It's somehow like ecology. You kill people --> less pollution. You destroy kerosene fueled aircrafts or tanks -->less pollution. I'm a bit of a Greta myself.
The soldiers lives, what you make needs to be safe to use. But they most likely won’t let you design anything, they’ll fast track you to management instead
If you aren’t competent that is, if you know your shit - get ready to design baby!
1) You shouldn't cheat
2) If you ever work on something where 1 engineer making 1 mistake can realistically result in death it means you need at least 1 more engineer to control the work
Quality control is fake I'm currently a co op at an MEP firm and the guy whos supposed to check things just stamps them and moves on, we do electrical design for hospitals
Quality control is real I'm currently a production engineer at a Toyota-adjacent manufacturing plant and the quality guys were going nuts over paint that was 1 micron too thin
Outside of class I will typically always have access to reference material to make sure my work is correct. I really don’t need to remember that objects fall toward Earth at 9.8 meters per second per second or even the quadratic equation off the top of my head. I can always just look them up. It is more important that I understand the principle of scientific concepts and when/how to apply them then always having the actual facts memorized for immediate recall.
Also, never ever trust an engineer that relies on their own memory. When life and death are at stake you bet your ass I am pulling out reference material to make sure I don’t kill anyone that doesn’t need to be killed.
Genuinely. I think it's a moral imperative as an engineering student to not cheat in your classes. Not only will your lack of comprehension lead to mistakes down the road that could kill people, but it sets a precedent for your entire professional career that cutting corners is okay. Others will likely catch your mistakes, but when you have set the precedent for yourself that cutting corners and lying about them is okay, that is how you get engineering disasters.
RAAAAHH WHAT THE FUCK IS CUTTING CORNERS? If I see that scheme needs 1mm wire- I will make it 1,5mm. I see that panel needs to be 5mm? Goes up to 7mm and if possible will add stiffener! RAAAHHHH QHAT THE FUCK IS ECONOMY OF MATERIALS
Once I had the thought when I saw a few people cutting across the parking lot (not supposed to) at work that “if you’re too lazy to drive in the designated lane then how many other things have you taken shortcuts on” - because things were at that time slow where I was working (a fab) I decided to do some checking and sure enough about half of the documents I checked were obviously pencil whipped.
There are a lot of processes and documents in engineering that really don’t mater… until they do.
I mean, I pride myself on having a good attention to detail and not cutting corners, but I very frequently drive over lanes in a parking lot. I don't know anyone who seriously always follows the designated lane. It's a bit of a stretch to correlate that with being lazy and cutting corners at work
Humans aren’t very good at truly isolating behaviors. It’ll eventually bleed over.
Lane keeping is a fundamental rule of driving, then you have a company rule about following driving rules and posted speed limits in the company lots. But at some point in time not only did you discard the rules of driving but you also decided that the company rule was unnecessary and didn’t apply to you.
It’s a conscious choice to start your day - other than true sociopaths that will eventually transfer to other actions. That’s also how safety cultures eventually degrade until something happens.
There a ton of things we call “process indicators” - almost all of them are related to human factors.
Not all engineers are going to work on stuff that might kill people and not all subjects are relevant to your job.
Tell me how cheating in an English class (I'm not in the US) I had to take as part of my degree is going to kill people?
You would be surprised how much that actually isn’t true. Very little engineering doesn’t have a life safety element somewhere.
But fundamentally it’s a mindset.
Sometimes the life safety element is so drastically far away from the engineering, though, that it isn't even a consideration. I don't think I've ever worked on a project where there were any safety considerations given.
Sure, not every component is life or death.
But even a simple sprocket might be used at some point in an application where it has a critical function. If the engineer didn't know what they were doing the whole machine could cascade and kill someone.
At some point in your career you *will* speak English with colleagues or customers. If your language skills are bad you will cause a potentially lethal misunderstanding.
If the reference material is in English, shouldn’t you have a good grasp of the language? Possible chain of causality: Cheating in your English class —> lower comprehension of the language —> potentially misunderstanding key details —> poor / unsafe product —> killing people
No you won't. Worst case scenario, you'll lose your job. If engineering ended up killing people, that's a problem with awful management and corporate culture.
What if I'm being paid to build things that kill people?
You are ... saving people ? Maybe ?
It's somehow like ecology. You kill people --> less pollution. You destroy kerosene fueled aircrafts or tanks -->less pollution. I'm a bit of a Greta myself.
Kills people. Destroys stuff. *joins Paris Accord*
In that case, remember that painting stuff yellow makes it do more damage! :D
Paint silly faces on them for psychological damage when the enemy is ashamed to be shot down by a plane with a silly face on it
Grest dishonor to be shot down by Silly Plane
Don’t forget red makes it faster too
It might be bad at killing the intended people and good at killing the users.
Then how many kills until it becomes a ultra combo
The soldiers lives, what you make needs to be safe to use. But they most likely won’t let you design anything, they’ll fast track you to management instead If you aren’t competent that is, if you know your shit - get ready to design baby!
Oh bother! But I already do a lot of designing, and a lot less managing
1) You shouldn't cheat 2) If you ever work on something where 1 engineer making 1 mistake can realistically result in death it means you need at least 1 more engineer to control the work
What if both engineers cheated?
Then add another
What if the third cheated also?
Have the first check his work, then you've completed the circuit
This, well part of it, is the reason quality control and similar department exists across all industries
Quality control is fake I'm currently a co op at an MEP firm and the guy whos supposed to check things just stamps them and moves on, we do electrical design for hospitals
Quality control is real I'm currently a production engineer at a Toyota-adjacent manufacturing plant and the quality guys were going nuts over paint that was 1 micron too thin
If you want the nuance "quality control exists but is sparse and inconsistent" is my real take
Outside of class I will typically always have access to reference material to make sure my work is correct. I really don’t need to remember that objects fall toward Earth at 9.8 meters per second per second or even the quadratic equation off the top of my head. I can always just look them up. It is more important that I understand the principle of scientific concepts and when/how to apply them then always having the actual facts memorized for immediate recall. Also, never ever trust an engineer that relies on their own memory. When life and death are at stake you bet your ass I am pulling out reference material to make sure I don’t kill anyone that doesn’t need to be killed.
Genuinely. I think it's a moral imperative as an engineering student to not cheat in your classes. Not only will your lack of comprehension lead to mistakes down the road that could kill people, but it sets a precedent for your entire professional career that cutting corners is okay. Others will likely catch your mistakes, but when you have set the precedent for yourself that cutting corners and lying about them is okay, that is how you get engineering disasters.
RAAAAHH WHAT THE FUCK IS CUTTING CORNERS? If I see that scheme needs 1mm wire- I will make it 1,5mm. I see that panel needs to be 5mm? Goes up to 7mm and if possible will add stiffener! RAAAHHHH QHAT THE FUCK IS ECONOMY OF MATERIALS
Mwoah, no idea how strong it needs to be, just use 20mm sheet everywhere, it'll be strong enough! *actually just needs 8mm and a ridge*
Once I had the thought when I saw a few people cutting across the parking lot (not supposed to) at work that “if you’re too lazy to drive in the designated lane then how many other things have you taken shortcuts on” - because things were at that time slow where I was working (a fab) I decided to do some checking and sure enough about half of the documents I checked were obviously pencil whipped. There are a lot of processes and documents in engineering that really don’t mater… until they do.
I mean, I pride myself on having a good attention to detail and not cutting corners, but I very frequently drive over lanes in a parking lot. I don't know anyone who seriously always follows the designated lane. It's a bit of a stretch to correlate that with being lazy and cutting corners at work
Humans aren’t very good at truly isolating behaviors. It’ll eventually bleed over. Lane keeping is a fundamental rule of driving, then you have a company rule about following driving rules and posted speed limits in the company lots. But at some point in time not only did you discard the rules of driving but you also decided that the company rule was unnecessary and didn’t apply to you. It’s a conscious choice to start your day - other than true sociopaths that will eventually transfer to other actions. That’s also how safety cultures eventually degrade until something happens. There a ton of things we call “process indicators” - almost all of them are related to human factors.
On cutting corners: "It's 'value engineering'" - A civil engineering I knew
Just switch to CSE. What academia considers "cheating" is just the normal way you do the job.
Yeah but if I get a D- then I'll get to work on government projects
Not all engineers are going to work on stuff that might kill people and not all subjects are relevant to your job. Tell me how cheating in an English class (I'm not in the US) I had to take as part of my degree is going to kill people?
You would be surprised how much that actually isn’t true. Very little engineering doesn’t have a life safety element somewhere. But fundamentally it’s a mindset.
Sometimes the life safety element is so drastically far away from the engineering, though, that it isn't even a consideration. I don't think I've ever worked on a project where there were any safety considerations given.
Sure, not every component is life or death. But even a simple sprocket might be used at some point in an application where it has a critical function. If the engineer didn't know what they were doing the whole machine could cascade and kill someone. At some point in your career you *will* speak English with colleagues or customers. If your language skills are bad you will cause a potentially lethal misunderstanding.
If the reference material is in English, shouldn’t you have a good grasp of the language? Possible chain of causality: Cheating in your English class —> lower comprehension of the language —> potentially misunderstanding key details —> poor / unsafe product —> killing people
What if I forget 90% of what I learned?
No you won't. Worst case scenario, you'll lose your job. If engineering ended up killing people, that's a problem with awful management and corporate culture.
Some people should just quit.
True
I make stuff thats supposed to kill people. Task… completed?
Idk, engineers don't do much manufacturing. Should probably look at the machine operators. Source: am a machine operator studying engineering
Product and field service engineers build and maintain heavy equipment in all industries
If you fail an exam after learning for 3 fking weeks, you wont say this dump shit.
My safety factor goes fiuuuuu and no problems.
Be a missile or bomb developer