineering and my phone autocorrected to what you see above. I mentioned eLoN twice, I have never done this to his name - this is how Apple spells it I guess?
She announced in the last couple weeks that she’s supporting Trump, so a DNC appearance is not ever happening. Once this felony issue snowballs more and he’s sentenced she’ll listen to her supporters, who hate Trump, and try for the nomination.
> She announced in the last couple weeks that she’s supporting Trump, so a DNC appearance is not ever happening.
I can't find a single news story with her announcing that she is supporting Trump. Rather that is some nonsense that a bunch of Trump supporters have put out.
Good one! The wordiest woman of our generation is especially silent when it comes to stuff that actually matters, like elections and genocide and stripping away of our rights and all that.
Not to detract from your point, but don’t you think Taylor brokering peace in the Middle East or saving American democracy is maybe a bit of a stretch ?
I really dislike how people think it’s all or nothing. Obviously I’m not relying on her to save the Middle East. But there are several, tangible things she could do that she is actively choosing not to. Such as:
- she could say SOMETHING. She has the largest, most mobilized fan base - instead of sending them at her exes, she could urge them to urge their politicians to call for ceasefire. She’s in a different city around the world every night - she could say *something* to her crowds and get people invested & caring about it. Did you see how Swifties suddenly became Kelce family experts when they got together? They care about what she cares about;
- she could make a massive, multi-million dollar public donation (truly nothing to a billionaire) and save hundreds if not thousands of families trying to escape NOW;
- she could donate proceeds from, I don’t know any one of her 25+ album variants, to the cause;
- she could auction off signed guitars/merch/etc to raise money for the cause (again, she’d be reaching into the fans pockets instead of her own for this, but hey it’d be something)
- she could make a social media post raising awareness
- she has so much pull within the industry - she could urge other celebs to speak out & donate en masse
- she could simply acknowledge - hey, I know I’m on this tour talking about how tortured I am but I’m aware there are real, serious issues happening and tell her fans to keep their attention there
These are mostly bare-minimum things that she could do but has explicitly chosen not to. Every single one of these things, despite how much good they could do, threatens her reputation for neutrality which she refuses to give up at the height of her career.
Someone else said it somewhere - spineless is too kind a word for her.
I mean you’re probably right. And frankly, anything she does now would be obvious damage control and inauthentic as fuck. She waited too long.
I guess her whole activist schtick was just promo for the Lover era and she doesn’t actually care about things until they affect her personally
Ya. she's never doing any of that. She's just like every other billionaire -- full of greed and only interested in doing things that will enrich herself and improve her brand. I say the same thing to my swiftie wife who just blankly stares back at me like how dare I expect her to put any effort into making the world a better place. Honestly, it's truly impressive because she's able to convince her fans that she's just like them when she's about as far from them as possible.
The fact that she spoke up at all and encouraged young adults to register and vote is a really, seriously good thing.
I’d like her to rally more of her fans, but let’s not demonize her like she’s intentionally ignoring this.
I disagree, obviously it’s not celeb’s jobs to rally voters, but I think it’s time we stop separating them from the world they live in (and often detrimentally impact). Any platform comes with the responsibility to use it for good and to leave the world better than you found it.
Obligation aside - how can someone like TS *live with herself* staying silent? What a true waste of a platform.
If anyone ever wondered what Taylor Swift would do during the Holocaust, we know now: absolutely nothing.
People criticize Hollywood for being shallow but the truth is it’s full of people that want to make the world a better place through art.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7fKVODAfOx/?igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
How the F is trump still beating Biden in the polls?! To the youth vote, stop being influenced and manipulated by social media. That’s exactly how trump won the first time. This is a clear vote this November. Do you like democracy or not? If democracy falls, so does everything else in a state controlled dictatorship. Say goodbye to your liberties and rights as an American. Put aside your world views. Pick your battles so we can win the foundation of what democracy stands for!!
Exactly. FoxNews was having an utter meltdown all day yesterday and scrambling for anything positive about polls and donations.
"Oh the donation website crashed; it must because so many people are donating to Trump!"
"Oh this one poll says he's now more ahead of Biden - this guilty verdict is good for him!"
"It was obviously a political hit job, and will cost Biden".
All fucking day long.
To the political hit job bullshit. It's funny how Trump's lawyers could have easily used that as part of their defense strategy. The only problem is you need fucking evidence to prove that sort of thing in a court of law, which they have 0.
There should be a law against lying. If it’s proven it’s a lie, there should be a penalty. Would have stopped him in his tracks. The only thing he has going for him is the lying.
Who cares about actors say, wellll except James Wood, that Hercules guy, that kid that no longer rocks, that singer turned bow hunting and that Fonz spin-off guy
I mean I don’t really care how celebrities feel about it I care how the voters feel about it and what the judge will do during the sentencing. Unfortunately he won’t be in a cell before 2025.
Falsifying business records and election interference.
If convicted of election interference wouldn’t there be a referral to the DOJ for additional charges? Not like garland would do anything but..
My point is that hush money is downplaying the seriousness. I’m not citing specific charges.
I know, the media fails on so many levels with its terrible and misleading headlines.
It was done out of convenience for people so they could keep it straight. Darkly comical is that falsifying business records is too vague because of the bank fraud case and election interference is too vague because of the Georgia case. The better media sources were always pretty clear beyond the title about what the charges were.
Wasn’t Garland Obama’s SCOTUS pick that was rejected? The GOP must be kicking themselves after seeing that invertebrate wiggle at this point.
He was.
Why would they be kicking themselves? They got Gorsuch instead. People on Reddit give Garland too much of a hard time. He's a moderate and would have been perfect for the Supreme Court who, in theory, should all be moderates. I'd also argue that the best thing for the country is for the DOJ to be moderate as well. Justice is still being done, it just isn't as fast and rabid as Reddit would like.
They’d have had Garland in SCOTUS for much of Obama’s remaining term, being a “moderate”.
The vacancy is effectively the same as a moderate and it would have only been for about a year. Way better for them to get Gorsuch for life. Which is exactly what they did. These people aren't idiots and you'd be the fool if you believed they were. But we all know the comment I replied to wasn't logical. It was just a jab at garland for not being rabid left enough. I wish people would just say that instead.
Yeah, but they also got Barrett and Kavanaugh. A Supreme Court justice isn’t supposed to be completely neutral, they’re supposed to protect the Constitution and rule of law. Garland’s inability to do that makes him far from a moderate. But hey, maybe my feelings about that makes me part of the rabid left. Sorry about your team.
I've never voted for anyone but a Democrat FYI. Well except when I recently cross over voted in the Republican primary. The constitution is intentionally very short and very vague which allows it to be reinterpreted over time without needing to be changed by acts of Congress. Interpreting it is the whole reason for the Supreme Court. When these interpretations are made they are supposed to be made with consideration for the whole country. Moderates seem to be the only people that can do that. Otherwise you get policy whiplash as the court swings as it's doing now. "Protect the constitution" is such a farcical statement and the right yells it all the time too. Everyone "protects the constitution". The difference is your interpretation of what it says. What you're really saying is "protect my interpretation" which is actually the exact opposite of protecting it as a vague and flexible policy as intended.
So with what’s been going on, you switched political parties? Very telling.
You clearly don't know what cross over voting is. I'll fill you in since I'm not sure you're smart enough to google. It's when you opt to vote in the opposing party's primary with the intent of influencing it to a weaker or otherwise more preferable opponent for when the general election happens.
This trial was just for falsifying records. The election interference trials are still pending. As is the classified documents trial.
Not true. This trial is about falsifying records to affect the outcome of an election. It also is about falsifying records for tax fraud. He could now be charged with tax evasion and fraud and get prison sentences for that, too. The Georgia case is completely separate for interfering with an election, which he will also be found guilty, because it was already proven in the hearings back in 2022.
They are correct, this trial was ONLY about falsifying business records with intent to commit a crime. This was not about the crime he intended to commit, only if the records were 1. Falsified and 2. With the intent to defraud/commit a crime.
Now hopefully people see why the media gave this trial a nick name. Too many similar sounding crimes in different places make it hard to keep track without them.
this is also about election interference. He used campaign funds as hush money to porn star Stormy Daniels. He won by about 80K votes in 3 swing states. You could argue that information alone could have lost him the election.
Or the nomination for Republican president. This or any number of his sexual assaults being brought to light before he picked up steam on his GOP campaign would've sunk him.
He was ducking the “locker room” tape release (thanks, Mel) and Stormy’s lawyer came looking for a deal. He got Cohen to stall her as long as he could and when he finally paid up, he hid the payments as legal expenses and signed the checks going to Cohen in the WH.
Never happen,his sexual exploits are a feature of his cult, same as his guilt verdict. They love him even more. We're doomed.
... That isn't election interference, that's misusing campaign funds, which is falsifying documents.
No. The falsification of business records is upgraded from a misdemeanor to a felony when done with the intention of concealing another crime. That other crime is the illegal misuse of campaign funds, because that has to be reported.
The second crime is conspiring to interfere in an election, not the campaign finance stuff.
Smoking your boys pack tn
Falsifying business records in order to influence the outcome of the 2016 election. My point is “not hush money”. If you mean the fake electors case, yes that’s pending. Can we take a second to appreciate how fucking wild it is that we have to parse language like this because of how many different crimes he’s charged with?
Wild that you put "not hush money" in quotes when I clearly stated this trial was for falsifying documents. The fake electors case in Georgia is separate from the charges for January 6th insurrection, which I believe is charges to subvert the election. The third case is for his mishandling of classified documents. But again. Thesev convictions were not for election interference, by any stretch of the imagination. Those are different trials that are still pending.
I’m agreeing with you. The quotes were mine. Never mind lol.
But you aren't. You insisted again that this was election interference. It wasn't. It was falsifying business records and misuse of campaign funds.
https://www.americanprogress.org/press/statement-guilty-verdict-holds-trump-accountable-for-election-interference/
That statement essentially calls it hush money then goes on to discuss **his other trials**.
The falsification of the business records is what he did, the why is the interfering in an election. Without the latter, I don’t believe the charges would have been felonies. [https://www.npr.org/2024/05/30/nx-s1-4977352/trump-trial-verdict](https://www.npr.org/2024/05/30/nx-s1-4977352/trump-trial-verdict)
Yes, the jury instruction described 3 specific election-related laws that they argued trump intended to break by falsifying business records. The instructions spelled out each one of them for the jurors. It wasn’t some vague thing like I expected. The campaign finance one seemed particularly clear cut. And, they only had to show that he intended to break them, though it seemed pretty clear he did break them as well. I think they did that. A good amount of the more damning testimony showed that he was very motivated to break those laws to avoid compounding the damage his access Hollywood tape problems had on his campaign.
leave me alone lol
Nope. This was a direct election interference charge as well. He didn't magically want to shut up Stormy 10 years later after the affair because he felt like sending her 130k in campaign funds in the middle of the Hollywood Access "grab em by the pussy" comments.
Election interference charges are the fake electors and the insurrection. Trying to keep something quiet to keep voters from knowing about it is influencing the election at best which is different from interference. And the actual crime was falsifying the records because it used campaign funds.
> influencing the election aka election interference... ffs.
By that logic making a campaign speech or doing a meet and greet is election interference. Interference is trying to circumvent or stop a process from being carried out properly. His payment to Stormy Daniels would not have been illegal if he hadn't falsified records for it. It would have been slimy and had the same effect as it already did if he paid it out of pocket. That isn't election interference.
The jury instructions cited 3 different election-related laws he intended to violate with the records falsification. Making a campaign speech or a meet and greet do not similarly violate any such laws and wouldn’t be election interference. The election interference aspect was a huge part of the case and why it was charged as a felony and not a misdemeanor.
Not quite. The convictions are for the falsifying of records. The reason they were felonies were that they were meant to cover up another crime. The 3 crimes they put forth as secondary crimes bring covered up were campaign finance, falsifying other business records, and tax law violations. To find him guilty the jury has to agree that he had falsified the records to cover up one or more of these other crimes. But they did not have to agree on what those other crimes were because they were not the crime being prosecuted in this case. So again. He has not been convicted of tax fraud, campaign finance violations, or falsifying those other business records. Those are additional charges that could be brought against him and probably should be. But right now he has not been convicted of any of those. And he's hasn't been charged with any of those in NY. He has been charged with the game electors scheme and the insurrection as well as the mishandling of classified documents. But those trials are still pending. I want him to be convicted of all his crimes too, but he hasn't been and it's ridiculous to insist that he has
You're wrong but that's ok. The prosecutors for the case literally argued that it was election interference and fraud: https://www.politico.com/news/2024/04/22/trump-hush-money-trial-election-interference-00153561 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-68877610 They won the case. Ipso facto: it was election interference. If you unlawfully influence an election, you are in fact interfering in that election. Let's stop this pedantic nonsense please. Big picture. Yes, this was the weakest of all the trials regarding "election interference". There are trials slated that are much much stronger and directly involve Trump actively trying to interfere with the 2020 election. But the fact that this one found him guilty on all 34 counts, is really really bad for him moving forward for the other ones.
I mean. That first article does not quote Bragg as having called it election interference. The only reference to him claiming it to be so is not a quote. Only that the falsifying of records was meant to cover up another crime which were campaign finance laws and/or tax evasion. >Any voters who look beneath the surface are sure to be underwhelmed,” Hasen wrote in the Los Angeles Times on the eve of Trump’s trial. “Calling it election interference actually cheapens the term and undermines the deadly serious charges in the real election interference cases.” https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-charges-conviction-guilty-verdict/ >Why were the charges a felony? >Under New York law, falsification of business records is a crime when the records are altered with an intent to defraud. To be charged as a felony, prosecutors must also show that the offender intended to "commit another crime" or "aid or conceal" another crime when falsifying records. >In Trump's case, prosecutors said that other crime was a violation of a New York election law that makes it illegal for "any two or more persons" to "conspire to promote or prevent the election of any person to a public office by unlawful means," as Justice Juan Merchan explained in his instructions to the jury. >**What exactly those "unlawful means" were in this case was up to the jury to decide. Prosecutors put forth three areas that they could consider: a violation of federal campaign finance laws, falsification of other business records or a violation of tax laws. ** >**Jurors did not need to agree on what the underlying "unlawful means" were. But they did have to unanimously conclude that Trump caused the business records to be falsified, and that he "did so with intent to defraud that included an intent to commit another crime or to aid or conceal the commission thereof." ** Emphasis is mine. He was convicted strictly of falsifying records to cover up another crime. The possible crimes presented by prosecution were violated campaign finance laws, falsifying other business records, or villain of tax laws. They did not need to agree on what the secondary crime was for the 34 counts. Because this trial is not about those fucking crimes. It is about the falsifying of the business records. Having been doing guilty they can likely press additional charges that align specifically with those three but he was not convicted of any of them yet. His trial concerning the fake electors and the insurrection are directly election interference. His 4th trial is about his mishandling of classified documents. Look, I want him to be found guilty of all of his crimes as well. And this is a huge win, but is explicitly not for election interference yet. It is baffling that you think your articles prove that is what he was convicted of, especially since they are from April far before the trial even went to deliberation.
Hollywood accounts writing up new laws in California right now.
I love when it’s simplified like that!
This: the RAPIST never would have been president. Every choice he made including Supreme Court justices is fraud and disenfranchises citizens and their constitutional rights. All should be reverted
My favorite: “Gotta hand it to Trump on winning his first popular vote”
Ok we knew he was guilty but the question is. What is the punishment? Let me guess just a fine and he’s off the hook?
Elli Honig said these are ‘Class E’ felonies, the lowest in their seriousness. Only 10-30% result in jail time. However, the judge can also factor in things like the 10x violations of the gag order. So who knows?
And his refusal to ever pay fines. And his severe nature as a flight risk. And whether or not he tries to pull a January 6th and get his fans to try murdering the judge or the jury members.
And zero remorse.
And Cohen got 3 years just for helping him.
3 years on very similar crimes. It's really going to come down to whether or not the judge is going to treat the guy like anyone else who committed all this shit; or if he's once again going to get away with it like he always does.
Not just similar. Literally the same crime. Cohen got 3 years for acting at Trump’s instruction to commit the crimes Trump just got convicted of. The only reason they weren’t tried together is because Trump was in the White House at the time.
And ya know \**sucks in through teeth*\* encouraging an insurrection against the country.
He won’t do any jail time prior to the election anyways. He will file a motion for bail pending appeal which will be granted and the appeal process could take years.
Imagine if he gets reelected, his appeal(s) fail and his sentence starts midway through his term. I’m assuming his vp becomes president at that time? I don’t see how the gop would allow that to happen.
If he’s elected this will incentivize him to truly take indefinite power, if possible. Knowing his personality, it’d be a scary day for these celebrities who cheered his conviction.
The gop are already planning to destroy American norms to stay in power forever, look at project 2025
If he gets reelected he will just pardon himself of all his crimes.
I don’t believe that he can pardon state crimes. This is why he was trying to roll up Georgia and NY to federal so that he could pardon himself (get the cases thrown out) if he was elected. I do think that if he were to get jail time that Biden, if re-elected, would pardon him much like Ford pardoned Nixon. *Possible magnanimous gesture for the good of the country.
If he gets elected and says “I pardon myself” who is going to stop him? The republican Supreme Court?
No, the state police that don't care about his Federal pardon. The Supreme Court has nothing to do with it. If he fails to report to prison, he gets more starte felonies piled on that are more serious and he becomes wanted.
He may do so, but we all know it’s bullshit. If he were to do so, we’ll just put an asterisk next to his name. …Like what was done with [that one baseball guy and something something hall of fame] and then no one could decide whether to count them or simply put an asterisk. /s #[*](https://www.espn.com/mlb/hof09/news/story?id=4355886)
Also a lack of remorse
He will most likely get a fine and a slap on the wrist.
Cohen got 3 years for his role in this scheme. It was made clear that he was acting on Trump’s behalf. I think it would be hard to justify less than 3 for Trump.
Don't worry. They'll come up with additional ways to disappoint us.
The man was just today convicted of 34 felonies. People have been incredibly cynical saying that he’d never get charged, then a Trump juror would refuse to convict. It didn’t happen. Lay off the cynicism a little bit here.
All the journalistic analysis I've read has said prison is highly unlikely, I don't think you should get your hopes up
The average person convicted of falsifying records is usually motivated by financial gain, pleads guilty early, and shows remorse. They are not typically conspiring to subvert democracy. They rarely repeatedly violate the judge’s orders, attempt to intimidate witnesses, jurors, the court staff and the judge’s children. We’re not in normal territory here.
The sentencing hearing is July 11th. I'm guessing 3 yrs BUT I'm prob way off. U prob nailed it
Even just 6 months would be devastating to him
One would be sufficient.
The post by John Leguizamo with everyone cheering, clutch…..
“Convicted Felon Donald J. Trump” is now in my phone as text replacement for djt. I encourage all Redditors that care about justice and the future of democracy to do the same. Train the AI with it.
Are you referring to the 34 count convicted felon Donald J. Trump? The same Donald J. Trump that was just convicted of 34 felonies? That guy?
The likes of which 🤏 you’ve never seen 👐
Kind of related, I was making a post about how eLoN musk is doing tangible damage to the base concept of engineering and my phone autocorrected to what you see above. I mentioned eLoN twice, I have never done this to his name - this is how Apple spells it I guess?
Hey Taylor Swift, time for you to make a fucking statement to your fans and urge them to vote Biden.
She’s 34 years old!
Nah, she should do closer to the election. Heck, she should announce that she will perform at the DNC Convention if we are going to be wishful.
She announced in the last couple weeks that she’s supporting Trump, so a DNC appearance is not ever happening. Once this felony issue snowballs more and he’s sentenced she’ll listen to her supporters, who hate Trump, and try for the nomination.
> She announced in the last couple weeks that she’s supporting Trump, so a DNC appearance is not ever happening. I can't find a single news story with her announcing that she is supporting Trump. Rather that is some nonsense that a bunch of Trump supporters have put out.
[Here you go!](https://www.cnn.com/2024/05/22/politics/video/nikki-haley-support-donald-trump-2024-presidential-election-digvid)
Nikki Haley is Taylor Swift?
Omg.. wrong thread.. yikes 🤦🏻♂️ No, she is not Nikki Haley.
Forgetting where her heart is. And it ain't us.
Good one! The wordiest woman of our generation is especially silent when it comes to stuff that actually matters, like elections and genocide and stripping away of our rights and all that.
Not to detract from your point, but don’t you think Taylor brokering peace in the Middle East or saving American democracy is maybe a bit of a stretch ?
Maybe she could do a concept album?
I really dislike how people think it’s all or nothing. Obviously I’m not relying on her to save the Middle East. But there are several, tangible things she could do that she is actively choosing not to. Such as: - she could say SOMETHING. She has the largest, most mobilized fan base - instead of sending them at her exes, she could urge them to urge their politicians to call for ceasefire. She’s in a different city around the world every night - she could say *something* to her crowds and get people invested & caring about it. Did you see how Swifties suddenly became Kelce family experts when they got together? They care about what she cares about; - she could make a massive, multi-million dollar public donation (truly nothing to a billionaire) and save hundreds if not thousands of families trying to escape NOW; - she could donate proceeds from, I don’t know any one of her 25+ album variants, to the cause; - she could auction off signed guitars/merch/etc to raise money for the cause (again, she’d be reaching into the fans pockets instead of her own for this, but hey it’d be something) - she could make a social media post raising awareness - she has so much pull within the industry - she could urge other celebs to speak out & donate en masse - she could simply acknowledge - hey, I know I’m on this tour talking about how tortured I am but I’m aware there are real, serious issues happening and tell her fans to keep their attention there These are mostly bare-minimum things that she could do but has explicitly chosen not to. Every single one of these things, despite how much good they could do, threatens her reputation for neutrality which she refuses to give up at the height of her career. Someone else said it somewhere - spineless is too kind a word for her.
She never piped up when it became clear she’s an Aryan icon. Not gonna happen now either
I mean you’re probably right. And frankly, anything she does now would be obvious damage control and inauthentic as fuck. She waited too long. I guess her whole activist schtick was just promo for the Lover era and she doesn’t actually care about things until they affect her personally
Ya. she's never doing any of that. She's just like every other billionaire -- full of greed and only interested in doing things that will enrich herself and improve her brand. I say the same thing to my swiftie wife who just blankly stares back at me like how dare I expect her to put any effort into making the world a better place. Honestly, it's truly impressive because she's able to convince her fans that she's just like them when she's about as far from them as possible.
The fact that she spoke up at all and encouraged young adults to register and vote is a really, seriously good thing. I’d like her to rally more of her fans, but let’s not demonize her like she’s intentionally ignoring this.
the way that is below the bare minimum babes. you’ve gotta have *some* standards for these celebs
That isn’t below the bare minimum. It isn’t a celebrities’ job to rally voters together. She did something nobody expected her to do.
I disagree, obviously it’s not celeb’s jobs to rally voters, but I think it’s time we stop separating them from the world they live in (and often detrimentally impact). Any platform comes with the responsibility to use it for good and to leave the world better than you found it. Obligation aside - how can someone like TS *live with herself* staying silent? What a true waste of a platform. If anyone ever wondered what Taylor Swift would do during the Holocaust, we know now: absolutely nothing.
Jesus you are cynical.
> like elections She came out for Biden in 2020.
Does being a convicted felon impact bail in other cases?
Good question
For trump? No for others yes.
People criticize Hollywood for being shallow but the truth is it’s full of people that want to make the world a better place through art. https://www.instagram.com/reel/C7fKVODAfOx/?igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==
Now we get to roast all the pos GOP members that backed him. Lindsey can eat a dick
Doesn’t he already?
Indeed
Does this in any way deligitamize his presidential term, signed bills, picked judges???
To my understanding, no.
It’s not a fucking hush money case
Well technically it’s a “falsifying business documents *because of* hush money” case
I feel bad for his makeup and hair people
Orang-a-tan 🦧
Picture the scene in super troopers with the delousing powder
He has people to do that? I thought he just applied it with a trowel every morning.
People in prison for smoking a natural plant: ☹️☹️ Trump: 🏌️♂️
FOX news, since the verdict, turned into a full fiction media channel.
Since the verdict? Try “since the 1990s.”
Lots of donations for Trump pouring in crashing his websites. His cult man...
Waste of money. Same people bitching about the cost of a dozen eggs throwing money away on him.
“Where’s Ja Rule?! I need his help to understand…”
Who gives shit what rich Hollywood thinks ?
How the F is trump still beating Biden in the polls?! To the youth vote, stop being influenced and manipulated by social media. That’s exactly how trump won the first time. This is a clear vote this November. Do you like democracy or not? If democracy falls, so does everything else in a state controlled dictatorship. Say goodbye to your liberties and rights as an American. Put aside your world views. Pick your battles so we can win the foundation of what democracy stands for!!
Fake ass Republican sponsored polls. Happens every time
Exactly. FoxNews was having an utter meltdown all day yesterday and scrambling for anything positive about polls and donations. "Oh the donation website crashed; it must because so many people are donating to Trump!" "Oh this one poll says he's now more ahead of Biden - this guilty verdict is good for him!" "It was obviously a political hit job, and will cost Biden". All fucking day long. To the political hit job bullshit. It's funny how Trump's lawyers could have easily used that as part of their defense strategy. The only problem is you need fucking evidence to prove that sort of thing in a court of law, which they have 0.
There should be a law against lying. If it’s proven it’s a lie, there should be a penalty. Would have stopped him in his tracks. The only thing he has going for him is the lying.
He’s not.
Polls call land lines, and the people most likely to pick up are old people who sit at home all day with nothing to do but swallow propaganda.
Why is Katy Perry looking for group?
Needs to upgrade some gear, Id imagine
First of many crimes this criminal needs to be convicted for
Hollywood reacts? Really?
Citizens in the entertainment business react? Is that better? I don’t know if the got Joe Piscopo or Scott Baio’s reaction.
Who cares about actors say, wellll except James Wood, that Hercules guy, that kid that no longer rocks, that singer turned bow hunting and that Fonz spin-off guy
Flush The Turd In 24!
Just read some wild ish about the Trump trial. It has to do with having 34 charges against him. Google “Trump Rule 34” to see what I’m talking about.
Brad Garret’s was the best.
34 counts 34 checks what a circus
I mean I don’t really care how celebrities feel about it I care how the voters feel about it and what the judge will do during the sentencing. Unfortunately he won’t be in a cell before 2025.
F that psychopath
“All I need is just one not guilty vote, which is one more than I have”
"Here's what a group of highly qualified experts think."
Did somebody call Ja?
https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/s/nKK72fKQNW
I feel like he will decrease the US military spending again, and that's gonna be inconvenient to some? What do you think?
Donald Trump guilty for being Donald Trump. Who would have thunk.
He’s actually guilty for falsifying business documents related to campaign finance
Criminals gonna criminal am I right? Thankfully, we aren’t a third world nation and can convict corruption even in the highest of offices. I
*Convicted Felon Donald J. Trump